"But, again, our country is great because people can say what they think and they believe, but I also think that they have to take responsibility for any incitement that they may cause."Okay, then, I think that you are desperate and depleted of arguments on the merits of the atrocious, amorphous health care reform you thought the American people would swallow whole simply because you won an election and we tend to regard Barack Obama as a well-meaning person. And now you are babbling and whining about the way people are talking.
And I hope you will take responsibility for this embarrassing display. You haven't done your job and now you are crying in public — you, the first female Speaker of the House. Crying. Pretending to be afraid of violence when the talk that troubles you so hasn't even included threats of violence.
UPDATE: Michelle Obama tries to one-up Nancy.
Posts
205 comments:
1 – 200 of 205 Newer› Newest»What's worse is that the guy who shot and killed Moscone was a Democrat who had a personal grudge against him. It had nothing to do with political debate across the land.
Odds of her being called out on this little fact by the so called MSM?
It is not important to be correct, it is how you feel. Having a US Senator who was crying on the floor of the Senate, Voinivich Rino-Ohio, I understand.
Agree or disagree with Condaleeza Rice, she did her job as a professional without all the drama that SOME female political figures seem to engage in.
wknea - weak kneed?
It's richly ironic that Pelosi would try to use Milk and Moscone's murders as an example of the type of political violence that she claims to fear.
They were, after all, killed by their own fellow Democrat Party politician - angry with them because he couldn't get his hack job back and pissed off about his low government paycheck.
What exactly is the lesson to be drawn there? That you can't trust Democrats? That members of the Democrat Party are the source of political violence in America? That guns don't kill people, Democrats kill people?
Are those the lessons to be drawn?
Nancy is being dishonest. The violence she is referring to is the murders of George Moscone and Harvey Milk. Dan White killed them because he was angry over being rejected for reappointment to the SF Board of Supervisors.
The killings had nothing to do with political rhetoric.
Politically the late seventies were comparatively calm in SF and the rest of the nation.
Whether we're talking about the current debate, or the killings of Milk and Moscone, there's so much willingly being left out of the story it's almost pointless to comment on the charade they're presenting - which is how the Dems want it for anyone who seriously questions them, including poor ol' Dan White, who was driven crazy. Me, I want more hidden camera videos! Since nobody will openly admit anything, then, dammit, I want exposure in a manner that's as ruthless as the games these hypocrites are playing with our lives - because, Momma, that's where the fun is!
Screaming they're cultish liars is so old fashioned now - lifting the rock and watching 'em scatter is where it's at! Busting that ass, 60 Minutes stylee - and purely for our "enlightenment" and entertainment - has always been what's happening!
Keep that shit up and, in time, I'll finally be seen as one of the few nice people still left on the planet, funky mouth or no.
I'm loving it.
The Macho Response
For 8 years the left compared Bush to a Nazi or a monkey, depending on mood, and accused the executive of sending young Americans to their death so his defense industry buddies could prosper.
Why are they surprised at the push back when the tone they set was vile?
Apparently, to them, politics IS beanbag when the Democrats have the Presidency.
What a week for Democrats.
We're all racists, according to the Democrats.
If we dare to fight back against our own government, we're violent Nazis, or possibly members of a resurgent KKK.
And, Obama's get out of the vote squad, ACORN, has been exposed as a criminal syndicate.
If only the Republicans had something... anything... better to offer.
I never realized the Twinkie defense was related to the Milk murder.
Pelosi is absurd, maybe she shouldn't go out and call people "un-american" if she wants to keep the dialogue at a higher level. Physician, heal thyself!
Queen Pelossi is setting up the media meme that when Thugs are hired to violently suppress protests of the Cap and Trade robbery(which is her goal of goals) that anyone publicly calling her and Obama Liars will have caused the violence.
Social unrest is a predictable outcome of financial scandal and economic crises.
If the Democratic-led administration wants to avoid violence, ensuring financial stability would be step one. But they're spending like drunks and even printing money to do so.
She's looking for blame in all the wrong places.
And I hope you will take responsibility for this embarrassing display. You haven't done your job and now you are crying in public — you, the first female Speaker of the House
garage mahal are you here? Nancy Pelosi is crying? What was it you said to me yesterday....something about quit crying because it's being...oh what was the word you used...childish?
Oh don't forget about the other time Nancy got all weepy. That's when she flew to Italy on the public dime to 'strengthen our relations with our most important NATO ally. I'm sure that was news to our other NATO allies, you know the ones who actually have committed soldiers to action but I digress. Yes she went all weepy when she was presented with a birth certificate of her grandparents.
Actually I was amazed she had the ability to shed tears considering how much Botox she's shot into her mug.
Those aren't real tears, it's her body purging a botox overdose.
In a way it's a good thing to have her as Speaker because her high visibility is a constant reminder of how grotesquely artificial limousine liberalism can be.
Dissent is the highest form of Patriotism!
- The Democrats
It's not like the people that elected him and the people that were civil to him in opposition just discovered Obama is a part-Negro....and shocked racists are now pouring out to deride The One.."By golly, Helen, there's this ni**er in office! After 2 1/2 years of weeing and heraing his endless speeches - I just learned that! Lets get to those town meetings and show that despite how much we LOVE his wisdom and wise policies...we have to be true to our racist ways!!"
NO, his policies are being challenged and if anything, the true gasoline is being poured by those inside and outside the Obama Administration. That accuse protestors of being fake, "haters", wannabe assassins, manipulated by vast right wing conspiracies, ignorant old seniors, Nazi-like, and of course "racist! racist! racist!!". As Pogo noted, America is full of some very angry people after (in my opinion) Reaganomics failed as the voodoo economics most of us really knew it was..., 40% of Americans life savings went away in fiscal and leadership scandal.
It is exceptionally stupid in the midst of this rage, this massive social unrest, which should be directed at both Parties...the Chris Dodds and much as Republican Corporate Cronies like Chris Cox - to tell furous citizens that their dismay and disgust is Really All About Obama and the Left. It is the Obamites and the Left telling the Independents and seniors that they are the real targets - not say, Bush's deranged supply side theory as he grew Gov't like LBJ and decided in wartime to borrow from China to fund it AND give the wealthy fat tax cuts..It is exceptionally stupid for Pelosi and other hard Left idiots to cast this anger now as "haters full of racism, homophobia, sexism, classism, senior citizen ignorance".
Basically, it is taking this angry mass of Americans and telling them that what they truly are angry about is not what Wall Street and corrupted leaders in BOTH parties did....that their anger is REALLY al about Obama and the progressive Left...and their anger has no legitimacy because it leads to homo-killing. "Now shut up and go home, you haters!!", a crying Pelosi promounces.
That there are some racists in the opposition mix is as OBVIOUS as certain Americans who are traitors, supporters of radical Islam, and anarchists thrilled to the bone to see the WTC fall - were part and parcel of the Leftist opposition to Bush. And part and parcel of the ACLU and other groups efforts to promote "Precious enemy terrorist rights".
Let us all admit that.
And concede that opposition to Obama is no more grounded in racism as a primary factor - as criticism of Bush and Gitmo mainly rested on opponents anti-Americanism, their lack of patriotism and their sympathy with the enemy.
Attempts to use "racist smears" or Pelosi's style of smears are a desperate attempt to shut down debate on a foundering Obama/Hard Left Democrat agenda.
It is just sooo stupid to try to use Marxist delegitimizing tactics when you have an angry mob by telling the mob "their anger is really all about you...and if they are good little sheep, and not hateful bigots, they should shut up." Much as neocons desperately accused opponents to their machinations as being anti-Semetic and "hating the Victims of 9/11" - then found themselves the target of fury about Bush's bungled Iraq Occupation.
And the only actual violence has been committed by people on Pelosi's and Obama's side of the issue.
The inability to be honest, in both Pelosi and Obama, is breathtaking.
Speaking about NATO allies, The O tossed them into the pit with the Bear yesterday. On the 70th anniversary, to the day, of the Soviet invasion of Eastern Poland.
The rationale? That point defense patriot missile with a range of 70 km can do a better job of defending the US against Iran missiles than the same long range interceptors we have already deployed in Alaska.
Oh, and the fantasy that the Iranians don't have a long range missile capability and aren't workin on one.
Earth to Obama, Iran launched a Satellite. If you can launch a satellite, with fractional orbital bombardment (FOB), you can pretty much hit any place in the world with a little work.
wiki: The Fractional Orbital Bombardment System (FOBS) was a Soviet ICBM program in the 1960s that after launch would go into a low Earth orbit and would then de-orbit for an attack. It had no range limit and the orbital flight path would not reveal the target location.
Speaking about NATO allies, The O tossed them into the pit with the Bear yesterday. On the 70th anniversary, to the day, of the Soviet invasion of Eastern Poland.
You know part of me wonders if the date is really coincidental or if this administration is actually this callous that they decided to wait until that specific date to toss the Poles under the bus. Or T-72 if you will.
Fiscally speaking, Cford is correct.
Longtime Congress critters like Biden, McCain, Specter, etc have supported excessive govt spending for several decades. Because it was simple and painless for them to increase tax rates and FICA/ Medicare "contributions".
wv = corap
They perpetrated several Ponzi like schemes and the voters looked the other way. Now, people have figured it out and are angry.
Drill Sgt:
Do you think Obama's odd policies will lead to defections or resignations among his more centrist advisers? Like Hillary perhaps? or George Mitchell?
You know, I just want to take note of how many condemnations of "Democrats" appear in this thread. The funny thing is that I was always a Democrat in the past. I don't think that I have ever voted for a Republican in my life. I donated repeatedly to Hillary and to the DNC (which is why I constantly get emails from them) and though I had profound reservations about Obama based on his disingenuous, dishonest campaign and his inexperience, I voted for him.
But I cannot wait for my next opportunity to vote so that I can vote for every Republican on the ballot in order to send a message to the Democrats in Congress and the White House and in order to reverse the direction this administration is moving in.
Pelosi, Reid, and Obama are acting like rulers rather than representatives.
Pelosi and Obama, within the terms of our politics, are extremists on the far left of our political spectrum.
It's time for them to go.
wv: solkic--when you get a sunburn on your butt.
AJ Lynch said...
Drill Sgt:
Do you think Obama's odd policies will lead to defections or resignations among his more centrist advisers? Like Hillary perhaps? or George Mitchell?
Hillary has got to bail sooner or later. She has no power and is just a figurehead at State. She also loses, not gains, by being associated with The O over the long run
If Pelosi really believes what she says then it is her responsibility, as an elected official sworn to protect the public, to call for the arrest of these people or at the very least to call for the justice department to investigate who is inciting violence.
Now why do I think she won’t do that?
This is the same Nancy that told us that the CIA lied to her that the CIA never briefed on the harsh interrogations.
Nancy.. YOU LIE!
Hillary has got to bail sooner or later. She has no power and is just a figurehead at State. She also loses, not gains, by being associated with The O over the long run
I'm still trying to figure out what she thought she was getting out of hooking up with this administration.
Great, you're now SoS Hillary and the one 'big' foreign policy coup of his administration and he used your husband to close the deal.
Poor gal gets no respect from men.
From Politico, here is some of the soft power, smart diplomacy at work. We decide, fly to Moscow to make the announcement and call our allies while the plane is in the air to tell them we tossed them to the Bear. Unlike that cowboy Bush, we have such a nuanced foreign policy now. We love our enemies and stick it to friends.
Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk confirmed today that he declined last night to take a call from the U.S. informing him of the decision to scrap planned missile-defense bases in his country.
Two U.S.-based sources close to the Polish government said Thursday that Tusk also rejected a call from Secretary of State Hillary Clinton — on the grounds that, as the head of the government, he should speak to the president.
"Hillary called — and the reason he turned it down was because of protocol," said a source.
Questions about the exchanges surfaced in the Polish press after Obama reached the Czech prime minister late last night to warn of the policy change, but did not speak to the Pole until this morning. And the static offers a glimpse at the distress beneath the diplomatic facade being offered by Eastern European leaders.
Nancy fears the reaction when we finally wake up to how cheaply she and Obama have sold us out. Pelossi of course gets money. Obama gets his shot at World Leader. The rest of us get to live without any property of our own in a small part of the area of North American Provence along with the peoples from the former Canada and the former Mexico that has not been set aside for a World Natural Park. Putin and his gang get whatever they can take. The Jews get to serve as victims in Iran's Final Solution...Now, don't anybody say anything ugly or else.
I get the very sick feeling some Dems want something bad to happen. So they can take advantage of it.
Nanzi deserves an Oscar for that one. It sounded like she was talking directly to to Limbaugh.
"Do you think Obama's odd policies will lead to defections or resignations among his more centrist advisers? Like Hillary perhaps? or George Mitchell?"
They would only do that if they are racists.
I get the very sick feeling some Dems want something bad to happen. So they can take advantage of it.
Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.
Nancy chokes up?
Are we sure that wasn't just the botox running out?
Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.
Thank you Mr. Spock. :-)
HAR! I feel a Photoshopping session coming on.
That pouty face is priceless. I could get her jaw to quiver even if she can't. Body shake, then stream of tears, while incredibly hypocritical monologue marquis across the frame.
The Tears of a Clown
by
Smokey Robinson and AllenS
♪ ♫
Now if there's a smile on my face
It's only there because of the botox
But when it comes down to fooling you
Now honey that's pretty easy
But don't let my glad expression
Give you the wrong impression
Cos really I'm sad, and in pain from the injections
Well I hurt and I want you to give me more money
Like a clown I appear to be glad
but yet I'm sad that this stuff is leaking out of my face
ooh yeah
How did she see this type of rhetoric back in the 70's when Milk was killed but somehow not notice it while the dems were busy speaking truth to power and accusing Bush of war crimes/mass murder/war profiteering/being Hitler/setting up a quasi police state/let New Orleans drown because he just doesn't care for blacks etc? and while the net roots were running around making films about how Bush was personally involved in 9/11 and books were written about how Bush should be assassinated (etc etc etc) and were otherwise throwing extremely vicious and extreme rhetorical molotov cocktails for 8 years!
Talk about not seeing the forest for the trees.
And now she's crying? As Tom Hanks would say "There's no crying in baseball (or politics). Man up and taking your hoisting like a man Pelosi.
One thing I picked up in Pelosi's remarks was here conclusion after talk of being menaced by "crazy haters", and how she and others best prevent these meetings from spawning violent dangerous haters: "The balance between freedom and safety is one that we have to carefully balance."
For the longest time, President Obama and AG Holder have been telling us all this right-wing jibber-jabber about balancing freedom and safety is a "false choice."
Sure is getting hard to follow these folks.
Is the next step Pelosi urging the FBI to monitor these meetings and compile Enemies Lists of the "true haters" who oppose The One??
======================
Truth is, racism is a small component, just as anti-Americans who were thrilled and uplifted to see America humbled when the WTC fell were a small part of the ACLU and the anti-Bush movement.
The real problem is BOTH Parties are currently unable to answer, or give honest answers to Americans now scared out of their minds that:
1. We will never be able to compete with China or the 2 billion others making 7 to 20 times less than the average wage of 28.00 here that want each and every American job.
2. Soon we won't be able to afford private insurance for healthcare and each employer will either have to reduce wages or benefits - or outsource whatever they can outsource overseas.
3. That in some sense, capitalism did fail, Reaganomics did fail ---and now the pendulum has swung to socialist redistributionists..who will also fail.
4. Medicare is 37 trillion in the hole, social security is 8 trillion in the hole. The Fed Gov't is now 10 trillion in the hole. It all may collapse, along with the dollar. Guns and gold are growingly being seen as the only safe investments.
5. Palpable fear that the American dream is now being lost for our children and grandchildren by the grave mistakes America has made since the 70s, and by diversion to unsustainable activities involving overseas foreign policy advantures, ruinous globalism, immigration, free trade policies. And unchecked growth of government under both Republicans and Democrats.
6. Fear that America is now secretly controlled by a cabal of corrupting and corrupted - Ruling Elites - and what ordinary Americans want, and vote for peacefully..no longer is part of it. That violence is indeed coming, but not of the sort Pelosi contemplates...true Revolutionary violence and change.
The fricken Dems are imploding and it is oh so pretty to see. Oh so pretty.
Their cries are falling on increasingly deaf ears. The racism charge, with the election of a black president by an overwhelming number of whites on both the right and left, has lost its sting as has Nancy's crying wolf about right-wing incitement.
No one is buying it anymore which sucks for them because they don't have anything else to sell.
What was less than a year ago their crowning achievement - the destruction of the GOP - is now the exact opposite - the probable destruction of their own party.
Does that mean the Republicans are out of trouble? Nope, not if they continue doing what they were doing before the perfect storm of Obama tossed them out.
But as to how real conservatives are going to fair in the future . . . well, it's look pretty damn good.
She fears her fellow Americans more than she fears her fellow Congressmen. That is why she is a bad Speaker of the House; it's also why she was chosen to fill that position.
Social unrest is a predictable outcome of financial scandal and economic crises.
We are in the Fourth Turning.
Currently reading "The Fourth Turning" one coauthor a historian-economist, written in 1997.
Basically a view of American history in 4 stage cycles each cycle roughly 2 decades:
Current cycles:
- The First Turning: American High (1946-1964)
-. The Second Turning: Awakening (1964-1984)
-. The Third Turning: Unraveling (1984-2005?)
-. Fourth Turning: Crisis (2005?-2025?)
Book was written in (1997) the 3rd cycle predicting the 4th cycle in mid 2000. We are now in the 4th or 'Crisis' cycle. Prior 4th cycle was 1926-46 encompassing the 1929 stock market crash, Great Depression and WW2.
It's interesting because I recently finished "The Next 100 Years - A Forecast for the 21st Century" also predicated upon historical geopolitical cycles.
wv-ismsjz: government just attempting to force feed us a recycled (in keeping with the greens) brand of isms jazz
Hoosier:
Sherlock Holmes..
"“Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.”
Spock read A.C. Doyle?
wv quisaugi..a peck of quahogs
Nancy is afraid that the people in this picture will return one day:
http://iowntheworld.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/capitol-view-lo-res.jpg
And she's worried they might be carrying pitchforks and torches instead of protest signs.
I am reminded of the duty we have as citizens that Thomas Jefferson wrote about in the Declaration of Independence:
"... [G]overnments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed.
"But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces [i]a design to reduce them under absolute despotism[/i], it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security."
I wonder if Nancy had a chat with Hillary about this?
Hoosier:
Sherlock Holmes..
"“Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.”
Spock read A.C. Doyle?
Well he said he was a distant ancestor in The Undiscovered Country.
Cedarford wrote:
"It's not like the people that elected him and the people that were civil to him in opposition just discovered Obama is a part-Negro....and shocked racists are now pouring out to deride The One.."By golly, Helen, there's this ni**er in office! After 2 1/2 years of weeing and heraing his endless speeches - I just learned that!"
What!?! Wait a second, are you suggesting that Barack Obama is a .... negro?Heavens to Betsy. Where did you get this information and are you sure it's accurate? With a name like Obama, I thought he was Irish.
Althouse going all in. Full Metal Wingnut. How DARE Democrats implement a policy on the platform they ran on! Break that promise!
The Peter Principle applies to female legislators. QED
"“Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.”
Douglas Adams' Dirk Gently says, “the impossible often has a kind of integrity to it which the merely improbable lacks. How often have you been presented with an apparently rational explanation of something that works in all respects other than one, which is just that it is hopelessly improbable? Your instinct is to say, ‘Yes, but he or she simply wouldn’t do that.’”
WV: eutopir. The real goal of some people's politics. It sounds like utopia, only it's really not. But they slip it in and scoop up all the power before a person has a chance to say, "Hmmm? What was that word again?"
Currently reading "The Fourth Turning" one coauthor a historian-economist, written in 1997.
Interesting! I might have to put that on my reading list.
garage makes a good point. Obama is just doing what he said he'd do. With all of the experience we knew that he brought with him. Bless his heart.
*waves at garage*
But I cannot wait for my next opportunity to vote so that I can vote for every Republican on the ballot in order to send a message to the Democrats in Congress and the White House (etc etc)
The problem with voting like this is that Republicans will misinterpret your vote to be one for their policies, rather than against the Democratic ones. Just like many votes last time were against something rather than for Obama, yet the winner will claim a mandate.
I think this may be the last straw for Pelosi. Her conduct is simply unbecoming of House Speaker.
The call for her resignation must proceed.
"How DARE Democrats implement a policy on the platform they ran on! Break that promise!"
That's a bunch of bs.
Barack Obama specifically ran against Hillary Clinton by opposing mandatory insurance.
Now safely elected, and with Hillary neutered, he is proposing the most massive tax increase on young people ever enacted by the federal government, in direct contradiction to his promises as a candidate.
He is lying. And it won't work.
His health reform is dead.
That's a very good point, MadisonMan. Right now, the swing in the generic ballot is pretty passive. The Republicans are doing nothing to earn it. Sadly. Geez, they're pathetic for the most part.
Hopefully, in the next year or so, we'll see more solid, articulate, consistent conservatives finding their voice. Thad McCotter is a great start.
Althouse going all in. Full Metal Wingnut. How DARE Democrats implement a policy on the platform they ran on! Break that promise!
Hi garage! Good morning sunshine! Hey, can you believe that your Speaker of the House was crying?! I mean how childish is that?
:-)
From the link:
“And so I wish that we would all, again, curb our enthusiasm in some of the statements that are made, understanding that — that some of the people — the ears it is falling on are not as balanced as the person making the statement might assume,” she said.
Love the passive voice, do you not? Statements are made.
This is so vague, you could interpret this as a slam on Obama, if you wanted to. Obama may assume that everyone knows he's talking nonsense about the costs of his proposals. But some people -- those with unbalanced ears apparently -- actually believe him when he promises something for nothing.
How DARE Democrats implement a policy on the platform they ran on!
You mean health care reform? Well WTF is the problem garage? YOUR party has overwhelming majorities on Congress. Is President Shortpants that much of a loser he can't even unify your own party to pass such important and vital legislation?
You'd have a lot more credibility if you'd pull your pants up and admit this guy is a dipshit as a leader and that perhaps your own party needs to reflect on itself and start wondering if everyone is on the same page. The fact you guys can't get this passed says a lot more about your lack of direction than it does about anything else.
It may be a bitter pill to swallow but the first part in fixing the problem is recognizing you have one.
While we're talking about prescient writers, it is good to regularly review Alexander Solzhenitsyn's address at Harvard in 1978.
"We have placed too much hope in political and social reforms, only to find out that we were being deprived of our most precious possession: our spiritual life.
n the East, it is destroyed by the dealings and machinations of the ruling party.
" In the West, commercial interests tend to suffocate it.
"This is the real crisis. The split in the world is less terrible than the similarity of the disease plaguing its main sections. "
you, the first female Speaker of the House. Crying. Pretending to be afraid ..
Gawd is she embarrassing or what?
Looked to be one Twinkie short of a break down to me.
re madisonman:
yes, that is a problem in voting for many republicans. it does depend on who they are. in my state, they will be relative moderates. in fact, i would be voting for divided government, which usually works pretty well because it actually represents everyone.
my heart's real affiliation at this point is independent. i hope the republican's new opinion research initiative ("resurgent republic") leads them to a republican version of the "new democrat" centrism that brought bill clinton to power.
wv: poods--poodles from the 'hood.
But I cannot wait for my next opportunity to vote so that I can vote for every Republican on the ballot in order to send a message to the Democrats in Congress and the White House (etc etc)
The Dems were booted in 1994 (?), then the Repubs in 2006. Dems are just as if not more arrogant and elitist then pre-1994. Repubs will go down the same path. Power corrupts.........
Voters need to develop the mindset and discipline to kick out incumbents at least every 2 terms and to maintain split government.
Barack Obama specifically ran against Hillary Clinton by opposing mandatory insurance.
I also seem to remember a lot of talk about fiscal sanity and keeping the deficit down.
Now, a lot of us knew that was bunk since we can do basic math, but obviously not everone!
btw-
Did you not see -Pelosi's tour de force performance when the Ted Kennedy funeral broke out in the middle of the health debate monologue?
[not to be confused with the time a health care argument broke out in the middle of a Ted Kennedy funeral.]
Happens to the best of Hoosier. Even tough Republicans like John Boehner and Glenn Beck cry all the time. Both Bush I and II have broken down in public. Mitt Romney.
You mean health care reform? Well WTF is the problem garage? YOUR party has overwhelming majorities on Congress. Is President Shortpants that much of a loser he can't even unify your own party to pass such important and vital legislation?.
Actually, it's come farther than at any point in history. One problem is Blue Cross Democrats who are on the take from the same companies who don't want reform. But you're right, they should just ram this mofo home with 51 votes and tell Repubs to suck it.
Give me a break garage Nancy's one Twinkie short of a full wrap around jacket.
She's crying over the imagined safety threats in her head.
Gawd!
Garage said...But you're right, they should just ram this mofo home with 51 votes and tell Repubs to suck
if they actually believed it would work and that people would ultimately be pleased, they should.
however, the Congresscritters know in their heart of hearts, that most of the people will get hurt by this Bill, hence the detail that it won't go into effect till 213, after the next TWO elections.
Drill SGT - It was hard to justify a missile defense system perched on Russias Western Border as being all about stopping "Evildoer Terrahist" types 3,000 Km away. We had far better sites to build such a massive anti-air and missile defense system system. One that worked without tracking every aircraft movement in the 1/3rd of Russia where 80% of their population is with missiles at the ready to alunch against any aircraft or missile launch -- to simply "peer into Iran".
What it was was one of Bush's many neocon-inspired actions designed to antagonize and alienate Russia, while the same guy was licking China's boots at his Corporatist backer's behest since Day 1. Letting China take 3 million jobs from us while fretting that royally pissing Russia off was worth it "because of a possible years off Iranian evildoer threat the Neocons claim requires us to watch them through Russian territory..."
Since we let the Poles and Czechs join NATO, it is hardly about "selling them out". It is just about putting yet another stupid, reckless Neocon policy to bed.
======================
Florida - Now safely elected, and with Hillary neutered, he is proposing the most massive tax increase on young people ever enacted by the federal government, in direct contradiction to his promises as a candidate.
He is lying. And it won't work.
His health reform is dead.
Like it or not, Florida, Medicare is financially unsustainable. We currently pay 80-120% more for our healthcare costs while deliberately underfunding paying for it with taxes and insurance costs...sweeping the balance into that 37 trillion (so far) unpaid bill that is coming due.
All other advanced nations require each person to pay into the system throughout their working lifetime.
No free ride...then at 65 under the "great American system" , giving free healthcare for the elderly magically happens..with all the costs thrown on taxpayers of future generations to pay off rather than be taken from Granny's estate.
To work, and not kill the 50+ cohort with bills of 3500-4000 a month for healthcare insurance or ask them to assign their homes and 401K to a government functionary to oversee as collateral to make payment from in case they get badly ill - you have to make it a lifetime deal. To spread out the burden. No more 20-50 somethings who figure that government will cover them in any health crisis as long as they spend all they make on expensive toys and accumulate no assets others can seize. (Free riders). Or people that say that with medicare 70% underfunded by present taxes that the elderly deserve any and all healthcare benefits they demand with nothing taken from their estates or savings on death..all the bills just get deferred 20-30 years for others to pay off...
Any Asian or European knows the US system is built on lies and deception - and is financially unsustainable. And growingly, so do Americans...the reality of the mess is unescapable and the solutions to spending beyond our means and past the tax revenue since the 70s will be most, most painful - we have in a sense had an artificially inflated standard of living...and the fiscal reckoning of this happens simultaeously with realization that the Ruling Elites have sold the US worker's future out so a privileged few gain harvest immense gains from globalization, unfettered trade with nations using cheap labor.
And, what the flying hell -she's implying due to her safety concerns our freedoms have to be-balanced against...that.
Happens to the best of Hoosier. Even tough Republicans like John Boehner and Glenn Beck cry all the time. Both Bush I and II have broken down in public. Mitt Romney.
I'm shocked that you placed those nazis...I mean republicans as the best. They certainly aren't the best in my eyes but what do I know.
Actually, it's come farther than at any point in history.
Horseshoes and handgrenades garage. Until the pen hits paper and Obama can wave it in the air declaring universal health care in our time it's nowhere.
One problem is Blue Cross Democrats who are on the take from the same companies who don't want reform.
And here I thought Democrats are for the little guy. Wasn't Obama supposed to change how this worked? Wasn't it supposed to be no more business as usual? Why aren't Nancy and Whorehouse Harry Reid coming down like 100lbs of shit on these turncoat Democrats? Why aren't they exposing those Blue Cross Democrats as paid for by BIG INSURANCE?
Like I said, you guys got a real problem if you can't pass a bill with the majorities you have.
Happens to the best of Hoosier. Even tough Republicans like John Boehner and Glenn Beck cry all the time. Both Bush I and II have broken down in public. Mitt Romney.
If I didn’t think it was totally calculated nonsense, I would be sympathetic to that point of view, but for a women who one day is calling people “un-american” and astroturf for protesting something to come out the next day and say that she is afraid the tone has gotten too heated, well that seems a bit disingenuous to me.
Shorter: Crying because 9/11 just happened would be ok, crying because you want people to shut up and just let you do what you want is not.
How about lameness, Althouse for key word descriptors.
In the past two months we have seen a concerted attempt by the rightwing in this country to blurr rights with behavior that is unacceptable. First there were ths shoutdowns defended by "free speech". So go friggin stand outside on a soap box and shout at the sun for all i care but if an elected official wants to talk to and with his constituants, then we should as a civilized society permit that right. Otherwise go shut up or go home or go outside.
Then we have knuckledraggers showing up at public meetins packing guns. What the hell??? are these people insane? to what point? that there is a wildass interpratation of the 2nd amendment or is it just simply to command fear and provoke a confrontation - any confrontation so these assholes get their moment in the sun to talking about the rightness of gun ownership. They these pigs show up in proximity to the President and we are what? supposed to just give them a pass? Where the hell did your brains go Ann.
Then there is the Wilson foolishness. Oh right free speech. And the lying bastards making up one after another in order to defeat what? civility? common good?
I would get choked up too if you are trying to do something that is so clearly for the good of the country and you get it shouted down not by a contrary suggestion but by neaderthalic madmen who appear to be so deranged that violence is not out of the question.
Again, Ann, I've been a supporter of this blog for years but this type of cheap shot is so not like you.
@ Florida and Madison Man...The inertness of the Republicans who say, "we are reasonable people who are not going to do anything bad or good" will not win when Obama or Hillary starts the old "We are for the People are not for the Rich like the Republicans are" meme. To win today we need a Fair and Strong but principled leader that attacks real problems with real solutions. Inertness appearing intellectual prowess wont work for Republicans anymore than it did for Adlai Stephenson. We need a known fighter like a Sara Palin even if he/she is not a great intellectual type like we want in order to appear intellectual for supporting them. That single weakness in the Republican's character was immediately exploited by Charley Gibson and Katie Couric last time. We need to get over that.
Armstrong and Getty's call screener comments that Nancy had tears rolling down her ears.
A facelift joke.
I would get choked up too if you are trying to do something that is so clearly for the good of the country and you get it shouted down not by a contrary suggestion but by neaderthalic madmen who appear to be so deranged that violence is not out of the question.
You got a problem with neanderthals?
I would get choked up too if you are trying to do something
Dude I believe ya....
Old leftist tact: Rethuglicans are just like Nazis. Bushitler is worse than Hitler. He hates black people and wants to kill all the Muslims. And he was behind 9/11.
New leftist tact: We are very disturbed by the language being used by these opponents of our besanited Barack. It is verrrry scary and anyone who makes these charges is a racist or worse. Anyone who even refers to these people and their charges against Saint Barack of Honolulu is just disgusting. Like Althouse. I really use to respect you Ann. Now you just want to make me weep.
Cedarford: Some of those other advanced nations don't:
(a) Allow a significant portion of their citizenry to not pay taxes.
(b) even offer some of the end-of-life care options available here.
(c) Operate in a hyper-litigious legal climate.
For my part, a healthy middle aged male insured for catastrophic contingencies and saving money in an HSA for my inevitable decline, I'm already doing what a sane person should do. Plus I guess I'm supporting Medicare/Medicaid through FICA and the erosion of my savings denominated in dollars.
I would get choked up too if you are trying to do something that is so clearly for the good of the country and you get it shouted down not by a contrary suggestion but by neaderthalic madmen who appear to be so deranged that violence is not out of the question.
It must really be irritating that the violence you fear is actually being perpetrated by your side.
But don't let facts get in the way of your rant there hdhouse. Cause we all know its a horrible thing when the electorate shouts down elected officials who spew bullshit.
"Like it or not, Florida, Medicare is financially unsustainable."
I disagee with that, but for a moment I'll humor you long enough to ask this question:
Did it just become so, or was it financially unstable when Barack Obama was running for the nomination against Hillary on the platform of "no mandatory insurance?"
Was Obama lying then, or is he lying now?
Medicaid aside (and it's perfectly viable if we stop wasting money on worthless programs such as the billions on ... say ... ACORN) garage mahal's statement that the Democrats are merely enacting what they promised during the campaign is a bunch of horsecrap.
Barack Obama campaigned AGAINST that which he is now proposing.
That's morally indefensible, and he can't be allowed to get away with that.
And he won't be allowed to.
if an elected official wants to talk to and with his constituants, then we should as a civilized society permit that right. Otherwise go shut up or go home or go outside.
Hd, I don’t think people should shout down opposition, but most of these people WERE trying to “as a civilized society permits” TALK to their elected officials. Many of the elected officials were the ones shouting down the constituents, accusing THEM of lying, etc..etc... And many were just so evasive and sticking to talking points that it was impossible to have a dialogue with them.
From the town hall’s I saw, the ones where congressmen were acting properly and really trying to talk honestly with their constituents seemed to run pretty smoothly. I think there is blame on BOTH sides of the incivility, where it occurred, because I saw as much from the congressmen as from the constituents. The difference is, they could boot people out who they didn’t like, they could take the mike away, they could close the halls, they could have a hissy fit and leave.
Barack Obama specifically ran against Hillary Clinton by opposing mandatory insurance.
STILL nothing to say about this, garage?
Think of the poor kids that have that "If You're Not Outraged You're Not Paying Attention" bumper sticker on their cars. Should they scrape it off? Will people understand that now they're outraged about conservative outrageousness? It's so easy to be misunderstood.
The lady obviously has more than one screw loose. Maybe it's early onset Alzheimer's.
One of the great ironies is her example of Moscone and Milk, two Democrats killed by another Democrat. So far, in the town halls, most of the violence if from the Democrats too.
Did it just become so, or was it financially unstable when Barack Obama was running for the nomination against Hillary on the platform of "no mandatory insurance?"
Actually the CBO's office pointed out Medicare was going insolvent about 4 years ago and 2018 or 2019 I think was the date it was going bust.
I think the question that needs to be asked, particularly of the left who believes the government is the answer for everything, is how much are we, including the lefties, willing to part from our paychecks to ensure that we all get the Federal pony? I mean if its not health care its universal education, or day care or a new overpass named after Robert Byrd, or a Starbuck's inspired library for the local schools or making sure the illegal alien population is made to feel welcome.
How much of my paycheck should I be allowed to keep? Can one of the resident lefties here please let me know? I mean all of President Shortpant's proposals sound groovy but they ain't free.
I should have added, I'm still voting against the incumbent, especially Tammy if the Congress exempts themselves from whatever health care they pass. I think that could be a death knell for many candidates. But Tammy is especially vulnerable, since making healthcare affordable for all Americans has been her calling card for as long as I can remember.
Then we have knuckledraggers showing up at public meetins packing guns. What the hell??? are these people insane?
Cute SEIU poster
Kinda ot but a cute photo of the lean SEIU Healthcare members
wv- goursici: gorging results in goursici syndrome
I've never seen such political desperation as this woman. She is embarrassing whether the emotion is real or contrived. It's either sad or insulting.
The Democrats have complete numerical control of the government, yet they continue to use basically partisan attacks as arguments. This should show people 2 things: the weakness of their ideology and their low opinion of the people.
The next 14 months should be interesting. How will they get the votes of people after insulting them. There is gonna be some exotic hoop jumping and ass kissing, or they will just continue to be arrogant fools going down in flames. I got my ticket.
Hd house... Pelossi reminds me more and more of that final scene in the movie Cool Hand Luke. The Pelossi-like character keeps saying "What we have here is a failure to communicate." The Paul Newman character just was not afraid to say truth to power because he did not fear the Bossman enough, to the point that the other Chain Gang slaves were being emboldened to acts of resistance. Today we expect to live out our lives in a place where a free citizen can negotiate within a private property and civil liberties context as our unalienable right endowed by God. But that is seen as a Failure to Communicate by our Neo-Chain Gang Masters, who want us, for our own good, to live again under the old style Bosses that have ruled all men from creation until Americans began an experimental government in Philadelphia in 1787. So what Pelossi does not like it. She has too much Mafioso thinking relying on ChiTown muscle in her approach.
But wait ... there has been violence ...
oh wait. It's all been perpetrated by Democrats who like Obamacare.
Nevermind.
What's really worse is that the violence in San Fran during the Moscone murder was ... wait for it ... carried out by raging mobs of homosexuals.
The rest of the city sat and watched from their windows in shock.
Unbelievable.
How much of my paycheck should I be allowed to keep?
Suggested Republican slogan for 2010: "If you like the paycheck you have now you may keep it."
Speaker Pelosi's comments were lame, and out of line.
Someone above complained about "knuckledraggers" showing up at protests with guns. Some points:
a) I seem to recall video that showed one of those folks was a supporter of the health-care proposals; I also seem to recall video (perhaps same or different protester, I don't remember now) very carefully edited to omit the man's race--and then MSNBC proceeded to lament nasty white people packing guns at rallies!
b) If there were any actual problems because of any of those knuckledraggers carrying guns, I missed those reports. Can anyone please post them?
c) The cases of actual violence that happened at these town halls involved supporters of the President's proposals--in fact, union activists. I know, I know: it's shocking to hear of union operatives involved in any sort of violence, who ever heard of any such thing?
Back to Madam Speaker. When I saw her comments, I am sorry but I laughed out loud. It was so ludicrous. This is of a piece with her smearing protesters with the "Nazi" link and labeled them "unamerican."
And to preempt the defense of Pelosi's "Nazi" remark: That any protesters used the Nazi connection wisely or not, in their own signs is irrelevant, because there is no question such instances are universal across the spectrum of demonstrations, and they are almost always on the fringe. And in any case, it's called free speech: I don't expect her to like being called "Nazi" any more than Bush did; but the First Amendment protects that.
My other reaction to Pelosi's weeping was to think: what's really going on is she's afraid that the rabble, the mob, is rising up against her.
And then I thought: with what contempt our rulers view us! They really do think we are a bunch of rabble, a mindless mob. They must make the decisions for us.
And I will offer a GOP example of this: did you see the report that came out a few months back, that the Bush administration--at the time of the financial meltdown last fall--made plans for "riots"? Talk about projection--it was they, our "betters," who lost their heads, while we the "rabble" kept our far better.
The Party of Government (which includes Rs and Ds) views us as sheep to be sheared and children to be cared for--and when we, knowing us to be citizens from whom they draw their power, act accordingly, they blanch and weep and fear.
Well, that's good in a lot of ways.
WV: "dentl"--a yentl who fixes teeth
I'm sorry, but this from a woman who smeared her opponents as Nazis?
A bit rich.
And, so is she.
Florida - I disagee with that, but for a moment I'll humor you long enough to ask this question:
Did it just become so, or was it financially unstable when Barack Obama was running for the nomination against Hillary on the platform of "no mandatory insurance?"
Was Obama lying then, or is he lying now?
Obama lied, Bush lied, both Clintons lied, Tio O'Neill lied, the Gingrich Republicans lied, Teddy lied, Hastert lied...and more importantly, every American is lying to themselves and in denial if they think the whole fake edifice of a deluxe healthcare system with no cost restraints is sustainable in the future without massive, painful changes.
Who has told the truth about Free Trade, Globalism, the unsustainability of charging Americans 20 dollars in taxes to pay for Granny'ss 100 dollars worth of medicine, healthcare, free hover-rounds while eliminating Granny's "death tax"???
Only people not bought and co-opted by America's Ruling Elites.
Certain analysts that noted a day of reckoning was coming 30 years ago.
Certain gadfly politicians NOT on the pad to billionaire Jewish and Gentile Owner classes & financiers of Wall street or DC lobbyists...the Perots, the Ron Pauls. Who the Ruling Elites let alone because they were gadflies who would never win telling the truth that the likes of Bush, Reagan, the Clintons, Tom Delay, Obama, his Pritzker & Crown Family mentors, Bill Frist, etc. , all obscured..
Not sure why the last person to comment remains in this nation since he or she knows that just about every member of congress is very very wealthy and that the "ruling elites" probably include anyone with a college degree. But that said: the comments here seem asinine.
Pelosi, recalling the murder of someone she knew and cared for got teary. Is that a political thing that needs snide remarks? You weep when you think of your dead and then we too will laugh, ok?
It was exactly this sort of dumb venom spewed here that she was warning against, but the "ruling elites" here unable to figure that out.
@garage mahal
Wow. You're in perfect form today.
Happens to the best of Hoosier. Even tough Republicans like John Boehner and Glenn Beck cry all the time. Both Bush I and II have broken down in public. Mitt Romney.
Point of order...Beck isn't a Republican. Nice try.
One problem is Blue Cross Democrats who are on the take from the same companies who don't want reform. But you're right, they should just ram this mofo home with 51 votes and tell Repubs to suck it.
I take it you meant Blue Dog Democrats.
Strike two.
Besides...your original point was pwnd as fast as you made it. He's gone back on at least four things he campaigned on...that's just off the top of my head. If I really did a little checking, something you don't seem to want to do based on the above, I could probably whittle out a few more.
No, Blue Cross Democrats is the new term that liberals use to describe those in the Democratic party who they believe are "on the take" from insurance companies.
Here
Who has told the truth about Free Trade, Globalism, the unsustainability of charging Americans 20 dollars in taxes to pay for Granny'ss 100 dollars worth of medicine, healthcare, free hover-rounds while eliminating Granny's "death tax"???
Free Trade? This week Obama announced tariffs on Chinese tires, in violation of WTO rules. He's not a free-trader. He's a protectionist.
It is not unsustainable for the federal government to give us what we pay for with our payroll tax dollars. If it is, then Obama is certainly within his power to recommend the abolition of Medicare.
We would have TRILLIONS available for health care if we weren't instead spending billions of bogus corrupt dollars every year going to ACORN, buying car companies, paying $7 million salaries to AIG, giving Citicorp employees $100 million bonuses, giving billions to John Murtha's corrupt enterprises, studying the mating habits of fruit flies, funding bogus global warming science, etc. etc. etc.
Barack Obama has made his priorities clear. How many operations could have been paid for with the $100 billion dollars given to corrupt unions at GM?
As usual garage changes the subject. He didn't address Pelosi's crying or incitement against conservatives. But that's all part of Alinsky's Rules for Radicals.
wv: nazinef - Nazis who play nef ball
Ah...I'll rescind strike two then. I didn't realize we had a new pejorative term for Democrats coined by Democrats.
Is that just kinda new or bleeding edge new?
Regardless, the two things that piss me off the most about this, being a very happy user of an HSA, is that under this scheme I will be FORCED (coerced, made to do against my will, etc) to have insurance and that money I'm currently setting aside for my own health care will be taxed.
Someone please explain to me how the Democrats, supposedly the party of personal liberty and "looking out for the little guy" banks all of its most important policy issues on coercion.
Milton Freidman was right.
It was exactly this sort of dumb venom spewed here that she was warning against, but the "ruling elites" here unable to figure that out.
I guess some people just don't take kindly to being warned against publishing their unpopular opinions. Terribly rude of them, isn't it? And dangerous! There ought to be a law!
Someone please explain to me how the Democrats, supposedly the party of personal liberty and "looking out for the little guy" banks all of its most important policy issues on coercion.
I don't think you can ever really call them the party of personal liberty, except when that liberty interest was the owning of chattel slaves. To the extent that they really had a liberty interest, it seemed to be primarily in rejecting the federal government intruding into their quasi-segregated treatment of Blacks.
But it is also the party of socialism, the New Deal, Great Society, and now ObamaCare, etc. All of which are directly counter to liberty.
Under Obama's proposals the insurance companies would make out like bandits as healthy people are forced into the highest-cost plans. Who are those Blue Cross Democrats again?
Liberty as defined by liberals"
1- The ability to get an abortion.
2- Plus, if you a minor, you have the liberty to get an abortion without telling your parents!
3- You have the liberty to send your kids to crappy schools controlled by labor union members. If you live in a big city, this is almost guaranteed. Heh.
4- You have the liberty to give more and more of your earnings to the state! [I am not sure if this truly counts as a liberty].
"Suggested Republican slogan for 2010: "If you like the paycheck you have now you may keep it.""
Oh!
Totes, Ann. Totes.
And did you see the way she was shamelessly pointing her titties at the camera?
Unacceptable.
The Democratic Party is the party of power; namely, they want it and will do anything to get it. What they promise to do is just a means to getting power.
There is no difference between the Democratic or Republican party in this regard, except that in the immediate past, the Democratic Party has been more successful at getting the American Public to buy what they're selling.
The problem for political parties, however, is that buyers can have remorse and change minds.
It's my party and I'll cry if I want to
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsYJyVEUaC4&feature=fvw
The interesting thing about Althouse used to be the stuff she would raise that wasn't the usual partisan back and forth. But now, besides the fact that she leaves the comments open and there is a little tiny bit of ideological diversity here, I don't have to come here. I can either listen to Rush directly, or go to Powerline, etc. I mean, "I hate Pelosi" is not the most interesting thing in the world to hear from conservatives...
By the way, why do conservatives hate Nancy Pelosi so much? Is it because you also hate her constituents? San Francisco? She's the highest ranking female member of government ever, is she not? Is that the problem?
What's wrong with San Francisco? It's pretty, nice restaurants, laid back...
I mean, Tom Delay was an actual criminal. Pelosi has a pretty spotless record.
Who has told the truth about Free Trade, Globalism, the unsustainability of charging Americans 20 dollars in taxes to pay for Granny'ss 100 dollars worth of medicine, healthcare, free hover-rounds while eliminating Granny's "death tax"???
Sad but true.
Congress people take our cash and credit cards and then look really awsome by buying drinks for the house with our money.
And we keep voting for them because we forget the drinks aren't free.
And once you reach the tipping point where over 50% of the people in the bar can keep drinking without ever having to pay anything...
....well, then it's all rapidly downhill from there.
" Darcy said...
garage makes a good point. Obama is just doing what he said he'd do. "
This post isn't criticizing Obama's support for the government healthcare takeover. It's criticizing Pelosi's position that disagreeing with Obama is dangerous and tantamount to inciting violence. Garage is completely off point and should be embarassed.
By the way, why do conservatives hate Nancy Pelosi so much?
I hate the policies that she tries to push on the rest of us. I could give two shits about her personally other than she's a typical fake politician.
@MM
What's so bad about SF?
Well, what comes to mind right off the bat are things like, oh, I dunno, sanctuary city policy even in the face of murderous illegals, official voting ballots written in Klingon, fighting to ban ROTC recruiting...
What's so bad about Polosi?
I can't say I know her personally, so I don't have an opinion there, but I've got two major beefs with her. 1) The Charlie Rangle situation...blatant political protectionism. 2) The whole apologist Catholic abortion thing. She exposed herself horribly there. Mind you, I make no attempt to find abortion immoral or awful on religious grounds...it's immoral and awful all on it's own.
Politicians that claim to be Catholics can't have it both ways. Catholicism is not a democracy.
The interesting thing about Althouse used to be the stuff she would raise that wasn't the usual partisan back and forth
Ah, I shed a tear just thinking about how Althouse used to be.
"By the way, why do conservatives hate Nancy Pelosi so much? Is it because you also hate her constituents? San Francisco? She's the highest ranking female member of government ever, is she not? Is that the problem?"
Why do you liberals hate Sarah Palin so much? Is it because you hate her constituents? Alaska? She was one of the highest female elected officials in the country was she not? It that the problem?
What is wrong with Alaska? It is a very laid back friendly place with amazing scenery.
Mortimor do you realize how stupid you come off sounding? You are tyring to be cute which makes it even worse.
John gets 2000xp for striking with his +5 Sword Of Insight.
"Garage is completely off point and should be embarassed."
LOL. Don't you know that to be an American liberal in the 21st Century, if it means anything, means to have no shame and be incapable of embarassment.
These are the same people who are unphased by ACORN's willingness to facilitate white slavery and are willing to accuse anyone who is of making war on the poor. You really can't be serious thinking anything would actually embarass someone like gargage.
LOL, AJ and Bushman.
I miss Palladian! I'm sitting here imagining how much fun his comments would have been to read here.
Mountain - so wtf do you keep coming back? To complain?
I don't go to Andrew Sullivan's site and complain in his comments section that he's not the same person he was in 2002.
Quite, Monty... the only reasons to be on Nancy Pelosi's case is if you hate gays or women with power.
It couldn't possibly be her politics.
It couldn't possibly be her little tin-pot dictator routine that her allies actually *praised* when she became speaker.
It couldn't be the blatant hypocrisy of suddenly noticing people saying bad things about a president.
No... the most likely reason is that she's from San Francisco and *nudge* *wink* you know who her constituents are *wink* *nudge*, or for a reason we can just say out loud, she's a powerful woman and you KNOW how much those Palin groupies at Althouse blog hate women.
*sigh*
You found us out, Monty.
Good on you!
"Hey John, do you know how stupid your stupid stupid face sounds? Plus you're trying to be a smarmy ass, which makes it worse. Nyah nyah nyah boo boo."
If I didn't know any better I would wonder if you were retarded. But, the reality is that stuff like your post above passes for whit and humor and the circles you run probably run in.
That is right Synova. And Morty just has a problem with people from Alaska. He just can't stand them.
Reason #1 I hate Sarah Palin:
"We believe that the best of America is in these small towns that we get to visit, and in these wonderful little pockets of what I call the real America, being here with all of you hard working very patriotic, um, very, um, pro-America areas of this great nation."
She. Can. Go. F. Herself. Thanks. Your turn.
You mean you just dislike Palin and not people from Alaska in general? Wow. Gee then perhaps other people do this amazing thing called individual judgement. And perhaps people dislike Pelosi because well, they dislike Pelosi and not because they hate her constituents.
Gee Mort, you may get out of the short bus yet.
"Are you crying? Are you crying? ARE YOU CRYING? There's no crying! THERE'S NO CRYING IN [POLITICS]!"
She. Can. Go. F. Herself. Thanks. Your turn
You're right MM. That so much worse than calling people opposing Obamacare nazis and un-American.
Garage was on topic, by the way. Althouse referenced the health care reform bill in her piece. He was reacting to her comment there, I'm sure.
Actually MM, upon further reflect of Palin's comment, I tend to agree. Particularly if you're comparing small town America to say, San Francisco.
Remember, just because Palin objects to Monty and the Get the US Out of North America wing of the Democratic Party, doesn't mean she is perfect. She does have flaws.
From Sir Walter Raleigh:
Tell men of high condition,
That manage the estate,
Their purpose is ambition;
Their practice only hate.
And if they once reply,
Then give them all the lie
I guess Palin was talking about the parts of America that will not allow the Marines to film a recruitment video or allow the USS Iowa to dock - all because they don't support the job that the military does.
I've noticed a lot of complaining about this blog's perceived bias lately. I would suggest that the problem is that she is just covering the news and it's been bad for the left lately. Don't blame the messenger. She has been hitting the left harder than the right, but that's because the right isn't doing anything.
The battles right now are between the left and the majority of the country. Considering the democrats radical agenda, it would be hard for anyone who values the country's character to be even handed right now. One side is nuts and trying to overcome the laws of economics, numbers and history, while unfairly attacking the people who disagree. The Repubs are just standing around watching with smiles.
Wasn't it in SF that the mayor claimed that we don't need a military...that all we needed as a national police force?
Wasn't it in SF that the city council decided to give homeless people card swipes for more efficient begging?
Wasn't it in SF that they tried that municipal bicycle thing? Where they had racks of bikes unlocked and free for anyone to use, just asking that they leave them in another free bicycle rack for other when they were done?
"Wasn't it in SF that the mayor claimed that we don't need a military...that all we needed as a national police force?"
Council member, I believe. I'm pretty sure it wasn't the Mayor.
MM-
You know--you're kidding right?
Waaa why do you hate Nancy?
Please like Nancy loves Republicans.
And, it's Nancy flashing back to how terrible San Fran was/is-when Democrats killed Democrats...
Great now Republicans get blamed for that somehow post-mortem.
Damn those Twinkie Pushing profiteers -Aaaaaaaaargh!
There were swastikas at health care rallies. And at anti-stimulus rallies. And at anti-war rallies! This is a staple of hotheads at protests on the left and the right. Pelosi neither lied nor called anyone a nazi. So your little dither about that is pretty unconvincing. And pretty much a ditto-head talking point, which really adds value...
I don't know, read a book or something. A steady diet of Rush can't be healthy, even if you do think he's a genius.
There is no history of political violence in this country, right? The absolute hysteria that greets every move of the administration from the reactionary wing is totally healthy and productive, right? There is no other way to register disapproval of policies besides creating a unified conspiracy theory of socialist takeover, right?
MM
You've got four examples three of which are-
Null or no to Nazi signs-
But hey! if Nancy had visions of white supremacists dancing in your head-you were pre-conditioned for that response...
And of course judging a whole group of people by four examples out of a thousand or more would be-
a sophisticated and nuanced approach, n'est ce-pas?
There were swastikas at health care rallies. And at anti-stimulus rallies. And at anti-war rallies! This is a staple of hotheads at protests on the left and the right. Pelosi neither lied nor called anyone a nazi.
Actually she did. She also called them un-American.
There is no history of political violence in this country, right?
Never said there wasn't. The problem is your poster girl is hearkening back to a time when the political violence was being perpetrated by the type of people she represents today. I mean if she's using the Milk murder as her example, it pretty much shows 1) how completely ignorant she is or 2) shows how completely ignorant she thinks the masses are. I'll leave it to you to decide which.
Pelosi certainly has her San Francisco history screwed up. But, surely no one with a brain in their head thinks it is a good idea to bring guns to political rallies.
What did Pelosi actually say, dittoheads?
"This is a staple of hotheads at protests on the left and the right. Pelosi neither lied nor called anyone a nazi."
First, you need to stop accusing people of listening to Rush Limbaugh. It just makes you look foolish and prevents anyone from taking your seriously.
Second, you need to stop lying. Pelosi said people were carrying swazstikas at these rallies. As someone pointed out above, the signs were accusing Obama of being a Nazi, not endorsing Nazism. Pelosi never mentioned this fact. She just said people were carrying them implying that they were endorseing them and were just Nazis.
Perhaps you are a rightwing troll and are just writing stupid things to discredit the left. I don't know. But you really need to put up a better effort than that. Save your sheckels and enroll at the Urkobold school of trolling.
When did she say the word nazi, dittoheads?
When did she say the word nazi, dittoheads?
Monty - ever hear the expression you attract more flies with honey then vinegar? You aren't making any friends here calling anyone you disagree with a "dittohead".
I don't know, MM. Pelosi (who is in a position to know) compared the current culture of vitriol to the frightening hate speech just before the assassinations of Milk and Moscone. She asks for help in turning the nasty, violent political rhetoric back down to 9. I don't see that she's guilty of the crime that she's been charged with, here.
"carrying swastikas and symbols like that to a town meeting on healthcare."
The implication of that statement is that they are carrying those signs because they are Nazis. Pelosi left out key facts to smear people. That is called lying.
Again Monty, your tolling skills are abysmal.
Monty - the aversion most of us have to Nancy Pelosi is that she looks like a scary monster-type thing with all that botox going on.
you KNOW how much those Palin groupies at Althouse blog hate women.
Heh.
Wasn't it in SF that they tried that municipal bicycle thing? Where they had racks of bikes unlocked and free for anyone to use, just asking that they leave them in another free bicycle rack for other when they were done?
That sounds kind of awesome, actually.
WV: a card. Not even trying! Maybe they meant acorn.
Perhaps Pelosi was referring to the times when returning US servicemen were spat upon in the streets of San Francisco. The happiness of that memory would evoke her tears.
@Shanna
Wasn't it in SF that they tried that municipal bicycle thing? Where they had racks of bikes unlocked and free for anyone to use, just asking that they leave them in another free bicycle rack for other when they were done?
That sounds kind of awesome, actually.
Well, it is awesome, if you can do it. The problem, as always with things the left wants to do, is that the plan would work in a world-as-they-want it, but fails horribly in the world-as-it-is. Recall the chocolate pudding pack dilemma. Liberal policies would probably work in a world where I can leave a Jell-O chocolate pudding pack in the fridge at work over the weekend and have it there, as unopened and full as when I put it in there, on Monday. Unfortunately, as we all know, this isn’t the case. Sadly, people (not all, but enough) will get away with what they think they can get away with. In the SF bike case, they had to shut down the program due to most of the bikes being stolen.
…as if your average ten-year-old couldn’t have told them that would be the outcome.
This is conservative America, in the eyes of Nancy, and Maureen and other elite liberals:
link from "Blazing Saddles"
(The link above is not safe for office viewing.)
@MM
"What's wrong with San Francisco? It's pretty, nice restaurants, laid back..."
Wasn't it SF that was the one place that President Obama felt comfortable enough in large group to say that we fly-overs were just bitter, grasping our Bibles and firearms?
Mont said: "When did she say the word nazi, dittoheads?"
Pelosi: "I think they are Astroturf. You be the judge … carrying swastikas and symbols like that to a town meeting on health care." (source)
Please don't bother to argue that saying "carrying swastikas and symbols like that" is not calling someone a Nazi. Because that would be silly.
Darcy:
I used to like Palladian too. But he has a lot of nerve to desert all the friends he had here.
Does he think it is easy for the rest of us to continue to show up here day after day and make comments that no one ever fawns over?
At least Palladian got regular ohhs and ahhs from the readers!
Heh.
AJ: Oooh! ;-)
Good answer! That was a test and you did well!
"Well, it is awesome, if you can do it. The problem, as always with things the left wants to do, is that the plan would work in a world-as-they-want it, but fails horribly in the world-as-it-is. Recall the chocolate pudding pack dilemma. Liberal policies would probably work in a world where I can leave a Jell-O chocolate pudding pack in the fridge at work over the weekend and have it there, as unopened and full as when I put it in there, on Monday."
Well... it depends on where you work. I'm sure there are some places that your food is safe. I think that a chocolate pudding pack would be safe in the fridge where my husband works now. Of course, they provide snacks, too, so there's always something to take. Generally, no one touches other people's food.
He *used* to work for Lucasfilm at Skywalker Ranch. They had free-use bicycles and I never heard that they went missing. They also had completely inadequate parking so that employees had to park two deep all the time. If you blocked someone in you just left your keys in your beemer so they could move your car if they had to leave. Simple!
But it was a "know everyone" sort of place with a gate and guard and cameras tucked into little turrets on the hillsides among the llamas and Longhorns in case any crazed fanboys or girls managed to sneak in.
It's not like anyone would get away with stealing a car even if they wanted to trade their job for some grand theft auto.
I watched Pelosi do that and thought, it's a set-up. We're being set up.
It was hard to justify a missile defense system perched on Russias Western Border as being all about stopping "Evildoer Terrahist" types 3,000 Km away.
In the first place, Poland isn't “perched on Russia's Western Border” — except in the sense that the tiny Kaliningrad enclave (part of the former German East Prussia, and only about half again the size of Los Angeles County in California) is Russian territory. Poland does not border on Russia proper; the entirely of Belarus, an independent nation about the size of Romania or Minnesota lies in between; it's like saying that Serbia lies perched on Ukraine's border, or Iowa lies perched on Manitoba's border, which just ain't so.
Secondly, the missile defense system in Poland was placed 3,000 km from Iran because that's an appropriate location for intercepting intercontinental missiles during their mid-flight phase.
Lastly, one must note that these are wholly defensive not offensive missiles. Their whole purpose is to shoot down somebody else's attack, and as such they're incapable of directly harming or threatening anyone. Thus, the only reason for Russia to be upset about them is if Russia a) actually intended to attack Europe or America with nuclear weapons, or b) they wished to intimidate our nations with the threat of doing so, i.e,, via nuclear brinksmanship a la the cold war. Nice folks the present Russian regime.
@Synova
He *used* to work for Lucasfilm at Skywalker Ranch. They had free-use bicycles and I never heard that they went missing.
...then he's in some way responsible for the cinematic raping of my youth with the abominations that were Star Wars I, II, and III. Off with his head (lol)
Honestly, though, the rest of the workaday world isn't Skywalker Ranch.
As I opined in another thread yesterday and commenters above restated the Moscone and Milk murders were not political assassinations but murders by a colleague, a Democrat.
However upon thinking about the SF Bay Area and violence in the 70's; perhaps Pelosi is referring to the climate of fear created by this group of armed disrupters.
Perhaps the political assassination by this group of religious nuts?
No?
Then this is all I got.
WV: villies - vot Pelosi's face gives me.
"Honestly, though, the rest of the workaday world isn't Skywalker Ranch."
I know. :-)
I wasn't actually disputing with anyone. The fact is that a whole lot that would be *nice* and even works some times in some places doesn't work at all applied to everyone. Community bicycles is certainly one of them.
BJM-
Your first instinct yesterday looks to be on target.
A top Pelosi aide later confirmed reporters' suggestions that her statement was a reference to the City Hall murder of gay rights activist Harvey Milk and Mayor George Moscone in November 1978, an earth-shattering experience for Bay Area Democrats like the speaker.
twincities.com
[Glen Thrush @ Politico]
"carrying swastikas and symbols like that to a town meeting on healthcare."
The implication of that statement is that they are carrying those signs because they are Nazis. Pelosi left out key facts to smear people. That is called lying.
Plus the people who actually did this have been revealed to have been LaRouchies.
Well, it is awesome, if you can do it. The problem, as always with things the left wants to do, is that the plan would work in a world-as-they-want it, but fails horribly in the world-as-it-is.
Well, yeah, I know. I mean, bikes get stolen all the time when they are locked down, I’m sure that the free ones would all go home with someone. Still, it’s a nice idea. It would be cool if they could really do it. (I was going to say that maybe a charitable group could try something, but the bikes would probably just all end up on ebay, so that wouldn’t work either).
Recall the chocolate pudding pack dilemma. Liberal policies would probably work in a world where I can leave a Jell-O chocolate pudding pack in the fridge at work over the weekend and have it there, as unopened and full as when I put it in there, on Monday. Unfortunately, as we all know, this isn’t the case.
It is the case at my work. It wouldn’t work if your co-workers are assholes.
It only takes one asshole acting assholishly to make everyone else not trust everyone else regarding food in the fridge. Especially if that one asshole is never caught in the act.
But you're right, they should just ram this mofo home with 51 votes and tell Repubs to suck it.
I would love it if the Dems did that. It would unite Republicans for a generation and give them an unlimited, non-expiring license to point to every flaw in the health care system from then on as the fault of the Democrats. The Dem's ability to every call for a bipartisan approach in the future when they're out of power would be ridiculed: "the party that rammed the most fundamental change in American sociey in history into law without consulting the Republicans at all NOW wants to be bipartisan?"
Not only would the Dems be tossed out, the legislation would be repealed and modified to the point that it served no real purpose anymore.
Ramming through a fundamental change would backfire because it's wrong to do that. And when you do something that's wrong, the People know that and you pay for it with a fundamental loss of legitimacy.
Which is also why it won't happen. The Dems aren't suicidal, tho the left wing of the party would be happy to force it on the 80+ percent of the population that isn't left wing. Either they compromise enough to get at least a few RINOs to sign on, or there won't be anything at all.
But you're right, they should just ram this mofo home with 51 votes and tell Repubs to suck it.
Please garage! I hope that's exactly what they do. I'm praying for it.
While at lunch, I listened to Michelle Obama talking up that it is women that are the ones in need of health care, and almost crying in a compassionate siren song. Sounds like sending all his women out crying is Obama's newest tactic. Obama is more and more reverting to Manson Tactics. Will he implode on us when he is a failure.
That in some sense, capitalism did fail, Reaganomics did fail ---and now the pendulum has swung to socialist redistributionists..who will also fail.
4. Medicare is 37 trillion in the hole, social security is 8 trillion in the hole. The Fed Gov't is now 10 trillion in the hole.
You have an odd idea of capitalism and Reaganomics if you think they directly caused #4.
Indirectly, Reagnomics made us so many of us so much richer, we thought we could afford more government giveaways. That's our fault, not capitalism's.
Bizarre.
Totally, completely bizarre.
When the leftists destroy hundreds of thousands - perhaos millions --of dollars every time there is a WTO meeting trade whatever, did she cry about them inciting violence?
So if some SEICU thugs push back and someone gets hurt it's because other side "incited" them? I.e. it isn't going to be their fault? What parallel universe do you live in? ("Mommy, he called me a name!!!!1!!!")
Geeze Louise Nancy girl (you just lost your respect robe) the Tea Party and other potestors PICKED UP their trash themselves in Washington, DC last weekend. There are some adults left in the USA.
Grow up.
wv caless
Nancy Pelosi could caless about whether she communicated responsibly.
Damnit I miss that German opera loving, single malt whiskey swillin' art guru...
And damn it he was the best guy to have in the fox hole but I sat back and let him defend Bauhuas by himself.
And, it started over a church that Jonah Goldberg probably passed judgment on-without going inside.
You really don't appreciate it until you experience it from the inside out...and up close.
St. John's
@JAL
Did we ever get a confirmed, official count of the number of arrests made at the 912 rally in DC?
Would you Republicans please stop being mean to Nancy? You made her cry. Are you happy now?
< Not a Republican.
< Doesn't hate Speaker Pelosi; don't know that I hate anyone.
< Strongly agreed with whoever it was who said that if folks crying "racism" lately have their way, it means we're now in a situation where -- if we disagree with our government, we have to prove we did it for acceptable reasons. How's that for being free citizens?
< Has zero sympathy for the "poor Nancy meant well" routine. "Poor Nancy" is big girl, and she's the Speaker of the House of Representatives, 3rd in line to the Presidency.
We have every right to expect she is and will be responsible for her words, her choice of words and her comparisons, and her omissions. When she referred to "swastikas" and so forth, she can't later say, "oh, I didn't mean..."--so please don't offer that as her defense; she's not entitled to it. (Someone noted that it was LaRouchites who carried those signs. If so--no surprise there. And someone who's been around as long as Speaker Pelosi knows full well what a LaRouchie is, and their MO. And she's not entitled to be confused on this point. It would be like claiming to get ACORN and the NRA confused. You play in the big leagues, you're supposed to know what you're talking about--and if you don't, don't utter smears.
She is entitled, however, to apologize for that smear and the "unamerican" jibe. And for choosing to associate her opponents with the violence committed in San Francisco, which had zero to do with the "right wing" and any of the current debate.
Feelings...
Nothing more than choked up feelings...
Coming to the surface, through all the Botox...
Feelings, oh woah oh, feelings...
Oh, woah, oh feelings, feelings... It's something I've lost, in my face...
Feelings, oh woah oh, feelings, oh woah oh, feelings, will I ever know you again...
fred wrote:
"Pelosi, recalling the murder of someone she knew and cared for got teary. Is that a political thing that needs snide remarks?"
Yes, it is a "political thing". When Speaker Pelosi got teary, she was in the midst of using the essentially non-political murders of Harvey Milk and George Moscone by Dan White (a Democrat and frequent political ally of Milk) in an attempt to quell free speech by painting her political opponents as being on the verge of violence.
Using the non-political deaths of people you claim to care about to score political points (and bolster your flagging popularity) by shamelessly appealing to emotion is always worthy of open mockery.
Geeze Louise Nancy girl (you just lost your respect robe) the Tea Party and other potestors PICKED UP their trash themselves in Washington, DC last weekend.
"Yeah, because WAR NUT LAHK THEM NIGGERZ."
@madwaskan 1:10 - Monty seems to have reading/comprehension issues.
Wasn't he one of the trolls claiming that the "Bury Obamacare with Kennedy" sign was inciting assassination?
It's his side that's inciting violence by inflaming the real wackos in mimicking the voices in their heads.
@ethan
The N word is not acceptable language here and we're on to your sleazy game.
Get lost, creep.
You are a pathetically talentless troll, 'Ethan'. Worse than Trademark Dave. Worse than AJD in his billion sockpuppet manifestations.
You're 34? Man, I am so embarrassed for your sake.
". I mean, bikes get stolen all the time when they are locked down, I’m sure that the free ones would all go home with someone. "
I ride my bike through Compton, CA everyday on the way to work. I'm lucky it doesn't get stolen with me on it. It's happened to others. In most places public bikes would get stolen just for the hell of it. Unfortunately, these are the same places where people would benefit most from the idea.
"Did we ever get a confirmed, official count of the number of arrests made at the 912 rally in DC?"
I'm still waiting to find out the number of shootings at the rally, what with all those gun-totin' right wingers out there. I'm figuring that there had to be at least five or ten.
Oh, and the flag burnings. Where are the statistics on the flag burnings? I can't even imagine how many flag burnings there were with a protest that big. All protests have flag burnings, don't they? Isn't that in the handbook somewhere?
wv: pries (Well, there's a government joke in there somewhere.)
"But you're right, they should just ram this mofo home with 51 votes and tell Repubs to suck it."
Please garage! I hope that's exactly what they do. I'm praying for it.
Yeah, same here. Really, garage, why do you think they haven't done that already? If the bill is as awesomely wonderful as you seem to believe, why do they even WANT Republicans on board? The more Republicans who vote against it, the more that encourages people to vote for Democrats, right?
The fact that the Democrats are desperate for a fig leaf of "bipartisanship" should tell you that they know the bill is a stinker.
What's with Ethan? Is there a brain frying virus going through the left community?
Arrests: I cannot find any record that there were any arrests at the September 12 Tea Party in DC. To the contrary I followed a link to the claim that there were NO arrests. I understand that is very unusual if not unprecendented.
And if Ethan or other with the same mindset haven't seen the pictures of the mall in front of the Capitol after the 9/12 protest and the pictures after the Obama inauguration, I suggest google. It's a search program available on most home computers.
Adults take responsibility for themselves.
There is no there there yet. There is no bill. It's several different ones. Revised on the run. You can't ram something through that isn't there.
No rational person would agree to something -- a legal contract -- without knowing what it was and being able to examine it. Question it. Evaluate its application, implication, risks versus benefits.
"Transparency" is the biggest biggest LIE this administration has foisted on the American people who have employed them.
For all of those who haven't noticed, the President Lied.
My sister lived in Arcata, CA (isn't someone on here from Eureka?) where Humboldt State is. Neat little town.
They had bikes painted the same color (green?) which were here and there around the town for whoever needed one. Don't know if it still in on going. The area (Eureka, Arcata, McKinleyville) is a bit isolated on the far northern coast of CA, so more likely to work in that environment.
Further to the racism charge, listen to this conversation between talkshow host Dennis Prager and an Obama supporter. It provides a clear example of what Thomas Sowell describes as "Stage One" thinking.
Yet besides this caller, Maureen Dowd, Jimmy Carter, and other "intellectuals" purport to believe the same thing.
Come on liberals. It's not whites that Obama's going to sell out. It's taxpayers. Stop confusing which component of the white upper middle class establishment he's dismantling.
Nancy Pelosi reminds me of the mother in the Terry Gilliam movie, Brazil.
You MUST look at this picture.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/95/237415302_aad5a61437.jpg
wv reemer
heh heh
heh heh heh
Lame is perfectly descriptive of this Speaker of the House.
Another "Free Public Bikes" real-world socialist policy failure:
They tried "free public bikes" in Hermosa Beach, CA some years back.
Hermosa is a liberal, tightly packed bedroom enclave (read: party town) that eschews icky things like bourgeois manufacturing and real industry. Lots of liquor stores and bikini shops. The city survives on parking tickets, mostly. And garages converted to bootleg apartments and rented to dudes as playhouses for the summer.
Anyway, they placed a bunch of brightly colored bikes in racks around the city some years back, secure in the knowledge that the goodness of man would allow them to move freely for all from one location to another within the city for the good of all.
And, like all thing socialist, when the public "owns" the bike, the "public" surely will take care of it and repair it. Not.
All the bikes disappeared or were broken.
The same will happen to "free" healthcare.
Poor little insane Soros sock puppet. I remember the cases in San Francisco, San Francisco Mayor George Moscone and Harvey Milk. Nancy must have forgotten that it was an insane Democrat that killed them!
So, is Nancy saying she is going to be involved in political violence? So far it has been the far left DEMOCRATS in the form of SEIU, American Communist Party, ACORN and assorted DNC nuts that have been responsible for any violence.
I would have a lot more sympathy if someone like Russ Feingold were saying this. Also, I have read that when Moscone and Milk were shot it was Diane Feinstein who actually dealt with the angry crowds. Pelosi, as usual, is a hypocrite.
wv: suphonet, the sophisticated way of surfing the net
...and we tend to regard Barack Obama as a well-meaning person.
Who's "we"? And why haven't "we" been paying attention for the last 3 years?
But otherwise I agree. Where are Nancy Pelosi's tears for Kenneth Gladney or the guy who got his finger bitten off by an ObamaCare supporter? Does she really think nobody remembers that the political violence she's exploiting has been conducted, then and now, by the left?
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