Althouse: "Some Girl Scout badges promote stereotypical notions of femininity. Many are about helping others."

October 14, 2017

"Some Girl Scout badges promote stereotypical notions of femininity. Many are about helping others."

"Even the flowers badge asks girls to 'find out how flowers help people.' There’s also a focus on appearance. The independence badge, for 'striding down your path to changing the world,' includes learning how to 'make your clothes look great.' The 'eating for you' badge — recently called 'eating for beauty' — emphasizes how nutrition helps with 'smooth skin, shiny hair and strong nails.' The Scout Law for [Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts] includes similar virtues, like being honest, helpful and friendly. But girls might be better off, too, if more boys earned badges like those from the Girl Scouts for respect and fair play, and for taking responsibility for their actions, not to mention babysitting and making dinner. In that spirit, here are 10 Girl Scout badges that might benefit Boy Scouts...."

From "Things Boys Could Learn at Girl Scouts" (NYT).

118 comments:

Craig Howard said...: Toxic asininity.; 10/14/17, 7:48 AM
Rusty said...: "Things Boys Could Learn at Girl Scouts"
Oh. I can think of several things, but they don't give badges for that stuff.; 10/14/17, 7:56 AM
bleh said...: "... for taking responsibility for their actions ..."

Just what exactly is the author trying to say about boys (and girls)?; 10/14/17, 8:02 AM
rehajm said...: find out how flowers help people.

Makes total sense.Learn about how Poppy, Nightshade, Quinine, Periwinkle, Ipecac, pepper help people. C'mon girls! How 'bout a career in venture pharmaceuticals? That's what they're saying, right?; 10/14/17, 8:03 AM
Laslo Spatula said...: I like to buy cookies from Girl Scouts.

I am Laslo.; 10/14/17, 8:04 AM
gg6 said...: "Things Boys Could Learn at Girl Scouts"
Learn about the hypocrisy abounding in fake 'movements' like Feminism. Learn what every adult should know and understand - morality, decency, character and true accomplishment is a matter of individuality, not Gender. Either the girl or the boy next to you, above you or beneath you may be a total creep or a living saint. Decide which you want to be and Live it.; 10/14/17, 8:05 AM
Humperdink said...: I didn't see a transgender badge.; 10/14/17, 8:07 AM
Fernandinande said...: promote stereotypical notions of femininity

Is that good or bad?

'find out how flowers help people.'

Teleology appeals to children; they should actually find out how people exploit flowers.; 10/14/17, 8:07 AM
rhhardin said...: The design of the birth control merit badge ("Respect myself and others") is good.; 10/14/17, 8:09 AM
Eleanor said...: I was the leader of a troop of teenage Girl Scouts for years. We hiked a couple of hundred miles of the Appalachian trail routinely, went whitewater rafting, and participated in a runway fashion show every spring. It doesn't have to be one or the other. When we competed with the Boy Scouts at Camporees, we beat the boys' asses off. Not only could we get the cook fires going faster, we could make a meal someone might actually want to eat. I have no problem with the Boy Scouts inviting girls to join. It just might not turn out the way the boys expect.; 10/14/17, 8:14 AM
David Begley said...: I can recall a camp out where one activity essentially involved getting filthy dirty. My son's socks had to be thrown away. Girls won't go for that.

And I coached grade school girls in basketball. If one player got knocked down the others would say "sorry" and help the girl up. That never happened with the boys.; 10/14/17, 8:17 AM
BudBrown said...: This scout stuff is too bewildering. I was a scout. Appearance? Once a month meetings
where there was inspection. Boy, did I want to win an inspection. At first, well, because
competitive spirit. Later because once a year or so they had the total loser from each pack win. The same night. That was really embarrassing. First 5 mile hike. How much do you weigh
at 11. I weighed about 145 at 15. Whatever my pack was probably between 50 and 60 pounds.
July, outside Tampa. Bright side was we hiked on an asphalt road. No mountains. Still,
after that it was be prepared but not too prepared. Cooking. Well, I guess it depends on the troop. My pack, one of the dad's owned a couple of barbeque places and was a chef. He liked to
cook. We did a lot of fishing and he'd cook up some feasts. There were different duties
on a campout. No, I did not want to dig the latrine. Or fill it in. So I washed a lot of pots and pans. Took a couple of years to realize latrine duty was the way to go. If you're
campimg on a beach and washing the pots in the gulf, beach sand is very useful in cleaning.; 10/14/17, 8:17 AM
Humperdink said...: I had heard where the girl scouts are less than thrilled the boy scouts are poaching from their ranks.; 10/14/17, 8:17 AM
CWJ said...: If the Boy Scouts add the Girl Scout badges to their current list, I don't see any problem. Each scout, boy or girl, will gravitate to their own collection of interests.; 10/14/17, 8:21 AM
Laslo Spatula said...: Know who benefits from girls joining the Boy Scouts?

The cute girls and the cute boys.

The cute girls will lavish attention on the cute boys.

The cute boys will pant after the cute girls.

The also-rans will pine for the fjords.

I am Laslo.; 10/14/17, 8:21 AM
Humperdink said...: "And I coached grade school girls in basketball. If one player got knocked down the others would say "sorry" and help the girl up. That never happened with the boys."

I played b'ball for 50 years. Loved the game. One time, I was beckoned out of the stands to ref a girls (ages 10-12) game as the one of the refs got caught in a snow storm. The first time I blew my whistle for a foul, I thought the girl was going to cry. Never again.

Earth the SJW's, boys and girls are different.; 10/14/17, 8:23 AM
Darrell said...: I learned that you don't pull your dick out and chase a woman around the room when you answer the door for a business meeting.; 10/14/17, 8:24 AM
tcrosse said...: It was in the Boy Scouts that I learned how to masturbate. No merit badge for that. I tremble to think what I could have learned from the girls.; 10/14/17, 8:26 AM
gspencer said...: Do they have a badge for pole-dancing?; 10/14/17, 8:27 AM
Chris N said...: It might just be that the Girl Scouts represents something of what girls are:::which is apparently taboo to say in these times:; 10/14/17, 8:31 AM
Ignorance is Bliss said...: Some Girl Scout badges promote stereotypical notions of femininity....But girls might be better off, too, if more boys earned badges like those from the Girl Scouts for respect and fair play, and for taking responsibility for their actions, not to mention babysitting and making dinner.

Some NYT columns promote stereotypical notions of boys...; 10/14/17, 8:32 AM
Matt Sablan said...: Actually, I think, maybe not a style badge, but a badge about how to dress appropriately/professionally might be good for kids.

It wasn't until after college someone finally told me you can't just wear the same kind of white socks with everything.; 10/14/17, 8:38 AM
Matt Sablan said...: Also, here's a list of merit badges required to be an Eagle Scout, per Wiki:

Camping; Cooking; Swimming, Hiking, or Cycling; Citizenship in the Community; Citizenship in the Nation; Citizenship in the World; Communication; Lifesaving and/or Emergency Preparedness;
Environmental Science or Sustainability; Family Life; First Aid; Personal Fitness; Personal Management.

A lot of that sounds like taking responsibility for their actions.; 10/14/17, 8:40 AM
Matt Sablan said...: "Meanwhile, when girls are encouraged to do things that boys have traditionally done, but boys aren’t encouraged to do “girl” things, it’s a message that what’s masculine is superior and what’s feminine is inferior."

-- I don't think that's the message that boys get when they're told they shouldn't try to be teachers, nurses or other feminine careers. Men in childcare careers, for example, are strongly dissuaded from it. I really wonder how much this author knows about gender issues or the Boy Scouts.; 10/14/17, 8:42 AM
Ignorance is Bliss said...: CWJ said...

If the Boy Scouts add the Girl Scout badges to their current list, I don't see any problem. Each scout, boy or girl, will gravitate to their own collection of interests.

That's fine, as long as they are voluntary. I give it about five years before they start showing up in the list of requirements for rank. I mean, how can you be considered First Class if you haven't earned your fair play and taking responsibility merit badges.

And you certainly shouldn't be allowed to become an Eagle Scout until you've spent a week living transgendered ( surgery optional ( for now. )); 10/14/17, 8:43 AM
Paddy O said...: This conversation reminds me of the great Pawnee Rangers episode of Parks & Recreation.; 10/14/17, 8:43 AM
Matt Sablan said...: "But girls might be better off, too, if more boys earned badges like those from the Girl Scouts for respect and fair play, and for taking responsibility for their actions, not to mention babysitting and making dinner."

-- There's a goddamn cooking badge in the image the NYT used to illustrate their own article for the Boy Scouts.; 10/14/17, 8:45 AM
Ignorance is Bliss said...: Matthew Sablan said...

A lot of that sounds like taking responsibility for their actions.

Star, Live, and Eagle all require service projects, which sounds a whole lot like helping others.; 10/14/17, 8:47 AM
Darrell said...: I would run the new Girl Scout Division like a paramilitary organization.; 10/14/17, 8:47 AM
Renee said...: We are not adding Girls Scout badges to the list. The girls will be doing the same program as the boys.

We already have 'cooking' badges which is required for Eagle, and yes boy scouts learn to sew as well. Do people realize that boys cook all of their own food for camp outs. Do people realize they do their own shopping on a budget for their camp outs? And clean up after themselves, and tend to to the fire.

The boy to joins Boy Scouts is from Girls Scouts, because their GSA's crap is lame.

at least the girls can finally camp.; 10/14/17, 8:50 AM
Matt Sablan said...: Charitably, it sounds to me like the author of the NYT didn't look to see what you need to do to get some of the Boy Scout badges, meanwhile a lot of the Girl Scout Badges are super vague. What does "Take Responsibility" or "Science of Happiness" even mean?; 10/14/17, 8:50 AM
Matt Sablan said...: I don't know if I'd say the Girl Scout stuff is "lame." Some of the badges look interesting (like the robotics challenge and archery, just from a quick scan.); 10/14/17, 8:53 AM
bobby said...: If you believe that there are no genetic gender differences - that it's nurture, not nature - then the Kids' Scouts is the way to go.

If you believe that there are real and substantial differences between boys and girls - not just meaning the body parts, but the psyche - and that there are both good and bad consequences resulting from those differences that can be socialized to nurture the good and suppress the bad - then we need to separate boys and girls for part of their childhood training and address those issues.

Boy Scouts was always a good way to channel boys' more energetic, competitive, aggressive tendencies into the good and away from the bad. Girl Scouts (the old ones, not the modern SJW-centric ones) was well-aimed to satisfy girls' more socialization-oriented and skills-oriented needs.

Just as women argue that boys overshadow girls in school to the girls' detriment, so do girls overshadow boys in mixed groups such as Scouts. The activities get polited-down so as not to offend the girls (but mostly the girls' parents.) The boys get no instruction or enlightenment about channeling their robust aggressions when girls are included.

Girls would be better off in the long run if boys can be Boy Scouts with just boys. If nothing else, Scouting helps form gentlemen.; 10/14/17, 8:55 AM
Paddy O said...: The Pawnee Goddesses have a "best Penguin blog" badge.; 10/14/17, 8:55 AM
Matt Sablan said...: "Fair Play" is a badge that is something the Boy Scouts could learn from the Girl Scouts?

Am I supposed to believe that none of the Boy Scout badges promote fair play or "Respect myself and others?" That none of these things might promote "Finding Common Ground?" Not even the Boy Scout's Salesmanship badge or Public Speaking?

I think I see the problem. Most of the Girl Scout badges highlighted are about improvements to oneself, while the Boy Scout badges have yet to trend that way and are still primarily skills/objectives/knowledge focused.; 10/14/17, 9:03 AM
Quayle said...: Some Girl Scout badges promote stereotypical notions of femininity....

A stereotype is: a set form; convention. Or in Sociology as a simplified and standardized conception or image invested with special meaning and held in common by members of a group.

What in today's America are the stereotypical notions of "femininity"? I don't know of any set form or conception or image held in common in the US.

How many more decades do we need to go until we start to suspect that the notions of feminism might not be so much coming from or enforced from the outside, but just may be emanating from the inside? That it just might be genotype and not stereotype?; 10/14/17, 9:04 AM
Michael said...: Reading this, it appears the objective is to turn boys into girls.; 10/14/17, 9:10 AM
Scott M said...: OH FFS!!!; 10/14/17, 9:14 AM
Renee said...: The requirements are less, and the never get done.

This is why so many girls scouts move to the BSA Venture Scouts.

Seriously,

this isn't a big deal for people within the BSA.

Now girls can join at the age of fine, instead of waiting until she is 13.

I can't believe how out of 'wack' people about this.; 10/14/17, 9:16 AM
mockturtle said...: More fucking idiocy from the NYT.

I was a Bluebird/Camp Fire Girl. [Do they even have that organization any more?] My brother was a Cub Scout and my mother was a den mother. She also had a Bluebird group for a while but said the Bluebirds were far more difficult than the Cub Scouts.; 10/14/17, 9:18 AM
Matt Sablan said...: I know nothing about Scouting or Boy Scouts or Girl Scouts.

My main problem is, again, the NYT totally failed in presenting the reader with information. Information that the NYT *had*. If you read further down, the text even acknowledges that there's a Cooking badge and that it is a requirement for Eagle Scout. So why the dig about the Boy Scouts not teaching boys how to make dinner?

Because the NYT is staffed by idiots.; 10/14/17, 9:18 AM
Fernandinande said...: Speaking of girls, girls at a special school for girls wrote:

"Shutting down rhetoric that undermines the existence and rights of others is not a violation of free speech; it is hate speech."

Barbie shoulda said "Punctuation is hard!"; 10/14/17, 9:29 AM
Anonymous said...: "But girls might be better off, too, if more boys earned badges like those from the Girl Scouts for respect and fair play..."

It's truly bizarre that the author thinks that "fair play" is an alien concept to boys, but native to girls.

The article reads as if everything the author thinks she knows about boys was picked up from the philosophical writings of retired actresses.; 10/14/17, 9:30 AM
Ambrose said...: It looks like our betters prefer the Girl Scout's message of diversity, inclusion and social justice - and are worried now that this will be tested in the market.; 10/14/17, 9:32 AM
Anonymous said...: Fernandinande: Speaking of girls, girls at a special school for girls wrote:

"Shutting down rhetoric that undermines the existence and rights of others is not a violation of free speech; it is hate speech."

Barbie shoulda said "Punctuation is hard!"

Lol.

But truth sometimes rides in on the inaptly wielded punctuation of illiterates.; 10/14/17, 9:33 AM
Fernandinande said...: Matthew Sablan said...
So why the dig about the Boy Scouts not teaching boys how to make dinner?

Because the MSM write(s) fake news about everything, not just Trump.

I failed to attain "Tenderfoot"(?IIRC), because one of the requirements was to cook dinner while camping, which I did, but I wouldn't eat the stupid baked potato because I don't like baked potatoes. The bureaucrat-in-training decided that the written requirements - cook dinner, no mention of eating it - weren't good enough so I quit, which gave me more time to make fireworks.; 10/14/17, 9:44 AM
Meade said...: 10 Merit Badges Girls Could Earn at Boy Scouts (especially if they want to be more like Meade):
American Business
Cooking
Dog Care
Drafting
Family Life
Graphic Arts
Gardening
Landscape Architecture
Personal Management
Pottery; 10/14/17, 9:44 AM
cronus titan said...: Althouse has said before (this is from memory) that comparing girls and boys is fine as long as you conclude that girls are superior in some way. That article is more of the same. The "fair play and respect" part is a nice touch. Middle school girls are not exactly renowned for their sense of fair play and respect.

The "taking responsiblity for your actions" phrase is a nice touch too. Hillary Clinton could not be reached for comment.; 10/14/17, 9:47 AM
Meade said...: 1 Hypothetical Merit Badge That Might've Persuaded Meade Not to Drop Out Boy Scouts at Age 13:
Girls; 10/14/17, 9:47 AM
roger said...: Meade, Dog Care?
Really?; 10/14/17, 9:48 AM
Fernandinande said...: Someone else ate the baked potato, so it wasn't like I just threw it in the fire and burned it.; 10/14/17, 9:49 AM
roger said...: I failed to attain "Tenderfoot"

How is this even possible?; 10/14/17, 9:50 AM
hombre said...: Stereotypical females are infinitely preferable to the harridans spawned by the new wave of feminism.; 10/14/17, 9:51 AM
Meade said...: "Meade, Dog Care?
Really?"

Yeah, I know — what about bitch care, right?; 10/14/17, 9:54 AM
cronus titan said...: The article itself is a hoot and obviously written by someone with no children. We have three boys 13, 22, and 25. THe oldest two have yet to have a girlfriend who could make a "simple meal" (and some who were offended that they should know how). "Coaching" to motivate a team to accomplish its goals is a good one too. Boys learn that on athletic fields starting at around 7.

"Babysitting" may take the cake. When our kids were young, we used local male baysitters, who were awesome (kids asleep and house clean when we got home, and one was doing his math homework after putting the kids to sleep). We lost count of how many parents were horrified at the thought of a male babysitter. Fine by us since we always had a babysitter available.; 10/14/17, 10:02 AM
Fernandinande said...: roger said...
I failed to attain "Tenderfoot"
How is this even possible?

Well, "?IIRC" - whatever they called the first level where you actually had to do something to qualify.

Q Why Latvian man not eat potato?; 10/14/17, 10:09 AM
Sebastian said...: So after the BS admit girls, will they also offer badges for things that promote 'smooth skin, shiny hair and strong nails,' for the sake of fighting sexist stereotypes, of course?; 10/14/17, 10:17 AM
JAORE said...: If:

Girl scouts .... good.
Boy scouts .... bad.

Then don't allow your daughter to join the Boy Scouts.

Or, maybe we could form the Pajama Boy Scouts.; 10/14/17, 10:17 AM
lonetown said...: What if some girl scouts want a more traditional role?; 10/14/17, 10:20 AM
roger said...: Meade, Dog Care?
Really?"

Yeah, I know — what about bitch care, right?
=====
I cant help you there, my friend........; 10/14/17, 10:22 AM
roger said...: The foundation premise here is that the NYT and affiliated fools feel that boys are incomplete (I am being charitable here) and in need of the superior feminine attributes which the Girl Scout program promotes. I am an Eagle Scout and yes, Ferdinande Tenderfoot is the first rank in Boy Scouts, impossible to screw up.

That the Left believes that the boys need guidance to smother their toxic masculinity (perhaps at the hand of a wise Latina) is laughable and deserving of ridicule.

but then that would be my male privilege seeping out again.......; 10/14/17, 10:36 AM
Henry said...: Good god. Almost every boy scout badge has some aspect of applying it to help others.

The local boy scout routinely supports community events.

Recent Eagle projects include planting flower beds at an assisted living home, collecting and repairing broken bicycles and giving them to kids in need, and rebuilding the playspace at a preschool.; 10/14/17, 10:43 AM
The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...: "10 Merit Badges Girls Could Earn at Boy Scouts (especially if they want to be more like Meade):"

Fruit so low-hanging that I bet even Laslo would refuse it.; 10/14/17, 10:46 AM
Henry said...: That's a horrifying article. As the author admits, every girl scout badge she promotes for backward boys has a boy scout equivalent -- either a badge, a badge requirement, or as part of the core principles of the organization.

Except for the Misandry badge. That one the boy scouts haven't adopted yet.; 10/14/17, 10:50 AM
roger said...: Recent Eagle projects include planting flower beds at an assisted living home, collecting and repairing broken bicycles and giving them to kids in need, and rebuilding the playspace at a preschool.
=====
and the America Left is perfectly prepared to diminish all such service and values gained from such service by future rapists and oppressors in an unrelenting effort to destroy BSA.......; 10/14/17, 10:51 AM
Henry said...: Every time the author compares girl behavior with boy behavior, she should replace the word girl with the word "white people" and the word boy with "the natives" and see how it reads.; 10/14/17, 10:58 AM
Anne in Rockwall, TX said...: Meade certainly has his wittiness dial set to high today!; 10/14/17, 11:03 AM
ddh said...: Aw, puke.; 10/14/17, 11:14 AM
Birches said...: I'm actually teaching my wolf den to cook a meal for their families in two weeks. ..; 10/14/17, 11:18 AM
Jim said...: The slogan of the Boy Scouts is :Do a good turn daily.

The Boy Scout Law
A Scout is:
Trustworthy
Loyal
Helpful
Friendly
Courteous
Kind
Obedient
Cheerful
Thrifty
Brave
Clean
Reverent

This Eagle Scout thinks that the BSA doesn't have much to learn from the Girl Scouts about helping others.; 10/14/17, 11:38 AM
wwww said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 10/14/17, 11:53 AM
Meade said...: "It was in the Boy Scouts that I learned how to masturbate. No merit badge for that."

yyyeah. Pretty sure that one falls under the category of Discontinued Merit Badges.; 10/14/17, 12:01 PM
Meade said...: Right up there with Hog Production, Hog and Pork Production, and Sheep Farming.; 10/14/17, 12:02 PM
tcrosse said...: Pretty sure that one falls under the category of Discontinued Merit Badges.

The Internet has replaced the Boy Scouts as an incubator of Onanists.; 10/14/17, 12:11 PM
Meade said...: Fine, but does the [Internet] Manual have a section advising the neophyte onanists to refocus their young impressionable minds on better choices: sports, chores, homework, how to use nutrition to help with smooth skin, shiny hair and strong nails..?

Wait. Nevermind that last one.; 10/14/17, 12:24 PM
Howard said...: Rampant gynophobia is a symptom of being a cuck. In my elite, SWJ, wealthy community, the girls participate vigorously in all manner of sport, including the dangerous sports of downhill mtn biking and big wave surfing. Our small community also sports several semi-pro roller derby teams. The girls are just as tough as our boys. The boys go on to play in the NFL, MLB, UFC and win Mavericks. It's obvious from the negative reviews of girls in sport and the outdoor arts is coming from conservative communities that have neutered themselves and are bleating because they no longer have balls.; 10/14/17, 12:27 PM
Expat(ish) said...: My daughter led her venture troop to Philmont where they hiked ~80 miles in the mountains. My sons are at 1.5 Eagles trending toward 2. I volunteered a lot for 8+ years in cubs/boy scouts and have 100+ nights "under the stars." (If you count the bunk beds on the Yorktown.)

I will tell you that the girls attracted to scouting *love* venture scouts, which is 80% like regular scouting and 0% like girl scouts.

I just hope having girls in cubs isn't like letting Californians into Colorado.

-XC; 10/14/17, 12:27 PM
mockturtle said...: I just hope having girls in cubs isn't like letting Californians into Colorado.

Or Washington, Oregon or Montana. :-(; 10/14/17, 12:44 PM
tcrosse said...: Fine, but does the [Internet] Manual have a section advising the neophyte onanists to refocus their young impressionable minds on better choices

Cold showers.; 10/14/17, 12:58 PM
Howard said...: What, you don't like higher property values?; 10/14/17, 1:09 PM
Kate said...: If this is the kind of crap badges the Girl Scouts are doling out now the girls are better in the Boy Scouts. I had badges down the back of my vest and I don't remember any mealy-mouthed categories like these.; 10/14/17, 1:15 PM
Bruce Hayden said...: "Or Washington, Oregon or Montana. :-("

OR is already lost. WA is trending. Seeing some now in MT, but so far, they bring their guns, which means that we are getting the good ones (so far). First time I ever saw a "bullet button" AR-15 was maybe a month ago at the local range. Guy had two of them, and was working on marksmanship with his two sons who had delayed enlistments into the Army.; 10/14/17, 1:42 PM
ALP said...: My time in Girl Scouts gave me nightmares! This was due to our "Civil Defense" training during the 1970's cold war. Our troop met in the basement of our school, which happened to be the site of the area's bomb shelter in the event of nuclear war. We studied radiation poisoning in great detail (the source of my nightmares), pondered what would happen to the earth due to the nuclear fallout (more nightmares), and ate some of the rations from the bomb shelter to be better prepared (dry graham crackers and hard candy - two flavors). This was on top of copy-cat 'bomb threats' inspired by the low level Mafia war going on between leaders of small subsidiary groups in Rochester, NY. The main result of my time in Girl Scouts was a deep fear of being blown up at any minute!

I don't recall getting a mushroom cloud badge for all my pain either.; 10/14/17, 2:25 PM
tcrosse said...: What, you don't like higher property values?

Not at the expense of other values.; 10/14/17, 2:34 PM
Birches said...: AZ also has most of the good CA transplants.; 10/14/17, 2:58 PM
Big Mike said...: I believe there is -- or there used to be -- a merit badge for animal husbandry. Sounds like something Harvey Weinstein would do if he was casting a sequel to "Babe."; 10/14/17, 3:02 PM
Big Mike said...: and for taking responsibility for their actions

There's no merit badge for "taking responsibility for one'sactions" because it's an expectation built into Boy Scouting itself. Now if only we could get women and Times journalists to do the same ...; 10/14/17, 3:07 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: Kate said: If this is the kind of crap badges the Girl Scouts are doling out now the girls are better in the Boy Scouts. I had badges down the back of my vest and I don't remember any mealy-mouthed categories like these.

Exactly Kate. My husband asked me why a girl would want to be in the BOY scouts. Because the activities are more interesting and challenging. I'm the kind of gal who likes outdoor activities, mechanical skills and science based challenges. Astronomy, building things, electronics, fishing, camping, hunting, animal husbandry.

He agreed. The Boys Scouts sound much more fun and challenging than the pap that the Girl Scouts are offering.

'find out how flowers help people.' There’s also a focus on appearance. The independence badge, for 'striding down your path to changing the world,' includes learning how to 'make your clothes look great.' The 'eating for you' badge — recently called 'eating for beauty' — emphasizes how nutrition helps with 'smooth skin, shiny hair and strong nails.'

OMG!!! Spare me from this drivel.; 10/14/17, 3:35 PM
Browndog said...: Maybe Scouting success depends on your Troup leader.

Me, the first meeting, we said the Pledge, then tied yarn to coat hangers to make dust mops. 3 days later, I was using one to clean the classroom during detention.

I just wanted to catch frogs, make a fire, and fish.

I was out-; 10/14/17, 4:00 PM
n.n said...: According to Mother Nature, the feminine gender is characterized by these physical and mental characteristics. They're still typecasting. It's a diversity or perhaps Pro-Choice thing where the solution is avoidance.; 10/14/17, 4:01 PM
Freeman Hunt said...: Just because the boy badges don't have those stupid names doesn't mean their badges aren't teaching those same things.; 10/14/17, 4:52 PM
n.n said...: doesn't mean their badges aren't teaching those same things

Cooking, sewing, laundry, cleaning, ... It's integrated.

Be Prepared.; 10/14/17, 5:29 PM
MadisonMan said...: Maybe Scouting success depends on your Troop leader.

This. Our Scoutmaster was awesome, and knew about boys. He was kind and he showed his temper when necessary. And he could cook very well on an open fire, and was tolerant with tenderfeet.

I'm picturing overnight camp-outs with 13- to 15-yo boys and girls mixed. Too much to go wrong there.; 10/14/17, 6:34 PM
mockturtle said...: OR is already lost. WA is trending. Seeing some now in MT

The Kalispell/Whitefish/Bigfork area was Californicated years ago.; 10/14/17, 7:36 PM
Rick said...: But girls might be better off, too, if more boys earned badges like those from the Girl Scouts for respect

It's revealing her underlying belief is that men should be raised for the benefit of women. It seems the feminist goal is to reverse everything they believe unfair to them instead of eliminating the problem. There's little surprise decent people reject them.; 10/14/17, 8:59 PM
Jane the Actuary said...: Among other differences, Boy Scout troops, to my understanding, have a built in norm that outings (typically campouts) take place once a month, which means that the cooking, planning, "getting along with others," leadership, etc., occurs on a regular basis. So far as I understand, it is entirely dependent on the leaders as to what Girl Scout troops do.

Also -- just to be clear on this point -- the Boy Scouts is not "going co-ed." There will be a separate, sister organization to which troops of girls can affiliate and follow the Boy Scout curriculum. Call it Pre-Women Scouts since Girl Scouts is already taken, I guess.; 10/14/17, 9:37 PM
Gospace said...: The NYTs article with associated graphic is comparing apples and oranges, to, of course, the detriment of BSA. All the GSA badges for all levels of Girl Scouting, and just BSA merit badges, without the requirements for each rank.

The 40 belt loops and pins Cub Scouts can earn.
http://meritbadge.org/wiki/index.php/Belt_Loops_%26_Pins

The otehr Awards for Cub Scouts and their leaders.
http://meritbadge.org/wiki/index.php/Cub_Scout_Awards

And for BSA, aside from merit badges, which are part of the requirements for each rank past First Class, there are requirment to achieve each rank. For example, Second class:
1 Second Class rank requirements
1.1 Camping and Outdoor Ethics
1.2 Cooking and Tools
1.3 Navigation
1.4 Nature
1.5 Aquatics
1.6 First Aid and Emergency Preparedness
1.7 Fitness
1.8 Citizenship
1.9 Personal Safety Awareness
1.10 Scout Spirit
from http://meritbadge.org/wiki/index.php/Second_Class_rank
And then, some of the badges GSA awards, like "Buddy Camper" aren't badges in BSA. They're the way things are. Every camper always has a buddy with him. In the pool, in aquatics, everyone in the pool, or lake, ALWAYS has a buddy and is aware of where the buddy is. No awards for doing what you're supposed to do.

And as far as that quality called leadership- my current BSA troop has been around for 47 years. Takes in young men from 11-18. The older Scouts teach the younger Scouts as much as possible in basic scouting and skills. Our leaders perform cursory checks if a an older Scout tells us a younger Scout has completed a rank requirement. We trust them to do it right, or ask us how to do it. As near as I can determine, Girl Scout Troops aren't continuous. They're formed by age cohort and dissolve when the girls age out. I could be wrong, but it looks like older Girl Scouts aren't involved in instructing the younger ones as Boy Scouts are..; 10/14/17, 9:55 PM
Biff said...: An interesting thing about Boy Scout merit badges is that despite being largely skills/knowledge-based, their requirements are flexible enough that they can be interpreted in ways that can be challenging to both a twelve-year-old and a seventeen-year-old.

I've often thought that it would be interesting and worthwhile for adults to attempt to complete the requirements for many Boy Scout merit badges, but at a skill level appropriate for adults.

An adult could do far worse than the official Boy Scout merit badge handbooks and requirements for gaining a general understanding of any area covered by a merit badge.

For those who may be interested, the requirements for all current merit badges are available at http://www.scouting.org/meritbadges.aspx.; 10/14/17, 10:09 PM
Denny said...: "if more boys earned badges like those from the Girl Scouts for respect and fair play, and for taking responsibility for their actions," Maybe the MSM should join the Scouts. They could learn to be respectful, play fair and take responsibilities for their action.; 10/14/17, 10:15 PM
TBlakely said...: "I have no problem with the Boy Scouts inviting girls to join. It just might not turn out the way the boys expect."

Girrrrl power, the most powerful force in the universe. If one has sufficient Girrrrl power, they can escape from a black hole.

Hey sweety, when the barbarians arrive enmasse why don't you take them out for us weak males?.... kk, thx.; 10/14/17, 10:34 PM
Michelle Dulak Thomson said...: Bruce Hayden,

OR is already lost.

I don't think so, and I say this as a CA transplant who spent a quarter century there. We're well out of CA, but we aren't turning OR into more of the same. Then again, we're in Salem, which is one of the saner parts of the state. Portland, say, is definitely Californicated, to the point where I can hardly say which infected which.; 10/14/17, 10:57 PM
wholelottasplainin said...: tcrosse said...
It was in the Boy Scouts that I learned how to masturbate. No merit badge for that. I tremble to think what I could have learned from the girls.

*****************************

So...you're saying that it took the Boy Scouts to teach you how to masturbate?

Did the scouts teach a course, or something?

Or are you just full of shit?; 10/15/17, 12:06 AM
wholelottasplainin said...: If the organization just changed its name to the Scouts, no feminoid would be interested.; 10/15/17, 12:08 AM
Bill Befort said...: All this comment, and no one mentions Tom Lehrer's "Be Prepared" song?; 10/15/17, 3:22 AM
Paul said...: I can't stand badges. Stripes, patches.
The thing itself is its own reward.; 10/15/17, 4:37 AM
iowan2 said...: I,m sure someone else has posted this, but I haven't read all the comments
On my honor, I will do my best
To do my duty to God and my country and to obey the Scout Law;
To help other people at all times;
To keep myself physically strong, mentally awake and morally straight.

The Oath and Motto, are all about how you treat others.

We as parents were involved in both Girl Scouts, and Boy Scouts , involved with both kids in their respective troops. With out any competition, Boy Scouts far surpasses the Girl Scouts, by focusing on building character...by being of service to others.; 10/15/17, 7:25 AM
iowan2 said...: "Maybe Scouting success depends on your Troop leader."

If done right, adult leadership is best when they get out of the boys way. The boys should be doing the planning, and younger, teaching older. Adults play a role. Best if in the shadows.; 10/15/17, 7:32 AM
Rusty said...: Blogger mockturtle said...
OR is already lost. WA is trending. Seeing some now in MT

The Kalispell/Whitefish/Bigfork area was Californicated years ago.

That's a shame. I liked the small town local atmosphere of Kalispell and Whitefish. It's getting to the point that there aren't any more western towns that California hasn't corrupted.; 10/15/17, 7:33 AM
Stoutcat said...: Rick said: "It's revealing her underlying belief is that men should be raised for the benefit of women..."

Actually, she doesn't understand that her underlying believe is fully in accord with our evolution. Men are -- and should be -- raised for the benefit of women. Heinlein (as usual) had it correct:

"All societies are based on rules to protect pregnant women and young children. All else is surplusage, excrescence, adornment, luxury, or folly which can - and must - be dumped in emergency to preserve this prime function. As racial survival is the only universal morality, no other basic is possible. Attempts to formulate a "perfect society" on any foundation other than "Women and children first!" is not only witless, it is automatically genocidal..."; 10/15/17, 9:40 AM
Inkling said...: Part One

One of the books I've written on health care, Hospital Gowns and Other Embarrassments, is still perhaps the only book in print advising patients—teen girls in particular—how to deal with the embarrassment issues that arise in hospitals.

Looking for ways to promote it, I contacted the Girl Scouts. I was surprised to discover that they have almost no way to communicate content to girls or, in my case, to review my book. They have no magazine like the wonderful Boys Life I read long ago as a kid. They have a website that's little more than gush. The person I contacted apologized. She said they simply lacked the money to do anything substantial. You can see the website here. It's little more than "Girls are Great" puffery.

http://www.girlscouts.org

Both Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts have lost their way and are floundering. At least the Boy Scouts have kept Boy's Life going, although I wonder how they'd do that now that it is expected to cater to both boys and girls. Their tastes in reading could hardly be more different. Will issues like that on "Cave Men" have to be matched by ones on "Decorating Your Bedroom in Pink."

http://boyslife.org/section/magazine/
-----
Those who're interested in a realistic description of differences between the sexes, particularly teen boys and girls, might want to read another of my books, Embarrass Less. It's written for hospital staff and gives practical ways to make patient care less embarrassing. The book is based on when I was on the adolescent unit nursing staff of a top children's hospital.

One point I make it the book is that our care inadvertently created a situation that revealed how the two sexes respond to high levels of stress, both the helplessness that follows major orthopedic surgeries and the embarrassment issues that arise when teen boys are being cared for by women (our young, lovely nurses) and the girls were being cared for by me, the unit's only male staff.

To put it concisely, the boys were sullen and uncooperative. They wanted to feel in charge and there's nothing a hospital, much less a children's one, wants to do less that give patients control. Their instinctive response was 'fight or flight' and, unable to punch their nurses, they fled into a shell. Disliking the embarrassment of being bed-bound, they always wore undies, they kept their gowns tucked in, and they pulled their sheets up to their chests despite the summer heat. I found that hilarious. I felt like telling them, "Hey, most of these nurses are married to guys better looking than you. They don't care about seeing your undies.

The girls were the opposite, responding to their stress with tend and befriend with me as the primary beneficiary. Those who could get about tended me, going out of my way to cheer me up. Those left helpless by their surgeries befriended me by being helpful. Unlike the boys, these girls did not want to take charge of their care. But their willingness to cooperate raised issues, particularly with male caregivers. They knew men fell into three groups.

1. A creep who was dangerous, much like Harvey Weinstein.
2. A wuss who resembled most Hollywood males
3. A hero who'd protect them.

Continued.; 10/15/17, 9:45 AM
Inkling said...: Part 2
The girls would watch me for about an hour on my first day of caring for them in their room of four and would place me in the third category. My basic message to them, conveyed by my deeds was, "I'll do everything I can to reduce your embarrassment if you'll live with the rest." That they did and we got along marvelously. One result of that was that dress in their room was relaxed and casual. They did not suffer from the heat like the boys. For most girls, sheets were kicked down, undies were optional, and gowns flopped about. I got very good at looking the other way. And even the most modest of the girls, who kept carefully under their sheets, smiled and were delighted to have me as their caregiver. Our nurses were a bit too casual with exposure. They knew I'd protect them from outside creeps.

Then one day a male float showed up and I quickly picked up that he was a creep. He was a bit too eager to linger in the room with all those under-dressed girls. That ticked me off, since I considered them under my protection. Their willingness to cooperate was not going to be turned against them. I decided to declare that room off-limits to him the next time he tried to enter. Yes, unlike Hollywood's male creeps, I was a male in 'fight' mode. I had advantages. Those girls were my patients not his. They also trusted me and would back me, as would our unit's nurses. But I was also quite willing to escalate our confrontation as far as necessary to keep him out—getting physical if that was required. The situations was a good illustration of how beneficial 'toxic masculinity' can be. To protect those girls, I could not only turn violent, I would enjoy doing so.

The creep got lucky. Nursing administration soon called and sent him elsewhere. I never saw him again.

In short, guys tilt toward aggression and girls toward cooperation. Even their faults mirror that. Those teen boys were miserable because the hospital allowed no space for their aggression. The girls did well because their cooperation fit in well. But those distinctions also create issues. The horrors of Weinstein existed because Hollywoods males didn't get aggressive for those women, and those women had trouble turning aggressive even when it was obvious that being cooperative meant being a victim.

And that's why we need a Boy Scouts for boys. They need to be taught to turn their aggression into good channels, including protecting girls. And we need a Girl Scouts to teach a complimentary role to women—to cooperate with good men and not with the creeps. While there's nothing wrong with organizations that mix boys and girls together, we also need organizations that keep them separate and benefit from that.

--Michael W. Perry, author of Embarrass Less: A Practical Guide to Doctors, Nurses, Students and Hospitals.; 10/15/17, 9:45 AM
Bad Lieutenant said...: Actually, she doesn't understand that her underlying believe is fully in accord with our evolution. Men are -- and should be -- raised for the benefit of women. Heinlein (as usual) had it correct:

...

For a different take:

As I Please

in Tribune
14 July 1944

George Orwell

...The other thing that needs dealing with is the parrot cry ‘killing women and children’. I pointed out before, but evidently it needs repeating, that it is probably somewhat better to kill a cross-section of the population than to kill only the young men. If the figures published by the Germans are true, and we have really killed 1,200,000 civilians in our raids, that loss of life has probably harmed the German race somewhat less than a corresponding loss on the Russian front or in Africa and Italy.

Any nation at war will do its best to protect its children. and the number of children killed in raids probably does not correspond to their percentage of the general population. Women cannot be protected to the same extent, but the outcry against killing women, if you accept killing at all, is sheer sentimentality. Why is it worse to kill a woman than a man? The argument usually advanced is that in killing women you are killing the breeders, whereas men can be more easily spared. But this is a fallacy based on the notion that human beings can be bred like animals. The idea behind it is that since one man is capable of fertilizing a very large number of women, just as a prize ram fertilizes thousands of ewes, the loss of male lives is comparatively unimportant. Human beings, however, are not cattle. When the slaughter caused by a war leaves a surplus of women, the enormous majority of those women bear no children. Male lives are very nearly as important, biologically, as female ones.

In the last war the British Empire lost nearly a million men killed, of whom about three quarters came from these islands. Most of them will have been under thirty. If all those young men had had only one child each we should now have an extra 750,000 people round about the age of twenty. France, which lost much more heavily, never recovered from the slaughter of the last war, and it is doubtful whether Britain has fully recovered, either. We can’t yet calculate the casualties of the present war, but the last one killed between ten and twenty million young men. Had it been conducted, as the next one will perhaps be, with flying bombs, rockets and other long-range weapons which kill old and young, healthy and unhealthy, male and female impartially, it would probably have damaged European civilization somewhat less than it did.; 10/15/17, 10:14 AM
Tom Perkins said...: " if more boys earned badges like those from the Girl Scouts for respect and fair play, and for taking responsibility for their actions, not to mention babysitting and making dinner "

I should like this idiot to demonstrate there is any lack of learning respect and fair play, and personal accountability, and there certainly are badges that deal with making dinner (frequently while carrying it in on your back while leaving no trace). As for babysitting--show me the Girls Scouts teach babysitting without it being called sexual stereotyping? Professional feminist hystericists blithering about rape culture have spent 40 years convincing people males cannot be trusted with children, because abuse*. Now they want Boy Scouts to have a babysitting merit badge ?!

*To the extent male airline passengers have been booted off flights because they would been seated next to 3rd party unescorted children.

The correct response to these people is, "Screw you, hippie!"; 10/15/17, 10:16 AM
Tom Perkins said...: @Inkling

" Both Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts have lost their way and are floundering. "

No. The GSA is run by leftist radicals, and it is run top down to suit them.

The BSA is not run top down, neither is it floundering.

https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/278224/

If you read the comments not posted by social conservative "social justice warriors", you'll notice the comments from numerous people involved in Scouting who are saying this in response to requests from parents disgusted with the GSA, that it is not a top down mandate for all units to admit girls--it is only permission for local units to operate dens of girls in Cub Scout Packs if those units wish to do so.; 10/15/17, 10:43 AM
RonF said...: If the GSUSA emphasizes diversity and the BSA does not, how is it that the BSA is now and is going to be even more diverse than the GSUSA?; 10/15/17, 11:08 PM
RonF said...: Organizationally a Den is a group ideally of 6 Scouts all the same age, working on the same rank and badges and led by adults. A Pack is a collection of Dens covering the age groups of 1st through 5th Grades. If girls join in the fall of 2018 they will be in single-sex Dens, and the boys will continue to be. Dens of both sexes will be in those Packs whose sponsoring organization so choose.

In the fall of 2019 the BSA states it will roll out a program that will be as close to the current Boy Scout program as possible. Young women will be organized by Patrols and Troops. Patrols are groups of 6 - 8 Scouts. They are often grouped by age but need not be - originally Patrols were organized by neighborhoods and the Scouts were all ages and were in Scouting's heyday. They are led by their Patrol Leader, who is elected by the Scouts. The Troop has a Senior Patrol Leader, who is elected by all the Troop's Scouts. The Senior Patrol Leader runs meetings and camp outs in conjunction with the Patrol Leaders and Troop Officers (Scouts in Patrols who also have Troop related jobs like Scribe or Quartermaster). They all get varying amounts of guidance and instruction from the adult leaders, headed by the Scoutmaster. They will be separate from the Boy Scout Troops.; 10/15/17, 11:41 PM
RonF said...: It will be interesting to see how young women implement that leadership model and style.; 10/15/17, 11:42 PM
RMc said...: "If you're looking for adventure of a
new and different kind,
And you come across a Girl Scout who is
similarly inclined,
Don't be nervous, don't be flustered, don't be scared.
Be prepared!"

--Tom Lehrer; 10/16/17, 5:54 AM