August 21, 2019

"The cancellation of what was considered an important state visit in Denmark was described as a 'farce' by the leader of the populist Danish People's Party, Kristian Thulesen Dahl."

"'What is this man thinking of though? And with grounds that are worthy of an April Fools' joke,' he wrote in a tweet. Danish Conservative MP Rasmus Jarlov, who earlier said that 'of all things that are not going to happen, this is the most unlikely,' accused Mr Trump of lacking respect for his country in a tweet on Wednesday."

BBC on the Greenland ruckus.

ADDED: It's August. It's hot. We're tired of thinking about the southern border and "racism" and — who remembers? — Mueller and whatever it was last week. We're having a mental vacation is Greenland. So cool. So remote. So imagination-y. The escapism is fantastic.



And who cares if Danes are miffed? They're white people. Nice choice of antagonists, Trump. Why do they have Greenland anyway? They were not the first people of Greenland or even the first Europeans:
In prehistoric times, Greenland was home to several successive Paleo-Eskimo cultures known today primarily through archaeological finds. The earliest entry of the Paleo-Eskimo into Greenland is thought to have occurred about 2500 BC. From around 2500 BC to 800 BC, southern and western Greenland were inhabited by the Saqqaq culture.... From 2400 BC to 1300 BC, the Independence I culture existed in northern Greenland.... Around 800 BC, the Saqqaq culture disappeared and the Early Dorset culture emerged in western Greenland and the Independence II culture in northern Greenland. The Dorset culture was the first culture to extend throughout the Greenlandic coastal areas, both on the west and east coasts. It lasted until the total onset of the Thule culture in 1500 AD. The Dorset culture population lived primarily from hunting of whales and caribou.

From 986, Greenland's west coast was settled by Icelanders and Norwegians, through a contingent of 14 boats led by Erik the Red. They formed three settlements—known as the Eastern Settlement, the Western Settlement and the Middle Settlement—on fjords near the southwesternmost tip of the island. They shared the island with the late Dorset culture inhabitants who occupied the northern and western parts, and later with the Thule culture that entered from the north. Norse Greenlanders submitted to Norwegian rule in 1261 under the Kingdom of Norway (872–1397)....

The Norse settlements, such as Brattahlíð, thrived for centuries but disappeared sometime in the 15th century, perhaps at the onset of the Little Ice Age. Apart from some runic inscriptions, no contemporary records or historiography survives from the Norse settlements.... Recent archeological studies somewhat challenge the general assumption that the Norse colonisation had a dramatic negative environmental effect on the vegetation... More recent evidence suggests that the Norse, who never numbered more than about 2,500, gradually abandoned the Greenland settlements over the 1400s as walrus ivory, the most valuable export from Greenland, decreased in price due to competition with other sources of higher-quality ivory, and that there was actually little evidence of starvation or difficulties.....

In 1605–1607, King Christian IV of Denmark sent a series of expeditions to Greenland and Arctic waterways to locate the lost eastern Norse settlement and assert Danish sovereignty over Greenland. The expeditions were mostly unsuccessful, partly due to leaders who lacked experience with the difficult arctic ice and weather conditions, and partly because the expedition leaders were given instructions to search for the Eastern Settlement on the east coast of Greenland just north of Cape Farewell, which is almost inaccessible due to southward drifting ice. The pilot on all three trips was English explorer James Hall.

After the Norse settlements died off, Greenland came under the de facto control of various Inuit groups, but the Danish government never forgot or relinquished the claims to Greenland that it had inherited from the Norse. When it re-established contact with Greenland in the early 17th century, Denmark asserted its sovereignty over the island. In 1721, a joint mercantile and clerical expedition led by Danish-Norwegian missionary Hans Egede was sent to Greenland, not knowing whether a Norse civilization remained there. This expedition is part of the Dano-Norwegian colonization of the Americas. After 15 years in Greenland, Hans Egede left his son Paul Egede in charge of the mission there and returned to Denmark, where he established a Greenland Seminary. This new colony was centred at Godthåb ("Good Hope") on the southwest coast. Gradually, Greenland was opened up to Danish merchants, and closed to those from other countries.

When the union between the crowns of Denmark and Norway was dissolved in 1814, the Treaty of Kiel severed Norway's former colonies and left them under the control of the Danish monarch. Norway occupied then-uninhabited eastern Greenland as Erik the Red's Land in July 1931, claiming that it constituted terra nullius. Norway and Denmark agreed to submit the matter in 1933 to the Permanent Court of International Justice, which decided against Norway.

Greenland's connection to Denmark was severed on 9 April 1940, early in World War II, after Denmark was occupied by Nazi Germany.
On 8 April 1941, the United States occupied Greenland to defend it against a possible invasion by Germany. The United States occupation of Greenland continued until 1945....

During this war... Governor Eske Brun ruled the island under a law of 1925 that allowed governors to take control under extreme circumstances; Governor Aksel Svane was transferred to the United States to lead the commission to supply Greenland... After the collapse of the Third Reich, Albert Speer briefly considered escaping in a small aeroplane to hide out in Greenland, but changed his mind and decided to surrender to the United States Armed Forces.

Greenland had been a protected and very isolated society until 1940. The Danish government had maintained a strict monopoly of Greenlandic trade, allowing only small scale troaking with Scottish whalers. In wartime Greenland developed a sense of self-reliance through self-government and independent communication with the outside world. Despite this change, in 1946 a commission including the highest Greenlandic council, the Landsrådene, recommended patience and no radical reform of the system. Two years later, the first step towards a change of government was initiated when a grand commission was established. A final report (G-50) was presented in 1950: Greenland was to be a modern welfare state with Denmark as sponsor and example. In 1953, Greenland was made an equal part of the Danish Kingdom. Home rule was granted in 1979.

Following World War II, the United States developed a geopolitical interest in Greenland, and in 1946 the United States offered to buy the island from Denmark for $100,000,000. Denmark refused to sell it. Historically this repeated an interest by Secretary of State William H. Seward. In 1867 he worked with former senator Robert J. Walker to explore the possibility of buying Greenland and perhaps Iceland. Opposition in Congress ended this project. In the 21st century, the United States, according to WikiLeaks, remains interested in investing in the resource base of Greenland and in tapping hydrocarbons off the Greenlandic coast. In August 2019, the American president Donald Trump again proposed to buy the territory, prompting premier Kim Kielsen to issue the statement, “Greenland is not for sale and cannot be sold, but Greenland is open for trade and cooperation with other countries — including the United States.”
For more information on what happened to Denmark on April 9, 1940, here's "Denmark in World War II" (Wikipedia). Key sentence: "Sixteen Danish soldiers died in the invasion, but after two hours the Danish government surrendered, believing that resistance was useless and hoping to work out an advantageous agreement with Germany."

310 comments:

1 – 200 of 310   Newer›   Newest»
gspencer said...

Oh no! The cheese-making and beer-brewing Danes are upset with the Don. Ha ha ha.

“I’m gonna make them an offer they can’t refuse”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeldwfOwuL8

mccullough said...

Trump is still upset about the death of Hamlet

madAsHell said...

He has them talking.

wild chicken said...

Trump acted stupidly. Denmark has its shit together in a quiet, no-nonsense way.

Respect!

jim said...

Will be watching this space to find out how all this makes sense, and that our president is not insane.

Great way to break NATO, start pressuring allies to fork over territory. BEST explanation is that the man is demented.

dreams said...

Well, it's always politically correct to bad mouth Trump.

tim in vermont said...

Yeah, Trump seems to have screwed the pooch on this one. Whatever. Still the best president of my lifetime. Reagan had his hands full with the Soviets though.

dreams said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
CJinPA said...

This Trump fella is no statesman. We like our statesmen to be vague, passive-aggressive and ineffectual.

Seriously, I can understand the Danes not looking forward to a visit under those circumstances.

jim said...

Next best explanation is he's trying to distract us from something else.

FrankiM said...

All of you who voted for him, how many more instances of this sort of thing will it take to make you think you may have made a huge mistake? He’s a laughing stock to the world.

jim said...

The Danes should say not postponed, cancelled. But, I'm sure they're way to polite for that.

tim in vermont said...

I am sure a state visit by the real president, Hillary would have included hefty donations to her “foundation” in case there was anything the Danes wanted from us.

narciso said...

Well the previoud regime gave 120 k to miftah, trump has made deals with more disparate partners

tim in vermont said...

"He’s a laughing stock to the world.”

No, he’s not. Left leaning polticians and newspapers throughout the world try to make him a laughing stock, but since when do we let other countries choose our leaders?

My understanding is that the rest of the AFC East has gotten together and told the Patriots that it would be better for the division if Belichick were replaced.

Sebastian said...

What's next? Marines on Greenland?

Fernandistein said...

Trump should have a better picture of his plans for Greenland beyond the seaside Trump Tower, perhaps a golf course with a glass dome over the whole shebang.

FrankiM said...

When will you make him take responsibility for his own actions, blaming the Press, the rest of the world and their Press, the man in the moon, just sounds like pathetic excuse making.

tim in vermont said...

I don’t know about the rest of you guys, but I feel shame when The Guardian slams our president. Europeans know better than us! Look at the Treaty of Versailles if you want proof of that! Or the world wars they so blithely undertook, their vast colonial empires.

narciso said...

Its not a priority, like when czar nicholas neefed to offload alaska

jim said...

YEA, WHAT-ABOUT HILLARY DAMN IT!!!

Fen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
tim in vermont said...

"just sounds like pathetic excuse making.”

You said he was a. world wide laughing stock. I say that Hillary Clinton, the alternative you guys most recently offered is a bigger laughing stock, and you guys have yet to take responsibility for that. He’s not perfect. But for blunders, you can’t possibly compare this to the shit show Hillary and Obama got us into in Syria and Libya.

Fen said...

accused Mr Trump of lacking respect for his country in a tweet on Wednesday" he whined, squandering whatever remaining respect I had for the tiny and irrelevant nation of Denmark.

Trump 2016-2028: The Great Unmasking

Unbelievable how so many Trump haters keep stepping on that rake.

Can we patent that?

FrankiM said...

Blame Obama! He should’ve bought Greenland so Trump didn’t have to!

tim in vermont said...

"jim said...
YEA, WHAT-ABOUT HILLARY DAMN IT!!!”

When the Democrats apologize for making her the only realistic alternative to Trump, I will let it go. Even if they acknowledge that she was the only alternative.

We can only compare the acts of presidents to the acts of other presidents.

MikeR said...

Weird story. Makes little sense. I guess I'll wait.

CJinPA said...

Next best explanation is he's trying to distract us from something else.

Or Occam's razor: acquiring Greenland is in the best long-term interests of the country he leads, and after it was prematurely leaked he explained why that was and stressed it was not a top priority, but the publicity surrounding it made the Danes understandably uncomfortable.

Fen said...

Population

Denmark
5.7 mil

Wisconsin
5.8 mil

jim said...

YEA, WHAT-ABOUT HILLARY DAMN IT!!!

FrankiM said...

Blame American Jews for voting Democrat! Greenland would be ours by now if not for the American Jews!

JPS said...

FrankiM,

OK, I'll bite.

"All of you who voted for him,"

I didn't, so you weren't talking to me. But since I ignore what he says and watch what he does, I find him a lot less awful than I was expecting.

"how many more instances of this sort of thing will it take to make you think you may have made a huge mistake?"

Or would have made, in my case. I'm not there yet. I balance stuff like this - annoying, but not consequential - against what's going right, and say, OK. I wish he wouldn't do this, but it's not the end of the world. Or even of our alliance with Denmark, a country Wild Chicken describes well and a good NATO ally.

"He’s a laughing stock to the world."

See, I'm just not that insecure. Let them laugh.

Which brings me to a bigger point. It seems to me that most of the evidence for the Trump=Putin-stooge fantasy was that he said nice things about Putin - while pursuing policies not at all congenial to Russia's interests. Was Obama respected on the world stage? Yes, in the same way. Lots and lots of people said fawning things about him, talked about how wonderful he was. But did they listen to him? Did they take him seriously? I don't think so.

tim in vermont said...

So you are saying that Obama’s ham fisted military adventurism in Syria and Libya were not blunders an order of magnitude or more larger on account of he was cheered on by the Europeans?

Presidents make mistakes. Better that they be settled with a few tweets. Obama’s fuckup has now created open slave markets in Libya. Will we see that in Greenland? Will we see thousands of drowned refugees fleeing? Will we see a refugee crisis that destabilizes the EU, like Obama and Hillary cooked up?

A little pespective here is all I am providing. Where is Trump’s kinetic war to match the shit shows of the last administration. He can fuck up like this a hundred times as long as he doesn’t start any actual wars, like the last administration did.

Amadeus 48 said...

Have you read the Danish PM’s comments? They were extremely insulting to Trump. He respond d thanking her for being so direct and postponing the visit.

Trump was the diplomatic one.

The BBC hatesTrump. .

Dust Bunny Queen said...

When someone makes you an offer that you find ridiculous, insulting or just plain stupid you have several choices in response.

1. No. Not interested! (Hope they take no for an answer if not...to to #2 and keep repeating)

2. Interesting. We may consider this in the future, but at this time it is not anything we could consider. (This way you can keep the person as a friend or acquaintance and the future consideration never happens....Besides, you might change your mind later and decide to take the option on the idea)

3. What kind of an idiot are you? This is absurd. You must be retarded. etc (You now have alienated the person and created an enemy)

Sounds like the Danes took option #3

The Godfather said...

Has the MSM run out of anti-Trump stories? The Greenland one is pretty lame.

tim in vermont said...

"FrankiM said...
Blame American Jews for voting Democrat! Greenland would be ours by now if not for the American Jews!”

You should calm down, take a step away from whatever two-minute hate you are attending and have a cup of tea.

Fen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
J. Farmer said...

The Greenland thing was pretty idiotic but certainly nothing to get worked up about. Even if Denmark wanted to sell Greenland, it has no ability to do. However, there are no reasons for a quarrel with Denmark, and cancelling a visit over their response to the Greenland interest is petty and childish.

narciso said...

Actually its more about countering russias advances into the arctic.

Fen said...

Jim: "Will be watching this space to find out how all this makes sense, and that our president is not insane."

You could try doing some remedial work instead, since you obviously have no idea what this is really about.

"Great way to break NATO, start pressuring allies to fork over territory. BEST explanation is that the man is demented."

Idiot. NATO is a dinosaur who's members are shirking their finincial conditions of their membership.

This is about China. Greenland is either going to fall under their sphere of influence or ours. Would you like to have a huge Chinese submarine base parked in the middle of the North Atlantic? Do you have any idea what the ICBM flight time is from Greenland to New York?

How about you refrain from calling our president demented until you've done some basic fuckin research. Or do we have to spoon-feed you?

Seeing Red said...

They never learn. Lolol

FrankiM said...

“You should calm down, take a step away from whatever two-minute hate you are attending and have a cup of tea.”

@Brown Birdie,

I’m quite calm and having fun with this latest nonsense. I think you should not take what I say about Trump personally, he’s not your daddy.

Rob said...

Time to turn up the heat: expropriate Legoland.

tim in vermont said...

Is there any real evidence that the visit was about buying Greenland? It looks like somebody leaked some blue sky talk and Denmark reacted in a nasty way to a press report. Surely if the trip was about that, it would have been on the agenda and the Danes forewarned. It sounds like the trip was postponed due to the nasty comments of the Danish PM, not a collapse of talks to buy Greenland.

Fen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Ingachuck'stoothlessARM said...

" I will be postponing our meeting scheduled in two weeks for another time...."

Oso Negro said...

@FrankiM - what can you tell us about yourself. Do you deny that you are the banned poster Inga? What kind of person persists in posting on a site where she is not welcome? It’s my theory that you are part of an organized trolling effort by Democrats.

Seeing Red said...

We can call you every name in the book, but you need to come visit anyway? So we can humiliate you more?

Because.....


No thanks. I have other things to do.

Fen said...

Farmer: "cancelling a visit over their response to the Greenland interest is petty and childish."

LOL. Now we get to hear from the "foreign policy expert" who said pretty much the same thing when Trump tied the new NAFTA deal to Mexico policing their own border.

And what happened? Mexico came back to the table, did as they were told, and the waves of illegal immigrants have subsided.

jim said...

YEA, WHAT-ABOUT NATO DAMN IT!!!

tim in vermont said...

"I think you should not take what I say about Trump personally, “

I don’t take it personally at all. I have fun pointing out your ridiculous failures of logic. it’s like playing scrabble. I guess it’s personaly in the way that laying down a seven letter word is “personal.” Maybe you are the one taking it “personally” and so you think I am. How about instead of trying to imagine you know what I am thinking, you explain why I am wrong. That’s the game we are playing here.

gilbar said...

so, Frankie, let's recap

a) Danes wanted a meeting (i KNOW it was Danes that wanted the meeting, because WHY would we?)
b) President Trump suggested a long term deal, bringing our counties closer together
c) Cheese Danish, the PM, LOUDLY Insulted President Trump
d) President Trump cancelled plans to visit
e) people blame Trump

get it?

Unknown said...

My take: Trump like to hash things out and spitball about different approaches. Buying Greenland was one of likely a dozen things discussed. The MSM, as is its won't, pounced as they saw "Tump wants to buy Greenland" as fitting their "Trump-bad-stupid" narrative.

So Trump was never really serious about it, as he stated to reporters. When the Danish PM reacted rudely (following the MSM narrative), he blew them off.

If the Danes had reacted in a polite way he would still be going. Why reward someone who insults you?

BTW just returned from 3 days in Copenhagen and loved it.

J. Farmer said...

Grand Beagle Fen:

LOL. Now we get to hear from the "foreign policy expert" who said pretty much the same thing when Trump tied the new NAFTA deal to Mexico policing their own border.

I'm afraid you've gotten your strawmen confused there. I never said any such thing and would be totally fine with tying increased policing of Mexico's border to a trade deal. Try again.

Angle-Dyne, Servant of Ugliness said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Amexpat said...

Trump's actions make no sense. I can understand suggesting the purchase of Greenland as an amusing diversion. But cancelling a state visit because the Danes rightly refuse to consider selling serves no rational purpose (although I'm sure some here will make something up).

BTW, the quote given was from a right wing populist Danish politician. The Danish equivalent of the Tea Party. The type of European political party that Trump could make alliances with.

tim in vermont said...

Why does everybody think that every poster who livens this place up is Inga? Do you guys miss her that much?

“Today I saw somebody, who looked just like you.
She walked like you too
I thought it was yoooo

As she turned the corner, I called out your name!”

We all know the song.

Seeing Red said...

Obama visited a few times. They should check their privilege.

J. Farmer said...

@gilbar:

c) Cheese Danish, the PM, LOUDLY Insulted President Trump

What was the loud insult to Trump?

Angle-Dyne, Servant of Ugliness said...

wild chicken: Trump acted stupidly. Denmark has its shit together in a quiet, no-nonsense way.

That is my impression. What has Denmark done to deserve to be so trolled?

There are far more deserving targets out there. Trump just get bored with trolling the usual suspects?

tim in vermont said...

"But cancelling a state visit because the Danes rightly refuse to consider selling serves no rational purpose (although I'm sure some here will make something up).

Amexpat the omniscient knows that only he speaks from absolute knowledge of the truth, and everybody else is just making shit up.

OK, I will admit that lots and lots of shit goes on that never gets reported and so I have no real idea what happened. All I really know is that the press is rabidly anti Trump and paints every story in the worst possible light. One thing I am sure of is that press reports filtered to us are not any real kind of truth.

MadisonMan said...

He’s a laughing stock to the world.

And that is a concern why, precisely? It seems to me the world is laughing because they're angry that Trump is putting USA first, and laughter is the only thing they've got.

Bob Boyd said...

I want to be the first on my block with a "Free Greenland!" bumper sticker.

narciso said...

No this is the other one, shes a relatively sharp lefty, whose a hawk on immigration, and other quality of life issues.

Fen said...

IngaFrank: "When will you make him take responsibility for his own actions"

You first.

Althouse determined you were a troll and told you to leave you refused she had to ban you. Now you come back under a new name.

When is Inga going to start taking responsibility for its own actions?

That writer was spot on. I've forgot his name and his article, but it's pretty close to: "the Left simply cannot see themselves. They have no self-awareness"

MadisonMan said...

And per the Headline: what was considered an important state visit ... by whom?

What does the USA stand to gain/lose by a better relationship with Denmark? (It's not like the relationship is one the ropes, after all). Why was this trip even planned?

Bob Boyd said...

I guessing we haven't heard the whole story yet.

Fernandistein said...

Is it an error to use the words "Denmark" and "important" in the same sentence?

Fen said...

"He’s a laughing stock to the world."

And get some new material for crying out loud. You you guys tried it out the same "world is laughing at us" card during Reagan and Bush.

And it's a creepy projection. Why are you so concerned about what other people think of you?

tim in vermont said...

Was the purchase of Greenland on the agenda? If not, there is no way it could have been discussed. The only way the visit could have been cancelled for that reason would be if it were on the agenda.

FrankiM said...

“And that is a concern why, precisely? It seems to me the world is laughing because they're angry that Trump is putting USA first, and laughter is the only thing they've got.”

If you have no concern about how the rest of the world sees the POTUS, you’re a very small thinker. How is Trump putting America first with this hare brained scheme? Defend it without sounding like an idiot.

Fen said...

"But cancelling a state visit because the Danes rightly refuse to consider selling serves no rational purpose"

Murray-Gellman Amnesia Effect.

If you honestly believe the visit was canceled because Denmark refused to sell Greenland to us.... I can't help you.

MadisonMan said...

You tell me why this expensive CO2-belching trip was planned first.

tim in vermont said...

Maybe in a year or so, Trump can got to Hans Island and shake hands with the Danish PM while stepping across Canadian lines.

Michael K said...

BEST explanation is that the man is demented.

That's Inga's explanation, if you think she knows anything. If she is your guru...

Nobody has mentioned China. That's what this is about.

tim in vermont said...

"Defend it without sounding like an idiot.”

Said the person who refuses to defend his own posts with anything other than name calling and fantasies about the motivation of the people trying to debate him.

Amexpat said...

OK, I will admit that lots and lots of shit goes on that never gets reported and so I have no real idea what happened. All I really know is that the press is rabidly anti Trump and paints every story in the worst possible light. One thing I am sure of is that press reports filtered to us are not any real kind of truth.

This is not a matter of how the press painted this story. It is based on Trump's tweet:

"Denmark is a very special country with incredible people, but based on Prime Minister Mette Frederiksen’s comments, that she would have no interest in discussing the purchase of Greenland, I will be postponing our meeting scheduled in two weeks for another time...."

How does this represent any serious foreign policy goals?

sinz52 said...

The good thing about our political system is that mistakes can be corrected.

Trump will be gone and his administration will pass into history, just like all the others.

The bad thing is the reaction and backlash that results from a divisive President.
The next time the Dems win the presidency (and they will eventually), they're going to be bent on revenge.

The climate for the Trump supporters will turn very chilly indeed.

tim in vermont said...

You start with faith in the proposition that the man is demented, then you interpret every hostile news report though that lens. It’s called “assuming what you are trying to prove."

Fen said...

Frank: "If you have no concern about how the rest of the world sees the POTUS,"

LOL. We are expected to believe that the Inga creature who is constantly sliming the President of the United States and his supporters it's now suddenly very concerned about how others view the President? Ha.

All you've done is shown how submissive you are in the face of conformity. You would become a Nazi because everyone Elsa's and you want them to like you. What a waste of a human being. Can I give you some advice on a shotgun? Easy to use, and I'll even drive you out into a field so what's your poor daughters don't have to clean up afterwards I'm sure they've had to endure all kinds of nightmares from you.


Also: quit pretending that you speak for the world, you can barely speak for yourself.


stlcdr said...

"3. What kind of an idiot are you? This is absurd. You must be retarded. etc (You now have alienated the person and created an enemy)

Sounds like the Danes took option #3

8/21/19, 9:15 AM"

Exactly. I think it is yet another Trumpism which is tearing down the curtain of politics, and demonstrating how farcical the whole thing is.

Left Bank of the Charles said...

So much for the Greenland and Reparations Act of 2019. Maybe 2021?

rehajm said...

Did Obama stop in Denmark on his world apology tour? Now that would be a childish diss...

FrankiM said...

Hear hear sinz52. 9:37AM

tim in vermont said...

"How does this represent any serious foreign policy goals? “

Like I said. It was a blunder. Now we have to put it in perspective. Was it as a large a blunder as the only alternative the Democrats offered to Trump made when she advocated the invasion of Libya “We came! We saw! He died!” - HRC, or when she poured gasoline on the civil war in Syria by sending in weapons?

Has Trump mad any blunder on that scale?

traditionalguy said...

The Danes claim to be insulted by a man offering them a deal that is good for them. The deal cannot be made unless Trump first walks away. It is the dance of the deal. Not an insult. They can try to get a better offer, and then come back to the table. Trump is offering money. The ChiComs will offer them more money unless Trump has broken their economy.

tommyesq said...

The article talks of the opening of new sea routes due to ice melt from global warming, and suggests that global warming/climate change is also causing the Greenland ice cap to disappear; yet later asserts concerns that the receding ice will reveal toxic waste dumps left over from military bases that were in place during the Cold War (which ran from 1945 to 1991). If these areas were not covered in ice in that time frame (and remember that the 1941 and '42 had record cold winters), why should we get so concerned that they might not be covered in ice in the near future (toxic waste notwithstanding, of course)?

rehajm said...

My understanding is that the rest of the AFC East has gotten together and told the Patriots that it would be better for the division if Belichick were replaced.

Nice one! Seriously though, the rest of the AFC East just wants the Patriots to be more like Sweden.

Michael K said...

Sorry, Fen did mention China. The rest seem to be talking about something else.

tim in vermont said...

“The climate for the Trump supporters will turn very chilly indeed.”

As long as you keep it to tweets, and not re-education camps, America will be fine.

gilbar said...

So, Greenland (with Denmark's blesings) is allowing Chinese mines (and Airports) to be built on Greenland. Because of this (loudly insulting move), Trump has little or no desire to discus dropping the Steel tariffs that Denmark wanted to talk about.

Denmark wanted this meeting (to plead for tariff reductions
The President of the United States said: NOT

sounds good to me

stlcdr said...

Blogger FrankiM said...
“And that is a concern why, precisely? It seems to me the world is laughing because they're angry that Trump is putting USA first, and laughter is the only thing they've got.”

If you have no concern about how the rest of the world sees the POTUS, you’re a very small thinker. How is Trump putting America first with this hare brained scheme? Defend it without sounding like an idiot.

8/21/19, 9:32 AM

This has got to be the most hilarious, clueless, and ironic comments I've ever seen! More concern with 'how it looks'! Haha! Leftist Lunacy at it's peak.

Gunner said...

Does the average Dane give a shit about Greenland? I dunno but all they had to say is we can't sell it because it is autonomous or don't want to or whatever reason. They didnt have to go on a libtard rant about it.

Wince said...

Maybe Trump is sending a populist signal to the residents of Greenland that they might be better off with a US purchase?

Purchasing Greenland would also mean taking on its social costs. The island of 56,000 has an unemployment rate of 9%, with youth unemployment particularly high, and it depends heavily on funds from Denmark to keep its economy and services ticking. Its main industry is fisheries, while mining and quarrying employ just 124 people a month on average, according to Statistics Greenland's 2015 figures.

If history is any guide, the autonomous Danish territory is worth at least $1 billion. In 1946, the United States offered Denmark $100 million in gold to buy Greenland, according to documents in the US National Archives. That's equivalent to $1.3 billion today, taking inflation into account...

gilbar said...

sinz52 said...
The climate for the Trump supporters will turn very chilly indeed.


What the?
FIRST, you say that the climate is WARMING... and That's BAD!
NOW, you say that the climate isn't Warming, that it will 'turn very chilly indeed' and THAT's bad!
Which is it?

Michael K said...

The climate for the Trump supporters will turn very chilly indeed.

You and Inga make a nice pair.

Along with Amexpat, too.

This is just Orangemanbad # 503.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

Trump offered to buy it, they said no. What's the big deal?

tommyesq said...

J. Farmer - Even if Denmark wanted to sell Greenland, it has no ability to do.

Could you explain? Not trying to cast doubt or be critical on this point, just to understand it - I haven't heard this suggested before.

Nonapod said...

Does the average Dane give a shit about Greenland?

I suspect not. But because Trump said a thing, suddenly they'll all start to. Funny how that works.

Sebastian said...

"The climate for the Trump supporters will turn very chilly indeed."

It already was before he was elected, and we deplorables are well aware that progs want to see us dead and buried. But then, having a read a little history, we remember the Vendee and the Kulaks and the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution and the Killing Fields. US Progs are itching for their own Cultural Revolution, a final cleansing.

Anyway, I realize that progs need to oppose even Trump's occasional brain farts, but shouldn't they be in favor of the full decolonization of Greenland and its liberation from the white-supremacist Danes?

Bob Boyd said...

WAPO is calling it a postponement, not a cancellation.

tim in vermont said...

They are probably dreaming even now of seizing our assets and sending us off to camps just like their hero FDR did to Japanese Americans. After all, we are just about the lowest form of life, people who believe in human freedom, not freedom of the state to impose its will.

traditionalguy said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Darrell said...

What has Denmark done to deserve to be so trolled?

How about not holding that Iranian tanker when we asked them to?

Hail Nato my ass.

traditionalguy said...

The claim of ownership comes from the Danish King's conquest of Norway. The Norge guys had settled Greenland and it was theirs. The Danes that had taken Norway by conquest, then stole it as a condition of letting Norway have its freedom from Denmark's rule.

Today the real best claim is whoever operates the secret Military bases out in the isolated no where of northern Greenland and that would be the Clowns In America's private military. That is Trump's target. He has to remove them before they get him.

tim in vermont said...

That article you quoted needs to change as we all know that “The Little Ice Age” never happened. Just ask Michael Mann!

joshbraid said...

"If you honestly believe the visit was canceled because Denmark refused to sell Greenland to us.... I can't help you."
This.

At this point, I assume that each and every news article that purports to embarrass Trump is fake news. Might not be, of course. However, in the longer news cycle, this assumption appears accurate as quite often the facts come out later that show the news was fake.

tim in vermont said...

Not the movie director who made The Last of the Mohicans, but the graphic rhetorician who used to be a climate scientist before he gave it up to save the world.

Amexpat said...

Trump offered to buy it, they said no. What's the big deal?

It was Trump not the Danes who cancelled. For the Danes it's not a big deal and won't change their relationship to the US. But it is an annoyance as there is lot of preparation and expense that goes into a State visit from a US President. Security concerns require a lot of planning and assigning personnel to the period he was supposed to be visiting.


Ann Althouse said...

If someone asked me about buying my house, though I have not put it on the market, I would not be insulted. It's not as if they'd tried to buy my honor or my loyalty to my husband or something that's insulting to try to buy. Their country was taken from them by the Germans in WW2....

Wince said...

AAT said...
Maybe in a year or so, Trump can got to Hans Island and shake hands with the Danish PM while stepping across Canadian lines.

You mean there really is "Hans Island"?!

"Man, you come right out of a comic book."

Lydia said...

The Danes are true allies. They fought alongside us in Afghanistan from 2001 to 2013 and in some of the most dangerous missions. They're still there, but now involved in training and logistics.

BleachBit-and-Hammers said...

Inga cheers the revenge seeking punitive corrupt left.

Amexpat said...

If someone asked me about buying my house, though I have not put it on the market, I would not be insulted.

OK, but how would you feel if they cancelled a dinner date to your home because you refused to sell?

mccullough said...

Denmark isn’t meeting its NATO commitment of 2% of GDP on military spending.

Of course, most of NATO doesn’t.

Some alliance

Meade said...

I’ll bet someone has beat me to it but:

Make Danes Great Again!

(woof)

Narr said...

Yada yada yada-- everybody just breezes by "small scale troaking with Scottish whalers" like they know exactly what "troaking" is!

Is it a form of Norse or Greenlandic twerking? Might make a good Olympic sport.

Also, I've noticed that a lot of people here just seem to hate small European countries; can't quite figure that one out.

Narr
They can be a lot of trouble, true

Kassaar said...

“If history is any guide, the autonomous Danish territory is worth at least $1 billion.”

If Trump thinks Greenland is worth a lousy 1 billion, Denmark shouldn’t have trouble finding higher bidders.

Nonapod said...

If the leader of Denmark said they were interested in buying back the US Virgin Islands from us, I really wouldn't care one way or the other. In fact, maybe we could throw in Epstein's Pedo Island for free.

Fen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
tim in vermont said...

LOL, but its Hans Island, not Han’s Island.

"how would you feel if they cancelled a dinner date to your home because you refused to sell?”

OK, granted. But how would you feel if you lived in a shitole country that at least had some order, and some woman who wanted to be POTUS deposed your leader, and now you have to protect your daughter from slave traders?

It’s about perspective. Sure Trump handled this badly. Has he started a war over it?

Seeing Red said...

It already was before he was elected, and we deplorables are well aware that progs want to see us dead and buried. But then, having a read a little history, we remember the Vendee and the Kulaks and the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution and the Killing Fields. US Progs are itching for their own Cultural Revolution, a final cleansing.

Some of us remember Friend of Obama Bill Ayers.

Howard said...

A dog days distraction. Trump gets to show off his bossy macho posturing that titillates his impotent cuck core base. Like Ann said, the Danes are a baggage-less target of opportunity, so it's a win-win.

J. Farmer said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
tim in vermont said...

"Also, I've noticed that a lot of people here just seem to hate small European countries; can't quite figure that one out.”

Maybe because you don’t have any actual evidence it’s true. Careful thinking requires attention to evidence and your priors.

Bob Boyd said...

The back story:
Canada has been complaining to the Danes for years about loud music and raucous laughter coming from Greenland at all hours of the day and night. Denmark has been nice on the phone, but has done nothing about it. Trump heard about the situation and the real estate developer in him decided to try to help Canada by buying the place and fixing it up to attract a better class of occupant.

J. Farmer said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
J. Farmer said...

If someone asked me about buying my house, though I have not put it on the market, I would not be insulted.

I am no fan of people acting insulted or offended at the drop of a hat, but that is an inapt analogy. You own your house and have the right to sell it at your whim. Denmark does not own Greenland.

J. Farmer said...

@tommyesq:

Could you explain? Not trying to cast doubt or be critical on this point, just to understand it - I haven't heard this suggested before.

Though Greenland was once a colonial holding of Denmark's, it no longer has this status. It is considered to be in a political union, and this status is recognized by the Greenland Home Rule Act and the Act on Greenland Self-Government. Denmark has no more capacity to sell Greenland than England has to sell Scotland.

Ryan said...

What if we just moved in and said it was ours.

narciso said...

Just play along farmer.

Kevin said...

Denmark does not own Greenland.

Then it has even less reason to be insulted.

If someone noticed you working in your yard and asked about your neighbor and whether they might be willing to sell, why should you take offense?

Would it not be a shrewd strategy to gain valuable information that might help you make your offer more enticing?

doctrev said...

Huh. You know, I wonder if Trump's making an oblique point. Denmark does not "own" Greenland, and China cannot do whatever it likes in Hong Kong. Not without pushback somewhere else. I can definitely see how he'd enjoy advantages by bringing it up.

The American media is comprised mostly of nepotists smelling each other's farts, so I really don't care what their opinion is. I can see strategic value in holding Greenland for America. China might be building bases there, but it's disastrously stupid for them to expect a Greenland base to survive five minutes of war with America.

On the broadest scale, a purchase (or secession) of Greenland would go well with Trump's broader policy against the EU. First Britain, now Italy, in future Greenland? Trump is going out of his way to push on the EU boundaries, and it shows.

Beaver7216 said...

Denmark is a great country. They support freedom of speech (recall their support of the Mohammed cartoon while Pres. Obama stated that disrespect of the Prophet [PBUB] had no place in the civilized world). And they have paid the highest per capita loss of life in Afghanistan.

But their PM stated, correctly and rightly, that Greenland is not Danish. It belongs to Greenland. All Trump has to do is offer the 57,000 Greenlanders something of value. Denmark would not refuse the wishes of Greenlanders.

readering said...

Obama visiting Denmark next month and will make everything better.

narciso said...

So its really about rare earth metals under the permafrost.

Fen said...

"The next time the Dems win the presidency (and they will eventually), they're going to be bent on revenge."

So we should act pre-emptively and with diproportionate force, as per Marine Corps Doctrine.

Thanks for the heads up.


...you are trying to threaten and intimidate us. That's a huge mistake. We could kill every last one of you just by shutting down the EBT system - watch your blue city-states devour themselves with food riots. Watch as the inner city pulls you out of your comfy gated communities, painting the snow red.

And if there is one downside to us throwing all the NeverTrump Cuck Traitors overboard, it's that there is no voice of moderation and restraint that we respect. Team Trump will no longer abide the likes of McCain, Romney and David French.

This is bad news for you and your fellow Marxist scum, as it means we will no longer err on the side of caution, our mistakes will be aggressive ones made from going for the ball, instead of Surrendering Gracefully.

No more running. We aim to misbehave (Firefly).

So please, keep poking us with a stick. See what happens.

Ivanka 2024-2032

tim in vermont said...

"What if we just moved in and said it was ours”

No fair because they were the first white people to do it since the seal hunters who got wiped out 9 or 10 thousand years ago by the Younger Dryas event.

Kevin said...

What is this man thinking of though?

He's thinking American Presidents don't go traipsing around Denmark for no reason.

There is no strategic interest, trade deals, or cultural ties between our countries. The biggest thing you have going for you is the knowledge of what new Lego sets might be coming out this Christmas.

You had a nice visit scheduled where you might have been able to raise your own issues and build some kind of a relationship, and instead you made it clear before he arrived that you had no interest in discussing what he found interesting.

Any sane businessman cancels that trip.

The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...

"3. What kind of an idiot are you? This is absurd. You must be retarded. etc (You now have alienated the person and created an enemy)

Sounds like the Danes took option #3"

And now the folks in whatever the Danes call their State Department are frantically trying to figure out how to repair the damage.
The Left has been in a fever dream the last three years.

Michael K said...

At this point, I assume that each and every news article that purports to embarrass Trump is fake news. Might not be, of course.

Pretty safe assumption, especially if the usual trolls agree that it is "extremely embarrassing" and the Trump is a "laughing stock."

The memo went out early from the DNC.

rehajm said...

He’s a laughing stock to the world

This is a common and recurring belief amongst white American liberals. I've found 'the world' likes President Trump. However, they love love love Melania. Talk about a woman of the world. What a worldly couple they are...

Fen said...

"I've noticed that a lot of people here just seem to hate small European countries; can't quite figure that one out.”

Nah, I haven't seen that. What I have seen is a lot of America bashing by pretentious Europeans who only exist because we will it. Like Canada, they are either hiding behind our skirt or nipping at our heels.

I'm a native Texan. Do you know how Texans respond when a state like New Hampshire or Vermont start talking trash?

....

Exactly. If we notice it at all, it's only to smile and shake our head at the cute little toy dog yipping away.



J. Farmer said...

@Kevin:

Then it has even less reason to be insulted.

I am no fan of acting insulted, but from the remarks I've seen of Mette Frederiksen, her response was pretty straightforward and reflected the political reality. The strongest word she has used to describe the idea was "absurd."

If someone noticed you working in your yard and asked about your neighbor and whether they might be willing to sell, why should you take offense?

A better analogy would be like asking someone if they would be willing to sell you their neighbor's house. Both Trump and Larry Kudlow are wrong on the substance. Trump said, "Denmark essentially owns it, we're very good allies with Denmark. Strategically it's interesting and we'd be interested, but we'll talk to them a little bit." Larry Kudlow said, "And Denmark owns Greenland, Denmark is an ally, Greenland is a strategic place, up there. And they’ve got a lot of valuable minerals." Neither of these statements is accurate.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

If someone asked me about buying my house, though I have not put it on the market, I would not be insulted.

True for me. I would be flattered if someone thought my home so nice that the would consider asking me if I wanted to sell.

However, if I responded to the person making the offer in a manner that was insulting they would be and rightly be offended. If you (generic you not Althouse in particular) responded by saying You idiot. How absurd that you would ask me this. Are you crazy. Never set food on my property again. Are you stalking me!!!!! etc etc etc that person asking would definitely not want to have anything to do with you again.

We have had many people ask to buy our 1972 K5 Blazer. They are very collectable right now. We are flattered. Thank them and say "No Thanks. We aren't ready to sell right now." They ask if we are ever interested in selling would we contact them. Sometimes we take their card and put it into consideration.

THIS is how adults handle things. You don't insult either party in a potential deal. The Danes broke the unspoken rules of deal making and diplomacy. That means the gloves are off :-D

Fen said...

"Neither of these statements is accurate."

Then perhaps you can explain why China has approached Denmark several times regarding the purchase of Greenland?

I look forward to your Monday Morning Quarterbacking of the Middle Kingdom.

We have an opening at the State Department if you're interested in putting your analysis to the test.

I'll even write you a rec LOL.

Bob said...

Bob Boyd said, "I guessing we haven't heard the whole story yet."

Yes, that's usually the case. But people can't resist having opinions. It's especially fun to be incensed when one has no clue.

By the time we get the whole story, if we ever do, most people have moved on to something else about which they know nothing.

tim in vermont said...

Now we are getting into narciso territory. It’s Biblical, there is an impact crater that is perhaps 12,000 years old and that likey vaporized a huge area of Greenland’s glaciers filling the atmosphere with water vapor and quite possibly generating rains for forty days and forty nights! This is Trump trying to get to the bottom of it!

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/crux/2018/11/14/greenland-crater-discovered-cause-younger-dryas/#.XV1mKi3Myu5

We already found the impact crater from Sodam and Gomorrah, which was a nasty event, and likely spurred the whole idea of an angry and jealous God that Jesus had to sort of correct.

Quaestor said...

Besides surrendering after only two hours of actual war Denmark contributed more than its share of volunteers for the SS-Nordland Division.

bleh said...

Is Greenland owned by Denmark or not? If not, why does Denmark send them $500 million a year in subsidies?

Marc said...

If the Russians can have the Crimea with impunity, we may as well have Greenland.

tim in vermont said...

"1972 K5 Blazer.”

Seinfeld, the car collector talks about “man die cars,” the cars that are only for sale when the owner dies. But if you ever want to sell it....

narciso said...

I think your time scale is off by a matter of 10

tim in vermont said...

My mother was a young teenager when the Nazis took the Netherlands. Imagine the sky dark with bombers, soon to be followed by advanced tanks. It wasn’t about collaboration, but the Nazis, being racial collectivists, certainly hoped to win over the Dutch as “natural allies."

tim in vermont said...

"I think your time scale is off by a matter of 10”

You don’t think that The Flood could have occured 12k years ago? 10,000 BC?

stlcdr said...

Blogger The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...
"3. What kind of an idiot are you? This is absurd. You must be retarded. etc (You now have alienated the person and created an enemy)

Sounds like the Danes took option #3"

And now the folks in whatever the Danes call their State Department are frantically trying to figure out how to repair the damage.
The Left has been in a fever dream the last three years.

8/21/19, 10:33 AM


See, now, that's the thing. You, I and the Danish people like to trade, sell stuff, buy stuff. What has happened here has done nothing to change that relationship - the only change is if the, or any, government decides that we can't. Essentially, governments acting like spoiled brats. This is what Trump is exposing.

Reference: the Canadian government putting a tariff on Bourbon - which they don't make and only penalized the makers of bourbon and the buyers of bourbon - in retaliation of the metals tariffs.

Reference: Brexit and the Europhiles wanting to put up barriers to trade because Britain wants to leave the club (we'll show you, for taking your ball home!)

exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...

Meh. This is a weird and trivial story.

Two weeks from now, everyone will have forgotten it.

narciso said...

Maybe 4500 years tops.

Hagar said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Hagar said...

In 1814 Denmark had no compunction about surrendering Norway proper to Marshal Bernadotte, Prince of Ponte Corvo and "king-in-waiting" of Sweden, on demand without even asking for compensation, while retaining all the overseas Norwegian possessions for itself.

It is a little late for the Danish government to get on their high horse about this kind of transaction.

And it appears China has been quite active lately with commercial developments along the coasts of Greenland. This appears to have been noticed by the U.S. Government.

J. Farmer said...

@Grand Beagle Fen:

Then perhaps you can explain why China has approached Denmark several times regarding the purchase of Greenland?

They haven't. China is certainly trying to make commercial inroads into Greenland, but that is not the same thing as buying the country. The Kvanefjeld project is not akin to buying the country. And once again, even if Denmark wanted to sell Greenland, it can't. Anymore than the US could sell Puerto Rico to a foreign country. Denmark, which manages Greenland's national security, already raised objections last year when the China Communications Construction Company submitted a bid to build three airports in Greenland.

I'll even write you a rec LOL.

Nah, I prefer one written by someone who knew what they were talking about.

tim in vermont said...

There was an impact in Switzerland around that time, but Younger Dryas is the only event in the geologic record on the scale of the flood. I come from this as a person who thinks that the Bible has a lot of truth in it, some literal truth, but it’s not all literal truth, and the records were certainly spotty. So I am keeping my mind open on this one. If that crater is dated to Younger Dryas, that would explain forty solid days of rain, or whatever it took to get all of that water vapor out of the atmosphere. Thank God it wasn’t sulphuric acid like the one that killed the dinosaurs.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

AAT Seinfeld, the car collector talks about “man die cars,”

Actually, woman die car :-) It is my vehicle. His (current toy)is a 1969 GMC 3500 (1 ton)flat bed (aluminum). Fully restored and beautiful!

Re the Blazer....Thank you for your kind offer though. I am not ready to sell it. Perhaps some day in the future. I'll keep you in mind. Do you have a card? Here is my card.

(Actually, we will probably sell sooner now that the market for those is still hot. And I can get the most money from you :-D You probably would want to wait a bit for the market to cool off and then get a better deal)

See. This is how it is done.

Marc said...

The Timeses and Guardians etc etc affecting to be shocked, shocked at the grave insult to HM Queen Margrethe by Mr Trump's decision: they'll be the first ones on board with throwing her out the window when the People's Revolution gets to Denmark. In any case, I doubt that she has been scrubbing windows and polishing the silver getting ready for the Trumps: based on what little I know of her public character she will have smiled and thanked God for one fewer state occasion requiring her presence.

narciso said...

Well an asteroid impact, wouldnt lead to a major cooling period, but i dont thonk a precipitation event.

tim in vermont said...

Anyway, I am a little jealous.

tim in vermont said...

"Well an asteroid impact, wouldnt lead to a major cooling period, but i dont thonk a precipitation event.”

Imagine instantly vaporizing a cubic mile of ice.

Kevin said...

A better analogy would be like asking someone if they would be willing to sell you their neighbor's house.

You keep pushing this point. No one cares. Please, don't turn yourself into Chuck.

Denmark has great influence on Greenland. It's keeping it financially afloat. And Trump can't really spend his presidency walking around in a parka, holding town halls with Greenland's 60,000 residents.

If you want to influence people, you go to the people who have influence over them.

That's often a better strategy than going to them directly.

Hammond X. Gritzkofe said...

From the BBC? Sour grapes. If the Brits were out to purchase Greenland....

tim in vermont said...

Imagine a guy building a boat and taking along pairs of domesticated animals, like settlers to America did once. Imagine him being hailed as a hero. Suddenly it’s kind of believable.

Fen said...

Then perhaps you can explain why China has approached Denmark several times regarding the purchase of Greenland?

"They haven't."

They have.

Please catch up. If you're going to suggest ideas that could impact the lives of millions, the least you can do is research the topic before opening your mouth.

bleh said...

Obviously we're pretty concerned about growing Chinese influence in the North Atlantic. In other words, this episode of political whackiness is actually a helpful reminder that while so many Americans obsess over the situation in the Middle East and Russian cyberfuckery ... China is always there, everywhere, scheming for themselves and against us, quietly and patiently.

J. Farmer said...

@Kevin:

You keep pushing this point. No one cares. Please, don't turn yourself into Chuck.

I keep making that point because it is the point.

Denmark has great influence on Greenland. It's keeping it financially afloat. And Trump can't really spend his presidency walking around in a parka, holding town halls with Greenland's 60,000 residents.

It's influence on Greenland is largely irrelevant to the topic of discussion. Even if Denmark were 100% on board with Trump's plan, it has no ability to make it happen. The only way such a transaction could happen is if Greenland was granted full independence from Denmark and then it would be up to the population of Greenland to enter into some kind of arrangement with the US. Plus all of this would require significant Congressional involvement.

JPS said...

Quaestor:

"Besides surrendering after only two hours of actual war Denmark contributed more than its share of volunteers for the SS-Nordland Division."

I didn't know that latter part, but I can't give them any crap about surrendering so quickly. Under occupation they (collectively, I'm sure there were exceptions) acquitted themselves with unique honor.

When the Nazi occupying authority started ordering Danish Jews rounded up, Danish civil servants started identifying and contacting Jews - to tell them to hide. Ordinary Danes managed to get over seven thousand Danish Jews across a narrow stretch of the Baltic to Sweden over just a few nights. Then the Danish government annoyed the hell out of the Nazis inquiring after the five hundred they hadn't been able to spirit away - and kept on annoying them, insisting that these were Danish citizens for whom they were still responsible, and they wanted answers.

Fen said...

"We already found the impact crater from Sodam and Gomorrah"

I'm so old I still remember when the city of Troy was a myth :)

J. Farmer said...

@Grand Beagle Fen:

They have.

Please catch up. If you're going to suggest ideas that could impact the lives of millions, the least you can do is research the topic before opening your mouth.


Please provide a source for this claim. I'll wait.

And while you're at it, read the third sentence I wrote after the one you quoted: "And once again, even if Denmark wanted to sell Greenland, it can't."

Fen said...

Greenland does go to show how unserious Europe is about climate change.

If you honestly thought your people had 12 years left to live wouldn't you have already invaded Greenland and put down stakes?

The answer to why they haven't taken Greenland is simple: like nuclear power solutions, it does not involve Global Socialism - redistribution of wealth via rationing energy production and consumption.

J. Farmer said...

@narciso:

Well an asteroid impact, wouldnt lead to a major cooling period, but i dont thonk a precipitation event.

This is certainly not a topic I know much about, but it was my understanding that a large asteroid impact would put dust and ash in the atmosphere, which would block solar radiation and result in a cooling period. Is that inaccurate?

Jeff Weimer said...

Of course everyone is like "WTF, Greenland? Where did that come from?".

Then you think about it. Eventually it becomes "why not? We'll have Canada surrounded."

bleh said...

"Anymore than the US could sell Puerto Rico to a foreign country."

Can we not? If we wish to unburden ourselves of PR, you're saying our only choice is to just grant them independence, remove ourselves and get nothing in return? Why can't we sell the island to a foreign country and, if the locals are unhappy about it, well gosh, that's the purchaser's problem now?

I mean, it's not as though local sentiment wouldn't matter in the negotiations and so forth. A purchaser would be crazy to take on PR and agree to a certain price without having a pretty good idea of what awaits them as colonial overlord. The purchaser wants to know what kind of return they're going to get on their investment.

William said...

Up until last week I had lived my entire life without ever once pondering the geostrategic importance of Greenland. Even worse, I had never once considered the dark history of Danish imperialism and how crude and graceless they are in the field of diplomacy.....I have the sneaking suspicion that after next week, I will never again think these thoughts. I think there was an episode of VEEP that covered a similar imbroglio, but it wasn't so far fetched.

Fen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
tim in vermont said...

According to the paper’s abstract, the scientists discovered evidence of a “high-heat” explosive event north of the Dead Sea that instantaneously “devastated approximately 500 km2.” The explosion would have wiped out all civilization in the affected area, including Middle Bronze Age cities and towns. Silvia told Science News that the blast would have instantly killed the estimated 40,000 to 65,000 people who inhabited Middle Ghor, a 25-kilometer-wide circular plain in Jordan.

Likewise, the fertile soil would have been stripped of nutrients by the high heat, and waves of the Dead Sea’s briny anhydride salts would have — tsunami-like — washed over the surrounding area. At the same time, the explosion’s fallout caused blisteringly hot, strong winds, which deposited a rain of mineral grains, which have been found on pottery at Tall el-Hammam


https://www.timesofisrael.com/evidence-of-sodom-meteor-blast-cause-of-biblical-destruction-say-scientists/

I love how the “pillars of salt” might really have happened. Probably did. I think that this impact changed the course of history by its impact on the mind of man.

J. Farmer. The Younger Dryas Event, a planet wide cooling happened concurrenty with a comet impact. It is suspected that the Gulf Stream was shut down by the changes in salinity caused by a huge influx of fresh water. It’s a big subject. It is thought that there were Europeans in North America descendents of seal hunters who came over working the edges of the ice sheet that were wiped out by the sudden and severe cold. It’s a huge subject. Get googling if you are interested.

Fen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
J. Farmer said...

@bleh:

Can we not?

No, it's called the principle of national self-determination.

If we wish to unburden ourselves of PR, you're saying our only choice is to just grant them independence, remove ourselves and get nothing in return?

Yes. And of course, if it were up to me, Puerto Rico would be jettisoned tomorrow.

Fen said...

"China is always there, everywhere, scheming for themselves and against us, quietly and patiently."

Yup. I have always envied China's position on the board. They play the long game, and when anyone else notices, they turn loose a "squirrel" like North Korea and everyone chases after.

I think America is in decline and will fall like Rome did. The Brits picked up the mantle for almost 400 years. After World War II we took up the burden of protecting and progressing Western Civilization.

But I think that when America falls it will be China who takes our place, for good or ill. They seem(?) more wise and less corrupt than the West, so maybe some hybrid Chinese-American culture can take root and preserve some principles of our founding.

Although my history books are full of fools who thought China could be westernized.

We will see. But I think China is going to win the end game regardless.

PS - history will not remember Denmark

FrankiM said...

Trump just said he called off the trip to Denmark because their leader was “not nice” to him. What a petty small person, an embarrassment. He is NOT the USA. He often conflates himself with the USA and any disrespect shown to him is disrespect shown to the USA. There are millions of Americans who think he hasn’t earned much respect by his actions.

FrankiM said...

Respect has to be shown to me!
Trump

Daniel Jackson said...

Häagen-Dazs!

Photo op for the coffee ice cream complexioned Royal and her minister. Until this story, I had no idea what the royal of Häagen-Dazs looked like. Nor did In know the Chinese were buying their way into the island to the benefit of the royal of Häagen-Dazs.

The Mouse has roared. A bit too much, me thinks.

Trump did the right thing. Diplomatically no less.

tim in vermont said...

"Respect has to be shown to me! - Obama”

Weren’t you guys the ones who thought it was a big deal if Trump paid hookers to pee on a bed where Obama had slept? Like you made a two year big deal where you talked about nothing else?

narciso said...

Thats why the analysis of unrestricted warfare from 20 years the russians call it full spectrum is important.

Bob Boyd said...

These Danes sound a tad nationalistic to me. And they're white too. Very concerning.

bleh said...

"We will see. But I think China is going to win the end game regardless."

At the same time, China could be cleaved by all its internal problems including rising separatist movements.

(1) A million Uyghurs have recently been "reeducated," no small undertaking by the Chinese government. Of course there are the Tibetans.
(2) Taiwan remains fiercely opposed to Beijing's meddling and honestly that situation makes China look weak. Can you imagine if the U.S. routinely and angrily declared that a country of more than 20 million people was in fact a U.S. territory, but the U.S. was basically unable to enforce that claim over the strenuous, public objections of that country? Do you think we would look weak or strong?
(3) And don't forget about recent events in Hong Kong. Does it seem like China really has control of the situation there? Does the restiveness of Hong Kong's millions of protesters augur well for Beijing's ability to govern in the future?

This is just to name a few of their problem spots. If the United States is serious about containing or influencing China, the smart play for us is to stoke those tensions and exploit them to our benefit. To undermine Beijing's legitimacy, to encourage a liberal reformation of their regime, to break up their empire into a looser confederation.

readering said...

Han Chinese too numerous. Not like USSR where Russians barely half by end.

Kevin said...

It's influence on Greenland is largely irrelevant to the topic of discussion. Even if Denmark were 100% on board with Trump's plan, it has no ability to make it happen. The only way such a transaction could happen is if Greenland was granted full independence from Denmark and then...

Wait...what was that thing about Greenland needing independence from Denmark?

Gunner said...

If the mostly non-white population of Greenland really wanted to join the US, Denmark wouldn't be able to stop them anyway, out of fear of being called racist white colonial masters. Take them at their word. Denmark has no control over Greenland.

bleh said...

"No, it's called the principle of national self-determination."

That's sort of a bullshit answer, though. It's just a "principle," as you say, and it's not even a deep-rooted or enduring one. Heck, such a "principle" could be used to justify all sorts of racist policies, for example, restrictions on immigration. I mean, just as a practical matter, no country is going to buy PR from us because it's a mess and not worth the cost.

But a sparsely populated territory that's strategically located and could be rich in resources?

Kevin said...

If the mostly non-white population of Greenland really wanted to join the US, Denmark wouldn't be able to stop them anyway, out of fear of being called racist white colonial masters.

If Trump doesn't have Denmark on board, the left will lobby them to block any deal he might strike with Greenlanders because the US is a racist hegemony that's trying to rebuild its empire.

When you put a complex deal together, you have to do it in the right order so someone with little skin in the game doesn't hold it up at the end.

Trump might know a thing or two about that.

Kevin said...

It's just a "principle," as you say

The Code is more what you call guidelines, than actual rules.

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