New Media Meade, the protector of war monuments, takes signs down from the statue of Hans Christian Heg, who died at Chickamauga. Do you think it's cool to have a sign that reads "I fought for the Union/You should too" tied to his foot? We didn't.
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145 comments:
Of all things I appreciate your (both of you) genuine respect and obvious affection for veterans most of all . . .
It's even worse with pigeons.
as a Vet, I appreciate the concept, but am sort of surprized that your behavior is though it were some sort of covert action :)
it's littering :)
relax
The cop was "I'm out of here".. as soon as new media turned its back.
Thanks! (for the monument maintenance and for the reportage, available no where else!)
We appreciate all that you are doing on behalf of those of us who cannot be there. It's refreshing to see someone with some common sense and sense of decency. Unlike most of the 'protestors'.
Too clever. Like General Betrayus. They have no clue how much this stuff offends.
Heg was the commander of the only All Scandinavian Regiment in the US Army. He is buried in the Lutheran Church Cemetary at Wind Lake, Wisconsin, where another monument to Heg can be visited
Meade is like Antigone burying Polyneices.
Chickamuga was not a good day for the Union army (or for the Confederates either, in terms of casualties.) It was the end of the career of Union General Rosecrans. The Confederate commander was General Braxton Bragg.
Here is a good account from About.com, written by a man named Kennedy Hickman.
As the day wore on, Bragg's numerical advantage began to tell and Union forces were slowly pushed back towards the LaFayette Road. As darkness fell, Rosecrans tightened his lines and prepared defensive positions. On the Confederate side, Bragg was reinforced by the arrival of Longstreet who was given command of the left wing of the army. Bragg's plan for the 20th called for successive attacks from north to south. The battle recommenced around 9:30 AM when Lieutenant General Daniel H. Hill's corps attacked Thomas' position.
Beating back the attack, Thomas called for Major General James S. Negley's division which was supposed to be in reserve. Due to an error, Negley's men had been put in the line. As his men shifted north, Brigadier General Thomas Wood's division took their place. For the next two hour's Rosecrans' men repeatedly defeated the Confederate attacks. Around 11:30, Rosecrans, not knowing the precise locations of this units, erred and issued orders for Wood to shift position.
This opened a gaping hole in the Union center. Alerted to this, McCook began moving the divisions of Major General Philip Sheridan and Brigadier General Jefferson C. Davis to plug the gap. As these men were moving forward, Longstreet launched his assault on the Union center. Exploiting the hole in the Union line, his men were able to strike the moving Union columns in the flank. In short order, the Union center and right broke and began fleeing the field, carrying Rosecrans with them. Sheridan's division made a stand on Lytle Hill, but was forced to withdraw by Longstreet and a flood of retreating Union soldiers.
With the army falling back, Thomas' men held firm. Consolidating his lines on Horseshoe Ridge and Snodgrass Hill, Thomas defeated a series of Confederate assaults. Farther north, the commander of the Reserve Corps, Major General Gordon Granger, dispatched a division to Thomas' aid. Arriving on the field they helped block an attempt by Longstreet to envelop Thomas' right. Holding until nightfall, Thomas withdrew under the cover of darkness. His stubborn defense earned him the nickname "The Rock of Chickamauga." Having incurred heavy casualties, Bragg elected not to pursue Rosecrans' broken army.
. . . .
The fighting at Chickamauga cost the Army of the Cumberland 1,657 killed, 9,756 wounded, and 4,757 captured/missing. Bragg losses were heavier and numbered 2,312 killed, 14,674 wounded, and 1,468 captured/missing. Retreating back to Chattanooga, Rosecrans and his army were soon besieged in the city by Bragg. Shattered by his defeat, Rosecrans ceased be an effective leader and was replaced by Thomas on October 19, 1863. The siege of the city was broken in October following the arrival of the commander of the Military Division of the Mississippi, Major General Ulysses S. Grant, and Bragg's army shattered the following month at the Battle of Chattanooga.
The poster covering the lettering bothered me, but the one tied to his foot wasn't doing any harm, I thought. Glad to see Meade patrolling more Veterans' monuments -- but I'm sure the veterans themselves would appreciate a visit. The late mother of a friend of mine would volunteer weekly at Hines VA Hospital, and the vets were so glad to see her.
Put your teeth back in, Emil.
About 4000 Americans died in combat at Chickamuga. Nearly 25,000 (!!!) were wounded. Many of those would have died later of wound complications.
My great-grandfather was wounded at Chickamauga--Illinois 38th. Thank you, Meade.
"I fought for the Union, you should too." At least it's clever.
Official memorial post-it notes are needed.
Preprint each with some historical information about somebody or other.
There would be room for your message at the bottom.
It could be like the wailing wall maybe.
Some tradition needs inventing here.
The Union soldiers fought to preserve the nation.
These unions fight to preserve the noose around the taxpayers necks.
Also-Don't wear your hearts on your sleeve. Just remove the signs. At this time educating on them is a waste of your time and dignity, they will only drag you down to their sludgeline.
(New to, and really like, the site)
"Do you think it's cool to have a sign that reads 'I fought for the Union/You should too', tied to his foot?"
Hell, no, more like one of the lamest, most disrespectful, egocentric things I've heard of. I don't doubt the genius who thought of it was the product of union teachers.
The Drill SGT said...
as a Vet, I appreciate the concept, but am sort of surprized that your behavior is though it were some sort of covert action
Considering how the "peaceful" protestors are acting, I suppose one has to comport oneself as if he/she (a big thumbs up, Mr Meade, for leaving the Mrs at home for this op) were behind enemy lines. Meade might do well with some time at Ranger School.
"Also-Don't wear your hearts on your sleeve. Just remove the signs. At this time educating on them is a waste of your time and dignity, they will only drag you down to their sludgeline."
Hank, nice to see you commenting here on Althouse, and in support of her "coverage" of capitol events.
Thing is, Althouse is primarily a teacher. And a remarkable one at that!
Two young soldiers were killed by an IED in Afghanistan yesterday and two more were killed in Germany today. In times like these I think even Garage and MM will agree that putting signs on Veterans' monuments is in bad taste or, at least, "insensitive".
I love the conceit of the teachers Union--thinking the long-dead veterans would approve and using their sacrifices as implied moral cover/approval. Just how do they know the vets would have approved?
Thanks Meade and thanks to both of you for your coverage.
It has been a great source of what is really going on there.
John Henry
Leftists feel no affinity with soldiers, whom they consider beneath them; this was a ho-hum desecration.
Ho-hum.
No. Another absurd equivocation.
Chickamauga is one Civil War battlefield I have visited, as well as others in the Chattanooga area. The battle covered a large area and the fighting was ferocious as it was in many Civil War battles.
Ann, can I make a recommendation for video taping these events?
Use a camera with a chest mount. Something like the Go Pro HD.
http://www.live2kite.com/images/GoPro-GCHM30_1_386.jpg
This has several advantages.
1) It looks like a camera just hanging from your neck, so people don't know they are being filmed.
2) they can't swat the camera down without putting their hand on your chest
3) the GoPro HD has a very wide angle, and often times the action at these events is around the periphery
demo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yo3M6EB8kmk
See the thing is...Althouse isn't "covering" capitol events, so much as she is UNCOVERING them. At least to my mind.
Before any of these statues appeared in the Wisconsin Capitol area, some one, backed by a group of friends, petitioned the legislature to "honor" fallen heroes and in this case, a fallen Norwegian immigrant who died in the course of protecting our country for the winning side in the Civil War.
Norwegian-American "friends" apparently prevailed with the legislature, and a sculptor sculpted for money and the rest was "history"....Until Althouse and Meade showed up...to make it a TEACHING moment.
So what were Althouse and Meade REALLY trying to teach us?
The policeman's response to Meade was right on. Why he then seemed to gun his engine and speed off is unclear.
Despicable. Commandeering someone else's accomplishments and sacrifice is like the losers who yell out at concerts, drawing attention to their thuggish, boorish behavior. Thank you for standing up to their childish tantrum.
Colonel Heg fought to hold the Republic together against her traitors, and he fought for the freedom of the slaves. He was a strong abolitionist.
And the Democrats left their office, doing damage to our representative government by giving no voice to those who dutifully voted.
I am angry beyond words.
Colonel Heg was a Republican, too. Smart man.
The policeman's response to Meade was right on. Why he then seemed to gun his engine and speed off is unclear.
I thought so too. My impression of the Madison/Capitol police is of dedicated professionals.
Are there usually Port-A-Potties available in front of the Capitol Building?
Too bad you didn't open up one of the doors. Having been to Woodstock, you should have seen the crap (and toilet paper) well over the brim.
Good also to see that the crowds aren't there outside. And, given how the crowds were harangued by the drummers. And, the bull horn "artists." It's no wonder there's been such a drop off.
Good too to respect memorials.
The cop seemed reasonable enough. Glad he took the sign into his vehicle. Wonder if another one will be up t'marra?
Maybe you should send your stuff to Faux News because O'Reilly just got busted showing scenes of 'violence' in Wisconsin-- with palm trees and people in t-shirts in the background.
Whoops.
ok, Meade finally does something somewhat constructive.
and since "we're" going down Civil War memory lane, interspersed w/the usual ad nauseam AA meme: (((all liberals are unAmerican, low-life Communist/Socialist scumbags))) yada yada yada
a few words from Abe:
I am loath to close. We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained, it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battle-field, and patriot grave, to every living heart and hearth-stone, all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature.
take care, blessings
That's OK.
Here in Arizona they are voting on bills to nullify federal laws, seize federal property and require federal employees to register with the state or with local officials when they come here on business, including FBI agents conducting an investigation.
The word, 'secession' is also being mentioned uncomfortably often.
"Meade is like Antigone burying Polyneices."
Exactly like that. (Okay, I admit my ignorance.)
"Heg was the commander of the only All Scandinavian Regiment in the US Army. He is buried in the Lutheran Church Cemetary at Wind Lake, Wisconsin, where another monument to Heg can be visited."
A question for you Civil War experts: As I've generally understood it, soldiers during the Civil War weren't brought back home for burial. They were buried on their battlefields. Or is that a misunderstanding? Or did it vary a lot? Or, perhaps, was Heg brought home because he was a high-ranking officer, a colonel, and was afforded that special privilege?
"you should have seen the crap (and toilet paper) well over the brim"
Thanks, Carol, but that was waaay too much information. :)
General Meade, taking care of his troops.
shiloh said...
ok, Meade finally does something somewhat constructive.
Well, that was large of him (shiloh/PB&J/some phony folksy).
and since "we're" going down Civil War memory lane, interspersed w/the usual ad nauseam AA meme: (((all liberals are unAmerican, low-life Communist/Socialist scumbags))) yada yada yada
Ann (or Meade) has said nothing of the kind. Typical, though, for him to sneer at soldiers' sacrifices.
a few words from Abe:
I am loath to close. We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained, it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battle-field, and patriot grave, to every living heart and hearth-stone, all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature.
Abe's attitude, but not sholoh/PB&J/some phony folksy's
Thanks Meade
All Scandinavian Regiment in the US Army
Was that the one where they had to number the Ole Olesens? I'm serious! It's in the Wisconsin Veterans Museum, just across from the Capitol.
Makes sense when you consider the source, people who think that billions in additional debt is for the benefit of their students.
Thanks Meade.
Hey! I think you found Waldo at 3:00.
Just a few months before the battle at Chickamauga, Meade had defeated Lee at Gettysburg.
Therefore, it is altogether fitting and proper that Meade removed the vile defacement from the monument to the fallen union solder.
Shiloh,
You're correct, the grown man Abe Lincoln did say these words: We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained, it must not break our bonds of affection.
And our freakish and divisive man-child Obama says over and over that Republicans can ride in the back of the car, "if they bring a knife, we bring a gun," and that Latinos need to "punish their enemies."
So please don't lecture me about Conservative or Libertarian lack of civility.
kcom said...
"Meade is like Antigone burying Polyneices."
Exactly like that. (Okay, I admit my ignorance.)
you can google it.
Shiloh -
"((all liberals are unAmerican, low-life Communist/Socialist scumbags))) "
That's too many adjectives. They are simply vermin to be eradicated.
Now, at this time, is when some great damage can be done to the dems.
Hold tight, Governor Walker and Governor Kasich. Eliminate collective bargaining and quit collecting dues for the unions.
This is what you were elected for.
Leftists feel no affinity with soldiers, whom they consider beneath them
Leftists like these avoiders of military service? They didn't feel sufficient affinity with soldiers to join the military:
Mitch McConnell
Trent Lott
Jon Kyl
Richard Shelby
John Cornyn
John Ensign
George Allen
Phil Gramm
John Boehner
Roy Blunt
Eric Cantor
Denny Hastert
Tom DeLay
Dick Armey
Dick Cheney
Haley Barbour
Newt Gingrich
Mitt Romney
Jeb Bush
Fred Thompson
Rudy Giuliani
Karl Rove
Michael Steele
John Ashcroft
John Roberts
Clarence Thomas
Antonin Scalia
Sam Alito
Rush Limbaugh
Sean Hannity
Bill O'Reilly
Glenn Beck
The Koch Brothers
"See the thing is...Althouse isn't "covering" capitol events, so much as she is UNCOVERING them."
So what were Althouse and Meade REALLY trying to teach us?
THAT STATUE IS A PLANT!!!!
Heg was their courageous leader. The Norwegians who made up the 15th Wisconsin Regiment were the descendants of Norsemen. I suspect that they were not about to leave the body of their fallen commander behind. The RR from Chattanooga goes straight to Wisconsin. Heg was shot in the guts and then he died painfully a day later, while under the care of his brother-in-law who was the Brigade's surgeon. So somehow Heg's body made it home to Wind Lake. When his soldiers were age 60 or so they got a permanent remembrance monument to their fallen Viking Commander erected on Madison Capitol grounds. Some of them even got a monument erected to him in his birth place of Lierbyen, Norway that recites his bravery in the American Civil war. I guess wearing your heart on your sleeve about a courageous commander is a Norwegian weakness.
*snap snap* Students! ;)
So what were Althouse and Meade REALLY trying to teach us?
"Leftists like these avoiders of military service? They didn't feel sufficient affinity with soldiers to join the military:"
Ergo, denigration of the military is ok, cause some republicans didn't join. Sure. Makes sense to me.
As I recall, the Confederacy was actually largely politically led by the Democratic Party. The Union was led by the Republicans.
That soldier fought for the Union. And today's Democrat Union would have fought that soldier.
Irony.
kcom said...
A question for you Civil War experts: As I've generally understood it, soldiers during the Civil War weren't brought back home for burial. They were buried on their battlefields. Or is that a misunderstanding? Or did it vary a lot?
Soldiers' bodies were often returned home for burial. Mortuary arts were well developed, as long as the soldier, his unit, or his family could afford them. Of course, many if not most remains were unidentifiable or too badly decomposed to benefit. A commonplace was for a soldier to pin his name and home town inside his blouse before a battle so that there might be no delay in returning his remains to his family in the event of his death.
@FLS:
The "chickenhawk" meme is so last decade.
I find it amusing that leftards like yourself get all up with your Heinlein when it comes to enfranchisement. "OMG, those rethuglicans didn't serve in the military! They can't comment on war 'n' shit like that!"
Get a clue, moron. Less than 10% of the US population have served or are serving in the military. The fact that your list implies avoidance of service is scurrilous but expected from a bottom feeder such as yourself. The vast majority don't serve.
And service is no badge of honor for many; witness John Kerry or John Murtha. Honorless scum both.
You've got no arguments, so you resort to this sort of bullshit. How typical of the liberal mind.
And how about Ohio? That's gotta have your balls shrinking in pain.
Now, go take your cute little list and beat off to it. I'm sure it'll be oh-so-satisfying basking in your alleged superiority.
Ann (or Meade) has said nothing of the kind.
Was obviously talking about AA's conservative flock spouting daily insults/ad hominems ie in this thread:
Leftists feel no affinity with soldiers, whom they consider beneath them ...
as AA and her tagalong just infer their daily meme, w/out using overt invectives.
>
Again, as mentioned previously, AA generalizations ie all conservatives think the same and all liberals think the same and there is never any grey area in AA political discussion, as well as being useless in a debate and make said ideologue using them look foolish are often laced w/childish insults.
and so it goes ...
oops sorry I screwed that up the first time... let me try again:
Dead Heg bare besøkte meg og fortalte meg, på norsk, for å fortelle deg takk for at du tar tauet ut av foten hans. Det var plager ham. Kanskje i morgen kan du ta med til ham en genser? Han sa det var fucking kaldt.
"but I'm sure the veterans themselves would appreciate a visit." - FLS
I disagree silently with most of what you say/think/link. In this case I think your attitude needs a comment. STFU*
(*The 'New-Civility' in this comment brought to you by the Obamanauts.)
@David: The Battle of Chickamauga was a 3 day event that was immediately followed by the earliest killing frost in memory (back then.) Many more men died of exposure in the days after the fighting ceased than had been KIA. My mom had a great-aunt who lived to be 106 (she died in the 50's) who was a young teenager when the battle occurred. She told of riding through the battleground on the back of a wagon, seeing men who had died with minor wounds because they hadn't been taken to a hospital house and given shelter.
One CW era house close to us was rented out to friends of mine when we were all kids. It was a big house, maybe 3 miles from the national park that marks the site of the battle. The two front rooms had blood stains on the floors by the windows where the amputations took place. History and sacrifice, right there on the floor. Makes an impression on a kid.....
And our freakish and divisive man-child Obama
Again, the prosecution rests ...
Ha ha ha ha
Meadia get's to ask others what they're doing w/ their cameras: "Are you media?"
But, don't you dare ask Meadia who/what he is.
1) Do as Meadia says, not as Meadia does.
2) Meadia has healthy dose of self righteousness.
Is it just me, or does Meadia seem to have a lot in common w/ the lamestream media? Is his bumbling purposeful, i.e. is he mockingly aping the errors of the non-meadia media? Or, is he an earnest dope?
jeff: what it means is my whited sepulchre detector went off.
Thank you for this. My great-great-great grandfather was a Norwegian who fought for Wisconsin in the Civil War. He would be very happy, I'm sure, to know that people still care.
JAFAC: does honoring a block of stone symbolizing sacrifice really outweigh honoring a living embodiment of sacrifice -- say, a war wounded vet?
If so, your priorities are sadly askew.
Shiloh: Again, as mentioned previously, AA generalizations ie all conservatives think the same and all liberals think the same and there is never any grey area in AA political discussion, as well as being useless in a debate and make said ideologue using them look foolish are often laced w/childish insults.
Althouse also (often) uses short, clear, sentences. That must really cut.
@FLS -- In regard to your 9:13 post, reread your 6:35, then your 9:09.
"They didn't feel sufficient affinity with soldiers to join the military:"
Do you even understand what affinity means?
I feel affinity for lots of groups of which I am not a member.
Of course you do. You just didn't want to acknowledge the antagonism of many on the left for the military. Show me any on your list who has displayed a similar antagonism.
Get a clue, moron.
John Kerry or John Murtha. Honorless scum both.
go take your cute little list and beat off to it.
~~~~~
And the hits just keep on coming ...
Congrats AA!
>
Let the record show (((Henry doesn't disagree w/anything I said))), but has a problem w/my sentence structure.
And yes, AA is quite educated, which surely makes her feel very special ...
Our post-Eisenhower military sucks balls. I don't understand why anyone would join it. Those who do are not contributing to anything good.
Wasn't there a time when American soldiers fought for liberty and freedom and survival and defense of their homes? Now they kill people so that the Democrats and Republicans can remain in power, and so American corporations can get cheaper oil.
You can't trust the Establishment. They all lie. Why would you put your life on the line for them>?
AA, better start another thread quickly as this one appears to be dead in the water!
"and so American corporations can get cheaper oil."
Do you have any evidence for that at all? I see that argument made frequently but events never conform to that claim. The cheapest way we could have acquired oil before the war was to buy it and look the other way on everything else (like France, for instance) - the much vaunted "stability". If we were trying to minimize the price of oil, invading Iraq wasn't going to get the job done. It hasn't made oil cheaper. It accomplished a much different goal. And if you say the idea was to go in and "steal" it, then you're just living in a fantasy land.
... there is never any grey area in AA political discussion
Well, except for the assertions that resources are ALWAYS used better by government bureaucrats than the private sector, so they should be collected from those who have them at confiscatory rates ...
... and the attempts to micromanage peoples' lives, from mandating "green" light bulbs (that constitute hazardous waste if broken) to low-flow toilets (that clog more often and are harder to unclog), with a fundamentalist zeal that makes Baptist preachers look like lassez-faire libertines by comparison ...
... and the persistent pigeonholing as "ignorant" of those who take spiritual worldviews more seriously than a hobby ...
... Re-, er, Progressives are so open-minded ...
... to the point of their brains leaking out ...
Shiloh, I appreciate your good humor, but it's not really your sentence structure that I'm mocking.
"We're" talkin' about American corporations cheaper oil in a thread about a Civil War monument.
Yessssssssssss! ;)
>
Henry as long as you have something to mock you're always welcome at Althouse ...
kcom:
I am not an actual Civil War expert but sometimes I play one on this blog.
Tyrone's answer was concise and accurate as to the Union dead, but it was quite different with the Confederates.
Very few Confederate dead other than officers were returned home for burial. The South lacked the transportation, other logistics, manpower and even will to do this. Many southerners fell much farther from home than did Union troops, especially in the earlier years. The south was not nearly as methodical and complete as the north in all aspects of record keeping. The warmer weather made decomposition more of a problem.
In my South Carolina town, which was occupied by Union troops from November 1861 to the end of the war, there is a large National Cemetery. It was begun during the war, and expanded after the war ended, when the north made extensive efforts to locate scattered grave sites throughout the south and rebury the dead in National Cemeteries or near their homes. This effort was for Union dead only. Most confederate dead, especially the enlisted men, have no grave markers.
All counts of American dead during the war include both the fallen of north and south. As they should.
Ahh, FLS... so dependably passive-aggressive.
And regarding your list, FLS ...
Strain strain strain ... strain those gnats!
Then fling 'em out, see if they'll stick
From wherever you're at ...
As you swallow camels of dysfunction
'Till your belly's fat ...
Strain strain strain ... strain those gnats!
I've had this kind of accusation thrown at me, as well ... and, given my age and health, putting me on the battlefield would put our warfighters at greater risk to find me, for it is likely, slow as I am, that I would end up as the subject of an al Quada snuff video.
Methinks the warfighters would much rather have me doing what I do best ... applying my years of engineering experience to the design of better tools for their necessary work ... work made continually necessary because Progressives are always standing in the way of the direct/timely/resolute and DECISIVE use of their services to end tyranny and establish a SUSTAINABLE peace!
Methinks that many on your list would be in the same situation as I, with respect to tactical usefulness ... OTOH their efforts in our nation's capital, countering the INACTION mandated by the belief system of the Progressive faith, are quite useful to the cause of sustainable peace ... so I think our warfighters like these people right where they are at.
"AA, better start another thread quickly as this one appears to be dead in the water!"
And so she does..."start another thread"...time, and time again.
Half the time, we "get it".
And other times...we're all, merely "half-time shows".
"JAFAC: does honoring a block of stone symbolizing sacrifice really outweigh honoring a living embodiment of sacrifice -- say, a war wounded vet?"
No - it doesn't.
'Meade should do better' you imply - Meade has done damn well I say.
Smile for the cameras, Althousians!
:)
Ritchie The Riveter gets extra pts. in this thread for mentioning an al Quada snuff video.
"Ahh, FLS... so dependably passive-aggressive."
He is, indeed.
And PRECISELY like the rest of us when face-to-face with "the power" we do not agree with.
Two things I liked about this video:
1. The police officer says "Whoopsie!" as he attempts to unlock the back door of his squad car. Awesome.
2. It's really the first distance shot I've seen of the demonstrators, and . . . y'know, there doesn't appear to be a lot of them. I guess they had to get back to reality eventually?
About 20 years ago, I lived in Madison and would cut through the Capitol as I walked to and from work each day. I passed Colonel Heg twice a day. He’s dear to my heart.
After Madison, my husband and I moved to Trempealeau County, Wisconsin. We often had occasion to pass through Hegg, Wisconsin (basically just an intersection), and wondered if there was a connection between the two Heg(g)s.
I couldn’t find much information today, but according to this, the community of Hegg was named after Colonel Heg. I’m not sure if that’s accurate, especially given the two spellings of the name.
(People who are interested in war memorials might find a trip to Arcadia, Wisconsin, also in Trempealeau County, worthwhile. It boasts an impressive Memorial Park with monuments commemorating each of our country’s wars.)
Shoot, my links didn't got through.
Here's the Hegg one:
http://www.epodunk.com/cgi-bin/genInfo.php?locIndex=24101
Here's for the Arcadia Memorial Park:
http://www.arcadiawi.org/RS/Attractions/MemorialPark.php
God Bless you and Meade Ann,
Bob
@Hank Rearden_WI: Welcome and thanks for your comment.
Just want to say that the interaction between Ann and Meade is touching.
"a few words from Abe"
One wonders what his words were when he learned his beloved brother-in-law, General Ben Helm, was killed at Chickamauga. That was Ben Helm of the army of the Confederate States of America.
I knew precisely who Heg was when I saw his name mentioned. I am fortunate to live less than an hour from Chickamauga, and have visited many times. I can even visualize the exact location of the monument marking the spot where he fell. Having read it several times, I would recommend Peter Cozzens' "This Terrible Sound" as perhaps the definitive account of the battle.
"Very few Confederate dead other than officers were returned home for burial."
One Confederate officer who was buried near family was Captain Tod Carter. He was mortally wounded within sight of his home at the Battle of Franklin, Nov. 30 1864 (his family found him the morning after and brought him home, where he died). One of the most vicious and brutal battles of the entire war. Some of the wildest fighting occurred in the yard of the Carter House.
I think the fuckhead who thought they were being real cute with the note should be sentenced to a guided tour of the Chickamauga battlefield. They probably wouldn't come away being so flippant about such memorials.
dead in the water??
Hardly
Empowered by remembered stories and shared history, this thread has flowed with life and interest.
Honor accorded to one by one, invites others do the same. What started with the clearing of a memorial, and the mention of one man's name, created an invitation for others to honor through memory and the recall of history, the cause, the conditions and costs involved.
Thought, word and deed are all part of the same flowing river.
"Ahh, FLS... so dependably passive-aggressive."
And you can't even think about identifying with that?
Then leave the comfort of Althouse.calm, Paco.
Sorta, kinda like Meade, when he headed out to "report" on the happenings in Madison.
Right before you set a personal goal to find fls a "home" that is not in your neighborhood.
Pretend that you are his egg donor, or sperm donor. That you either need to raise and "understand" him, or pass him off to your neighbor as...? What? The zygote that wouldn't quit?
Pretend that you REALLY want fls to get beyond his passive aggressive response to this environment at Althouse!
Find a suitable alternative for fls, since you have determined he doesn't belong HERE, "wat wit his passive aggressive" and all.
Fls is the "kid" you don't understand, and the "student" who doesn't get it.
But YOU, Paco?
I'm gonna guess you are the headliner at the Althouse half time show. ;)
@fls
"but I'm sure the veterans themselves would appreciate a visit."
Are you walking the walk or just flapping your lip?
Thanks Ann and Meade. Colonel Heg gave his life to preserve the United States, a country to which he was not even native, on one of the more hellish battlefields of the Civil War. The least we can do is not despoil his monument.
Two young soldiers were killed by an IED in Afghanistan yesterday and two more were killed in Germany today. In times like these I think even Garage and MM will agree that putting signs on Veterans' monuments is in bad taste or, at least, "insensitive".
Are you kidding? Liberals spit on those young soldiers, they're Little Eichmanns to them.
I have to admit, I don't get this fetishizing of war monuments. Why war monuments in particular?
Tying a sign to an actual veteran would be disrespectful, and would probably get you some missing teeth. But a statue, what's the big deal?
Statues don't have feelings. You're just projecting.
Hey, MamaM,
Nice to see you again.
And so you say, "Honor accorded to one by one, invites others do the same."
Agreed!
And I am merely ONE, and one not honored?
Whatever would you suggest for such an underappreciated lady such as myself, your highness?
I have to admit, I don't get this fetishizing of war monuments. Why war monuments in particular?
Tying a sign to an actual veteran would be disrespectful, and would probably get you some missing teeth. But a statue, what's the big deal?
Statues don't have feelings. You're just projecting.
FAIL. Why do leftists desecrate war memorials if they have meaning? They know doing so is a KNIFE IN THE HEART of most decent Americans.
Hey, MamaM,
Nice to see you again.
And so you say, "Honor accorded to one by one, invites others do the same."
Agreed!
And I am merely ONE, and one not honored?
Whatever would you suggest for such an underappreciated lady such as myself, your highness?
Hey Penny. Take the sign off my toe, loosen the sticky tape and let me commune with the pigeons for a while and I'll meet you at Trooper's Bar and Grill if you promise not to stick me with the tab.
Shiloh,
You said "the prosecution rests" because I called our President a "freakish man-child" because he talks like one. Presidents who stand on a platform and say "slurpee" and "car in a ditch, ride in the back" don't impress me. I don't have to talk like a President, but I expect him to.
He doesn't sound presidential to me when he says those divisive words. He sounds petulant and childish. His language is not the language of grown men and educated men like Washington and Lincoln.
He has no serious qualifications. When did he ever engage with foreign governments before this? Where are his papers from college? From law school? Why was he the editor of the Harvard Law Review and yet wrote nothing for it?
He has no published works, except for his short biographies, which we all know could easily have been ghost-written.
20-somethings write his speeches, and it shows. He makes cringe-worthy historical mistakes all the time.
I'll stop now, because this thread is about a real man who was very brave, and about us thanking Meade and Althouse for giving a damn about a hero who believed in the Republic and in liberty for all, and who gave up his life at a very young age for both.
"I have to admit, I don't get this fetishizing of war monuments."
And nor should you, eatbees.
Althouse, nor Meade, are doing that either.
Thinking they are just asking questions that they "know the answers to".
Lawyers and Lovers are symbiotic, which Althouse can surely explain.
The rest of us need to figure out how lawyers and lovers and politicians came to share the same bed?
Julius said...
Our post-Eisenhower military sucks balls. I don't understand why anyone would join it. Those who do are not contributing to anything good.
Wasn't there a time when American soldiers fought for liberty and freedom and survival and defense of their homes? Now they kill people so that the Democrats and Republicans can remain in power, and so American corporations can get cheaper oil
Thank you for a rare honest expression of the prevailing view the left has of our military.
Most leftists feel this way, but choose to lie about their contempt for military members and veterans.
Jane, I already know you despise Obama, so no need to embellish, eh. ok, ok, if it makes you feel better. And on the bright side, you're definitely in the majority at AA's conservative paradise ...
MamaM says...."loosen the sticky tape".
She makes me LAUGH!
And I love that about you, MamaM.
Course those who know me, also know that I am predictively and hilariously "ticklish".
And that is a DIFFERENT sort of laugh.
Wouldn't you agree, MamaM?
How could anyone think showing respect for a war memorial is a fetish?
That is some fucked up thinking right there.
You guys should think before you talk.
"Jim Howard says, Thank you for a rare honest expression of the prevailing view the left has of our military."
Jim, there are no "rare, honest expressions" from the right either....assuming we judge our left and right from the loony center that has made it a habit to waffle back and forth as "it suits".
And we do! Dress just "so" for each election. And we do it PERFECTLY in each and every election.
Are we "tipsy"? ha ha
Think I'll let both the far "right" and the far "left" come to their "correct conclusion"...
E V E N T U A LL Y !
Sweet! Double L's! Twins! Alphabeta's, Cal!
OR merely, alphabetacal?
HELP! I'm kung-fused!
FLS: Thanks for the list. I suppose you are still working on the leftist list.
FLS: Start with Soros. Oh, don't. He was in the army OK, the German army wasn't it? The one with the Nazis?
Meade:
On a different thread, I asked the question if you had seen any 'Peaceprints' left around by any of the protesters.
Well, did you see any???
wv - snesesum
I know our resident Libtards think they're being cute with all their stinkbombs, but all they've really done is reveal how lost they are.
Don't Tread 2012 said...
Meade:
On a different thread, I asked the question if you had seen any 'Peaceprints' left around by any of the protesters.
Well, did you see any???
Nope.
@Meade
So I guess I can count myself as another duped citizen.
After seeing all the pretty 'I Leave Peaceprints' bumper stickers, 'Coexist', etc etc
I'll never believe another one of them ;)
FLS, the unsurprising fact that you aren't able to perceive the harm done by disrespecting a war monument -- or by sneering at those who show respect for them -- doesn't mean the harm isn't there. Soulless folks like "eatbees" who think that showing respect for people who laid down their lives is the same thing as "fetishizing" are living illustrations of that harm. And you're another one: trying to devalue Meade's small act of respect by taking personal credit for some volunteer work that your AUNT does, for crissakes. Now really. I already know the answer to this question, but have you no shame at all?
If you and eatbees try very hard, you may be able to realize that there's a significant difference between showing respect for those who die in our wars and showing concern for those who are still alive. Hint: they aren't mutually exclusive.
However, a visit to the vets' facility nearest you is a great idea. So big of you to suggest it! I can give you some tips A musically-inclined relation of mine has been giving concerts at a local vets' facility for some time now and has made many friends there. I go with him to help lug speakers and microphones, and it's quite something to see all those happy people singing along and asking for their favorites. You can do this, too. Don't worry if you aren't musical. Whatever talent you may have would be welcome, or if you haven't got any, somebody will appreciate being read to, or maybe even just listened to -- call the volunteer coordinator at the facility nearest you for ideas. The folks will be pleased to meet you and it's possible you might even learn a thing or two -- but only if you leave the sneers at home. When are you planning to turn up?
One of the interesting facts about the majority (if not great majority) of monuments on the actual battlefields is that they were placed with input from the veterans involved. There has been a push in recent years to have a monument to Rosecrans erected somewhere (likely Stones River), but some ACW grognards feel the addition of monuments by those who weren't contemporaries is inappropriate.
When you speak of "fetishizing" these monuments, realize that they were mostly erected under the direction of those involved and were meant to commemorate the sacrifices and deeds of those who fought. I'm given to understand that there is a motel in Memphis and a theater in Washington D.C. that have been similarly "fetishized." I have no problem with that. Do you? If not, why the double standard?
Those bothering to engage with shiloh should just stop. It's pointless. This person revealed in a thread a week or two ago that he or she can't tell the difference between a hundred thousand and a million, even after posting the numbers in question several times and insisting that they added up to what they didn't. Look, there are simply no brain cells there -- don't bother.
Mrs Whatsit: FLS, the unsurprising fact that you aren't able to perceive the harm done by disrespecting a war monument -- or by sneering at those who show respect for them -- doesn't mean the harm isn't there. Soulless folks like "eatbees" who think that showing respect for people who laid down their lives is the same thing as "fetishizing" are living illustrations of that harm. And you're another one: trying to devalue Meade's small act of respect by taking personal credit for some volunteer work that your AUNT does, for crissakes. Now really. I already know the answer to this question, but have you no shame at all?
Nice takedown.
"Our post-Eisenhower military sucks balls. I don't understand why anyone would join it. Those who do are not contributing to anything good."
Thanks for that. Always good to know there are people out there rooting us on, and valuing what we do!
oh, and fetishizing" a war memorial? Huh?! I am glad Meade did what he did - I would hope people would give the memorial a little respect, as it is supposed to be doing just that for those that gave all. I would hope when my generation of combat vets finally departs this life that whatever memorials are laid for us are not treated as ornaments for political protest or as a bulletin board for signage.
@LTC John: Thanks for your comment and thanks for service. I have a long way to go to make up for my own past sins. Liberating veterans' memorials from disrespect wherever I come upon it is just a selfish little personal mission of mine.
FLS, the unsurprising fact that you aren't able to perceive the harm done by disrespecting a war monument
Harm is relative. Discarding a candy wrapper is less harmful than smashing a window.
Most confederate dead, especially the enlisted men, have no grave markers.
There is a National Cemetery at Shiloh and there are also mass graves where the Confederate soldiers are buried. The Confederate flag flies over that at least one Confederate burial site. The Confederate soldiers were not buried with the Union soldiers because they were not US military vets.
Captain Edward Saxe of the 16th Wisconsin, the first Federal officer killed in the battle, is buried at the Shiloh National Cemetery.
"Discarding a candy wrapper is less harmful than smashing a window. "
Good metaphors. Pick up someone else's candy wrapper, and fewer additional wrappers get dropped. Replace broken windows, and fewer additional windows get smashed.
Refuse to join in any lefty NewAge yoga mantra guru protest demonstration cults, and fewer additional fools join lefty NewAge yoga mantra guru protest demonstration cults.
Why was he the editor of the Harvard Law Review and yet wrote nothing for it?
Why do people perpetuate this long-demonstrated falsehood? How does that benefit their cause?
http://www.politico.com/news/
stories/0808/12705.html
Good on you, Meade, for taking those signs down. Those folks simply have no respect.
'Meade should do better' you imply - Meade has done damn well I say.
JAFAC's priorities are screwed up, not Meade's. Meade made no choices; he specified no priorities -- he merely walked across town, noticed a sign blocking an inscription, and dealt with it on the spot.
The Union was fighting against slavery, which was, in an economics sense, other people living on the backs of others and taking the fruit of their labor for their own enjoyment...hmmm...irony?
Those bothering to engage with shiloh yada yada yada
Must compliment the Mrs on avoiding me her own self. I'll have to go back and count all the posts which say avoid shiloh, eh as it's pretty much impossible for AA's lemmings to avoid me, especially when I'm constantly tellin' them the truth. It must have to do w/winger DNA ...
After Shiloh, the South never smiled!
shiloh, go ahead and study the archives of the prodigious body of comments which constitute your work.
But I wouldn't flatter myself if I were you. She talks to people she disagrees with all the time.
If they're interesting.
Otherwise, she's usually pretty busy.
Meade, if by "she" you are referring to AA ?!? you proceed from a faulty premise. I was obviously talking about "mrs whatsit" ie Those bothering to engage with shiloh. And having previously said I don't take myself too seriously and am only here for the entertainment value, such as it is, whether AA or mrs whatsit replies to my veracity is of no concern to me, flattery notwithstanding.
Most political blogs being so much bs!
ok, your second reply has me convinced you were indeed talking about AA. Catch a clue Meade. And most of AA's replies from what I've seen the past (2) mos. are just clarifications and occasional snark, mostly towards conservatives.
But it's good to know you are payin' attention to all my posts.
take care
I see mrs whatsit concurs on what I said about your comments just not being interesting enough.
take care and good luck. Have you tried the "Lawyer, Guns, and Money" blog? You would probably fit right in over there.
And they serve free cookies!
After I tore Meade a (((new asshole))) he resorts to inane deflections ...
Shocking!
shiloh man -- declaring victory is lame.
declaring victory is lame.
True, especially considering the competition er lack thereof. It was more sarcasm, than a declarative statement re: Meade's lack of reading comprehension.
He just "assumed" Mrs was AA, when I've only been using AA for quite some time ...
>
When you don't read the whole thread one may have problems, especially when Meade is fixated on my every word.
former law student said...
"shiloh man -- declaring victory is lame"
who is shiloy man?
Meade, I left out a comma. Perhaps I should have said, "shiloh, dude."
Is it clear I have no quarrel with you, by the way?
fls, I don't know who shiloy man is either ...
"JAFAC's priorities are screwed up, not Meade's. Meade made no choices; he specified no priorities -- he merely walked across town, noticed a sign blocking an inscription, and dealt with it on the spot"
Well - I agreed with you in spirit - but denigrated you for your attacks on Meade. He made the choice to stand for something - that's what Citizens do and what too many taxpayers choose not to do. Let's be clear - he made that choice. Why you would say otherwise is confounding. He could have easily chosen silence. As Althouse's other post on closing the Capital illustrates, good people can be herded into wrongful submission. He chose otherwise.
Why do you sell this short?
"Why do people perpetuate this long-demonstrated falsehood? How does that benefit their cause?"
He wrote one article about how a fetus cannot sue?
"...and that records showed it was the only piece he'd written for the Review."
This is the case: "TORT LAW - PRENATAL INJURIES - SUPREME COURT OF ILLINOIS REFUSES TO RECOGNIZE CAUSE OF ACTION BROUGHT BY FETUS AGAINST ITS MOTHER FOR UNINTENTIONAL INFLICTION OF PRENATAL INJURIES."
There was nothing new in this article - there was nothing of note. It was so unworthy of attention it did not have his name on it.
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Congrats to Heg for getting in the way of a Confederate bullet. We eagerly await the Madison monument to General Lee and to top it off the Ripon monument to President Davis as Wisconsin finally renounces it's vile Union history.
Must be a spoof.
No one could possibly be this consistently insufferable.
What? As opposed to Unions who try to Buy elections?
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