"... the fact is that this hero happens to be a man of color who stopped another man of color from further harming or killing a white cop; thereby reminding us that black lives matter, blue lives matter, and indeed all life matters."
That was written on the Facebook page of the Lee County, Florida sheriff's department, about a man named Ashad Russell who happened to be on the scene when Edward Strother had Sheriff’s Deputy Dean Bardes pinned to the ground and was beating him in the head and trying to take his gun. Russell happened to have his own gun, walked up to the fight with his gun drawn, and Bardes begged Russell to shoot Strother. Russell did so, and Strother died.
Fortunately, for Russell — and Bardes! — Russell had a concealed-carry permit and Florida has a stand-your-ground law (under which the district attorney deemed Russell's killing of Strother justified). Under the stand-your-ground law, you're immune from prosecution if you use "defensive force" and have "a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm" (even where the harm is to another person).
So: Russell saw a fight, saw that the person losing the fight was a police officer, and responded — after telling the attacker to stop or he'd shoot — to the police officer's request.
Strother’s brother expressed outrage: “They are calling him a good Samaritan?... Was my brother armed?”
What would have happened if: 1. Russell hadn't had a gun? 2. Russell had a gun but not a concealed-carry permit? 3. Russell had a gun and a concealed-carry permit but Florida didn't have a stand-your-ground law?
Was it smart — was it right — for the Sheriff's Department to praise Russell the way it did — especially the "black lives matter, blue lives matter, and indeed all life matters"? Why draw attention to race? Why focus on Russell's race and his willingness to shoot another black man? Does this make it more likely or less likely that the next black man will help a police officer who is endangered by another black man?
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48 comments:
He doesn't fit the narrative. Blacks all admire black crime especially against police.
Since when have blacks had a problem with shooting blacks?
Strother’s brother expressed outrage: “They are calling him a good Samaritan?... Was my brother armed?”
This man's comment is a window into his soul.
Most Black people will come to the defense of someone irrespective of their color. So, will a White, Brown and Yellow person. Only Trumpies believe White people do not commit any crime whatsoever in this world.
It is difficult to frame any lethal shooting of an unarmed person as successful policing.
If Barack had a son, he would look like Ashad.
I have a feeling Ashad Russell's life is about to be ruined.
He cannot be allowed to be a hero. Race. Concealed-Carry. Stand Your Ground.
It will begin with Hashtags, of course.
I am Laslo.
Just stating the facts.
Unknown said:
Only Trumpies believe White people do not commit any crime whatsoever in this world.
This man's comment is a window into his soul.
OK, Begley, you beat me to it.
===============
An obviously unsuccessful police event (they are human beings), saved by a good Samaritan (per the facts given). Race? I dunno. I never used to pay any attention to it (really), but there was such an unrelenting barrage of BS about race for so long, I am now obsessed with it like everyone else.
"more or less likely"?
That is up to the "black community," and to a lesser extent, the left in general. Will they view this through racially-tinted glasses, or through justice-tinted glasses? If I was a betting man ...
You go for a cop's gun, you've decided it's him or you.
This has more to do with the State, after all it is Florida.But trying to break up a violent fight without a gun can be dangerous, Just ask Colum McCann.
In the south, there's a very different view of race and relations between the races. I once heard someone say regarding whites view of blacks, "In the north, they love them as a people but hate them individually. In the south, they hate them as a people but love them individually."
Does this make it more likely or less likely that the next black man will help a police officer who is endangered by another black man?
That depends on whether the "next black man" is a decent human being. Most are.
The easy answer is that they were all Americans. That is Scots Irish culture speaking: If you do the right thing, you skin color is invisible.Welcome to the community.
Working in DJT, he was accused of having a Neandethal or Cromagnon view of RACE. That means he is using the American Scots Irish viewpoint. That irritates the bankable rabble rousers no end.
All good questions Professor. With the luxury of the right situational outcome to examine them by...
Trump should invite the police officer and the wrongfully maligned black man to the white house for a club soda summit.
White cop, black assailant. White cop begs black bystander for help before assailant steals gun from cop to use against cop. Black bystander comes to the aid of cop.
Brother of assailant asks the timeless question of bystander...
"Which side are you on? Which side are you on?"
Only Trumpies believe White people do not commit any crime whatsoever in this world.
That is so unfair. They know Hillary Clinton is a national security felon. Bil Clinton is a rapist. Fauxhontas is an affirmative action fraudster (and nobody is Whiter than Elizabeth Warren).
And that is just off the top of my head.
PB@7:41AM/
Another version/varient re living patterns goes: "In the North they don't care how high you get as long as you don't get too close. In the South they don't care how close you get as long as you don't get too high."
In answer to your questions:
1. Cop would likely have been murdered, and Russell likely would have, also.
2. Carrying concealed without a permit appears to be a felony in Florida. Since the cop asked Russell to intervene, the chances of Russell being charged range from slim to none.
3. Without a stand-your-ground law, Russell would have still been justified in shooting Strother in self-defense because (1) the cop asked him to intervene, and (2). Strother was trying to gain control of the cop's gun. (Self-defense laws cover third parties - - wives, children, even strangers, if they are themselves in danger of death).
“They are calling him a good Samaritan?... Was my brother armed?”
He was trying to be, and in another few seconds might have been.
I guess police will back off supporting outlawing carry of guns by the good guys now. They were for it once as a monopoly seemed good until Kill Cops became the Soros paid agitators theme.
AReasonableMan said...It is difficult to frame any lethal shooting of an unarmed person as successful policing.
The guy who did the shooting isn't a police officer, so criticism of him for bad policing doesn't make much sense. I doubt the officer thinks things went well in this situation so I'm not sure what criticism of him for bad policing would really mean. "You shouldn't have gotten your ass kicked by a guy to the point that you were in danger of being killed and had to be saved by an armed civilian." Yeah, I'm sure he agrees.
"Unarmed" is a funny word when used to soften the fact that a guy was doing his best to beat another guy to death and/or beat another guy and take that guy's gun (thus arming himself).
There was a somewhat similar case in Phoenix a month ago. In that case, the bad guy who was, of course, an illegal alien, was armed and shot the state trooper from ambush.
The good guy stopped and went back to his car for his gun when the trooper asked for help. He alos told the bad guy to stop beating the wounded cop before shooting him.
The good guy is of unknown ethnic background although he seems to have a lot of tattoos.
Naturally, the lefties side with the cop assailant.
What a world they would create if allowed to rule. We already saw that with Obama.
I live near where this happened - it was a big big deal in the local papers (we have old people so still have a good newspaper) and local radio.
The gunshop down the street offered the guy a free gun since his was in custody. Apparently he got a lot of offers like that.
Florida, man.
-XC
Georgw Zimmermann was unavailable for comment.
"Why draw attention to race? Why focus on Russell's race and his willingness to shoot another black man? Does this make it more likely or less likely that the next black
man will help a police officer who is endangered by another black man?"
Seems that you have answered your own question. We focus on race because we know it is a very powerful predictor of behavior. Almost as powerful as sex. But if you really want to know, who is most likely to help a cop in trouble, it's not the man, or the woman, nor the black, nor the white. It's the person who is legally carrying a concealed firearm.
Unknown said...
"Most Black people will come to the defense of someone irrespective of their color. So, will a White, Brown and Yellow person. Only Trumpies believe White people do not commit any crime whatsoever in this world."
Are you ever embarrassed by the things you post? The left is truly deranged. You have turned the corner and your amorality is out there for everyone to see.
There is no way you can not see the shooter as a hero. It is one thing to protest police tactics. But anyone who would assault a police officer with clear intent to end his life like this is not doing any community any good.
Russell had a concealed weapons permit, as do many Americans, and used his weapon appropriately. Race shouldn't enter into to it. Yes, he is a hero.
Of more immediate importance to Bardes, what have happend if Strother had been armed, or if had taken Bardes' weapon?
What would have happened if: 1. Russell hadn't had a gun? 2. Russell had a gun but not a concealed-carry permit? 3. Russell had a gun and a concealed-carry permit but Florida didn't have a stand-your-ground law?
1. There is always the "kick-em in the balls or head move"
2. I think you confuse CCW, with the possibility that the gun was still legal. Open carry is legal in Florida, as is carrying a loaded weapon in your glove box. Now if the bystander were an ex-felon, but of course, his "team" might be in question then...
3. Self defense of a third party, or the possibility that the bystander felt threatened still makes it potentially justifiable. You really think the injured cop is going to testify against the bystander?
Why draw attention to race?
You're trying to prevent BLM riots?
I probably wouldn't have focused on race, but yeah the guy is a hero.
Michael K, I watched the press conference with the guy in Phoenix. He was obviously very haunted by the fact he took someone's life, even though he knew he had to. A good guy.
Are you ever embarrassed by the things you post? The left is truly deranged. You have turned the corner and your amorality is out there for everyone to see.
No, next question.
Also why I almost never feed trolls.
I confess to a few temptations surrendered to but it is always a waste of time.
Ten or twelve years ago I had some useful debates over at Washington Monthly with lefties but that all changed about 2004.
It may have been Iraq or the 2000 election but left wingers mostly went off the deep end about then.
"I watched the press conference with the guy in Phoenix"
I did, too and felt for him.
An armed society is a polite society.”
~Robert Heinlein
1 U.S. jurisdictions that have constitutional carry
1.1 Alaska
1.2 Arizona
1.3 Arkansas[disputed]
1.4 Idaho (residents only)
1.5 Kansas
1.6 Maine
1.7 Mississippi
1.8 Missouri
1.9 Vermont
1.10 West Virginia
1.11 Wyoming (residents only)
2 U.S. States that have a limited form of permitless concealed carry
2.1 Montana (outside city limits)
2.2 New Hampshire (unloaded weapon & loaded magazine)
2.3 New Mexico (unloaded weapon & loaded magazine, vehicle carry)
2.4 Oklahoma (residents of constitutional carry states)
Please note that these states are notoriously dangerous and violent.
Hey, Washington State does, too! I still have mine as I am still officially a WA resident but will be able to get one easily here in AZ, too.
And my CCP has reciprocity in enough states that I can travel diagonally across the US where it is valid.
No comment from the Strother’s brothers parents, the ones that forgot to explain to their sons, "It's a bad idea to assault a police officer."
Human life has variable, and, in fact, selective value under the State-established Pro-Choice Church. Fortunately, there are people who deny this quasi-religion, reject the underlying twilight faith, and judge people by the content of their character, rather than the "color of their skin".
I love how the "but was he armed?!" question is proffered for a guy who had the cop on the ground and was beating him in the head.
You don't need weapons to kill or cripple someone by doing that.
"Committing a violent felony, and continuing to do so" is more than enough, with good reason.
Stand your ground deals only with the common law "duty to retreat" (i.e., one's back must be "against a wall") before self defense is used. Because the officer was pinned to the ground, stand your ground doesn't make a difference at all. If the common law retreat rule (the default in non SYG jurisdictions) was in place, the third party self defense would have been equally as justifiable.
This is exactly why the Zimmerman-Martin case was not a SYG case. The jury found that Martin had pinned Zimmerman to the ground. And, being pinned to the ground and pounded is by law a threat of grave bodily harm, against which deadly force can be used in self defense.
Bring back the Duel. The people need someway outside of the courts to legally let off steam and right a perceived wrong. Would take a large bite out of violent crime which makes the victim a slave to their fears until death. And civil society and our ability to trust absolutely others with it. We must not allow this if America is to return to its roots. Where the community levied quick justice when beyond tar and feathering. Take a man's horse so he'll starve to death. You die.
"Does this make it more likely or less likely that the next black man will help a police officer who is endangered by another black man?"
The vast majority of American men of ANY race will help a police officer in trouble.
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