The choice to portray her as irritating, self-absorbed, whiny and inappropriate was no accident. In discussing the show, “Love Story,” one of its producers explained: “Given how much we’re rooting for John and Carolyn, Daryl Hannah occupies a space where she’s an adversary to what you want narratively in the story.” Storytelling requires tension. It often requires an obstacle. But a real, living person is not a narrative device.
There is also a gendered dimension to this thinking. Popular culture has long elevated certain women by portraying others as rivals, obstacles or villains. Isn’t it textbook misogyny to tear down one woman in order to build up another?...
I have never used cocaine.... I have never desecrated any family heirloom.... I never compared Jacqueline Onassis’ death to a dog’s....
My question to Grok, "Daryl Hannah writes 'I never compared Jacqueline Onassis’ death to a dog’s.' How does the TV show say that she did and what is there that she did do that could be characterized that way?"
I'm told: "Hannah's dog died after JFK Jr. accidentally let it off the leash during a walk in Central Park.... Hannah, who was devastated, held a funeral for the dog in Los Angeles and insisted JFK Jr. fly there to attend, even as his mother was in her final days battling cancer—a decision that left him resentful and contributed to their breakup. Additionally, shortly after Onassis' death, Hannah reportedly called JFK Jr. repeatedly to discuss her other dog's illness, which friends like Sasha Chermayeff described as insensitive given the timing, with JFK Jr. expressing frustration over her focus on the pet amid his mourning."
2 words: "Streisand effect."
Well, one more thing: Is it "textbook misogyny to tear down one woman in order to build up another"? At least Hannah doesn't in any way tear down Carolyn Bessette in this column. And she does acknowledge an explanation that might exclude the misogyny theory. It's the producers' explanation: They needed conflict in their plot. The narrative did it.
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74 comments:
How do you "accidentally" let a dog off-leash?
He kills her dog and she's the one behaving poorly?
I’m invited to hate Hannah but I guess I don’t. When they were an item and attended that Spring House wedding on Block Island friends said they were gracious and ordinary. I never had contact with him but he struck me as a bit of an airhead…
I’m betting on the side that says him killing her dog is what ended them as a couple…
I have no dog in this fight, but I read it that she was defamed by using her as a character and building a false narrative of events. I don't know why one would call it a Streisand effect, unless you believe the false narrative to be true and Hannah is now making more people aware. Is she not allowed to claim defamation, because it might make the false narrative more famous?
Admittedly, better to fight defamation in the courts than the NYT.
"Popular culture has long elevated certain women by portraying others as rivals, obstacles or villains. Isn’t it textbook misogyny to tear down one woman in order to build up another?... "
Yeah, it'd be so exciting to see a story of two women who loved and helped each other. Think of the drama!
I guess we'd better make all the villians in stories men, because otherwise we hate women.
Isn’t it textbook misogyny to tear down one woman in order to build up another?
Speaking of needing conflict, didn't Hannah dramatically and very publicly tear down one man, Jackson Browne, in order to build up another, JFK Jr.?
I was supposed to stay in their Santa Monica guest house that fall with a friend who knew JB before the split caused them both to move out.
Geeze… Jackson Browne allegedly beat the shit out of her and now this.
Wince just a guy looking for a place to land…
"I’m betting on the side that says him killing her dog is what ended them as a couple…"
Well it most certainly ended her being a passenger in his plane. That would have ended them as a couple.
Darryl should just be happy that she didn't end up flying with Junior to Martha's Vineyard.
"The choice to portray her as irritating, self-absorbed, whiny and inappropriate was no accident."
Res ipsa loquitur
Gendered? Sexual orientation? Breast topologies?
If what she says is true, this seems like straightforward defamation lawsuit material. Is she doing that? If not, why not?
(As an aside, while she was never a particularly important actress, I've always thought she deserved an Oscar nom for Elle Driver in Kill Bill.)
Admittedly, better to fight defamation in the courts than the NYT.
I'm not sure that I agree with that, given NYT v. Sullivan. This may also be battlespace prep for the jury.
Did she deny the dog funeral?
Trans women have ruined it for women like Daryl Hannah. You can't be attracted to a nice tall, strong girl with a bit of a hard face without worrying she's got a johnson.
Or vice versa, I suppose. If you're into chicks with dicks, you might try picking up girls like Daryl Hannah and then you both are disappointed. CC, JSM
I tried to use AI to make a Roy Lichtenstein-style cartoon of a weeping girl saying "He thought I was trans!" Copilot refused to do it. Google AI did a pretty nice one, although the girl is too feminine looking. I can't figure out how to link it. CC, JSM
Pro-Choice is misogynistic that promotes religious advocacy of the fourth choice, the wicked solution. As if there is any mystery in sex and conception, and women are bereft of dignity and conscience advocated by feminist females and their masculinist male partners.
Well, you have to give her some credit. She's a Progressive, but she's no phoney, she has the achievements to show for it. Good for her, standing up to defamation.
I've never forgiven Neil Young for leaving Peggy for Hannah.
Howard for the win.
They killed John Wick’s dog. Look how that turned out.
Always risky twisting facts about real people to fit a narrative
’I have never used cocaine...’
I’m gonna have to call bullshit on that claim.
I actually watched some of this show (why? I couldn't tell you), and Daryl Hannah has a right to be annoyed by how she was portrayed. She came off as unpleasant and pushy, and seemed to be constantly pressuring JFK Jr. for more commitment as her acting career faded and she wanted to be known for her granola-activism. (Meanwhile, she was given a weird, beyond-Valley Girl way of speaking -- and the actress who played her had nowhere near the surfer-girl beauty of Hannah in her prime, which can't have pleased the real Hannah's agents.) On the other hand, Kennedy didn't come off much better. He was portrayed as an overprivileged hunk who didn't put much effort into anything and couldn't say no to any of the women in his life -- and who led Hannah to think he was more into their relationship than he actually was, even when they were living together. (And, yes, as the show dramatized it, he was definitely responsible for her dog getting run over.)
The only one who came off well in all of this was Bessette, in part because the actress who played her was fantastic -- if the real-life woman was anywhere near as charismatic, you can see why he married her. (And she got the classic "Disney princess" treatment -- if Hannah was the aristocratic woman who thought marrying the prince was her right, Bessette was the beautiful commoner who had no interest in becoming royalty but married him for love.)
On the other hand, there is one thing I remember about Hannah as a real-life "activist": it's the time she personally attacked a guy who wanted to build a warehouse on a valuable piece of urban land he owned in Los Angeles, because the "people" had decided it should be a community garden. (Actual residents of the area said they would have preferred the warehouse, because at least that would have created local jobs.) Hannah sat in a tree doing press interviews for two weeks and basically ruined the guy's life, and he ended up selling the land just to get away from the whole situation. The New York Times might remember that they also covered that story in a way that was far more favorable to Hannah than anyone else.
I lose respect for the man who is not strong enough to say "sorry about the dog, but I'm not flying to LA for a dog funeral," but then bitches to other people about having to do it. Maybe the kind of guy whose arrogance causes him to ignore flight instruments and fly a plane into the ocean killing himself, his girlfriend and her sister..
I agree with Will Cate @10:58 AM.
The ugly cad, Neil Young, left his wife of 36, who had cancer and divorced her, and went public with his relationship with Hannah weeks later. So, he cheated on his dying wife. And Darryl was FINE with it. She is a schmuck as well.
of 36 years.
Hannah's dog died after JFK Jr. accidentally let it off the leash during a walk in Central Park
To be fair, JFK Jr, didn't even know Kristi Noem was in New York that day.
As someone who has reviewed many docudrama screenplays for legal clearance, I'd be surprised if the cocaine use element wasn't supported by substantial evidence. That is a clearance red flag that can be handled by either removing it or by altering the scene to have the cocaine user be a made up character or a (now) dead person.
W can testify he snorted lines with Hannah in the early 80s.
"...a real, living person is not a narrative device."
Even when the real live person is another Kennedy on the rise?
"Storytelling requires tension. It often requires an obstacle."
Mission Accomplished.
In happier times, Daryl Hannah and JFK Jr. were often spotted sharing apple pancakes at The Original Pancake House in Chicago's Gold Coast neighborhood.
"BarrySanders20 said...
I lose respect for the man who is not strong enough to say "sorry about the dog, but I'm not flying to LA for a dog funeral," but then bitches to other people about having to do it. Maybe the kind of guy whose arrogance causes him to ignore flight instruments and fly a plane into the ocean killing himself, his girlfriend and her sister.."
The problem was not he ignored instruments, but that he was not instrument rated. He had only completed half of the course. Probably why he only made it half way to his destination.
This whole story of disliking a Netflix (or whatever network is streaming the Hallmark napkin show) is concocted to introduce Jack Schlossberg to the women. The problem is the name Schlossberg doesn't even come close to sounding like Kennedy.
There needs to be a story linking the dynastic Kennedy name to Jack Schlossberg.
If it wasn't for the Kennedy name, Jack Schlossberg would have to do whatever it is a no name politician would have to do to rise in politics.
How do you tell people Jack Schlossberg is 'really' a Kennedy?
This is how you do it.
JFK Jr. forgot the adage: There are old pilots, there are bold pilots, but there are no old, bold pilots.
Supreme confidence will get you every time.
Jackson Browne vs Daryl Hannah
Joni Mitchell wrote a song about it
Not To Blame
https://youtu.be/3T5sCCodvtk?si=cnrN0vTzj1S_Q_IJ
Maybe the kind of guy whose arrogance causes him to ignore flight instruments and fly a plane into the ocean killing himself, his girlfriend and her sister..
In fairness to JFKj, it isn't as easy as that.
His rating was VFR, single engine, complex aircraft. That meant he was legal to fly in weather that was better than a ceiling of 1500', and visibility greater than three miles.
The crash occurred during descent from the west into Martha's Vineyard while over the water.
I have no idea what is taught at flight schools en route to a a VFR ticket, but it may very well have gone unmentioned that while over water, even though the weather is well above VFR requirements, can be just like flying in cloud, in that there is no distinguishing the water from the sky. And zero depth perception. And that's during the day.
Completely legal. Insidiously dangerous.
Frankly, it does not appear that neither JFK, Jr., nor Ms. Hannah was exactly ideal spouse material.
"Humperdink said...
JFK Jr. forgot the adage: There are old pilots, there are bold pilots, but there are no old, bold pilots.
Supreme confidence will get you every time."
I'm not sure that's fair. I think it may have been more what is called "getthereitis." He was trying to get to his cousin's wedding. Conditions were marginal for VFR flight, but legal. They ruled he had spatial disorientation and crashed into the ocean.
I can't tell you why, but right after JFKjr crashed that plane I went out the next day and signed up for Private Pilot lessons at Hawthorn airport, right next to LAX class B. What a place to learn and fly - desert, huge mountains, beaches, oceans and lakes + big and small plane traffic of all kinds. Got my ticket a few month later, but found the hobby to be far too expensive. Moved on to hang gliding, which was almost free and actually less scary - I could only hurt myself. JFKjr really blew it on that flight. Bad decisions.
Curious George said: “I'm not sure that's fair. I think it may have been more what is called "getthereitis."
Maybe. I’m not sure how many hours he had as a VFR pilot, but he clearly was ignoring his instruments.
I don't think he "blew it" in the sense that he made a decision that he was consciously aware of the inherent risk.
For maybe another 15 mins flight time, he could have followed the coast, approached the field from the north, and stayed overland virtually the entire time.
Would have been an easy choice to make, had he been aware ahead of time.
"I’m not sure how many hours he had as a VFR pilot, but he clearly was ignoring his instruments."
Spatial disorientation is a bitch.
Isn’t it textbook misogyny to tear down one woman in order to build up another?...
It sure is! Like, ya know, all the men who watch the "Real Housewives of Wherever" shows on Bravo. It's just misogyny to portray all those women as such nasty bitches!
Oh, wait....
As I recall he was still VFR and the third wheel girl got stuck in weekend traffic, delaying their departure. The classic general aviation gotta get there cascade…
Having flown into Block Island a couple of times as the sun is setting the colors are weird and it’s quite disorienting…
He flew a plane with his wife and sister in law straight into the water because he was unqualified to read instruments and fly in those conditions. Would have been safer for me to drive both of them in my convertible after drinking a pint of vodka. But had I done so and crashed, I would have been rightfully criticized.
JFKJr seemed like a nice guy. Rush Limbaugh always had positive interactions with him. Too bad they’re not both still around.
As I remember it, conditions were VFR at take off, but marginal at best in route, and not VFR when he got there. It's hard to get disoriented in VFR. He lost sight of the coast due to low visibility and lost all reference points out over the water.
He had 310 total hours, 72 solo, between 3-10 hours IFR training, and only 48 minutes in that plane at night. It was a bad decision by him to think he had enough experience to fly people in those conditions at night. Then another bad one to continue on when visibility dropped. I would not have departed. I would not have taken passengers, and I would have turned around about half way if I did depart. I would have taken a car. I was never a brave pilot.
Some dogs are loved more than some mothers.
As I remember it, conditions were VFR at take off, but marginal at best in route, and not VFR when he got there.
If Martha's Vineyard wasn't VMC (weather suitable for visual flight rules) on arrival, then he would either have to alter course to remain VMC and divert to a field with VMC, or proceed and get violated.
Above I said flight over water at night, or when the surface is calm, is insidiously dangerous. A couple guys I knew hit the water at 500 mph on final at The Wash Weapons Range. Sunset, perfectly clear, absolutely glassy water. Some other guys I knew watched a Tomcat hit the water while they were being intercepted during an exercise with the Navy in the Med.
I was coming off target on a hazy day at Cowden Range off the east coast of England, and looked back to air score my delivery while on the turn to downwind — bad headwork. Turned around, quite puzzled to find a boat in the sky.
Okay, it has been a *long* time since I started flying light civil aircraft — out of Santa Monica, CA — but I don't remember spatial disorientation over the water ever being mentioned.
Daryl Hannah - not too bright. Chose Neil Young as her hubby.
The Kristi Noem line deserves some recognition. So here it is.
It’s silly to say the Kennedys are being exploited. I mean, in the days weeks and months following one maybe? But after a string of family tragedies to make a new movie about it just goes to show how the interest of Americans in that family does not waiver. If anything schmuck Schlossberg should be flattered. Little wonder he wants to be a politician.
Hannah’s best role was as a pron actress in “The Last Days of Frankie the Fly”, starring Dennis Hopper, along with the late Michael Madsen and Kiefer Sutherland.
Daryl Hannah? Bocce balls!!
Choosing Young as her husband was good idea. Hannah is 65 and Young is 80.
Daryl Hannah has had a complicated life with many unpleasant realities beyond being a stunning film starlet working in Hollywood. To have dated both Jackson Brown (as teen) and JFK Jr, two self-absorbed self-important stars who are also cads, and to marry gruff Neil Young, is to tread a difficult pathway through life. She finally disclosed her Asperger's diagnosis, only after all the unsympathetic media attention to her relationship histories, to now be offered up for our entertainment by fictional biography depicting her as the difficult person.
JFK Jr in fact wanted to marry her, but Jackie sternly forbad it; Daryl's family, though wealthy, was disordered with multiple step-parents and step-siblings not intune with Jackie's Puritan sense of propriety. So when Caroline Bessette intentionally modeled herself after Daryl Hannah, dyed her hair blonde, and glammed-up. Lady-killer JFK Jr was sufficiently besmitten to marry her, so Daryl, still in contact, dodged a tragic death. in handsight, better outcome.to be married to Neil Young then buried too young.
bagoh20 said... “Moved on to hang gliding, which was almost free and actually less scary - I could only hurt myself.”
Here’s a short vid of a hang glider who flies from Fort Funston, part of the Golden Gate NRA at the far southwest corner of San Francisco. It’s not unusual to see them to fly along Ocean Beach, catching the updrafts as the winds slam into the dunes.
Hang Gliding in the clouds Fort Funston VR 360
Ugh. The link didn't attach properly. Mea Culpa.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4ft_KAfXhE&list=PLYs-oCx5rwauUaCLuyWjPN_XLJFCOtDRm&index=3
Streisand effect, indeed. I didn't know that much about her, but, judging from the comments here, she had some other complicated relationships. Still, one can see her point. She achieved a measure of fame and success, and now this is what she is to be remembered for......And even if she were, in fact, maligned by the show, she certainly can't claim precedence over the other female casualties in the Kennedy dramas. As a movie star, she was beautiful and successful, but she never attained legendary status. As a Kennedy victim, she barely deserves mention.
KellyM, That's a famous place for flying, beautiful. I've never flown there. A lot of great flying spots are like that, at cliffs above a beach. The constant wind up the cliff face means you can fly all day and land back on top. I've flown at Big Sur which is like that. You launch in the mountains, fly down to the cliffs above the beach, fly around and land on top of the cliffs. I don't fly anymore. Lost my nerve after losing a few friends, but I sure miss it.
I look at Schlossberg and just laugh. He’s an impudent child (still) and apparently proud of it. He brings nothing to the party, has accomplished nothing, will accomplish less, and will retire a rich vacuous human being. In other words, a perfect lefty.
“ Would have been safer for me to drive both of them in my convertible after drinking a pint of vodka. But had I done so and crashed, I would have been rightfully criticized.”
Presumably the young Kennedy would have declined your offer, having learned from his uncle Ted’s experience.
While hangglider Any of you see Honour Harrington dancing in the clouds?
I think it's safe to assume Hillary Clinton was the happiest person in NY when JFK, Jr crashed into the ocean.
Why did Hannah leave her dog with him while his mother was dying? That seems inconsiderate.
A couple of posters have hit upon my main reaction when JFK Jr is the topic. Her was portrayed as America's best and brightest. A prince for our non-royalty nation.
Feh.
His magazine was failing despite his celebrity getting the magazine juicy interviews. IIRC he flunked the bar. And he killed himself, his wife and sister-in-law by flying into conditions he was NOT trained or rated for.
Read that as arrogant prick.
But being a "Kennedy" and pretty is enough for some.
I guess it's useful for the commentariat to take time off from the weighty matters of the world to indulge in high-gloss gossip. At least I get to learn some things about flying at night over calm waters in Long Island Sound.
It's called impetuous youth, and Hannah should take responsibility for hers. Her need to micromanage past indiscretions in which she has no control over at present---comes off as callow and petty. There had to be a platoon of lawyers that vetted this project, I'm sure the Attorneys anticipated all the howling and ravings of key players.
She was cheating on him. There was no "them" to root for. They were as phony as Jack and Jackie.
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