Althouse: "Harvard historian Niall Ferguson schools MSNBC’s Mika on what has happened in Egypt and Obama’s incompetence."

February 15, 2011

"Harvard historian Niall Ferguson schools MSNBC’s Mika on what has happened in Egypt and Obama’s incompetence."

266 comments:

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Michael said...: Victoria: "I bet he changed the spelling of his name to make him sound more intelligent."

Open minded and worldly lefties!! Take note of their deep understanding of how one gets to sound more intelligent. Your name makes sounds in their world, not words. And those funny foreign spellings of names are just too much when the opinions don't match your own.; 2/15/11, 9:04 PM
shiloh said...: No short-haired, yellow-bellied, son of tricky dicky is gonna mother hubbard soft soap me with just a pocketful of soap ~ It's money for dope ~ Money for rope

Kumbaya!

During the Afghan/U.S.S.R war in the '80s Dutch supported the Afghan resistance ie Osama bin Laden ~ hmm, whatever happened to bin Laden ?!?

>

Always enjoyed Crossfire during the '70s/'80s as Buckley was both informative and entertaining ...

Too bad Rich, I'm sure I'm not the only male in America who, when palin dropped her first wink, sat up a little straighter on the couch and said, "Hey, I think she just winked at me." And her smile. By the end, when she clearly knew she was doing well, it was so sparkling it was almost mesmerizing. It sent little starbursts through the screen and ricocheting around the living rooms of America. This is a quality that can't be learned; it's either something you have or you don't, and man, she's got it., Lowry is now the National Review editor as William F. Buckley, Jr. surely is turnin' over in his grave ...

You bet'cha!

carry on; 2/15/11, 9:08 PM
Synova said...: "Haplessness is not what you accuse someone of for conceding that events are best left in the hands of those who have a better reason for controlling those events."

No, haplessness is what you accuse someone of for having a different policy statement every day of the week.

How this differs from a coherent policy of non-interference is obvious to anyone not invested in making excuses for Obama.; 2/15/11, 9:10 PM
Freeman Hunt said...: The difference is that we invaded Iraq and forced a 'revolution' while in Egypt the people rose up and forced the 'revolution'.

Big difference.

Are you serious? The people of Iraq couldn't have a revolution because Saddam killed anyone merely suspected of being disloyal to him. Also, Iraq is full of mass graves.

Now perhaps you'd like to tell us how we should have allowed Jews in concentration camps to rise up in revolution rather than having the Allies interfere.; 2/15/11, 9:12 PM
Blue@9 said...: I don't understand why some of you are presenting the false choice of "Be an imperious hegemon or don't do anything." It's a strange formulation in an age where people are trumpeting "soft power" and "smart diplomacy."

Also, if you listen closely to Ferguson, he is not saying Obama should have acted like an emperor or that he should have taken any particular position on Egypt, but rather that Obama should have a strategy behind whatever policy he chooses. That, and the fact that Obama couldn't identify a policy at all is what has people like Ferguson upset.

We may not be an empire, and we may not be able to dictate events, but what the U.S. says or doesn't say is very important on the world stage. Giving out contradictory or confusing policy statements does indeed make us look amateurish.; 2/15/11, 9:12 PM
kent said...: I don't understand why some of you are presenting the false choice of "Be an imperious hegemon or don't do anything."

Be kind. It's the very best strawman they could hurriedly slap together, on such short notice.; 2/15/11, 9:15 PM
Ritmo Re-Animated said...: It's funny reading the initial comments that obsess on the typical issues: Looks, appearances, looks, appearances. Predictable and shallow as always.

What Mika is conveying is a sense of incredulity. She probably assumed that Ferguson would say something reasonable and well-supported, rather than just jumping on the Glenn Beck bandwagon. And when you jump on an alcoholic's wagon, that's not a good thing.; 2/15/11, 9:17 PM
Ritmo Re-Animated said...: Ok. Obama should be the Hugh Cleaver of the Middle East. Wally and the Beav need clarity and direction. Or maybe they don't.

You guys obsess about image and presentation so damn much it makes me think we should just install some right-wing celebrity figurehead as the emissary of America's Voice to The World, just so he can pontificate with clarity.; 2/15/11, 9:21 PM
PSGInfinity said...: If we made sobriety a prerequisite for leading parades, where would that leave the Kennedy's following?

wv: converse - seems apropos...; 2/15/11, 9:26 PM
Ritmo Re-Animated said...: The only Kennedy that really mattered (or would have mattered) was Bobby.

And I guess JFK was important for giving the cons a sense of appreciation for the kind of fluff that they didn't get in the flesh until Reagan. But I'm saying that for your sake, not mine.

Not a drunk between the two of them.; 2/15/11, 9:30 PM
Patrick said...: I have never heard of Mika, and I always thought Ferguson's first name was pronounced NYE-AL. If that is the cost of not having cable, I am quite willing to pay it.

Unfortunately, there is the whole Rose bowl on ESPN thing I need to work out.; 2/15/11, 9:30 PM
KCFleming said...: Mika was in way over her head, hoping her assertion of success was sufficient.

Niall made her look rather foolish. She hardly managed a coherent resonse in reply; 2/15/11, 9:32 PM
Ritmo Re-Animated said...: Apropos of alcohol, I think a fun drinking game would be to take a shot every time another con comes in here to opine on the "look" of things.

I imagine we could get a very high count that way.; 2/15/11, 9:34 PM
traditionalguy said...: All of this nonsense about Obama did or did not do a proper Presidential job just the right way is only wasting time. Obama could do very little. The GOP candidates and the British with their better than thou lectures are not touching Obama. They are only reminding us that he has the Presidential authority in war and foreign policy. What is important today is the regulatory agencies forbidding Americans from doing business without Obama's a fascist like permits being unreasonably withheld by his Czars.; 2/15/11, 9:35 PM
Ritmo Re-Animated said...: Well, at least we have one honest conservative.

Do you know how happy traditional guy makes me to know that his views exist?; 2/15/11, 9:37 PM
shiloh said...: Indeed C4 as Reps are totally obsessed w/female superficiality ie palin types, airhead babes.

To be fair, politics has a lot to do w/looks/appearance w/both Dems and Reps ie Scott Brown/JFK etc.

But when conservatives continually go after what they deem liberal female reporters/media and female Dem politicians re: appearance it just makes them look petty and pathetic ... and attacking our current educated/eloquent first lady is the crown jewel of ignorance/stupidity.

Remember when Teresa Heinz Kerry said Laura Bush never had a real job ?!? as one wonders how many votes Kerry lost in 2004 every time Ms. Heinz opened her mouth, eh.

I digress.

Paraphrasing Adm. Kirk in Star Trek II ~ Republicans keep missing the target!

>

Attack the message, not the messenger ie (((Big Picture))) is how you win presidential elections ~ and of course $$$.

One can't have a positive message when they always look soooo frickin' angry lol ie after the Reps won a wave election in 2010 most of them still look like someone just stole their puppy!

take care; 2/15/11, 9:39 PM
Alex said...: But when conservatives continually go after what they deem liberal female reporters/media and female Dem politicians re: appearance it just makes them look petty and pathetic ... and attacking our current educated/eloquent first lady is the crown jewel of ignorance/stupidity.

Wishful thinking. Everyone can see Michelle has a fat ass.; 2/15/11, 9:43 PM
Ritmo Re-Animated said...: And it's not just that... Notice how The Good Dr. Pogo says "made her look rather..."?

No comment on what her response might have actually been, just how she looked.

It looks like looks have become more important than credible explanations.; 2/15/11, 9:45 PM
Alex said...: Ritmo is either supremely confident that the USA is going to turn into a Commie paradise or is the best bluffer ever. More of a fluffer if you get my drift, hardy har har!; 2/15/11, 9:46 PM
David said...: FS sez "An understanding of modern history would include acknowledging a century of British cockups in the Middle East."

Have you actually read Ferguson's books? That's a rhetorical question, because obviously you have not.

Liberals: Making Up Facts Since 1963.; 2/15/11, 9:48 PM
Ritmo Re-Animated said...: Alex, I know you can't see it. But right now I have given you a look like "you're crazy!"

Maybe you can feel it!

(Feelings are also important. Feelings and looks).

Actually, I applaud your interest in humor.; 2/15/11, 9:49 PM
Alex said...: Ritmo - it pays to have a sense of humor when fluffing is your profession.; 2/15/11, 9:51 PM
Ritmo Re-Animated said...: Haha. I also see that Dust Bowl Queen called someone a "lazy fuck" for refusing to source what amounts to common knowledge. Lol. Good times.

Here's a clue: When you take issue with something that someone says, you might want to do at least enough homework to provide evidence for the criticism.; 2/15/11, 9:54 PM
shiloh said...: Wishful thinking. Everyone can see Michelle has a fat ass.

Then why repeat the obvious, as you say, ad nauseam ?!? Rhetorical question.

But it's good to know many of Ann's wingers are totally fixated on our first lady's behind.

>

hmm, many jokes come to mind, but I'll refrain.

ciao; 2/15/11, 9:54 PM
kent said...: our current educated/eloquent first lady

Ickiest. Online. Crush. EVAH.; 2/15/11, 9:55 PM
Ritmo Re-Animated said...: So says someone who wears spandex tights and a superhero outfit.

Kent reminds me of some of these guys.; 2/15/11, 9:56 PM
shiloh said...: apologies to Star Wars clones ;); 2/15/11, 10:00 PM
DADvocate said...: Ferguson doesn't mince words. I'm betting his fears will be realized before the democratic utopia the airheads on MSNBC think will rise from the ashes occurs. Mika, et al seemed completely incapable of comprehending what Ferguson was saying.

Democracy doesn't have the same meaning around the world that it has to us. Most of these people don't expect their governments to be democratic any more than most of us expect our churches to be democratic as in Catholics, Mormons and many other religions.; 2/15/11, 10:08 PM
former law student said...: Obama's NSC and State Department were caught flat-footed, yes?

They're not on Facebook?

Let's go back to this:

identify and encourage pro-democracy groups beforehand.

What pro-democracy groups? This is a Critical Mass-style revolution -- just show up. Facebook is the organization, not a network of cells, each one a bunch of revolutionaries huddling around a guttering candle and a shortwave, listening to the Voice of Freedom, waiting for the Liberators to parachute in.; 2/15/11, 10:11 PM
former law student said...: Obama should have a strategy behind whatever policy he chooses.

Obama's strategy was to support our old friend Mubarak up until the moment he couldn't. And having an orderly transition over the next several months sounded better than kicking him out and letting the military take over -- an octogenarian must realize a changing of the guard is inevitable -- but events moved and that possibility was closed off.; 2/15/11, 10:15 PM
chuck said...: Add to that issue that most Egyptian men seem to think that Western women are equivalent to whores.

Not without reason, the boomer girls did their best to implant that impression abroad. Adventurous, sure. Smart? No way.; 2/15/11, 10:16 PM
former law student said...: Have you actually read Ferguson's books?

Was that a prerequisite for watching him on TeeVee?

The dude just started talking and that's what came out.; 2/15/11, 10:17 PM
former law student said...: If Ferguson were a serious man he wouldn't have ditched the mother of his three children.; 2/15/11, 10:22 PM
jr565 said...: C4BDH wrote:
Not a drunk between the two of them.

You know who also isn't a drunk. Obama. But he is a cokehead.; 2/15/11, 10:31 PM
george said...: "I am sure you know what they should want...better than they do."

Funny how this argument should apply to Islamic revolutionaries but when it comes time to decide what to do with the money in my pocket...; 2/15/11, 10:38 PM
Republican said...: Obama's strategy was simply to have no strategy.

He is a leaf in the stream of international policy.; 2/15/11, 10:43 PM
Anonymous said...: This schooling was thorough. I'm not sure why the lefties here are so defensive. It could easily have gone the other way with an airhead on FOX and a Republican president with third-rate policymakers. Like the ones who advised Reagan to flee Beirut, for example.

I am on a jeremiad of late to point out that this Republicans-must-be wrong-if-I-am-to-be-right goofiness and this Democrats-must-be wrong-if-I-am-to-be-right goofiness leads nowhere.

We can all agree to the following:

1. This journalist, like most journalists, showed herself to be a complete airhead.

2. Obama has shown no coherent policy toward Egypt whatsoever.; 2/15/11, 11:02 PM
bagoh20 said...: "Lennon had many things to say. Almost all of them very wise. Most of them way before their time.

He was ahead of the game, no doubt."

Maybe if you're in Junior High, and already smoking up for lunch. Holy crap on a waffle!; 2/15/11, 11:11 PM
kent said...: This schooling was thorough. I'm not sure why the lefties here are so defensive.

Religious fanaticism. Ugly, ugly thing, really. Like Rachel Maddow, in a thong.; 2/15/11, 11:25 PM
Anonymous said...: FLS -- Bill Clinton thanks God twice a day (three times on Thursdays and major holidays) that we do not judge professionals by their grotesque and disgusting personal failings.

So, what else do you have?; 2/15/11, 11:34 PM
Emil Blatz said...: Jeez. He unloaded.; 2/15/11, 11:49 PM
Cedarford said...: Matt said...
Dust Bunny Queen

Niall Ferguson believes Europe would have been better off if England would have not entered the war and Germany had won WW1.

Niall Ferguson thinks Henry Kissinger - who orchestrated war crimes in Cambodia, Laos, Bangladesh and Timor and who supported Pinochet's crimes against the people of Chile - was a great Secretary of State.
-----------------------
1. Had Germany been allowed, not to win WWI but end it as it sought to in 1917? No Red Terror. No mass starvation of 2 million Germans. No Ukrainian genocide. No Great Depression. No Hitler. No WWII. No "Anglo-French" redrawing the maps of the ME or planting the Zionists smack dab in the middle of the Mahgreb as a reward for Jewish financiers of WWI.
Germany would not have been ever considered "in the right". Or the just victor. And still would have transferred significant reparations to the Congo butchers in Belgium, the French, and the Brits by the 1917 deal they sought.
Had Great Britain avoided the Triple Entente and stayed out of WWI, they would have preserved the British Empire.

2. Kissinger is no more a war criminal than Lincoln, FDR, Truman, or LBJ were. Or SOS like Stimson, Rusk, Colin Powell were.
Can't blame him for what the SE Asia commie Gooks, Chilean right, or Paki Islamoid soldier-butchers did in Bangladesh.; 2/16/11, 12:32 AM
kent said...: Bill Clinton thanks God twice a day (three times on Thursdays and major holidays) that we do not judge professionals by their grotesque and disgusting personal failings.

"Ex"- Klan Imperial Wizard Robert Byrd, "Ex"-Nazi sympathizer George Soros and "Ex"-cokehead Barack Obama doubtless all heave massive sighs of relief, as well.; 2/16/11, 1:00 AM
jamboree said...: Pfft. Cookies and milk.

I'd like to have seen Philip Seymour Hoffman's character from "Charlie Wilson's War" rip them a new one.

:-D; 2/16/11, 2:00 AM
Michael said...: "What Mika is conveying is a sense of incredulity. She probably assumed that Ferguson would say something reasonable and well-supported, rather than just jumping on the Glenn Beck bandwagon. And when you jump on an alcoholic's wagon, that's not a good thing."

The Glen Beck bandwagon? I am not sure that Beck holds any of the views expressed by Ferguson but then I don't watch Beck. So thanks for doing it for me.

I personally have read several of Ferguson's books and thus know a bit more than could be gleaned from a review in The New Republic about his views on several topics. Unlike the author of the nonsense quoted above I could not find anything in Ferguson's argument that could be easily refuted even by pure snark. But point out refutable positions would take work, thought, and snark does not.; 2/16/11, 4:48 AM
kent said...: Unlike the author of the nonsense quoted above I could not find anything in Ferguson's argument that could be easily refuted even by pure snark. But point out refutable positions would take work, thought, and snark does not.

They're finally coming -- with agonizing slowness, granted -- to the dim, drear realization that, no, their beloved Boy King won't be lifting them all bodily into sweet, sweet socialist heaven, after all.

No magical, light-speed, Wonka-powered intercontinental choo-choo network. No shouting, Egypt-style throngs spontaneously arising in Florida and New Jersey and Wisconsin in order to sack and pillage stubborn taxpayers on behalf of their beloved SEIU slugs and slatterns. No more government-sponsored tumbrels and bastinados for those too stubbornly scientifically literate to take in much (if any) of their "global warming" magical thinking without an accompanying fusillade of giggles.

Naturally, then: they're more than just a wee bit pouty, right about now.; 2/16/11, 5:45 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: Niall Ferguson believes Europe would have been better off if England would have not entered the war and Germany had won WW1.

Well its possible he's right. Had Britain sat out WW1, they wouldn't have lost a generation of young Brits. If Germay had won, highly likely if not a foregone conclusion that Hitler would have never rose to power since his talking points (Versailles, humuliation, backstabed at peace talks) would have never occured.

The Kaiser may have been a bastard but he was no Hitler.; 2/16/11, 7:21 AM
Fen said...: Obama's strategy was simply to have no strategy.

To be more precise, Obama's strategy was to position himself favorably for the aftermath.

Pattern of his life.; 2/16/11, 8:05 AM
Roger J. said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 2/16/11, 8:30 AM
Roger J. said...: a small point directed to my friend Ritmo--the author of the prince was his tome to suck up to his employers--you should focus on the last several paragraphs of the prince to understand where his sentiments really resided

And you might want to peruse "Discourses on Livy" to understand Machiavelli's underlying political philosophy.

Your understanding of the classics seems to be a bit superficial.; 2/16/11, 8:34 AM
Fen said...: Just watched the clip. What a dingbat "journalist". She really thinks Obama's "flip followed by flop followed by flip" contributed positively to the outcome in Egypt.

If only Obama has chosen to take another "golfing" vacation that week...; 2/16/11, 8:34 AM
knox said...: Brutal. Embarrassing. Awesome!

I love the deer in the headlights look everyone has.; 2/16/11, 8:48 AM
Henry said...: @Fen. The most idiotic word out of her mouth was "was" -- as in the revolution "was a success". We know the media has a very short attention span, but that block against future thinking is an impairment like something out of an Oliver Sacks book.

* * *

@FLS wrote "An understanding of modern history would include acknowledging a century of British cockups in the Middle East."

Obama has avoided a debacle of Anthony Eden proportions. You have to give him credit for that.

Actually, I'm pretty much in agreement with your 10:15 pm above. But I'm also in agreement with Fen's 8:05 am.

Given how little influence any foreign nation can have on such an event, Obama's first, best, task was to avoid direct action. Success! His next task was to make the U.S. (and himself) not look foolish. Failure! But it's a failure of picayune importance.; 2/16/11, 8:52 AM
Scott M said...: But it's a failure of picayune importance.

Maybe on it's own, but as yet another straw on the camel's back of poorly handled incidents...well, you know what's bound to happen.; 2/16/11, 8:56 AM
roesch-voltaire said...: I am a bit surprised at this narrow and partisan take by Ferguson as I like much of his work on colonialism. The failure to anticipate the revolution, even though youth groups have been networking for years to promote change, rests with the CIA and the State Department as much as with Obama. Further if democracy in Egypt happens, it will be far more effective because it will be put in place by Egyptians for Egypt and not as a result of our interference (army). What is he suggesting that we do differently? Step in with what? Oh yes these are poor, poorly educated folks who need our colonial help-- give me a break.; 2/16/11, 9:01 AM
Roger J. said...: You are aware RV that the CIA and the State Department work for Mr Obama? are you suggesting he has no control over them?; 2/16/11, 9:24 AM
Roger J. said...: rv--as to the rest of your comments I am in agreement--except with your rather absurd postulation that military intervention would be appropriate--
this is an Egyptian revolution and no one has any idea what he final outcome will be--the only thing we know is (really) that nothing has changed in Egypt--the military is, as it always been since King Farouk was deposed by Naguib and Nasser, is in full congtrol--I see no democratic outcome at this point but things could change if the military so allows; 2/16/11, 9:32 AM
Michael said...: rv: The only thing "partisan" about Ferguson's take is that he thinks the president did a terrible job of enunciating a policy. Criticism is not partisan if it comes from a center left member of the academy or anybody else for that matter. Which point of his do you think were mistaken or motivated by his politics? Is it partisan to observe that our president had a thin resume before leading us? Is it partisan to remark that Kissinger was a better hand a diplomacy than Hillary?; 2/16/11, 9:44 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: the author of the prince was his tome to suck up to his employers--you should focus on the last several paragraphs of the prince to understand where his sentiments really resided

I remember reading The Prince in college in one of my Poli Sci classes. The 'hidden meaning' wasn't so hidden once you read it clearly.

Your [Ritmo] understanding of the classics seems to be a bit superficial.

I think his superficialness goes well beyond the classics ;-); 2/16/11, 9:45 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: What is he suggesting that we do differently? Step in with what? Oh yes these are poor, poorly educated folks who need our colonial help-- give me a break.

RV do you find it ironic that the most respected institution in Egypt is the Egyptican army which relies heavily on the generosity of $2 billion annually of US 'help' and training?

Maybe we should cut off that 'colonial help' and let them go it alone.; 2/16/11, 9:51 AM
former law student said...: Our foreign aid to Egypt mirrors our foreign aid to Israel: a continual reward for continued good behavior to Israel. Why would we welch on a deal that has succeeded for over 30 years?

7M: if I have ever supported any observation that came out of Billy Jeff's mouth I withdraw it here and now.; 2/16/11, 9:59 AM
Hoosier Daddy said...: Our foreign aid to Egypt mirrors our foreign aid to Israel: a continual reward for continued good behavior to Israel. Why would we welch on a deal that has succeeded for over 30 years?

RV was mocking our 'colonial help' to the poor uneducated masses in Egypt. I merely wanted to know if that 'colonial help' also included propping up thier 'most respected institution.'

Like I said, liberals tend to be like teenagers in that they enjoy the financial largese that parents provide but don't want to be told what to do.; 2/16/11, 10:35 AM
Roger J. said...: FLS--of course we have propped up the dictator ship in Egypt for 30 years--I will stipulate that.

The downside is that as a result of Mr Obama's inept handling the saudis have apparently promised Egypt they will make up any diminution of US aid to Egypt.

A wonderful outcome to US foreign policy--removing the only lever we had--and now Egypt, that sits aside the Suez canal, is in a state of flux.; 2/16/11, 10:44 AM
shiloh said...: Re: failed intelligence ...

Israel is right next door and their very existence depends on 100% accurate intelligence and they were as clueless as American intelligence re: Egypt's insurrection.

Simple solution: just ask the WIKI leaks folk! :) as they seem to know everything, eh.

>

We now return you to non-stop, disingenuous sarcasm er total (((obsession))) concerning the freely elected 44th President of the United States of America!

take care, blessings; 2/16/11, 11:41 AM
kent said...: We now return you to non-stop, disingenuous sarcasm er total (((obsession))) concerning the freely elected 44th President of the United States of America!

Every time Serene Branson posts something here, an angel coughs up blood and dies.; 2/16/11, 12:06 PM
lemondog said...: PBS series based on Ferguson book 'Ascent of Money'; 2/16/11, 3:13 PM

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