November 20, 2011

Russ Feingold: "The big lie is beginning. The big lie is that this is an out-of-state movement...."

He was speaking about the movement to recall Scott Walker at a rally in Madison, Wisconsin yesterday.



"The big lie"? The "big lie" is a lie that has "a certain force of credibility" precisely because it is so big:
[T]he broad masses of a nation are always more easily corrupted in the deeper strata of their emotional nature than consciously or voluntarily; and thus in the primitive simplicity of their minds they more readily fall victims to the big lie than the small lie, since they themselves often tell small lies in little matters but would be ashamed to resort to large-scale falsehoods. It would never come into their heads to fabricate colossal untruths, and they would not believe that others could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously. Even though the facts which prove this to be so may be brought clearly to their minds, they will still doubt and waver and will continue to think that there may be some other explanation. For the grossly impudent lie always leaves traces behind it, even after it has been nailed down, a fact which is known to all expert liars in this world and to all who conspire together in the art of lying.
Those aren't Feingold's words. Those are the words of Adolf Hitler, which Feingold evoked when he used the historically resonant expression "the big lie." In accusing his opponents of employing "the big lie," Feingold is likening them to Hitler.

Let me remind you that the Wisconsin protesters have been equating Scott Walker with Hitler since last winter.  From last March, here's a protester explaining why Scott Walker is like Hitler. Here's another explanation, from a woman with a sign portraying Scott Walker as Hitler. Here's a photo I took last February. I vividly remember this woman:

P1060646

I asked her if she thought Scott Walker was like Hitler...
... and she said "Yes." So I said, "Are you saying that you think fascism could come to America," and she said, "It's what's happening."
Russ Feingold is a very intelligent and informed man. His allusion to Hitler is subtle, not — I think — accidental. He's sounding the deep chord. His speech continues:
"How can they even say it with a straight face? This movement is so grass-roots, so red-and-white Wisconsin, that it is absolutely ridiculous to say that."
Can you look at this picture of a truck parked on the Capitol Square during yesterday's rally and maintain a straight face?



It says: "Kentucky/West Virginia/Indiana." (And here's a golden oldie from last March: "Chicago is up in the house... Everyone left is from Chicago.")

Feingold continues:
Now, we've got a great football team. They may not be #1, except for a couple little problems there, but they're darned close, but when it comes to grass-roots activism that is all Badger, we are #1.
All right. Quite aside from the truth of the assertion that the recall movement is totally in-state and grass-roots, how can he say "Now, we've got a great football team. They may not be #1"? We've got a great football team that is most certainly #1, but it's not in Madison, Wisconsin. It's in Green Bay. You can even hear an audience member yell out "Two!" in a prompt that Feingold could have heard. But it's a Madison, Wisconsin crowd, and Feingold is Madison-focused. He used the expression "red-and-white Wisconsin" as if the colors of the University of Wisconsin—Madison were the state colors. Red-and-white Wisconsin? What about green-gold-and-white Wisconsin? Feingold is unwittingly displaying that he is out of touch with the rest of the state — which voted him out of the U.S. Senate in 2010, despite his vast popularity in Madison.

And this is the state that voted in Scott Walker. The people of Madison never supported him, but they weren't in synch with the majority of the state in 2010. Now, it's a year later, and the people of Madison want to force another election, using the recall mechanism from the Wisconsin constitution, which doesn't limit the reasons why we might recall a governor. Russ Feingold addressed the question of when recalls are justified:
Our law says you can be recalled if you simply attack the people of the State of Wisconsin, and that is what this is all about. 
The state constitution says no such thing. "Attack the people"? It is for us, the people of Wisconsin, to decide when and why we want to use the recall device. There's no attack-the-people standard, whatever that's supposed to mean. Feingold attempts to infuse meaning into his made-up standard:
Now, I'm going to be the first to say I don't believe you should do recalls just any old time. I don't think that's a good idea. I think it could be damaging. 
I agree!
For example, I don't think it would be a valid basis to recall Walker because he ruined our chances to have a railroad system. I mean that was totally dumb. It was $800 million from the federal government that he just threw away. 
He just threw it away. Isn't it shocking to think of federal money like that? The federal government is deeply in debt. There is no money to throw away. Once the federal government offers money for some specific purpose it may seem to acquire reality, and if you are completely fixated on what you want for yourself, you may think, I'd better snap that up now or I'm going to lose it, but that's a delusion. There is no money. And if we'd taken the money for the railroad line (to connect Madison to Milwaukee), we would have been on the hook — as a state — for endless additional expenses over the years.

But according to Feingold, the railroad "was our future." It's not right to recall Scott Walker over that, however, Feingold says, because "he said he was going to do that." (That is true. It's why I voted for Walker.) What Walker didn't say, and what is therefore the reason to recall him, Feingold says, "was that he was going to go at the basic collective bargaining rights and voting rights of every citizen in this state. That's a big deal. That goes to the foundation of who we are."

Now, Walker didn't go after "the basic collective bargaining rights... of every citizen in this state." He only went after some of the collective bargaining rights of some public employees. And he didn't go after the "voting rights of every citizen in this state" — only the "rights" of citizens who haven't yet acquired a state-issued photo ID.

But Feingold is stirring up the crowd. And the fact is, he's a great speaker. He ends: "Where do I sign?" and signs a recall petition.

Our recall procedure requires an election with an opposition candidate, and what's the point of going through the collection of all these signatures unless the governor can be ousted? Who will oppose Scott Walker? The only candidate with a real chance, it seems, is Russ Feingold, but Russ says he's not running. That's what he's saying now, before the signatures are collected. I happen to believe that if there is a recall election, Feingold will run. But that is a subject for another post.

131 comments:

Paddy O said...

"How Feingold lost me"

Rose said...

I wish we had a Scott Walker in California - perhaps it could save our state.

pbAndjFellowRepublican said...

"But it's a Madison, Wisconsin crowd, and Feingold is Madison-focused."

Althouse conclusion: " Feingold is unwittingly displaying that he is out of touch with the rest of the state"



Who knew that she was such a political novice.

Maybe someday she'll notice that politicians throw in specific references to whatever city/population is sitting in front of them. It's not some secret tell.

Sheesh.

Petunia said...

Well, Feingold ought to know all about "big lies", since one of the biggest lies of all was that he was a "maverick".

I don't think Feingold will run if the recall happens, because he knows there's a good chance he'll lose, and losing two elections in just over a year is not something he wants. I think he's more likely to run for governor in 2014.

Good for pointing out the Hitler quotation, Ann. There's no depth to which Feingold and the left will not sink in their efforts to distort the truth and persuade more useful idiots to support them.

Mike said...

Slick talkin' skunk.

Petunia said...

And BTW, Russ, the big lie is that this is a grass-roots movement with little to no out-of-state money behind it.

edutcher said...

How many pre-printed signs came off the semis?

How much of the money for the rally came from Dr Evil?

This is grass-roots like the fight here in OH.

Rose said...

I wish we had a Scott Walker in California - perhaps it could save our state.

I think you'd need a State Assembly full of them and Mayors and City Councils packed with them in SF, LA, and SD as well.

Roger J. said...

Looks like Mr Feingold has turned in a demagogue--

Ann Althouse said...

"How many pre-printed signs came off the semis?"

If you look at the video of the big march yesterday (in the previous post), you will see that the pre-printed union signs predominate.

Big Mike said...

Tell me, Professor, do you ever look around at your fellow Madisonians and wonder whether you've been mistakenly become an inmate in the asylum?

EDH said...

In that picture, Feingold, aptly, is begining to look a lot like Soupy Sales, but acting like the Bizzaro Soupy Sales.

On January 1, 1965... Sales ended his live broadcast by encouraging his young viewers to tiptoe into their still-sleeping parents' bedrooms and remove those "funny green pieces of paper with pictures of U.S. Presidents" from their pants and pocketbooks. "Put them in an envelope and mail them to me", Soupy instructed the children.

Feingold is the Bizzarro Soupy Sales, however, because he is urging parents to dip into their childrens' wallets.

F said...

Rose:

There's no saving CA. Sorry to say that; I'm a transplanted Californian. That category -- "transplanted Californian" -- is a rapidly increasing cohort. The salvation of CA would be to hold onto productive citizens. Your state government seems to be on a determined course to get rid of the people who pay the bills. Pity, really.

phx said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
AllenS said...

"The big lie is beginning, as soon as I open my big mouth." -- Feingold

Paddy O said...

Rose, we did, in a way. Arnold came into office with a huge push to transform the state, making a lot of steps to fight the legislature then going the route of initiatives.

He lost. Then he was crushed. Then he was utterly cowed. Then he basically switched sides.

The unions are still too strong here, and Walker had the gift of a welcoming legislature to help him. Meaning we need much more than a Scott Walker. We need a total transformation.

Henry said...

Brilliant piece.

Can one create a pre-emptive recall petition? What if the current recall drive succeeds and Walker is a prohibitive favorite against his liberal opponent. Could Walker opponents start collecting signatures for yet another recall election?

But what if the liberal stages an upset? Would the next recall election have to be held anyway?

pbAndjFellowRepublican said...

BTW, if Russ was accusing others of implementing a big lie, Althouse's analysis is completely wrong.

In that context Russ is Hitler. And those accused of lying (i.e. "his opponents") are Jews.

So, Althouse thinks that she's uncovered Feingold's hidden message where he sees himself as Hitler, and Scott Walker et. al. are cast as Jews.


Oh my.

sydney said...

What do they haul in those big union semi's?

roesch/voltaire said...

How grass roots can it get? Yesterday afternoon at the gym I over-heard a conversation between a carpenter, who own his own business, talking with a cancer researcher; it turns out both had attended the anti-Walker Rally.

edutcher said...

Ann Althouse said...

"How many pre-printed signs came off the semis?"

If you look at the video of the big march yesterday (in the previous post), you will see that the pre-printed union signs predominate.


I saw the vid; that was my point.

phx said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Roger J. said...

RV: your anecdotal sample of two means what exactly?

Alex said...

How grass roots can it get? Yesterday afternoon at the gym I over-heard a conversation between a carpenter, who own his own business, talking with a cancer researcher; it turns out both had attended the anti-Walker Rally.

What can I say, liberals are insane. So what about a cancer researcher? I know plenty of super smart people when it comes to their technical area of expertise and are total dunces when it comes to economics & politics. But you forgive all if they are leftists.

Alex said...

Liberals are liberals to the bitter end. The mind is poisoned early on and never recovers.

ALH said...

Wow- great post.

Pretty much off topic:
At the local level, the area newspaper ran a story this morning with the headline of local officials being skeptical that Walker's "budget tools" have allowed them to balance their budgets.

Buried on the inside, several paragraphs down... a fleeting admission that both the city and county pushed through contracts in March (with NO debate or transparency btw) which gave raises and didn't require nearly as much employee contribution for benefits as they could have. Ummm, yeah. The tools don't work if you don't use them. The county administrator says it wouldn't "be fair" to have done this to employees who didn't cause the budget crisis. WTF?????!!!! So now, you don't have to deal with facts and numbers( i.e. reality), just YOUR sense of fairness?

Serenity now!

bagoh20 said...

All you have to do is just stop judging people by what they say and rather by what they do. Then there are no lies, big or small, that effect your judgement.

The question is not whether or not the recall is grassroots or not, or if the opponents are lying or not.

Scott Walker has been governing, and before that his opponents had their way. The question is simply: Is Scott Walker doing better or worse than the alternative. Everyone knows what they will get with each alternative. Choose wisely.

But how can you when 90% of the discussion is about the optics or the reality show type bickering?

Just think how much spare time we would all have if we just judged the actions and results. If pundits mostly analyzed that, and how candidates accomplished things in their past.

Of course, then candidates would need to have a record, and a successful one to win.

Naaaa, that's crazy talk. I need coffee.

Henry said...

Feingold's big lie is awfully small.

This particular bunch of people determined to change the world are awfully defensive.

The defensiveness comes from identity politics. Reason, logic, and principle are secondary to the idea of authenticity. The most important way to be authentic is to be a minority. And if not that, be working class. Or at least more working class than the next guy.

This is why Feingold pulled out the rhetorical howitzers to bombard such a minor point. The accusation that the recall is supported by out-of-state money or agitators assaults the smugness at their core.

bagoh20 said...

"Liberals are liberals to the bitter end. The mind is poisoned early on and never recovers."

I got better. It started soon after leaving the nest, and I got better and better with each challenge I knocked down. It's often called growing up. You can barely see the scars now.

I think the government should subsidize the study and expansion of growing up. We need a Manhattan Project type commitment, starting with a congressional committee and a study of some kind.

Alex said...

It appears the only way for a liberal to get all hot & bothered these days is to compare Republicans to Hitler. It makes their cocks hard and pussies wet.

bagoh20 said...

That makes me wonder: Who gets the majority of the hermaphrodite vote?

purplepenquin said...

It is kinda cute how so many out-of-state commentators are getting the vapors because out-of-state people are supporting the Walker recall. The whiners and complainers seem kinda hypocritical, no?


But what is really funny is how Althouse invoked Goidwin's Law before the thread even got started.

Comparing Fiengold to Hitler just 'cause he says something is a "big lie" tells me that the AntiLabor movement is desperate ad grasping at straws...

Alex said...

Comparing Fiengold to Hitler just 'cause he says something is a "big lie" tells me that the AntiLabor movement is desperate ad grasping at straws...

Listen purple dumbfuck, it's YOUR side comparing MY side to Hitler all the time. As a Jew, I'm very offended by it. Especially Feingold should know the FUCK better by now. I prefer to call him Feinfucker.

Alex said...

I got better. It started soon after leaving the nest, and I got better and better with each challenge I knocked down. It's often called growing up. You can barely see the scars now.

You were not as seriously brainwashed as kids are these days. It's 100% total with all the internet & video they're assaulted with. 80% of young people voted for Obama in 2008. I expect that to be 90% next year.

Paco Wové said...

"Walker didn't go after "the basic collective bargaining rights... every citizen in this state." He only went after some of the collective bargaining rights of some public employees..."

Government of the public workers, by the public workers, for the public workers... isn't that in your Constitution somewhere?

Bruce Hayden said...

It is kinda cute how so many out-of-state commentators are getting the vapors because out-of-state people are supporting the Walker recall. The whiners and complainers seem kinda hypocritical, no?

No, I would suggest just the opposite, projection and hypocrisy on the part of those pushing the recall. They know that much of their support comes from outside the state (as is obvious from all those big-labor semis lined up). And, they likely just assume that the other side is doing the same. Plus, they likely figure that if they point out the other side supposedly getting outside support first, no one will notice their out of state support.

purplepenquin said...

Listen purple dumbfuck...


With that attitude I doubt anyone will listen to you.

You really expect to be taken seriously when you start off your comments with incitful and violent remarks like that?

*rolls eyes*

Jason said...

Feingold is a chicken shit.

He's always the first to speak out against Walker and his policies. And always the first to say he wont run against Walker in a potential recall election.

Liberals are seeing that Dane County doesnt run this state anymore. And it pisses them off to no end.

Spread Eagle said...

Of course, the problem with comparing any garden-variety US politician with Hitler is that it grotesquely trivializes the horror of Hitler. Of all people, Jewish folks ought to know better.

As for California, a lost cause because the fringe has irreversibly outgrown the bedspread. Irreversibly, because it is a confoundingly worsening situation, as people of substance --small businesses-- do a steady exodus to more hospitable climes, leaving behind a growing class dependent on taxpayer shrinking largess.

garage mahal said...

Feingold = Hitler!

Sounds like some people are getting desperate.

LOLZ

David said...

Feingold is lying, but yet he isn't. At some point even intelligent people like Russ Feingold come to believe their own make believe. Lies and fantasy can cover a common area in the mind. That is the area where Russ Feingold now lives.

bagoh20 said...

What's the recall about? Recall what? Is there some record of failure by Walker? I understand wanting to fire someone, but doesn't he have to screw up his job first?

Is this one of those jobs where you get fired for doing the job too well? You know what I mean - like a union job.

Alex said...

Feingold = Hitler!

Sounds like some people are getting desperate.


Own it fucktard. Feingold is the equivalent of a 21st century Judenrat.

Pogo said...

Democrats and their Union arm are tax alcoholics who, despite hitting rock bottom, lack any insight into their problem.

The big lie has always been that the State can be larger than the productive sector, or that it can even run it entirely.

Once it exceeds about 30% of GDP, the state becomes a parasite or even a cancer, eventually killing its host.

AllenS said...

sydney said...
What do they haul in those big union semi's?

Hitler mustaches.

Titus said...

I would do Feingold.

I bet he is good in the sack.

I would like to see that Jew Hog.

Titus said...

Allens I would definitely not do.

Not hot.

AllenS said...

It would also result in you having a broken neck.

Mary Beth said...

Is saying he won't run a big lie, a little lie, or just politics as usual?

pauldar said...

Well, since that truck is from KY, and I live in Ohio, but was born in KY, it would be only fitting that the wife and I contribute to the Walker campaign - Unions ( That my entire family USED to belong to, well, suck

lordhack_99 said...

What that truck ought have had added to its banner is "or else."

Chip S. said...

It is kinda cute how so many out-of-state commentators are getting the vapors because out-of-state people are supporting the Walker recall. The whiners and complainers seem kinda hypocritical, no?

You've got a funny sense of equivalence, penq, by which posting comments on a blog is identical to shipping in Teamsters organizers and funds.

Anyway, these "hypocrisy" charges are getting stale, and have always been lame. Your position is that, while your pals are allowed to finance a recall effort that has questionable support among the people who'll have to pay for it, Walker's pals aren't allowed to point this out unless their url resolves to a Wisconsin server.

Ridiculous.

sorepaw said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Carol_Herman said...

Here's a bet: Russ Feingold is never getting back to where he was, before he lost his senate seat. And, toodled around, arm in arm, with John McCain.

Voters really don't have regrets.

As to the "visual" of Feingold, it dawned on me he looks a lot like Spanier. That's another creep who dreams he's gonna get back into Penn State and kick ass.

Sad, though, how bad politics has become. There are just no good examples to point to ... to show that decent people serve in congress. Well, they don't.

And, whores don't have "hearts of gold," either.

The Internet lets people see in. And, see stuff that's usually not carried by the media ... once you lose a big battle. And, go home.

You know, today I realized that back in 1996, the GOP had up as one of its 9 Thumb Wrestlers: Alan Keyes. Black, before Obama won. And, the GOP lost sight of calling Alan Keyes back onto the stage.

It's like watching soap bubbles bursting.

Now, in 2012 ... will more incumbents fail, and have to go home? Doesn't Feingold's appearance tell you something about these fears? Both sides of the aisle.

Where the GOP has returned Newt Gingrich to center stage!

The democrats won't give Feingold the same opportunity.

I wish there were real differences between the two parties.

Chip S. said...

@PB&J--What's more relevant: the actual passage from Mein Kampf or the quote as it is most widely attributed and known?

Your insistence on historical accuracy is commendable, but when the topic is dogwhistle politics what's more relevant is what deep beliefs are being stirred up in the crowd.

Feingold is engaging in pure demagoguery, and Althouse is rightly calling him out on it.

William said...

One longs for the purity and idealism of NJ politics. In NJ, the 99% were able to rally behind Jon Corzine, a true man of the people. I can't fathom how Chris Christie, clearly the closest thing to Hitler America has ever known, was able to win that election. That man is not only overweight, but he talks rudely to teachers. That's how it starts. A nasty aside to a teacher and pretty soon the jackboots are kicking down your door. I just hope Corzine avoids prison long enough to rally the forces of democracy for the next big election in NJ. Corzine has a busy schedule just now, but perhaps he can find the time to appear in Wisconsin at some of their rallies. He truly is the face of Democrats in America.

garage mahal said...

Your position is that, while your pals are allowed to finance a recall effort that has questionable support among the people who'll have to pay for it,

The latest polling we have, from St Norbert College/WPR, shows 58% approving of recalling Walker. Interesting 24% of Republicans in the poll said they supported the recall. Walker is in deep shit.

cubanbob said...

If Walker is going to be demonized as a Hitler, he might as well be a Hitler. He ought to organize a Wisconsin SS and then round up and shoot the commie clowns. Probably by doing that he ought to be able to raise the Madison area average IQ by thirty points. As the expression went in the old days, 'the only good commie is a dead commie'.

Seriously he is one clever operative. He succeed where Kasich failed (by trying to make the goal in one big leap) and when the recall efforts fail and the elections next year go mainly republican I suspect he will then press round two which will curb the police and firemen's unions. Depending on things unfold, Walker has long term a very bright future in republican circles nationally.

roesch/voltaire said...

The CEO of Google on the CBS morning news show last week stated that the Republican mantra of taxes and regulations were responsible for job losses was, and I quote, "A lie," but because he did not say "big'we can not compare him to Hitler-- sucks.

Alex said...

The CEO of Google on the CBS...

The Google boys are notorious communists. This is old news.

cubanbob said...

garage mahal said...
Your position is that, while your pals are allowed to finance a recall effort that has questionable support among the people who'll have to pay for it,

The latest polling we have, from St Norbert College/WPR, shows 58% approving of recalling Walker. Interesting 24% of Republicans in the poll said they supported the recall. Walker is in deep shit.

11/20/11 12:35 PM

Too bad we can't have a recall election on Obama. His numbers are probably worse than Walkers. The difference is that Walker will probably survive the recall movement and Obama will probably lose his reelection.

purplepenquin said...

Own it fucktard.

the only good commie is a dead commie

It would also result in you having a broken neck.

dumbfuck



I also find it really cute how so many of Ann's Fans gnash their teeth about the violence of "union thugs", yet the vast majority of the violent comments and incitful language on this forum come from the AntiLabor crowd...

cubanbob said...

roesch/voltaire said...
The CEO of Google on the CBS morning news show last week stated that the Republican mantra of taxes and regulations were responsible for job losses was, and I quote, "A lie," but because he did not say "big'we can not compare him to Hitler-- sucks.

11/20/11 12:43 PM

Too bad the guy from the Communist Broadcasting System didn't press the CEO of Google on why so much of Google's operations are structured to avoid US taxation by being offshore. There just might be a correlation with taxes and regulation.

Joe said...

Unlike socialism, fascism retains the appearances of capitalism--in essence crony capitalism is fascism. Making union power an extension of government is an oft ignored aspect of crony capitalism and of fascism.

Alex said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
garage mahal said...

Too bad we can't have a recall election on Obama. His numbers are probably worse than Walkers.

Wrong again. From the same poll:

Job Approval / Disapproval
Pres. Obama: 53 / 43
gov. Walker: 38 / 58
Sen. Johnson: 36 / 27

Favorable / Unfavorabe
Mitt Romney: 37 / 42
Rick Perry: 23 / 46
Michele Bachmann: 23 / 51
Newt Gingrich: 26 / 50
Ron Paul: 29 / 37
Herman Cain: 24 / 44
Jon Huntsman: 14 / 22
Rick Santorum: 11 / 26

Alex said...

penfuck - Ever heard the expression "you shall reap what you have sown"?

Alex said...

haha, garbage citing a commie HuffPo poll as if that means anything. Obama is toast.

cubanbob said...

purplepenquin said...
Own it fucktard.

the only good commie is a dead commie

It would also result in you having a broken neck.

dumbfuck

I never said fucktard or dumbfuck so I guess that self describes you. As for dead commies, that is true. The only good ones, like nazi's are the dead ones. Communism is always ultimately imposed by and maintained with violence. Hence the only good commie is a dead commie. You have a problem with that?

Chip S. said...

@garage: I don't have the immense privilege of continual exposure to WI media, so I can only reply with conjecture. If the ratio of pro- and anti-Walker ads has been about 50-50, then that poll result is decent evidence that Walker's in trouble. But if he's been bloodied by an ad (Teamster-funded?) blitz and has yet to return fire, then I'd say it's not all that important.

cubanbob said...

Joe said...
Unlike socialism, fascism retains the appearances of capitalism--in essence crony capitalism is fascism. Making union power an extension of government is an oft ignored aspect of crony capitalism and of fascism.

11/20/11 12:51 PM

The correct term is Peronism after the Argentinian dictator Juan Peron. Thanks to the democrats America is becoming more and more like a Latin American banana republic, with Argentina becoming America's future. God help us.

James said...

Last Friday afternoon I got a robocall on my home phone inviting me to the Recall Walker Rally. The message started with "Hi, this is your County Board Supervisor Analiese Eicher."

Rather odd since I live in Racine County and we don't have any County supervisors with that name. Turns out she a supervisor for Dane County, over 100 miles away.

Chip S. said...

The CEO of Google on the CBS morning news show last week stated that the Republican mantra of taxes and regulations were responsible for job losses was, and I quote, "A lie," but because he did not say "big'we can not compare him to Hitler-- sucks.

How about calling him a guy who understands the importance of sucking up to the Obama administration in this new era of enhanced crony capitalism?

It's a lesson that the CEO of Gibson guitars learned the hard way.

Alex said...

Chip - while I want to believe Google are simply cozying up to the current DC masters, they have a long history of being solid socialists. It's in their breeding. Especially Brin, a Soviet Jew.

Petunia said...

Back around 1990, one of the 1-L's at my school was one of Bobby Kennedy's sons. He got Uncle Teddy to come speak, so I went.

I have to say, Teddy was an amazing public speaker. If you listened only to his turn of phrase, his tone, his inflection...you could easily be swayed into thinking he had something amazing to say.

But if you listened critically to the substance of his speech, it was pretty obvious that he was full of cr@p.

The same thing was true of Obama in 2008, and is true of Feingold now. Although Obama, at least, is nowhere near the public speaker that Kennedy was.

gadfly said...

It occurs to me that Russ violates his "no skeleton" assertion the minute that he lies to the public. My, my, how politics can change a man!

Then again, perhaps Feingold's "big lie" lie was also borrowed from Paul Wellstone at the time he plagiarized (failed to source the MN Senator) in his "No Skeletons In My Closet" ad in 1992.

purplepenquin said...

If the ratio of pro- and anti-Walker ads has been about 50-50, then that poll result is decent evidence that Walker's in trouble. But if he's been bloodied by an ad (Teamster-funded?) blitz and has yet to return fire...

Actually, Walker and his backers have been running ads ever since a Republican filed the paperwork for a fake-recall a week or so ago. (That enabled him to start raising funds)

There are at least 3-4 different ProWalker commercials being aired on the TV (one of which was on Monday Night Football two days before the actual recall effort was launched)...some from him, some from out-of-state groups...but I haven't seen any AntiWalker ads on the TV yet.

Shanna said...

They may not be #1, except for a couple little problems there, but they're darned close

You Wish!!! SEC West 123 baby!

lordhack_99 said...

Not sure about the HuffPo methodology in polling re Walker. Here is Rasmussen from October 29, 2011

Nearly seven months after large-scale protests first erupted in Wisconsin against his budget bill limiting collective bargaining rights for public employees, new polling shows state voters have a slightly improved opinion of Governor Scott Walker.

The latest Rasmussen Reports telephone survey of Likely Wisconsin Voters shows that 38% Strongly Approve of the job Walker is doing, while the same number (38%) Strongly Disapproves.

Maguro said...

The CEO of Google on the CBS morning news show last week stated that the Republican mantra of taxes and regulations were responsible for job losses was, and I quote, "A lie," but because he did not say "big'we can not compare him to Hitler-- sucks.

Have you ever heard of regulatory capture?

Google is a huge, politically connected incumbent so of course they're in favor of more regulation. They can absorb the cost of compliance much better than a small start-up can, which will help ensure that "the next Google" never gets off the ground.

A powerful regulatory state is very much in the interest of big, established firms that can afford armies of lobbyists and compliance lawyers. It gives them a big advantage over their smaller competitors.

roesch/voltaire said...

I believe the CE0 of Google was speaking as part of the group of about twenty Patriotic Millionaires for Fiscal Strength who spoke before congress, but like Warren Buffett, they are probably all Jews from Russian and just communist--right Alex? So they can not possible be right about our tax system.

sorepaw said...
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Alex said...

roesche - historically American Jews have tilted socialists, what's new?

sorepaw said...
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Chip S. said...

Well, good luck to you and your fellow public employees, penq.

¡Viva la revoluci√≥n! ¡Viva la hora de comer!

sorepaw said...
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Henry said...

Reference to the big lie is a double-edged sword. Hitler accused Jews of "the big lie" in blaming Erich Ludendorff for Germany's loss in WWI. As a historical parallelism, this places Feingold in the position of Hitler and his opponents in the role of the Jews. Feingold is the petty revolutionary calling out his conspiratorial opponents.

The idea that there is such an indoctrination tool as the big lie has subsequently been used against Hitler and against totalitarianism in general.

Feingold would place himself in this context: the George Orwell that detects the real use of the big lie by a real totalitarian threat (not Weimar Jews).

Yet, as I said upstream, the thing that Feingold identifies as "the big lie" is pathetically small. George Orwell at least had a real knowledge of evil.

Henry said...
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sorepaw said...
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I Callahan said...

The latest polling we have, from St Norbert College/WPR, shows 58% approving of recalling Walker. Interesting 24% of Republicans in the poll said they supported the recall. Walker is in deep shit.

If it turns out to be so, then the majority of the people of Wisconsin are stupid, and I hope the state goes under like California and Illinois, because it's what is deserved. Especially if we get a Republican senate and presidency next year - there will be a lot less federal money going to the states that they've been getting from the zero administration.

Reforms like Gov. Walker's are the ONLY way states are ever going to turn around, and anyone that thinks otherwise is delusional.

garage mahal said...

The unit known as Garage emits only those precious few poll results that its programmers select for it to emit.

I linked to the most recent polling we have in Wisconsin. We're discussing Wisconsin, sorepaw. Also your link is dead. Nice work here as usual!

sorepaw said...
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roesch/voltaire said...

Alex I gather from your comments if a person doesn't agree with a particular conservative view of yours then they my be " total dunces when it comes to economics & politics" or communists- especially millionaires who talk about fair taxes. I take it you live in a very self-satisfied world-- like so many liberals you complain about?

sorepaw said...
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cubanbob said...

roesch/voltaire said...
I believe the CE0 of Google was speaking as part of the group of about twenty Patriotic Millionaires for Fiscal Strength who spoke before congress, but like Warren Buffett, they are probably all Jews from Russian and just communist--right Alex? So they can not possible be right about our tax system.

11/20/11 1:33 PM

Thank you for making and confirming Maguro's point about regulatory capture. By the way, Buffet owes the government one billion in back taxes. Why doesn't he just write the check instead of fighting it so hard?
As for the Patriotic Billionaires For Fiscal Strength, I'll take them seriously when they put their money where their mouths are. They can start by firing their tax lawyers and accountants and let the IRS and their respective local and state taxing authorities complete their returns and calculate the taxes due. Lead by example.

sorepaw said...
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Chip S. said...

"Patriotic Millionaires for Fiscal Strength"?? Oh, that's hilarious. How dare they question the patriotism of spending-cut advocates!!

I took a look at their manifesto. It proves that self-proclaimed millionaires (all ya gotta do is "sign" their online petition) can be as stupid as the 99.9 percent.

Here's a sample:

But societies with 308 million participants also need employees who work for the country – people whose job it is to ensure the effective functioning of our society – people who inspect the food we eat to make sure it’s safe, people who land planes, pave roads, build or rebuild bridges so they don’t collapse at rush hour, people who teach our children, put out our fires, people who get in boats to rescue fellow citizens from rooftops when category 5 hurricanes rip their community apart.

These morons are petitioning the SuperDuper Committee, yet babbling about firefighters and teachers. IOW, they don't even grasp the differences among federal, state, and local government responsibilities. And no mention at all of Social Security and Medicare spending forecasts. Why should we pay any attention at all to idiots like this?

BTW, I think Buffett's past his expiration date on this raise-my-taxes bullshit. I have previously defended him here, but now it's clear that he's just another crony capitalist.

garage mahal said...

Maybe someone will conduct a better quality poll in Wisconsin before any recall election takes place.

You're butthurt over a poll because you don't like the results.
You don't even know how to hyperlink, or even provide a working link, period. You need to work on yourself first, sorepaw!

sorepaw said...
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Carol_Herman said...

Our current stock of politicians, from both parties, would love to "dictate." Obama? He hates his job. But he'd like it more if he could be "the dictator."

I don't get the "Bush Hitler" meme at all.

Seeing it again? It must mean the GOP is whooping ass in political contests.

As to the big empty Teamster truck; it makes me laugh. It's supposed to slap terror into the hearts of people? REALLY?

That truck is traveling EMPTY!

And, the only little closet space Russ Feingold has ... where he'd attract people to listen to him speak ... is in Madison!

Man. It's a slow news day.

bagoh20 said...

I don't think Hitler coined the phrase "the big lie", and I think in the vast majority of cases where that combination of words is used, it has nothing to do with, Jews or Hitler. Saying it does is the big lie today.

sorepaw said...
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Bill M said...

Didn't Mussolini hold his finger like that? Or was it Hitler?

J said...

garag---"sorepaw" aka Byro's got issues. One, he belongs to an extreme right-wing mormon church. Two, he never finished HS, and spent 20 years doing hard drugs in AZ (and in and out of prison). So take his brainfarts with a big grain of salt (and
tell AA to get the iggy button up)

garage mahal said...

And of course the unit has been provided with no modules for parsing this kind of input, but, for the benefit those not so cognitively limited, I will repeat this basic point:

That's awesome sorepaw, except your link that you did paste correctly the 2nd time tells me some in the Real Clear poll aggregate are polling adult Americans!

I think it's time for a system update buddy. You be failing here.

sorepaw said...
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sorepaw said...
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sorepaw said...

Meanwhile, the unit has avoided emitting nay output concerning Russ Feingold's recent rhetoric.

Just as it was programmed to do...

garage mahal said...

Garage is merely such a moron that he regularly fails the Turing Test.

Dude, first you tell me the Wisconsin poll I linked to wasn't valid because it surveyed adult Americans. Then it took you twice to simply paste a link for us, that shows polls THAT SURVEY ADULT AMERICANS! Not to mention your claim that Obama would be recalled in Wisconsin, based off polls not directly surveyed in Wisconsin, and based off what you believe to be faulty methodology.

Tell me this isn't your A game.

Revenant said...

Rallies like this serve as a useful reminder of how the *last* progressive movement spawned communism, fascism, and Nazism.

J said...

Your terminal degree! Heh heh. Like a PhD in..Meth studies? Byro-Sorepaw, perp, liar, fraud--you mean your nearly completed AA at Casa Grande JC? The phlebotomy course with Ms Garcia proved too much, though you did wow some yokels as ...what was it...one of the goons in Guys n Dolls? Just STFU.

sorepaw said...
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LilEvie said...

I grew up and live in California. Yes we could use Scott Walker, but it's almost better this way; in fact it's kind of sweet. The dems wanted it all and they got it. They cannot raise taxes so they are up against it. Unless they can push through an initiative to raise taxes they are done. That's why Moonbeam is pushing pension reform -- of course it's only for the new state employees, because unions and politicians are always happy to screw over the new hires. California is like the addict that has to hit bottom first.
Anyway, it's fun (if you have a secure income) to sit back and watch the show.

ignatzk said...

If you live in Dane County the best thing you can do for your children's future is to put your children in private school and *do not* send them to the University of Wisconsin or MATC.

Robin said...

Evidently Garage Mahal's fighting for Feingold's right to brazenly lie without being called on it.

garage mahal said...

By which computation, Barack Obama is averaging 44.0% approval from registered or likely voters.

How did your programmers compute this I wonder? I don't see any such filtering option at your link. It would also appear to blow a hole in your theory that surveying adults is less reliable when there is only a 0.3% difference.

rcommal said...

80% of young people voted for Obama in 2008. I expect that to be 90% next year.

In 2008, approximately 51% of those 18-29 (which is considered the youth vote) in the U.S. turned out to vote, 2% more than in 2004. (So, in other words, just half of the people in that category voted at all for president.) There was an education gap, in that 36% of those without any college (which in turn represents about half of that age cohort) voted in 2008, as opposed to 62% among who had at least some college. Link (from there, a pdf featuring a breakdown of such data by state is available).

Of the roughly half of the youth-vote cohort that voted in 2008, 66% picked Obama and 31% chose McCain. (There was only 1 percentage point difference between the college-experienced and no-college folks on this point, at 65/32 and 66/31, respectively.) Link.

Will this particular cohort be more or less enthusiastic about voting, in general (turnout), in 2012? Will its make up be the same? And what will it do at the ballot box?

It will be interesting to see what, if any, changes there are.

Nora said...

I wonder if there is a peovision for recalling the recall, i.e. a procedure for people who are against recall to be counted. After all they pay their taxes too and ought to have a say on how they are spend, or in this case wasted

Milwaukee said...

I think I missed something. Did you say that Feingold was comparing Walker to Hitler, all the while quoting Hitler? Isn't there a word for people who murder their parents, and then throw themselves on the mercy of the courts because they're orphans? Too bad we've allowed public schools, with stupid teachers, to indoctrinate so many children.

A study once came out in Iowa, years ago, attributing low student achievement in social studies to the number of coaches teaching social studies.

sorepaw said...
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garage mahal said...

To recap:
The unit known as sorepaw is okay with polls using adults, but only if he gets caught using them first, and apparently only if they are used in Real Clear aggregate polling. Makes you wonder if the unit really did go through all of the different polls to determine their methodology or not.

Paul said...

My God Ann! Have you been mugged lately?

That is usually a sign of a neo-conservative!

That is a liberal who has been mugged.

If so, welcome aboard. None are more devout than the converted and have had their eyes opened.

One day Atlas will shrug.

Jay said...

purplepenquin said...

It is kinda cute how so many out-of-state commentators are getting the vapors because out-of-state people are supporting the Walker recall. The whiners and complainers seem kinda hypocritical, no?


Um, no, because "commenting" and sending money or showing up aren't the same thing.

Idiot.

Jay said...

Russ Feingold is a very intelligent and informed man.

Hilarious.

He is no such thing.

Joe Schmoe said...

The reason the Google CEO said what he said is: 1, he's a shill for the current admin (Ann, in the Jobs bio the author details a meeting between Obama and 10 CEOs at Jobs house; Schmidt of Google was one of them) and also the internet is still one of the industries with the least regulation at this point. Sure, there's the occasional monopoly threat, and some inter-industry posturing about stealing ideas and technology, but in general it's the wild west compared to the energy and manufacturing industries. Google has no restrictions on their bread-and-butter ad revenue; and Amazon is fighting tooth and nail to keep from having to charge state sales taxes on its sales. So yeah; the Google CEO is talking out his butt on that one. And he'd better be careful because every Dem in Congress stays awake at night trying to figure out how to get their hooks into the high-tech pockets. Someday they'll succeed.

Nate Whilk said...

Feingold said, "It was $800 million from the federal government that he just threw away."

Althouse wrote, "He just threw it away. Isn't it shocking to think of federal money like that? The federal government is deeply in debt. There is no money to throw away."

And even if there were, the government doesn't gets its money from its fairy godmother. THE MONEY COMES FROM US, THE TAXPAYERS. WE THE PEOPLE. It's OUR MONEY at every step of the way. Just another case of the government bribing us with our own money.

Milwaukee said...

This last summer I was in Decorah, Iowa, where they were putting in a very expensive addition to their fine system of bicycle trails. This addition included dynamiting a cut through rocks and cement going up and down a good sized hill. One person I talked to thought it was a waste of money. Another said something like "Those that complained acted like the money was coming out of their pockets. It was mostly Federal grant money." The second one acted like the money was free, and if we didn't spend it, somebody else would. Yes, Governor Walker "threw away" $800,000,000.00 dollars, but he also threw away the obligations that would come with that money. Good move.

SukieTawdry said...

Meh, I don't think he's such a great speaker. But, if there's a recall election, he most certainly will run.

Wasn't Feingold supposed to be some kind of conscience of the Senate? I never could see it; to me, he's always had a bit of the snake oil salesman about him. And I really, really hated McCain-Feingold. Really.

David said...

It's too ad the word asswipe has fallen out of favor. On the other hand, let's all say,"Thanks Scott Walker."

nevadabob said...

Where is the "Feingold is Like Riefenstahl" tag?

Jim Lindgren said...

It's odd that Feingold should talk about lying in the Walker recall effort.

Just a few days ago I received a fundraising mailing at my apt. IN ILLINOIS from the Wisconsin Democratic Party. I started reading it and the first statement made was how Walker was costing jobs in Wisconsin.

The last time I looked, Wisconsin under Walker had one of the best records of creating jobs in the country.

Is Feingold just "projecting" what his side is doing to the other side?