January 8, 2009

Sarah Palin: "Is it political? Is it sexism? What is it that drives someone to believe the worst and perpetuate the worst ... gossip and lies?"

Reflecting on the way she was treated by old and new media:



ADDED QUOTE: "The grizzly rises up in me, hearin' things like that."

AND: I'm told she says "The mama grizzly rises up in me, hearin' things like that." I'll take your word for it, rather than listen again. I also see, from Gawker, that the filmmaker, the interviewer in the clip, is John Ziegler, who was the radio talk-show guy that David Foster Wallace wrote about in "Host."

You can read the DFW. Excerpt:
John Ziegler, who is a talk-radio host of unflagging industry, broad general knowledge, mordant wit, and extreme conviction, makes a particular specialty of media criticism. One object of his disgust and contempt in the churn so far has been the U.S. networks' spineless, patronizing decision not to air the Berg videotape and thus to deny Americans "a true and accurate view of the barbarity, the utter depravity, of these people." Even more outrageous, to Mr. Z., is the mainstream media's lack of outrage about Berg's taped murder versus all that same media's hand-wringing and invective over the recent photos of alleged prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib prison, which he views as a clear indication of the deluded, blame-America-first mentality of the U.S. press. It is an associated contrast between Americans' mortified response to the Abu Ghraib photos and reports of the Arab world's phlegmatic reaction to the Berg video that leads to his churn's climax, which is that we are plainly, unambiguously better than the Arab world...

Depending on one's politics, sensitivities, and tastes in argumentation, it is not hard to think of objections to John Ziegler's climactic claim, or at least of some urgent requests for clarification. Like: Exactly what and whom does "the Arab world" refer to? And why are a few editorials and man-on-the-street interviews sufficient to represent the attitude and character of a whole diverse region? And why is al-Jazeera's showing of the Berg video so awful if Mr. Z. has just castigated the U.S. networks for not showing it? Plus, of course, what is "better" supposed to mean here? More moral? More diffident about our immorality? Is it not, in our own history, pretty easy to name some Berg-level atrocities committed by U.S. nationals, or agencies, or even governments, and approved by much of our populace? Or perhaps this: Leaving aside whether John Ziegler's assertions are true or coherent, is it even remotely helpful or productive to make huge, sweeping claims about some other region's/culture's inferiority to us? What possible effect can such remarks have except to incite hatred? Aren't they sort of irresponsible?

155 comments:

Simon said...

Good stuff. One realizes that she has to address broader concerns as time goes by, but it's also the case, I think, that the various lies, distortions and smears in the record from this election be set straight.

AlphaLiberal said...

Sarah can dish it out but she can't take it. Her reputation is based on her own record.

Ya gotta love how this wealthy woman complain about "class discrimination."


Palin in 2012!

ricpic said...

Despite all you have to go on believing that decency will prevail in America.

Michael said...

She just can't believe these crazy "rumors" and how unfair they are.

You know, things like being a Muslim or not being born in Hawaii and being part of a secret terrorist cell...stuff like that.

She was unqualified to be the V.P. pick, and she knows it, too.

Just like the American voters knew it.

And John McCain knows it.

chickenlittle said...

Not finished listening yet, but I noticed that John Ziegler put this together. He used to follow tweedle dee and tweedle dum on AM KFI radio and was always worth listening to.

AllenS said...

My hope for this country is when AlphaLiberal, Michael and others are running this country.

How does the Althouse woman think about the interview?

AlphaLiberal said...

Despite all you have to go on believing that decency will prevail in America.

Uhh.... decency did prevail.

Palin was an unrepentant liar (Bridge to Nowhere) and now she's posing for Victim of the Year. ("Poor me!")

Please, run her again!

Michael said...

"My hope for this country is when AlphaLiberal, Michael and others are running this country."

We are.

Obama won.

JAL said...

I think the quote is actually "The mama grizzly rises up in me...."

--- which for an Alaskan is even a more powerful picture.

JAL said...

Why does AL call her "wealthy?"

AlphaLiberal said...

Because, Sarah Palin is wealthy. At least by working (non-Republican) standards.

AlphaLiberal said...

Here you go. Because I back up my allegations. From the Washington (Moonie) Times:
"Palins' finances unusual for Alaskans."

Queue right wing insults.. and 1, 2...

Synova said...

Sure Alpha... no one treated her children as "fair game".

It's all a delusion.

And it's not at all about "class" when someone thinks that "Trailer" and "Trash" would be good "T" names, or jokes are made about pick-up trucks on the White House lawn or the ever-so-dreadful "hoochi-hoop-gate."

You don't have to like her to admit the truth that her children were savaged and that a whole lot of the criticisms of her were based on social class.

You don't have to think that those things were determining factors, but it takes a whole lot of Kool-Aid to pretend they weren't *there*.

Simon said...

AlphaLiberal said...
"Uhh.... decency did prevail."

Ridiculous statement, given that Obama and Biden won. We may have been on the losing side; still not convinced it was the wrong side. This is going to be a long 1400 days, but I think we'll survive. Some of the mistakes your boy's going to visit on us will be irrevocable, but what can be fixed will be.

Simon said...

JAL said...
"Why does AL call her 'wealthy?'"

Because they're successful, under their own steam, and Alpha can't handle that.

Michael said...

Palin also whines about how Caroline Kennedy will be treated better because of the ""class bias" distinction drawn between herself and Kennedy.

Than again, why not take a minute to compare their resumes:

Palin attended 5 colleges, has a degree in communications, won the Miss Wasilla Pageant, finished third in the 1984 Miss Alaska pageantmedia, was the mayor of a city with about 10,000 people and a Governor for less than two years.

Kennedy on the other hand:

Graduated from Concord Academy, received her A.B. from Radcliffe College at Harvard University . She also earned a J.D. from Columbia Law School in 1988, graduating in the top ten percent of her class.

She is an attorney, writer, editor and serves on the boards of numerous non-profit organizations.
She is a member of the New York and Washington, D.C. bar associations.

She's worked as director of the Office of Strategic Partnerships for the the New York City Department of Education where she helped raise more than $65 million for the city’s public schools.

She serves as one of two vice chairs of the board of directors of The Fund for Public Schools, a public-private partnership.

She is currently president of the Kennedy Library Foundation and is an adviser to the Harvard Institute of Politics.

She is also a member of the boards of directors of the Commission on Presidential Debates and the NAACP Legal Defense and Educational Fund.
(Wikipedia)

I'd say there was a massive intellectual, performance, accomplishment and class difference between the two..so what's the beef?

Michael said...

Simon, So you think Sarah is just a really good saver?

That's how she threw together her current financial situation?

Read much?

knox said...

Well, alpha, it's the people on your side who are constantly denigrating her in terms charged with class discrimination. How many times has she and her family been referred to as ignorant rubes, white trash, inbred, etc. etc.

So, don't ask me why they call her that... if she's actually "wealthy."

1jpb said...

But can folks see England from NY?

Michael H said...

I don't know what drives some people to reflexively hate Sarah Palin. She doesn't deserve it.

I suspect that those on the fringe left, the Kos Kids types that have unformed beliefs, can live comfortably with the inherent contradictions that come with demanding equality for women while hating a woman whose beliefs are different than theirs.

I think too that there is a vicious adolescent hatred of Palin because she doesn't fit into the stereotypical mold of an east-coast educated woman.

What is most telling, I think, is the torrent of hatred for Plain based on Palin having a family and a job. I don't get this - women are told that they can 'have it all', and when one quite visibly does, she is met with endless hatred form those who told her it's okay to have both. Interesting how liberals want to destroy her because she has a family.

The hatred for Palin stems from her being pro-life. Democrats are small-tent, very small tent.

Last, the left is populated with foul-mouthed misogynists. Whey they are tolerated in the PC wing is beyond knowing. Listening to them is not unlike listening to Palestinians screaming for Israelis to be sent to the ovens.

Synova said...

Wow Alpha! The GOVERNOR of ALASKA has a higher income than the average in her home town. And a nice house too!

And an airplane... not at *all* common in Alaska. Sure proof of outrageous elitism.

I suppose all those years of one week on and one week off working on the North Slope was just a vacation for Todd. Good thing they were wealthy and he didn't have to do that. Silly people thinking that a couple working for 20 or more years to get where they are might identify with "working class."

Oh the HORROR!

knox said...

Yes, Michael, a resume worthy of Obama himself!

TreeJoe said...

I'm amazed no one has brought up Biden in the comments so far.

Everything I've seen to date (including past histories, "resumes", activities done in office, etc.) indicate to me that Sarah Palin was better suited to be Vice President than Joe Biden.

That's damning with faint praise, but nonetheless....we have Joe Biden as our Vice President.

1jpb said...

Are folks competing for a hyperbole award?

Doesn't the first person who links their opposition to Nazi's lose?

Simon said...

Michael H said...
"I don't know what drives some people to reflexively hate Sarah Palin."

They have very small penises and feel the need to take it out on someone.

Simon said...

1jpb said...
"Doesn't the first person who links their opposition to Nazi's lose?"

Only by a common misstatement of Godwin's law.

Synova said...

Michael... when you get poetic about the accomplishments of someone born to wealth, with access to all the very best, most prestigious schools, legacy admissions and all the *very* best networking and recommendations... someone famous the very day she was born... you sound positively glowing.

I don't mind Caroline, and figured she couldn't be dumb, but it seems she can sound like a duffus in an interview every bit as much as the child of school teachers who went to five different state schools on scholarships she earned herself.

But you don't even hear yourself, do you.

Michael H said...

Are folks competing for a hyperbole award?

Doesn't the first person who links their opposition to Nazi's lose?


Please re-read my comment. I did not link those to oppose Sarah Palin to Nazis.

Simon said...

TreeJoe said...
"I'm amazed no one has brought up Biden in the comments so far. Everything I've seen to date (including past histories, "resumes", activities done in office, etc.) indicate to me that Sarah Palin was better suited to be Vice President than Joe Biden."

Absolutely - indeed, Palin was better-qualified to the Presidency than was Obama, which made the constant, vacuous claim that she was unqualified so patently absurd. Anyone who voted for Obama and actually bought the "inexperienced" claim against Palin - which wasn't all of them, to be sure - is presumptively too stupid to engage in debate with. I'd fire anyone who worked for me who thought that.

Kirby Olson said...

Had she been a Democrat, she would have been lauded for her bootstrap functionality, and ballyhooed from coast to coast as the best and the brightest, the next Al Franken.

If Obama had been a Republican we would have heard about 57 states all day and all night, with every comedian calling him an idiot, and suggesting that he have a brain transplant.

It wasn't sexism.

It was just political expediency.

author, etc. said...

Look, she was a risky pick chosen solely to jumpstart McCain's then moribund campaign, and in the short term it worked. She had plenty of shortcomings and I've no doubt that he was fully aware of them.

I just wish that, rather than pathetically cram for her Gibson/Couric exams, she'd come out and said, Look, I'm the governor of a state and I ain't about to apologize for not knowing every bleeping detail about world and national affairs. I've had other business on my plate, thank you, and I'll gather my facts and articulate my positions in due time.

And hey, anyone who thinks Joe Biden has anything brainwise over Palin other than mere time in office is mistaking hair plugs and capped teeth for the wonders of permanent youth.

chickenlittle said...

Michael H said: I don't know what drives some people to reflexively hate Sarah Palin.

Envy

AlphaLiberal said...

Queue right wing insults.. and 1, 2...

Ha-ha. That's funny. You guys immediately followed up with insults, as you always do!

At least Synova had some kind of substance, unlike Simon.

Synova, I didn't hear about the stuff you cite, have no idea who said it and suspect it came from marginal people.

Contrast that with the smears against Obama from the Republican Presidential campaign, like making him look like a child molester or Sarah Palin questioning his love of country.

See, I try to adopt standards for others, that I (and my allies) have to live by, too!

For Republicans, they have one standard for them and a whole different standard for their opponents. "Bear false witness" against Democrats? No problem!*

* (Oh, and Republicans want to put the Ten Commandments up all over the place, even though they don't follow them!)

knox said...

Last, the left is populated with foul-mouthed misogynists. Whey they are tolerated in the PC wing is beyond knowing.

Synova, I used to wonder this kind of thing myself.

Eventually, I came to understand that Political Correctness was not created to help create respect for minority groups. It was merely fashioned to demonize and thereby silence any opposition to the left.

(A great example is the Althouse thread about Milk, from back in Dec. I just read it for the first time today. There are sexist and even gay insults slung at Pogo and Freeman Hunt--from those on the left. All they really want is compliance or silence.)

1jpb said...

I agree with the folks who say Palin was great, but the media (and wicked libs) tricked folks into thinking otherwise.

Palin 2012!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Does anyone have the Palin calendar yet?

AlphaLiberal said...

For the 1,000th time:
"Hate" does not equal "criticize."

How many times has she and her family been referred to as ignorant rubes, white trash, inbred, etc. etc.

From what I heard, very seldom or not at all. Maybe you travel in different circles.

But, please! Put her back up there!

(BTW, I'm adamantly opposed to Caroline K getting the appointment. I think if she wants it she should run for it and have to talk to all the little people. But, I don't hate her).

Simon said...

1jpb said...
"Palin 2012!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Gets my vote.

"Does anyone have the Palin calendar yet?"

I don't know if it's healthy for me to be fanning the flames.

Minzo said...

"Everything I've seen to date (including past histories, "resumes", activities done in office, etc.) indicate to me that Sarah Palin was better suited to be Vice President than Joe Biden."

Would this be the same Sarah Palin who used her proximity to Russia as some sort of asset to her credentials? The one who identified certain states as 'the real America'? The one who gave those car-crash interviews? I dont hate Palin at all- I admire what she's achieved and yes she was immensely charming- but she was a terrible choice for VP. Biden was a bad choice too, but still a better one.

Michael H said...

All they really want is compliance or silence

It's the Democrat Dhimmitude.

Simon said...

AlphaLiberal said...
"For the 1,000th time:
'Hate' does not equal 'criticize.'
"

That's right - you and yours hated her and refused to limit yourself to good-faith criticism. It's nothing inherent to liberalism, so I'm assuming it's because you - the leftosphere, that is - are gutter trash first and liberals second. I know a few liberals who are embarassed by the way you people behaved towards Palin.

Simon said...

Minzo said...
"Biden was a bad choice too, but still a better one [tjhan Palin]."

How many minutes executive experience did Biden and Obama have between them?

nathan said...

Sarah said nothing ever in her speeches when running that would indicate she has substance of any kind. She did not even know the role of the VP, the job she was trying for.
Can you beat that for incompetent?

1jpb said...

Gets my vote.

So, I'm going on a limb by guessing that's a net zero change.

Not sure there were a lot of BHO voters who would have voted R if only Palin was at the top of the ticket.

I'd love to test the theory in four years.

Simon said...

Alpha:
"Contrast that with the smears against Obama from the Republican Presidential campaign, like ... questioning his love of country."

I have no doubt that he loves a country - just not this one. He obviously doesn't love this country: he wants to change it. Weren't you paying attention?

Michael said...

"How many times has she and her family been referred to as ignorant rubes, white trash, inbred, etc. etc."

We ARE talking about the Palin family, right?

john said...

This argument is getting so stale. I admit I have contributed little to moving the Palin discussion forward, but really, no one else here has much new to say either.

That said, I think Palin would do better if she stayed out of these kinds of interviews and documentaries, friendly or not. As much lashing out as she could rightfully do regarding her abysmal treatment, she shouldn't appear to be wallowing in the injustice but should try to stay above it. Living well is her best revenge.

nathan said...

Simon:

Abe Lincoln had much less experience than Biden and/or Obama, but he sort of worked out ok.

Simon said...

nathan said...
"She did not even know the role of the VP, the job she was trying for."

In repeating that vacious canard, you reveal yourself to be either lying or brain dead. Since you managed to type a comment, I'm assuming you're a liar.

1jpb said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Simon said...

nathan said...
"Abe Lincoln had much less experience than Biden and/or Obama, but he sort of worked out ok."

Experience doesn't trump all - but experienced and right trumps inexperienced and wrong every time.

Michael said...

Simon - "I have no doubt that he loves a country - just not this one."

You try to represent yourself as some kind of semi-intellectual, then say something like this.

When you do, you lose all credibility, it makes you look small...and you sound exactly Michael Savage or Rush Limbaugh or Sean Hannity.

It's an ignorant thing to say about our new President and I think you're an arrogant asshole for saying it.

Michael said...

John - "I think Palin would do better if she stayed out of these kinds of interviews and documentaries, friendly or not. As much lashing out as she could rightfully do regarding her abysmal treatment, she shouldn't appear to be wallowing in the injustice but should try to stay above it. Living well is her best revenge."

Finally, something worth reading.

1jpb said...

I, for one, must have been too distracted to come up with imaginary BHO expressions because I heard him explicitly say that he loved this country.

Though I did hear Rush say BHO "hates America." Rots the brain, that guy.

Gary said...

As I watch her I sense that deep inside she holds back the two words that she really wants to say to her attackers (which I and others wish she would do).

I will continue to support her because I catch glimpses of what Americans used to be like before diversity and egos and "feelings" got in the way. Before we lauded intellect over heart, book and media sense over common sense.

God, how I love those two words on their own or paired, Common. Sense.

Oh and those two words she should say to Katie, Keith, Chris and their ilk?...

"Eat shit."

AlphaLiberal said...

Simon, spewing insults and falsehoods again?
In repeating that vacious canard, ....

Sarah Palin:
“As for that VP talk all the time, I’ll tell you, I still can’t answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the VP does every day? I’m used to being very productive and working real hard in an administration. We want to make sure that that VP slot would be a fruitful type of position, especially for Alaskans and for the things that we’re trying to accomplish up here for the rest of the U.S., before I can even start addressing that question.”

From Politico.

I guess we're not supposed to believe her words.

1jpb said...

Gary,

Bush can't run for a third term. But, I can see how you've found a new savior with the same qualities.

jdeeripper said...

ADDED QUOTE: "The grizzly rises up in me, hearin' things like that."

Sarah said "The MOMMA grizzly rises up in me, hearin' things like that."

A very dangerous animal.

Michael said..."My hope for this country is when AlphaLiberal, Michael and others are running this country."

We are. Obama won.


And yet you guys are STILL pissed off.

Where's the joy? When is the bitterness and spite in you guys going to dry up?

AlphaLiberal said...Ya gotta love how this wealthy woman complain about "class discrimination."

If Todd and Sarah Palin are wealthy it's because they earned it.

Sarah was born into a middle class family of no special status. Her parents were public school teachers and she worked to pay her way through college.

The hostility to Sarah Palin was/is rooted in a kind of intra White race racism.

The Good White People were/are spewing their hatred toward the Palins and all the Bad White People who supported them.

Obama came to America as a gift, an historic black savior come to redeem America of it's Original Sin.

Sarah Palin and "her kind of people" are that sin.

And that's why they are hated.

Minzo said...

"I have no doubt that he loves a country - just not this one. He obviously doesn't love this country: he wants to change it. Weren't you paying attention?"

That's pretty much scrapping the barrel. Are you saying any politician advocating change hates America? New policies become some form of treason? Seriously...

Michael H said...

A note to Alpha and Michael:

Earlier in this thread I said: Last, the left is populated with foul-mouthed misogynists....I think [..] that there is a vicious adolescent hatred of Palin..

Thank you both for illustrating both points.

Crimso said...

"being part of a secret terrorist cell"

"like making him look like a child molester"

I call bullshit.

Michael said...

Gary - "I will continue to support her because I catch glimpses of what Americans used to be like before diversity and egos and "feelings" got in the way. Before we lauded intellect over heart, book and media sense over common sense."

And you wonder why McCain and Palin got smoked?

"...intellect over heart, book and media sense over common sense..."

God knows we certainly wouldn't want someone with an intellect or who might read books running the country.

Especially considering what we've seen (and are left with) over the past 8 years from the "common sense" type we've had running the show.

campy said...

Michael said..."My hope for this country is when AlphaLiberal, Michael and others are running this country."

We are. Obama won.

And yet you guys are STILL pissed off.


I think all the righties here at the Althouse need to rend their cybergarments and pretend to be inconsolable at the ascension of The One. That's what Lucky and Alphie are looking for.

Minzo said...

jdeeripper- is your post tongue in cheek? Black saviour? original sin? As I said earlier, I dont hate Palin at all- infact I admire her in many ways- but I think the hatred of her is a lot more complex than your 'self-loathing-black-saviour-original sin' mumbo jumbo. Its the same way that people hate Obama for different reasons- you cant come out and speak for that entire group and assume they all hate him for the same reason.

Hunter McDaniel said...

As much as I like Sarah, I don't think this kind of interview does her any good. Even though I agree with almost everything she says, it still comes across as whiny.

I much prefer the Sarah we saw in that interview Ann posted many months ago (before the McCain selection), when she was talking about the sexism Hillary had to deal with it. But maybe it's a lot harder when you yourself are the target.

Eli Blake said...

rumors:

Let's see here:

Bill Clinton was brainwashed in Moscow.

Bill Clinton was working with a drug smuggling ring that was flying cocaine into Mina, Arkansas.

Bill Clinton has a plan to confiscate every gun in the country.

Bill Clinton was involved with the orders to shoot Randy Weaver's wife at Ruby Ridge (even though this happened before Clinton was President.)

Bill Clinton has special forces and U.N. troops already occupying strategic locations inside the U.S. to facilitate a takeover, before he leaves office.

Bill Clinton and Janet Reno ordered the destruction of Waco, and set the fire themselves to establish the principle that they could, and to send a message to 'Patriots.'

The Oklahoma City bombing was an inside job perpetrated by the Clinton administration so they could pass the 1995 anti-terrorism bill, and also to get rid of physical evidence from Waco, which was being stored in the Murrah building.

Bill and Hillary had Vince Foster murdered and made it look like a suicide.

Not to mention how many other people they once knew who have since died. Jim McDougall was murdered in prison with a poison that mimicked a heart attack, to prevent him from telling the special prosecutor everything he knew about the Clintons.

Bill Clinton is trying to make everyone get a national I.D. card so he can keep tabs on them. (this one is especially ironic given that Bush actually did try to do that.)

Bill Clinton signed a secret provision in NAFTA which will get rid of national borders and establish a 'North American Union' (another that is ironic considering how far the Bush administration has expanded NAFTA.)

Bill and Hillary Clinton are using secret spy powers and resources to compile secret dossiers on millions of Americans.

Bill Clinton and the Israeli secret service are running a secret prison, either in Israel or on some windswept island, where 'American Patriots' are kidnapped and sent to (also ironic, given the concept of 'extraordinary rendition' developed during the Bush administration.)

Bill Clinton has a plan to hold Americans without charges indefinitely (again, ironic given the Padilla case.)

Bill Clinton attacked Osama bin Laden eleven days after the African Embassy bombings just so he could take a headline away from the Monica scandal. Sen. Dan Coats (R-Ind) even called publically on Clinton to resign for attacking bin Laden.

Bill Clinton cooked intelligence to suggest that the Kosovar Serbs were engaged in genocide and then went to war there to distract attention from the Monica scandal, and for no other reason (yet another that is now to be viewed with a touch of irony.)

These are just a select few of the unfounded rumors I remember hearing during the Clinton administration (and that's without even getting to the things that were true, but then blown way out of proportion, such as trying to impeach the President of the United States for lying about sex.)

Yup, ridiculous and malicious rumors, Palin does have a point there. But it didn't originate with her. And if Hillary had won the election-- hoo boy, the rumor mill would be spinning so fast it would come off its foundations.

Michael said...

Campy "And yet you guys are STILL pissed off."

Based on what?

The fact that I find it rather unfair and silly that many here will not afford Obama the opportunity to at least be sworn in before slamming each and everything he says or does?

We've seen what Bush can do...why not wait for the man to be President before ushering in all of the bullshit we read here?

All I read here is the same right wing batshit I've been reading for the past two years.

And that why YOU lost and WE won.

Michael H said...

The Palin hatred seems to demand destruction of her family by any means necessary. Children are not out-of-bounds.

Her soon to be son-in-law, Levi Johnston, headed to the North Slope to earn money to support himself, Bristol and their new baby. Johnston worked hard, did a good job, and is one course away from receiving his GED. He was offered an apprenticeship, and accepted the offer.

The Anchorage Daily News had a reporter dig into the details, and found that the apprenticeship program requires a high school diploma. Levi lost the apprenticeship.

The Anchorage Daily News didn't run an article about all applicants for the apprenticeship program and their levels of education; it looked only at Levi Johnston. It singled out one kid and fucked with him because he will be part of Sarah Palin's family.

Article.

Michael said...

Did many here teach Palin how to whine or was it vice-versa?

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!

We lost and we just can't accept it.

Like a bunch of little children.

Crimso said...

Hey Eli, you forgot the one about Clinton engaging in rendition...

Crimso said...

And the one about Obama wanting to talk with Hamas. Oh, wait...

AlphaLiberal said...

In Sarah's own words:

"I'm very, very pleased to be cleared of any legal wrongdoing ... any hint of any kind of unethical activity there. Very pleased to be cleared of any of that." --Sarah Palin, after an Alaska legislative report found she had broken the state's ethics law and abused her power in the Troopergate scandal, conference call with Alaska reporters, Oct. 12, 2008

Palin in 2012!

Eli Blake said...

Crimso:

I did include it.

As I said, it is ironic how many of these were rumors that had the far right up in arms during the Clinton administration, but then when Bush actually did some of those things they just laid down and purred.

Even more ironic given that all the expanded government powers that the Bush administration put in place will now be handed over to Obama (just as how it is ironic that the initial assault on Waco carried out by ATF agents with no warning or identification was actually legal, because of 'war on drugs' legislation passed during the Reagan administration. They got (or 'arranged' to get) a tip that there were drugs in the compound, and immediately that expanded what they could do and how they could do it.

Before people get excited about expanded government powers, just keep in mind that Presidents come and Presidents go, and it is virtually certain that sooner or later someone will be elected President who you don't trust. Think about it.

AlphaLiberal said...

My favorite was:

a) "Obama is a closet Muslim".
b) Obama's (Christian) pastor is anti-American.

They held those two thoughts in their heads at the same time!

Crimso said...

Hey AL, I called bullshit at 5:39. Cite or retract.

Patm said...

I'm so-so on Palin, but I wonder why so many people feel the need to not the dropped g's in quoting her. I heard Caroline Kennedy dropping her g's and never saw it written out. I've heard Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton drop their g's - frequently, esp on the campaign trail - and it was never noted. But with Palin, anytime I see her quoted, even here, the dropped g's are noted.

I suspect there is something class-oriented in that. She's too much the commoner for our people of letters?

garage mahal said...

The Oklahoma City bombing was an inside job perpetrated by the Clinton administration so they could pass the 1995 anti-terrorism bill, and also to get rid of physical evidence from Waco, which was being stored in the Murrah building.

This was always one my personal favorites. The birth pang of the Truther Movement, if you will. The Clinton Body Count was another good one. Republicans talked about Vince Foster "suicide" on the Senate floor. Waco. Right wing militias. Ruby Ridge. The Clinton One World Order. Black helicopters. Good times!

Crimso said...

"I did include it."

Are you claiming that the Clinton Admin didn't engage in rendition?

Simon said...

1jpb said...
"I, for one, must have been too distracted to come up with imaginary BHO expressions because I heard him explicitly say that he loved this country."

There are plenty of books that will explain revealed preference to yoou far more comprehensively and eloquently than I can.

Alpha, you know full well that the quote you and similarly brain-dead anti-Palin types reiterate endlessly is a distortion. Unless you're really admitting that you're too stupid to understand what a rhetorical question is, or too lazy to have watched the original clip, you have no honest basis for spreading that misrepresentation.

Minzo said...
"Are you saying any politician advocating change hates America? New policies become some form of treason?"

He didn't say new policies, he said change. He made it quite clear that the change he had in mind was not tweaks or minor changes in policy, but rather a fundamental changing of America. There is a vsat gulf between what Obama advocated and the sort of "change" advocated by Gingrich and the "reform" advocated by Palin.

"I dont hate Palin at all ... but I think the hatred of her is a lot more complex than ..."

I don't think the hatred of her is complex in the slightest.

campy said...
"I think all the righties here at the Althouse need to rend their cybergarments and pretend to be inconsolable at the ascension of The One."

Oh, I won't need to pretend. I am planning to be at the bottom of a bottle on inauguration day.

Patm said...

Ya gotta love how this wealthy woman complain about "class discrimination."

You are mistaken. It's not about wealth, it's about where she went to school, what neighborhood she came from. Palin is came up middle-class and has maintained middle class values. Anathema to the elite, or elite wannabees. And the leftist snobs.

AlphaLiberal said...

Uh, The Anchorage Daily News is a newspaper. And, Levi Johnston is not a child, he's grown up. And, if they're pulling strings to financially aid their family and friends (which she has a well-established track record of doing) then that's a public concern.

Did you think it was terribly unfair, too, that Palin Administration stopped drug trafficking charges from being pressed against Levi's mom until after the election?

I guess in Republican eyes any unflattering coverage of Republicans is cause for mega-whining and playing the victim.

Crimso said...

"Before people get excited about expanded government powers, just keep in mind that Presidents come and Presidents go, and it is virtually certain that sooner or later someone will be elected President who you don't trust. Think about it."

Agreed.

Crimso said...

"Uh, The Anchorage Daily News is a newspaper. And, Levi Johnston is not a child, he's grown up. And, if they're pulling strings to financially aid their family and friends (which she has a well-established track record of doing) then that's a public concern."

Then we all wait with bated breath for some enterprising Chicago reporter to look into Michelle's job.

Eli Blake said...

In other words, Crimso:

If you got upset when you heard the rendition rumor during the Clinton administration, now that Bush has done it, Obama could in fact carry out rendition against you (remember the Padilla case-- he was an American citizen and was held without charges) and the legal underpinning would already be there for him to do it, courtesy of George W. Bush. When something has been done and accepted once, it is much easier to do it again.

Presidents come and Presidents go.

But expanded government powers stay forever. And could therefore be abused, forever.

Patm said...

Caroline Kennedy's "impressive resume" and "massive intellectual, performance, accomplishment and class difference between the two.." are all the product of her last name.

If her name had been you know Marianne Johnson, daughter of two you know school teachers, it's very likely that she would never have attended those ummm, you know elite schools, so easily had her books published (Jackie Kennedy's favorite poems!)you know, and been invited to um, you know, sit on all those um, you know boards.

Palin, daughter of two school teachers is the governor of a state and an expert on energy and the snobs are so small and narrow that they cannot be generous enough to give her her due.

Snobs. It is what it is. Rank snobbery, and nothing else.

Simon said...

Hunter McDaniel said...
"As much as I like Sarah, I don't think this kind of interview does her any good. Even though I agree with almost everything she says, it still comes across as whiny."

I understand, and in ordinary circumstances I might agree. Nevertheless, here's the problem with that. It's like Scalia's answer for why he's doing more TV interviews these days: you're going to be on TV whether you want to or not, you're going to be quoted (and misquoted) whether you like it or not. That being so, better to be there on your own terms. Likewise with Sarah: these vicious, vacuous smears are going to be there whether she rebuts them or not. As Alpha demonstrated by his repetition of the smear that she didn't know what the veep does, these idiots are going to keep spewing their nonsense no matter what. If you do interviews that rebut the smears you'll be accused of being a whiner; if you don't rebut the smears, you'll be accused of having no answer to them. That being so, you might as well do the interviews; no matter what happens you'll be criticized, but at least then you'll be out there and you'll have rebuffed the smears. You won't convince the anti-Palin zealots, everyone, but you might convince the sane people.

Bruce Hayden said...

This was always one my personal favorites. The birth pang of the Truther Movement, if you will. The Clinton Body Count was another good one. Republicans talked about Vince Foster "suicide" on the Senate floor. Waco. Right wing militias. Ruby Ridge. The Clinton One World Order. Black helicopters. Good times!

Waco and Ruby Ridge are problematic gross over uses of force sanctioned by the Clinton Administration. But Bill or Hillary? No - their only culpability was in putting Janet Reno at Justice. The rest are likely scandal mongering.

Patm said...

"Would this be the same Sarah Palin who used her proximity to Russia as some sort of asset to her credentials?"

God, is that tired and played out.

I don't hate Obama for saying he hadn't visited "all 57 states" yet.

Eli Blake said...

OK. You answered it, I was writing that post as you were posting your answer.

It just irks me when some people switch back and forth from supporting civil liberties to supporting expanded powers of Government, depending on which party is in power. If it's a good idea, then it's always a good idea, and the reverse as well.

HelenParr said...

In other news of defeated Republican Vice Presidential candidates: Bob Dole is still retired and drawing a decent pension and Jack Kemp is diagnosed with cancer. (Reported on ESPN of all places!)

Trooper York said...

A post about Sarah Palin never fails to pump up the number of comments to record numbers.

And the number of stupid comments to hall of fame numbers.

I think it is kind of lazy in a way.

It is amazing how the lefties can't let go. They won the election but that is not enough. Any minute now hdhouse will rise out of his puddle of piss to denounce Palin and make fun of her accent and Loafing Oaf will insist that we examine her pussy.

It is a new administration. You guys should be enjoying yourselves. Don’t you have anything positive to say about you guy? You will never have a better time to do it because he is a blank slate.

Just remember you are playing defense now.

Eli Blake said...

Bruce:

Ruby Ridge is one of my favorite 'Clinton conspiracies,' since (as I mentioned in my first post) it actually happened in 1992 when Clinton was merely a candidate running against an incumbent President. But these folks still always say, 'Ruby Ridge' when they bring up Clinton (and living in the rural west, I've met my share of them.) Little details like 'he wasn't President then' don't matter. Bring it up and you'll get a 'he still had something to do with it' kind of response.

Patm said...

:::And that why YOU lost and WE won.:::

Now if you all could just grow out of the schoolyard mentality of "us good them bad" and grow up, we might get somewhere.

Eli Blake said...

In other news of defeated Republican Vice Presidential candidates

Poor Bob Dole. He still doesn't get any respect.

jdeeripper said...

AND: I'm told she says "The mama grizzly rises up in me, hearin' things like that." I'll take your word for it, rather than listen again.

The line can be found at 4:30 in the clip.

Bruce Hayden said...

My theory about Gov. Palin is that the left hates her because of what she could potentially do to their base. She is charismatic and has strong blue collar roots.

In the last election, Biden claimed blue collar roots through his upbringing in Scranton, but doesn't dress or act the part anymore. Neither Obama nor McCain has anything approaching the common touch. Palin's husband works for a union, etc.

The reason that she is dangerous is that she has the potential to reform the political configuration of the two parties, and in particular, steal some of the core Democratic constituents away, notably blue collar and Roman Catholic. Obama picked up a lot of traditionally Republican votes this time, and that is fine with the liberal MSM and the net nuts. But the countervailing trend is not.

Bruce Hayden said...

I stand corrected. At Ruby Ridge, Weaver's wife was killed August 22, 1992, which was towards the end of GHWB's Administration, and not during WJC's.

1jpb said...

"that tired and played out."

No it isn't.

I would love to find out if this was part of the talking points from the McCain folks. Cindy, Sarah, and a spokesperson all used this line, is that a coincidence?

Regardless of whether it was a coincidence or not; what in the world made those folks think this was a good line to repeat?????????

Does anyone know why they repeated this? Assuming folks couldn't predict the weakness of this line of sight argument. After it was rolled out and ridiculed the first time, wouldn't they decide to cut their losses? But, no folks kept on using that Russia line.

This is intriguing.

P.S.

Who set the budget for clothes and makeup? Or, if there was no budget who spent huge bucks on these things. Was it the same folks who came up with the Russia line?

The internal dynamics of the McCain campaign seem interesting. Though not as interesting as the FU yelling matches of the HRC campaign.

Beth said...

It is amazing how the lefties can't let go.

That's funny. Palin is STILL giving interviews about the campaign, channeling her inner grizzly, but somehow it's the left that "can't let go." It would be easier, if she'd just climb down off the cross.

Simon almost gets it right: she does, indeed, need to address broader concerns. She ought to do so the very next time she appears in any form of media. If she doesn't let go of this campaign, then there's no reason to take her seriously in the future.

Simon said...

Trooper York said...
"Loafing Oaf will insist that we examine her pussy."

/volunteers/

Bruce Hayden said...

My thoughts on why Clinton is charged with Ruby Ridge, when it was under his predecessor's watch is that it was somewhat similar to Waco in its gross overuse of force resulting in what many would consider murder on the part of the feds. And Waco was clearly under Clinton's watch, since we have such vivid memories of Janet Reno being stampeded into giving the assault order in order to protect the children (who, of course, all ended up dying as a result). The two seemed to be similar incidents, and the second was clearly under Clinton's watch.

Simon said...

1jpb said...
"Who set the budget for clothes and makeup?"

It wasn't Sarah, and that's all that's relevant for most purposes.

"The internal dynamics of the McCain campaign seem interesting."

Indeed. There are several people who should "never work in this town again," so to speak; it would be useful to find out who.

Beth said:
"Simon almost gets it right: [Palin] does, indeed, need to address broader concerns. She ought to do so the very next time she appears in any form of media. If she doesn't let go of this campaign, then there's no reason to take her seriously in the future."

That's not entirely fair. She answers the questions she's asked. Would you prefer that she do the move that makes most normal people want to introduce politicians to the sharp side of a fillet knife: ignoring the question and talking about whatever she wants to talk about? It's not that she can't let go, it's that there are things that were said during that campaign that deserve to be addressed but which couldn't be addressed before the election.

My view is that she should address the questions of what she believes in a format and on terms of her choosing; I would prefer a book, but I'm a reader so that's to be expected. A series of speeches would be fine too. In the meantime, though, I think she should answer the questions she's asked, so long as the questions are in good faith and aren't absurd.

Mark said...

I think all the righties here at the Althouse need to rend their cybergarments and pretend to be inconsolable at the ascension of The One. That's what Lucky and Alphie are looking for.

I am one rightie who is rubbing my hands and grinning in anticipation of the Obama administration. I mean, a month before the guy is even inaugurated he's already got several scandals going! I don't recall that happening in the 40 years I've been paying attention to politics. I'm still waiting to hear the Obama camp explanation of Blago's comments that they wouldn't bargain. That means he talked to someone about a bargain, which means someone knew he was trying to make a bargain and didn't notify the authorities. And don't tell me that Obama didn't know. His subordinates are not going to make those kinds of decisions on their own.

I predict that the Obama administration is going to be one of the most colossally disappointing in history. Which shouldn't be a surprise considering how high an opinion he has of himself and how much groundless adoration his followers have shown him.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

We've seen what Bush can do...why not wait for the man to be President before ushering in all of the bullshit we read here

Nah.

We should give Obama the same treatment Bush got. I say take all the "O"s off of the keyboards. It's a hell of a lot harder to type a letter without "O"s than without the "W"s.

Beth said...

She answers the questions she's asked. Would you prefer that she do the move that makes most normal people want to introduce politicians to the sharp side of a fillet knife: ignoring the question and talking about whatever she wants to talk about?

I'll look into that and get back to ya, Simon.

Seriously, at this point she can control the dialogue. If someone asks her for an interview, she can set terms. She can say she's not interested in rehashing the campaign, but she's available to talk about x, y and z - those broader concerns you allude to. She's stuck on the campaign because she wants to be, not because she's being subjected to questions against her will. If she continues to do that, she's toast.

chickenlittle said...

Beth said: That's funny. Palin is STILL giving interviews about the campaign, channeling her inner grizzly, but somehow it's the left that "can't let go." It would be easier, if she'd just climb down off the cross.

First, I don't think she initiated this interview. In my view, much of what happened, specifically wrt the media, deserves airing. And I'm glad Ziegler is doing this.
Second, much of what you might think of as "not letting go" is exactly the future media scenario that she will likely face down the road, should she choose to have a political future on the national stage.
Third, people hate her for reasons that go well beyond one election cycle; I suspect it does have something to do with the cross.

Mark said...

Things I don't like about Sarah Palin: I don't think she's articulate enough for the political big leagues. It may just be that she needs more practice but you only get one first impression and the impression of her is that she's out of her depth on national and international topics.

I also don't care for her talk about getting the government more involved (i.e. spending more) with handicapped children. And I think her daughter's out of wedlock pregnancy sets a bad example, especially when she behaves as though it is fine.

What I like about her: she seems to have gumption. I admire someone who says "I want to change things, so I'm going to run for city council", and then mayor, and then governor. Good for her.

But what I like most is that she is the first politician I can remember offhand who really seemed like a traditional, real, old-fashioned American. All of the various attributes we all know - hunter, beauty pageant contestant, state college graduate, the way she talks, her lifestyle. She is an American in the ways that distinguish America from Europe: independent, in favor of small government, standing on your own two feet, insisting on the right to self-defense, Christian, and so on.

The people of the left who despise her are not really Americans. They are Europeans who happen to live here by an accident of birth. They want to change America into another European country: indifferent if not openly hostile to Christianity, admiring of elitism, in favor of large nanny-state government, appeasing towards civilizational threats. So Palin was right when she implied certain people weren't really American. They're only technically American, while their hearts are thoroughly European.

1jpb said...

FYI:

The 'W' keyboard story was proven to be untrue.

Gary said...

Bravo Mark.

Beth said...

So Palin was right when she implied certain people weren't really American. They're only technically American, while their hearts are thoroughly European.

I'd say "fuck you" in French, but I only know it in English.

It's deeply satisfying to have seen the kind of self-righteousness, holier-than-thouness, I'm more American than you-ness you espouse rejected by American voters.

Gary said...

I apologize for the bravo to Mark.

I learned quickly that you need to check a commenter's profile and blog to see where they are coming from.

My sincerest regrets.

Alex said...

Does Althouse even have the ability IP ban trolls?

Zachary Paul Sire said...

So, she's still whining about how she came off as a total moron in her interviews. Too bad, so sad.

People like her (and the majority of you here) think these hissy fits about the "liberal media elite" will get you somewhere, but you're beating a dead horse. No one cares. You lost.

Hey, people in the media are liberal. So what. Now go find a candidate who's not an idiot and who is savvy enough to deal with them.

Mark said...

Does Althouse even have the ability IP ban trolls?

Excuse me, but my comment was not trolling. I was not name-calling. I think it is a legitimate point: people of the Left yearn to make America more like Europe. I challenge you to name one cherished policy of the Left that hasn't already been implemented in Europe. In that sense, people of the Left are "Americans" in terms of geography and citizenship but not in terms of their outlook. They tend to have contempt for what has been traditional America: Christian, self-reliant, small government, right of self-defense, etc.

That's not trolling. That's just a fact. If people like Beth take it as an insult, that's her choice.

And Gary: grow a pair. If I'd posted as an anonymous commenter you would have agreed with my comment, but because you disagree with other things I've written (what, exactly?) you can't agree with it? Way to cave in to p.c.!

Simon said...

CAP front "Think Progress" says that in the same interview, Palin "saw the photo of one of the film’s targets, Keith Olbermann, [ ] literally let out a shriek and, pointing to his photograph, declared, 'THAT guy is EVIL!'” Speaking of people who ought to be on the sharp end of a fillet knife...

Simon said...

Zachary Paul Sire said...
"Hey, people in the media are liberal. So what."

Then they should be honest about it, and drop the fraudulent pretense that they are anything but a house journal for the Democratic party. It's the dishonesty - the self-delusion that some of these morons entertain that they're actually unbiased, and the duplicity of those who actually realize they aren't - that gets people's goat. It's a fraud, and the only thing that makes me sad about the prospect - widely reported - of the NYT going belly up later this year, throwing legions of journalists out onto the streets, is that it won't be until winter is over.

john said...

Mark - re your comment of 7:10, you forgot one other thing to like about Sarah Palin: her ability to give a straight-faced interview while a truckload of turkeys was getting off'ed in back of her.

Gotta love her for that.

Beth - you have been spot on tonight, generally, except for your lapses into french. I think you are right that she needs to move beyond the election if she wants to move upward. It's so 2008.

Michael H said...

I really wanted to change the line of comments to something apolitical so we can end the evening with an upbeat tone.

All I could think of was boobs and pussy. But we already have that.

Ralph said...

I thought once the election was over we wouldn't have to have these food fights anymore.

I happen to be a Democrat who thinks the media's treatment of Sarah Palin was a disgrace and reflected much worse on them than on Palin. Quite frankly, I really wish a lot of my fellow Democrats didn't act the same way.

To me, Palin is a middle-class person who determinedly made her way through college (while it's unusual, you don't go to that many schools if you don't really want to finish), unseated the ridiculously corrupt GOP establishment in Alaska, and has governed Alaska in a responsible, successful, moderate-conservative fashion. If every Republican was like her (instead of say, Tom DeLay or Ted Stevens), this country would be a lot better off.

You can be a Democrat and still admire some Republicans, while disagreeing with their policies. Political differences don't neccesarily mean moral failings. If the primaries and the general election campaign taught me nothing else, it's that this immediate, reflexive extreme criticism of anybody and anything on the opposite side is tiresome and played out. No more calling people unpatriotic because they oppose the Iraq War. No more calling people racist because they think that four years of being an absentee senator doesn't make you a president. Enough already.

john said...

Michael H - how about excitable Andy receiving his mail order package of "temple garments"? I understand he was very disappointed that the Catholics had nothing special for lounge wear, and was continuing his spiritual search.

Michael H said...

john - Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?

john said...

Gee Ralph, very well put. After 3-4 Christmas parties in which I was the only conservative (who would admit to being one), I wish there had been one Democrat, besides my wife, who would have spoken up the way you just wrote.

I'm partied out and learning to drink alone.

Michael H - it's only a bjoke about Andrew Sullivan's fixation with that strange and foreign religion practiced in Utah.

James said...

Mark -

You're right, if you had simply posted anonymously, people like Gary might be fooled into agreeing with you. As it is, however, you allowed people to see what you really mean when you talk about "America" and what you want America to become - kicking out anyone who is not at least 75% "European," kicking out anyone who chooses to marry any non-white person or non-citizen.

You are bat-shit crazy, and if people like Gary knew what you meant when you typed in "America," they would never have agreed with it.

William said...

I read part of David Foster Wallace's criticism of Ziegler. It is true that Ziegler is more a polemicist than a font of reasoned, balanced judgement. The same, of course, is also true of Al Franken and his ill fated career on Air America. Al Franken is now a United States Senator. What are the chances of The Atlantic hiring a good writer to subject Al Franken's simple minded views to reasoned analysis.....Here's my argument with media bias. There are issues like the differences between the economics of Keynes and Friedman that I am not qualified to pass judgement on. But where the govt places the accent mark on these differences will soon have a profound effect on my life. I don't think most journalists--or for that matter most congressmen--have a deep understanding of these differences. I am pretty sure that the Democrats and the media will take the side of Keynes. Perhaps they are right, and I hope they are. But one thing's for sure: we will not hear the other side of the argument.

Michael H said...

john - got it, thanks!

TitusIAmSixteengoingonSeventeen said...

Oklahoma or Florida?

TitusIAmSixteengoingonSeventeen said...

I just pinched an evening loaf.

i don't generally have evening loaves.

john said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
john said...

Titus, the beaches are better in Florida, but if you can get a cheaper flight to OK, I'd say that's fine too.

Cedarford said...

Minzo - Would this be the same Sarah Palin who used her proximity to Russia as some sort of asset to her credentials? The one who identified certain states as 'the real America'? The one who gave those car-crash interviews? I dont hate Palin at all- I admire what she's achieved and yes she was immensely charming- but she was a terrible choice for VP. Biden was a bad choice too, but still a better one.

I'm not sure. Biden has proven himself a consistent idiot over 38 years. Palin only proved herself a poorly informed idiot adept at reading lines and looking photogenic...over the course of only 3 months. Palin has the possibility of improving past the present coterie of Right wing conservatives that view her as a Goddess. Biden does not have any real potential for getting better than he is.

Nathan - nathan said...
Simon:

Abe Lincoln had much less experience than Biden and/or Obama, but he sort of worked out ok.


Not really true. Lincoln was that rare breed of lawyer (James Baker III, Avner Mikva are two other exemplars) known as a high-level "Fixer", a consigliere used by all sides to help hash out differences. For around 10 years, Lincoln was involved in the effort to reconcile the Midwest legislatures, governors, and private railroads, shipping, road cartage, and banks in creating a modern economic infrastructure. 6 in Leadership. Effectively, Lincoln was functioning before becoming President not as the "small country lawyer" but as a Chief Legal Officer in 2 railroad firms and one of the highest paid attorneys (of the honest ones at least) west of NYC.

I also agree with the Obama supporters on one thing - The President elect proved himself an excellent executive leader in running his Presidential campaign. During the campaign, perhaps it shouldn't have been counted as an "experience" credential, but now that the election is over, it should be. He ran a contest as good as Nixon did in 1972, Reagan in 1984, and both of Clinton's campaigns.

Contrasted with the weekly disasters of John McCain's mismanaged effort and Hillary executive leadership seeing her campaign imploding until she finally found her stride at the very end...unfortunately for the Hillary! Goddess -when Obama had all the delegates he needed basically in the bag.

****************

hdhouse said...

Simon said...
"I think, that the various lies, distortions and smears in the record from this election be set straight."

Which lies, smears and distortions do you refer to?

Why oh Simon do you insist on kissing up to her? Is this a crusade for the glories of mediocrity?

TitusIAmSixteengoingonSeventeen said...

I meant Florida or Oklahoma in the BSC Football Championships.

I hope to God you didn't think I was weighing which to vacation in.

As if either would be an option.

TitusIAmSixteengoingonSeventeen said...

As far as Palin she is a car crash.

Could whining and get back to work.

Not attractive.

I would still fuck her though.

john said...

I think on one night last week Utah would have kicked either of their butts. Probalby only on that one night, tho.

OK by 10.

john said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
john said...

Not Attractive???? WTF

You need to go back and finish wiping your butt.

Stephanie said...

The focus and title of the Ziegler documentary is "Media Malpractice."

So what topics do you think she should be answering in this interview? And what answers to the questions do you expect to get?

"The media are the most wonderful truthful and kindhearted folks I've ever come across?" I don't think so....

Simon said...

hdhouse said...
"[Simon said, 'I think, that the various lies, distortions and smears in the record from this election be set straight.'] Which lies, smears and distortions do you refer to?"

We'll be here all night if we try to list them all, so let's start with the one that Alpha vomited up earlier: the lie that Palin "admitted" that she didn't know what the veep's job consisted of, a lie buttressed by a willful distortion of a quote in which she posed a rhetorical question, complete with a carefully clipped youtube video designed to hide the context and thus the obviously rhetorical nature of the question. The dishonorable liars responsible for that and a bunch of comparable smears are beneath contempt. They're very lucky that we no longer live in a civilized age when human detritus such as they would have been dealt with appropriately.

"Why oh Simon do you insist on kissing up to her?"

Because I think she's terrific.

paul a'barge said...

is it even remotely helpful or productive to make huge, sweeping claims about some other region's/culture's inferiority to us? What possible effect can such remarks have except to incite hatred? Aren't they sort of irresponsible?

wait.

You're talking about cultures that kidnap and behead people who worship a religion different from their own and cut the clitorises off their daughters?

Dude. Are you really that morally clueless? If so, well then, rot in hell.

john said...

Of course I meant Florida by 10.

Synova said...

Of course, the present answer to what the VP does is a very comforting, "Not a dang thing."

Biden got a puppy and will retire, effectively doing nothing but staying in the wings in case Obama dies.

The answer to Sarah Palin's rhetorical question was that the VP is involved in energy policy and the promotion of programs to help special needs children.

The honest answer is that a person can't say what the job of VP consists of without knowing what *that particular president* wants the VP to do.

chickenlittle said...

Of course, the present answer to what the VP does is a very comforting, "Not a dang thing."
.
.
The honest answer is that a person can't say what the job of VP consists of without knowing what *that particular president* wants the VP to do.


As much as I loathe Cheney-loathing, Bush & Cheney did condition us to think that the VP could do more than ever before. Good or bad, perhaps that experiment can come to an end for a time.

Synova said...

I'll accept that Cheney pushed the limits. I'd argue that it's not proven that he passed over them, but not unreasonable to think he did.

LoafingOaf said...

I still can't get over how the Republican base creams over Sarah Palin even though she didn't know jack squat about anything. And all because she looked sexy with a gun and didn't abort a Downs Syndrom baby.

It's one of the most shocking things I've ever seen in American politics.

Palin is still whining about the Katie Couric interview? What exactly was unfair about that interview? Palin's just mad cuz she exposed herself as a pathetically unqualified candidate.

LoafingOaf said...

If anyone feels sorry for Sarah Palin, just remember that she was calling Obama a pal of terrorists after she exposed herself as a know-nothing candidate. Disgusting. The GOP has pretty much lost me. They can be the party of the igoramous from Alaska and Joe the Plumber if they want, but they're not gonna win many elections with that.

LoafingOaf said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
LoafingOaf said...

*ignoramus

LoafingOaf said...

To these Michelle Malkins and Laura Ingrahams of the GOP, I have heard your shit enough. You called me a RINO. Guess what? I ain't voting for the GOP any time soon. This RINO is gone. That's what you wanted, that's what you get. Enjoy your stupid political party as it goes down the drain.

TitusIAmSixteengoingonSeventeen said...

I meant her whining was not attractive.

Hello, I said I would fuck her.

The most important reason we like her is because she is attractive.

She's hot and I bet her pussy smells real good. I want to taste and feel and ram her pussy.

I also want to feel her tits. Her tits are real nice.

Hoosier Daddy said...

The GOP has pretty much lost me.

I would argue that's not a loss.

Shanna said...

The 'W' keyboard story was proven to be untrue.

I don’t remember the details anymore, but I was in DC at the time and knew people who went over to the white house who at least confirmed that the Clinton folks left a hell of a mess.

Bruce Hayden said...

The 'W' keyboard story was proven to be untrue.

Is this statement really credible? It essentially assumes proof of a negative, and my guess is that it was originally claimed by someone who wanted the story to be disproved.

Remember, proving that the story was untrue in one instance, in one office, does little, if anything, to disprove it in others.

Unless someone is willing to prove that they visited all of the possible offices between the time they were vacated and when the Bush people arrived, found no keyboards with missing "W"s, and would be considered unbiased, I am going to assume that this alleged disproof is wishful thinking.

Synova said...

If anyone feels sorry for Sarah Palin, just remember that she was calling Obama a pal of terrorists...

Palin attacks Obama for his association with Ayers, and... what... that makes it okay to investigate and report and slander her CHILDREN?

MTfromCC said...

1. There is a huge difference between qualifying for US Senate, and qualifying for Vice President (which means you must qualify to be President from Day One). Sarah Palin clearly was qualified to be the US Senator from Alaska -- and just as clearly unqualified to be President. Caroline Kennedy is easily qualified to be a US Senator. And she is just as clearly unqualified to be President. That Sarah Palin does not understand that distinction herself is another example of why she was unqualified.

2. Obama just won a resoundingly successful campaign for President, an executive accomplishment in and of itself. His transition has been impressively pragmatic and very much what he promised in terms of transcending politics as usual. Anybody who says otherwise is clearly biased.

3. Biden may or may not be qualified to be President, but he has a lifetime of interest and exposure to national and international affairs and public service, and was a well-vetted public figure (not all great, but known), and is a mainstream Democrat if ever there was one. Sara Palin was a woefully inexperienced 1st term governor of a remote and sparsely populated state, and small town mayor, with absolutely no interest in national or international affairs until she was selected as the VP nominee by McCain, who was poorly vetted figure who, the more we fuond out about her ethics and governmental instincts, the worse we liked her, and she was politically far to the right within her own party. She was red meat to the right wing, and scary to many of the rest of us -- well outside the mainstream of current American politics. The notion that she was in any way qualified (much less more qualified than Obama or Biden) to serve as President, and of all things from an "executive" perspective, is beyond absurd.

Thank god McCain didn't get elected. That decision proved more than any other he made -- and he made several -- that he was a risky bet.

Synova said...

2. Obama just won a resoundingly successful campaign for President, an executive accomplishment in and of itself.

So, ah... that means that if Sarah Palin wins a campaign for President that that win, itself, is sufficient executive experience for the post of President?

In the end, getting elected is the only qualification that matters, but why do I think that it would seem far less important to you, if the win went contrary to your preferences instead of confirmed them?

I hope that Obama does a good job. I see no need for panic yet. But the idea that Palin was not qualified, or, frankly, that Caroline Kennedy is *less* qualified than Obama just shows that ...anybody who says otherwise is clearly biased.

If Obama does a good job, it won't be because he was particularly qualified. A first term Senator who started running before even learning *how* to be a Senator?

Simon said...

MTfromCC, as Synova has already noted, the contention that Obama's run for the Presidency bootstrapped him into having executive experience can't be made with a straight face. It's a makeweight argument, which is why even the Obama people dropped it after the first outing.

Your point (3) is only interesting because it's so hilariously inconsistent with your point (1): Having criticized Palin because, to be veep, one "must qualify to be President from Day One," tacitly and falsely implying that she was not, you defend Biden - who really isn't ready to take over from someone who isn't ready to be there in the first place - saying that he "may or may not be qualified to be President." For all the the babbling, braying silliness of your comment, it remains the case beyond serious argument that Palin had far more experience than Obama and Biden put together. I don't fault you for failing to prove your ridiculous thesis. That would be an impossible task. I do fault you, however, and it speaks poorly of you, that you tried in the first place. At least Obama's payroll could defend themselves saying that it was their job to come up with the best they could in the circumstances; I don't hold the twinkie defense against Dan White's attorneys.

Ultimately, your post boils down to the same thing that all the anti-Palin screeds do: a loud whine that Palin is more conservative than you'd have preferred. That's a fair reason for voting against her, but an infirm foundation for the house of hatred you guys have built for her. It is no excuse for how she has been treated - the lies, distortions, and half-truths, or even for the sort of jejune silliness lurking in your comment.

Not your best comment - indeed, your dumbest contribution in nearly a year. If it doesn't ask to much, try thinking for a change, instead of rote repetition of hackneyed lefty talking points. Otherwise, take your dog and pony show back where it belongs. That slovenly intellectual laziness will make you a star in the leftosphere, but it'll earn you little other than contempt in better bred circles such as this.