A *9 year* prison recommendation for non-violent crimes committed by a 67-year-old man. https://t.co/9w7IUa2f09
— Chuck Ross (@ChuckRossDC) February 10, 2020
I agree that the recommended sentence is ridiculously harsh, but not because us people in our 60s deserve extra compassion.
Why am I giving this post my "Trump pardons" tag? The more vindictive the prosecution looks, the easier it seems for Trump to do what we expect him to do.
Posts
93 comments:
The only question is whether PDJT will wait until after the election to pardon Stone.
THEOLDMAN
Many more to come IMO
Wow, talk about abuse of power. This is disgusting. They want him to do 9 years for LYING. This sickens me, I hope Trump pardons him immediately.
he's complaining 'cause he's going to lose years 68-76?
AS IF people do things at that age
(i KNOW that y'all are that age, but...) Think about your years 20-29?
Think those are LESS important?
What will be the recommended sentence for Kevin Clinesmith, the FBI lawyer who hid and altered CIA messages about Carter Page's previous collaboration with the CIA?
Don't forget this is on top of how the FBI conducted the arrest. They tipped off CNN then showed up with a dozen agents guns drawn, toting a ram to bust down the door. Stone opened the door - it was all a media show. Another abuse of power by the FBI.
Why am I giving this post my "Trump pardons" tag? The more vindictive the prosecution looks, the easier it seems for Trump to do what we expect him to do.
That’s a canny insight, Professor.
In the case of Roger Stone, an aggravating factor was that he actively supported Donald Trump's political campaign.
The same aggravating factor applies to Michael Flynn. In order to deal with Flynn's appointment to the position of National Security Advisor, the FBI used a transcript of a secretly recorded phone conversation between Flynn and the Russian Ambassador. Then the FBI interviewed Flynn about that conversation, intending to find discrepancies between the transcript and the FBI interview. Based on those discrepancies, Flynn was charged with lying to the FBI and now faces prison time.
"us people in our 60s"
But what about WE people in our 60s?
he's complaining 'cause he's going to lose years 68-76?
AS IF people do things at that age
@gilbar, I have a nice list of accomplishments from that time, with a couple years still to go.
They tipped off CNN then showed up with a dozen agents guns drawn, toting a ram to bust down the door.
@cacimbo, more like two dozen, IIRC
How many years for WaPoop, CNN, and MSNBC? They lie to us all the time. And what about Rep. Adam Scheisskopf? His alternative memo to the Nunes memo was full of lies, and the OIG proved it. Is he to lie to the American people, the Congress and the Executive Branch without consequence? What kind of example is that for our children? Will people in Russia, China, Africa and South America be able to better their governance with the example of Adam Schiff before them?
A candid world demands an answer.
@gilbar, I have a nice list of accomplishments from that time, with a couple years still to go.
Seriously? compared to your twenties?
You're going to SERIOUSLY argue, that the roof of your house has more accomplishments than the foundation?
Seriously?
admittedly, i was being snarky when i said AS IF :)
Watching the great documentary Get Me Roger Stone you have to conclude at a minimum that Roger is prison-curious.
What'd You do in your twenties?
"Oh, i finished school, got married, started a business, had kids... What'd You Do?"
"Me? I spent those nine years in Prison"
They also went after him knowing that the Russia dossier was a hoax, and there was very little reason to suspect he was working with Russia.
I wonder if any of the reporters who pushed the collusion feel a little bit bad about what they've done to people's lives.
I am all for pardoning people who are set up in a perjury trap, but Roger Stone, like all Republicans has to learn the Bill Clinton phrase, "I don't really recall" when asked anything by the Feds.
We people, not us people.
The extra compassion is because of not much life left to try out redemption.
Also the taxpayers want to bail out before high medical costs kick in.
In the 60s the brain is no longer fully formed. People start reasoning like women.
The Scooter Libby case set the precedent.
"Why am I giving this post my "Trump pardons" tag? The more vindictive the prosecution looks, the easier it seems for Trump to do what we expect him to do.
'That’s a canny insight, Professor.'"
I'm not understanding the insight. Is it that the prosecutors are intentionally being unreasonable so they give Trump a reason to pardon? That makes no sense.
After (just off the top of my head) Ruby Ridge, Sen Stevens, the rancher guy, Hillary, Podesta and Trump, the DOJ needs a deep and thorough cleaning and I don't see Barr as being capable.
Think those are LESS important?
They are when you're 67.
Browndog said...
The Scooter Libby case set the precedent.
Or Martha Stewart. Same same. It's all Comey. When will people realize how awful he has been for this country?
This outrage could not have occurred without the willing participation of a federal judge. The sentencing guidelines did not compel this result. Rather than stand between Roger Stone and the vindictiveness of the prosecutors, the judge piled on her own vindictiveness. Judge Sullivan is doing the same thing in the Michael Flynn case.
Seriously? compared to your twenties?
@gilbar, college, unable to land good job after graduation due to 1-A classification, draft notice (you may have heard of Vietnam?), graduate school on the GI Bill, married in late twenties, junior position in high tech start up. Company went bust. Starting career over in a new job in another small startup (I would be in my thirties when it went bust).
At 67 I was one of the most senior engineers in a large corporation with a track record of successful projects over the years and an entry in the company wiki. Working on interesting and challenging projects as a direct report to a corporate officer. Numerous young engineers I had mentored now earning awards in their own right (damned proud of that!). Received a patent for machine learning applications to healthcare delivery. Now retired. Living the good life. I might want to swap my libido today for the libido I had as a twenty-something, but that and my musculature as a young martial artist who pumped a lot of iron versus a paunchy old geezer with metal joints are about all I would be willing to exchange.
Or Martha Stewart. Same same. It's all Comey. When will people realize how awful he has been for this country?
Stewart wasn't political.
Scooter Libby:
-Investigating a non- crime. Valerie Plame was not undercover, and she being Joe Wilson's wife was public knowledge.
-The target wasn't Libby; it was Dick Cheney.
-The prosecutors knew from the beginning who committed the so called crime, yet kept investigating until someone close to the target was prosecuted.
-The sum total of all the crimes were "giving false statements.
-Elderly man given an extremely harsh sentence when probation was within the sentencing guidelines
-Liberals cheer, and use this as proof as to how corrupt this republican President is.
At 67 I was one of the most...
hmmmm... And WHERE do you think'd you be IF you spent your twenties IN PRISON?
No offense, but are y'all senile, or something?
The Coup plotters had better get more than that!!! There are so many, they should probably put them in Gitmo.
I'm not understanding the insight. Is it that the prosecutors are intentionally being unreasonable so they give Trump a reason to pardon?
The way Althouse and I see it, Trump needs to lay the groundwork for a pardon. The judge and prosecutors are intentionally being unreasonable to demonstrate how much they hate Trump, not to help him. But Trump is saying to the public, look at this old man being hounded by the grandstanding lying liars in the FBI while Joe and Hunter Biden go free. The more sympathy he generates for Stone, the less heat he takes for the inevitable pardon.
@gilbar, okay I didn’t understand your frame of reference. Still, when I got that draft notice I would not have bet that I would still be alive at 25.
There is also a Jullian Assange aspect to this.
This is a man that will probable die in jail for the crime of contributing to Hillary's loss without facing a jury.
Browndog said...
There is also a Jullian Assange aspect to this.
This is a man that will probable die in jail for the crime of contributing to Hillary's loss without facing a jury.
But Seth Rich, who gave him the thumb drive with the data is dead, so there is that.
@Buster,
The prosecutors are asking for nine years. The judge has not made a sentencing decision yet.
judge Jackson, was the attorney for William 'cold cash' Jefferson, since when were assanges tidbits top secret, until they involved Hillary Clinton,
now I give roger stone, demerits for hanging around with leftist twink randy credico, and deighning to legitimate that national enquirer story planted likely by fusion gps, but those aren't indictable offenses,
how have you been, mike Sylvester?
Blogger buster said...
This outrage could not have occurred without the willing participation of a federal judge. The sentencing guidelines did not compel this result. Rather than stand between Roger Stone and the vindictiveness of the prosecutors, the judge piled on her own vindictiveness. Judge Sullivan is doing the same thing in the Michael Flynn case.
---------------++++++++++++++
do judges go to cocktail parties?
Exactly because Trump is older than 67, he knows how many wonderful things imprisoned for unjustly high sentence 67 yo Roger Stone would be missing. Exactly because of this he can empathize.
the ny state prosecutors also charged manafort, to prevent him from being pardoned, but the appeals court reversed that situation, they used steele and klimnik, who both worked with deripasha, to set the 'narrative', the horowitz reports reveals the earlier connection,
gilbar, were you also a dick in your twenties, or did this character flaw develop later?
Just in case there was any doubt, progs also lie about wanting sentencing reform and an end to the "carceral state."
They just want their enemies to get all the harsh sentences, and the state to be a tool they can use.
The DOJ recommended nine years for stuff they didn't prove - and they didn't have to prove it because they didn't charge him for it.
Among the many disgusting "features" of our current prosecution system - don't get me started - is this relatively new tendency to convict on relatively minor things (including "process" crimes) and recommend sentencing the "perp" as if he had done the things the prosecutor claims but never bothered to prove.
Just another case of the Federal Prosecutions being used as political gang assassinations of innocent people.There are thousands a year.But Defense lawyers cannot complain.Our fees are all that you own. And that is the biggest threat used by the Feds. Plead or else!
so in order to prevent a slapdown like with Arthur Andersen, they force general Flynn into a plea, it's taken years for Sydney powell, to cut through all that underbrush to get to the truth, and it was all the fruit of the steele dossier, the most dangerous piece of dezinforma since the Zinoviev letter, which toppled the first macdonald govt,
Those silly words about nobody being deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law means the Feds will use the process of law to deprive you of life , liberty and property.
the model was john Sirica's collusion with the Watergate prosecutors, now if you're more conspiratorial, one might consider more severe pressure exerted on howard hunt,
Defrauding the American people deserves a harsh sentence. One after another of Trump’s associates aided and abetted that scheme and their asses are all sitting in jail.
I see you guys are all squishy and progressive over civil rights when it's a flaccid chunky pasty old white dude getting the shaft. Pale-faces matter
While liberals decriminalize every thing in sight, try to abolish cash bonds, and the police, they tout themselves as very hard line law and order types when it comes to..well, non-liberals.
turbo tim Geithner didn't pay taxes for 5 years, but they had to make him treasury secretary, even though he failed to stop the lehman collapse, which would have made his promotion unnecessary,
Blogger MayBee said...
They also went after him knowing that the Russia dossier was a hoax, and there was very little reason to suspect he was working with Russia.
I wonder if any of the reporters who pushed the collusion feel a little bit bad about what they've done to people's lives.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!! *wipes tear* Oh, you're funny.
natasha Bertrand is still citing david laufman as evidence so no they 'aren't over macho grande'
Touche, Browndog
What “government” recommends a chickenshit sentence like this while the “dossier” and Russia hoax perps remain unprosecuted and unnoticed by Mueller’s button men?
Age IS relevant to *unjust* sentences. What if the unfair punishment is 20 lashes? That would kill many 67 year olds but not many 22 year olds.
Stone will be pardoned one day after the election. No matter if Trump wins or loses.
Why Stone is looking at 9 years, while Comey and McCabe seem to have skated away Scot-free is absurd. We have two forms of justice, one for D's and one for R's.
At 67 a nine-year sentence could mean "Jail For life" - age does matter.
Can't leave a guy like Stone free to work his evil on an undeserving world!
Narr
We can all sleep better now
Only an incompetent boob of a defense attorney would NOT argue an older's client age as a mitigating factor. Has nothing to do with special consideration per se. And you, a law professor!
they don't care, stone is an unperson, just like Assange became in 2016, before he was speaking truth to power
https://twitter.com/davereaboi/status/1227286711316733955
Browndog rightly noted,
"Scooter Libby:
-Investigating a non- crime. Valerie Plame was not undercover, and she being Joe Wilson's wife was public knowledge.
-The target wasn't Libby; it was Dick Cheney.
-The prosecutors knew from the beginning who committed the so called crime, yet kept investigating until someone close to the target was prosecuted.
-The sum total of all the crimes were "giving false statements.
-Elderly man given an extremely harsh sentence when probation was within the sentencing guidelines
-Liberals cheer, and use this as proof as to how corrupt this republican President is."
It's actually worse. Way worse. The "lie" wasn't a lie at all. Libby's recollection of a distant conversation with NYT reporter Judith Miller differed somewhat from her recollection of that conversation, so they convinced a grand jury he must be lying (!). That's terrible to begin with. But it gets worse. Three years after the trial, Miller wrote a book and in it she explained that prosecutor Fitzgerald induced her to give what she now realized was false testimony. By withholding critical information about the context of that phone call and manipulating her memory as he prepared her to testify, she said Fitzgerald “steered” her “in the wrong direction.” She eventually looked at her original notes again and realized that her recollection didn't contradict Libby at all.
And Flynn is in limbo.
The judge “indefinitely postponed” his sentencing.
—She eventually looked at her original notes again and realized that her recollection didn't contradict Libby at all.—
She was an idiot for not saying “let me check my notes.”
That’s what I would have done.
Fitzgerald that fucker. Wasn’t he the one out of Illinois?
This was an insane prosecution where the government’s witness exonerated the defendant. This is 100% a political prosecution and the judge would be right to throw it out and sanction the prosecutors. Further, the gag order is a supreme violation of the defendant’s right to free speech. David Axelrod ought to be very worried someone is coming for him, next.
it's like shooting womp rats, no longer sporting
fitz was insulating Michigan state for a year and a half from larry Nasser, before the accounts of the assaulted gymnists came out
"I agree that the recommended sentence is ridiculously harsh, but not because us people in our 60s deserve extra compassion."
Sure we do. We're on the decline, our minds make promises our bodies can't fill and past glories become distant memories...
Roger Stone was the last gasp effort of the Mueller Inquisition. For those who didn't follow the actual details of the Mueller Inquisition, in June of 2018 William Barr wrote a memo that he sent to Rod Rosenstein that outlined the problems with Weissman's theory of obstruction- basically, Barr wrote that Mueller etal. really did need a crime whose investigation was being obstructed in order to target Trump. Starting not long after that memo was published, Mueller's team restarted the effort to prove that the Trump Campaign really was involved with Wikileaks and their publication of Russian Government sourced DNC e-mails.
This part of the investigation had been dormant for almost a year at that point in the Summer of 2018 because Mueller could never prove a connection between Assange and the Russians. Stone had spent all of the Summer and Fall of 2016 pretending he had an in at Wikileaks- he continuously made predictions about how Wikileaks was going to release damaging material on the Clinton Campaign and the DNC. The problem was that Stone was simply repeating the same information Wikileaks was releasing publically before each e-mail dump. Additionally, all of Stone's predictions about the actual content of the dumps was laughably wrong. Mueller took Stone at his word about having an in with Wikileaks, and so sought to find the evidence of it so that he could include Trump in a conspiracy to hack and realease DNC e-mails. However, it was clear from Stone's e-mails and texts that Stone was lying about having such an in with Wikileaks. In pressuring Stone's associates to provide the proof of this in, they instead simply told the truth in the end, that Stone was full of shit and had actually pressured them to lie for Stone. In short, Stone didn't want to publically admit that he had been lying his ass off since 2016, and to Congress on the same issue. Stone's charging documents proved that the Trump Campaign had no contact or influence with or over Wikileaks- it was all Stone lie.
Does Stone deserve 10 years in prison for this? No- the lies were only material in the sense that Mueller had to pretend to believe them in order to try to get to Trump, but I think it all but certain that Mueller and his team knew in 2017 that Stone was lying and had basically incontrovertible truth of it from Stone's e-mails and texts that they already had, but then proceeded to waste time and resources reproving what they already knew. The proof of this is in the Mueller Report itself in the section where Mueller admits they had zero proof Wikileaks got the e-mails from the Russians.
I have no sympathy for Stone here- rather than admit he was a bullshit artist, he doubled down on the lie and tried to suborn perjury to cover it up. This is especially annoying to me because the truth would have saved Stone and undone the Russian Hoax to a great extent.
I'll have less sympathy for Stone when the Fed Storm Troopers start their 6AM raids on the residences of Brennan, Comey, McCabe, etc., with CNN cameras in tow.
SOBs anyway...
There is reporting just now that the DOJ leadership disagrees with the sentencing recommendation and will intervene.
The extra compassion is because of not much life left to try out redemption...
Also the taxpayers want to bail out before high medical costs kick in...
In the 60s the brain is no longer fully formed. People start reasoning like women...
Burma Shave...
-Only an incompetent boob of a defense attorney would NOT argue an older's client age as a mitigating factor. Has nothing to do with special consideration per se. And you, a law professor—-
If you’re a member of the Mob, however...
Interesting:
https://mobile.twitter.com/cbs_herridge/status/1227296502302887936?s=21
More than just the DOJ leadership disagrees with the proposed sentencing!!
DOJ leadership has announced the sentencing recommendation it heard from its own lawyers was different than that presented to the judge.
That is evidence of prosecutorial overreach, if any were needed.
better luck never:
https://amgreatness.com/2020/02/10/nevertrump-burns-leftist-cash-on-failed-impeachment-crusade/
What do women reason like after 60 if men reason like women?
One after another of Trump’s associates aided and abetted that scheme and their asses are all sitting in jail.
What scheme?
no not really
https://twitter.com/seanmdav/status/1227325890868191232?s=20
Oops--the heirs of Bob Mueller and Andrew Weissman just got their butts spanked. New, shorter sentencing recommendation coming for Stone.
They are finally cleaning house at the DOJ.
Tired of WINNING? Vote Dem in 2020
Prosecutors--resigned, forced to resign, or allowed to resign?
And I turned twenty-one in prison doing life without parole
No one could steer me right but Mama tried, Mama tried
Mama tried to raise me better, but her pleading I denied
That leaves only me to blame 'cause Mama tried
Sung by Merle Haggard
It's the new Democrat bombshell with Schumer now demanding an IG investigation into AG Barr for the injustice of noting 7 to 9 years as unreasonable for a non-violent process crime. It's all the Democrats do now.
Yes, it now appears this entire recommendation was a ruse by the two prosecutors to make it look like inappropriate interference. That they apparently lied to the DoJ pretty much proves it.
All 4 prosecutors have now resigned from the case. Big deal. All that's left is the sentencing by the hack Obama judge, and they're still at DOJ.
Jonathan Swan
Verified account @jonathanvswan
SCOOP: Trump suddenly pulls former U.S. attorney for D.C.'s nomination to Treasury post ...
Liu was confirmed in September 2017 to lead the largest U.S. attorney's office in the country, overseeing a number of politically charged investigations that included the case against Trump associates Roger Stone, Paul Manafort and other spinoffs from the Mueller investigation.
The United States Attorneys Manual forbids a prosecutor from considering a person's political association or personal beliefs (among other things) when deciding whether to implement charges. A similar rule must also apply to sentencing recommendations.
Because this is obviously a politically motivate prosecution, the judge needs to take a much more active role in regulating the behavior of the attorneys. The nine year recommendation is so bizarre that, I think, it triggers the Court's inherent power to sanction. At a minimum, the prosecutors should be forbidden from practicing in district courts and federal appellate courts for a few months or years. How about nine years?
All four of the prosecuting attorneys have since resigned from the case. One is leaving the DOJ entirely, the other three plan to stay on. If they’re allowed to.
Post a Comment