October 13, 2011

If the Occupy Wall Street movement became for the Democratic Party what the Tea Party is to the Republican Party...

... what would that be like?

I can't imagine that it would help the Democratic Party to become infused with Occupy Wall Street spirit to the degree that the Tea Party has taken over the Republican Party. I mean, think of Christine O'Donnell and Sharron Angle, who were Republican Party candidates in Senate elections. Now, try to picture their counterparts: Democratic Party candidates who are as Occupy Wall Street as O'Donnell and Angle were Tea Party.

If that scenario came to pass, I think the Tea Party side would win overwhelmingly... which is another way of saying that the Democratic Party should not wish for too much OWS momentum. But the energy is so exciting, isn't it? And they always wanted their very own Tea Party.

355 comments:

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Fred4Pres said...

It would mean the Democratic Party would be completely out of power (with the exception of a few liberal ghettos). There is no comparison between OWS and the Tea Party other than them being political movements. Despite all the attempts of the left and MSM to mischaractorize the Tea Party, it is actually a pretty mainstream conservative movement (it's primary goal to to control government spending, how mainstream is that?). OWS is off the spectrum of electability.

roesch-voltaire said...

I think as Lawrence Lessig pointed out this movement shares some of the same perspectives as the Tea Party and, to quote him: For there is a common ground between the anger of the Left and the anger of the Right: That common ground is a political system that does not work. A government that is not responsive, or -- in the words of the Framers, the favorite source of insight for our brothers on the Right -- a government that is not, as Federalist 52 puts it, "dependent upon the People alone."

Fred4Pres said...

I know it is October, but the United States is not St. Petersburg, 1917. Sorry, I do not see OWS going anywhere other than hurting the Democrats. Nancy Pelosi will regret giving them support.

Shouting Thomas said...

This is precisely what NPR wanted to do in an interview with me. Compare and contrast the TP and OWS.

Apparently they can't find any full-fledged Tea Party members in NYC.

NPR got in contact with me solely because I put up a few pictures of OWS in my blog and I link to one Tea Party site.

NYC is a one party town!

SGT Ted said...

The leftwingers already have control of the Democrat Party. So, the OWS guys are really protesting their success.

R-V, OWS guys demanding confiscatory taxation and more liberal fascism to fund the welfare state is the exact opposite of the tea party demands.

ricpic said...

But the energy is so exciting, isn't it?

I find the energy to be terrifying. And not the energy of the Occupiers so-called. The energy that terrifies is the concerted effort on the part of our Marx Stream Media to inflate a tiny ragtag rabble into some kind of significant irresistable unstoppable force.

Hagar said...

The more the voters see of these people, the better.

Chuck66 said...

You can disagree with the Tea Pary activists, but they are just normal people who feel the gov't is wayyyyy to big and powerful. Example, yesterday a Federal bureaucrat ordered Milwaukee to print its election ballots in Spanish.

Have you been watching the YouTube videos of the occupy wackos? Basically they want a bunch of free stuff, and want to take it from the hard working wealth producers.

edutcher said...

1972 all over again.

roesch-voltaire said...

I think as Lawrence Lessig pointed out this movement shares some of the same perspectives as the Tea Party and, to quote him: For there is a common ground between the anger of the Left and the anger of the Right: That common ground is a political system that does not work.

My God, what drivel.

I can think of nothing less like the spontaneous, orderly, law-abiding Tea Parties than the OccupyAnywhere nonsense.

The Tea Parties are about consensus on a range of issues and, mirabile dictu, even have some Liberals in their ranks.

The Occupiers are mad at the world with an "Us against Them" mentality.

MikeinAppalachia said...

r-v
Just curious, what is your favorite source of insight?

traditionalguy said...

Demonstrations at the seat of power are the heart and soul of Community Marxism.

A demonstration intends to quickly break laws to instill a lawless spirit in a crowd...no boundaries for them.

Then they drive out a scapegoated enemy of the people...that's usually middle class civil society that protects persons and property from mobs.

For a short course in OCW organizing tactics you can read Charley Manson's prophecies.

Chuck66 said...

edu...a group of people who are perpetually angry victimists who want free stuff and not have to work for it.

Many Tea Party activists are small businessmen or want to work hard and be able to prosper and keep some of what they earn/produce.

garage mahal said...

I can't imagine that it would help the Democratic Party to become infused with Occupy Wall Street spirit to the degree that the Tea Party has taken over the Republican Party.

Why not? OWS is much more popular than the Tea Party.

MarkG said...

When lefties want to make comparisons with the Tea Party, they should use their favorite term, "teabagger." Don't get all respectful all of a sudden.

Christian said...

The area where the occupy wallstreet benefits the Dems is that it makes normal people look at all protesters and think they are a bunch of yahoos.

It's a guilty by association... instead of seeing tea partiers as the more traditional, sensible "American" approach it could become, "We have these crazies on the left who are the Occupy crowd and the crazies on the right who are the Tea Party crowd, and both are fronts for the Dems and Repubs respectively".

Chuck66 said...

garage, were they popular when, in the Confederate city of Atlanta, they refused to let African-American civil rights leader John Lewis speak?

Chuck66 said...

Or when they talk about the Jews controlling the country?

FloridaSteve said...

I'm reminded of the song lyrics: "I see your true colors shining through. True colors, that's why i love you. Now don't be afraid, of letting go.. True colors are beautiful.."

YoungHegelian said...

The democrats are being fools to snuggle up next to this OWS beast.

Right now, the OWS crowd is a motley crew of disaffected youth, old professional lefties, and just general malcontents who want a platform. It won't stay that way.

Even as we write, multiple groups are trying to "organize" the OWS movement, to remake it to their own ends, e.g. the unions. Who are also grinding away are hard-left groups like ANSWER.

Groups like ANSWER are great at organizing rallies. It's what they do for a living.

If the far-left takes over the OWS rallies, they'll turn from inchoate "give me some of that fed money" rallies to "exterminate the bourgeoisie" rallies, and all the Dems who supported the early OWS will end up owning the words of the later OWS.

Maguro said...

Why not? OWS is much more popular than the Tea Party.

Hee hee. I hope Debbie Wasserman-Schultz is thinking along these lines.

edutcher said...

Chuck66 said...

edu...a group of people who are perpetually angry victimists who want free stuff and not have to work for it.

Many Tea Party activists are small businessmen or want to work hard and be able to prosper and keep some of what they earn/produce.


Couldn't agree more.

And another characteristic of the Tea Parties versus the Occupiers.

The Tea Parties are Clean. Responsible. They pick up after themselves.

garage mahal said...

I can't imagine that it would help the Democratic Party to become infused with Occupy Wall Street spirit to the degree that the Tea Party has taken over the Republican Party.

Why not? OWS is much more popular than the Tea Party.


With whom?

The Lefty media?

All the over-the-hill Radicals in the Democrat Party?

You don't see people in the streets cheering them on. You see a lot of people complaining about the noise and the mess and the snarled traffic and the smell.

Especially the smell, I'll bet.

Pastafarian said...

garage: "Why not? OWS is much more popular than the Tea Party."

You're absolutely right, garage. I'd like to help you elevate the OWS to its rightful place, as the face of the Democrat Party.

We'll make up a new logo -- no more jackass. We'll make it a silhouette of that guy taking a shit on the cop car.

Quayle said...

Are the OWS-ies likely to have any measurable impact at the ballot box as the Tea Party clearly had?

We'll see, but right now I'd bet no.

And the Dems seem to know it, because, except for a few loonies, none of them are flocking to be seen speaking at the podium in any city.

garage mahal said...

Hee hee. I hope Debbie Wasserman-Schultz is thinking along these lines.

I hope so too, but I doubt it. When Democrats see fifty fucking polls in a row showing Americans are strongly behind them on something, they will do the opposite.

SteveR said...

The biggest problem the Tea Party has in terms of popularity is that most of the people who would support it have jobs.

Bob_R said...

You can imagine all you want, but haven't we seen this crowd before? Isn't this the same group that shows up whenever the G7 or G8 or G20 or G7pi meets? That group has never had much impact on the mainstream political process.

On the other hand, I do think that the revulsion with crony capitalism is a big overlap between OWS and the tea party. It's just that the two sides want to take an axe to different halves of the government/business partnership.

ndspinelli said...

Yes..if the Occupy people spawn candidates it would nominate people like Dennis Kucinich, Bernie Sanders...oh wait!

Quayle said...

As Zappa said so very long ago:

"Every town must have a place Where phony hippies meet"

"Psychedelic dungeons Popping up every street."

Chuck66 said...

OWS is popular like Air America is.

Kit said...

The Dems can try, but the OWS’ers won’t buy it. The biggest reason is the Dems heavy reliance on Wall Street campaign donations. Duh, that both parties rely heavily on financial industry contributors. This is not so much a problem for Repubs as it is for Dems (the common narrative of not trusting Big Gov’t vs. Big Business). How in the world can Obama and congressional Dems wave pitchforks at Wall Street while engaging in Wall Street fundraisers (among Obama’s biggest institutional donors were Goldman Sachs, Chase and Citigroup)?

Christopher said...

I'm sorry but the comparison just doesn't work for me.

There is one major difference between the two groups (aside from the usual leftist love of violence and projection).

The OWS people are professional protesters (and I don't just mean the ones getting paid). These are the people who always show up and riot at the G8 or WTO meetings. They're the ones who claim to support the little guy right before they smash his windows and loot his property They protest anything and everything and have nothing better to do.

The TP on the other hand is made up of middle class and middle aged people who by and large had never taken part in a protest in their lives. They were not politically active and were usually far more concerned with their jobs.

master cylinder said...

So the powerful Tea Party is about to have Mitt Romney as their nominee? How much impact have they really had? Mitt is really RINO no?

Scott M said...

When Democrats see fifty fucking polls in a row showing Americans are strongly behind them on something, they will do the opposite.

I have to admit that I saw the teasings of a joke with the link of Debbie Wasserman-Schultz to fifty fucking poles. However, I went to the Scott M snark well and came back empty. Sorry.

Can anyone help me out? I KNOW there's a joke in there somewhere.

sonicfrog said...

I'm with r-v. I found a simple but note-worth chart that shows the connection. Both movements are a reaction to perceived corruption within the economic / political system that currently overlays the US government. One side focuses more on big government failings, the other on corporate greed, but when you come right down to it, both coexist hand in hand. Big corp actually likes Big govt. If you have a government that expands into business, then it's very very easy for big business to buy off politicians to do their bidding and provide benefits, be it grants for solar industry or subsidies for big oil. Does anyone else not notice that most of the speeches read aloud on the floors of the House of Reps and the Senate are not only written by lobbyists, but most of the time the politician presenting the speech clearly has never even seen the speech until he or she is reading it.

Mark O said...

Please, please, please. Can I be the Mad Hatter? Please.

Bender said...

If the Occupy Wall Street movement became for the Democratic Party what the Tea Party is to the Republican Party, what would that be like?

Instead of embracing it as a common cause, the Dem leadership would be embarrassed and seek to undermine and ignore it, at most tossing meaningless gestures at it in an attempt to appease, all while protecting their own establishment prerogatives and authority.

edutcher said...

master cylinder said...

So the powerful Tea Party is about to have Mitt Romney as their nominee? How much impact have they really had? Mitt is really RINO no?

Since the first vote has yet to be cast, nobody knows who the nominee will be.

If the polls are right, it will be Herman.

If it comes to who's the best one-on-one, it may be Perry.

But, since Milton's the only RINO running (Huntsman's a Demo in cheap clothing), I'd say the Tea Party effect has been considerable.

Tough luck you're stuck with Zero.

Michael said...

Garage: "Why not? OWS is much more popular than the Tea Party."

Hope that you are right. I can only pray that the OWS in its current form grows and that the Democratic Party is guided by their demands. I hope you invite them to your convention and that they act according to their desires. I hope you choose candidates from their midst. I implore you to encourage your fellow Democrats to praise the OWS and their objectives and their thinking.

lgv said...

Now, try to picture their counterparts: Democratic Party candidates who are as Occupy Wall Street as O'Donnell and Angle were Tea Party.

Dennis Kucinich?

Well, they ARE the 99% aren't they? Seems like that covers all dems, indies, and most repubs, so any OWS candidate would be welcome.

Cedarford said...

roesch-voltaire said...

I think as Lawrence Lessig pointed out this movement shares some of the same perspectives as the Tea Party and, to quote him: For there is a common ground between the anger of the Left and the anger of the Right: That common ground is a political system that does not work.

edutcher said - My God, what drivel.

Cedarford responds: If you ignore the outlier idiots like perky Christine O'Donnell or the confused lad with pink hair that wants a guaranteed living stipend of 45,000 whether you elect to work or not - you will see what RV and Lessig say is on target.

People exist that are boiling mad at the political system, Wall Street, a sense that DC is corrupt and bought out //

The Tea Party is far broader than just the reactionary right. A pack even Reagan would think of the new John Birchers - that believes "everyone else in America is a RINO traitor or a wishy washy independent or a Reagan Democrat with impure non-conservative views, and the commie-Lefties". That appear to be trying to hijack the Tea Party into a pack of apologists for the plutocrats. I have dropped in on a large Tea Party gathering..maybe it's just one time - but my wife and I met Democrats, union members, people who said they hated Bush and his wars.

Or the hard left/progrssive Jewish community "everyone else is stupider than us, didn't go to school for advanced education degrees, or lacks a heart." That are claiming Occupy Wall Street is the 2nd coming of 60s lefty activism.

Some of the smarter observers are noting that the anger has spread in society and is focused on the DC and Wall Street Elites of both Parties.

master cylinder said...

Love my zero, see ya in 2016. Maybe you all can find someone by then. Cain is on top now, but it's been a new dance partner every few weeks. Cain will have to get serious about his fundraising if he wants to stay in.

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
to fifty fucking poles

If they weren’t F*cking how do you think there came to be 50 Poles?

grackle said...

The energy that terrifies is the concerted effort on the part of our Marx Stream Media to inflate a tiny ragtag rabble into some kind of significant irresistible unstoppable force.

Yep. The MSM, taking their cue(as usual) from Lefty public figures and Democrat politicians, are in the first stages of a process of the rehabilitation of the image of OWS.

I think the OWS movement, which has grown apace in recent weeks, is the manifestation of the simple desire to protest and demonstrate, for its own sake. Liberals yearn for a return to the glorious days of the Vietnam War protests and the post-Watergate ascension of the Left. They associate demonstrations and protests with victory in the larger Culture War.

If OWS turns nasty and/or proves difficult to present in a positive light any Democrat politician who endorsed OWS will be excused by the MSM – just as those politicians who endorsed the Iraq War were excused after public opinion(again, at the instigation of the MSM) turned against the Iraq War

EDH said...

As if to demonstrate metaphorically the level of co-dependence that already exists, NYC has announced that it will start cleaning the OWS's bedroom for them.

What next, doing their laundry?

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Both movements are a reaction to perceived corruption within the economic / political system that currently overlays the US government.

True, they both dislike the same thing....BUT for different reasons.

Neither group agrees with each other in principle or in core values, yet they are both upset at the results of government/economic corruption.

They are pissed at the end result, but differ on how we got to this destination or how to solve it.

That difference is never going to be resolved.

traditionalguy said...

The OWS does not want to elect any candidates...they only want to shoot all those in authority and steal power at gunpoint.

Is that not clear to everyone? George Soros has been disguising his secret army as Democrat activists since 2004.

The Tea Party is a traditional political organization running candidates in elections whether the GOP likes it or not.

Scott M said...

@Joe

Insta has a link to a new YA book on zombies. Looks like a crap read, but even Insta is acknowledging what you refuse to see. They ARE coming for you.

edutcher said...

master cylinder said...

Love my zero, see ya in 2016. Maybe you all can find someone by then. Cain is on top now, but it's been a new dance partner every few weeks. Cain will have to get serious about his fundraising if he wants to stay in.

No, that's 2020. Really, 2024.

Even Milton beats Zero. And that's today.

A year from now, it's gonna look a whole lot worse for the jackasses.

Bob Ellison said...

I have nothing negative to say about the OWS movement. These protests are good for America.

Rose said...

As always, the "liberal"/Democrat/OWS candidate will have to lie to get elected.

They will NOT be able to say what they really stand for and they know it. They will pretend to be centrist.

Once in office, just as now, you will find they are anything but.

They will pretend to be pious, like Clinton (and Obama) attending church, a facade Obama dropped immediately upon being elected, but which his handlers periodically, weakly, try to revive - you will see him suddenly portrayed as deeply religious as we get closer to the election.

They will pretend to care about business and fiscal responsibility. They will profess to care about "working together" and then, when the votes come, they will flee the state.

There ought to be courses in dissecting lovely rhetoric and groking the fact that what they say, the opposite is true.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

Why not? OWS is much more popular than the Tea Party.


Hilarious in your silly delusions.

sorepaw said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
PaulV said...

What happened to the Coffee Party and No Labels?

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
Insta has a link to a new YA book on zombies. Looks like a crap read, but even Insta is acknowledging what you refuse to see. They ARE coming for you

I saw that and went to the advert page and read some of the “related” works….I laughed….Battle of Omdurman…and the Dervishes had brains, of their own, not for eating….I was amazed at the breadth of the genre, though. Honestly, “zombies” give me nightmares. Only watched the first 2 minutes of The Walking Dead, nightmares for a week. Probably books would have an equal result. I’ll just stick to “Hyperion” by Simmons.

pm317 said...

I mean, think of Christine O'Donnell and Sharron Angle,...

Notice OWS is not saying anything negative about Obama. At the very least they are sympathetic to him. In a way Obama IS/WAS their (and Dems) O'Donnell or Angle. Remember his 57 states thingy, his stuttering comments on breathalyzers and more in a townhall, his unhealthy dependence on ToTUS, and many more which would have been ridiculed if it was any other man or woman. If he was vetted by any other standard he would have ended up like an O'Donnell or Angle. In terms of competence there is really not much difference. So they already have elected an incompetent guy.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

Why not? OWS is much more popular than the Tea Party.



Really?

In scale, OWS’ demonstrations-cum-encampments are to Tea Party events as Pittsburg, Kan., is to Pittsburgh, Pa. So far, probably fewer people have participated in all of them combined than attended just one Tea Party rally, that of Sept. 12, 2009, on the Washington Mall

A day doesn't go by where you don't rush to prove yourself a moron on the Internet...

EDH said...

"It's for your own good, honey."

"Mom, stay out of my room!"

Protesters with the Occupy Wall Street movement threatened on Thursday to block any efforts by clean-up crews to enter their camp to clear away three-weeks worth of debris, raising concern about a potential showdown between demonstrators and police.

While New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg has said their protests can continue as long as laws are obeyed, the city has become concerned over the build-up of trash and general wear and tear on Zuccotti Park, headquarters for the demonstrators.

Jay said...

Cedarford responds: If you ignore the outlier idiots like perky Christine O'Donnell or the confused lad with pink hair that wants a guaranteed living stipend of 45,000 whether you elect to work or not - you will see what RV and Lessig say is on target.


Um, and if you ignore the fact that OWS is made up almost entirely of people like the pink hair guy, we get your comments on the matter.

Duh.

Jay said...

what would that be like?



Bernie Sanders and Dennis Kucinich

Chef Mojo said...

what would that be like?

Like a Mummers gathering with hookers.

Fun, despite the weirdness, while it lasts. A real trainwreck when the whole responsibility thing kicks in and the bill comes due.

O2BNAZ said...

Was occupy ever a good name choice for a movement? I mean the left accused Bush of "occupying" Iraq, frequent fliers "occupy" the lavoratory and not to drag out the unfortunate Hitler comparisons but didn't Hitler "occupy" Poland, France and much of Europe.

Scott M said...

Was occupy ever a good name choice for a movement?

This and this. I've wondered this since they announced it. Occupying something in this context is militaristic and implies a previous conquer. Complete with a kill list of New York's wealth and maps to their homes, no less.

edutcher said...

O2BNAZ said...

Was occupy ever a good name choice for a movement? I mean the left accused Bush of "occupying" Iraq, frequent fliers "occupy" the lavoratory and not to drag out the unfortunate Hitler comparisons but didn't Hitler "occupy" Poland, France and much of Europe.

Excellent point. I've been waiting for some of the Rightosphere to start referring to it in that way.

If the community organizers behind this start putting up signs calling the places where they're camped "Occupied Wall Street" or "Occupied DC", what Fred said initially (top of the thread) might come to pass.

It would be the paradigm shift similar to 1860 and 1932 a lot of people have been expecting.

garage mahal said...

A day doesn't go by where you don't rush to prove yourself a moron on the Internet...

Jaytard, Althouse was asking the question whether it was wise for Dems to embrace OWS. I said yes, considering the relative popularity they receive the public, not how many show up for rallies, brainiac. Curious though, you equated a Glenn Beck rally with the Tea Party. You sure you want that? Because, he's close to playing with his own shit.

Methadras said...

The Occupy Bowel Movement is nothing like The Tea Party Movement. The two are not correlated at all. OBM is nothing more than a mob blob that has sprung up like an infection to pass on it's disease of malformed thoughts on anarchy, communism, marxism, and socialism. The fact that the Democrat Party, the race-baiting, race hustling, bigoted, welfare statist party of the south has endorsed them along with its incompetent fool empty suited figure head of a president, only speaks volumes for the type of shallow thinking twaddle it and they represent. Theft of capital from those who produce to those who don't and seeking to codify it. Oh wait.

Franklin said...

#occupywallstreet is the first protest movement in history that wants to re-elect the people in power.

"Keep the status quo!"

At least the Tea Party wants to effect change.

Jay said...

Jaytard, Althouse was asking the question whether it was wise for Dems to embrace OWS. I said yes, considering the relative popularity they receive the public, not how many show up for rallies, brainiac

Hysterical.

Now "popular" means, "popular with the media" to you, idiot.

See stupid, when more people go to a rally or vote for candidates of a particular party in a sweeping manner, said movement is popular

And you're still stupid.

Robert Cook said...

"The leftwingers already have control of the Democrat Party. So, the OWS guys are really protesting their success."

Are you (or were you) really a Sgt. in our military? And you believe such baloney?

Either you are a thankful exception to the rule or this reveals how ignorant and fanatically right wing our military has become.

Peano said...

But the energy is so exciting, isn't it?

Oh, golly gee willikers, YES!!!

Jay said...

Jaytard, Althouse was asking the question whether it was wise for Dems to embrace OWS. I said yes, considering the relative popularity they receive the public, not how many show up for rallies, brainiac


And this "relative popularity" conveniently isn't measured by the number of people who show up to support them.

Funny, that, huh?

By the way bozo, how many ads on Craig's list was the Tea Party running to pay people to show up at their rallies again?

Curious though, you equated a Glenn Beck rally with the Tea Party

Um, no, I did not.

You effing clown.

Quaestor said...

OWS could be compared to the Ranters and Diggers of the 1650s, but the key difference is those English dissenters were honest rebels, hard-working peasants whose class had been oppressed and exploited by the landed gentry from the time of the Conquest, if not before. In contrast the typical OWS protester is already a receiver of public largess. Now they want more freebies and even less responsibility -- in other words they want to be infantalized.

Just the smell of the OWS crowd is a heavy negative for the Democrats.

garage mahal said...

Now "popular" means, "popular with the media" to you, idiot.

No you fucking moron. The public. Polling. Voters. To answer Althouse's original question.

kwood said...

I have dropped in on a large Tea Party gathering..maybe it's just one time - but my wife and I met Democrats, union members, people who said they hated Bush and his wars.

The cool thing about the core 'Taxed Enough Already' ideal of the Tea party is that's it's entirely independent of the need for people to gather at all. It's a magnetic North towards which anyone can advance in the privacy of their very own voting booth.

If meetings or gatherings are co-opted, it won't really matter. There's really no such thing as a 'Tea party member'. If you feel strongly about the ideal, then follow your compass.

Unlike the OWS folks, we're not looking to score points with our peers for getting hauled away in zip-cuffs or getting our snarling, fist-pounding visage in the local paper. We want results, and we know how to get them, because we've been doing it all our lives.

Jay said...

Curious though, you equated a Glenn Beck rally with the Tea Party



Actually, I cited a Tea Party rally you illiterate jackass.

But hey, you should go on pretending that OWS is "popular"

Really. You should.

Scott M said...

You effing clown.

Why expend the energy to type "effing" when a good "fucking" is what you really meant and only one letter more?

Jay said...

The public. Polling. Voters.

Hysterical.

Your "proof" of this is your continued dipshit assertions.

How many ads on Craig's list was the Tea Party running to pay people to show up at their rallies again?

AJ Lynch said...

RV:

Libruls and the MSM are the only ones whining that the govt does not work. In fact, it is working well- and is similar to a married couple who are wrestling over the family credit cards.

Jay said...

No you fucking moron. The public. Polling. Voters. To answer Althouse's original question.


They are so "popular" with "voters" that, um, yeah there is no proof of this.

They are so "popular" with "the public" that there is a cohort of them who are paid to show up and their numbers are small.

They are so "popular" with "polling" that well, you can't cite any.

Dumbass.

SPImmortal said...

Are you (or were you) really a Sgt. in our military? And you believe such baloney?

Either you are a thankful exception to the rule or this reveals how ignorant and fanatically right wing our military has become.

-----

Hey, Robert Cook, are you a truther?

AJ Lynch said...

Congress critter Anthony Weiner was an abrasive and obnoxious person. The average OWS participant is just a pungent, disheveled version of Anthony Weiner.

Jay said...

For there is a common ground between the anger of the Left and the anger of the Right: That common ground is a political system that does not work. A government that is not responsive,

Actually, the government is too responsive.

Which is how you get fantastic ideas like Obamacare and Cash for Clunkers.

But of course you're so far to the left you don't grasp these basics.

garage mahal said...

They are so "popular" with "voters" that, um, yeah there is no proof of this.

54 percent view the Wall Street protests favorably, versus only 27 percent view the Tea Party favorably.

Link

J said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
AJ Lynch said...

And memo to Dems: voters will never support a movement comprised of pungent, disheveled Anthony Weiners.

J said...

Jefferson opposed Hamilton's and the federalists' finance schemes (mostly derived from the Bank of England). So...in spirit ,the OWS might be said to be..somewhat related to the principles of the Founding Fathers (though not quite as ..PC), at least the..Jeff./Anti-federalist faction. TJ at times sounded a bit Jacobin as well. Ergo, the OWS...are following early American tradition--. Liberté, égalité, fraternité!

(teabugs consider a libertarian idjut like Ron Paul a Jeffersonian ,when he isn't--except trivially at best..ie upholds civil liberties..at times)

edutcher said...

garage mahal said...

They are so "popular" with "voters" that, um, yeah there is no proof of this.

54 percent view the Wall Street protests favorably, versus only 27 percent view the Tea Party favorably.


A Time poll is hardly gospel. When Rasmussen says it, you may have something.

Mitochondri-Allie said...

So will th elderly and middle class Tea Party folks like having a 9% tax on their purchases? This would be a tax increase, aren't they taxed enough already?

traditionalguy said...

The word to occupy means a new group replaces the old group in a location which is the seat of authority of the other group.

In chess it is capturing the King.

In football it is entering the other guy's end zone.

Mick calls it usurping the White House as a smooth way to capture the other's Capital without a fight.

It is the basic "substitution" play which requires two steps: first remove the others, and then replace them.

The military always points out that the Air Power is a necessary tool, but that final victory requires boots occupying their ground.

Jay said...

Keep beclownin' garage:

Democrats = 30%, Republican 17%

That is the sample of the poll.

But again, tell youreself this "movement" is popular.

Really, you should.

Jay said...

54 percent view the Wall Street protests favorably, versus only 27 percent view the Tea Party favorably.


How did the OWS crowd do in the last election, stupid?

Tyrone Slothrop said...

@garage

Let me help you save some time--make out that $20 check to the National Rifle Association, then you'll be ready to mail it when Holder resigns.

SPImmortal said...

They are so "popular" with "voters" that, um, yeah there is no proof of this.

54 percent view the Wall Street protests favorably, versus only 27 percent view the Tea Party favorably.

Link

-----------

lol look at this piece of shit question especially calibrated to get a positive result:

"Q11. IN THE PAST FEW DAYS, A GROUP OF PROTESTORS HAS BEEN GATHERING ON WALL STREET IN NEW YORK CITY AND SOME OTHER CITIES TO PROTEST POLICIES WHICH THEY SAY FAVOR THE RICH, THE GOVERNMENT’S BANK BAILOUT, AND THE INFLUENCE OF MONEY IN OUR POLITICAL SYSTEM. IS YOUR OPINION OF THESE PROTESTS VERY FAVORABLE, SOMEWHAT FAVORABLE, SOMEWHAT UNFAVORABLE, VERY UNFAVORABLE, OR DON’T YOU KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT THE PROTESTS TO HAVE AN OPINION?"

"Let's put together some amorphous yet popular positions and associate them with OWS in order to get a favorable response. Oh, and let's not even mention the name Occupy Wall Street, because that might get a more negative reaction."

Meanwhile, on planet Earth, a real polling firm does a poll on OWS:

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/business/federal_bailout/october_2011/public_divided_on_occupy_wall_street_protesters

Jay said...

54 percent view the Wall Street protests favorably, versus only 27 percent view the Tea Party favorably.


I love the fact that you asserted OWS was popular with "voters" then linked to a poll with a sample of 1,000 adults.

It is almost as if you are stupid or something.

traditionalguy said...

Mitochrondrie...This thread should be a rare Herman Cain free zone. We cannot make Herman the only story in town.

SPImmortal said...

Keep beclownin' garage:

Democrats = 30%, Republican 17%

That is the sample of the poll.

But again, tell youreself this "movement" is popular.

Really, you should.

--------

lol

Remember when Time and Newsweek were respectable organizations instead of embarrasing propaganda mills?

Neither do I.

cubanbob said...

If the Occupy Wall Street movement became for the Democratic Party what the Tea Party is to the Republican Party...
... what would that be like?

A 49 out of 57 state landslide. And a bullet proof congress. Heck even if a RINO like Mittens gets elected (and that is still infinitely better than The Zero) he won't go wobbly with a TEA Party dominated congress.

OWS is the McGovernites with out the brains, the aims and the class. Folks its official: OWS is a deep cover republican op. Nixon and the boys are back in town.

J said...

That bag of LDS shit aka Glenn Beck started the Teabaggers wearing a Thomas Paine get up---little did he know, Paine was anti-banking, hated England, royalists,--and was abolitionist (a bit "more PC" than his pal Jefferson).

In spirit the OWS is Paineian.

Browndog said...

Yes, Ann, the genesis of a Marxist takeover is very exciting-

Watching this exact same tactic spread from Asia to Latin America, and now to the United States makes for great tv.

Embrace your inner Fellow Traveler-

DADvocate said...

#occupywallstreet is the first protest movement in history that wants to re-elect the people in power.

Yeah. Their position is the old definition of insanity: What we've been doing isn't working, so let's do the same thing over and over and expect a different result.

edutcher said...

Mitochondri-Allie said...

So will th elderly and middle class Tea Party folks like having a 9% tax on their purchases? This would be a tax increase, aren't they taxed enough already?

They want spending cuts along with and tax reform and a 9% income and business tax would lower cost of living and business costs, so there might be an overall benefit in it. Besides, most states have sizable sales taxes already.

But the one-celled lifeform misses the point (surprise!). Conservatives are discussing this, asking if it's the best way to go.

Unlike the Lefties last time out, who swallowed GodZero like a bad blow job.

Scott M said...

That bag of LDS shit aka Glenn Beck started the Teabaggers wearing a Thomas Paine get up

Overt bigotry aside, this is not how the Tea Party was started, E-Grade.

SPImmortal said...

Are you (or were you) really a Sgt. in our military? And you believe such baloney?

Either you are a thankful exception to the rule or this reveals how ignorant and fanatically right wing our military has become.

-----

Hey, Robert Cook, are you a truther?

------

Still haven't gotten an answer to this question.

J said...

most Teabugs are too stupid to realize that they're defending the demons of the earth: WASP-zionist finance. Con usura

garage mahal said...

But again, tell youreself this "movement" is popular..

More popular than the Tea Party. Actually, there is no Tea Party anymore. Keep fucking that chicken, Jaytard.

Scott M said...

Actually, there is no Tea Party anymore.

Shark successfully jumped, GM.

DADvocate said...

demons of the earth: WASP-zionist finance

Antisemitism rides again.

J uses the moniker J because his real name is too hard to spell. "Joe"

Bob Ellison said...

Garage, that poll you linked to is fascinating. Time doesn't state any margin of error, which is unusual, but the pollster, ABT SRBI, has a good reputation.

Most of the results are pretty far from what most other polls say. I read the whole thing, and this looks like a tell:

Q6. IN POLITICS AS TODAY, ARE YOUR VIEWS BEST REPRESENTED BY THE (DEMOCRATIC PARTY), (REPUBLICAN PARTY), THE TEA PARTY, ANOTHER PARTY, OR DO NONE OF THE PARTIES REALLY REPRESENT YOUR VIEWS?

DEMOCRATIC PARTY 30%

REPUBLICAN PARTY 17%


Most pollsters typically show numbers closer to 30/30. Gallup typically shows Democrats with a small edge among respondents who state an affiliation, like 32/26, and a wavering dead-even "leaning" tendency among all respondents at around 45% apiece. Rasmussen shows affiliated respondents close to dead even at about 34% apiece.

Anyway, a poll that shows 30/17 is pretty far outside the mainstream of polling data.

J said...

In fact, it was in essence Squat Hayseed--with some help from Santorum and a few other of yr TP bozos. E-grade---you mean the -enlisted pay scale, masonic scab? yeah that was a bit deep.Then a dimwitted POS such as you doesn't know when it's been checkmated.

Lance said...

This is backwards. Democratic Party leadership adopted OWS' goals long ago--there's nothing for OWS to take over. Think of Waxman, Frank, Wasserman-Schulz, Pelosi, and Schumer. They've been supporting OWS' control-the-corporations/soak-the-rich goals since before they were elected. Example: the Dodd-Frank crowd were happy to undermine lending standards, and they'll be just as happy to forgive the mortgage and student loan debts that have since accumulated. The President is right there with them.

Of course they all want to appear moderate, so they'll distance themselves from the crazier OWS campers (NYT, WaPo, and MSNBC will help with that), but ultimately they're all singing out of the same hymnbook. OWS is just the most successful Democratic effort to astroturf an answer to the Tea Partiers. It's only working because Democrats finally found an issue that their core can really get behind: debt clemency.

J said...

DAD-ad--scary huh, puto.. Actually its not the same as anti-semitism. but yr too stupid to know the difference. Why even lib-rall hero Krugmann supports the OWS. He must be somewhat tolerant of the anti-zionist rhetoric.

Jay said...

More popular than the Tea Party.

Yeah, I guess that is why the 2010 elections went so swell for you and your ilk, bozo.

Jay said...

More popular than the Tea Party.

And your "proof" of this is conveniently not which movement can gather more people at a rally or votes Republicans into office in a record number, it is a singular poll with a skewed sample.

Why, it is almost is if you are a bad parody or something.

Love said...

One of the juicier nuggets in TIME’s wide-ranging new poll is that voters are embracing the Occupy Wall Street movement as they sour on the Tea Party.

Twice as many respondents (54%) have a favorable impression of the eclectic band massing in lower Manhattan’s Zuccotti Park than of the conservative movement that has, after two years, become a staple of the American political scene.

A closer look at the poll’s cross-tabs provides a fuller picture of the movement’s diverse support. Occupy Wall Street enjoys majority backing among men (57%) and women (51%), young (60% of respondents 18 to 34) and old (51%). Self-identified Democrats, unsurprisingly, comprise the left-leaning movement’s largest bloc, with 66% professing support.

But more than half of independents (55%) harbor favorable views of the protesters, as do a third of Republicans.

Jay said...

More popular than the Tea Party.

Really?

How many ads on Craig's list was the Tea Party running to pay people to show up at their rallies again?

Jay said...

One of the juicier nuggets in TIME’s wide-ranging new poll is that voters are embracing the Occupy Wall Street movement as they sour on the Tea Party.


Actually, the poll sampled "adults" which doesn't necessarily translate to voters.

Watching you silly people wet yourselves over this really is disturbing.

DADvocate said...

Actually its not the same as anti-semitism. but yr too stupid to know the difference.

Of course not, it's OK to hate when you have a "reason," no matter how invalid the reason is. Those damn Jews have been controlling the world economy for centuries now, haven't they?

Roger J. said...

The OWS movement remind's me John Sayle's wonderful short story, "The Anarchist's Convention."

cubanbob said...

J said...
most Teabugs are too stupid to realize that they're defending the demons of the earth: WASP-zionist finance. Con usura

10/13/11 12:43 PM

Hurry up its nearly roll call at the insane asylum. Who knows, perhaps after several hundred rounds of ECT and years of medication you might be able to get a legit day pass from your institution. And tell your mom to stop indulging you by giving you access to her computer in the basement. Its worsening your condition.

Sue D'Nhym said...

Now, try to picture their counterparts: Democratic Party candidates who are as Occupy Wall Street as O'Donnell and Angle were Tea Party.

Al Franken. Elizabeth Warren. Bernie Sanders.

Was that supposed to be difficult? It wasn't.

Charles Rangle. Pete Stark. Anthony Weiner. Al Sharpton. Ramsey Clark. Boy, this is like eating potato chips. Once you pop, you can't stop!

Roger J. said...

OK--I can understand anti-semitism, and even the freemason bug--but I am at a loss to understand the anti-wiccan calumny.
J: what your problem with wiccans?

cubanbob said...

@Love said...

Your quoting TIME. Class dismissed.

Sue D'Nhym said...

Debbie Wasserman-Schultz. Carol Mosely-Braun. Howard Dean.

garage mahal said...

Yeah, I guess that is why the 2010 elections went so swell for you and your ilk, bozo.

OWS wasn't around in 2010. They are now.

Notice we're not hearing anything about deficit hysteria, SS cuts, Medicare cuts, lately? Eat it Jaytard, it's delicious watching you running around squealing like a stuck pig.

J said...

Heh heh heh heh. I jus' knew the tweekhouse would dig that.

Some humans don't accept the Teabugs or Ayn Rand's corpse-snatch as Authori-tay. Buh bye Ayn-ism

Love said...

Jay - Maybe this poll will help you out.

One of the juicier nuggets in TIME’s wide-ranging new poll is that voters are embracing the Occupy Wall Street movement as they sour on the Tea Party. Twice as many respondents (54%) have a favorable impression of the eclectic band massing in lower Manhattan’s Zuccotti Park than of the conservative movement that has, after two years, become a staple of the American political scene.

A closer look at the poll’s cross-tabs provides a fuller picture of the movement’s diverse support. Occupy Wall Street enjoys majority backing among men (57%) and women (51%), young (60% of respondents 18 to 34) and old (51%). Self-identified Democrats, unsurprisingly, comprise the left-leaning movement’s largest bloc, with 66% professing support. But more than half of independents (55%) harbor favorable views of the protesters, as do a third of Republicans.

Read more: http://swampland.time.com/2011/10/13/why-occupy-wall-street-s-more-popular-than-the-tea-party/#ixzz1agZNsyFD

J said...

cubanbob---fuck you, Randian anti-christ scum. ad yr palsies too

Sue D'Nhym said...

Barney Frank. Nancy Pelosi.

DADvocate said...

DEMOCRATIC PARTY 30%

REPUBLICAN PARTY 17%


What's sad about polls like this, no matter what side you're on, is that the people polled probably don't know shit one way or the other.

This morning, a local talk show host was taking calls to see who could answer three out of four questions from the naturalization exam. He simply took callers who thought they could do it. Which you would think would skew the success rate up. About a third, at most, succeeded. The questions are incredibly easy.

What is the supreme law of the land?

What did the Declaration of Independence do?

What is the economic system in the United States?

Name one branch or part of the government.


and so on.

Basically, these polls show the leanings of people who know next to nothing.

Love said...

Jay - "Watching you silly people wet yourselves over this really is disturbing."

As if YOU and others haven't been "wetting yourselves" over the Tea Party for months on end.

Why do you support Wall Street over the average American?

Seems...un-American.

Roger J. said...

I am all in favor of the OWS folks--by all means let them continue--I am sure all thinking Americans will rally to their position(s) ?
and support them

Christopher in MA said...

"Why do you support Wall Street over the average American?"

Seems as though you ought to ask the SCOAMF that question, since he was the biggest beneficiary of Goldman Sachs' largesse and insists we must continue to shovel money at them because they're too big to fail.

And I was unaware that the "average American" now was a pierced, pink-haired emo hipster douchebag with a masters in Transgendered Interpretations of Pre-Raphaelite Art who wants his student loans forgiven because. . .well, just because.

But you must know better than I. You linked to a TIME poll. And we know they're a scrupulously fair news organization.

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
Why do you support Wall Street over the average American

Say Love, got a 401(k) yet or an IRA or even invested with an institutional retirement fund, such as CalPERS? If you are YOU are hooked up with Wall Street. Most “average Americans” are…so it behooves us to “side with Wall Street” over a bunch of smelly Madonna Studies Majors who can’t re-pay their loans.

Paddy O said...

Love,

SHAME! SHAME! SHAME on you for your intentional support of corrupt politicians!! Willing to use an average American as your shield to protect your fragile ideological integrity is SHAME FILLED! SHAME ON YOU! How can you look at yourself in the mirror? SHAME!

Bob Ellison said...

Love, perhaps my earlier post was too dry. It's up there somewhere. I was trying to point out that this poll is apparently garbage.

Consider: what would a professional pollster who came up with poll results like this normally do with them? What would the magazine that commissioned the poll normally do?

If I were in charge, I'd shout, "My goodness, this is dynamite!" It'd be the cover story: "America has no idea how far left it really is!" "All the other pollsters are wrong!"

John Lynch said...

I hope there is a takeover of the Democratic Party. The Democratic leadership is sclerotic. The Congressional leadership is ancient, the White House is full of fools, and they need a good housecleaning. Many of the protesters are fools as well, but some of the people they'd vote for won't be.

Both parties should be viable options for leading the country. Right now, I'm not sure either is. But I know the Democrats aren't.

jamboree said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Don said...

The 99% really are the 99%. Obama is going to be reelected in a landslide. And the 99% will still be mindlessly groping for some dismal utopia...

Christopher said...

Garage actually has a point for once, we aren't hearing about deficits or social security right now.

We are merely hearing about Solyndra, Fast and Furious, and Obama's crappy polling. Clearly OWS is a success.

SPImmortal said...

Yeah, I guess that is why the 2010 elections went so swell for you and your ilk, bozo.

OWS wasn't around in 2010. They are now.

Notice we're not hearing anything about deficit hysteria, SS cuts, Medicare cuts, lately? Eat it Jaytard, it's delicious watching you running around squealing like a stuck pig.

----------

That's right, in 2010 you had the *snicker* Coffee Party. That was a total flop, since it was a pretend niceness and "moderation", and not the sort of hate and violence that gets the left going in the morning. But this new "movement" has all the hate and violence and Alinsky tactics you could ask for, which is making it marginally more successful.

Too bad the left still has to pay to get "protesters" to show up and give saturation media coverage in order to get the paltry interest you've gotten so far.

SPImmortal said...

You want exciting energy?

The Tea Party and the Occupy people need to unify.

Now *that* would scare the crap out of everyone.

-----

There's nothing to unify.

A true grassroots movement uniting with a bunch of bums coming to a park for free food and t-shirts? Does not compute.

Love said...

Christopher - "pierced, pink-haired emo hipster douchebag with a masters in Transgendered Interpretations of Pre-Raphaelite Art who wants his student loans forgiven..."

Thanks, Glenn.

Love said...

Bob Ellison - "Love, perhaps my earlier post was too dry. It's up there somewhere. I was trying to point out that this poll is apparently garbage."

Why is this poll any more "garbage" than any other that comes via reputable polling organizations?

Is Gallup also wrong when it posts a daily polling of Obama's approval ratings?

Which polls are accurate and relevant; only the ones with which YOU agree?

*We all know the answer to that.

Love said...

Paddy O - Who signed the bank bailout bill?

garage mahal said...

We are merely hearing about Solyndra, Fast and Furious, and Obama's crappy polling. Clearly OWS is a success.

You're hearing it on winger blogs. Nobody gives a shit about Fast & Fyrious, or Solyndra.

Love said...

Of the respondents in TIME’s poll familiar with the protests, 86%–including 77% of Republicans–agree with the movement’s contention that Wall Street and its proxies in Washington exert too much influence over the political process.

More than 70%, and 65% of Republicans, think the financial chieftains responsible for dragging the U.S. economy to the brink of implosion in the fall of 2008 should be prosecuted.

Who disagrees?

SPImmortal said...

Bob Ellison - "Love, perhaps my earlier post was too dry. It's up there somewhere. I was trying to point out that this poll is apparently garbage."

Why is this poll any more "garbage" than any other that comes via reputable polling organizations?

Is Gallup also wrong when it posts a daily polling of Obama's approval ratings?

Which polls are accurate and relevant; only the ones with which YOU agree?

*We all know the answer to that.

--------

We already explained why the poll is garbage. It was a ridiculous push poll style question that didn't even have the words "occupy wall street" in it.

The polls that are relevant are the ones that do not ask leading and innacurate questions.

Plus, the sample is a joke, almost 2 to 1 Democrat. Plus Time magazine is pure agitprop

Love said...

Just 34% say the Tea Party has had a positive impact on U.S. politics, including just 35% of independents. Only 11% of respondents familiar with the movement call themselves members. It’s easy to trace the Tea Party’s withering support to its obstinacy; 89% of those surveyed argue it’s better for politicians to find common ground than to be hidebound to fixed principles.

Who disagrees?

SPImmortal said...

We are merely hearing about Solyndra, Fast and Furious, and Obama's crappy polling. Clearly OWS is a success.

You're hearing it on winger blogs. Nobody gives a shit about Fast & Fyrious, or Solyndra.

--------

Yeah who would give a shit about the US government arming drug warlords and getting hundreds of innocent people killed in order to make political hay at home.

Probably only people with a conscience.

SPImmortal said...

Just 34% say the Tea Party has had a positive impact on U.S. politics, including just 35% of independents. Only 11% of respondents familiar with the movement call themselves members. It’s easy to trace the Tea Party’s withering support to its obstinacy; 89% of those surveyed argue it’s better for politicians to find common ground than to be hidebound to fixed principles.

Who disagrees?

-----

The voters, Nov 2010

lol

Scott M said...

Nobody gives a shit about Fast & Fyrious, or Solyndra.

From someone who attempts to make reasoned arguments at times, GM, this is patently false. Very Bad Things are coming down the road toward someone on both of those issues. What remains to be seen is how high the head rolling will go, but roll heads will.

I assume you believe that there was no wrong-doing whatsoever? This is unrelated to the "caring" issue.

Love said...

Cain's 9-9-9...

WASHINGTON -- In Herman Cain's America, the tax code would be very, very simple: The corporate income tax rate would be 9 percent, the personal income tax rate would be 9 percent and the national sales tax rate would be 9 percent.

But there's already a 999 plan out there, in a land called SimCity.

Long before Cain was running for president and getting attention for his 999 plan, the residents of SimCity 4 -- which was released in 2003 -- were living under a system where the default tax rate was 9 percent for commercial taxes, 9 percent for industrial taxes and 9 percent for residential taxes.

Kip Katsarelis, a senior producer for Maxis, the company that created the SimCity series, was excited that politicians may be looking to video games for ideas.

"We encourage politicians to continue to look to innovative games like SimCity for inspiration for social and economic change," said Katsarelis.

"While we at Maxis and Electronic Arts do not endorse any political candidates or their platforms, it's interesting to see GOP candidate Herman Cain propose a simplified tax system like one we designed for the video game SimCity 4."

Scott M said...

Hysterical, Love. The default tax rates work great for growth in SC4 until the Sims start getting extremely whiny about their desires. Then things start to go to hell.

garage mahal said...

Yeah who would give a shit about the US government arming drug warlords and getting hundreds of innocent people killed in order to make political hay at home.

We do that all around the world.

Wasn't this going on under Bush too?

Fred4Pres said...

Nobody gives a shit about Fast & Fyrious, or Solyndra.


The more Dems say that, the more you know they do care...a lot. Because they know it hurts their guy Obama.

Love said...

Scott M - In the broad scheme of things, you know; things like the economy, unemployment, two wars...


...Fast & Furious and Solyndra are less than big players.

*And where were you, along with the hyperbole you suddenly feel is warranted when Halliburton and other contractor ripped off billions of tax dollars in Iraq?

Or how about the deaths related to not securing the arms in Iraq after the initial invasion?

Not that big of a deal?

Tyrone Slothrop said...

You know who gives a shit about Fast and Furious? Darryl Issa. Congress, not the Gallup Poll, has the power of impeachment. My advice to liberals is to start taking it seriously, also. It's the only way they can begin to mitigate the damage.

Jay said...

Love said...
Jay - Maybe this poll will help you out.


Um, the poll was of 1,000 adults, 30% of whom identify as Democrats adn 17% of whom identify as Republicans.

So no.

Jay said...

Love said...

Why is this poll any more "garbage" than any other that comes via reputable polling organizations?


The poll was of 1,000 adults, 30% of whom identify as Democrats adn 17% of whom identify as Republicans.

Can you grasp what that means?

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
We do that all around the world.

Wasn't this going on under Bush too

1) Funny it was the folks like Garage who USED to worry about the “Dead Brown” People, but now that they’re being kilt by a DEMOCRATIC President, I guess not so much
2) And No, it didn’t go on under Bush…the closest program was “Wide Receiver” which the DoJ shut down after arresting, the Straw Purchasers before the weapons left the US.

Love said...

Fred4Pres - So you're really upset about Fast & Furious and an energy company going belly up?

Where were you during the previous administrations program: Operation Wide Receiver -- which also allowed guns to be transferred to suspected traffickers for the purposes of tracking their movement -- mainly because it remained a secret during the previous administration.

Oh, and as for Solyndra:

Solyndra loan guarantee was a multi-year process that the Bush Administration launched in 2007.

The Bush team even tried to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office.

Geee, you learn something new every day, huh?

SPImmortal said...

*And where were you, along with the hyperbole you suddenly feel is warranted when Halliburton and other contractor ripped off billions of tax dollars in Iraq?

Or how about the deaths related to not securing the arms in Iraq after the initial invasion?

Not that big of a deal?

--------

Leet me clue you in as to the difference. Iraq was a war.

Fast and Furious was a political operation to pass guns to bad guys in order to push gun control here in the states.

It just sickens me that liberals are trying to obfuscate these crimes.

Jay said...

Love said...
Just 34% say the Tea Party has had a positive impact on U.S. politics


Yes, leftists don't like the tea party and you're citing a poll that over sampled leftists.

We get it.

By the way, in January 2011, Republicans took control of at least 19 Democratic-controlled state legislatures Tuesday and gained more than 650 seats, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures. The last time Republicans saw such victories was in 1994, when they captured control of 20 state legislatures.

Republicans haven't controlled as many state legislatures since 1928.

If the tea party is so "unpopular" how did that happen?

Oh, you're here posting wishful thinking and silly lies.

That's how.

Never mind.

SPImmortal said...

The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
We do that all around the world.

Wasn't this going on under Bush too

1) Funny it was the folks like Garage who USED to worry about the “Dead Brown” People, but now that they’re being kilt by a DEMOCRATIC President, I guess not so much
2) And No, it didn’t go on under Bush…the closest program was “Wide Receiver” which the DoJ shut down after arresting, the Straw Purchasers before the weapons left the US.

-------------

Brown people killed for nothing, no less. Killed for politics.

Not to combat terrorism. For politics.

Christopher in MA said...

"Wasn't this going on under Bush, too?"

Ah, the old Blame Bush(TM) card. Never gets old, does it garbage? And yeah, who gives a shit about a few dozen dead wetbacks? Clearly, you don't.

And "we do that all around the world?" Who's "we," white man? Your precious Little Black Jesus is doing that - but of, course you don't give a shit. I look forward to your moral compass resetting to "OUTRAGE!WARCRIMINAL!ELEVENTY!" when the next Republican sits in the Oval Office.

Jay said...

Oh, and as for Solyndra:

Solyndra loan guarantee was a multi-year process that the Bush Administration launched in 2007.

The Bush team even tried to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office.

Geee, you learn something new every day, huh?


You mean that you're a silly hypocrite who can't bring themself to criticize Obama for anything?

PS:
The results of the Congressional probe shared Tuesday with ABC News show that less than two weeks before President Bush left office, on January 9, 2009, the Energy Department's credit committee had voted against offering a loan commitment to Solyndra.

You are a liar.

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
Solyndra loan guarantee was a multi-year process that the Bush Administration launched in 2007

Bad news Dood/Doodette Solyndra DIDN’T qualify under the hated Booooooosh…..learn something every day, doancha…oh and then here’s the 1.2 BILLION dollars to new “Green Boondoggle.”

Jay said...

Wasn't this going on under Bush too?


No, it wasn't. You silly little dipshit.

Love said...

Joe - "And No, it didn’t go on under Bush…the closest program was “Wide Receiver” which the DoJ shut down after arresting, the Straw Purchasers before the weapons left the US."

That's bullshit:

Federal law enforcement officials familiar with the matter say Operation Wide Receiver began in 2006 after the agency received information about a suspicious purchase of firearms. The investigation concluded in 2007 without any charges being filed.

To date in Wide Receiver, nine people have been charged with making false statements in acquisition of firearms and illicit transfer, shipment or delivery of firearms. Two of the nine defendants have pleaded guilty and a plea hearing is scheduled for Oct. 13 for two other defendants.

"acquisition of firearms and illicit transfer, shipment or delivery of firearms"

Love said...

Jay - Once again, you are incorrect:


Federal law enforcement officials familiar with the matter say Operation Wide Receiver began in 2006 after the agency received information about a suspicious purchase of firearms. The investigation concluded in 2007 without any charges being filed.

To date in Wide Receiver, nine people have been charged with making false statements in acquisition of firearms and illicit transfer, shipment or delivery of firearms. Two of the nine defendants have pleaded guilty and a plea hearing is scheduled for Oct. 13 for two other defendants.

"acquisition of firearms and illicit transfer, shipment or delivery of firearms"

Jay said...

Or how about the deaths related to not securing the arms in Iraq after the initial invasion?


Yeah, because that is like the exact same thing as a federal agency distributing firearms to drug cartel members.

Exactly the same.

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)


And News Flash Garage and Love…saying “Bush did it too” isn’t really going to stir a TEA Party, much of what Bush did, DID anger us.

DADvocate said...

Wasn't this going on under Bush too?

It always comes around to that for you. Your entire belief system is a tu quoque fallacy.

Scott M said...

Not that big of a deal?

"But...but...but...THEY DID IT TOO"

Doesn't change the wrongdoing one iota.

I don't need to justify my history to you unless you can find a specific statement contradicting something I have said subsequently. Suffice to say I left the GOP as a registered member in 2004. Does that give me enough justification to be allowed in your eyes to criticize what my government is doing right now just as I did during the last administration?

Spare me your "they did it too's" when your idea of what I did or didn't think about a specific issue during the last eight years relies on your own innate prejudices that describe people as "If Anti-Obama Then Pro-Bush."

Don't pray to the alter of relativism. A crime is a crime and cronyism is cronyism. If you're only against it when your guy isn't in office, you don't give a shit about right and wrong.

Jay said...

Love said...
Jay - Once again, you are incorrect:


Um, huh?

Nothing you posted addresses the matter.

Note you provide no link.

Want to take a guess as to why that is?

SPImmortal said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
Solyndra loan guarantee was a multi-year process that the Bush Administration launched in 2007

Bad news Dood/Doodette Solyndra DIDN’T qualify under the hated Booooooosh…..learn something every day, doancha…oh and then here’s the 1.2 BILLION dollars to new “Green Boondoggle.”

but but GOOD INTENTIONS

Love said...

Jay - I have no problem criticizing Obama for anything I feel he did wrong.

But for you to deny this is pure partisan bullshit:

Solyndra loan guarantee was a multi-year process that the Bush Administration launched in 2007.
(Loan guarantee - multi-year...two years BEFORE Obama took office))

The Bush team even tried to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office.

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
The Bush team even tried to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office

Let me repeat: UNTRUE

Love said...

Joe - I realize you just can't accept the facts of the matter, but what do you base your theory that what I say is untrue on?

I base my comment on the following link and detailed timeline:

http://thinkprogress.org/romm/2011/09/13/317594/timeline-bush-administration-solyndra-loan-guarantee/

SPImmortal said...

Solyndra loan guarantee was a multi-year process that the Bush Administration launched in 2007.
(Loan guarantee - multi-year...two years BEFORE Obama took office))

The Bush team even tried to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office.

------

No, they didn't, they rejected it just before Obama came in.

Love said...

Scott - Were you asleep during the previous situations or do you just not care unless it pertains to President Obama?

Saying that two wrongs don't make a right is ridiculous.

*Basically because you never even acknowledged the first.

SPImmortal said...

Scott - Were you asleep during the previous situations or do you just not care unless it pertains to President Obama?

Saying that two wrongs don't make a right is ridiculous.

*Basically because you never even acknowledged the first.

------------

Sorry, what were the two wrongs again? Fast and Furious was an Obama admin only operation.

Jay said...

I base my comment on the following link and detailed timeline:


Hilarious.

Your "source" is a left wing blog.

We are all shocked by this development.

The Bush team even tried to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office.


No, no they did not and you can produce no actual facts suggesting otherwise.

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)


Let me repeat…the Bush Administration CONSIDERED the Solyndra deal AND REJECTED IT…. Now they may have done this JUST BEFORE Obama took office, and so PART of your statement is true, but the macro-level truth IS: Bush REJECTED Solyndra….but keep telling yourself these stories if it makes you feel better.

Jay said...

Love said...
Scott - Were you asleep during the previous situations or do you just not care unless it pertains to President Obama?


Fast & Furious started under Obama.

The loan to the now bankrupt Solyndra was approved under Obama.

In light of these facts you are arm waving and trying to obfuscate.

Love said...

SPImmortal "No, they didn't, they rejected it just before Obama came in."

What does "rejecting" it "just before Obama came in" have to do with Solyndra getting a loan guarantee, that included a multi-year process...along with the Bush team even trying to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office?

Are you saying that Bush initiating and funding it, and then trying to push it through is irrelevant...because they changed their minds right before Obama came into office?

And what about the initial "funding?" That's doesn't count either?

Seriously? That's your argument?

Scott M said...

Scott - Were you asleep during the previous situations or do you just not care unless it pertains to President Obama?

Love, did you completely miss the part where I stated I left the GOP in 2004?

Jay said...

Love said...
Jay - I have no problem criticizing Obama for anything I feel he did wrong


Yet you can't do so.

But for you to deny this is pure partisan bullshit:

Solyndra loan guarantee was a multi-year process that the Bush Administration launched in 2007.


Um, who cares when the process started?

In fact, I never commented on that, only pointed out that you were lying in asserting that The Bush team even tried to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office

Which is a lie and we see who the partisan hack here is.

You.

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
via Faux news

The results of the Congressional probe shared Tuesday with ABC News show that less than two weeks before President Bush left office, on January 9, 2009, the Energy Department's credit committee had voted against offering a loan commitment to Solyndra.

Even after Obama took office on Jan. 20, 2009, analysts in the Energy Department and in the Office of Management and Budget were repeatedly questioning the wisdom of the loan. In one exchange, an Energy official wrote of "a major outstanding issue" -- namely, that Solyndra's numbers showed it would run out of cash in September 2011.



Read more: http://nation.foxnews.com/solyndra/2011/09/14/bush-admin-voted-against-solyndra-loan#ixzz1agwZv4O8

Jay said...

along with the Bush team even trying to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office?


They did no such thing you silly little liar.

Love said...

SPImmortal - You're behind the curve. I suggest you backtrack a few comments to catch up.

Jay said...

Are you saying that Bush initiating and funding it,

Bush did not "fund" anything you silly little liar.

Jay said...

Love said...
SPImmortal - You're behind the curve. I suggest you backtrack a few comments to catch up.


Actually, you're posting lie after lie.

You could quit doing that, you know.

Tony said...

Now, who would their candidates be? Rosanne Barr? Rosie O’Donnell? Keith Olbermann? Jeremiah Wright? Van Jones? Barack Obama?

Love said...

Jay - I don't appreciate being called a liar, especially by people hiding behind a computer keyboard. It makes you look small.

I provided a link, and there are plenty more if you merely Google it.

If you choose to not follow the links that's your problem.

SPImmortal said...

What does "rejecting" it "just before Obama came in" have to do with Solyndra getting a loan guarantee, that included a multi-year process...along with the Bush team even trying to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just before President Obama took office?

Are you saying that Bush initiating and funding it, and then trying to push it through is irrelevant...because they changed their minds right before Obama came into office?

And what about the initial "funding?" That's doesn't count either?

Seriously? That's your argument?

---------

What the hell are you talking about?

There was no intial funding there was a funding program which Solyndra was being considered for. The Bush administration rejected the funding applicataion. The Obama administration sent it through.

Really the way you're shoehorning in the word "try" in order to claim BUSH DID IT TOO is pathetic. The Solyndra loan was considered and REJECTED by the Bush admin. Do you understand?

Love said...

SPImmortal - Google it and get back to me.

Posting silly comments refuting what is not only true, but easily proven is a waste of time.

Pass that onto your buddy Jay.

SPImmortal said...

SPImmortal - You're behind the curve. I suggest you backtrack a few comments to catch up.

------

I already did that. It looks like you tried to take a program for catching illegal guns sales and compare it to something completely different, the criminal Fast and Furious operation.

In other words, it seemed like a bunch of shilling and obfuscation to me.

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)


Who loaned Solyndra 535 Million dollars, Love? Bush or Obama?

SPImmortal said...

SPImmortal - Google it and get back to me.

Posting silly comments refuting what is not only true, but easily proven is a waste of time.

Pass that onto your buddy Jay.

--------

The content free whine of utter defeat. Better luck next time.

Joe said...

(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)


Who let 2,000 weapons cross the border, knowingly, without the slightest ability to track them or arrest their owners, in Mexico? Who, in fact, ORDERED the guns shops to continue what were obviously “straw purchases?

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