April 14, 2010

"New Hampshire Democrats are engaged in a statewide search for liberal activists willing to attend so-called tea parties on Thursday and carry signs expressing racist or fringe sentiment..."

Who knows the extent and organization of the Tea Party Crashers movement? Given this mystery, what should Tea Partiers do? Let's brainstorm. I'll start:

1. If any Tea Partiers feel tempted to express themselves in a manner that can help their opponents paint the movement as racist/extreme/violent, they need to resist that temptation. If they now think it's okay or humorous or something, they'd better think again. They are hurting the movement.

2. Tea Partiers should look around and listen and notice people who might be Crashers. Whether they are Crashers or actual fringe Tea Partiers, talk with them. It's good for people at these gatherings to talk to each other and be friendly anyway. It helps project the image of normality, which, I think, is the reality with most Tea Partiers. And it's nicer for everyone, and it encourages even more participation by average folks. You can also reach out to the outlier types in your own movement and help them become more mainstream. And, in the process, you have a shot at detecting the frauds. That's all good.

3. People should talk a lot — here for example — and get the message out that those who attend a Tea Parties are going to be trying to spot the Crashers. They should fear exposure. Right now, the frauds may be assuming that Tea Partiers just accept people in their group who stand around with offensive signs and yell terrible things. That makes it easier to crash. But if they think your name and face will be all over the web displaying your ugly fakery, it will take some boldness to crash.


4. ....

238 comments:

1 – 200 of 238   Newer›   Newest»
Pogo said...

A vicious beating of racist sign-bearers would help, but I'd wear an SEIU, Che, or Obama t-shirt to do it.

Ann Althouse said...

Oh, Pogo! That so... Alinsky!

Zachary Paul Sire said...

I wouldn't be surprised if the so-called "Tea Party Crashers" were actually a phony group set up by the actual racist teabaggers in an attempt to make it seem like all the racists weren't actually teabaggers, when in fact they are.

Floridan said...

"Crashers"?

Is there some kind of loyalty oath that one has to take in order to attend a tea party?

BTW, the origins of this story are pretty weak.

Robert Cook said...

Either the New Hampshire Dems are so stupid as to be beyond fathoming, or this is a false story, planted by someone to discredit the NH Dems. I think the latter is more likely, but I am certainly prepared to believe the former.

TMink said...

ZPS, you are thinking WAY too much about this dude.

The crashers are out, they are loud and proud, there is no need to go looking for double secret probation or turn this into a scene from The Princess Bride. It just is what it is.

Recall, the tea party is just a bunch of likeminded people. We do not have an office, our signs are not pre-printed, this is not an organized phenomenon. But we show up, and miracle of miracles, there are a couple or tens of thousands of people like us.

It is difficult to wrap your head around that when you are used to the scripted astroturf from SEIU and other people who are paid to protest.

But try.

Trey

HDHouse said...

TMink said...
"We do not have an office,.."

ok.

"our signs are not pre-printed"

really? you do them when then?

"this is not an organized phenomenon."

asided from planned events that is

"But we show up, and miracle of miracles, there are a couple or tens of thousands of people like us. "

just appearing out of thin air.

Peter V. Bella said...

4.) Since these people are so stupid as to publicly state their tactics, the Tea Party should just blame all racist and other negative comments and signs on Democratic operatives, agent provocateurs, and infiltrators.

Play their game right back on them.

MadisonMan said...

Why not just take a nice clear video of the person holding the sign, put it on the web, and ask for help identifying the "racist". No one can have an expectation of privacy at an outdoor rally.

This will accomplish two things. It will shame the sign-holder, and when the name is discovered, the backstory will come out. True, some of the media is unlikely to cover the whole story, but some will.

Fred4Pres said...

I have been to a few tea party events and they are about as edgy as a Rotary or Lions Club meeting. If someone is making a complete jackass of themselves, I am going to conclude that person is a Kos Kid.

Scott said...

I wondered where AlphaSockPuppet was. Hmmmm. I bet he's out trying to rally some agent provocateurs for tea party rallies tomorrow.

In fact, where are all of the Althousian leftist stooges today?

Very suspicious!

themightypuck said...

Pics or it didn't happen.

AllenS said...

If they bring a sign, you bring a tomahawk.

Scott said...

I'm going to look at sub-$200 pocket HD camcorders today. Glenn's idea of seeding every protest with people taking videos is a great one!

Titus said...

The tea party is here in Boston today.

I will not be attending.

I don't like large groups.

Never been to any political event including any gay pride event.

I don't like being around other people.

Scott said...

Titus: Here is a Blogger avatar for you.

garage mahal said...

I would watch out for those vicious undercover SEIU members off-duty from their 5-11 shift scooping mashed potatoes on plates and mopping floors. Thugs. And they're everywhere! Gawd.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

I wouldn't be surprised if the so-called "Tea Party Crashers" were actually a phony group set up by the actual racist teabaggers in an attempt to make it seem like all the racists weren't actually teabaggers, when in fact they are.

Yep. It's a double double triple blind with a half gainer twist. Paranoia much?

The Tea Party people need to self police and as Ann says, inform those with inflamatory, racist signage that their signs are inappropriate and not welcome.

Find out who else knows them. Generally these events seem to be rather low key and consist of groups of people who have met in the past. If the person is completely unknown to anyone and refuses to behave....... Take Pogo's advice and beat the crap out of them with a Don't Tread on Me sign.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Why not just take a nice clear video of the person holding the sign, put it on the web, and ask for help identifying the "racist". No one can have an expectation of privacy at an outdoor rally.


MM has the best idea.

Expose them and denounce them. Whether they are infiltrators OR actually idiot racists Tea Partiers.

Comrade X said...

I like MM's idea too. Make whoever brings racist signs own them with their face.

bagoh20 said...

Here is the solution: No matter what happens, VOTE FOR SMALLER GOVERNMENT.

Nobody can Moby your vote. In a Democratic Republic, slavery is an option, if you take it, and so is liberty.

garage mahal said...

Old Spin: There are really no racist signs.
New Spin: Plants!

William said...

Shouldn't there be a demand that prominent New Hampshire Democrats denounce such unworthy tactics? The plain fact is that such tactics are more likely to undermine the processes of democracy than the tea party movement.

madawaskan said...

ZPS-

My my my you do have your little heart set on Tea Partiers being racist.

I mean if someone told you otherwise-well it would flash you back to when Mom came down to the basement when you were all of 38 and told you-

Son it's time to move out and oh btw there t'ain't no Santa Claus.

lemondog said...

Have several tea partiers step up as 'liberal activists' and do multiple undercover videos a
la Acorn.

former law student said...

According to the source, who sought anonymity for fear of reprisals

Damn those diabolical Democrats! They would surely destroy their last decent member, now that he has revealed their sinister plot.

shoutingthomas said...

You're really falling into a trap that the Obamanauts have set by playing into this racism hysteria.

If you will read your own liberal commenters, you will see that outright displays of racist comments and behavior aren't the real focus of their racism hustle.

The core idea of the Tea Party... that one's income and property belongs to the individual and not to the state... that's ultimately what the Obamanauts consider racist.

Because the Obamanauts intend to take away your money and property and give it to their preferred constituencies... blacks, other minorities, gays and women.

You're off track, Ann. This racism gambit is a diversion.

You are a racist, Ann, by definition in the eyes of these people, because you believe that your income and your property belong to you.

In the world of the Obamanauts, your income and property exist at the discretion of the state.

Read that MM character. He makes it quite explicit. You are a racist if you believe that you have the right to ownership of your income and property.

dave in boca said...

BTW, garage doesn't know or care that the purple fruitcake SEIU thugs aren't those illegal immigrants doing KP, but the huge administrative overhead Andy Stern erected of friends of family and nepotistic no-show mobbed-up clowns who get PAL contracts and sit around effing off all day.

I worked in a union shop for years and the amount of slacking off was amazing.

Pogo does have the right idea, and every Tea Party rally I've attended here in FL has been polite and well-behaved with few signs going beyond "Taxed Enough Already."

Titus said...

I enjoy being around dogs...people not so much.

Titus said...

I enjoy being around dogs...people not so much.

Michael Hasenstab said...

Spread the rumor that there's free weed for anyone who wears an "I'm a Liberal Activist" tee shirt.

MadisonMan said...

Of course, if I were carrying a racist sign, I'd wear a mask or a sheet :) or some kind of makeup. So maybe my idea would work, maybe it wouldn't.

Methadras said...

Zachary Paul Sire said...

I wouldn't be surprised if the so-called "Tea Party Crashers" were actually a phony group set up by the actual racist teabaggers in an attempt to make it seem like all the racists weren't actually teabaggers, when in fact they are.


Of course you wouldn't be surprised to see your alleged double-cross conspiracy. What else would your ideologically diseased brain concoct if not visions of tea partiers as nefarious and evil. I'd call you insane, but that might be a compliment.

former law student said...

You are a racist, Ann, by definition in the eyes of these people, because you believe that your income and your property belong to you.


This argument would be more persuasive had Althouse worked for Rearden Steel instead of the State of Wisconsin. Basically everything she has has been extracted by the state by force from the citizenry.

edutcher said...

The best way to infiltrate something is to keep it SECRET.

And they say the Tea Partiers are dumb.

Ann Althouse said...

Oh, Pogo! That so... Alinsky!

I'll bet you say that to Meade when you're feeling frisky.

bagoh20 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Dust Bunny Queen said...

Because the Obamanauts intend to take away your money and property and give it to their preferred constituencies... blacks, other minorities, gays and WOMEN

Hey!! I may have to re think this Tea Party thingy.

I would like to have someone GIVE me money instead of having to work for it.

Maybe I could even double dip...I'm a woman AND a minority. How many Welsh/Basques do you think are in the US. I'm definitly under represented and ......while I'm at it. .....help help I'm being repressed!!

Lem said...

My plan is to show up early enough to hopefully introduce myself to as many tea party people as possible.. I've decided not to take a sign because that could logistically hinder my photo/video taking.
Hopefully somebody will be selling appropriate T shirts and maybe one of those little American flags.

SMGalbraith said...

Why would you need to infiltrate a, you believe, racist movement in order to plant racist views? It'd be like going to a nudist colony and holding up Playboy centerfolds.

As I said, this is first center-right or rightwing or non-left (however you want to label it) mass movement in my lifetime.

And it's driven everyone batty.

SMGalbraith said...

Why would you need to infiltrate a, you believe, racist movement in order to plant racist views?

It'd be like going to a nudist colony and holding up Playboy centerfolds ("Hey, these people are naked! See, look at this!").

As I said, this is first center-right or rightwing or non-left (however you want to label it) mass movement in my lifetime.

And it's driving nearly everyone nuts.

victoria said...

Oh, and Tea Partiers, look around for the Tea Party members who are willfully trying to stir things up to give more validity to this group.


Like Zachary said/


vicki from pasadena

Doug Smith said...

What are teabaggers so afraid of? That they'll be exposed for the vicious, vile racists that they are.

/Alinsky off

Calypso Facto said...

Tea Party Patriots prep (via email) for dealing with disrupters:

"So here are some tips for dealing with this situation, should it arise at your tea party.

1. Be prepared. Make sure your security team knows about the potential for disturbance, and your procedures for dealing with any issues. If you have law enforcement at your event, let them know about the potential threats in advance. Most are happy to remove people who intend to disturb your event.

a. Have a plan. We suggest that you handle every incident in a predetermined manner. Your preparation will allow you to handle any incident in a calm and reasoned manner.
i. No aggressive confrontation. Make sure all of your people know that they are in the media spotlight. Our behavior will be watched. So if you encounter these miscreants, be polite, and ask them to leave your event. If you have police there, ask them to help you.
ii. Video, video, video. Make sure you have teams of people with Flip cams or other easy format video, and make sure every single encounter of this nature is captured on videotape. Create the record. We'll use it later to publicly humiliate the bad actors, and also to allow you to prove your version of the incidents if challenged.
iii. Partner up. If you are going to deal with one of these situations, always have at least one other person with you. It's imperative that any situation not be your word against someone else's. Have a witness and a helper with you at all times.
iv. Make signs that say "Infiltrator. This person is not with us." Put a big arrow on it so that you can stand next to infiltrators and point at them. Usually this will embarrass them, ruin their prank, and they will leave. Plus it's just plain fun and makes for great photos and video. Again...always with good humor, and a cheerful demeanor. It's fun to mock the lefties, and it makes them truly crazy when you are nice.

b. Talk about the issue of behavior and signs at the beginning of your event. Set the guidelines from stage.
i. No signs or behavior evidencing bigotry or racism of any kind will be tolerated, and people will be asked to get rid of them or leave.
ii. We are polite, law abiding people, and that's how we run our events.
iii. Ask attendees to immediately report any suspicious people to event security or the police (according to your own guidelines).

c. Don't worry...be happy. If you weren't so good at what you are doing, and so successful at influencing the debate in this country, people wouldn't feel compelled to try to shoot you down using sleazy tactics. You are dominating the political playing field, and doing so by being honest, operating with integrity and staying within the law. Be proud of what you are accomplishing, and enjoy your day."

God those "racist teabaggers" (to quote ZPS) manage to sound SO PEACEABLE, and REASONABLE. Shocking.

shoutingthomas said...

Of course, I should have added, the actual result of the Obamanauts seizing your money and property will be to enrich themselves and their cronies.

See Detroit.

AJ Lynch said...

Poor Zach and Vicky:

They thought Obama's election had put an end to their having to hear opposing views and right-leaning ideas and free speech. Oh those mean mean mean right wing freedom lovers- why won't they just STFU and worship the new president!

New "Hussein" Ham said...

Yes, talk with them. Get their names. Introduce yourself.

Follow them around.

Watch who they talk to. Take pictures of their friends.

Film them saying "n*gger."

After the event, film them walking back to their cars.

Get their license plate numbers.

If you can, follow them home and find out what their home address is.

Make sure you have a good photos of them if you can't get video.

We'll need to track these people down later to out them as the racist party crashers they are.

Celia Hayes said...

I've been to any number of Tea Party events, protests and meetings, and I'd have to agree - they're about as far out there as your average Lutheran church pot-luck. A lot of people who attend are ... well, mostly middle-class (of all colors) and of the sort who used to be called 'square'. And they usually know each other or come with friends. Anyone being really hateful, racist and confrontational without provocation really, really stands out.

MadisonMan said...

I think SMGalbraith made the best point. If you think the Tea Party is racist, why the need to plant signs?

The only conclusion is that the New Hampshire Democratic Party knows that the Tea Party is not racist.

TMink said...

Not spin, there are advertisements calling for people to be pretend racists. You can do much better than this GM.

The times they are a changin.

Trey

TMink said...

Celia, I bet 65% of us love Jesus.

Trey

GMay said...

It's a blast to watch libs lose their shit over the right/center/libertarians/conservatives finally protesting. They're absolutely unhinged, and as another poster pointed out already, a good litmus test is the braindead postings of the lefties here.

For fuck's sake, when the AP is even reporting it, you deny at risk of further cementing your title of village idiot.

To further make the lefties lose their tiny little brains on this thread:

Sarah Palin

Boo!

roesch-voltaire said...

This is a clever move, now anybody with a racist sign can be labeled a "crasher" and not part of the Tea Party, as they were in the past. I wonder if that covers those who can not spell America?

GMay said...

Hey RV, want to get into a contest on who can post more pictures of offensive/racist/violence-inciting/hate-filled signs?

You go first on the Tea Partiers. I'll take the left. Readyyyyy.....GO!

Christopher said...

Here's a TPM story on the infiltration

Just Lurking said...

The crowd was too large in Boston for infiltrators to really make a scene, seemingly. Although we had to leave at 11:30 (EDT) and the rally was still going on. Maybe after we left, a riot broke out among the old biddies holding the large American flag and the college kids carrying the "MIT nucular (sic) engineers for Palin" sign.

A group of 20somethings carrying Ayn Rand slogans ("operatives" IMO; they were too obvious) starting chanting something and singing "give peace a chance" really loud, and generally acting silly, and people around me rolled their eyes and shook their heads.

The only foul language I saw or heard was from Palin haters. One guy in a batman mask(??) had "fuck Palin" handwritten on the back of his t-shirt, and a guy yelled out "Sarah Palin is a bitch." White-haired Tpers scolded them, reminding them that children were present, and the guilty potty-mouths just shrugged and mumbled "I don't care" and walked away.

AlphaLiberal said...

Yeesh. Ya got nothing, Althouse. Supposedly a right wing blog has the inside scoop from Democrats that they intend to discredit the Teabaggers*.

This is a partisan web site, not even posing as a news site.

We are seeing an obvious effort by the Teabagger leaders to pre-emptively deflect the responsibility for crazies in their midst. We have seen racist signs and heard racist speech from Teabaggers since they started.

Please, stop making up and spreading apologies for them.

* - I have reconsidered my

Just Lurking said...

pt2
I didn't see any racist signs (I really didn't expect to; I didn't think any "operatives" would really have the nerve, despite my facetious comment in an earlier thread.) But again, it was a large crowd so I don't claim to have seen every sign.

I saw one birther sign, being held by an old guy who was with an old women, and he was definitely not a plant. He had a website listed. He, of course, was being interviewed.

There were counter-protesters carrying anti-Palin signs, but they were fine. They chanted a little, but again the crowd was too large for them to be effectively disruptive.

Overall pretty tame. I think lefties are finding out that middle-aged conservatives types don't get riled up that easily by the actions of silly college kids. I really don't understand it when people say they are afraid to attend these things.

LonewackoDotCom said...

A tea partier brainstorm? This should be fun!

Meanwhile, here's what Tea Party opponents should do.

AlphaLiberal said...

I've posted numerous examples of patent racism at Teabagger events.

Just this week we saw incredible racism from the Tea Party's candidate for Governor in New York.

Lowlights:
* In December 2008, Paladino forwarded a message entitled “Obama Inauguration Rehearsal” including a video clip showing African tribesmen dancing in a village.

Well, more at the link. It doesn't matter how much evidence when people are intent on denying reality.

al said...

Pajamas Media is looking for citizen journalists to provide images and video of the "crashers". More here

AlphaLiberal said...

Crashers are not needed as the Tea Party movement overflows with racism.

For the past year we have seen repeated racism at TP events. Things like Obama presented on hundreds of posters as a with doctor with a bone in his nose. Or the Aunt Jemima pancake box. Lot's of example of Tea Party racism around.

And let's face it, the Republican Party has based their strategy on open appeals to racism for years. That's what the Southern Strategy is all about.

LarsPorsena said...

AL:

"We are seeing an obvious effort by the Teabagger leaders to pre-emptively deflect the responsibility for crazies in their midst. We have seen racist signs and heard racist speech from Teabaggers since they started. "

What's this "we". DNC, Moveon, OFA?

TMink said...

Alpha, I hate that kind of derogatory dacist humour. Thanks for helping to out that scuz.

Apparently, the tea party folks don't like him either. "
"It's absolutely incompatible with anything we stand for," said Mark Williams, formerly a radio talk show host on WROW AM-590 and now chairman of the Tea Party Express. "Clearly he doesn't understand what this movement is about if he's touting himself as a Tea Party candidate. Because again, we're a human rights movement, and it is flat out impossible for an advocate for human rights to embrace what he stands for."

Is that enough of an unambiguous statement of disapproval for you?

Here is the link.

http://www.timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?storyID=921378&category=STATE#ixzz0l66aZzrI

ricpic said...

It's good that the lefty thugs still think the charge of racism will be enough to neutralize the opposition and terrify the great mushy middle. I have news for them: the great mushy middle is HURTING! The great mushy middle is SCARED! And most important, the great mushy middle is getting ANGRY! Compared to its own survival the accusation of racism is so much piffle to the great mushy middle that sees WHO IS IN CHARGE. You are, lefty thugs, and in November a tsunami is coming your way. So please, go ahead, continue the j'accuse bit. You are so fried.

AlphaLiberal said...

Lars, "we" means us. Americans. People who read the news and the blogs.

There was a memo put out earlier this week regarding tax day protests, telling people to chill.

The right wing, including Ann Althouse, talks up this supposed infiltration thing.

But racism has been prevalent at Teabagger events. I listed examples above.

Of course, to most white conservatives, there is no such thing as racism.

AlphaLiberal said...

Hey, how about that crazy racist Governor of Virginia? Now he wants a writing test for felons to get their voting franchise back after paying their die to society.

Jim Crow is stepping out!

This is after all the dog whistle politics to the racist base of the Republican Party in their celebration of the treasonous Confederacy.

LarsPorsena said...

AL:
"Lars, "we" means us. Americans. People who read the news and the blogs. .."

I think "we" means you and the mouse in your pocket.

ET1492 said...

Is there an ethical difference between what the Tea Party Crashers are doing or plan to do and what the Protest Warrior group does?

TMink said...

I looked at your other photos, and they are not compelling. The words 'white slavery" are in no way racist are they? I have been to several tea party meetings and NEVER seen the bone through the nose photo before. I have seen hundreds of posters and never seen that one. I think you are being mislead with that one.

And calling Obama "massa" is not racist, calling him "boy" or house n or something like that might, but calling him "massa" is at worst confused and a bit deranged.

And as far as the southern racist strategy, you need to come down here to visit. Let me buy you a beer and show you around. We are not even mostly biggots down here. Racists are marginalized, we are all just getting along.

Don't be misled by liars. It makes you feel stupid.

Trey

AlphaLiberal said...

Someone else notes the right effort to blame liberals for the racism in the Teabagger movement.

'While explaining the vast left wing conspiracy to portray the Tea Party as racist to Sean Hannity, Breitbart first tried to tell Hannity that the racial slurs and spitting on members of the Black Congressional Caucus did not occur but at the same time he defended the attack, “Their accusing us of what they’re doing, that’s classic Alinsky. The very act of the Black Congressional Caucus walking through the Tea Party people while holding all those videos was an act of provocation.”'

No-one does crazy like Andrew Breitbart.

Peter V. Bella said...

Alpha,
Why is it when white politicians are depicted in unsavory and detestable imagery, it is called expression. When it is the Black Jesus (coined by the Obama Campaign) it is racism.

Just curious? Is this just left wing hypocrisy or bullshit in general?

TMink said...

Alpha, you racist pig. Now you are saying that black people in Virginia cannot read. Racist.

Trey

GMay said...

BetaLib - Perhaps you could connect a few dots and define the Tea party leadership, name its chairman, and its support for Paladino. I mean, Paladino has contributed to Republicans and Democrats, to include Eric Massa, so take that for what you will.

I guess if he had been a member of the KKK at one time, he would have made an excellent Democrat eh?

AlphaLiberal said...

So, can we see a show of hands?

how many people agree with this Teabagger that Obama seeks "White Slavery"

NOT THAT THAT'S RACIST! NOTHING IS!

Scott said...

Ah, AlphaSockPuppet is back from his coffee break.

kimsch said...

I'm going to the Chicago Tea Party tomorrow with my camera, Flip and mobile as backup. I will be taking pictures and talking to people. I'll send mobile videos to PJTV as necessary. The rest will posted on my blog.

wv: neitral

AlphaLiberal said...

Wow. Ann Althouse sure has low standards in news sources.

From the "article" she links to:

Sullivan has also been making herself a bit of a nuisance in Manchester. She has been attending meetings of the Board of Mayor and Aldermen to glower at Mayor Ted Gatsas.

OMG! You guys! This is like all like factsy and everything!

AlphaLiberal said...

Imagine that. Someone attended a public meeting!!

Pogo said...

Announcing that racist/etc signs are forbidden is essential. Video is essential.

But take a cue from the left and out everyone who does this.

Get their name and address. Find out where they work. Let their employers know what they've done. Picket in front of their house or business. Call the police about a hate crime.

A plant would think twice about it if he knows he'll be exposed as a racist. 'I was only kidding' hasn't saved anyone's job so far.

If it turns out they have Democrat of lefty organization ties, all the better for publication.

What goes around comes around.

Comrade X said...

instapundit had a post yesterday about the man who killed himself after he had been falsely accused of making racist remark and suspended from his job. PC gone mad.

too stupid to draw any lessons from this, public servant tea party infiltrators are going out of their way to act racist and are already being investigated.

PatCA said...

Yes.

Take their pictures, take a short video with your cell phone.

GMay said...

BetaLib said: "But racism has been prevalent at Teabagger events. I listed examples above."

I don't think "prevalent" means what you think it means. You had one overtly racist guy as proof. The other couple of examples weren't as bad, but still inappropriate.

And then you cited wikipedia? I don't even think that cuts it in high school dude. At least you didn't post the pics of the protesters with the Lyndon Larouche produced signs. Shows you're not completely stupid.

So do you want to take up the challenge I offered RV? I got gobs and gobs of crazy shit I can post that shows whacked out, violent lefties spouting all sorts of racist shit. I'll show you "prevalent". Just gimme the word champ.

AlphaLiberal said...

Elsewhere on the site we find out that it is run by Republican operatives! What a brilliant news source!

'HYNES STEPS ASIDE. Young’s business partner, conservative Web master Patrick Hynes, says he’s stepping away from his controversial Now!Hampshire Web site and handing it over to Jayne Millerick’s husband, Shawn, who has been a contributor to the site.

“This will infuse the site with new energy,” Hynes said. “It will also open me up to take part in some New Hampshire campaigns if the opportunity should arise.”'

And Hynes' business partner is former state Republican Party Executive Director! Everything on this site must be completely TRUE! OMG you guys!

Young, a founder of Calypso Communications in Portsmouth and part-owner of Hynes Communications, is a former state GOP executive director and party treasurer who worked for the presidential campaigns of the late Jack Kemp, Bob Dole, Steve Forbes and John McCain over the years. He lost a bid for party chairman in 1997..

Ann Althouse - regurgitating the Republican propaganda for years!

AllenS said...

Expose the liberal activists and then cut their tea bags off!

Doug Smith said...

Notice how among lefties it's a truism that tea partiers are racists and evangelical Christians. I mean it's just not possible that there could be atheists at these rallies.

shoutingthomas said...

AlphaLiberal,

What you clearly believe is that racism is Original Sin, and that Original Sin cannot be expunged.

You've deflected your religious impulses into the political arena.

And, amusingly for a liberal, you've become a fire and brimstone preacher condemning the sinners to eternal damnation.

You're very confused. This psychological problem you're suffering doesn't have anything to do with politics.

GMay said...

BetaLib: "OMG! You guys! This is like all like factsy and everything!"

Translation: I got nothin'.

AlphaLiberal said...

GMay, the Republicans' Southern Strategy is well-known and well-established as a race-based appeal to the former "Dixiecrats."

The RNC Head Ken Mehlman admitted that when he apologized for it years back.

The fact that you may be ignorant of something doesn't mean it is false.

GOP: 'We were wrong' to play racial politics (But we're going to keep doing it anyway)

Republican National Committee Chairman Ken Mehlman apologized to one of the nation's largest black civil rights groups Thursday, saying Republicans had not done enough to court blacks in the past and had exploited racial strife to court white voters, particularly in the South.
"It's not healthy for the country for our political parties to be so racially polarized," said Republican National Committee Chairman Ken Mehlman.
.

GMay said...

Damn, BetaLib went plaid!

AlphaLiberal said...

Doug Smith:

Notice how among lefties it's a truism that tea partiers are racists and evangelical Christians. .

No.... it's a fact that there are many racists involved with the Tea Party. what about the Tea Party candidate for NY Governor, Paladino?

You guys were oddly silent on that one. I posted others. All you have in response are these vague cracks and insults. LAME!

Keep gettin' crazy!

shoutingthomas said...

AlphaLiberal,

You were born to be a Baptist preacher.

This psychological problem you have... you know, this deep seated need to condemn the sinners... has nothing to do with politics.

Go take care of your problem. Doesn't have anything to do with the Tea Party.

Doug Smith said...

AL:

You guys were oddly silent on that one. I posted others. All you have in response are these vague cracks and insults. LAME!

Keep gettin' crazy!


You obviously think of the Tea Party as the "gift that keeps on giving" to the Democrats. The question is why are Obama and the Dems tanking in the polls IF the Tea Party is so damaging to the GOP?

Doug Smith said...

Obama's tanking job approval since innauguration

Explain that away LIBELerals.

AlphaLiberal said...

GMay:
BetaLib: "OMG! You guys! This is like all like factsy and everything!"

Translation: I got nothin'.
.


You missed the part where I showed how the guys who are running the web site that Ann Althouse cites are Republican Party operatives.

To factsy for ya?

shoutingthomas said...

AlphaLiberal,

Get a grip.

Whether or not you believe other people are sinners (er, racists) of no importance.

If you feel the need to go to confession, then, by all means, go see the priest.

Otherwise, why don't you cut the fire and brimstone.

You're a odious bore, and a stuffed shirt.

Doug Smith said...

AL - so you just believe in "shoot the messenger"? The only issue is if the story was factual and it is.

GMay said...

BetaLib: "The fact that you may be ignorant of something doesn't mean it is false."

Perhaps you missed the point where I was criticizing your use of wikipedia as a source? That would explain the whooshing sound.

Maybe when the Democrats lay off their racial politicking, we can actually get somewhere.

Want me to start listing the Democrats' record in that arena? It won't be pretty for you.

Mutnodjmet said...

Ann: You will want to have people holding "Infiltrator" or "Not One of Us" with arrow sings, for use in digital images and videos for when a Crasher is identified. This sign, and other downloadable Tax Day Tea Party signs are available HERE:


Dealing with INFIL-TRAITORS! Downloadable “Not One of Us” Signs!

Slow Joe said...

It's interesting that the LGFs want to lump people together as much as possible, except when it makes then look pretty awful.

LGF told me I Was helping racists when I attended a Tea Party with a sign condemning racism and asking for sustainable spending.

Of course, a hell of a lot of the violence, racism, and race hustling has been from the people on LGF's side, and hardly any on mine, so his argument is extremely dishonest. But that's OK, it was a dumb argument.

Bring a camera and get these people on film. Try to find out what the names of the bigots and phonies are... a lot of these people will travel in groups and talk to eachother, so use your imagination.

This is public... you do not get a right to privacy, and if you're trying to destroy free speech and protest by pretending it's racism, you need to be exposed. We don't need a violent civil war... we need an informed people and enough patience to wait for the election. Exposing the left is part of the solution to unsustainable spending.

sierra said...

I was just at the tea party on Boston Common, and there were a good number of fake protesters there pretending to be racists & whatnot. Nobody was buying it. I found the best approach was to politely thank them for attending and for boosting the crowd count.

LarsPorsena said...

ShoutingTom:

"...What you clearly believe is that racism is Original Sin, and that Original Sin cannot be expunged..."

For AL racism is more like witchcraft or possession.
It has many manifestations that only properly trained 'cleric'(AL) can discern.

Sin can be cleansed. Evil has to be
expunged.

Slow Joe said...

" Zachary Paul Sire said...

I wouldn't be surprised if the so-called "Tea Party Crashers" were actually a phony group set up by the actual racist teabaggers in an attempt to make it seem like all the racists weren't actually teabaggers, when in fact they are."

Also, they proved who was behind this. It's a HUGE Obama fan, who loves Keith Olbermann and thinks the democrats are too conservative most of the time.

Democratic Underground types. The people beating up Sarah Palin pin wearers and Ken Gladney are liberal democrats.

GMay said...

BetaLib: "To [sic] factsy for ya?"

I guess you missed the AP report I linked upthread.

Too factsy for ya?

Keep on denyin' though, it's working out so well for Democrats. Darn those racist Teabaggers and their fringey members!

Defenseman Emeritus said...

Alpha, no matter how shrill you get, and no matter how many times you post the same shit, you will not convince anyone here besides garage and ZPS that the Tea Party movement is racist. You're wasting your time. But I hope it's cathartic for you. Seems like you need it.

garage mahal said...

The people beating up Sarah Palin pin wearers and Ken Gladney are liberal democrats.

Haz video?

Todd said...

AlphaLiberal, to start why so angry? Seriously, relax or you might have a heart attack or something. Need to try to calm down and watch the old blood pressure. Second, why do you insist on using a derogatory gay sex term to describe people you have a political disagreement with? You don't know them and they have done nothing to you. If you actually did not know that "teabagger" is a term to describe a sex act then fine, now you do. Please stop using it. The more correct and appropriate term is teapartier or teapartiers. Third, as others have tried to point out, the tea party groups are not raciest or civil rights focused but are instead focused on government size and waste. Their stated goal is to support candidates and policies of either political party that strive to shrink government and return it to its constitutional roots.

This is America and it is find that you disagree with this particular group but why not debate them on the issues instead of attacking them with insults?

Brian said...

AlphaLib:
Of course, to most white conservatives, there is no such thing as racism.

This isn't exactly true. It's the proposed solutions that we disagree on. For the record, I thought the birther stuff was a dead end and counterproductive. I don't dispute that racism still exists.

However, Obama has been in office over a year, the dems have held both houses of congress for over 3 years, and it was the jacked up spending that got the tea party movement started. That and health care, the bailouts, etc. It may be hard to believe, but people do care about this stuff. You may attribute racism behind every motive to oppose Obama, but then you make a rookie engineering mistake: You can't discount the possibility you have more than one problem facing you.

So was it racism that got people to oppose Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid?

Slow Joe said...

"garage mahal said...

The people beating up Sarah Palin pin wearers and Ken Gladney are liberal democrats.

Haz video?"

I do have police reports, but it's hilarious that the other example I gave does actually have video of anti tea party nuts showing racism and violence.

You ignored that part and demanded video of the attack that happened in the middle of the night in an alley.

You're a nasty person who is defending horrible behavior. This isn't about partisanship. A lot of democrats are in the Tea Party movement, and millions of people will remember your hatred (you're part of it and there's no need to isolate one from another). You're with Al Sharpton and SEIU, on the wrong side of history.

I guess democrats wind up on the wrong side of history pretty consistently. I'm sure in ten years you guys will pretend the Tea Party was your idea. Too bad about the information age and all, or you would have a shot at pulling that off.

MadisonMan said...

Obama's tanking job approval since innauguration

Explain that away LIBELerals.

You have an interesting definition of tanking. The job approval shows a steady decline then a leveling off. A tank, to me, is a fall off a cliff, and I don't see that in the link.

I think that if Voters really hated the Democratic brand, then the special election in FL might have gone down a little bit differently than it did.

Brian said...

@garage:
Haz video?

Of course not garage. It was actually planted Republican operatives that love Sarah Palin that beat those people up, to pin it on Democrats.

Brian said...

@SlowJoe:
I'm sure in ten years you guys will pretend the Tea Party was your idea.

Joe Biden will assure us this is the case, just like the Iraq war will go down as a success for this administration.

garage mahal said...

Of course not garage

Then it didn't happen!

Brian said...

I didn't say those people didn't get mugged. It's just those dastardly Repubs, you know, the same ones that planted that militia guy in Michigan who was a registered Democrat.

rocketeer67 said...

I think that if Voters really hated the Democratic brand, then the special election in FL might have gone down a little bit differently than it did.

Probably not. I mean, we're talking about a very red house district - relatively small, and very politically homogenous.

A better bellweather would be a larger, statewide election. Like, say, a Senate or Gubernatorial election in a reliably red state. Like, for instance, say - just hypothetically - New Jersey. Or -and I know this sounds crazy, but stay with me - Massachusetts.

Relying on FL 19 to bolster spirits about the state of the Dem brand is whistling past the very, very large necropolis.

WV = "worishoo" - heh.

Hoosier Daddy said...

This is America and it is find that you disagree with this particular group but why not debate them on the issues instead of attacking them with insults?

Alpha, like most liberals believe in free speech for them but not others. They think only liberals can speak truth to power. No one else should have such a right and are racist if they have the audacity to think they should voice their concerns that the country is going to hell in a handbasket.

In other words, Alpha is a hypocrite of the highest order.

Slow Joe said...

"the special election in FL might have gone down a little bit differently than it did."

The RNC should have put at least a minor effort into getting the vote out, but this district was gerrymandered (by Republicans) to concentrate a bunch of democrats together. It's designed to be ignored and lost, to save money.

If you think this district shows democrats are doing fine, you're insane. That's like saying Texas electing a Republican proves the Democrats are toast... all you're proving is that you're lame.

George W Bush, after 5 years of deep unpopularity and extremely critical coverage, is within the margin of error if polled against Obama (who was recently extremely popular and gets a lot of favorable coverage). W would probably beat Obama if they ran campaigns first. That's how weak you guys are.

You can't even replace Ted Kennedy with a democrat. you can't even win the governor's mansion in New Jersey. You have some tough races in Illinois of all places.

I wish this was some kind of savior for the republic, but I don't think it's anything more than anger at the democrats being so dishonest and corrupt. No one expects the GOP to make our spending sustainable... they are lame too... just not insane.

Frankly, you left wingers should hope the GOP takes all the energy from the Tea Party. In the long run, the last thing you want is for the Tea Party to give up on the GOP and start a more conservative (spending) party.

SMGalbraith said...

Really, why are they trying to plant ugly stuff?

We've seen a number of liberal/left movements over the years. I've never read of a conservative attempt to tarnish or sabotage those causes by planting material or people.

If you believe a movement is so fringe, so out of the mainstream and marginal, why worry about them?


Makes no sense to me at all.

Shanna said...

I'm definitly under represented and ......while I'm at it. .....help help I'm being repressed!!

BLOODY PEASANT!

No.... it's a fact that there are many racists involved with the Tea Party.

Many=A couple of crazy people. By that standard there are “many” murderers involved with the democratic party.

rocketeer67 said...

By that standard there are “many” murderers involved with the democratic party.

Hell, by that standard, the president is palling around with "many" terrorists. But noting that is out-of-bounds for some reason.

MadisonMan said...

The Democrat won with 62% of the vote in a district that Obama carried with 66% of the vote. I just don't see that as people running away from Democrats. I don't know what kind of Candidate the Republicans put up, however. Could have been someone far worse than the Democrat.

Now don't read that to mean I think the Democrats won't lose a lot of seats in November. They will, of course. But who loses depends on the opposition. I don't think running as a not him Candidate will work very well if (Huge if) the economy is doing okay.

Ann Althouse said...

@Alpha, why are you bitching about the accuracy of the linked news story when I said "Who knows the extent and organization of the Tea Party Crashers movement?"?

rocketeer67 said...

Dogs gotta bark. Birds gotta sing. Fish gotta swim.

Hoosier Daddy said...

Of course not garage

Then it didn't happen!


garage obviously doesn't know the difference between verbal testimony and physical evidence.

Garage will accept as gospel, the word of a politician that he was called a racial epithet because it reinforces his biased opinion. I don't expect any less from him or most liberals who can't accept the possibility that it never happened and that a politician could ever lie to advance a self-serving cause.

Slow Joe said...

"MadisonMan said...

The Democrat won with 62% of the vote in a district that Obama carried with 66% of the vote"

The democrats pulled some dirty tricks in this race. For one, they hid the election from the public, and most people didn't know it occurred. Turnout was tiny, and there was a splitter candidate. The GOP has a pretty lame candidate and if they tried to win, the democrats would have won anyway, but I wish the RNC had put a token effort into every district in the country, even the sure losers like this one.

Running against Obama wouldn't work in this district, but it is a great strategy. Obama is unable to beat Bush beyond the statistical error in polls. The democrats were smart to run against Bush in some cases, such as the GOP will be smart to run against Obama, Pelosi, and Reid.

Granted, this is not good for our country: I think a lot of bad candidates will get a pass because they lazily oppose Obama. The GOP is not looking great to me... it's just that the democrats look a lot worse.

Hoosier Daddy said...

@Alpha, why are you bitching..../snip

You could have just stopped right there Professor.

garage mahal said...

Reports show more Americans feel economic recovery

This is great news for Republicans!

AlphaLiberal said...

Annie, because of the senstaionalist headline you put on the post, making it sound like fact. And you write about it as if it is fact. I don't think it's fact, I think it's spin, baby! (You're kind of gullible for the right wing)

Here is an ironic news report from Politico:
GOP operatives crash the tea party

haw haw!

madawaskan said...

Well if Alpha doesn't like that source-this is what The Concord Monitor had to say about Kathleen Sullivan:

White Pride

Don't blame the Tea Party.

Last Sunday, the New Hampshire Citizens' Alliance sent out a press release accusing the New Hampshire Tea Party of "celebrating White Pride" by waving Tea Party flags alongside White Pride flags at a demonstration at the State House. "The activities locally mirror the national display of disrespectful, racist and homophobic behavior that has characterized Tea Party activities over the last several days," the alliance wrote.

Turns out, it wasn't the Tea Party. The small rally was organized by the Massachusetts-based white supremacist group North East White Pride.

"The Citizens Alliance seems like they were in error," said former Democratic Party chairwoman Kathleen Sullivan, who had called on local Tea Party-affiliated candidates to denounce the rally.

Sarah Chaisson Warner, director of the New Hampshire Citizens' Alliance backtracked somewhat. "I don't think the Tea Party coalition organized it. I don't think they had anything to do with it," she said. But Chaisson Warner added that she did see a man holding a yellow "Don't Tread on Me" flag next to a White Pride flag. Though the "Don't Tread on Me" flag has a history dating back to the country's founding, it has most recently been used by the Tea Party. "It's concerning to see a Tea Party flag at an event being hosted at white pride nation," Chaisson Warner said.


So she has some sort of past performance-I don't know if The Concord Monitor is a Republican rag-but there you go.

I will say that both sources say she is the former chair of the NH Democrat party.

Maybe she's going rogue...heh.

Joaquin said...

"@Alpha, why are you bitching about the accuracy of the linked news story"

Cause that's what he does, and that's all he has.

madawaskan said...

Alpha-

haw haw

Don't you mean-

Hee haw?

Slow Joe said...

"AlphaLiberal said...

Annie, because of the senstaionalist headline you put on the post, making it sound like fact. And you write about it as if it is fact. I don't think it's fact, I think it's spin, baby! (You're kind of gullible for the right wing)"

UMMMMM, while it's not clear how much crashing is going on, the existence of liberal crashers is, in fact, a fact.

It's happening, and Alphaliberal knows it's happening. He's whining about spin because he's projecting. A lot of people saw the pathetic crash effort in Boston today. Go to your Tea Party tomorrow and you'll see it too. And Alphaliberal will claim it's not a fact that it happened, because Althouse or whoever admits she has no idea what the extent of the dishonest is.

That's called burning a strawman. Anyone claiming there's no infiltration going on is a complete kook.

Hoosier Daddy said...

This is great news for Republicans!

Actually its great news for Americans.

Slow Joe said...

It's interesting that democrats often use promises about the economy to gloat.

Let's not count those chickens yet. The economy could roar back in a faked way for a short time, thanks to the huge amount of stimulus money that could be spent to create the impression things are fixed.

But in all honestly, even the government doesn't expect that to work very well. Wages are lower, people are having a harder time making ends meet or getting work, and a lot of tax increases are coming, particularly to employers of large numbers of American workers. You can't overcome that with pork. Obama's going to have some juicy scandals to deal with thanks to House investigations, by the way.

I promise. We will see House Committees interrogate democrats on several scandals that go right to the top. We will see an independent counsel. The economy might even start to turn around... I hope it does, but that needs to happen before November of this year to save Obama's political destiny.

Ann Althouse said...

@Alpha Oh, bullshit. I frequently put inflammatory quotes in the post title and then fool around with it in the post. A quote in the title doesn't mean I endorse it, and if you think it does... well, you've been here to long to actually think it does. So: Bullshit!

AJ Lynch said...

I also heard the story that the voters, in yesterday's Florida election, did not get an official notice about the special election.

This is a pet peeve of mine. I believe every registered voter should get a sample ballot for every stinking election and they should get it at least 30 days before an election.

AJ Lynch said...

Shanna:

Just hearing "I am being repressed" cracks me up everytime. What a great clip that is.

Hoosier Daddy said...

Let's not count those chickens yet.

Well I clicked to garage's link after posting and noted some interesting qualifications:

"A flurry of reports out Wednesday suggested that many Americans are feeling better about the economic rebound."

When I see reports that 'suggest' that tells me they're guessing. The flurry of reports could also 'suggest' that people are having one last hurrah before the apocolypse too.

Or:"And Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke expressed confidence that the recovery will endure, though without enough strength to quickly reduce unemployment much."

So yes it's a positive sign but when you're like garage and you have so much invested in The Won you tend to bitterly cling to such news reports as they come by.

Bruce Hayden said...

This is what has AL and his liberal kin in a tizzy, and why they are so desperately trying to tie the Tea Party movement to racism: How Bad Could 2010 Really Get For Democrats? If the elections were today, the Democrats could lose upwards of 100 seats in Congress.

President Obama's problem is that he has apparently destroyed the coalition that Bill Clinton had put together that included minorities, urban liberals, suburbanites, and Jacksonians. The first two categories are safe, but the third is in trouble, and fourth lost. If not before the last election, then since then, and it is all about money, and has nothing to do with race, gender, or homophobia. Clinton was able to put this coalition together because he could show fiscal prudence. Just contrast his deficits with Obama's, and you can see why most anyone worried about their finances, or who believes in fiscal prudence is moving away, quickly.

Obama has, less than a year and a half, destroyed the Democratic brand that Clinton had been able to build, after the Carter Presidency. And, the potential for losing 100 seats in the House, and potentially even the Senate, has them scared.

So, what to do? The only thing that they can think of to trump their fiscal irresponsibility is to trot the racism card out there again. Never mind that they are the party of racist, always have been, back to their founding by slave owners, down to the present, in their strong support for racial quotas (i.e. affirmative action). And, if they can get the American People to see the Tea Party movement as racist, then maybe they will have a chance come November.

But one of their problems is evident here, that the left is not primarily oriented towards the grass roots, but is rather top down. So, they have to orchestrate this sort of thing from the top, and that orchestration, unfortunately for them, gives away the game to their opposition.

Kirk Parker said...

ET1492 asks,

"Is there an ethical difference between what the Tea Party Crashers are doing or plan to do and what the Protest Warrior group does?"

Totally and completely. PW "infiltrates" leftist events and tries to get out their own message, though the irony-challenged might indeed misunderstand them.

Webmaster said...

Tea Partiers perhaps should read this ADVISORY from the group itself to see what to do.

http://www.nhteapartycoalition.org/tea/2010/04/14/desperate-dems-devise-disruption/

Bruce Hayden said...

@Alpha Oh, bullshit. I frequently put inflammatory quotes in the post title and then fool around with it in the post. A quote in the title doesn't mean I endorse it, and if you think it does... well, you've been here to long to actually think it does. So: Bullshit!

I am surprised that he doesn't know this yet. But I think that assumption is why a lot of people really don't know where Ann sits on a lot of subject. What I see her doing is throwing out red meat for one side or the other to get a lively discussion going. And that is why so many of us keep coming back.

Slow Joe said...

"AJ Lynch said...

I also heard the story that the voters, in yesterday's Florida election, did not get an official notice about the special election.

This is a pet peeve of mine. I believe every registered voter should get a sample ballot for every stinking election and they should get it at least 30 days before an election."

This is why Howard Dean tried to win as many election certification posts as possible. This kind of stunt is precisely the kind of electioneering they had in mind.

In hundreds of little ways, they realize it's a lot cheaper if they can fudge the system a little. But, of course, this kind of thing will eventually backfire if there is an investigation. I am no bigwig or well connected person, but I know personally of a few hill staffers who are preparing for a GOP controlled House by assembling some investigations of many election abuses and failures to enforce the law. Our DOJ threatens prosecutions for HAVA compliance while letting racists bully voters for democrats. It's a complicated problem that appears to be a party-wide strategy of fiddling with elections, and it's annoying. Any republican or democrat who fucks around with our elections needs to wind up in prison. If you take a position controlling our democratic processes, and you manipulate them for your party, I hope you know how to navigate your way to RHOB 2138, because you might just be subpoenaed next year.

GMay said...

"I also heard the story that the voters, in yesterday's Florida election, did not get an official notice about the special election."

Yep, they kept it well under the radar. Keeps 'em from digging through car trunks and graves to find enough votes.

garage mahal said...

So yes it's a positive sign but when you're like garage and you have so much invested in The Won you tend to bitterly cling to such news reports as they come by.

Actually conservatives have so much invested in the economy staying in the shitter so they bitterly cling to the idea we can't recover. Dumb idea. The economy had really no where to go but up after the Bushies left office, and they are left cheering against the economy.

Pogo said...

Awesome post, Slow Joe.

Please send those investigators to my homely state first.

MN Sen. Al "Acorn" Franken seemed to have more than a little help with ballot counting. (Hey, there's like a thopusand more ballots here in the trunk of my car! And they're all for me! What are the chances?)

garage mahal said...

All Democratic wins are STOLEN, and not legitimate. All Republican losses can all be explained away!

Slow Joe said...

" garage mahal said...

So yes it's a positive sign but when you're like garage and you have so much invested in The Won you tend to bitterly cling to such news reports as they come by.

Actually conservatives have so much invested in the economy staying in the shitter so they bitterly cling to the idea we can't recover. Dumb idea. The economy had really no where to go but up after the Bushies left office, and they are left cheering against the economy."

Granted, a lot of people are personally invested in seeing the entitlement culture, where people do not hold themselves responsible for their personal needs, failing. I want to see that system fail, even though I do not want to see Americans suffer. I want the economy to roar back, but if it does, there will be the thought that it's cementing the crippling effect of depending on the government for your personal needs.

Now, the good thing is, part of each side's argument is that the economy is affected a great deal by these policies. I think the kind of spending Obama has encourages since 2006 has devastated our economy. I think the promises he's broken are scaring a lot of investment away, costing many millions of jobs.

If the economy roars back, I am repudiated. and of course, the democrats made very specific promises about the economy, for several years, about Fannie Mae, ACORN style mortgage fraud, Social Security, Medicare, their stimulus, General Motors, and on and on and on.

They claimed the economy would roar, thanks to their policies, but it's not happening at all. We had an internet bubble, and we had a Bush tax cut boom, and we had a mortgage fraud crash (That was caused by policies spanning three presidencies).

Why do you believe the democrats this time? Obama promised this boom last year and the year before, too. His policies aren't working and his people don't seem to have a realistic method for analyzing what's going on. That's just a fact, lady.

madawaskan said...

IOW-

Diebold will come back to life again as the evil buzz word.

You can just here some Dem politician:

I was against Diebold before Democrats won-now that we're back to losing-

Diebold is Eeeeeeeevvvviiiiill.

Oh and Haliburton, if things get really bad-Carlyle Group.

garage mahal said...

His policies aren't working and his people don't seem to have a realistic method for analyzing what's going on. That's just a fact, lady.

Jobs are lagging, but we went from -750k/month under Bush to +160k last month. Stock market is up 4500 points in on year. Name one president in our history that can chalk that up under their watch.

madawaskan said...

If things get really, really bad-

racists!!!!!

oh wait...

Slow Joe said...

"garage mahal said...

All Democratic wins are STOLEN, and not legitimate. All Republican losses can all be explained away!"

Anyone claiming the democrats steal every election they win is a nut, just as the people claiming Bush didn't defeat Al Gore and Kerry are nuts.

You seem to be criticizing me by mocking a view I don't hold. Obama won his election handily, but democrats are manipulating a lot of elections, and Howard Dean has repeatedly discussed the benefits of controlling as many low level election certifying posts as possible.

We should both ask for the same thing: a fair hearing on this problem, in public, under oath, with criminals and cheats on either side facing consequences, and reformed giving each person a single vote.

madawaskan said...

Damn garage-

That Obama sure has done a lot of investing...

But, but I thought he was against those Wall Street "fat cats"!?

bagoh20 said...

I'm with you Sloe Joe. Election tampering is not taken seriously and even less so by the winners. It should be investigated and prosecuted. Anyone who does not agree?

Doug Smith said...

Barack Obama has decided to make this November a referendum on leftist governance. It's that clear cut.

bagoh20 said...

Do you you really think it matters who came in 2009. Obama did nothing but increase government payrolls and those working to secure taxpayer (stimulus funds).
Recoveries are inevitable regardless of who is in power, the difference is in how long they take, how strong they remain and most importantly, how much they eventually cost. This one is unprecedented in cost.

The rest is yet to be seen.

The stock market rise has nothing to do with Obama, except that he is scaring everyone out of cash and into anything else.

garage mahal said...

LOL

Doug Smith said...

LOL That's pretty much what the American people think of Obama/Pelosi.

Slow Joe said...

" garage mahal said...

LOL"

You have lost the argument on several issues in this thread. People point out that the democrat's promises on the economy were broken, and the economy sucks now, and you reply with a democrat promise on the economy.

People cite documented examples of anti-tea party racism and violence, and you reply with some bizarre obtuseness about the ones without video needing video proof (and your changing standards show you're too familiar with the case to deny it's a problem).

People talk about election officials failing their obligation to inform their district of elections, and you reply by noting that not every democrat victory is stolen, burning a pathetic straw man.

Every single time you attempt to argue, you go so far beyond your intellectual weight class. It can be very frustrating to attempt to argue with an intelligent liberal on this blog, but with you, it's just annoying because you're a complete crank.

And I know enough cranks to know that being mad at you is really unfair... you're miserable. At any rate, you lost 3 arguments in this thread.

Comrade X said...

how's your 401k doing garage?

garage mahal said...

You have lost the argument on several issues in this thread. People point out that the democrat's promises on the economy were broken, and the economy sucks now, and you reply with a democrat promise on the economy.

What promises and who gave them? I want to hear them. The recovery has exceeded their own estimates [which weren't bold enough I admit].

Pogo said...

"The recovery has exceeded their own estimates"

Oh yeah, wa-a-ay better.
Especially that graph on the "with/without stimulus" comparison that Instapundit keeps showing.

Shit man, you ain't even trying anymore, gm.
What up?

garage mahal said...

Instapundit?

*face palm*

garage mahal said...

Screw Instapundit, why not go to some financial pages and fucking read?

The Crack Emcee said...

I'm with Pogo:

Beat the living crap out of them.

Stop being pushovers for these people. They wouldn't do it if they didn't think you'd let them.

You guys should've learned this shit in school.

AlphaLiberal said...

Well the focus of the story from the Republican web site Ann quotes says it's bunk and nobody from the right wing blogswarm on this contacts here:

Sullivan said that no one from any of the blogs that reported the story had tried to reach her to confirm the story.

"I just find it interesting," she said. "Something gets made up and posted by a right-wing blogger and posted by Michelle Malkin like that. She never called me, never emailed me, never tried to reach me."

Sullivan said that while she doesn't agree with the tea party message, "I don't have a problem with 99.99% of people who go to tea party rallies."

"The story is just a total, utter fabricated falsehood," she told me. "It's just ridiculous."

Pogo said...

"why not go to some financial pages and fucking read?"

I like to keep my hobbies separate.

Pogo said...

But howzabout Bloomberg?

"Confidence among U.S. small businesses fell in March to the lowest level since July 2009 as executives grew more concerned about earnings and sales, a private survey found."

AlphaLiberal said...

These arguments on the economy from Republicans and their ilk are simply crazy.

You guys ran the economy into the tank. Your policies were tried and failed.

You, and conservative Democrats, fought to keep the Recovery Act levels low, lowering the effectiveness. Even so, it's stopped or slowed the hemorrhaging

Then after screwing things up you come back and blame Obama?

That's some real dishonest stuff!!

AlphaLiberal said...

And, now the Republicans are closing ranks with the banksters to derail financial reform!!

Pogo said...

Or BusinessInsider?

"So, How Are Stock Prices Now That We're Back At DOW 11,000? They're 30% Overvalued...

Yes, you can argue that "it's different this time." You can argue that, since stocks have traded at an average CAPE of more than 20X for the past two decades, we're in a new normal. And you might be right. But they don't call "it's different this time" the "four most expensive words in the English language" for nothing."

AlphaLiberal said...

Hey, Pogo, when the economy went bad under Bush, you guys blamed Clinton. Reagan blamed Carter for bad economy.

Obama hasn't even been in office 2 years.

By your own logic it's Bush's fault!

Slow Joe said...

I know cranks on the right and the left, and they always act like Garage.

I specified three clear examples in this thread, where logically, garage lost the argument completely. There's no way out of that, Garage. You're wrong. That's just your specific arguments that lost. I haven't really proven that the economy is going either way, or democrats are worse than republicans on elections, or that anti Tea Party folks are jerks.

But your arguments are invalid or obviously unsound. You put them out there and they are complete failures. You seem to want to 'win' for the left, but you're completely failing to make that happen because you're so out of touch with reality that you don't even know how to make a point.

It's obvious that we're differently situated as to how much time we have to focus on these threads. But it's fun to win sometimes, and I enjoyed doing that to you several times today.

Pogo said...

Or mebbe Robert Shiller in the NY Times:
"Don’t Bet the Farm on the Housing Recovery"

"Consider some leading indicators. The National Association of Home Builders index of traffic of prospective home buyers measures the number of people who are just starting to think about buying. In the past, it has predicted market turning points: the index peaked in June 2005, 10 months before the 2006 peak in home prices, and bottomed in November 2008, six months before the 2009 bottom in prices.

The index’s current signals are negative. After peaking again in September 2009, it has been falling steadily, suggesting that home prices may have reached another downward turning point.
"

AlphaLiberal said...

First Republicans lie in bed with the banksters to derail financial reform.

Now, Republicans, Leukemia Team Up To Repeal Health Care Law!

AlphaLiberal said...

Nobody disagrees the economy is in bad shape. After years of Republican policies, after George Bush's TARP program, it was left in terrible shape.

Going from "terrible" to "bad" is progress! That's why returning to bush economic policies would be disastrous for our nation.

Pogo said...

""Living in Economic Downturn Has Become the New Normal""

'MODESTO, Calif. -- Vacant storefronts, abandoned homes and shuttered schools tell the story of the economy in the Northern San Joaquin Valley: This is the new normal.

People are beginning to look at the 3-year-old economic downturn as a permanent condition rather than a storm to be weathered.

Modesto is looking at $8 million in cuts this year from its $106 million general fund, the money that pays for essential services such as police, fire and parks, Mayor Jim Ridenour said. That number is down from the city's $130 million general fund of its 2006-07 budget year.

School districts around the region are feeling the pain, as well, with declining enrollment and the steep drop in tax revenues leading to layoffs, pay cuts and campus closures.

Businesses have closed or cut back drastically.
"

dick said...

THe Concord Monitor was the counterweight to the Manchester Union Leader when I lived in NH back in the late 80's-early 90's. It was totally in the sack with the NH Democrats and when I visited friends in 2005-6 it still was totally a liberal rag. Unless it has totally changed in the past 5 years I would guess it still is a totally liberal rag. Lousy newspaper then and probably has not improved.

Slow Joe said...

"Reagan blamed Carter for bad economy. "

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Oh man, you're young, aren't you?

Further, Obama was in power from 2007, and his policies and budget work and ACORN involvement can be linked to economic problems. The Democrats inherited the power of the purse in 2007. They took the 2006 economy and destroyed it.

Bush wasn't a perfect president... on domestic policy he was lousy I think. But he tried to fight Obama and Frank on the mortgage crisis and social security, and Bush was absolutely in the right.

It's easy to pretend it's the GOP's fault that banks were forced to lend money to lousy risks. Or blame the GOP for Social Security's insolvency. I suppose if Obamacare becomes a huge economic disaster in 2012, it will be pretty easy to blame that on the GOP president at the time.

Let's realize that both parties have been spending far too much money, and this isn't a partisan game. alphaliberal is really obsessed with rehabilitating Carter, Bashing Reagan, and onward being a loyal democrat. Why?

Do Tea Partiers bother to pretend Bush was fiscally conservative enough? Not really. The blame is easily extended to everyone who isn't strictly trying to drastically cut entitlement spending.

that's what the Tea Party is really about. That's why millions of democrats aren't scared of it. Democrats: join us! Let's all agree to balance the budget and save our country, and then split into opponents on the other issues. We're in serious trouble and should come together on this issue.

Partisan idiots are irrelevant right now.

Pogo said...

AlphaLiberal said..."Nobody disagrees the economy is in bad shape."

garage mahal said..."The recovery has exceeded their own estimates [which weren't bold enough I admit]".


You guys have got to get your story straight. So which is it?
The economy is terrible, because of Bush.

Or

The economy is roaring back, because of Obama.

Let us know.

AlphaLiberal said...

Regarding the blog that Ann hypes:

Sullivan, who ran the state Democratic party from 1999-2007, and current state party executive director Mike Brunelle told me Now Hampshire was a notorious right-wing site they said was set up and run by former Republican operatives.

AlphaLiberal said...

So, can anybody deny that Now Hampshire, the blog quoted in this post, is run by Republican Party operatives?

Anyone? Anyone?

Or, would you prefer to change the subject! Thought so!

AlphaLiberal said...

Pogo, not the sharpest knife in the drawer:

You guys have got to get your story straight. So which is it?

It is both! the economy can be recovering from the terrible shape it was in, better than expected, and still be in bad shape.

Kind of like I can go from Chicago to New York and get farther than I expected, but still not have arrived at my destination.

Oh, and Now Hampshire is a partisan web site that lies.

madawaskan said...

garage-

Under Obama's budget plan, the USA's debt in 2020 would be nearly the size of the entire economy then. Interest costs would be $900 billion, five times today's level.

USA Today

I know it's not the Liberal favorites Maureen Dowd or Frank Rich,and you probably won't believe that's bad till Chomsky says sobut it's a start for you.

USA Today:Soaring Deficit Could Make for Some Hard Choices

But don't worry in the same article they say Obama has a plan!

He's hired Clinton's old guy Erskin Bowles and he's talking to Microsoft about creating a deficit reduction video game!!!!!!

Confidence instilling don't cha think?

MadisonMan said...

Let's not count those chickens yet. The economy could roar back in a faked way for a short time,

That's a similar argument to one I read here after Obama's taking office, when the DJIA started rising: It's just a dead cat bounce. I did not believe it then.

Past performance is no predictor of future results.

Pogo said...

As soon as I run across financial articles that are as polleyannaish as AL,I'll let you know.


"can anybody deny that Now Hampshire, the blog quoted in this post, is run by Republican Party operatives? "
Does anyone give a shit?
Does anyone think that a Democratic party plan to crash the Tea Party would be reported by anyone else except a non-lefty news org?

madawaskan said...

Alpha-

What about The Concord Monitor that ran this story about Kathleen Sullivan:

White Pride

Don't blame the Tea Party.

Last Sunday, the New Hampshire Citizens' Alliance sent out a press release accusing the New Hampshire Tea Party of "celebrating White Pride" by waving Tea Party flags alongside White Pride flags at a demonstration at the State House. "The activities locally mirror the national display of disrespectful, racist and homophobic behavior that has characterized Tea Party activities over the last several days," the alliance wrote.

Turns out, it wasn't the Tea Party. The small rally was organized by the Massachusetts-based white supremacist group North East White Pride.

"The Citizens Alliance seems like they were in error," said former Democratic Party chairwoman Kathleen Sullivan, who had called on local Tea Party-affiliated candidates to denounce the rally.


Sarah Chaisson Warner, director of the New Hampshire Citizens' Alliance backtracked somewhat. "I don't think the Tea Party coalition organized it. I don't think they had anything to do with it," she said. But Chaisson Warner added that she did see a man holding a yellow "Don't Tread on Me" flag next to a White Pride flag. Though the "Don't Tread on Me" flag has a history dating back to the country's founding, it has most recently been used by the Tea Party. "It's concerning to see a Tea Party flag at an event being hosted at white pride nation," Chaisson Warner said.


Is Sullivan calling The Concord Monitor a right wing rag?

John Stodder said...

I wouldn't be surprised if the so-called "Tea Party Crashers" were actually a phony group set up by the actual racist teabaggers in an attempt to make it seem like all the racists weren't actually teabaggers, when in fact they are.

That assumes racists have some consciousness of guilt or care about public opprobrium. Imagine the kind of mindset that could at the same time carry around racist beliefs while also recognizing that such racist beliefs are a threat to the Tea Party movement, necessitating the creation of a movement of racists pretending to be non-racists pretending to be racists in order to protect the Tea Party movement from being perceived as racist, even though that's the direction you want to pull them.

But nice try, ZPS!

Let's face the reality that there is one group in America who hopes to stir up racial unrest in politics this year, and they are on the left.

AlphaLiberal said...

Slow JOe rewrites history:

"Reagan blamed Carter for bad economy. "

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Oh man, you're young, aren't you?
.

I like to think so, but I was in my 20s when Reagan was President. I remember him blaming Carter very clearly.

Perhaps you recall the phrase: "Are you better off today, than you were four years ago?" Hmmmmm?

Reagen's 1983 SOTU:

"The problems we inherited were far worse than most inside and out of government had expected; the recession was deeper than most inside and out of government had predicted. Curing those problems has taken more time and a higher toll than any of us wanted." .

Other...

"To understand the State of the Union, we must look not only at where we are and where we're going but where we've been. The situation at this time last year was truly ominous." .

"First, we must understand what's happening at the moment to the economy. Our current problems are not the product of the recovery program that's only just now getting under way, as some would have you believe; they are the inheritance of decades of tax and tax, and spend" .

And on and on and on...

madawaskan said...

Preemptively-

In 1999 the Columbia Journalism Review said that the Monitor was the best small paper in America and Time magazine has named it one of "America's best newspapers.

And they've been in business since 1864.

madawaskan said...

Alpha-

I like to think so, but I was in my 20s when Reagan was President.

omg-you're that old!?

Pogo said...

BERNANKE WARNS: U.S. debt could balloon to more than 100% of GDP.

""Under an alternative scenario that drops those assumptions, the deficit at the end of 2020 would be 9% of GDP and the federal debt would balloon to more than 100% of GDP.""

John Stodder said...

Reagan blamed Carter for bad economy.

Not just Carter. Although the weak economy under Carter helped Reagan to be sure.

But the Reagan movement's critique was as much of Republicans who had conceded to the New Deal, beginning with Tom Dewey, thru Ike, Rockefeller, Nixon and Ford. The kind of economics Reagan practiced was unknown in American politics for nearly five decades prior to Reagan. And when Reagan was out there talking about it, he had other Republicans as bent out of shape as Dems -- including George HW Bush.

jimspice said...

I call BS. If there was an email campaign, provide the emails. The original site should put up or shut up, and anyone else passing it along should be ashamed.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/04/new-hampshire-dems-say-theyre-under-tea-party-attack.php

madawaskan said...

new-hampshire-dems-say-theyre-under-tea-party-attack.

Now that's funny....

Are they bunkered down because wet tea bags are being hurled at them?

AlphaLiberal said...

madawaskan, I don't see what the problem is with that article you post. They thought the White Power rally was a Tea Party rally because they used many of the same signs. When they learned they were mistaken they admitted their error (which a conservative would never do).

Perhaps yuo've heard the term "BFD?"

dick said...

madawaskan,


Can't call the Concord Monitor a right wing rag with any kind of a straight face. They have been a Dem mouthpiece recycling the Dem talking points for as long as I have known anything about NH and that goes back to the mid-1980's.

Pogo said...

""I think it's a bad idea to infiltrate these rallies," she said. "I would defend to the death the right of anyone to express their free speech.""

Good for her.
With the Democratic party track record, however, I'll wait for the actual event for proof.

John Stodder said...

I call BS. If there was an email campaign, provide the emails.

Geez. It does appear as if that New Hampshire Now blog was had.

The State Party Chair's denials sound genuine. And she'd really have to be an idiot beyond compare to authorize something like this.

It's possible a party volunteer is doing this in her name. All kinds of nuts attach themselves to both parties. But I think unless proof to the contrary is found, Sullivan's denials should be taken at face value.

madawaskan said...

Alpha-

Ya, those Don't tread On Me Flags that have been around since I think 1777 and has been used by the Navy and Marines.

So confusing.

###

The NH Democrats are being attacked-quick someone call Josh Marshall at TPM maybe they'll use exclamation marks , block letters and red ink.....

AlphaLiberal said...

madawaskan:
The NH Democrats are being attacked-quick someone call Josh Marshall at TPM maybe they'll use exclamation marks , block letters and red ink..... .

Glad you agree they were being attacked.

And, these intertubes don't actually use "ink," old-timer.

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