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I'm a public school teacher with an underlying condition, and I frankly don't know what to do. I may not have a choice -- I can't just lose my job. I LOVE teaching. I love my classroom, and I love my kids. But I have to keep myself, my husband, and my 9-year old safe, too. It's an impossible and absolutely unfair position. Schools are taking the brunt of economic inequality and an anti-science administration.
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«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 258 of 258Schools are taking the brunt of economic inequality and an anti-science administration.
Schools are not taking the brunt of covid, many other industries have sufferend for 3 months what teachers are prospectively complaining about. Apparently they believe it's unfair for them to pay any price even as others are being financially ruined. Their sense of entitlement is disgusting.
If she has an underlying condition why is she teaching at all then? Classrooms are Petri dishes in the best of times.
Ann Althouse said...
I get the feeling you folks are not too sympathetic to this teacher...
What's not to love about people whose definition of shared sacrifice is that others sacrifice double so they don't have to at all?
We need kids to be educated. The virus is here to stay. It's mortality is exceedingly low. There is simply no choice. Find teachers who want to teach and can think rationally. Everybody else is working and shopping and living, and usually with people who are much more likely to carry it than children.
Anecdotal evidence is what it is, but we get lots of it everyday, so I'll throw in mine.
I have a close friend, 60 years old, has HIV, a seriously compromised immune system, high blood pressure and other issues. He caught Covid a couple weeks ago. Said it was like a mild cold. His partner caught it too and had no symptoms. I know dozens of people now who have tested positive, nobody has died, and the worst symptoms have been like the flu, which only two people I know of have experienced. The overwhelming majority had very mild or no symptoms. About 1/3 of the people I know like this are over 50. These are anecdotal data points, but they are ones I know for certain are true. Most of the rest we get is very suspect.
The fear comes from constant focus on one virus as a cause of serious illness and death. You could do that for any number of causes of morbidity and terrify people about that just as well. Imagine this level of focus and fear directed at heart disease, the flu, or cancer. If it was in the media like Covid is, people would be terrified of that in the same way, but their concern would be more valid. They would imagine they have cancer every other day as CNN spotlighted regular people dying from cancer in the thousands.
People are getting sick from the kinds of things they always have. The difference is we are mislabeling it as Covid. We could do the same with Herpes Simplex and have much more compelling numbers. We just test for Herpes and if you get sick or die and tested positive, then you died of Herpes. Covid is not anywhere near the most serious health risk we take everyday. Get back to work and life. Lost time is your real risk.
A simple and effective solution would be to just privatize education and not allow a union. Do you really think it could be worse than what we have? Do you care about children and their future or is something else more important?
"I get the feeling you folks are not too sympathetic to this teacher..."
For every teacher there are dozen of children who should matter at least as much, no? Besides, teach is voluntary. Nobody has to do it.
I don't have to work at all, but I have not missed a day this year, because there are other people who need me there, and that's enough. That doesn't seem to be a value most teachers share.
Teaching is on a continuum with coal mining.
Fine. No work. No pay.
No unemployment, either.
Good luck.
I get the feeling you folks are not too sympathetic to this teacher...
@Althouse, my sons are in their thirties now, but back when they were in elementary, middle, and high school most years I felt that they were engaged in learning despite the teacher. That does tend to lessen one’s sympathy. The main exceptions were when my younger son was in Montessori and my older son’s freshman year of high school. But his principal was replaced by a Latina, who immediately got the best teachers terminated. To no one’s surprise, the teachers’ union did not left a finger to save their careers — the Union only cares about saving bad teachers; good ones can go to Hell for all the union cares.
in this neck of the woods it's killed mostly old people in nursing homes, the ones least able to resist the infections, it's not deliberate policy like in the northeast, but terrible nonetheless,
I notice a lot of parents who are questioning having to pay taxes for schools that they can't use. Show of hands... how many of you, in the past, were volunteering to increase your own taxes so that those without kids could get a break from paying for something they weren't using?
Bueller? Bueller? Bueller?
I submit democrats/teachers unions/teachers are not going to allow private/parochial schools to open for long, if at all.
They all know school children are not affected, and cannot allow that fact to play out in real time for all to see.
BTW- the reason they don't want schools open is all about mail-in ballots and stealing the election--which everyone knows that's what they're doing but nobody is doing a damn thing to stop it.
These comments show why the US is failing on dealing with COVID while the rest of the OECD recovers. Looking forward to POTUS's COVID briefing--not.
This message brought to you by Trump Supporters United and has been registered as an in-kind contribution to the Biden campaign.
Your sniveling and bitching got old four months ago, Tim. Put a fucking sock in it.
That doesn't seem to be a value most teachers share.
..and that's it for me, too. It's not a lack of sympathy but we're all suffering, some more than others. Not once did the teacher volunteer for furlough or pay cut or consider the latest risk assessments or empathize with the children who we're told will suffer forever from a lack of learning in critical years. I sounds like the response we all fear from unionized teachers- Fuck you, pay me anyways because it's for the children...
On human research experiments ask the Black cop who goes out and gets lectured about racism by a white Karen. Now there's an experiment--how long will his self control hold out until he gives her the smack in the chops she so richly deserves?
In Michigan, I keep seeing a tv ad that Gov Gretchen Whitmer is keeping us safe, is following the science, and has not been political. Also, she has started a plan to start looking into starting to think about a way to start opening schools.
But (record scratch) people like Betsy DeVos hate public education! And have been trying to destroy it!
Now....Gretch Whitmer is not up for reelection this year. So this not being political thing apparently includes a political ad running for no reason. It ignores that she hired her Democratic Database Management firm to do contract tracing. It ignores that she keeps trying to blame nursing home deaths on the GOP not working with her. It ignores that she tried to make it illegal to buy seeds and paint. That is science, apparently. Where Betsy DeVos hates public education.
What is the point of this ad? I need to try to figure out who is running it.
Somewhere recently, I read a comparison of food assistance versus public schooling. If the government gave the food assistance dollars to the grocery store rather than the individual, and continued to send the money to the grocery store even when it refused to open, everybody would rightly consider that insane.
Why are education dollars different?
Give these rebel teachers an opportunity to perform their jobs, they choose not to, fire them and go full online until more can be hired
I said...
> Have you noticed that all the Covid stories are now about Florida and Texas, even though NY has 10x as many deaths. It's almost like they are trying to influence an election or something...
and, right on time, comes Howard with:
>>The No Mask re-opening in Tx, Az and Fla were a huge open air experiment that proved PDJT 100% right.
New York: 35,000 deaths. Florida: 4,900. Florida has a larger population, including a larger percentage of elderly.
Funny that you didn't mention NY. It's almost as if you are completely dishonest.
I've only read half the comments, so forgive me if I overlap, but I'm a public charter school teacher and I've given this a lot of thought.
First, I wonder that people don't realize that no one comes out of COVID life unscathed. Jobs, fear, quarantine, masks, school. Everyone experiences some level of COVID induced suffering even if some people feel the suffering is unnecessary (like wearing masks). I don't know why some teachers who aren't in the CDC high risk groups are unwilling to do their part and teach.
Second, the public discussion of costs and benefits of choices needs to expand. Good Lord, teachers whining about returning to schools drives me nuts. I want to say, "You're not the only factor here." One example of a cost not being discussed is what it means to have unattended 14-18 year olds lounging around for weeks. Bored teenagers are a recipe for mischief. Insofar as unemployment remains high, there won't be jobs for them. Sickened teachers a known cost, how many more hidden costs and unintended consequences are we going to run into?
Third, I can't figure out what is going on with testing, but widespread, regular testing of teachers sense to me. I think teachers should suck it up and return to school. But the populace that benefits from this should incur the cost of testing teachers for COVID. The earlier an infection is noted the better for the teacher, for the hiring of subs, the quarantining of their students, etc. Psychologically, I think it can help teachers feel more at rest that they aren't just being dumped into a situation they find fearful but that there is also some community support for them.
Even during this epidemic, teachers are still less at risk for disease than ever in history. How did we manage to keep schools open in the past, while educating kids better at far lower cost? The real risk for teachers is welcoming the public to evaluate their own priorities against those being expressed by teachers.
Put up a plastic shield. Wear a mask. Teach from the pulpit. Don't fool around with students. Plenty of other people working thru the pandemic.
What this reveals is that public schools are bad. Privatize them all and handout school vouchers. It looks like the dems will all go for homeschooling. There is the Khan academy now on the iphone. We could divorce the schools from education and assign them just the task of socialization.
“We haven't been told yet whether our grandchildren's school will be open this fall (Verona School District). If it closes we guess we're going to have to bite the bullet and put them in a parochial school. It's clear from this spring that not being in school is not good for them. And that's with a very diligent mother who's doing everything she can to keep up their education. My question is, how is it fair to continue to extract school taxes from us in this situation?”
My daughter lives in Monona and also still doesn’t know if my grandson will be going to in person school. It’s difficult doing the virtual learning and doing a full time job from home. My son in law has been called back to the office to do his job, luckily my daughter is still able to do hers from home.
Not an ideal situation by any means. I feel bad for both sides, the teachers, who will have a tremendously difficult job keeping the kids in masks and distancing and keeping themselves safe from infection while teaching them. Hazard pay for teachers, grocery clerks, delivery people, medical workers should be something worth considering, unless one is a typically selfish rightist and it’s evident there are plenty of you just from reading the comments in this thread.
I get the feeling you folks are not too sympathetic to this teacher...
Ha! Your drollery lightened up my day.
Medical workers, Police, fire-fighters, truck drivers, delivery drivers, meat processors, farmers, grocery store clerks, distribution center workers, etc. all have to work in this environment. Why are teachers so special they shouldn't have to?
There will be lots of demand for remote teachers and, now middle-class and wealthy parents are forming home-based "learning pods" with four to six kids and trying to hire teachers willing to handle a small group. https://bit.ly/2OI51Nq
That said, most districts pay by seniority so older teachers with 20+ years of experience make double the pay of early-years' teachers. A sure-fire way of reducing costs is to offer early retirement to top-scale teachers. (Most teachers are as good as they're going to be after two or three years of experience; some would say five years, but nobody says more than that.)
I think many teachers think Covid spreads like flu or the common cold and therefore they're likely to get it from their students. If they were motivated by self-interest, they'd see that driving people away from the district school system is a dangerous move. Many families won't return, especially those with easy-to-educate children.
Teaching is on a continuum with coal mining.
Yeah, the black faces were evidence of privilege. Then they washed and their White... white h/t AP faces were deplorable. A classic case of diversity.
Why are teachers so special they shouldn't have to?
Of all the groups you mention; teachers tend, more than the others, to form unions that donate heavily to democrat politicians. Police and fire-fighters do as well, but they also have a different relationship with the government, and right now the narrative needs the police to be a diversion from the other forms of government that are abusing us (however, in Houston, our mayor has spent the last couple of years denigrating our fire-fighters).
Howard says, so cleverly, he thinks:
What a fraidy cat. The No Mask re-opening in Tx, Az and Fla were a huge open air experiment that proved PDJT 100% right. The Covid is disappearing almost like magic, it's a beautiful thing just fantastic, nobody could believe it. Summer heat and herd immunity are keeping the virus in check in the red states just like the Donald predicted against the silly and cowardly Stalinist demands from pointy headed liberal egghead so-called experts who warned of out of control corona outbreaks. I cannot understand why some teachers don't have absolute confidence in the Betsy DeVoss school reopening plan."
But Howard, you left out California, where cases are rising also. California had a tightly controlled regimen, and it is a Democratic place where Trump does not rule. But, hey, why ruin a beautiful theory?
One aspect of this problem I have yet to see discussed. Classroom order and control. Teachers have had their control over the classroom destroyed in recent decades. The romantic ideology of the open classroom and the spontaneous joy of learning mantras have also eroded the old days of "sit in rows, raise your hand, and don't talk out of turn." I would have some sympathy for these teachers if they insisted on restoring this kind of draconian social distancing and control as a price for going back to work. Not only would that seem perfectly reasonable as a way to deal with the virus, it would be vastly preferable from a purely educational stand point to the disorder that is now such a destructive and discouraging force in teachers' practice. Of course in Madison, that would bring down the revolutionary guards, so perhaps it can't be. It should be.
"No man is an island, but - no matter what I do - someone's always attempting to undermine everything."
His name is Murphy. Don't take it personally.
In my neighborhood there are lawn signs everywhere proclaiming what heroes our local teachers are. Apparently they achieved this distinction by sitting at home and pretending to be teaching online. Two of my neighbors are teachers. One I've known since the day she was born. Both gave up even the pretext after three weeks.
I'm wondering if the signs will come down if/when they refuse to go back to work in the Fall. Will they still be heroes then? Can't wait to hear the spin from our lefty friends if that happens.
Well, I stopped with "...anti-science administration..." propoganda. Maybe she should stop teaching cause she sure doesn't follow the top scientists in this field. I'm not talking about those two idiot bureaucrats Dr. Fauci or Dr. Brix. Sweden's health agency says open schools did not spur pandemic spread among children. The report showed that severe cases of COVID-19 were very rare among both Swedish [left open schools] and Finnish [closed all schools] children aged 1 to 19, with no deaths reported. A comparison of the incidence of COVID-19 in different professions suggested no increased risk for teachers. I live in CA and there are 9 million school age children in our state, and not a single child with a Covid death has occurred among them. That’s right. There have been 27,400 positive tests among these nine million kids, but all of them, positively all of them, have been either asymptomatic or mildly ill—as children are wont to become—and have recovered. But like this idiot teacher cited by AA, the L.A. School districts Union recently proclaimed that no schools should open in LA until there is a Charter School freeze; the police are defunded; Medicare-for-all is adopted by the US Congress; new state taxes on the wealthy are enacted; and there is a Federal bailout of the LA school district. The MSM has switched recently from the death count to the case count. Hey, I wonder why??? I really don't blame this teacher. Without doubt, every institution in the USA has let us down these past 6 months. Moreover, our so-called experts are getting worst with their pronouncements. Dr. Fauci loves the fact that NY has done such a fine job. Really? NY boasts the worst record in the World, except for China, which lies about their numbers like they do about everything else.
Ann Althouse said...
"I get the feeling you folks are not too sympathetic to this teacher..."
Only because she doesn't seem too concerned about her students,and her stance puts her in league with those who use political stunts to influence an upcoming election.
Blogger bagoh20 said...
We need kids to be educated. ...
Exactly right. Good, bad or indifferent, they need some sort of education.
If they don't go to school, they will be educated by every talking head on TV, YouTube, twitter....
Oh....wait....
Gov Gretchen Whitmer is keeping us safe, is following the science, and has not been political.
Cuomo has tried this same game, and got Fauci to declare that he had "done it the right way." I guess doing it the right way means letting it spread like wildfire through nursing homes and public transportation that now the state and city are close to herd immunity. "Following the science evidently means micro-managing small businesses to death and lecturing people on their bad behavior, even when there's been no uptick in cases following reopening and massive testing.
Summer heat and herd immunity are keeping the virus in check in the red states just like the Donald predicted against the silly and cowardly Stalinist demands from pointy headed liberal egghead so-called experts who warned of out of control corona outbreaks. I cannot understand why some teachers don't have absolute confidence in the Betsy DeVoss school reopening plan.<
The only missing element Howard is the Wall. You are such a dick.
The sick cases are from Mexico and some are turning themselves into Border Patrol agents to get care.
I would be in favor of giving the local school expenditure amounts to parents. Let them find a school that wants the money. Even a weak charter is better than the standard public school.
Screw her. The whole damned world is going to hell in a hand basket. Just sayin.
So the sheltered workshops teachers infest are being exposed to what all else live with day to day. Teach or learn to code.
@Jon Burack, what do you expect from an educated fool like Howard?
Earlier I had said:
They are already producing hundreds of millions of doses so they will be ready to administer as soon as the trials are approved.
Perhaps I was wrong. Today I read that AstraZeneca is in production of 2 billion, not million, billion doses.
That is costing somebody, probably taxpayers, a LOT of money.
Unless the vaccine turns out to be really dangerous or completely ineffective I can't imagine it not being used.
Dr Fauci's wife will approve it flaws, ineffectiveness and all mumbling something about it may not be perfect but it is better than nothing.
Then we will all be forced to take it.
Remember, they are producing 2bn doses before they have even started phase 2 trials.
Yeesh!
John Henry
Exactly right. Good, bad or indifferent, they need some sort of education.
When UBI passes, we are quickly going to develop an uneducated and unproductive underclass content live off government checks. (I know, I know, but now it will done openly)
We are going to return to the days of bread and circuses, and the votes of these people will be openly bought. Millions of people won't bother to learn more than basic numeracy and literacy, if that. The nasty secret no one is talking about is the participation rate last spring in online learning. The districts are scared, because only about 20% of the kids showed up online. In my experience they were split between seniors desperate to bring their grade up to passing, and good self motivated students who are probably going to shift to totally online if given the opportunity.
Do not be surprised at the headlines in October and November about the low participation rates. And don't believe it when they say it's about resources. My district has given every student a laptop and access to the internet. We still only got about 20%.
I would have some sympathy for these teachers if they insisted on restoring this kind of draconian social distancing and control as a price for going back to work. Not only would that seem perfectly reasonable as a way to deal with the virus, it would be vastly preferable from a purely educational stand point
My district was going to open in a hybrid system, where the kids would be divided into two groups. The first group would be on campus on Monday and Tuesday. The second group would be on campus Thursday and Friday. Wednesday, everyone would be at home working and teaching online while our classrooms were deep cleaned every week. The groups not on campus would be attending class online that day. (This implied that teachers were going to have to work each day with a live camera feed going out over the internet.) The groups on campus would have to wear masks, have their temperature taken and practice social distancing. The first question from a teacher was: "We can't keep them from using their cell phones in class, how are we going to make them wear masks and social distance?" "I don't know" was the answer.
Student behavior being what it is, there are really only two options, and to be honest I don't know which is the right one. Either we open as normal and ignore COVID concerns, or we move completely online.
Another apostate from the Progressive Church? Here's to science, reconciliation, and conservation.
The sick cases are from Mexico and some are turning themselves into Border Patrol agents to get care.
Progressives are standing up to emigration reform, for transgeographic transmission, for diversity, and higher foreign student returns.
"The districts are scared, because only about 20% of the kids showed up online."
That's what I hear from my daughter who works for the Verona school district. The fact of the matter is, for whatever reason, on-line teaching is not teaching. And if they're not teaching, public schools are not entitled to the vast resources they commandeer. You would think the people educating our children would be smart enough to understand that.
Opening too fast has great cost: casualties from COVID.
Opening too slow has great cost: casualties from a ruined economy.
It is war.
No one knows the perfect time but we must decide.
Now teachers feel what soldiers feel.
"It isn’t fair to ask me to be part of a massive, unnecessary science experiment. I am not a human research subject. I will not do it.
There is no point in reading further. We know based on just this short passage that: A teacher, an adult person, thinks that it’s okay to refuse to do the job for which h/she is being paid if, in his/her opinion, it’s not “fair”. And, the teacher considers that what is happening all over the world is not relevant in the US; in other words, we are collectively inferior in terms of our ability to run our schools. And, the teacher is part of what she thinks of as an “unnecessary” endeavor. The total focus is on “me” and “I”. No mention of or reference to students’ needs or parents’ circumstances.
We have it all. Succinct and clear.
And if they're not teaching, public schools are not entitled to the vast resources they commandeer. You would think the people educating our children would be smart enough to understand that.
Some of them are. My district was desperate to get us back in the classroom. The union and some of the parents revolted, so we're going to open up online, transition to 50/50 and then transition to school as normal.
Teacher, Teacher said:
"Schools are taking the brunt of economic inequality and an anti-science administration<."
Ah, there it is. Doesn't take long for Orange Man Bad to show up.
Look, I get it. A while back, during an economic downturn, I had to substitute teach a lot to earn money, and I do NOT envy teachers in what they have to put up with as day-long daycare providers, regardless of a student's age. I rather admire them and advocate when possible that they get rewarded more handsomely.
But it is a rule of science...adapt or die. Harsh reality. At some point, life will return to something resembling what we knew before the COVID age. I don't wish for anyone to lose his or her job. But there are choices.
"I get the feeling you folks are not too sympathetic to this teacher..."
Althouse gets an A in reading comprehension today.
James K,
"... insofar as she has health issues that make her reluctant to go back to work."
Where did you get that information? It's not in her article.
Where did you get that information? It's not in her article.
I was referring to the teacher in the comment: "I'm a public school teacher with an underlying condition." You're right that the teacher in the article didn't claim that.
Now, here's the part where the teachers find out their retirement systems weren't ever fully funded.
Original Mike said...
You would think the people educating our children would be smart enough to understand that.
7/20/20, 9:39 PM
Assuming facts not in evidence...
Michael Ryan said...
Now, here's the part where the teachers find out their retirement systems weren't ever fully funded.
7/21/20, 7:16 AM
And that TOO will be everyone else's fault but the union, their members, and the D politicians that colluded together to get here.
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