From a NYT description of the scene in the Situation Room of the White House during the mission to kill Osama bin Laden. They were watching a video screen. On it was Leon E. Panetta, narrating, from CIA headquarters:
“They’ve reached the target,” he said.
Minutes passed.
“We have a visual on Geronimo,” he said.
A few minutes later: “Geronimo EKIA.”
Enemy Killed In Action. There was silence in the Situation Room.
Finally, the president spoke up.
“We got him.”
ADDED:
Anyone want to take offense at that code name?
Apparently the code namers thought of bin Laden as a 21st century equivalent of the Chiricahua Apache leader....
Like bin Laden, Geronimo proved to be an elusive target. More than 5,000 soldiers were deployed to capture him in around 1885.
Geronimo was fighting for his land, and committed what U.S officials at the time might have called acts of terrorism, conducting raids on white settlers in Apache territory. U.S. officials said they could convict Geronimo and his fighters of murder, and exiled the outlaw Apache to Florida as a prisoner of war, never to return to his homeland.
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334 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 334 of 334Kirk Parker - Yeah, that;s it.
They hung the banner on the way back from a "mission," but forgot to take it down for the little Georgie speech.
I mean, hey...forgetting to take down massive "Mission Accomplished" banners happens all the time.
That must be it.
I may have to have a few shots of tequila after reading that.
Are you suffering a mini-stroke?
Unlike yourself, I never had a problem giving credit where its due. I'll be the first to admit based upon his campaigning I would have never thought he would be stepping up drone attacks, authorizing SEALs to take out Somali pirates or sending them in to take out terrorists.
Just keep in mind that he would have never gotten bin Laden had Bush not 'started that Afghan war'.
Right?
Obama is "Black". Huh. But let's not forget that his family were slave owners in the US south...pre 1865.
My lily white ancestors were on the other side of that war.
"Washington: Osama Bin Laden's 12-year-old daughter watched her father's killing by the US forces, it was reported on Tuesday. The US special force shot and killed bin Laden at a Pakistani compound in Abbottabad, 60 kms from Islamabad."
Man, that must have sucked. Being Osama Bin Laden's daughter I mean.
Who cares that they used the word Geronimo? Seriously. It's like some right wingers are looking for every possible excused they can find to belittle this accomplishment.
No one is belittling it. I thought it was curious choice given the fact that its liberals who fall all overthemselves over perceived slights.
Notice Jeremy has nothing to say about:
* 20% unemployment
* $5/gallon gas
* $1.6 trillion deficits
* threat level elevated
nope, everything is just fine in Obamabi-land.
No one is belittling it. I thought it was curious choice given the fact that its liberals who fall all overthemselves over perceived slights.
This. PC is for the little people, not those that invented PC.
It's been my experience it's the Lefties who romanticize the Indians
So John Wayne in Big Jake was aided by native american. But for him white guys are not the good ones.
tonto,dumb is spanisn, the spnish version was toro, bull, aided teh lone ranger
Has anyone asked Andrew Sullivan if that was really Osama Bin Laden's daughter? Just sayn'
Hoosier - "Just keep in mind that he would have never gotten bin Laden had Bush not 'started that Afghan war'."
Yeah, it iwas our foray into Afghanistan that resulted in Osama's death. It had little if anything to do with years of intelligence work or Obama pulling the trigger on the actual operation.
But...if that's the case...why didn't little Georgie pull it off years ago?
Obama takes out Osama, and the teabuggers bitch. Had Obama not taken out Osama the teabuggers would have bitched. How it goes at the Byatchhouse.
Why is it so hard for some right wingers to just admit the planning of this was pretty good and leave it at that?
Who is having a hard time admitting that?
Chuck66 "My lily white ancestors were on the other side of that war."
Your relatives were against slavery, huh?
GFL with that...
"Cochise - almost certainly a "renowned Native American." Geronimo? Not so much. Now it's fair to say that he learned most of his horrific torture and killing techniques from the Mexicans, who he hated even more than the Americans. .."
The Apaches got schooled in war in all its aspects by the Commanches who kicked their asses out of Texas a long time before Americans were on the scene. As far as the Commanches, in re war (and torture) they were autodidacts who used Mexicans as training aids. They hated the Americans the most since they, unlike the Apaches and Mexicans, would not be driven away.
"It had little if anything to do with years of intelligence work or Obama pulling the trigger on the actual operation."
The intelligence work that culminated in this mission started two years before Barry was elected. Much of which involved enhanced interrogation techniques on Gitmo prisoners authorized by the Bush Administration.
Barry ordered the kill, but Bush's policies were instrumental in finding the guy so Barry could do so.
But you knew that.
"Who is having a hard time admitting that?"
Of course it was well-planned. We have some good operators in the SEALS and the CIA.
MayBee "Who is having a hard time admitting that?"
Are you kidding?
Hoosier thinks we got Osama because we went into Afghanistan (huh?), Skyler thinks it was no big deal and an easy decision because Obama campaigned on it (duh), many of the others here think this all happened because of torture...and of course, that it was really Bush & Company who should get much of the credit.
Jeremy said...
Hoosier - "Just keep in mind that he would have never gotten bin Laden had Bush not 'started that Afghan war'."
Yeah, it iwas our foray into Afghanistan that resulted in Osama's death. It had little if anything to do with years of intelligence work or Obama pulling the trigger on the actual operation.
But...if that's the case...why didn't little Georgie pull it off years ago?
God, these people are stupid.
We established yesterday - it took 2 years to develop the intel (that eeeevil waterboarding and all...) and another 2 to track down the courier and follow his movements.
And I believe this was the answer Jeremy got yesterday to the same whine (want a little cheese with that?).
J said...
Obama takes out Osama, and the teabuggers bitch. Had Obama not taken out Osama the teabuggers would have bitched. How it goes at the Byatchhouse.
Nobody is complaining about Little Zero getting bin Laden.
Nobody was complaining about Little Zero not getting bin Laden.
bin Laden was on few people's radar.
People were complaining about Little Zero destroying the country's economy.
People still are complaining about Little Zero destroying the country's economy.
J, not the Tea Partiers, is the Bitch Queen here
"Hoosier thinks we got Osama because we went into Afghanistan (huh?), Skyler thinks it was no big deal and an easy decision because Obama campaigned on it (duh), many of the others here think this all happened because of torture...and of course, that it was really Bush & Company who should get much of the credit."
Well, had we not going into Afghanistan it's doubtful we would have ever been in a position to kill Bin Laden in Pakistan so that's probably correct. And considering the level of intelligence Barry was presented I really don't think it was that big a decision to go on this one. My guess is he has said no-go on other chances that offered less favoable cirsumstances. The enhanced interrogation techniques(torture if you like - I don't mind using that term at all), is reported to have been a direct source of some of the intelligence used to get to him in this case. And finally Bush's policies on Gitmo and torture did begin this hunt, as I said before, at least two years before Barry was elected.
None of which takes anything from Barry making the right decision to kill the bastard by the way. And kudos to him for doing so.
He's still sucks on the economy though which is what is going to be important next year come election time.
Something to keep in mind as Jeremy trumpets that WaPo poll.
Y'all still haven't learned to ignore Jeremy.
MayBee - Does this answer your question"
TWM said..."Of course it was well-planned. We have some good operators in the SEALS and the CIA."
Do you see Obama's name in there anywhere?
When you read Hoosiers' several comments and then see this from Jeremy;
'Hoosier - Are you actially saying you think the American Indian population in the 1800's (Geronimo?) was an integral part of the stone age?'
the inescapable conclusion is that Jeremy either lacks very basic reading comprehension skills or hasn't a 8th grader's ability to integrate what he reads.
Probably both.
Hoosier Daddy
No one is belittling it. I thought it was curious choice given the fact that its liberals who fall all overthemselves over perceived slights.
True, not as much bitching on this blog. But over on Hot Air and other blogs the right is getting down right nasty.
True, about liberals and perceived slights. I think in this case 'Geronimo' is appropriate. If they said 'Sacajawea' or referred to an ancient Hopi ritual then it might not be. Geronimo seems to have become a word in our language that is seperated from the actual man. Hence, 'Geronimoooooo!'
Phil 3:14 - Fuck off.
22 people in the compound and not one prisoner? I want AG Holder on this case immediately.
TWM - "Well, had we not going into Afghanistan it's doubtful we would have ever been in a position to kill Bin Laden in Pakistan so that's probably correct."
I see.
So if we hadn't ever gone into Afghanistan, Osama would still be alive today?
And the fact that Bush had us in Afghanistan for years and years before Obama was even elected...doesn't really count, because we really weren't that interested in killing Bin Laden?
Bush's strategy was to NOT actually kill Bin Laden, but to save the good part for Obama?
Good lord...you people just can't bring yourselves to give Obama and his security team the credit they deserve.
Jeremy said:
'And, as for your "homophobic" drivel...it's the wingnuts themselves who came up with the term...so learn to live with it...'cause it ain't going away.'
Liar.
The genesis of the term 'teabagger' used in it's pejorative form to refer to members of the Tax Enough Already party - and that is how you use it - has been explained to you several times.
Good lord...you people just can't bring yourselves to give Obama and his security team the credit they deserve.
Good lord... you just can't pull tongue from ass.
Jeremy
This is what I responded to:
Why is it so hard for some right wingers to just admit the planning of this was pretty good and leave it at that?
Now.
Do you see Obama's name in that?
edutcher - So is this what you think?
If we hadn't ever gone into Afghanistan, Osama would still be alive today?
And the fact that Bush had us in Afghanistan for years and years before Obama was even elected...doesn't really count, because we really weren't that interested in killing Bin Laden?
Bush's strategy was to NOT actually kill Bin Laden, but to save the good part for Obama?
B - ONce again:
Jay Nordlinger at National Review admits, the term "teabagger" was introduced to the political lexicon by Tea Party movement leaders:
The first big day for this movement was Tax Day, April 15. And organizers had a gimmick. They asked people to send a tea bag to the Oval Office. One of the exhortations was “Tea Bag the Fools in D.C.” A protester was spotted with a sign saying, “Tea Bag the Liberal Dems Before They Tea Bag You.”
Tommy Christopher at Mediaite has it about right:
The Tea Partiers not only invented the term, they did so in order to inflict a similar double entendre onto the President, the Democrats, and liberals in general.
Now, they’re trying to re-cast the term as a slur, on a par with the “n-word,” hurtful to all the Tea Party members who are just ordinary moms, dads, sons, and daughters.
In emails, protest signs, t-shirts, and online, early Tea Party literature urged protesters to “Tea Bag the White House,” and to “Tea-bag the liberal Dems before they tea-bag you.”
The suggestion is that the metaphoric “tea-bags” be shoved in the mouths of the President, Democratic members of Congress, and even ordinary citizens who identify as liberal Democrats. The idea that they just didn’t know the term’s only (at that time) meaning is belied by the fact that they obviously knew it was negative (and non-consensual), since they didn’t want it done to them, and also because it only had one meaning.
Jeremy... so you are saying that because SOME teapartiers initially meant the homophobic slur, thus it's OK for you to use the slur against ALL conservatives?
(The Crypto Jew)
If we hadn't ever gone into Afghanistan, Osama would still be alive today?
We can’t know anything with certainty, better to say there’s a much higher probability he’d still be alive. UNLESS you believe that the Special Operations Team beamed down from the USS Enterprise. Instead they crossed over from Afghanistan.
And the fact that Bush had us in Afghanistan for years and years before Obama was even elected...doesn't really count, because we really weren't that interested in killing Bin Laden?
Bush's strategy was to NOT actually kill Bin Laden, but to save the good part for Obama?
Because the “good part” isn’t killing Usama, Jeremy…winning in Afghanistan is the good part. IF Usama died in 2001 WHAT would be different, in the world. He’s ONE guy, he was the INSPIRATION, not the LEADER of AQ.
And Reichwingerz HAVE been giving Obama his “Props” Jeremy, just not to your liking, it seems.
In the photo the very tall Obama looks like he's trying to make himself very small. It's as if he's in a class and has not done his homework and he's avoiding the teachers gaze. Not flattering.
Yeah, it iwas our foray into Afghanistan that resulted in Osama's death. It had little if anything to do with years of intelligence work or Obama pulling the trigger on the actual operation.
Where did you think all this intelligence came from?
Did they get any DNA from his daughter? How about that Obama? Having a man killed in front of his daughter. My, my.
Not flattering.
I wouldn't think candid situation room-type pics would be flattering.
Hillary's hand, though, you just KNOW that's going to be all over the place. I don't give her an ounce of credibility in that if it's a given she knew there was a journalist in the room.
Joe "UNLESS you believe that the Special Operations Team beamed down from the USS Enterprise. Instead they crossed over from Afghanistan."
No, I think this is what happened:
From Ghazi Air Base in Pakistan, the modified MH-60 helicopters made their way to the garrison suburb of Abbottabad, about 70 miles from the center of Islamabad.
NOTE: "From Ghazi Air Base in Pakistan"
Now, unless the Ghazi Air Base was somehow transported from Afghanistan for this specific mission...they did NOT come in from Afghanistan.
Correct?
'B - ONce again:'
Jeremy, once again, you are a liar. Jay N was talking about the unfortunate choice of a symbol by people unaware of it's with a second sexually deviant meaning and it's potential to be used against them by people well aware of it's second meaning.
You charging that the distortion of the meaning of the symbolic teabag into it's purely sexual connotation was the choice of the TEA party. Jay N is sayiong no such thing.
For the last time, you lying little pissant, Anderson Cooper was the first person to call TEA party members 'teabaggers' with the sexual connotation openly implied. Rachel Maddow and some other ignorant Air America twit giggled about it like two middle schoolers for most of Maddow's show a day or so later.
Cooper apologized. Maddow doubled down and the worst representatives of the left - including yourself - have tittered about it incessantly since.
And BTW, someone has already told you to beware of using the term in it's pejorative way in the physical presence of a TEA party member. That's good advice you don't deserve.
So, liar, to use the term that comes so easily to you, fuck Off.
Having a man killed in front of his daughter. My, my.
HAMAS was protesting the killing of a holy warrior in response to the attack on OBL's casa. What part of the "war" in "warrior" don't they understand? It sucks that his kids and wife were involved, but he knew that a long time ago.
Scottie So now it's Hillary's chance at being denigrated?
"I see.
So if we hadn't ever gone into Afghanistan, Osama would still be alive today?
And the fact that Bush had us in Afghanistan for years and years before Obama was even elected...doesn't really count, because we really weren't that interested in killing Bin Laden?
Bush's strategy was to NOT actually kill Bin Laden, but to save the good part for Obama?
Good lord...you people just can't bring yourselves to give Obama and his security team the credit they deserve."
No, what I said was it would be unlikely simply considering the logistics alone. That, plus the intelligence we have gathered on the ground in Afghanistan would make this event even more unlikely to have happened. Not impossible, but certainly, less certain.
Past that I have no clue what you are saying in the rest of your statement. It doesn't make one bit of sense.
And I just gave credit to Barry for giving the order to kill him. Did you not read that far down? I also give credit to Barry for adopting most of Bush's policies on the war - keeping troops in Iraq, increasing troops in Afghanistan, keeping most of the Patriot Act, etc. - and for using intelligence that was gathering using, to use your term, torture. That alone is causing no small number of liberal anti-war talking heads to explode.
And using Cheney's assasination squads? Kudos to Barry for doing so!
Geronimo seems to have become a word in our language that is seperated from the actual man. Hence, 'Geronimoooooo
I agree. Prior to D-day Ike told his troops they were to embark on a great crusade. After 9/11, Bush remarked we were embarking on a crusade against terrorism and was roundly condemned for inflaming certain, ah, sensitivities.
Evidenly after a nearly a millenium, the scars of the crusades run deep.
(The Crypto Jew)
Pakistan Tuesday described as "absolutely false" reports that US helicopters had taken off from its Ghazi airbase and expressed its "deep concerns and reservations" about the US not informing or
Sorry Jerry, no Ghazi Air base, the MH-60/53’s came from Afghanistan……
Remember, as Fox News is pointing out, this could all be a hoax to bolster his approval ratings. [18 months before an election].
Read all 237+ comments, am I the only one who noticed the horrified looks on the faces of Hillary and Obama? Look at their eyes, Gates was slightly squinted, calm like he was staring down a gun sight. Biden was sporting his practiced visage of the seasoned politician. Everyone else's eyes were on the mission's groove, engaged but not emotional. Only the two former Democratic candidates in the room were gobsmacked, and their eyes tell all.
So if we hadn't ever gone into Afghanistan, Osama would still be alive today?
Pretty likely. I mean the only reason we were able to launch the operation is because we have bases within Pakistan which were granted when we needed them for our operations in Afghanistan because at the time, thats' where bin Laden was, until we went in there. Had we not gone to Afghanistan, bin Laden would still be there.
This really isn't hard if you actually think about it.
jeremy said -
Scottie - Why do you even respond to any of my comments?
It's a waste of your time and my time.
then jeremy wasted more of his apparently precious time and said,
Scottie So now it's Hillary's chance at being denigrated?
Why are you wasting your time and mine?
By the by, though, I'll answer you in detail if you'll just admit you were wrong about Hoosier's use of "stone age" and your ignorance thereof.
"Read all 237+ comments, am I the only one who noticed the horrified looks on the faces of Hillary and Obama? Look at their eyes.."
Read my 2:43 comment?
"Now, unless the Ghazi Air Base was somehow transported from Afghanistan for this specific mission...they did NOT come in from Afghanistan.
Correct?"
As far as it goes yes. But the assets for this mission no doubt arrived at Ghazi via locations in Afghanistan. You're assertion is that we would be in the same place - both strategically and tactically - if we did not have such a large presence in Afghanistan. Much less politically.
There is insufficient evidence to support that assertion.
"Sorry Jerry, no Ghazi Air base, the MH-60/53’s came from Afghanistan……"
Well, hell, that's gonna leave a mark.
Jeremy said...
edutcher - So is this what you think?
If we hadn't ever gone into Afghanistan, Osama would still be alive today?
No, but it seems to be what Jeremy thinks because he's giving everybody the same answer.
And the fact that Bush had us in Afghanistan for years and years before Obama was even elected...doesn't really count, because we really weren't that interested in killing Bin Laden?
He said it wasn't his top priority.
Bush's strategy was to NOT actually kill Bin Laden, but to save the good part for Obama?
I'd tell Jeremy to go back and read what I said if I thought it would do any good. My exact words on the same subject yesterday were, "This is not a James Bond movie".
Apparently Jeremy thinks it is. He thinks intel is developed overnight because 007 jumps in the sack with Fatima and she spills her guts and troops are sent in the next day because, if it's in the movies, it happens that way.
Scott M - This is exacly what I said.
"Are you actially saying you think the American Indian population in the 1800's (Geronimo?) was an integral part of the stone age?"
Note the term; "integral."
Yes, I realize American Indians used stone tools and weapons, and yes, I have no doubt, because they did, they would be included in any discussion of The Stone Age, but again, it's is my opinion that that specific period of time would not be considered an "integral" part of The Stone Age.
Especially considering the fact The Stone Age began about 600,000 years ago and encompasses three distinct periods.
Now...are you also agreeing with Hoosier when he says we got Osama because Bush took us into Afghanistan...whatever the fuck that means?
'In emails, protest signs, t-shirts, and online, early Tea Party literature urged protesters to “Tea Bag the White House,” and to “Tea-bag the liberal Dems before they tea-bag you.” '
Ya? Link it. Not just the one image of a sign held by a middle aged matron used over and over again ad nauseum to support the lie you keep pushing.
It is the choice of YOU and low people like you to run with this meme and you're far too dense to realize that it says reams about you asshats and nothing about the TEA party.
edutcher - "He said it wasn't his top priority."
Yeah, right. But do you remember him sayng this?
"The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him."
- G.W. Bush, 9/13/01
BEFORE he said this?
"I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority."
- G.W. Bush, 3/13/02
Give it up.
B - "Ya? Link it. Not just the one image of a sign held by a middle aged matron used over and over again ad nauseum to support the lie you keep pushing."
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/president-obama%E2%80%99s-use-of-teabagger-term-provokes-media-debate/
http://nrd.nationalreview.com/article/?q=Mjk1YmRjNzIxNmUwMTI0ZWYxZWU4OWU2MzFiOWJmNDE=
"Now...are you also agreeing with Hoosier when he says we got Osama because Bush took us into Afghanistan...whatever the fuck that means?"
Jeremy,
Is it just us going into Afghanistan or Bush sending troops there that is the hang-up on this? Cause I got to tell you, it's pretty fricken obvious that our military and intelligence presence in that country has been pretty damn instrumental to the gathering of intelligence towards finding and killing of more than a few important terrorists and a shit load of not so important ones. Why you feel that is different when it comes to Bin Laden is beyond me.
So it must be that Bush got us there in the first place that is bothering you.
(The Crypto Jew)
"I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority."
- G.W. Bush, 3/13/02
Note the date Jerry, Bush realized that hunting Usama wasn’t THE goal of the GWoT….fairly early on. So is it your contention we can come home now….Usama being dead?
TWM - They came from the base in Pakistan.
Stop lying.
http://nationaljournal.com/whitehouse/the-secret-team-that-killed-bin-laden-20110502
Note the term; "integral."
Bullshit. You're parsing to cover your rhetorical ass and it's painfully obvious to everyone here. There are peoples, right now, that live a stone age existence. The shoe horn capital S-tone capital A-ge that you're trying to use now didn't apply to everyone all over the world at the same time.
What HD said was completely correct and you were trying to score points by attempting to make him look foolish, hence the unsuccessfully-spelled use of your word "actially". In other words, "OMG, YOU'RE AN IDIOT! DO YOU ACTUALLY BELIEVE...? etc etc.
It backfired and you look more oafish than normal.
Hoosier's point, that the Native Americans were a stone-aged culture being faced with a technologically superior culture, stands still despite your pitiful parsing.
I couldn't care less about the Bush/Afghanistan/Obama/Bin Ladin argument you're trying to push. It's a non sequitur.
Let me save you some time and respond in the manner that most suits you at this point.
"Fuck off, Scott".
The Geronimo reference seems inapt because the Bin Laden mission was an assassination mission. Capture in the case of Bin Laden was simply not in the cards.
The U.S. cavalry pursuit of Geronimo, however, was to enforce the U.S. Government's reservation policy with respect to the settling of the west, and was fought in response to the Chiricahua Apache struggle against the taking of traditional Apache lands, lands which the U.S. Government had refused to allow the Apaches to settle on as their reservation. The irony was that those traditional lands they would likely have agreed to have as their reservation lands, were never actually settled by others.
Also, Geronimo was not a Chief. He was a "shirt wearer" which is roughly equivalent to a medicine man. In that sense, it would have been a more appropriate name for a mission to capture or kill Ayman Al-Zawahiri, had they been closing in on him. Geronimo did build a huge reputation as a recognized military leader.
Geronimo was indeed a terrorist. As edutcher correctly pointed out, at 5/3/11 10:24 AM, he repeatedly and viciously attacked the innocent and defenseless with the intention of terrorizing them. He hated the Mexicans in particular, and throughout his long campaign of resistance, he sought revenge for a Mexican raid against his people in which his first wife, three children and his mother had all been murdered.
Specifically, Dave at 10:58 notes that one of the most gruesome things for which Geronimo was renowned was tossing infants and small children into the air and impaling them on an upturned blade. He did at one point (many years later) express some level of remorse for that brutality.
By the way, that book Dave mentioned, "Once They Moved Like The Wind," by David Roberts, is indeed a fascinating account of the final Indian wars with Apaches in the southwest.
As I recall, Roberts' title was a paraphrase of a quotation from Geronimo himself who, when he was finally captured in Mexico in early September of 1886 (and officially surrendered on the 4th in Arizona), he reportedly mused that "Once I moved like the wind," meaning that he would not have been caught at an earlier age because he was too quick.
He lived to the ripe old age of 86 or 88, when he got really drunk one night in 1909 (out in Oklahoma) fell off his horse, and died of exposure. On a somewhat earlier occasion (at age 84?) he and another Indian got toasted one night and briefly rode "off the reservation" which sent shivers of fear through the Ft. Sill area, raising cries of . . . "Geronimo has escaped!"
One final note – in 1905 Geronimo rode in the official inaugural parade of President Teddy Roosevelt, hardly something that could ever have been imagined no matter how long Bin Laden had stayed alive!
I was under the impression that the “Mission Accomplished” banner was purposefully hung because there were a number of coalition partners who conditionally agreed to assist in the peacekeeping efforts only once the “war” was “over”.
Domestic adversaries took the opportunity to call it, instead, a sign of hubris. It stuck.
Is that incorrect?
wv: suimanc
Joe - So, after making this statement:
"The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him."
- G.W. Bush, 9/13/01
And then, eighteen months later, the "Dead Or Alive" president gave up and made this his new and improved statement?
"I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority."
- G.W. Bush, 3/13/02
And you defend it my saying "Bush realized that hunting Usama wasn’t THE goal of the GWoT?"
WHY wasn't it the goal, Joe.
He just lost interest in finding the leader of the terrorist pack who killed 3,000?
Do you think that argument will fly with the friends and relatives of the dead?
Ridiculous and you know it.
(The Crypto Jew)
WHY wasn't it the goal, Joe.
He just lost interest in finding the leader of the terrorist pack who killed 3,000?
Do you think that argument will fly with the friends and relatives of the dead?
Ridiculous and you know it.
So IF it was THE goal, we’re leaving Afghanistan as we speak? Just waiting for you to apply some logic to your own statements. If Usama WAS the goal of the GWoT the War is over, then?
Or should I, just like Scott, respond for you, “F*ck off, Joe.”?
Lauderdale Vet - "Is that incorrect?"
Yes, that is incorrect.
And when Bush, one month later, repeated the banner's message in Afghanistan...he was also wrong.
"America sent you on a mission to remove a grave threat and to liberate an oppressed people, and that mission has been accomplished."
The mission was not accomplished by a long shot.
Joe - You can throw out whatever you want in defense of Bush, but he couldn't and didn't find Osama, and he basically gave up.
Obama's team found him and killed him.
Did you miss that?
"TWM - They came from the base in Pakistan.
Stop lying."
Shit, son, the WH story has changed three times already.
(The Crypto Jew)
America sent you on a mission to remove a grave threat and to liberate an oppressed people, and that mission has been accomplished
The grave threat wasn’t hiding out, his regime destroyed and the Iraqi people Liberated? Did I miss something? And again, the banner was for the CVN crew, THEIR mission HAD been accomplished, and they were on their way home……
You link an article showing a middle aged matron with teabags and a stream of self-referential nonsense to support your contention that it was the TEA partys intent that metaphoric “tea-bags” be shoved in the mouths of the President, Democratic members of Congress, and even ordinary citizens who identify as liberal Democrats. Your link does no such thing.
The term used in it's pejorative form is about YOU, Jeremy. That's why you use it.
And you follow that up with a link to the Nordlinger article that you transparently didn't comprehend the first time you used it, (or any other time you dredge it up to defend your tittering fascination with mouthing conservative balls).
You've established yourself as a liar here. Over and over again. A rather stupid and one with a defining distasteful obsession with sexual deviancy on top of it.
(The Crypto Jew)
Joe - You can throw out whatever you want in defense of Bush, but he couldn't and didn't find Osama, and he basically gave up.
Obama's team found him and killed him.
Did you miss that?
No I didn’t miss it…and I ask, for the third time, are we coming home from Afghanistan as we speak? Is the GWoT over? Usama is dead, and that means?
And the intell for this victory came from a Bush era interrogation, in part, in a Bush era Campaign Iraq, from Bush Era Bases in Afghanistan? Did YOU miss THAT?
Huzzah and A Tiger for Obama, I’m glad he got Usama, I haven’t seen too many folks apart from C4 who have been gain-saying it…..
Scott M - I'm not "parsing" anything.
I posted the exactl comment I presented in response to Hoosier.
If you think the American indian, during the time of Geronimo represents an "integral" part of The Stone Age, that's your opinion.
You can spend the rest of the day defending your teabagger buddy, but history is on my side of what I said.
The American Indian does not represent an "integral" part of The Stone Age.
Joe - "are we coming home from Afghanistan as we speak? Is the GWoT over? Usama is dead, and that means?"
I have no idea. I hope it means we'll get our asses out as soon as possible.
Don't you?
But what does that have to do with Bush getting credit for Osama's killing...because he took us into Afghanistan? (By the way; TO FIND AND KILL OSAMA...which he did not do.)
No "mission Accomplished Banners" on that one, huh?
"The American Indian does not represent an "integral" part of The Stone Age."
All I know is they mostly brought a bow and arrow to a gun fight.
Bad for them.
It sucks that his kids and wife were involved, but he knew that a long time ago.
I agree. I was be facetious. We know how Jeremy, et al would be playing this if a Repub had been in the president's seat. From the most recent reports, it appears there was no real attempt to capture OBL, who was unarmed when killed. Cheney's assassination team did it right.
The American Indian does not represent an "integral" part of The Stone Age.
Hoosier never claimed they were integral. You did that after your small brain assumed Hoosier was wrong due to the juxtaposition of era's you cited. He mentioned stone age and you went after him thinking you could prove his use of "stone age" incorrect.
His use of stone age was 100% appropriate. Your question of "integral" which he never brought up, was ridiculous. You tried to catch him in an error in an attempt at monojollies, but it didn't work. You're making it worse by arguing it further.
"Fuck off, Scott"
See how much time that saves?
"You're making it worse by arguing it further."
That's Jeremy for you.
The only problem I have with referring to OBL as Geronimo is that Geronimo was actually a very brave warrior... unlike OBL who was much more of a talker and a jihadi dilettante.
wv: pyred - what they should have done to OBL instead of letting him sleep with the fishes
Hearing that his codename was Geronimo made me think of the Skull & Bones society as well.
I wonder how this will affect sales?
"Osama bin Laden may have hated America, but he loved its soft drinks: Local shopkeepers say that people from Bin Laden's compound regularly bought Pepsi, Coke, and other popular brands in bulk.
"You're making it worse by not presenting a realistic or true counter argument."
Jeremy Teacupper: We are down with the president killing an unarmed man in a foreign country on information obtained using ungentle methods. We like that style. We thought you didn't. Now open up wide.
Now open up wide
...I need you to tell me...is it safe?
"Jeremy Teacupper: We are down with the president killing an unarmed man in a foreign country on information obtained using ungentle methods after winning a Nobel Peace Prize. We like that style. We thought you didn't. Now open up wide.
I fixed it for you Michael.
Scott - "Hoosier never claimed they were integral."
No, but the fact that he would throw it out there, I asked him if that was what he thought, that they we an "integral" part of The Stone Age, which I think was a pretty straight forward question.
I also thought this was rather ridiculous:
"As a conservative, I don’t hold a ‘romantic’ view toward Native Americans but rather a practical one that recognizes a stone age culture that meets a technologically advanced culture. The stone-age culture will lose out either by forced or voluntary assimilation."
As if "technology" created some kind of "assimilation" between the American Indian and the new arrivals.
Hoosier's definition of assimilation is different than mine, and I would assume, most Americans...especially the Indians.
But, for whatever reason, you're the one who's made this into some kind of insane back and forth argument for argument's sake.
You're wasting your time.
You're wasting your time.
You keep helping with that and you're still unwilling to admit you're wrong.
You misunderstood his use of the term and now keep trying to backpedal. It is fun to watch, though.
LarsPorsena "Jeremy Teacupper: We are down with the president killing an unarmed man in a foreign country??"
So now Osama Bin Laden has become just another "unarmed man" who was murdered by Obama?
Jumping the shark here.
Michael - Torture had nothing to do with this.
That's just a teabagger like yourself's wet dream.
*Do your buddies squeal when you slide your balls in? Does it turn you on? Does it make any didderence how big they are?
Does color or age matter?
B - Show me where I've "lied."
"Mr. obama looked 'stoned faced'... Jeremy fingered his raisin sized nuts."
"Mr. obama looked 'stoned faced'... Jeremy fingered his raisin sized nuts."
Sorry, but what I said was so awesome, I said it twice.
AllenS- From his bio: "Knuckledragger"
You got that right.
Why not add racist?
"5/3/11 - Pew Research Center Polling: 56% say they approve of the way Obama is handling his job as president while 38% disapprove."
also, that doesn't guarantee that he will be elected next year. replace Obama with Bush in that statement above and you would get the same responses. And that bump is temporary, unless O can reduce gas prices and inflation
why are libs so desperate for this leverage? obama has done a crappy job on the economy. Are Obots willing to suffer high gas prices and high unemployment just to keep him in office?
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
JeremyTeacupper: Well at least they had a warrant for his arrest. How did that part go? At least they didn't capture him because since Gitmo is closed they would have had to bring him to New York, to the scene of the crime, and give him the full rights accorded to him as a world citizen. At least there was that.
So no torture was involved, just murder of a foreign citizen in a foreign country without a trial. Dude, I am good with that and I am delighted to see that liberals don't much give a shit about it either. Finally a little truth leaks out between my balls and your lips.
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Michael - "just murder of a foreign citizen in a foreign country without a trial"
So now the teabagger meme is that Obama is a murderer?
As if you were there when Osama was taken out.
Are you implying we should have taken him into custody?
Have your run this by the rest of the teabaggers?
Why not ask them and see how they feel things should have been handled.
You're such fucking tool...and I have to wonder if you're not about twelve years old.
AllenS - "Define racist."
AllenS said..."I'll tell ya a little something, garage, I'll say any fucking thing that I want. Now, let me draw you a map. Naming someone who you want to kill in a military operation, Geronimo or Dirty Nigger, might, just might seem derogatory to some people."
AllenS said: "You're probably right, MadMan. They sure as hell would have figured out who we were talking about if the word was "Buckwheat."
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
Define "racist".
WV: bowdzoo
Finally, a good WV
Interesting stuff:
Could Osama bin Laden have been found faster if the CIA had followed the advice of ecosystem geographers from the University of California, Los Angeles? Probably not, but the predictions of UCLA geographer Thomas Gillespie, who, along with colleague John Agnew and a class of undergraduates, authored a 2009 paper predicting the terrorist’s whereabouts, were none too shabby. According to a probabilistic model they created, there was an 88.9% chance that bin Laden was hiding out in a city less than 300 km from his last known location in Tora Bora: a region that included Abbottabad, Pakistan, where he was killed last night.
The bin Laden tracking idea began as a project in an undergraduate class on remote sensing that Gillespie, whose expertise is using remote sensing data from satellites to study ecosystems, taught in 2009. Based on information from satellites and other remote sensing systems, and reports on his movements since his last known location, the students created a probabilistic model of where he was likely to be. Their prediction of a town was based on a geographical theory called “island biogeography”: basically, that a species on a large island is much less likely to go extinct following a catastrophic event than a species on a small one.
“The theory was basically that if you’re going to try and survive, you’re going to a region with a low extinction rate: a large town,” Gillespie says. “We hypothesized he wouldn’t be in a small town where people could report on him.”
'B - Show me where I've "lied."'
Incompetent lightweight. I have.
Look, liar, your positions always come down to just regurgitating the talking points fed to the progressive lockstep marching morons like yourself. Plus you're all about getting the approbation of of your peers, whose nasty minds work just like yours. Put them together and we get the added pleasure of having you deliver those talking points couched in your obessive desire to have a man's balls in your mouth. You're not to be taken seriously.
So you get trounced over and over again here by folks with far more smarts than you. They tie you up in your own statements until you're vehemently denying you said what you said 20 comments back.
You must be some sort of funky specimen in real life. And not funky in a good way, Funky looking, funky sounding, and no doubt funky smelling considering your sexual obsessions.
it's is my opinion that that specific period of time would not be considered an "integral" part of The Stone Age.
I wasn't referring to a specific time period but their level of technology. I stated that twice but you're obviously to stupid to read.
Now...are you also agreeing with Hoosier when he says we got Osama because Bush took us into Afghanistan...whatever the fuck that means?
It means if we hadn't gone to Afghanistan bin Laden would still be there. Seriously are you really that fucking stupid? I mean seriously I know you're a troll but you can't be that stupid.
I also thought this was rather ridiculous:
"As a conservative, I don’t hold a ‘romantic’ view toward Native Americans but rather a practical one that recognizes a stone age culture that meets a technologically advanced culture. The stone-age culture will lose out either by forced or voluntary assimilation."
As if "technology" created some kind of "assimilation" between the American Indian and the new arrivals.
Ok never mind Jeremy. You have convinced me beyond a shadow of a doubt that you are by far the dumbest fucking person I have ever had the misfortune of attempting to engage in a reasonable discussion. I could have a more sensible discussion with a pair of shoes.
B - You're just regurgitating teabagger bullshit.
Show me where I have specifically "lied."
Otherwise, fuck off.
Hoosier - "It means if we hadn't gone to Afghanistan bin Laden would still be there."
And you know this...how?
That's just your opinion.
It has no basis in fact, and for all you know, Bin Laden may have been in Afghanistan for years.
Complete conjecture.
Hoosier - You can call me anything you want, and I give give a rat's ass.
You're the one who thinks the American Indian was "assimilated" into our culture.
You're full of shit.
Re Geronimo, it's hard to imagine but he reportedly had a sense of humor, albeit a slightly cruel one. Years ago in Lawton OK I had a neighbor who had actually known Geronimo. As a small redhaired boy Joe was a particular pet of the Indian customers in his Dad's furniture store. He was afraid only of Geronimo, who would come in the door brandishing his "skinning knife" and demanding, "Where's that little boy? I don't have a red scalp yet!" This was Joe's signal to go hide under a bed while the other Indians disavowed knowing where he was. True story, according to Joe.
Was Bin Laden execution legal?
Euro-socialists apparently think not.
Jeremy, the first president I remember was Truman. Bush was not the worst president in my lifetime--not the best either, but not the worst. Until Obama, Carter was the worst, and the last Democrat I have ever voted for. I will never vote for another one. Obama is the worst president in my lifetime.
I am 63 years old, I will probably die before the American People elect another president as bad as Obama.
I am 63 years old, I will probably die before the American People elect another president as bad as Obama.
I hope you live another hundred years and I hope you're right.
Jeremy - Killing an unarmed man in a foreign country without that country's knowledge. Sounds like we have the makings of a war criminal on our hands. It's not illegal when the president does though. Right?
You better get back to the alter you built in your basement and burn more candles in honor of the Great One, BHO. Maybe if you write him, he'll send you a dirty sock or piece of used toilet paper as a relic to put in your place of worship.
"You're the one who thinks the American Indian was "assimilated" into our culture.
You're full of shit."
Reminds me of a story. I was in a class that included four American Indians - two Apache, one Cherokee and one Chippewa. I quickly became friends with Brett, the Chippewa, and we had quite a few discussions about American Indian history which were very interesting. Anyway, one day I pointed out to him that the two Apaches had the stereotypical looks of their ancestors (dark red skin, jet-black hair, large strong nose), but that the Cherokee had blond hair and blue eyes. I asked him why this was and he deadpanned, "He's Cherokee, they'll let anybody into their club."
One of the funniest things I ever heard.
Brett, by the way, looked Hispanic and not Indian which was the source of maybe the second funniest Indian-related story I ever heard.
The class was 12 weeks and Brett arrived two days late. One of the guys in the class, on the first break after Brett arrived, walked-up to him and said, "Que pasa?" Brett responded, again with total deadpan, "I'm Chippawa, asshole."
Hoosier - "It means if we hadn't gone to Afghanistan bin Laden would still be there."
And you know this...how?
That's just your opinion.
It has no basis in fact, and for all you know, Bin Laden may have been in Afghanistan for years.
Um, yes? That's what I just said. He was in Afghanistan in 2001. He was in Afghanistan during the 1990s during the Clinton administration. That was exactly my point you dumbass. He was in Afghanistan the whole fucking time up to and right after 9/11. Had we not gone to Afghanistan, where do you think he would be?
I'll give you 3 guesses and it starts with A and ends in stan.
Dumb as a box of rocks I swear.
You're the one who thinks the American Indian was "assimilated" into our culture.
Yes Jeremy because I know what the word assimilated means and you're a dumbshit.
Skull and Bones allegedly has Geronimo's skull in their "tomb." Perhaps the codename is a secret tribute to GWB.
'Show me where I have specifically "lied."'
I did, you miserable little worm. I know gathering info outside the left's marching moron sites is not your usual MO, but until you defend your jackassery about the TEA Party intending to take the pejorative 'teabagger' label on given the dates of the Cooper and Maddow antics, you own the liar label.
Until then, as you say, fuck off you funky sac licker.
They should of code named him Custer because he was doomed from the start.
They should have used cod word Custer because he was doomed from the start.
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