My symmetry solution: Build up the West Wing into the size of the new East Wing.
The presidential complex really should be that large. Once there is symmetry in the wings, the iconic building in the center will be the focus of attention and the 2 hulks on either side will blend into the background that is all of Washington D.C. — a city full of hulkingly large buildings.
The West and East Wings will provide a transition from the brutal city. They will loom in our peripheral vision as we gaze at the Executive Residence — the building that has always been the only building we see in our mind when we think of the White House.
I'll bet you think the Oval Office is in that building. It's not! It's in the West Wing. So take care with the demolition work when you undertake Project Symmetry. And by "you," I mean Mr. Donald Trump! Because the way to clinch the argument that the East Wing project is good is to use your building prowess in pursuit of proportionality.
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116 comments:
They should paint it with primer that orange color…
WaPoo lets me look at this one = this must be important propaganda…and I love this: This summary is AI-generated. AI can make mistakes and this summary is not a replacement for reading the comments.
He should also add an ADU to help with the housing crunch.
I can’t find a good picture but it’s starting to look like where I worked as a kid: Hall of Springs. You can’t really see but there’s another building connected with the porticos and it all has a similar asymmetry. Btw a Democrat built this one, all funded with taxpayer dollars…
Can't the work of the president be done using a PC sitting on a desk from Ikea? Forget all those buildings except for inaugurations and parties. And upscale those to an existing and appropriately large stadium somewhere. We have lots of those already -- a different city every year.
Problem solved. Money saved.
Change the portico such that it matches the one to the West Wing. Reduce the height of the new building so that it is noticeably shorter than the a White House.
It's the NYT, so it's probably either a lie or a gross exaggeration. Remember the Abrego Garcia story - "he's a suburban dad", when the reality was he was a gang banging, human trafficking, wife beater.
We could try not overreacting to whatever action Trump takes by reflexively taking the opposite view. I feel like we’ve spent more time talking about the demise of the East Wing than was spent discussing the Afghanistan withdrawal.
The problem with expanding the West Wing is it would require filling in the White House poolthat Gerald Ford build in 1975 for the lofty expense of $52,417 ($313,888 dollars in 2025 dollars).
Trump has left this historically cost effective renovation off his White House renovation timeline, for the obvious reason no doubt.
'As big as it is, it's not enough.'
Trump's proposition leaves Althouse wanting more.
Trümptseign…
The White House is it self dwarfed by the treasury building nearby.
Althouse makes a lot of sense here, though it would be trickier to expand the West Wing because you'd have to do it without destroying what's there. Remodels and additions that preserve original structure and character are generally much more difficult than new construction, take longer and often cost more. Screw it. Let's do it.
I have one message for Trump the Builder President: MMWSWD! Make Meade's Wife Squeal With Delight!
Proportional is not a word that I would associate with Donald Trump.
The basic problem here is the dual purpose of the White House. That is, as both the personal residence of the President and the working office of the top Administration. As long as you have both functions, it will continue to expand. If so, your symmetrical solution is a good one aesthetically, although over time it will look like the Versailles Palace with a melted and shrunken middle.
A different approach entirely would be to bulldoze both wings and put them underground with park-like gardens and pools above them. The underground design would provide much better security (needed now), reduced cost for the eliminated fancy exterior, and unlimited space for expansion downward. And, best of all, in case of a nuclear attack, it takes care of the burial necessities.
Just put up a giant mirror.
Make it bigly and YUUUUGE !!
There's always the Nixon Monument design.
I have a better and cheaper solution. Make the new east wing the size of the west wing and leave the west wing alone. It could have a sunken ballroom hardly noticeable from outside.
why not Oval Balcony in the curvaceouse bulgy part of WH with upper story columns?
to keep up with the Pope and the Queen/King
Change the portico such that it matches the one to the East Wing. Increase the height of the existing building so that it is noticeably taller than the White House.
Trump can do that in his third term.
Or Vance can do it in his first term. Either is acceptable.
I have solution > inflatable ball room ?
There is one very American type of building that could be built on the site of the demolished East Wing that would not have a symmetry problem even if it was much larger than the White House. A barn!
Think of the classic American farmstead. The white house is always much smaller than the red barn. Plus, a silo could be put next to the barn with a watch tower and missile defense system without attracting undue notice.
Talk about American Exceptionalism! No other country has a State Barn! No other country can host a State Hoedown for visiting dignitaries! All they’ve got is stables, we will have a White House Red Barn!
Who will build it? The Amish of course, who still know how to build barns. What could be more traditionally American than that?
'As big as it is, it's not enough.’
Sir Mix-a-Lot responded…
I like big ballrooms and I cannot lie.
Nearly there.
The executive bouncy castle for the west wing.
They need a small wing the size of a large wing.
hanuman_prodigious_leaper said...
“I have solution > inflatable ball room ?”
Inflatable rooms either need to be sealed or have a continuous supply of air to keep it inflated. Fortunately, DC has an oversupply of hot air that could be tapped.
Yeah, its sad in an abstract way. Who in real life looks at the buildings from that particular angle? Is it even possible to notice the asymetry (sic) in real life?
But gotta admire the far-left MSM. They've taken an incredibly positive act by Trump and turned it into an "issue".
Red Barn, White House, and Blue Silo.
I think the vast majority of us really don't give a damn.
The left is obsessed with D.C. The capital is the physical manifestation of power. And that is what they think about, 24/7.
The only riot the left noticed was that tiny, out of hand protest on January 6 in D.C. We had riots across the USA, with burning buildings and homicides, and the press didn't see any of that.
The left is obsessed with power, symbols, and narratives, and they don't give a damn about actual Americans. They're going on and on about one building that gets renovated all the time.
It was a joke the first time I heard it. What are we up to, week two?
Dialed past eleven
Of course this entire discussion is wasted energy since one man gets to make all decisions without any oversight or input by the owners of the building. Us
Seems to me that until you see the landscaping you don’t really know how it’s all going to be visually and from what angle. In their diagram they show a view from a place where nobody ever stands.
The graphic looks like the graphics designer for WaPo went into Photoshop and increased the size of the addition by a significant amount. As a result, the two story connecting portico is the same height as three stories on the original White House. Plus, the ballroom looks taller than the rest of the complex, whereas the other images show it at least slightly shorter than the original White House.
Notice how the WaPo animation tries to trigger its TDS readers by showing piles of rubble in the transition between the before and after images of the East Wing.
"There's always the Nixon Monument design."
Surprisingly similar to the World Trade Center monument.
https://www.911memorial.org/visit/memorial
It's nice to have Left Bank joining in the fun! Good Monday, all!
Why not just put the ballroom in the Old Executive Office building and move those bureaucrats to Prince George's County (or fire them).
There were lot's of better options that did not involve camping out in a tent. Trump is lame.
When they rebuild the West Wing, would they be able to keep the original structure basically in place as they build it to mirror the East Wing? I wish someone could do a rendition of the new East Wing over the top of the West Wing to see how much of the present West Wing could be kept in tact.
Then they could put up a fountain in the middle with gold leafed cherubs peeing into the water. They could call them Trump’s cherubs and put crowns on them. (Dems would call them the little Trumps and laugh at the size of their penises.)
Each night there could be one of those fountain performances with a light show.
While I think the Democrats completely totally overreacted to to the ballroom, it actually might mesh well as a political strategy if people lose their healthcare subsidies and the snap program goes away.
We shall see.
I still find it quite perplexing that almost all of you smart hardworking people with lots of life experience continue to bend over backwards and support nearly every single thing that President Trump does.
Maybe he is a little megalo mania like Adolf Hitler and has the arrogance and gaul to think that he can open up another War against the Democrats on a front that directly impacts the core of his supporters. The blue collar and working class who because of depressed wages require some government assistance in order to avoid bankruptcy.
The WP illustration is grossly misleading, as the White House is carefully situated to preserve security and its traditional appearance. There are subtle hills on each side, a slope down in the front, and large trees obscure both the West and East Wings. The new East Wing would either be hidden behind the trees or not perceived as part of the White House proper.
In the broader layout , the much larger and flamboyant Eisenhower Executive Office Building sits just behind the West Wing. It's not perceived as part of the White House at all, and it dwarfs the new East Wing. DC has regulated the height of buildings since 1910 to preserve the scale of the official buildings and monuments.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Height_of_Buildings_Act_of_1910
I sense intentional obtuseness afoot. The “Old Executive Office building” is already overcrowded with the president’s staff. So that would displace Executive personnel. Stop bitching about a minor home improvement project just because it’s Trump doing it. All your LAME ideas were considered and rejected by the people smarter than you working for Trump.
The real question is why you nitpick to death meaningless shit when there are real important issues. The improvements benefit all Americans. Big Orange sure does cause idiots to self identify.
Intentional obtuseness should be the Post masthead
LOL
Of course this entire discussion is wasted energy since one man gets to make all decisions without any oversight or input by the owners of the building. Us
The White House is an historical landmark, not the ever changing outbuildings. Find a new hobby. You are lousy at political theater.
Eva Marie said...
"When they rebuild the West Wing, would they be able to keep the original structure basically in place as they build it to mirror the East Wing?"
That is possible.
(hit publish too soon)
I still find it quite perplexing that almost all of you smart hardworking people with lots of life experience continue to bend over backwards and support nearly every single thing that President Trump does
We observe the alternative…
I find it quite amusing that most of the folks here on both sides of the aisle think that facts actually matter in this situation.
Rocco said what I also wrote a couple days ago, that the classic view of the WH doesn’t change. The east and west outbuildings are not even visible in the standard front and center framing used by every “live stand-up” report by every WH correspondent. Until this fake kerfuffle none of our usual lefties even knew the relative size of the buildings or their histories or what was in and around them.
That's your major malfunction right there, rehajm. You said it yourself alternative while in the real world there are an endless number of alternatives. Look through all of the podcasters that helped get Trump elected they are turning against him
Althouse said...
My symmetry solution: Build up the West Wing into the size of the new East Wing.
I suspect that's been Trump's strategic plan from the start.
Perhaps Trump saw an urgent need for an East Wing Ballroom, plus the added boost to the country's esteem and to his legacy of pushing it though during his term. Especially in view of his hospitality expertise set against the bureaucratic drag and resistance that would otherwise ensue.
And, per Althouse, maybe Trump fully knew pushing the East Wing project forward would compel a proportional change to the truly historic West Wing. But that such a change -- once necessitated -- could be more collaborative, albeit with Republican majorities, and would have to be symmetrical with his original vision.
Intentional obtuseness afoot in the masthead. I like that…
Symmetry is a label and judgment of cisgeometric human proportions.
Hence, I wouldn't be surprised if Trump already has designs for his vision of the West Wing already drafted.
There are subtle hills on each side, a slope down in the front, and large trees obscure both the West and East Wings. The new East Wing would either be hidden behind the trees or not perceived as part of the White House proper.
If you doubt this you can see it for yourself on Google Street View. I rate the claim as incredibly true…
According to chat you could built a building that looks exactly like the west wing on the outside and fit inside a ballroom that seats 500-700. Problem solved.
After reading all the ideas above, it’s clear why there was no public input phase…;)
Because of mr burns we need a tin cup to pay the troops
"So that would displace Executive personnel."
I don't give a fuck, and neither should any hetero, taxpaying man. Move them to PG County where real estate is cheaper.
Leading experts agree, spewing smug contributes to global laming.
Most of the West Wing dates to 1934.
I wish they'd make the corridor into the East Room retractable so the Palladian window remains visible, but we hardly ever see that side anyway because of the trees, and the TV cameras are along the west side driveway.
The Palladian window on the west side has its side windows blocked off, as is the regular one to its right (there's a fireplace there), to make the State Dining Room symmetrical. I guess they can do something else with it. It's been used as a conference room.
“ the building that has always been the only building we see in our mind when we think of the White House.”
This. Most people have never been to DC and seen the White House. Most people have no idea that these wings exist as separate structures. Depictions of the WH always have focused on the original structure. They think the east wing or west wing are the respective sides of the original building.
Take Columbia, Missouri and move the entire federal government there. DC becomes a giant museum and tourist destination.
What has columbia done to deserve that
“ Maybe he is a little megalo mania like Adolf Hitler.”
Perhaps those who don’t like Trump can quit with the Hitler references. Because you signal that have no point of finding common ground or compromise.
@TosaGuy: Depictions of the WH always have focused on the original structure.
The large majority of DC photos use tight framing and cropping to preserve the traditional look and feel in a highly urban landscape. There was a period 10 or 20 years ago where a hotel or something put a lighted sign several blocks behind the White House. It was surely approved by the local government, but it showed up in every photo of the White House. Distance compression resulted in an illusion of a glowing red-yellow rectangle atop the building.
It's gone now.
Tosaguy. For lots of reason I avoid Hitler comparisons. But your view on which side is more willing to compromise seems off the mark. Please propose a compromise on this building issue. Something you think Trump might agree with
Jim,
I am sorry that I couldn’t detect the nuance of the argument from those who always compare Trump to Hitler.
Jim,
You also confuse me with a Trump defender. I’ve watched things long enough to know that there is no compromise from a Democrat.
The diagram leaves out the Treasury Building, which is across the street from the East Wing and dwarfs the entire White House complex.
move them to Bridgeport and Utica and Trenton.
So, in your vision, the seat of the Executive Branch must always get larger?
Yea... Build up the West Wing into the size of the new East Wing. I like that idea.
With trees and drives and outdoor features and guardhouses and fences and surrounding buildings, the asymmetry is irrelevant. This is not an ordinary urban architectural rendering. Really, enough already.
I don't think it is a 90,000 sq ft ballroom. Looking at the renderings I've seen, and compared to the dimensions of the White House, I expect it is a 90,000 sq ft BUILDING. I estimate it could be outside dimensions of 250 Ft X 120 ft, yielding a 3-story structure of 30,000 sq ft on each floor. I expect the ballroom is on the top floor for aesthetic and security reasons, while a ground floor and a floor below ground level would have offices and storage, and mechanical operations.
The existing East Room is only a little less than 3000 sq ft and can only support 200 diners at round tables and 300 people seated in rows. A 30,000 sq ft ballroom floor would allow substantial expansion of that capacity as well as support an entry hall with stairway, escalators , and elevators; a performance stage; kitchen and food storage; storage for tables, chairs, and accessories, audio/visual; restrooms, etc. The space on the floors below would replace and expand on office space that was in the East Wing.
A vast improvement on what was there.
I learned yesterday that Trump offered to build a smaller version of this costing $100M for free during the Obama Administration after he attended an event there in what he called "a shitty little tent." They declined.
Dwarf is a pejorative judgment and label that retards social inclusion and a gay old time dancing in a climate controlled ballroom.
"Don’t even think of seeking the Democratic nomination for president unless you pledge to take a wrecking ball to the Trump Ballroom on DAY ONE." - Rep. Eric Swalwell (D-CA)
Meade @ 9:08
So my west wing bouncy castle has merit.
Jim you might want to consider that the building is going to host far more than a main ballroom. You might have noticed other mentions of the temporary kitchen and restrooms that are used now. Clever commenters have noted many multifunction spaces in hotels that are support systems needed for the space. Everyone here can multiply the sides of a rectangle but most of us know the area is not empty space IRL.
Another reason fang fang’s boyfriend will never be president. A wise man uses the assets seized from his enemies.
Of course, you all know that the faux outrage from the Althouse lefties is focus group tested and communicated to the brethren. It is as genuine as a three dollar bill.
Only the dolts like Igna and Kaki really believe it.
Ah, yes. Sid Meier's Civization in real-time :)
Mike - chat included all the stuff necessary for a functioning ball room. Large kitchen, bathrooms, cloakroom etc.
And quite likely a modern, hardened bomb shelter/command and control center underground. Just because it isn't being discussed doesn't mean there aren't some strategic purposes too.
Wrong solution. First build up the White house as large or larger than the east wing ballroom. The assymetry will the require the west wing to be built up. Or, it can stay small to represent the reduction of federal government.
I’m surprised they’re not surprised he didn’t build a hotel or condos…
I guess for a White House Hotel the property will need four houses first…
What sense does symmetry make when the design inspiration is so obviously a fiddler crab?
Do they dance in Columbia, Missouri?
At the very least, there should be a two-story walkway on the west side, or the one on the east should be taken back to a single story. That's the most jarring asymmetry to my eye.
I have not viewed the detailed plans but really if you want to what-if the design go ahead. I completely misunderestimated how many of you care so fucking deeply about a building. The ability to sustain a feverish interest over the entire last week has been truly impressive. But I cannot indulge in hypothetical reformatting of West Wing elements in a footprint based on gossip and bickering.
That is simply a bridge to nowhere too far for me. Out.
Cartoon : Democrats don't have a leg to stand on
jimmy numbers does the research on ballroom design so that you don’t have to!
Maybe once the Trump Ballroom is done, they should put the same crew on rebuilding the Pacific Palisades. And is Hawaii rebuilt yet?
To his bride said the lynx-eyed detective
Could it be that my eyesight is defective
Or has your East tit the least bit
The best of your West tit
Or is it a trick of perspective
When I drove down Pennsylvania Avenue and looked over and saw the White House I was shocked how small it was, but the power which emanated from it was palpable. And now when I look at the diagram and see the Oval Office I’m astonished. Maybe symmetry isn’t what Trump is aiming for, but rather he wants impressive view from the Oval Office?
As always, the solution is "plant more trees."
I always did think the Oval Office was in the main building. If you asked me, I might even have claimed to have seen it when my family went on the White House tour long ago. The Oval Room in the main building (second floor and not on the tour) was used in the 19th century as an office by some presidents. The room was copied in Theodore Roosevelt's new West Wing and went through changes over the years.
I wouldn't have built the new ballroom if I were in charge. I suppose I might even have gotten indignant about it if another president had tried to do it. As it is, though, I waver between seeing it as an indication that America is back to building things and shrugging it off as a distraction.
Build up the West Wing into the size of the new East Wing.
You all laughed when I said the ballroom project would lead to a massive expansion in White House office space. (Not literally, but I sensed the titters.)
My concern was that the 90,000 square feet of ballroom will eventually, absolutely be converted to office space. NOW, the west wing must grow in the name of symmetry.
All those new cubicles, all those additional bureaucrats.
I want Trump to start a Youtube channel where he renovates the East Wing like the people who renovate French chateaus. In one episode he could even go furniture shopping with Nancy O'Dell.
Of course this entire discussion is wasted energy since ... you predicted the ballroom will never be built.
I've been thinking the same thing as AA since I was first shocked by the renderings of ballroom building on WH website. So out of scale to main building. But it's long been a story on fights for office space in West Wing. Plenty of folks in old Executive Office Building who would be thrilled to be in an enlarged West Wing. As for Oval Office, the Taft Oval office was moved by FDR. But I foresee Ballroom building takes past 2027, and who wants to be without an Oval Office for years? Maybe Trump can spite his successor by just following precedent and tearing down West Wing in early January 2029.
Bureaucrats continue to grow in numbers. The space to house their activities need be no more than a square meter per drone, enough to stand inb front of a terminal for a shift. Go to 24/7 operations and that space requirement is cut by 2/3. Hmmm.
It looks fine to me. Photographers manage to miss the West Wing and the East Wing when they want to. They can keep doing that if they want to ignore the most photogenic part of the complex.
Let's not forget that the new East Wing ballroom entrance will be adjacent to a street. That is helpful for arrivals and departures. Its location makes sense for an event space.
I do estimates for living.
I can't find the dimensions of the ballroom itself, but this Whitehouse document says 90,000 sq ft and 650 seated guests.
My eyeball estimate of the ballroom itself based on the windows in the renderings is 120 feet by 80 feet, or 9600 sq ft. If my method is off by half, the ballroom itself is maybe 20,000 sq ft.
For 650 guests at round tables for eight there would be 81 tables. If each table plus aisles takes 10 feet x 10 feet, or 100 sq ft, 81 of them take 8125 sq ft. If you double it for a dance floor, dais, and other non-table space you get 16,000 sq ft.
For reference, a typical chain drugstore near me in suburbia is in a building of about 10,000 sq ft.
My conclusion is that the ballroom itself is nowhere near 90,000 sq ft.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/2025/07/the-white-house-announces-white-house-ballroom-construction-to-begin/
Here's an idea: tear the whole thing down and make presidents live in a Motel 6 for four years. Take away the imperial trappings and we might get fewer Gavins interested in the job.
Are we still laughing and mocking our most childlike political party - the Democrats - for their over-the-top hysteria about the Trump Ballroom?
Have they committed to never using it yet?
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