The AfD won 13% of the vote and came a stunning third place behind the main center-right and center-left parties. It becomes the first far-right party to enter the Bundestag since 1961. But it has been riven with internal strife: [party chairwoman Frauke] Petry has been regarded as a more moderate force in the party, arguing that it had to break with the far right in order to move from opposition into government.
"Today we must be open that there is internal dissent within the AfD," Petry said at the press conference. "We must not be silent about this. The community needs to know that we have controversial debates." She told reporters later that she would sit in the Bundestag as an independent.
AfD co-founder Alexander Gauland repeatedly called after Petry, saying "I do not approve of this behavior." He described the walkout as a bombshell.
September 25, 2017
"Far-right party AfD in disarray a day after historic German election result."
CNN reports.
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37 comments:
"The AfD won 13% of the vote and came a stunning third place behind the main center-right and center-left parties."
I think the left-wing media uses the word "stunning" much too often. I ain't stunned by this election. If German wants to permit the immigration of thousands of Muslims, that's there business. They will be stunned, though, at the increase in crime, terrorist attacks and slow transformation of their culture.
Huh. This populist party did way above expectations, and now the real news is that they are in disarray - chaos.
Why does that sound familiar?
The News media has its pre-written story about a party in chaos and confusion, but why believe them?
I think the far right parties should broaden their appeal. They should cater not just to the nationalists but they should also offer the kind of broad based appeal that is inherent in a socialist program. If they could unite these two potent forces, who knows what marvels Germany may achieve.
CNN - most trusted name in fakes news.
UKIP suffered a similar fate after Nigel Farage stepped down. As much of a supporter of UKIP as I was, it was a boutique party that existed for one primary purpose: to get the UK out of the EU. With that goal on its way to being accomplished, the party does not have much of a raison d'être. AFD is a very young political party (much younger than UKIP), having been founded around mid-2012, and like UKIP is mainly focused on euroskepticism. Given such a narrow focus, the party is likely to attract people from a variety of spectrums, and thus internal battling is inevitably, so long as the leadership is able to temper that battle and keep the party focused on the prize, it could do well. And of course, because a central component of AfD is immigration restriction, you can expect it to be described as "far-right" by pretty much any establishment media. In fact, when I learned that Farage was to speak at an AfD rally, I imagined the headlines would be hysterical, but even this shocked me. Here's a sample:
"Top Nazi's grandchild hosts Nigel Farage at AfD rally"
"Nigel Farage To Speak At Far-Right Rally After Invitation From Granddaughter Of Hitler’s Former Minister"
Apparently, if you have the unfortunate historical circumstance of being the "granddaughter of Hitler's foreign minister," you are ipso facto wrong.
Godwin's Law is dead.
Sounds like she got tired of people calling her mean.
On my own and in courses I've learned what Nazism was all about. The total state. Mussolini's famous quote - "All within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state" - describes Hitler's Germany.
But it also describes all totalitarian regimes, from Pharaohism to Caesarism to USSR to Red China, and others. That is, as left politically as possible.
Everything Hilter did, Stalin did, which was the same as what Mao did. The last two on scales even greater than Hilter.
Yet Hitler's NSDAP is called far-right?
gspencer:
Yet Hitler's NSDAP is called far-right?
I don't really quarrel with the notion that fascism is mostly a right-wing movement. Paul Gottfried, himself a traditional conservative, makes the case very persuasively in his book Fascism: The Career of a Concept. You can read Gottfried on the subject here and a review of his book here.
Germans decided that the answer to Merkel was a little more Merkel. So be it.
Exactly what makes AfD the "far right" party? Just politically incorrect speech, or are they actually doing or advocating something they shouldn't?
@GSpencer, @JFarmer - European "left" and "right" don't translate to American left and right. Reading the 25 Points of National Socialism should put to rest the ideological origins of the Nazis. Socialists! In the USA, socialism is driven from the left. It was convenient for American progressives to morph the Nazis into "rightists" for political purposes.
Oso Negro is correct. "Right" and "left" are vague terms and don't translate across country boundaries.
It's power that matters. Power, power, power. Statism, cronyism, socialism, whatever. Power.
I don't really quarrel with the notion that fascism is mostly a right-wing movement.
Fascism was invented by a socialist, and is most definitely a party of the Left by US conventions.
BTW, even NPR yesterday was reporting that AFD had scored a political touchdown in this election. The talking points are messed up. Did AFD deliver a knife-blow to socialist stupidity, or did it not?
Probably it will take 24 hours for them to figure it out.
Fascism is leftism. Learn it. Deal with it.
North Korea calls itself the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, yet it's not democratic and it's not a republic. Why?
A political party not in ideological lockstep. Hardly surprising. The last time they tried the lockstep thing it did not go well.
J. Farmer
Fascism is to the right of communism but it is not right wing - did Paul Gottfried explain how Benito Mussolini and Friedrich Hayek could both be comfortable in same party?
J.Farmer: UKIP suffered a similar fate after Nigel Farage stepped down. As much of a supporter of UKIP as I was, it was a boutique party that existed for one primary purpose: to get the UK out of the EU. With that goal on its way to being accomplished, the party does not have much of a raison d'être. AFD is a very young political party (much younger than UKIP), having been founded around mid-2012, and like UKIP is mainly focused on euroskepticism. Given such a narrow focus, the party is likely to attract people from a variety of spectrums, and thus internal battling is inevitably, so long as the leadership is able to temper that battle and keep the party focused on the prize, it could do well.
My (ignorant, outsiders) impression of opposition parties in Western Europe (the real ones, not the status quo "opposition" parties) is that they would have had to have successfully weathered their "awkward adolescent" phase of party-building 10-20 years ago to have reached the stage of organizational and strategic maturity necessary to make any difference now. Instead, a competent, disciplined PTB political/media machine and a lack of competent leadership and organizational chops in the opposition have resulted in a too little, too late scenario.
Not that the status quo can be maintained - just that a competent, organized opposition, with some experience in governing, would mean that things might not get quite as ugly as now seems inevitable. I hope I'm misreading things. But I suspect that the PTBs are gonna regret having done such a good job of demonizing everyone who wanted to introduce the slightest bit of prudence and common sense into the execution of their grand schemes.
"Top Nazi's grandchild hosts Nigel Farage at AfD rally"
"Nigel Farage To Speak At Far-Right Rally After Invitation From Granddaughter Of Hitler’s Former Minister"
I guess there always come the point, before le déluge, where the understanding of "grotesquely overplaying one's hand" is lost.
CNN--all the news that's fit to fabricate.
J Farmer asks: North Korea calls itself the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, yet it's not democratic and it's not a republic. Why?
Same reason that Europe was at one time called the 'Holy Roman Empire'. It sounded good.
North Korea calls itself the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, yet it's not democratic and it's not a republic. Why?
Because the Left believes that words are more important than reality.
The right, at least in America, has an individual orientation, which is antithetical to communist, socialist, fascist ideologies. Perhaps Germany's national charter and organizing philosophy defines their political spectrum on different terms.
We must not be silent about this. The community needs to know that we have controversial debates.
I'd say Alternative für Deutschland is better off without a woman of such dazzling rhetorical skill.
North Korea calls itself the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, yet it's not democratic and it's not a republic. Why?
This is what is known as a "lie".
I'm stunned they only got 13% of the vote, given that Merkel's platform is: "Vote for us so we can continue to spend your tax dollars to import rapists and terrorists to assault you, then call you a racist for complaining".
Turn out the lights, Germany is no longer part of western civilization. Just call it Bundistan.
The far left and the far right meet in a circle: Supporting evidence.
The left is also divided. So is the CDU/CSU. But the PTB are still strong in Germany. Will the SPD enter a new coalition? Can Merkel rule with FDP and Greens?
The far left and the far right meet in a circle
The left-right nexus. For example: anarchists, who are ostensibly individualist, serve at the pleasure of the state.
Merkel's party has its lowest Vote-gotten percentage in years, yet it's the Far-right that's in Disarray.
Got it.
The left-right nexus. For example: anarchists, who are ostensibly individualist, serve at the pleasure of the state.
I figured this out when Dennis Kusinich started making sense.
William @7:51 am: That was so understated that I think a lot of people missed it (I know I did). Hilarious once I finally got it!
mockturtle:
re: left-right nexus
I reasoned from what the anarchist offers and the state desires: cause and justification, respectively.
I figured this out when Dennis Kusinich started making sense.
I'm not familiar with Kusinich. What did he say or do to reveal the relationship?
We seem to be converging on the same conclusion, but following different fitness functions, thus the left-right division... gradient, really. Most of us, it seems, are open to reasonable reconciliation that permits a conservation of principles.
n.n, at times Dennis Kucinich, a far-left former Dem Congressman from Ohio, echoed many of the sentiments that Sara Palin and other far-right Republicans espoused. Much about crony capitalism and the establishment Deep State in both parties and with which I totally agree.
A party that went from 0 to major player is in a shambles?
Petry is an opportunist. If she was serious she'd stay in AfD and help reform it, not perform these theatrics.
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