What is the "extraordinary, unusual circumstance"?
Being Donald Trump? If so, she's revealing that she believes the prosecutors went after the man, not the crime, an abhorrent abuse of power.
So, whatever she thinks, she can't mean to be saying that. What else is there?
There's the classic unbelievable assurance that if you don't break the law, you've got nothing to worry about. If you're "law-abiding and rule-following," then you're not in the category with Donald Trump. Trump did something "extraordinary" and "unusual." Or did the prosecution do something "extraordinary" and "unusual"?
It's not reassuring.
The saying is commonly attributed to the Stalinist-era Soviet jurist Andrey Vyshinsky or the Soviet secret police chief Lavrentiy Beria... [There are] older similar sayings in English, such as 18th-century Scottish jurist Lord Braxfield's "Let them bring me prisoners, and I will find them law" and the Russian proverb "If there is a neck, there is a collar" (Была бы шея, а хомут найдётся; or Была бы голова, а петля найдется).... A similar quote has also been attributed to 17th-century French statesman Cardinal Richelieu ("Give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest man, I will find something in them which will hang him"). A related American saying is "A prosecutor can indict a ham sandwich." Polish writer Henryk Pająk summarized the saying in four words: "person exists, [their] crime exists" ("jest czlowiek, jest przestępstwo").
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143 comments:
Stop leaving the state, she's saying.
Forget it, Althouse. It’s Shit-For-Brains Democratland…
"If so, she's revealing that she believes the prosecutors went after the man, not the crime, an abhorrent abuse of power . . . she can't mean to be saying that."
Why not? Paging Michael Kinsley.
Come to think of it, can we still describe any slightly awkward prog propaganda as gaffes? I mean, under prog hegemony they just tell us what they think. In this case: that they can selectively persecute Trump with impunity. Message: equal justice under law is a deplorable fantasy. Believe them. (Of course, that doesn't rule out progs going after other targets with other lawfare in the future.)
I've always thought that Donald Trump was a bit of a clown. I largely still think that. So why are our rulers so hell bent on eliminating him that they are willing to throw away every last vestige of their credibility? It makes me wonder.
What she is saying is, "dear little sheep.. do not worry about the big bad wolf.. the wolf only went after Trump."
But who knows.. they may deem any rich person as bad and go after them as NYC slowly becomes Detroit...
Sweet dreams little sheep.
So the NY state tool for the totalitarian leftists is attempting to reassure multinational corporations that currently reside in NYC and NY state, that they are deliberately conducting law fare against a single individual/corporation and will never use the same strategy against any other individual/corporation?
Sure
What is the "extraordinary, unusual circumstance"?
He ran for President and won in 2016. He won again in 2020, and will win in 2024 with a clean vote. Trump didn't back down knowing he was forced to leave office via voter fraud. Trump is REALLY fighting for working class Americans.
Democrats feel they own the working class by pretending to care. Same with inner city minorities.
"Protecting democracy" now means protecting the interests of our elite global war machine. Any challenge to that is a mortal sin. It may just work and the great experiment is over. Too many soft brained stupid Americans are easily coerced via the psychological warfare being waged against our basic constitutional rights.
Most susceptible to the programming are educators, beta males, and college educated white women.
Blue states are punitive leftist hell-holes.
Trump made real estate deals and had sexual relations with women for many years prior to running for and becoming President. They have only lately become problematic. His political ambitions and successes are the extraordinary and unusual circumstances for his criminal prosecutions.....It used to be said (and it was a fact) that a Black man couldn't get a fair trail in the South. I don't think that Trump or a Trump supporter can get a fair trial in many blue states. Prejudice is not due to a deficiency of melanin. It's part of the human condition, and the left has it in spades.
No shit Sherlock.
"Trump did something "extraordinary" and "unusual.'" Why yes he did, he took on the swamp.
Trump is facing 91 felonies over 4 jurisdictions having never committed a crime before. Yep I believe you Governor Chokul (sarc). Waiting for a Commie-Pinko to fess up this was an exercise modeled after Lavrentiy Pavlovich Beria famous statement. I suspect it will be a long wait.
What Hochul is saying is that as long as you support the government and their narrative then you do not have to worry that the power of the government will come after you. It is a bit like the warnings from the old Mob bosses. Pay your dues, keep your mouth shut, do not challenge the mob's power, and your business can continue to operate with no (obvious) interference.
Translation: Nice business you have there. Vote Democrat and it will stay that way.
New York business people have nothing to fear. As long as they toe the line.
If so, she's revealing that she believes the prosecutors went after the man, not the crime, an abhorrent abuse of power...It's not reassuring.
Why is any of this surprising? Professor, where do expect to find reassurance when you know exactly what is going on? If you're looking for someone to tell you the US and blue state court systems you spent a lifetime teaching are going to be ok...they're not gonna be ok.
Are you still in the denial phase? Move on to acceptance.
We saw Wisconsin liberals do the same type of thing to Scott Walker and his supporters during the corrupt John Doe investigations. They ruined people for defying the political wishes of Madison, WI.
There will be more to come here in WI. Perhaps not directly targeted against Trump or Walker (the men), but against the voice and political influence of Madison's "outliers". Our current Supreme Court majority is corrupt.
Predetermined, coordinated outcomes of lawsuits and prosecutions is the new norm in blue America. I'm sure the WI Supreme Court will find a way to fuck with the 2024 Presidential election.
I suppose an election-year where a Republican billionaire is leading in the polls against an unpopular senile incumbent Democrat president qualifies as an "extraordinary, unusual circumstance," and will become even more extraordinarily rare in the future, especially after they're shown what's in store should one put everything at risk to ever try again.
They can't even get their story straight. Trump was not accused of "hiding assets."
The governor provided reassurance to New York businesses after the ruling. “By and large, they are honest people and they’re not trying to hide their assets and they’re following the rules,” she said of the people who own and conduct business in the New York City area.
Thanks, Kathy. You have just announced to the financial world that New York will abuse power as it seems fit. Good luck (not) with that.
"Good People Need Not Fear" is a collection of stories about Ukraine that I bought years ago, probably through the portal here, I bought it even before Ukraine got involved in US politics in 2016, and so before it came to my attention otherwise, I was just captured by the title. Now, in the United States, not Soviet Ukraine, the mantra is "good people need not fear."
Of course Colbert mocked Trump for saying that it was a "sad day for New York," because the most important thing is to normalize this kind of abuse of power through repetition in as many forms of media as possible. If you repeat a lie often enough, people will come to believe it. Our local political officer, Rich, explained that to us.
This reminds me of the failed Senate candidate who felt obligated to say "I'm not a witch". Except here it's a woman who already has political power, and she's reassuring us that the rest of us aren't witches.
What she’s saying is that you have nothing to worry about as long as you keep your head down and pose no threat to the Democrat party. If this political use of lawfare is successful you can bet your ass it will be used again.
It is absolutely corrupt and makes me more willing to vote for Trump.
But, I do blame DT in part for this new culture. He engaged in lawfare before he was a politician, and once he became a poolitician made jokes about lock her up, lock her up, etc. "They should all be in jail. . ." DT didn't actually do this when in power, the Ds did, and Obama had alread appointed a bunch of ideologues as judges, making it easier.
Now all the crazier MAGAs talk about is how everyone needs to go to jail, which doesn't actually encourage those in power not to use ever more corrupt means to destroy DT.
But once you have corrupted the judiciary and legal system, it's not easy to go back. Think the Bidens are going to be indicted / pay a big judgment for their role in the $100M medicare fraud? I still have sense something really, really bad (many, many thousands of Americans dead) is going to happen in next 18 months and maybe it will be enough of a crisis that it slows down things. But you can't hope for a catastrope to save us. And if/when that catastrophe happens, there's a good chance we will not even know who did it or why.
Trying to get the best deal on interest rates and terms, with a little puffing up on asset values, is an "extraordinary, unusual circumstance"?
What Gusty Winds said.
Not a single bank or lending institution said Trump de-frauded them.
Yeah we need a Space Monkeys meme: the judgement against Trump and every other business in the country looking over their shoulder lol.
"You all know, even before this trial, that Trump is pathological in his belief that the rules don't apply to him."
Actually, what we are seeing is that the "rules don't apply to anybody else."
The law is 100 years old, name the other person who has ever been prosecuted for it. But I assume now that NYC is combing through all of the major real estate deals in NYC looking for similar violations, so that fines of hundreds of millions of dollars can be meted out to other NYC real estate developers, should they have done any of the things that Trump did, you know, like valuing Mar a Lago according to what it would bring on the open market, rather than the far lower tax evaluation of his property.
The late, great Rush Limbaugh's Palm Beach home sold for $150 million, and the prosecutor valued Mar a Lago at $25 million, Mar a Lago is a much larger and more impressive property on one of the most expensive streets in the country. This is one of the bases of his "egregious" violations of the rules.
I know, I know.. "But Trump! Muh norms!"
Monkey Puppet meme, I should have said...lots of shenanigans in everyday business dealings.
This is the same state that passed a law suspending the “Statute of Limitations” for certain crimes so a woman, who can’t recall a rape within a few years, could bring a lawsuit against Trump. Trump was hardly the only person to face lawsuits thanks to this change in state law signed by Hochul. It is a free country, so go ahead and take your chances that this time it is only meant for Trump.
It would have been heartening to see fellow RE developers or others in that industry to gather and show up to support Trump. He did what every other one of them does wrt to securing loans. Standing by him would have been in their self-interest, you would think.
I wonder why they didn’t do that. (No, no I don’t). No need for Hochul to say anything.
"Stop leaving the state, she's saying." Exactly.
Real estate in South Florida has gone through the roof at the high end, from wealthy New Yorkers leaving. If you read her words, you can infer that she is somewhat troubled by the verdict, her family is big in real estate in New York, but "there's nothing she can do."
Holy Moly! asserted with confidence: "Come on, as the trial showed, Trump engaged in cooking the numbers to an epic degree."
The judge ruled him guilty of fraud before the trial started. No bank or business lost a nickel. So who gets the $355 mil oh Holy One?
As an aside, could you please provide an example of "epic"?
There's also the Queen of Hearts: "Sentence first--verdict later."
Obviously trying to stop the stampede of companies/people leaving that state.
“engaged in cooking the numbers to an epic degree”
The standard is now “epic degree”? Or is there a limit, such as 60 miles per hour. If so, what’s the limit? Cite statute please.
Otherwise, I charge your comment as cooking the numbers to an epic degree.
“You all know… Trump is pathological” sounds like defamation unless you know it to be true, but I see you are hiding your name.
I'm sure that Hochul does believe that they can selectively prosecute political enemies in order to confiscate their capital and prohibit them from doing business with no repercussions, such as businesses leaving the state for saner business climates, because she is an idiot. This is the sort of thing that causes third-world countries to be third-world countries. Also, what's to stop a red-state AG from finding some obscure law in their state and using it to prosecute political enemies on the left? The problem is that we are on the third or fourth generation of people who owe their positions due to their espousing leftist political dogma and connections.
"I've always thought that Donald Trump was a bit of a clown. I largely still think that. So why are our rulers so hell bent on eliminating him that they are willing to throw away every last vestige of their credibility?"
To me, he doesn't seem like a clown. In terms of his style and presentation, I'd say Trump is fun. He's a smart, accomplished man who makes serious points about important things, but he does it in a brash, comedic style that's practically the opposite of the mawkish, pseudo-intellectual style that most "serious" politicians conceal their idiocy within.
That said, the reason Trump's enemies are willing to throw away their credibility in order to defeat him is that he's extremely effective in calling out the BS that's being foisted on the American people by the globalist/socialist/bureaucratic/media elites. Obviously, he represents a huge threat to them, and the fact that he's supremely entertaining only makes him more lethal.
The assumption of power sometimes seems to rob lesser people of their self-awareness, doesn't it? That is the test of power - its effects on the wielder. Hochul has just been made aware of consequences by her advisors, and she is reacting by attempting to signal that she is not responsible. She is, though.
Large corporations have their own internal governance structure, and it trains a keen eye on business risk and continuity. They have fiscal and legal responsibilities to their investors. The Progressive leadership of New York State has just introduced an arbitrary Black Swan into that world. Watch the corporate exits begin to ramp up.
Seems to be a Biil of Attainder, plain and simple.
Are they radicalizing the institutions to get Trump or are using Trump to radicalize the institutions?
“Being Donald Trump? If so, she's revealing that she believes the prosecutors went after the man, not the crime, an abhorrent abuse of power.”
Quite a bit of sophistry there. Would you say the same about “Being John Gotti”? His defenders did, as I recall. Being encompasses the person and the behavior of the person.
This is how 2024 plays out.
Trump put on trial in DC this summer.
Trump convicted.
Judge Chutkin says, "Citzen Trump, I remand you into the immediate custody of the U.S. Marshalls. Sentencing will be in 90 days."
Crowd outside the DC courthouse gets wind of this. They break Trump free. Trump leads the crowd to the White House. They are all heavily armed this time. Biden flees. Trump back in the Oval.
Trump goes on Truth Social and declares that he is abolishing all current laws and is installing himself as Cesar until new laws can be drawn up. A beautiful new constitution.
Dow drops by 75%.
Biden orders the Army to retake the White House but the rank-and-file refuse.
The Air Force orders a squadron to bomb the White House. The leader of the squad is Major Ben Marco. Tom Cruise given special permission to tag along.
White House bombed. Trump killed.
Biden declares martial law. Biden saws he won't run for re-election. Dems select Hillary Clinton as the unity candidate with Michelle Obama as VP. (Still a Black woman as VP!)
GOP nominates Vivek. Vivek wins in a 49-state landslide. America saved.
Democrats are barbarians. They twist the law to punish their enemies. They gin up nonexistent laws to punish their enemies. They support barbarian mobs to punish their enemies. They fail to enforce the law to punish their enemies. They allow foreign barbarians to cross our borders to gain political power so they can punish their enemies.
The Democrat Party is the party of barbarism. Remember that and punish them.
William Roper: “So, now you give the Devil the benefit of law!”
Sir Thomas More: “Yes! What would you do? Cut a great road through the law to get after the Devil?”
William Roper: “Yes, I’d cut down every law in England to do that!”
Sir Thomas More: “Oh? And when the last law was down, and the Devil turned ’round on you, where would you hide, Roper, the laws all being flat? This country is planted thick with laws, from coast to coast, Man’s laws, not God’s! And if you cut them down, and you’re just the man to do it, do you really think you could stand upright in the winds that would blow then? Yes, I’d give the Devil benefit of law, for my own safety’s sake!”
——————-
Two things can be simultaneously true. Trump is a hideous human being who should be rejected and the prosecutions are damaging to the fabric of the Republic by their pursuit of him.
I think Trump will eventually prevail against New York State in this case, but only if he can get the case into federal court. Hochul has just provided him with a strong piece of evidence for overturning this idiotic trial outcome with a dismissal with prejudice.
“Not reassuring” sounds like a potato salad left out a bit too long at the church picnic. What was done to Trump is antithetical to the foundational principles of the United States. Won’t be united for long at this rate
It's not just the I-could-be-the-next-target issue.
It is that New York might think they can bleed developers for huge fees. Sure could use that sweet, sweet cash. Likely the developers would be offered much smaller settlements if they go quietly.
Holy Moly,
Please cite the outrageous conduct that the trial court found? Be detailed.
"I've always thought that Donald Trump was a bit of a clown ..."
It bothers me a bit, well more than a bit, to read this as a preface to one's comment.
I ask people: "How would respond if the government accused you of being a Russian spy? You know the agencies that can put you in jail forever?". And following that accusation, an avalanche of more false accusations. I am surprised Trump was able to keep his cool as much as he did.
Tell us Holy Moly, what would you do if the FIB sorted through your spouse's underwear drawer?
"he's extremely effective in calling out the BS that's being foisted on the American people"
and actually seems to be both willing and able to confront it.
They did it their way.
"'Trump' did something 'extraordinary' and 'unusual.'" Why yes he did, he took on the swamp."
Really? Did he? What did he do, specifically?
Some might call the verdict a judicial bill of attainder. Making New York City Caracas--that way the state will be more welcoming to Venezuelans.
Let's hope the trucker boycott screws NYC for a bit.
Hochul is saying; "Just doff your cap, tug your forelock and make your obeisance to your betters (Democrat hacks) and all will be well!"
Trump refused to do this, that's the unusual, extraordinary circumstance.
Nothing to see here!
I’m always highly skeptical of the dual claim that some person (here Trump) is a complete dunce and also the most evil person around.
"Are they radicalizing the institutions to get Trump or are using Trump to radicalize the institutions?"
I think that a pretty good majority of the citizens of the US now believe that:
1) The federal government is illegitimate
2) and is working to suppress them
3) That higher-education is imparting useless degrees and indoctrinating students with doctrines that both stupid and dangerous
4) That white males are being actively discriminated against
5) That elections are obviously being rigged
6) The MSM is colluding with the government to propagandize and censor the populace
7) That the border is wide open for the obvious reason that the self-styled "elites" have decided to turbo charge replacement of the current electorate with something more to their liking
8) That federal law-enforcement and the IC collude with politicians to take out anyone who challenges the status quo and that this is obvious
9) That the K-12 education establishments primary goal is not to teach children, but to indoctrinate them into believes that the parents don't share and get some of them to sexually mutilate themselves.
I could continue.
"It would have been heartening to see fellow RE developers or others in that industry to gather and show up to support Trump."
What, and be next? It's too late, the gate has been breached and the city is being pillaged already, the time for that was when the walls were still holding.
Omg. Did she really say that?
😆
For 200
What does the domestic violence abuser say in his defence?
There's the classic unbelievable assurance that if you don't break the law, you've got nothing to worry about. If you're "law-abiding and rule-following," then you're not in the category with Donald Trump. Trump did something "extraordinary" and "unusual." Or did the prosecution do something "extraordinary" and "unusual"?
It's not reassuring.
I find it revolting that outside of post comments,Joe Rogan/Aaron Rodgers and my ‘expert says’ commentary this is the best pushback I can find in print. CFA, CPA, MST, licensed commercial real estate brokers…and even attorneys- not a single formal protest or pushback on the abandonment of rule of law. Some passive hypotheticals in Jeopardy! format from a supposed big brained constitutional law prof is all we can muster…
I really recommend the Netflix documentary, or it may be on Prime, "The Winter King," it's about how Henry the Seventh cemented the Tudor hold on the British throne, by changing dates on historical documents so that what were once considered lawful opponents suddenly became guilty of insurrection and treason, and more germane to this discussion, he had special courts which had the power to go out and take jurisdiction over certain cases, or bring cases of their own, and these courts were used to bankrupt his political opponents.
This is why the regime mocks the knowledge of history, because there is nothing new. Even Julius Caesar gives an account in his Commentary on the Gallic Wars of being asked to resolve an election dispute in a tribe that was divided into two political parties, and one party, according to Caesar, used the power that it had while in office to break traditional norms, and to fix what had once been free and fair elections, much to the chagrin of half of the tribe.
Old and slow said...
I've always thought that Donald Trump was a bit of a clown. I largely still think that. So why are our rulers so hell bent on eliminating him that they are willing to throw away every last vestige of their credibility? It makes me wonder.
2/19/24, 8:30 AM
I've always thought that nobodies who feel compelled to get on some internet comment board and tell everybody that they consider Trump a clown are fucking idiots who have their fucking heads up their asses. Dogma And Pony Show put it nicely, I won't- You think you're superior to Donald Trump in any way, you're not- you're a fucking fool. You consider USA politicians, our representatives and senators, as having credibility STILL after all we have been subjected to in the last 10 years, and with our borders wide open because our politicians insist on American citizens securing the border of a foreign nation before they secure ours, and you call them our "rulers"? You're not just a fool, you're not just a fucking fool, you're a fucking dangerous tool.
Oh, and Virgil Hilts @8:53 who thinks that Trump brought all this on himself because he said "Lock her up"- You make Old and Slow look wise in comparison.
When the Democrats' house organ, MSNBC, doesn't even believe the BS then you know Hochul and NYC are in trouble. Katy Tur said her staff analyzed the way the law has been applied: “They looked at 150 cases over 70 years and found there was no case where there was a ban on doing business where there wasn't harm shown. So even though the threshold is harm shown, in the past, it has only been used to ban someone doing business when it's been shown that somebody was hurt. Say you're selling cosmetics that are poisoning you. Is it fair to go after Donald Trump like this in this environment, is my question?”
No one was hurt in Trump's case. No entity was actually defrauded. Hochul is confirming the truth: Trump was convicted for being Trump, not for doing business like every other real estate developer always does business. As Althouse notes, Hochul provides "the classic unbelievable assurance that if you don't break the law, you've got nothing to worry about. If you're 'law-abiding and rule-following,' then you're not in the category with Donald Trump. Trump did something 'extraordinary' and 'unusual.'"
But like every weenie defending the crazy outcome on here, Hochul never says what about Trump's business was "extraordinary" and "unusual" because there's no there there. The banks testified for the defense. They were not defrauded. And if the judge is correct in saying all the properties were "overvalued" then Trump over-paid taxes on the inflated value, which again is not defrauding anyone. Trump would have been harming Trump, not the state.
Contra to something Cook wrote on here yesterday, people who believe Trump did get more valid votes than Biden don't also hold the belief Trump is "an exemplary human being, possessed of extraordinary...concern for others." I know a lot Trump voters who think Biden's election was rigged. To a one they all think he's a blowhard New Yorker who, like every other human, says and does stupid shit occasionally, maybe even daily. But we all greatly appreciate his America First approach to the bullshit of kowtowing to China and Iran and border crossers who appear to be Biden's top priority. It's so simple that Lefties just can't comprehend it: He ran on a platform and then did what he promised, despite an uncooperative GOPe and hysterical Democrat opposition. And it worked. Every income category went up, minorities more than ever.
Someone on Twitter put it best: "New York is broke, is overwhelmed by migrants, and they just pulled a slot machine that paid out nine figures. I don't believe they can just put that down."
Once they know that they can do this and get away with it, they'll will do it again.
eliminating him that they are willing to throw away every last vestige of their credibility? It makes me wonder.
It's precisely that he's not a "serious, sober statesman" that he scares them. The fool can say things which others cannot, even if they are true. The managerial class today are entirely reliant on the accumulated social capital of previous competent generations in order to keep everything running while they sit at the top and take their cut. Trump scares them because he was willing to call out their bullshit on issues like European defense spending, foreign trade, or foreign policy.
The same people who are cheering the financial immolation of "Russian asset" Trump are mourning the death in prison of Navalny, who ran a political party in Russia that was funded by the United States. These people have wet dreams about Trump dying in prison.
Here is a link to the Wikileaks cable.
https://twitter.com/angeloinchina/status/1758817936024932701
They can't even get their story straight. Trump was not accused of "hiding assets."
You’re underrepresenting the absurdity of the decision. The ‘fraud’ in the judgement is an amalgamation of the delta in valuation methods using New York’s commercial property tax assessment vs the appraisal valuations used for loans and lines of credit AND the delta between the appraisal valuations for loans and lines credit vs the judge’s invented valuations using of ‘objective valuation methods’….
Its a floor wax AND a dessert topping…
This is not the only example, Delaware has been getting rich for 75 years by selling their legal system to corporations and big law (see asbestos). Getting a quick hit at enemy Elon Musk will give them a dopamine hit, but will cost them a fortune when corporations see that they are subject to the whim of judges when they paid good money to be protected by those judges. Spoiled the brand a bit, and they will regret their new"judges gone wild" image.
So, whatever she thinks, she can't mean to be saying that.
Really? Why not? Think of what she said as a warning to anyone else from the business community who might consider going off the plantation.
There's the classic unbelievable assurance that if you don't break the law, you've got nothing to worry about.
Oh good Gawd. Althouse gets it.
Trump did something "extraordinary" and "unusual." Or did the prosecution do something "extraordinary" and "unusual"?
He did do something "extraordinary" and "unusual.". He kicked Hillary Clinton’s butt. And he’s lurng the plebes — whether you dismissively refer to them ans “Normies” or “Deplorables” — off the Democrat plantation.
To me the biggest case for re-electing Trump — even greater than his economic and foreign policy — is that this behavior by the Democrats must be punished. We do not want any future politicians — Democrat, Republican, done future party not yet envisioned — to even begin to consider using lawfare ever again.
Migrants in, businesses out.
Blogger Bushman of the Kohlrabi said..."What she’s saying is that you have nothing to worry about as long as you keep your head down and pose no threat to the Democrat party."
Yep.
Leftwing judges and prosecutors went after Trump because they hate Trump. Its that simple. One law for Republicans and MAGA, another for everyone else.
Its disgusting. And you can hope there are some higher level judges who will set aside politics and do Right, but who knows.....
No, she meant that. Not sure why you're rejecting the only reasonable interpretation of events and of what she said.
Judge Engeron will be remembered as a man who smiled smugly as his self-gratifying issue shamefully stained the fabric of America's judiciary.
This does seem to indicate that the Governor is perceiving that people in New York view the prosecution as purely political and worry what will protect them from similar actions. And if a Democrat in deep-blue New York is worried about that, this seems like good news for Trump and Republicans in November.
I'm thrilled that truckers are refusing to deliver to NYC. I haven't and won't be going back since Cuomo told us to stay out, and Hochel did the same. Let the illegals take it over. Stick a fork in it...unless they get rid of the PROGRESSIVE problem, they are sinking as fast as shit filled San Franscisco, another city I will not be visiting any time soon, if ever.
New York businesses should move to Connecticut. Same left liberal democrat politicians. But none of them are smart enough to sue you.
As Trump's witnesses testified what Trump did was common practice in NYC.
Virtually all the cases against Trump are unprecedented in some way. It is some sort of tribute to left Amerika that they cannot acknowledge this.
What is the "extraordinary, unusual circumstance"?
Being Donald Trump? If so, she's revealing that she believes the prosecutors went after the man, not the crime, an abhorrent abuse of power.
So, whatever she thinks, she can't mean to be saying that. What else is there?
There's the classic unbelievable assurance that if you don't break the law, you've got nothing to worry about. If you're "law-abiding and rule-following," then you're not in the category with Donald Trump. Trump did something "extraordinary" and "unusual." Or did the prosecution do something "extraordinary" and "unusual"?
What Trump did that was "extraordinary" and "unusual" was challenge the Left, and the Establishment.
That's it.
The things he was charged for? Every single large business in NY that's even tried to get a real estate loan has done what Trump did, because in fact there's nothing illegal, immoral, or unethical about it.
Trumps "crime" was to negotiate with a bank, and then follow through on the agreement.
Delaware screwed Musk for politics, and now Musk is returning the favor. Everyone else who doesn't want to get screwed by Delaware over any political apostasy is going to follow suit.
And the same is going to happen to NY.
They have people leaving for tax reasons, for (not wanting to be a victim of) crime reasons. And now they'll have people leaving for "I don't want to be screwed because some activists decide I'm the next hate object".
Bob asked: "Are they radicalizing the institutions to get Trump or are using Trump to radicalize the institutions?"
Both. Their coup is well under way.
Ann said:
If so, she's revealing that she believes the prosecutors went after the man, not the crime, an abhorrent abuse of power.
So, whatever she thinks, she can't mean to be saying that. What else is there?
There's nothing else. Nothing. I believe that any reasonably intelligent person has to know that it is Donald Trump the man who is being targeted, not any of the supposed crimes he allegedly committed. Good lord, some of these prosecutors actually ran for office stating this outright. They have even changed the laws so they can retroactively apply them to the man. Yet when I read some of the comments that are posted here on this very blog it is quite clear to me that many are perfectly happy with this state of affairs. They celebrate it. they take pleasure in it and they cheer it on. To these people an abhorrent abuse of power is a wonderful thing because it is being directed against someone they abhor. Governor Hochul is no different.
"Don't worry. We'll go back to all that law and order stuff once we get him." Sure.
My favorite part about the Delaware court is when Hunter Biden wrote a threatening letter to a business associate demanding money, and pointing out that he personally knew every judge on the court.
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/delaware-judge-who-nuked-elon-musks-55-billion-package-steeped-bidenworld
'Being Donald Trump? If so, she's revealing that she believes the prosecutors went after the man, not the crime, an abhorrent abuse of power.'
Shouldn't this be one of the main pillars of his appeal?
The AG is on tape multiple times saying that she would find a way to put Trump in prison.
I'm not sure how the trial was even allowed to begin.
But keep voting for black democrats and you will continue to get chaos...
'Escape from New York' is real.
Any business that stays there should be sued by shareholders.
Same with any liberal state really. GTFO.
"Two things can be simultaneously true. Trump is a hideous human being who should be rejected and the prosecutions are damaging to the fabric of the Republic by their pursuit of him."
And, AMDG, what are you prepared to do to stop the latter?
They claim he exaggerated (high and low) his real estate holding values--but his org told banks to make their own estimates. Real estate is impossible to value because it can fluctuate with economic times far more than a used car. Is this office building worth $400Mil? Who knows until you sell it!
"If so, she's revealing that she believes the prosecutors went after the man, not the crime, an abhorrent abuse of power."
Of course she believes that. She's evil, not stupid.
Blogger Another old lawyer said...
“No, she meant that. Not sure why you're rejecting the only reasonable interpretation of events and of what she said.“
No, what? Who is “she”? What is “that”? What is the “reasonable interpretation”? What is the “events”? Who is “she” in this sentence?
I’m not a lawyer, but I know ones that are serious don’t use such vague language in debate unless they intend to obscure. And if a person meant to say “Hochul statements mean just as they do they prima facie”, then it suggests Trump was tried under a law that only Trump could and did commit. That’s the reasonable interpretation, right? Or does “only” mean something new these days?
Where there's smoke, there's toast.
Michael Fitzgerald said...
Old and slow said...
I've always thought that Donald Trump was a bit of a clown. I largely still think that. So why are our rulers so hell bent on eliminating him that they are willing to throw away every last vestige of their credibility? It makes me wonder.
2/19/24, 8:30 AM
I've always thought that nobodies who feel compelled to get on some internet comment board and tell everybody that they consider Trump a clown are fucking idiots who have their fucking heads up their asses. Dogma And Pony Show put it nicely, I won't- You think you're superior to Donald Trump in any way, you're not- you're a fucking fool. You consider USA politicians, our representatives and senators, as having credibility STILL after all we have been subjected to in the last 10 years, and with our borders wide open because our politicians insist on American citizens securing the border of a foreign nation before they secure ours, and you call them our "rulers"? You're not just a fool, you're not just a fucking fool, you're a fucking dangerous tool.
Oh, and Virgil Hilts @8:53 who thinks that Trump brought all this on himself because he said "Lock her up"- You make Old and Slow look wise in comparison.
2/19/24, 10:01 AM
******THIS^^^^*******
Don't the banks now have a fiduciary duty to go after all their mortgagees for fraud? Does the NY statute give a civil cause of action? Even if it doesn't, there's now a new common-law definition of fraud in NY. The banks could start all the suits and drown the NY court system in litigation until some judge finally sees sense...
JSM
The authoritarian left seems to be using the Soviet Union as their economic model. I remember the story of the ice skating rink in Central Park. Ed Koch's bureaucrats spent 5 years and millions and failed to reopen it. Trump promised to have it open for Christmas and did it. Mitt Romney did something similar with the Winter Olympics in Utah. Romney, of course, is still given credit because he has avoided any conflict with the Left.
Even the New York Times agreed that it could not find a single case in history where this statute was used against an individual or a company that did not commit a criminal offense, go bankrupt, or leave financial victims.
This is normal. And it gets even more normal:
Under New York law, Trump cannot appeal this ruling without depositing the full amount, including interest, in a court account. Even for Trump, $455 million is hard to come by. Likewise, a bond would require a company to guarantee payment for a defendant who has been barred from doing business in New York and is facing the need to liquidate much of his portfolio.
https://nypost.com/2024/02/19/opinion/democrats-weaponized-justice-system-to-punish-trump-in-business-case/
Presumably, he can to go Federal court, but who knows? It would be ironic if he was forced to sell some assets and they came in at his declared price.
I said: "'Trump' did something 'extraordinary' and 'unusual.'" Why yes he did, he took on the swamp."
Robert Cook responded with a question: "Really? Did he? What did he do, specifically?"
Forced NATO to belly up to the bar financially. The Swamp screamed from the roof tops.
Trump slapped tariffs on China. The first president that stood up to the Chi-Coms. The Swamp was not pleased.
Trump created the "Remain in Mexico" policy. The open borders crowd (Read: The Swamp) was not pleased.
Too name a few.
"Yet when I read some of the comments that are posted here on this very blog it is quite clear to me that many are perfectly happy with this state of affairs. They celebrate it. they take pleasure in it and they cheer it on. To these people an abhorrent abuse of power is a wonderful thing because it is being directed against someone they abhor."
Progressives are garbage people. And they're proud of it.
"It's not reassuring."
They're Democrats. Honestly, what did you expect?
I don't think wendybar and Michael Fitzgerald quite grok my point. I think the deep state people (the "bad guys") who organized the spying on DT and other election shenanigans actually believe that if DT is elected (this time) he really will go after them with a vengeance - that financial ruin / prison are possibilities. My bet is that wendybar and MF want that to happen (a good part of me certainly does). But this means that for those bad guys, the stakes are ultimate and personal, and they will do anything (yes, anything) to stop DT from being elected. I did not say (and certainly do not think) DT brought all this on himself. I have no idea what people who care about the country should do.
Letitia James took Beria’s statement to heart and did not hide the fact she was out to get Trump. On something. Worked too. Took her Howard law degree and found an ex taxi driver lunatic to be executioner
There's a cost to a partisan shit-show.
Anybody in the other party starts to think, "maybe there are safer places to live and work."
"New Yorkers who are business people" = Republicans
She's talking to Republicans, begging them not to leave.
"You're not deplorable, we love you."
Yancey Ward: "And, AMDG, what are you prepared to do to stop the latter?"
AMDG is prepared to go Full GOPe Suckup...but not to stop "the latter".
Quite the contrary in fact.
Kevin O'Leary [Shark Tank Guy] from an interview with Neil Cavuto posted on X:
"I would NEVER invest in New York now! And I'm not the only one saying that!"
"This $4 billion data center I'm talking about - not a chance I would put that in New York! Zero probability! Never!"
"I'm shocked at this. I can't even understand or fathom the decision at all. There's no rationale for it."
"Every investor is worried because where is the victim? Who lost money? What does this say about the legal bar in New York? Aren't they going to question this judge?"
"$355 million as a penalty plus interest at 9%, and there's no victim?"
O'Leary said Governor Kathy Hochul's "words fall on deaf ears to everybody. There's nothing she can say to justify this decision."
"This is a New York problem now."
What started as a trickle of businesses leaving the Democrat hellhole of New York under Spitzer and Paterson became a torrent under Cuomo, and threatens now to become a tsunami.
I honestly do not understand why any business with more assets than a hot dog cart would submit itself to the governance of that lawless state and its far-left rogue prosecutors.
Kathy Hochul looks like a wicked witch.
Also, what's to stop a red-state AG from finding some obscure law in their state and using it to prosecute political enemies on the left?
Such a move would instantly bring down the DOJ like a ton of bricks, with a Federal prosecution (i.e. persecution) of the state officials for "official oppression under color of law" or whatever statute they can make fit.
This is true no matter who is in the White House. If the President were a Democrat in this circumstance, the persecution would be initiated with his express approval if not at his behest. If a Republican, the DOJ would do it anyway, and dare the President to do anything about it. If he did, he would get the Nixon (and now Trump) treatment from the entire civil service and the security/intelligence complex, which is becoming a more powerful and unaccountable Praetorian Guard with each year that passes.
What Trump has been "convicted" of is standard practice in the business world at large and the real estate development industry in particular. There's no excuse not bringing literally hundreds of similar cases with all defendants found guilty immediately without a trial, exactly what they did to Trump. The governor's argument sounds like a Mafioso explaining a protection racket.
You would have to be a fool to keep your business in New York if you had any option to leave.
I suggest that anyone looking for historical context should take a look at the practice of proscription by several Roman emperors. The names of those to be proscribed (usually wealthy persons insufficiently subservient to the emperor) were published and all of their properties were forfeited to the state, they were to be killed on sight, and anyone assisting them was also proscribed.
With the death of privacy, and the astonishing ubiquity of digital tech, future emperors will be able to make short work of the insufficiently subservient.
All hail Emperor Hochul!
Well Wendybar, you've got a pretty big mouth for someone who seldom does more than quote second rate Internet publications. It turns out that when you do attempt to speak in your own voice, it involves a lot of "fucking this, and fucking that". You're very articulate, aren't you?. What you clearly are not is very intelligent. If you don't realize that they are, in fact, your rulers, then you just haven't been paying much attention. Maybe you will read something online that will help you understand, because you clearly lack the ability to think for yourself. "Lots of emotion" I seem to recall hearing that line recently...
We are watching the dismantling of "democracy". A shift from the once dominant legislative branches to the courts. We are watching the corruption of our courts and their now authoritarian overreach. The Trump verdict and fine in NY is just one of many examples.
Of course this is being cheered by the education establishment and college educated white women. I'm not sure they really understand the dangers of this shift, but they will clap along and bark like seals, or people cheering on the naked bike parade in Madison.
More than likely it is too late to correct. We had our chance, but he "let's just move on" crowd actually thought we could "move on" without severe consequences. Here we are.
Starting with COVID, and perhaps prior during the Russia collusion hoax, this was all very predictable. Wisconsin liberal temper tantrums and protests during the 2011 Act Ten battle was a pre-curser.
After a legitimately elected WI Governor and Legislature passed Act 10, liberals turned their hopes to a WI Supreme Court victory (which they lost) to overturn the will of the Wisconsin People. Madison was appalled. Milwaukee instituted lawfare against Walker.
None of what we are seeing should be a shock to anyone who has paid attention.
I have no idea whether Mr. Trump is the largest developer in New York, or just the most visible. The only way this prosecution looks unbiased is if the state has or is examining the books of other large developers. I'm not holding my breath...
Anyone who believes Governor Hochul that Trump was a "one-of" is a fool. Anyone who thinks Hochul doesn't thumb her ugly nose at the the rule of law is dumber than a moron. Recall when Hochul lost a 2nd Amendment case in the Supreme Court - and promptly ignored it.
From Alexey Navalny...
Jan 9, 2021
1. I think that the ban of Donald Trump on Twitter is an unacceptable act of censorship (THREAD)
Alexey Navalny
@navalny
·
Jan 9, 2021
2. Of course, during his time in the office, Trump has been writing and saying very irresponsible things. And paid for it by not getting re-elected for a second term.
Alexey Navalny
@navalny
·
Jan 9, 2021
3. The election is a straightforward and competitive process. You can participate in it, you can appeal against the results, they're being monitored by millions of people. The ban on Twitter is a decision of people we don't know in accordance with a procedure we don't know.
Alexey Navalny
@navalny
·
Jan 9, 2021
4. In my opinion, the decision to ban Trump was based on emotions and personal political preferences.
Alexey Navalny
@navalny
·
Jan 9, 2021
5. Don't tell me he was banned for violating Twitter rules. I get death threats here every day for many years, and Twitter doesn't ban anyone (not that I ask for it).
Alexey Navalny
@navalny
·
Jan 9, 2021
6. Among the people who have Twitter accounts are cold-blooded murderers (Putin or Maduro) and liars and thieves (Medvedev). For many years, Twitter, Facebook and Instagram have been used as a base for Putin's "troll factory" and similar groups from other authoritarian countries
Alexey Navalny
@navalny
·
Jan 9, 2021
7. Those who denied COVID-19 exist freely and communicate on Twitter. Their words have cost thousands of lives. And yet, it was Trump who got banned publicly and ostentatiously. Such selectivity indicates that this was an act of censorship.
Alexey Navalny
@navalny
·
Jan 9, 2021
8. Of course, Twitter is a private company, but we have seen many examples in Russian and China of such private companies becoming the state's best friends and the enablers when it comes to censorship.
Alexey Navalny
@navalny
9. If you replace "Trump" with "Navalny" in today's discussion, you will get an 80% accurate Kremlin's answer as to why my name can't be mentioned on Russian TV and I shouldn't be allowed to participate in any elections.
1:15 PM · Jan 9, 2021
Alexey Navalny
@navalny
·
Jan 9, 2021
10. This precedent will be exploited by the enemies of freedom of speech around the world. In Russia as well. Every time when they need to silence someone, they will say: 'this is just common practice, even Trump got blocked on Twitter'.
Prior to drilling (and fracking, ha) three oil wells on my property, I went to my bank to establish a line-of-credit to draw from to cover the cost of each as I drilled them. I was asked to furnish a net worth statement. This included my real estate, vehicles, stocks, cash on-hand, etc. It was only an estimate. I could have been high. In addition to the estimate, my lending institution reviewed my loan payment history. They aren't stupid.
The LOC's were paid in-full 6 (six) months from each oil well completion.
I noted in comments long ago that if you are a Marxist that believes the state should set prices, then there is nothing at all wrong with the ruling from this judge. I bring it up again in case anyone really thinks no one would use the precedent set to try any other cases.
Judge Engoron reminds me of Judge Ito of O.J. Simpson fame. Fiftfeen minutes of fame was too much for both of them.
Behave and act like a democrat in NY and businessmen(women) have nothing to worry about.
158 financial firms representing $993 billion in assets under management have left New York in the last three years according to Bloomberg.
Way to go, Kathy.
Old and slow said: "I've always thought that Donald Trump was a bit of a clown."
Reminded me Joe Pesci in Goodfellas.
Meanwhile truckers are organizing to NOT make deliveries to NYC
Judge Engoron meet Judge Ito.
Since Trump and his sons are not permitted to run the business they own, the regime has put this in charge of it.
One set of rules for Trump, another for the rest of us citizens? Cold comfort.
Have run into stupid-inept circuit-court judges in Wisconsin and Illinois too, judges who willfully ignore Statute Law and case-law precedents, grossly exceed their judicial authority, and intentionally rule on basis of their small cabal of attorney-connections. Not surprised by Trump's ridiculous penalty ruling, but truly disturbed to see how corrupt our judicial-system of politically-appointed and popular-vote elected judges has historically been.
I see that I misread Wendybars recent post. I thought that she( ?) had actually written something for once, but no. It was a cut and paste job as usual.
I thought one of the interesting things about the recent story about the journalist scammed out of $50,000, is that she appears to be a standard issue NY liberal who believes the federal government would victimize her without cause.
Consider for a sec all the office space appraised before covid hit, and what those half-empty properties are worth now. And how so many are on the knife-edge of bankruptcy, unable to service their loans AND to meet ordinary expenses..
Will NY prosecute every owner of such spaces for over-valuing their properties in the past, since they are worth much less now?
Good luck with that!
Or do you think the state will lower those appraised values to "real" values and suffer the resulting tax revenue losses?
Snort!
“Kathy Hochul looks like a wicked witch.”
She reminds me of Diana the lizard girl boss in the V sf series. I’m sure she now thinks it’s her turn to run for president.
Holy Moly! asserted with confidence: "Come on, as the trial showed, Trump engaged in cooking the numbers to an epic degree."
I'm curious, Moly, are you stupid or just dishonest?
Are you honestly trying to claim that those poor banks just were overwhelmed by businessman Trump? That none of them were able to do their own assessments of the values of the properties?
Have you ever obtained a mortgage? Because when I got one, teh bank did their own assessment of the value of my home. Are you trying to claim they do that for residential mortgages, but not for business property?
Just how stupid are you?
If you think the Judge was so bad, why didn't Trump retain an attorney who knew how to file a Jury Demand?
if you think the decision is so bad, why don't you stop whining and file your Notice Of Appeal?
effinayright said...
" Consider for a sec all the office space appraised before covid hit, and what those half-empty properties are worth now. And how so many are on the knife-edge of bankruptcy, unable to service their loans AND to meet ordinary expenses.."
Midtown's average office leasing prices are at $90 per sq. ft., with Midtown South at an average rent of just over $84. Downtown Manhattan property is cheaper at just over $63 per sq. ft., and the direct vacancy rate is at about 10%.
At mid-year 2019 the average quoted office rent in New York City across all building classes was $72.90 per square foot.
https://www.google.com/search?q=nyc+office+space+price+per+square+foot&sca_esv=53a8062f3e87ad60&sxsrf=ACQVn0_fnATt4UpkV-
"law-abiding and rule-following,"
The best part of business in New York City is the long history of business people in NYC being law-abiding and rule-following.
Any business that stays there should be sued by shareholders.
=================
NYSE could set an example of a trikle
Old and slow said...
I see that I misread Wendybars recent post. I thought that she( ?) had actually written something for once, but no. It was a cut and paste job as usual.
2/19/24, 6:07 PM
Just goes to show you ARE OLD and SLOWWWW...because I do a lot of cut and paste, but I also actually write things, so go back to sleep and worry about your own posts instead of what I posted. You sound like a stalker.
Mutaman,
The judge in the case advised that Trump was not able to have a jury trial & stated:
" Trump's team had 15 days to oppose that, but did not, Engoron said, because there was no point in doing so.
"It would not have helped to make a motion. Nobody forgot to check off a box," Engoron said."
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-trial-no-jury-fraud-new-york-judge-arthur-engoron/
Mutaman, the low information commenter.
The naturist cure for lawfare is hemp jewelry.
Meanwhile this governor doesn't want your family to be compensated if you suffer a wrongful death in NY ... vetoed the Grieving Families Act. Might raise costs for big insurance companies...
https://www.timesunion.com/state/article/grieving-families-act-prospects-dim-bill-18578549.php
@AA, this post made Insty. It even quotes Old and Slow's bit of a clown comment. So O and S, you have at someone who agrees with you, so there's that. I'm still not on board.
Its only surprising that she said it. Donald Trump is a bombastic politician that will say anything to get elected. Unfortunately for him he's publicly pro-American. Anyone with half of a brain knew this was targeted prosecution. I worked in home loans at a bank for several years. If they actually started prosecuting even loans that were never paid based on dishonest information, the courts would do nothing else.
Disgraced former governor Eliot Spitzer, when he was AG ('99-'07), went after a number of people he found inconvenient, even announcing his intent after opening an investigation, or after an indictment, a purported ethical no-no for a prosecutor. This sort of lawfare by Dems is ancient.
Bryce said...
Mutaman,
"The judge in the case advised that Trump was not able to have a jury trial"
You demand a jury. If the judge strikes your demand, you have a ground for appeal. Total malpractice by Habba.
Virgil hilts,
"I have no idea what people who care about the country should do."
Arm up! While it is not absolutely guaranteed to come to that, it's certainly likely - - so do you want to be unprepared?
Mutaman said...
If you think the Judge was so bad, why didn't Trump retain an attorney who knew how to file a Jury Demand?
Wow, Mut, you're getting stupider by the day.
He didn't demand a jury because an NY jury would be at least as corruptly left wing as the "judge"
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