Meanwhile, back in America — and consider that most of Megrahi's victims were American — Barack Obama is displeased:
"We have been in contact with the Scottish government indicating that we objected to it," President Barack Obama said of Thursday's release.Indicating that we objected... Let me indicate that I find Barack Obama infuriatingly bland. Has he ever showed passion (this purveyor of empathy) – has he ever showed staunch resolve in the war on terror?
"We thought it was a mistake. We are now in contact with the Libyan government, and want to make sure that if in fact this transfer has taken place, he is not welcomed back in some way but instead should be under house arrest...."
Janet Daley writes:
The credibility of Barack Obama’s influence on the world is going to take at least as hard a knock. In the end, all the protests and all the diplomatic pressure from the White House counted for nothing. Scotland’s determination to return Megrahi to the bosom of his family and his homeland was not going to be blocked.
The rehabilitation of America’s standing in the world was going to be one of the great gains, if you remember, of the Obama election victory.... The President and his Secretary of State could do nothing - for all their administration’s supposed global prestige - to prevent what they considered to be an outrage. On yet another score, Mr Obama could not deliver the goods.
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79 comments:
Scotland... I believe the term Hawaiian prep school boys who find their true black roots on the streets of Chicago after graduating from Columbia and Harvard Law School is... "You got played"
We could hire Blackwater to kill him.
Found your site on alphainventions.com
For all his foreign travel since he took office, it's pretty clear that Barack Obama is not much interested in foreign affairs, and that goes double for anything that might smack of the US pushing hard for our own interests.
We believe in democracy, and they use democracy against us, but practice it not.
We believe in compassion, and they use compassion against us, but practice it not.
We believe in human rights, and they use that belief against us, but practice it not.
We believe in religious freedom, and they use it against us, but practice it not.
@PJ, I'm going to assume you meant al-Megrahi?
... "You got played"
... soon to be replaced by the hipper, fresher: "You got wee-wee'd!"
You take the high road, and I'll take the low road and I'll be in Scotland a'fore ye.
Or out of Scotland, as the case may be
Obama can get passionate, but only when there's a real injustice, like Rush Limbaugh opposing his health plan or something.
"Or else?"
"Or else we will be very very angry with you, and we will write you a letter about how very very angry we are."
From "Team America World Police," a fable for our time.
"Obama can get passionate, but only when there's a real injustice, like Rush Limbaugh opposing his health plan or something."
...or when he can't just eat his waffle.
I would like folks to take note the 'heros welcome' he received upon arrival. The man slaughterd 270 innocent and he gets a hero's welcome.
This is why we will never, ever come to any kind of peaceful terms with savages. Yes, I said savages.
Those fictional CIA hit squads (or Blackwater contractors) sure would come in handy right about now. And it would be a mercy killing for poor sick ole al-Mergrahi, too.
As to Barry, the man has done worse in six months than Carter did in four years. He's a joke both here and abroad.
For all his foreign travel since he took office, it's pretty clear that Barack Obama is not much interested in foreign affairs,
Only to the extent it requires an apology or reference to our arrogance.
Other than that yes you are correct sir.
More passion from Obama?
Come on, it's not like this guy was some right-winger -- you know, a real terrorist.
"This is why we will never, ever come to any kind of peaceful terms with savages. Yes, I said savages."
And you are right to say it.
I doubt the Scottish people supported this? Another case perhaps of the political class doing whatever they please.
Well, looks like I won't be going to Scotland or Libya anytime soon.
"I doubt the Scottish people supported this? Another case perhaps of the political class doing whatever they please."
Go and read the comments section on this story in "The Scotsman".
There's lots of support for this.
It's seen as Scotland exercising its' independence and 'stuffing' the Brits and Americans.
The Soros/Democrat foreign policy is 100% dedicated to the appeasement of Muslim murderers while also using every diplomatic tool available to weaken any enemies of the Venezuelan Marxist Dictator for life. Now that he has been given the green light by Obama and the Democrats in Congress, that Dictator is furiously working to set up a Western Hemisphere bastion for Putin and Amadinighad to protect him while his forces work their way thru the conquest of Columbia, Panama, Honduras, and Mexico before moving north.It is not a pretty sight to sit by and watch Obama smile while he intentionally destroys America's power to protect itself.
Hey look everyone. President BarelyCare is going to raise the United States standing in the world and they won't hate us anymore now that he's in office. Guess what? Fail.
wv = tryeded = close cousin of wee weed.
Big Mike:
I agree with you- President Obama is mostly interested in wealth re-distribution here. Foreign policy takes a seat way behind that priority.
Is it possible to declare war just on Scotland? Or would the same Scots that LarsPorsena mentioned who are thrilled to be "stuffing the Brits" come running to Downing Street for protection?
I saw the headline for this and though "Oh, somehow this will be Obama's fault." And sure enough, Althouse obliges with a commentator who...thinks that it's Obama's fault!
So sorry that the President of the United States can't dictate to the independent judges of a foreign country, but that's the way the rule of law works, you know?
The rehabilitation of America’s standing in the world was going to be one of the great gains, if you remember, of the Obama election victory...
This is exactly what he meant by that campaign promise: Not raising a stink about Muslim terrorism in ways that put any kind of pressure on those governments that choose to appease radicalism. Doing nothing that would cause western diplomats to feel the least bit uncomfortable at a UN cocktail party at which we were represented.
'Scots, wha hæ wi' Wallace bled,
Scots, wham Bruce has aften led,
Welcome tæ yer gory bed, Or tæ Victorie!
'Lay the proud usurpers low!
Tyrants fall in every foe!
Liberty's in every blow! -
Let us do or dee!'
guess they decided to dee like the rest of uk.....
Hey, I thought Obama was going to "reboot" America's image in the world, in the Muslim world particularly. Those were his words. Did he mean it or not? He should have thanked the Scottish judge, and could've perhaps should've even been there among those cheering as the guy got off the plane. Instead here he is acting like Bush.
So sorry that the President of the United States can't dictate to the independent judges of a foreign country, but that's the way the rule of law works, you know?
Conveniently, you just made my point.
No, he can't dictate to them. But he and his administration could have expressed at least, say, 1/4th of the moral outrage they express at some old guy disagreeing with his health plan at a town hall meeting.
Apparently the Scots and the Libyans read between the lines of Obama's words the same way the gays do: He's just saying it for the rubes.
im surprised obama's not happy about this. after all, hes proposed a new christian government for the usa what with his sermon on the health plan... why would he be opposed to turning the other cheek??
"But he and his administration could have expressed at least, say, 1/4th of the moral outrage they express at some old guy disagreeing with his health plan at a town hall meeting."
obama's not good at faking emotions. notice he usually doesnt express any emotions except annoyance or anger when someone crosses him. why would he try to fake being upset about this? he doesn't care.
I'm lazy right now and don't feel like looking it up, but wasn't there one of these terrorists who has a questionable guilt? As in, the Israeli intelligence doesn't believe the guy is guilty but rather took the fall? I heard this story recently, and thought it interesting, and maybe a factor.
Still... it's a very bad message and doesn't reflect well on Scotland.
So, for the sake of my McBride forebears, I will take a wee moment to remind the Althousia of the fine efforts of Alex McIlveen", who knew the right way to treat a terrorist.
Xanthippas wrote: So sorry that the President of the United States can't dictate to the independent judges of a foreign country, but that's the way the rule of law works, you know?
He wasn't released by a judge. He was released by a political appointee.
A POTUS who wasn't dubbed "President Pantywaist" in the British press might have had some influence on this decision.
WV uribadst: Really wee-weed up!
As a tribute to this warrior for Mohammed, we should send him the latest in suicide bomber belts, but put in a GE microchip that detonates whenever the Taliban uses one to blow up another American convoy of nation-building National Guardsmen in the Taliban's Afghan Mountain shooting gallery.
I don't think it was Obama's fault. I was just trying to be funny.
I think this release and subsequent embarrasment is the fault of the international Left. They are the ones who believe that you can show compassion for those who are willing to kill innocent civilians and that, in turn, they'll eventually show compassion for you. Unfortunately, that's not the case in the vast majority of these "cases". Islamic jihadists have declared war against the west, whether it's under the umbrella of a rogue nation like Libya or independent of one. They will not rest until we are either dead or converted. For all the talk during the Bush administration from opponents of the WOT about how we only need to seek out the terrorists and bring them to justice, it makes me wonder what the Left truly thinks when they release a perfect example of what they claim to be a clean prosecution.
I will admit in all seriousness, I am disappointed with the Scots over this. For someone who admires their culture and independence, this strikes me as very un-highlander like. Or maybe I just had them all wrong from jumpstreet.
Now the Poles would have just shot the fucker.
"Has he ever showed passion (this purveyor of empathy) – has he ever showed staunch resolve in the war on terror?"
That's moronic. The whole point is that "showing staunch resolve" is a macho pantomime that resolves precisely nothing. It was painfully dumb when Bush did it, and how many terrorist plots did the rhetoric and playacting avert? None.
You know what averts terrorist plots? Intelligence. Not declaring and fighting war on a word.
p.s. The Obama presidency is restoring America's standing in the world. Just talk to anyone outside of America. The Instapunditian "Obama got elected and not every fucking problem in the world got instantly resolved, I guess you guys are suckers" schtick is dumb, so so dumb. Hey guess what, probably 98% of people who were enthusiastic about Obama's election didn't expect a magic pony show, so why don't you drop the act? You're making an ass out of yourself.
but that's the way the rule of law works, you know?
it's a textbook example, which is why it's inadequate to defend us from those who make war on civilians. the humane response was to wage war on this guy and those that support him.
No, he can't dictate to them. But he and his administration could have expressed at least, say, 1/4th of the moral outrage they express at some old guy disagreeing with his health plan at a town hall meeting.
Mr. Stodder wins the thread.
wv-hormorp = I ain't touching that one.
You know what averts terrorist plots? Intelligence.
Indeed. Too bad the Democrats and the NY Times were falling all overthemselves in hamstringing that part of the battle too.
The Obama presidency is restoring America's standing in the world. Just talk to anyone outside of America.
If restoring our standing means having to offer heartfelt apologies because we removed Saddam Hussein and are locking up Islamofascists on a Carribean island then count me as unimpressed. If that's what it takes for Paris or Bonn to like me now, fuck em.
A brother of one of the victims said the Scots board had turned down all six previous appeals in similar cases.
Not declaring and fighting war on a word.
Actually I thought Bush was an idiot for the WoT crap when the enemy was easily identified as Islamofascist savages such as those who provide heros welcomes for returning terrorists.
The last thing we'd need would be for the CIA or Blackwater to try to kill al-Megrahi. We'd end up with a failed civil war, the wrong people getting killed and all sorts of idiotic plans that would make even the writers of Austin Powers blush.
The one thing arguably more incompetent than Obama is the CIA.
The rehabilitation of America’s standing in the world was going to be one of the great gains, if you remember, of the Obama election victory...
I think this is pretty much what the people who thought America's standing needed rehabilitation had in mind. They were and are embarrassed by our influence in the world and would prefer to see us as just another country, dispensible.
I would like folks to take note the 'heros welcome' he received upon arrival. The man slaughterd 270 innocent and he gets a hero's welcome.
This is why we will never, ever come to any kind of peaceful terms with savages. Yes, I said savages.
Indeed.
In the same vein, can you imagine the POTUS communicating with the Libyans that people will be all wee-weed up if this guy is given a hero's welcome?
And, of course, he is given a hero's welcome and Ghadafi's son welcomes him at the airport!
I'm sure a strong letter from The One will follow.
Get used to it! It's Obamaworld!
There was a time and a group of Scots...namely the Border Reiver's whose only allowance for someone like the Lockerbie Bomber would be to release him from his cell to receive Jedhart Justice - Hang them first and hold their trial later.
Unfortunately the wisdom of too many in authority today is that we be sympathetic to butchers while ignoring the victims and their families.
From NBC News:
British Rev. John Mosey, whose daughter Helga, 19, died in the attack, said Wednesday he would be glad to see al-Megrahi return home.
"It is right he should go home to die in dignity with his family. I believe it is our Christian duty to show mercy," he said.
Is it Christian doctrine to show mercy to the merciless? I can't believe that is the case. But not being a Christian I don't know. Someone, anyone, say it ain't so.
The die in dignity phrase leaves me speechless.
"
Is it Christian doctrine to show mercy to the merciless? I can't believe that is the case. But not being a Christian I don't know. Someone, anyone, say it ain't so."
sorry to say this, but christianity does NOT make a sound basis for governance. christianity is not a political philosophy and pretending it is will get you killed.
In Obama's circles, the attack was just another one of those unfortunate chickens coming home to roost things.
America, running dog imperialist.
Meanwhile, Oblahblah and his Obots prepare to repel the "evil mongers" at home.
Bonn
Berlin. Bonn is famous again for Beethoven alone.
Or perhaps you meant Brussels?
"British Foreign Secretary David Miliband described the scenes as "deeply distressing". "
His reaction more so.
"obama's not good at faking emotions. notice he usually doesnt express any emotions except annoyance or anger when someone crosses him"
Pay attention people. This man is a psychopath who suffers from extreme Narcissistic Personality Disorder. His whole world is his self image and self importance. Look at his eyes. He's dead inside.
This is the stock from which tyrants come. Often these people are very charismatic and popular because their emptiness is a perfect vessel for the adoring masses to fill with their own projected qualities.
President Obama is always ahead of us on making our world better. He plans to bring Meghrhia here and remand him to a Single Payer Plan for deciding what health care he recieves. Mercy and justice become one.
Montaigne wrote: That's moronic. The whole point is that "showing staunch resolve" is a macho pantomime that resolves precisely nothing. It was painfully dumb when Bush did it, and how many terrorist plots did the rhetoric and playacting avert?
Well, I guess the answer would be "all of them," 'cause after 9-11 there were no terrorist attacks on the US during the Bush administration. Wasn't that "the whole point?"
Can you say the part about "macho pantomime" and "painfully dumb" in French for us?
Obama's on beta blockers.
That's why we didn't see his medical records.
That explains his blandness.
WV speripar
No idea
ricpic wrote (11:17): Is it Christian doctrine to show mercy to the merciless?
Christianity teaches justice and righteousness in addition to mercy. The Scots did not need to release this man to show him mercy and, as far as we know, his release was neither just nor righteous.
Rev. Mosey is apparently confusing personal acts of Christian charity with appropriate public policy.
Where is everybody shouting "No blood for oil!"?
It is about oil. Libya gave BP (British Petroleum) a plum contract and 2 days later this guy is free.
John Henry
Montagne Mointaigne said:
"The Obama presidency is restoring America's standing in the world. Just talk to anyone outside of America."
The U.S. government deals with other governments, not the man in the foreign street. I don't see any evidence that Obama can deal more effectively with the governments of Iran, N. Korea, France, Germany, the U.K., or any other.
As for the ordinary people of these nations, perhaps many of them like Obama more than Bush, but who cares? The question is whether they like America, not Obama, more than before. Or more precisely, whether they admire what America represents. I doubt that much has changed in that respect. But if we are now more admired because we elected Obama, or because we're debating whether to nationalize health care, screw 'em. Why should we care?
"has he ever showed staunch resolve in the war on terror?"
He's just not a staunch character!
How it could have been:
The President calls Gahdaffy and says, "Abdelbaset will be met at the airport by guards and then put into an ambulance and driven to home or hospital. There will be no hoopala--or else..."
At the time of the arrival, a stealth bomber orbits over the Tripoly airport. If the above conditions are met then nothing happens. If what actually happened took place, the order for the cluster bombs to be released is given.
elHombre-- by that standard, I guess Obama's lack of staunchness or whatever the hell you call it ALSO prevents 100% of terrorist plots. So we win either way. good for us.
It would have been ironic if someone had shot the plane down over Scotland "all on their own." We could have given them an eight year prison sentence.
Maybe we should do something like that, give early releases to all criminals in the US who have committed crimes against people from Scotland.
The "welcome home" is disgusting, an abomination.
Just how "terminally ill" is that guy? He should be on a stretcher and have tubes attached
What good would tubes do? He's past the point of treatment, apparently.
But consider terminally ill Elizabeth Edwards. She's appeared in public many times without tubes or stretchers.
Life imprisonment is not life imprisonment if you let the man go free.
This is a total miscarriage of justice and should not be allowed to stand. He killed a lot of Americans, and there's no need for us to let that go just because Scotland wants to.
Shoot him.
As for the welcome he received, vile. I would have expected better from Libyans.
"AJ Lynch said...
I doubt the Scottish people supported this? Another case perhaps of the political class doing whatever they please."
I don't know. I'd be surprised if a majority of people did indeed support it, I must admit, but as with any crime that potentially involves a political angle, there's definitely a vocal minority who's read the Scottish Criminal Cases Review commision's report (<- yes, that's a link to it) and have formed the opinion that he's at best a patsy and at worst improperly convicted.
Keep in mind that this is not my personal opinion on the matter. On the contrary, such belief seems to me to be standard conspiratorial mythologizing, so I have seriously strong doubts about their veracity. But, my point is not whether the sentiment is accurate or not, it's merely to acknowledge that the sentiment exists.
Here are some other links showing that such doubt has taken a tone of mainstream minority opinion (I leave to actual Scottish citizens to tell me if that's legitimately mainstream, or nothing more than the press attempting to impose a narrative):
The Herald: "Watchdog to rule on Lockerbie bomber conviction"
The Observer: "Evidence that casts doubt on who brought down Flight 103"
Sunday Herald: "Lockerbie: The truth at last?"
BBC: "Abu Nidal 'behind Lockerbie bombing'"
Lockerbie: Will we ever know the truth?"
The Observer: "I saw Lockerbie's victims. Tell their families the truth"
"Inconvenient Truths"
The Lockerbie Case blog
BBC: "Megrahi: 'A convenient scapegoat?'"
And one more time just so there's no doubt: I do not advocate the position that the Lockerbie conviction was incorrect, and that Libya was improperly blamed for the tragedy. On the contrary, I am actually quite skeptical of it. As one example of my doubt: I find it hard to reconcile the notion that Libya was improperly blamed with the fact that that nation accepted responsibility. There are other elements to what I've read so far that raise red flags to me, but again, I provide the links as proof that there's an undercurrent of doubt on the accuracy of the convictions and the narrative of the Lockerbie tragedy itself, nothing more. I'm only beginning to look into this alt-history proposal to see if it has merit, but studies of alternate proposals about history (Roosevelt and Pearl Harbor, Holocaust denial, and as some old timers around here know, 9/11 mythology) have shown me that most proposals tend to be incorrect. Still, though, as long as you keep a skeptical eye open, it never hurts to study such topics.
The hero's welcome was entirely predictable. This must be true, since I predicted it in the previous thread on this subject. Obama's reaction was also predictable--a rote disapproval by a man who really does not give a shit one way or another whether the guy is freed. This does remind me that the Gitmo closing deadline is coming up. With all the health care frenzy, this is off the radar screen. Maybe Scotland will take the Gitmo prisoners, doncha think?
Not declaring and fighting war on a word.
True as far as it goes, but you, Obambi and all your lefty buddies would have TRULY freaked the f*ck out had Bush had the balls to actually name our enemy.
If Obama is so impotent on the world stage that he can't even come to an agreement with Scotland, whose monarch he greeted with a handshake, what should we expect his influence will be the world leaders to whom he bows?
Then again, maybe the Scots were just paying better attention when he tossed out the priceless bust of Churchill for the "Egg of Power." Guess the Scots know where they can stick the "special relationship."
"Is it Christian doctrine to show mercy to the merciless? I can't believe that is the case. But not being a Christian I don't know. Someone, anyone, say it ain't so.
The die in dignity phrase leaves me speechless."
It is Christian doctrine, or at least advice, to turn the other cheek and love the one that hates you.
The important part of this is that it is not a command to governments but to individuals. It recognizes that hatred can consume and destroy us from the inside. So, in that case, the father with the daughter who had died can live with a consuming hatred or he can somehow find a way to forgive.
Beyond that personal admonition, though, there really is nothing that I can think of in Scripture that secular law isn't supposed to be upheld or that people are supposed to expect not to have to face consequences of their lawbreaking. Even those who repent and convert aren't spared temporal punishment (and shouldn't be.)
Turning the other cheek doesn't seem to extend to allowing yourself to be killed, though it might... it certainly in no way possible extends to making that decision for other people.
In this case, though... it could well be that the will of God is done in the release of this man.
It allowed the world to see the savages for what they are... people unashamed to glorify in the death of innocents. Seeing that demonstrated in no uncertain terms, seeing that response to (arguably misguided) compassion, might be worth the release of that man.
If it is, indeed, a spiritual battle between truth and an abomination.
To clarify my comment.
Apparently there have been 30 clemency applications and 23 were approved.
I saw the brother of a victim on TV. He asked about the "six" [maybe he meant seven] who were not approved and what crimes had they committed to be turned down.
I thought he asked a good question and now I see he may have omitted these 23 approvals from his argument.
I don't blame him for doing that.
It is Christian doctrine, or at least advice, to turn the other cheek and love the one that hates you.
In addition, I'm pretty sure the instruction goes "Repent, and be forgiven."
Go forth and sin no more.
Could we get a guarantee on that?
It allowed the world to see the savages for what they are... people unashamed to glorify in the death of innocents.
They've probably been told for years that he was wrongly convicted by those nasty, uncircumcised Scots (not that that would change the reaction of some).
I have lost my taste for single malt Scotch. It is going to take a long time to reacquire that taste.
Whatever happened to compassion for victims?
Whatever happened to oversight of public officials?
When it looked like the Achille Lauro hijackers were going to go free, Ronald Reagan sent fighter jets to intercept the plane and put those rats in prison.
Would have been fun to see Obama do the same thing, force the plane down on a U.S. base, then try the son-of-a-bitch in the U.S. or Guantanamo for murder.
He might not live to see trial, but he would die in prison, and that would send a very positive message to our allies and the British people.
Jason,
Great point and I agree that it would have been a couragous move to force the plane down. However, I don't see couragous in the Obama resume. A community organizer blames someone else for what just happened rather than doing the couragous. Time for another apology to the terrorists.
Fuck the Libyan government and Scotland. This bastard should die, and I look forward to working towards his death.
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