March 11, 2016

"I'm enjoying the irony of American Sanders supporters lecturing me, a former Soviet citizen, on the glories of Socialism and what it really means!"

"Socialism sounds great in speech soundbites and on Facebook, but please keep it there. In practice, it corrodes not only the economy but the human spirit itself, and the ambition and achievement that made modern capitalism possible and brought billions of people out of poverty. Talking about Socialism is a huge luxury, a luxury that was paid for by the successes of capitalism. Income inequality is a huge problem, absolutely. But the idea that the solution is more government, more regulation, more debt, and less risk is dangerously absurd."

Wrote Garry Kasparov on Facebook, in a post that has been widely shared. He expands on it here, at The Daily Beast.
America transformed the 20th century in its image with its unparalleled success. American technology created the modern world while American culture infused it and American values inspired it. In recent decades that storyline has flipped. The tireless work ethic and spirit of risk-taking and sacrifice have slowly eroded.....

I respect and even like Bernie Sanders. He’s a charismatic speaker and a passionate believer in his cause...  The “revolution” rhetoric of Senator Sanders has struck a chord with many Americans, especially the young voters who are realizing that their own lives are unlikely to match the opportunities and wealth of their parents and grandparents. They are being left behind in a rapidly changing world. It is a helpless, hopeless feeling.

The problem is with the proposed solutions. A society that relies too heavily on redistributing wealth eventually runs out of wealth to redistribute. The historical record is clear. It’s capitalism that brought billions of people out of poverty in the 20th century. It’s socialism that enslaved them and impoverished them....

96 comments:

MisterBuddwing said...

As the old joke goes, "Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under socialism, it's the other way around."

SeanF said...

"Talking about Socialism is a huge luxury, a luxury that was paid for by the successes of capitalism."

I love that sentence. Absolutely love it.

rhhardin said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Hagar said...

A little off topic, but about Sanders.
He says "white people" does not know what it is like to live in a ghetto, but Sanders is a Jew and "ghetto" comes from the name for the old Jewish quarter of Venice and then was adopted as the general term for the enforced Jewish enclaves in cities around Europe.
So is Bernie saying Jews are not "white" or that they don't know their own history?

rehajm said...

!!APPLAUSE!!!

Though the type of inequality spoken about by Sanders supporters is not as big a problem as they're making it out to be. Like arguments made about trade and immigration inequality arguments rely on cherry picked data and emotional anecdotes to tell a compelling tale. Measure properly and there's a different story to tell, and why does inequality seem to stop at our border? Could it be because the beneficiaries of redistribution become targets/victims?

Terry said...

Whoa, whoa, whoa! This Kasparov joker obviously doesn't know what he is talking about. He should read award-winning columnists Paul Krugman and Dana Milbank if he wants the real low-down on capitalism versus socialism. Doesn't Kasparov understand that the socialists will give him free stuff? That they will literally empty the bank accounts of the rich and stuff his pockets with money?

Bay Area Guy said...

Love this.

In theory, socialism cures all the ills of an inequitable capitalism system. Fight the Power, Bernie!

As practiced, hello Stalin, Mao, Fidel, Hugo Chavez and 100 million murders. How's Venezuela doing these days?

But, What about Sweden?!!?, the college student defiantly asks.

Sweden has 10 million people (New Jersey size), a mostly homogenous population, and was neutral during WW2, except for its occasional assistance to the Nazi regime. Yes, let's talk about Sweden.

If you are a socialist in modern day America, you are a loser, and we can't be friends.

AprilApple said...

I'm convinced the democrats in power want to be Castro. He is surrounded by opulence and wealth while his people are all equally poor. The Cuban people have some basics, (oh glory be to the highest!) but Castro himself lives in a compound fit for a king with his own personal blood donors.

Democrats in power want this for themselves.

See here

and read Michael Totten's brilliant personal essay as he traveled thru Cuba. This stuff is not taught in our pathetic socialist-run public school system.

rhhardin said...

It helps, in college, when a friend says that salt shakers prove that socialism works, to have a drawer full of salt shakers.

tim in vermont said...

Well, to make it work you have to kill a lot of people who will never understand it and aren't evolved enough to live under it. So if Kasparov is overlooking that factor, he doesn't get why it will work this time.

tim in vermont said...

"Every man is guaranteed a job, but a job is not mandatory!" What's not to love?

Amadeus 48 said...

As a friend of mine says (he is a a Russian literature expert), "The future is on its way (it's just stopped off for a few drinks)."

Also, from the brilliant Irina Alexandrovevskivich video endorsement of Sanders, "He is a man who will not hesitate to repeal the law of supply and demand."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8rjD4Gth58

sunsong said...

How boring. This is sooo last century...

tim in vermont said...

I love how Sanders supporters think highways are "socialism." Does the government own the means of production for highways? Does it own the factories that produce the heavy equipment? Does it own the mines that produce the material for the roads? No, it contracts with private companies to produce the roads. Highways are an example of government taking on a shared responsibility where it makes sense. If that is socialism, then enforcing a law against murder is socialism and Cruz is a socialist and the word doesn't mean anything. Obviously Bernie thinks the word means something.

tim in vermont said...

How boring. This is sooo last century

Well, some of you may think sunsong is being ironic. That would be those of you who have never seen any of her other posts. If she is being ironic, she is under deep cover.

We have never heard the argument "It's going to be different this time" before either, not once. Nor have we heard the argument "It's never been tried." <-- That is irony, sarcasm actually.

I would like one socialist here to explain to me how we are going to keep it from going off the rails as it has in Venezuela, to just take the latest example. Just once I would like to see a socialist address the fact, FACT, that socialism has been responsible for nearly every vicious dictator of the 20th century.

Rick said...

Income inequality is a huge problem, absolutely.

Income inequality is not a problem. It's natural for new developments to lead to enrichment, but inevitably the developments and wealth are dispersed throughout the economy. Globalization has increased the leverage success has which makes the concentrations on a scale never seen before, but the pattern remains the same.

We're on the path toward tremendous economic advances and socialists like Sanders and Clinton are standing athwart the path yelling stop.

AJ Lynch said...

I remember talking to a young Russian emigre a few years ago before Obama was elected. He was then working for a Chicago private equity firm and he was as dismissive of socialism as Kasparov. He said we Americans don't know how good we have it here.

Gahrie said...

Income inequality is a huge problem, absolutely.

Only because humans get greedy and jealous.

AJ Lynch said...

And what Terry said at 8:40.

hawkeyedjb said...

To be a socialist after the experience of the 20th century you have to loathe humanity with a passion that is frightening to think about. How many humans did socialism slaughter? One hundred million? More?

What's the slogan going to be? "A hundred million - not enough!"

Tank said...

Gahrie said...

Income inequality is a huge problem, absolutely.

Only because humans get greedy and jealous.


I don't think we can eliminate the humans, can we?

Terry said...

tim in vermont said...
Well, to make it work you have to kill a lot of people who will never understand it and aren't evolved enough to live under it.

Even after devising new methods of efficient mass killing, even after crushing every pre-existing social institution, even after moving entire populations thousands of miles to destroy their traditional way of life, the Russian socialists still couldn't get their crappy system to work. It has been proven that it is not possible to kill enough people to make socialism work.

Browndog said...

As practiced, hello Stalin, Mao, Fidel, Hugo Chavez and 100 million murders

Why does Pol Pot always get a pass?

PuertoRicoSpaceport.com said...

"Under socialism people wait for bread

Under capitalism bread waits for you"

It works better with the picture http://bizopy.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/food11.jpg

John Henry

tim in vermont said...

It has been proven that it is not possible to kill enough people to make socialism work.

Well, you could draw that inference with some confidence, but it isn't *proven* yet, so they keep trying.

PuertoRicoSpaceport.com said...

Bay Area Guy,

You left out the 12 million murdered in the National Socialist death camps.

You left out the 3 million by the Cambodian socialists under Pol Pot et al.

You are certainly on the right track, though. 100 million people murdered by socialism last century.

NEVER FORGET!!!

John Henry

Lucien said...

When nations trade with each other, the de facto system is capitalist, because the only transactions are between willing buyers and willing sellers.

That is why internationalist communism required a program of war and conquest, without which other nations cannot be compelled to interact in a "socialist" manner. As long as nations do not conquer and subjugate each other they must deal with each other on capitalist terms.

To compete in such a system, it is best to engage in internal capitalism, too.

Hagar said...

For a socialist, shared misery is preferably to unequal happiness.

dbp said...

It is all about freedom and the lack thereof.

Under a capitalist system, individuals can voluntarily band together and form communal organizations such as communes, co-ops and families.

Under a socialist system, you may not opt-out of the communal schemes and in fact will be prevented from engaging in mutually acceptable exchanges.

Eric the Fruit Bat said...

Last time I checked, Bernie Sanders' website said he's not a socialist.

Rick said...

Eric the Fruit Bat said...
Last time I checked, Bernie Sanders' website said he's not a socialist.


Only true if we define socialists as thinking male and female roles are the 'pathology of oppression,' and sex roles must be destroyed.

Tank said...

Hagar said...

For a socialist, shared misery is preferably to unequal happiness.


Ramzpaul has a great video about this called: Neighbor's goat must die too.

Hagar said...

"Socialism is the system where we pretend to work and they pretend to pay us."

Note the "they;" socialism requires a ruling elite and a police force to keep things equal - and static. Anything new necessarily cannot be everywhere at once, but must start somewhere and spread. This is unequal distribution of a good and is not permissible.

Drago said...

sunsong: "How boring. This is sooo last century..."

Danger Ahead: Reality Is Being Discussed

Michael said...

José Daniel Ortega Saavedra. Here was the revolutionary, the man of the people who fought against the evil Contras who were supported secretly by the evil Republican president and his sneaky underlings who were opposed to the revolution and to the future promised by José Daniel Ortega Saavedra. Alas, socialism has worked all to well for José Daniel Ortega Saavedra who is now, voila!!, the richest man who heads the richest family in Nicaragua.

Never say that socialism does not work. Go to Nicaragua and see for yourself. As you land you will notice something odd. The lake fronting Managua has no houses along its shores, no boats bobbing on its breeze-made waves. No children putting their toes into that vast cesspool, the view from the hills of lovely Managua.

MikeR said...

I don't find all this very convincing. Real socialism has failed badly, sure. But as Kasparov points out, most people are thinking of something more like Europe: somewhat more in the direction of socialism than we have here. More health care, etc. Europe to me looks like it's on the way out, cannibalizing the next generation for present benefits, but it hasn't happened yet. I don't find examples like the Soviet Union and Venezuela that much of a proof that a middle ground is impossible.

cubanbob said...

A kibbutz is the largest successful socialist enterprise possible. Every member of the collective is there by their choice and was accepted because they fill a need of the collective and was accepted for that reason. But even a kibbutz has to compete in the market to sell it's wares to earn income for purchases of what it cannot produce. Any collective enterprise greater than a kibbutz will fail unless force is used since participation is forcible and not voluntary.

Even a child understands this so therefore why is this pernicious nonsense still around? The only conclusion is that this isn't about some Utopian fantasy of equality but simple a revenge role-reversal: you have, I want, I take. Now you are poor and I'm rich. Every socialist is a proto-dictator. The only good socialist is a dead one.

Gahrie said...

I don't find examples like the Soviet Union and Venezuela that much of a proof that a middle ground is impossible.

We are the middle ground.

Gahrie said...

Last time I checked, Bernie Sanders' website said he's not a socialist.


I agree...he's actually a Communist.

Gahrie said...

Gahrie said...

"Income inequality is a huge problem, absolutely."

Only because humans get greedy and jealous.

I don't think we can eliminate the humans, can we?


Nope..but we can raise/educate them better.

Rusty said...

Income inequality is a huge problem, absolutely.

No it's not.

Birkel said...

Also, because Sweden and the rest of the socialist countries "that work" are poorer, per capita, than Mississippi.

Mississippi is the poorest U.S. state.

Let that sink in.

sunsong said...

If you have a social security card, congratulations! You are a card carrying socialist.

jaydub said...

AA: "It’s capitalism that brought billions of people out of poverty in the 20th century. It’s socialism that enslaved them and impoverished them...."

Which is why I consider Sanders to be a mortal enemy. Yes, he may be a charismatic speaker and passionate believer in his cause, but the cause he espouses is totalitarian. The reason Sanders seems to strike a cord with young voters is because, by and large, they have no sense of history or knowledge of the world. It's not that their own lives are unlikely to match the opportunities of their parents and grandparents, its that they have no understanding or appreciation of what their parents and grandparents have created for them nor from whence they came. These young people are the wealthiest, most priviledged strata of citizenry that has ever lived, but their fundamental ignorance and sense of entitlement leaves them to believe they are instead being crushed by an oppressive system. As I told a great nephew who was explaining to me how life worked, be careful what you ask for. Trump is not the only huckster seeking office, nor even the most dangerous.

Birkel said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Birkel said...

Agree with sunsong to the extent he is blaming FDR for the expansion of government and the socialism he sought 80 years ago.

Sweden is poorer than Mississippi.

Curious George said...

"sunsong said...
If you have a social security card, congratulations! You are a card carrying socialist."

Not clever. Not funny. No basis in reality.

hamiyam said...

jaydub @ 10:35

Well said.
Lets reinstate a factual civics class in k-12 schools.

Bay Area Guy said...

@MikeR

But as Kasparov points out, most people are thinking of something more like Europe: somewhat more in the direction of socialism than we have here. More health care, etc. Europe to me looks like it's on the way out, cannibalizing the next generation for present benefits, but it hasn't happened yet.

Some people, not most, want something like Europe, but in Europe, we are merely witnessing a slower version of the pernicious effects of socialism.

Why would any sane person want that?

Free market capitalism is the exception, not the rule of humanity. Liberty is the exception, not the rule. For most of history, poverty, war and disease have prevailed. Why would we reject success, wealth creation and freedom?

Roughcoat said...

"I see a lot of eggshells lying around, comrade, but where's this omelet you're always talking about?"

Ignorance is Bliss said...

sunsong said...

If you have a social security card, congratulations! You are a card carrying socialist.

Sure*, just against my will. Come to think of it, that's the case for the vast majority of socialists.

*Actually, I'm not. My social security card stays in a drawer at home.

Gahrie said...

. The reason Sanders seems to strike a cord with young voters is because, by and large, they have no sense of history or knowledge of the world.

The USSR collapsed 25 years ago.......

exhelodrvr1 said...

Mike R,
Europe also benefited immensely from living under the umbrella of our military. That is what allowed them to have their current lifestyle. Very few people realize that, and the leaders on the left that do understand are hiding that fact to enable their rise to power.

Gahrie said...

These young people are the wealthiest, most priviledged strata of citizenry that has ever lived,

Something I spend lots of time trying to get my high school students to understand.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

MikeR said...
I don't find all this very convincing. Real socialism has failed badly, sure. But as Kasparov points out, most people are thinking of something more like Europe: somewhat more in the direction of socialism than we have here. More health care, etc. Europe to me looks like it's on the way out, cannibalizing the next generation for present benefits, but it hasn't happened yet. I don't find examples like the Soviet Union and Venezuela that much of a proof that a middle ground is impossible.


The 2 problems you'll have to solve to keep that POV, MikeR, are 1) as you said Europe isn't Europe anymore/the European model isn't even working for Europe so how could it possibly work for teh US and more importantly 2) who will act as the U.S. for us if we're going to be more like Europe? What I mean is that rich America has been a great deal for the rest of the world and Europe in particular--we pay a ton more for drugs and medical innovation so they can freeride off of that, we've been footing the bill for worldwide/common defense spending for the better part of a century now so their defense spending is ridiculously low (we spend a ton so they don't spend much, and they use the savings to fund their domestic welfare states), and so on.

We subsidize and underwrite those quasi-Socialist European nations directly and indirectly, and have for decades. Who will do that for us? If the answer is "no one, obviously" then how will that model possibly work? It won't.

jaydub said...

"Something I spend lots of time trying to get my high school students to understand."

Thanks, Gahrie.

Anthony said...

Sweden et al. aren't really socialist, they're just capitalist with high taxes. And even they're finding out that they're (inevitably) running out of other peoples' money.

Rusty said...

sunsong said...
If you have a social security card, congratulations! You are a card carrying socialist.


I've been waiting for a usual suspect to bring this up.

Ahem.
It's my money you simpering dolt. It's my money that the treasury department steals from me every week.
The fact that there's no money in the account is because our betters decided that the money we all have been paying in all these years has gone to pay for all the social programs you love so much.
I want my money back.
cheers.

Rusty said...

Gahrie said...
These young people are the wealthiest, most priviledged strata of citizenry that has ever lived,

Something I spend lots of time trying to get my high school students to understand.


Dude. Do you know what a PS4 goes for?

rehajm said...

AprilApple said...
...and read Michael Totten's brilliant personal essay as he traveled thru Cuba.


Thanks for this link.

n.n said...

Socialism is a gateway ideology to minority consolidation of capital and control, and establishment of monopolies and monopolistic practices, which are invariably plagued with unaccountable progressive corruption.

That said, capitalism exhibits socialist symptoms when overregulation, class diversity, excessive debt, stagnant capital, and affirmative action undermine the dynamic, self-regulating ecology of a democratic economic environment.

Gahrie said...


Dude. Do you know what a PS4 goes for?


Yep..bought one for my niece and nephew.

PuertoRicoSpaceport.com said...

Blogger Curious George said...
"sunsong said...
If you have a social security card, congratulations! You are a card carrying socialist."

Not clever. Not funny. No basis in reality.

Why not? Social security takes from each according to their ability (15.5% or whatever of your earnings) and gives according to need. See some of the discussion in last night's debate about cutting benefits for the "rich". No mention of how much they might have paid in. Payment would be based on need.

And there are still some people, civilians and politicians, who think it is an "insurance" program.

It is a welfare program pure and simple. That is why all the blather last night about it running out of money are just so much bullshit. SS can no more run out of money than Section 8 housing, food stamps or the Navy can run out of money. It is 100% up to Congress to fund it or not fund it and the funding levels.

John Henry

William Chadwick said...

Apparently this blog does not accept links (I've tried, and aparrently they're shunted off to the Cyber Phantom Zone) but there's a great e-poster that was on the satirical pro-freedom blog "IMAO." It's credited to Susan Swift from PolitiChicks.com. In a parody of Soviet and Maoist posters, it shows Karl Marx, Lenin, Stalin, etc. lined up in noble-looking, forward-thinking profile. The line-up ends with Bernie Sanders. The caption is:

"Liberals say I should stop confusing socialism with communism. I say liberalos should stop confusing MY money with THEIR money."

coupe said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Paul Snively said...

"To be a socialist after the experience of the 20th century you have to loathe humanity with a passion that is frightening to think about."

Bingo. My family was one of six from my church who hosted a Vietnamese boat family that wound up in our town. I know the evil secondhand. Hand me a gun, put a self-described Communist in front of me, and I will not hesitate to personally pull the trigger, knowing I have improved the moral state of the world.

Socialism is only better to the extent it's democratic and based on ignorance of where the wealth influx required to sustain it comes from, e.g. Sweden with its enormous wood and oil exports to its capitalist neighbors. They're just fools. Cuba, Venezuela, Argentina... it's pull-the-trigger time again.

dbp said...

William,

Are you sure you can't put in links?

William Chadwick said...

Good going, dhp. All I can say is that I've tried putting in links here, and they used to work, and then they stopped working. I assumed our hostess had some kind of policy against it. OK, let's try another, just for the heck of it:

https://maddmedic.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/destroy-500x667.jpg?w=474&h=632

Unknown said...

MikeR holds up Europe as an example to be emulated--more healthcare etc. The per capita income of these countries puts the 4 richest between New Mexico and Missouri (39th place) out of US states (https://www.aei.org/publication/us-gdp-per-capita-by-state-vs-european-countries-and-japan-korea-mexico-and-china-and-some-lessons-for-the-donald/). And this is with a 1000 year head start. The "healthcare problem" in the US is mainly for those who lose jobs suddenly and then get real sick, or who have a chronic illness. It is better to get sick in the US than Europe on average and for serious illness (heart disease, cancer) much much better. Do you really want to wait 2 months to be seen for your cancer while it grows?

Deb said...

Why not? Social security takes from each according to their ability (15.5% or whatever of your earnings) and gives according to need.

SSA benefits (retirement, anyway) is based on your contributions, a percentage of your INCOME as you stated, over the years. It is not based on need. You are perhaps confusing SSA with SSI, which *is* welfare.

coupe said...

William Chadwick said...OK, let's try another, just for the heck of it

No, no, you have to use HTML.

n.n said...

While socialism can work in a homogeneous society that acknowledges intrinsic value, and in a society that has sufficient competing interests to keep the minority ruling party from running amuck, it is a gateway ideology to the hardcore left-wing ideologies that seek to establish social/political, economic/capital, and religious/legal monopolies.

holdfast said...

Income inequality is not a problem.

Wage stagnation, lack of opportunity, and a lack of upward mobility are all problems.

Americans are, on the whole, not covetous or jealous people, though of course they like having nice stuff and want their kids lives to be better than theirs were. Which is fine and good. If their lives are going well and they feel like they are succeeding, they won't care if Zuckerberg has $50mm or $50bb.

Anthony said...

>ArilApple said...
I'm convinced the democrats in power want to be Castro. He is surrounded by opulence and wealth while his people are all equally poor. The Cuban people have some basics, (oh glory be to the highest!) but Castro himself lives in a compound fit for a king with his own personal blood donors.

But they have free health care and 100% literacy!

Michael said...

Operators of hotels in Cuba pay $350 per worker per month to the Cuban Government. The Cuban Government then pays the workers $15 per month.

Viva la revolution!!

Theranter said...

Heard a great talk by 9th Citcuit Judge Alex Kozinski wherein he told of leaving communist Russia and how he immediately loved capitalism upon discovering bananas were not always black and squishy, and experiencing chewing gum! He probably feels the same as this guy.

n.n said...

holdfast:

Exactly right. Class warfare is repulsive as a matter of principle. A reconciliation of individual dignity and intrinsic value with natural imperatives leads to classical liberalism tempered by Judaeo-Christian religion or moral philosophy. Not the "secular" ideologies of socialism etc., despite the appearance of a limited congruence.

Rhythm and Balls said...

So what? Then Garry Kasparov is just another tortured idiot who, like Bobby Fischer, is great with figuring out how to move pieces of plastic strategically on a wooden board but does not understand that Scandinavia is not the USSR, and it's the totalitarian structure of the USSR, not anyone's social concerns, that was the difference.

These reductio fallacies work both ways. Hitler was also in favor of many of the things the current GOP is.

Rusty said...

Gahrie said...

Dude. Do you know what a PS4 goes for?

Yep..bought one for my niece and nephew.

Now they will never know the pleasure of mowing endless lawns in the hot summer sun so they could buy it themselves.

Rusty said...

Hitler was also in favor of many of the things the current GOP is.

But he was more in favor of everything progressives are.

Socialism doesn't work for anybody other than the rent seekers.

Rhythm and Balls said...

The reason Sanders seems to strike a cord with young voters is because, by and large, they have no sense of history or knowledge of the world.

It seems the people with no sense of history or knowledge of the world are:

1. Those who mistake 2016 for 1980.
2. Those who can't understand how 1917 was different from what happened here in 1932.
3. Those who mistake Western and Northern Europe with the USSR.
4. Those who can't tell the difference between tyranny and a simply decent society that doesn't seek to exacerbate poverty.
5. Those who can't tell the difference between a government that's doing too much for its Bill Gateses and not enough for its homeless and uninsured.
6. Those who want the kind of government-corporate collusion and corruption that led to Chernobyl, and those who want to separate the government from fixating on the interests of its richest donors.

Rhythm and Balls said...

But he was more in favor of everything progressives are.

It's great to get blind, laughable assertions from an avatar that pushes the bill of his cap down far enough to hide his lying eyes.

Socialism doesn't work for anybody other than the rent seekers.

I'm amused by the new armchair economist trend rampant in the same GOP that presided over 1929, 2008 and - in our Congress - the horrible recovery that has prevailed since 2010.

It must be akin to the same right-wing trend that makes every one of Trump's beloved "uneducated" supporters also believe he's an armchair 4-star general and military analyst, an armchair Islamic scholar, an armchair embryologist, an armchair oceanographer, and an armchair moral philosopher.

The GOP's motto should just be: Pull up an armchair and get comfortable with us! We will solve the world's problems from the comforts of our own barcaloungers and La-Z-Boys!

DO you also get angry and yell at the tv? Well, so do we! That's where we find our deepest wisdom and greatest accomplishments!

Michael said...

R&B

What went wrong in Venezuela? You OK that Ortega is the richest man in Nicaragua? How can these good intentions have gone so off the rails?

Rhythm and Balls said...

What went wrong in Venezuela?

Who knows and who cares? Lack of checks and balances like in America? Not many of us every looked to or ever would look to Venezuela for some type of lesson on what to do. But again, why the need to look away from Scandinavia, etc.? I guess you must be afraid of asking the question, "What went right there?"

You OK that Ortega is the richest man in Nicaragua?

Should I be? Again, I know nothing about him, and I don't care.

But I know that if you want a very Latin American, "strong man/strong woman" model of leadership, then Hillary's your girl. There's no special interest or excuse for doing something other than the will of the people that she was ever above. But interestingly, the Latin Americans who might know those downfalls best seemed to be her worst antagonists at the Univision debate.

She's also the Boss Tweed establishment of the Democratic party. If a guy as honest as Bernie is the only alternative to her brand and he's kicking her ass as badly as she's discovering, you guys had best get used to the people standing up and demanding that their priorities stop being ignored.

How can these good intentions have gone so off the rails?

I don't know. I guess by not having as many of your own, truly evil intentions, to countervail against them.

Michael said...

R&B


Check out Ortega. Bernie is big pals with him. Revolutionary. Now richest man in a poor country. Bernie loves Ortega. Loves the Sandanistas.

Rhythm and Balls said...

I'm sure that boring fact will make every minimum wage-earning practical slave forget how enraged he is at how lazy your government buddies are in every manner unrelated to catering to their richest campaign donors.

Your methods for scaring and distracting the voter aren't really very up-to-date. If only ordinary Americans let their interests go as moldy and stale as you did your refrigerator contents the last time your housemaid was out sick.

Michael said...

R&R

Bernie would be the one with the shopworn last century ideas. And how did those big shot donations work out for Jeb?

Bernie seems to be the one with moldy ideas and the same promises his buddy Ortega made to the gulls down there.

Michael said...

https://mises.org/blog/if-sweden-and-germany-became-us-states-they-would-be-among-poorest-states

Rhythm and Balls said...

So in order to shield your fragile ears when you leave the confines of your luxury car or mansion from the concerns of everyone earning $60,000, $50,000, $25,000, etc. on two or more jobs, how strongly do they have to build the reinforced plexiglass that you envelop yourself within? Does it block out all the sound or just 90% of it?

Well, I guess that's why you love life in the Old Confederacy so much. Very pliable and docile when it comes to respecting the post-Soviet fears of their economic betters. Which is why it won't decide which Democrat will win the 2016 election. Or the 2012 election. Or the 2008 election. Etc., etc., etc.

Old fears die hard among the South's most skilled auto-fellators. Last century it was fear of the blacks. This century it's fear of the Soviets. You planter class types are always about a century behind on what to scare people about, it seems.

Too bad this year it's fear of your dominatrix Hillary and her buddy, Trump, that will prevail. Maybe once they both lose you can have a get-together with them to gripe about how bad you all have it while bumpkin hubby Bill flies around on his plane full of child-fuckers as they make their way to fantasy island.

Rhythm and Balls said...

If Michael wants his plantation workers to stop fearing him and voting for their own interests, I think he's going to have to do better than to pretend that he sees Joseph Stalin in Bernie Sanders.

Michael said...

R&B

Trust me on this one. I would make a lot more money in a Sanders administration than in a Clinton or Trump admin.

You really don't get it.

Rhythm and Balls said...

I also don't care.

Your money is something I really don't give a shit about.

You must be really stupid to assume that I would. Not that I'm not stopping you from telling everyone why your money is so important. Especially in 2016.

Do you ever have a point to make, even? I think you just go on about the USSR because you probably never fought in a real war and just saw our dispute with them as the best way of feeling like you were actually part of a real struggle.

Gahrie said...

But again, why the need to look away from Scandinavia, etc.? I guess you must be afraid of asking the question, "What went right there?"

1) demographics.

2) Living off of other people's money, specifically ours. Europe has been free riding on America's dime since WWW II.

By the way, notice that as the disaster of third world immigration proceeds, the move away from socialism begins?

Michael said...

R&B

Don't think I wrote a single syllable about the USSR. You sobered up yet?

Rusty said...


Blogger Rhythm and Balls said...
But he was more in favor of everything progressives are.

It's great to get blind, laughable assertions from an avatar that pushes the bill of his cap down far enough to hide his lying eyes.

Socialism doesn't work for anybody other than the rent seekers.

I'm amused by the new armchair economist trend rampant in the same GOP that presided over 1929, 2008 and - in our Congress - the horrible recovery that has prevailed since 2010.


And yet he cannot refute anything I've said.


Good job ritmo!

Howard said...

We already live in a hybrid socialist/free market country. Socialism for the destitute, the druggie disabled, the wealthy, the banksters and international corporations. The middle class gets all responsibility of the free market and pays for the top-bottom socialism.

Bernie is a socialistic candidate, just like the rest of the bunch. He's the only one either stupid enough or with the balls to admit it