December 15, 2015

I'm really psyched for tonight's debate.

I think something big will happen.

ADDED: You can talk about the debate here. I'll update with comments if the spirit moves me.

AND: John is live-blogging, here.

ALSO: Trump says he will not run as a third party candidate. He's also made up with Cruz.

PLUS: The something big I thought I'd see was Cruz getting the better of Trump. But Trump was acting like Cruz's pal. It wasn't quite reciprocal, but it was disarming.

128 comments:

garage mahal said...

I'm psyched about finding the Snowy Owl that was spotted today in Madison. I might even go tonight and check around.

mccullough said...

Still too many people up on that stage.

Mike Sylwester said...

Maybe Jeb Bush will announce that he has a secret plan.

pm317 said...

watching the mini candidates.

Clyde said...

It's going up against The Voice's finale results show. Don't know how much of an audience will show up for CNN.

traditionalguy said...

Knowing CNN the moderators will probably declare that Clinton the winner unanimous world vote as per the Decree of the House of Saud that just bought the Network for pocket change.

clint said...

At dinner, we were talking about there being an "also ran" debate. I correctly remembered that there were four participants. But between us, we could only come up with Huckabee's name. I mentioned Graham, but was fairly sure he'd already dropped out. Apparently, he hasn't.

(Spoiler Alert: Pataki and Santorum are the other two.)

Eric said...

Maybe Jeb Bush will announce that he has a secret plan.

He'd better. The public plan just ain't cutting it.

Anonymous said...

The kids table debate was pretty darn interesting. I think Graham won that debate hands down, but strangly he often looked like he was on the verge of tears.

Titus said...

I am here! Hi fellow republicans!

Chuck said...

I'm psyched about garage mahal going out to look for Snowy Owls in the darkness.

n said...

So...Ted Cruz looks like Napoleon with the hand under the jacket. Ouch.

pm317 said...

Hi Titus, but I am no republican.. I am a Trumpian.

Guildofcannonballs said...

Most sadnesslly I have to relate:

They were write.

Er.

Umn (would they even know?)

They were RIGHT.

Better to live, like that heroin guy in Trainspotting says, than be drugged up on politicians words.

Only a small percentage will, Steynwise, at of course www.steyononline.com unless that rock precludith* sanity.

*defined forever and not discluding now as precluding timelyke/timewise/timeBuckley.

Ed.

steve uhr said...

This will be a bad night for Rand Paul. His views on terrorism, NSA are not in keeping with the mainstream just days after major attacks.

Guildofcannonballs said...

The reflections upon time, its important exulted beyond understanding human here, nor there indeed foremost moresost, revealed although you'd never knowed deriving from Liverpool is Pual PCartneys:

Simply Having, A Wonderful Christmas Time.

Heh.

Indeed you are.

Fact is folks, Paul McCartney not now nor ever was simply having a wonderful Christmas time, Time as you like, as to write is Dorothy Parker can tell you today matters.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Would it have been possible for Fiorina to have worn a gaudier crucifix?

What pandering. These are the most practiced opening statement I've ever heard.

At least they're all focusing on Obama and the Democrats. Rally the troops against the opposition, since no one feels positively enough about any of them for their own merits.

Ted Cruz would look passable in make-up and drag.

Titus said...

Bush is so boring and asexual and vanilla.

Lots of pube haircuts on that stage...other than Trump.

Oh God. Carson just held a prayer vigil for like one second....she's so dramatic.

Titus said...

Trump has had nice work done on his teeth.

Mid-Life Lawyer said...

They better bring their A game early are they are going to lose me. I ran trails hard this morning and I'm tired.

Trump sounded strong and under control in his opening. The Wolfster starting out on the borders with Trump. "Great Wall of Texas!"

Rhythm and Balls said...

So is this how it's all going to go? A minuscule fraction of all our country's gun deaths took place at the hands of a terrorist couple and this must now be the only agenda?

Trump is the only one with larger and more overarching themes. He ties things together. The others only have one-track minds.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Bush smiles like a creepy clown whenever the moderator mentions Trump and what he supposedly did wrong.

mccullough said...

Chaos candidate. An appealing moniker

tim in vermont said...

I am here! Hi fellow republicans

Sincere LOL.

Rhythm and Balls said...

I love how these also-rans with polls in the single digits are already positioning themselves for a run against Hillary Clinton.

Titus said...

I am wondering if Marco has a large Cuban cock?

Cruz just called Marco Alinsky-heaven.

Titus said...

Marco dyes his hair-fyi-just like Saint Ronnie....queens.

PB said...

Can all those who want to be Vice President leave the race?

Guildofcannonballs said...

Look I ain't even be knowin' if I be tellin' you.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/07/13/ike-turner-why-i-beat-tina.html

mccullough said...

Rubio's wife was a cheerleader for the Miami Dolphins. So he has Bill Clinton's support and admiration

Guildofcannonballs said...

You see, I know my red hair told you, but I didn't know my red hair told you that.

Guildofcannonballs said...

How much is my "you don't have a soul" tort worth?

I trust you all understand the efficacy of paying.

Titus said...

Rand just owned Marco and Christie just owned both of them.

All this republican hot air is making me horny just like the rest of u are I am sure!

These guys are so unPC and I love it!

mccullough said...

Carly needs to learn where the camera is

Rhythm and Balls said...

Bush is actually coming out with the strongest points on terrorism. If you want Muslim Americans to partner w/law enforcement as one of the best resources for doing so, you can't just demonize them.

PBandJ_LeDouanier said...

I have a slogan for a Jeb Carley ticket: "Woefully un-Americans activity folks will be fixed with Six Sigma!"

mccullough said...

Rubio is like a cross between W and Obama

PBandJ_LeDouanier said...

"Bush is actually coming out with the strongest points on terrorism. If you want Muslim Americans to partner w/law enforcement as one of the best resources for doing so, you can't just demonize them."

This thinking is appealing, at first. OTOH, are we saying that Muslim Americans will not report terrorists if they had Trump as President? Isn't that even more damming of these Muslims than anything Trump has said? Are they really that much on a knife edge between loyal American and terrorist?

gadfly said...

No, R & B, J.E.B. did say that if we want "Muslim Americans to partner with law enforcement . . .."

He said if we wanted Muslim support in the war on ISIS, we shouldn't ban Muslim immigrants which is so much BS.

The Muslim nations of the world are refusing to take the Syrian "refugees" despite the tent city already in Saudi Arabia - and they are building a 600 mile wall to keep Syrians and Iranians out of their country.

mccullough said...

Jeb looks like Woodrow Wilson

eric said...

Rhythm and Balls said...
Bush is actually coming out with the strongest points on terrorism. If you want Muslim Americans to partner w/law enforcement as one of the best resources for doing so, you can't just demonize them.


That is, if you're a pussy.

You're so pretty, and amazing, and did I mention pretty? Will you please please please gonout with me?

It works so well with women, I'm sure Muslims will fall for it too.

Guildofcannonballs said...

If I ain't be hiding, nor unrespecting the greatest living American, who in the least ways since Christ documented didn't shame his name, race, position, or profoundness, then thoughts advanced must biased against unjust.

mccullough said...

Fiorina wants to bring back Petraues? The fucking guy handed his girlfriend classified information. WTF

Titus said...

Carson can exit stage right please.

U will have a lucrative talk show program.

Spiros Pappas said...

The only Muslims fighting ISIS are the Kurds. And they're doing it for a homeland, not because Jeb is nice to them. Jeb is a loser and the Saudi Royals are Bush family BFFs!

Anonymous said...

Excellent substantive debate tonight! Cruz is doing really well. Trump is back to making faces, lol. The smiling should stop when under attack by an opens, makes them look weak.

wildswan said...

I like Carly saying she'll bring back the people Obama threw out because they disagreed. But really all these candidates are looking good. Even Bush.

Anonymous said...

Excellent substantive debate tonight! RUBIO is doing really well. Trump is back to making faces, lol. The smiling should stop when under attack by an opens, makes them look weak.

Rubio, not Cruz! Actually Cruz seems to be perfectly happy to not be asked too many questions and as for creepy smiles, his is the worst.

clint said...

I really want *someone* to point out that targeting civilians -- the families and children of the terrorists -- is not tough or strong.

Terrorists target civilians because they are too cowardly to attack soldiers, too weak to attack a military target.

For the leader of the free world to copy that is the opposite of tough. And it certainly doesn't signal strength.

Guildofcannonballs said...


"politicians words"


Do you understand the joke of politicians possessing anything, like an apostrophe might potentially above unless you pay a bunch to stop ... ..... .... ... .... ....... ... . ... ... .... ...... . .... .. .

Anonymous said...

Killing the families of ISIS members, does Trump not know about the Geneva convention as Rubio suggested? What a buffoon, he's been booed several times now.

PBandJ_LeDouanier said...

"Killing the families of ISIS members, does Trump not know about the Geneva convention as Rubio suggested? What a buffoon, he's been booed several times now."

I thought Bush lawyers decided these don't apply to these terrorists. Are cons backing away from this? Are they really saying the Bush administration were war criminals?

mccullough said...

You can see why Trump and Carson are doing well. Let these Muslims in the Middle East kill each other sounds like a very appealing policy

PB said...

The Geneva convention requires uniforms for combatants. No uniform, no protection.

Titus said...

Marco is a slippery son of a bitch.

eric said...

This has been an interesting debate so far.

The one thing that stands out for me, though, is Rubios ears. Superficial I know, but what the heck? Did he always have those huge dumbo ears?

Titus said...

Cruz just owned Rubio-I just blew.

PBandJ_LeDouanier said...

Rubio noted "the good, the bad and the ugly."

I'm not sure what he meant, but this made me think about Dirty H. His movie vividly pointed out that politically motivated war fighting can be the definition of futility.

Presumably Rubio had something else in mind.


Blow up the bridge, and everybody can go home.

traditionalguy said...

Bush confidently declared himself the winner over Trump two times. That's a relief. He must know some insider info about the future that we won't know until it happens.

Gabriel said...

@PB, Amanda:The Geneva convention requires uniforms for combatants. No uniform, no protection.

That's not all it requires. Prisoners need to get their paychecks, for example.

The Geneva Conventions allow you to shoot unlawful combatants with very little process at all. That's the whole point. Following the laws of war puts you at a disadvantage. The compensation is that captivity is not too onerous. Not following the laws of war puts you at a disadvantage and the Geneva Conventions consequently give you no protection.

Besides it's hard to imagine what atrocity ISIS is going to commit against those it captures that it doesn't already routinely do.

mccullough said...

Rubio is a better communicator than Cruz.

Chuck said...

I'm ever-more amazed at what a uniquely nasty person Trump is. How easily, and how routinely, he jumps to personal attacks at just about the most vicious level that semi-respectable conversation would allow.

It's no secret that he's shallow; a guy who generally just parrots what he hears on television, with a mix of New York talk radio. And that he's an oddly persistent name-dropper; even when he's talking about his preeminent personal physician and getting the doctor's name wrong.

There's something really strange and personally ugly about Donald Trump. A kind of a sociopathic bully. Anybody running for President is going to have an ego. But I think all of the people on the stage -- excepting Trump -- might well be nice and personable people off the stage.

PBandJ_LeDouanier said...

So far, Trump is probably winning the un-un-hinged contest. It's a bit of a toss up w/ Carson (but that's not news).

The rest, to varying degrees, seem to think that being riled up is the key to success.

Titus said...

Marco's done. Stick a fork in him.

Theranter said...

Eric--re the ears, same here!
I think it is due to hairspray overflow, it made his ears shiny, and much more noticeable on camera.

PBandJ_LeDouanier said...

"But I think all of the people on the stage -- excepting Trump -- might well be nice and personable people off the stage."

Is that supposed to be a feature or a bug?

It seems like a lot of con voters have decided that a nice person isn't the best person to understand and defeat cold blooded killers.

Killing them w/ niceness may not fly for cons in 2016. The same may be true for (the majority of voting) Americans, too.

steve uhr said...

Rubio and Bush down. Trump and Christi up. Cruz and Carson odd.

buwaya said...

" But I think all of the people on the stage -- excepting Trump -- might well be nice and personable people off the stage."

This may be a mistake. Word I have from acquaintances who have had casual dealings with him is that Trump in private is not quite like his public image, and not a prima donna.

Saint Croix said...

I'm ever-more amazed at what a uniquely nasty person Trump is.

His foreign policy plan is to murder the relatives of terrorists. Kill their children, kill their wives, kill their mothers, kill their babies. It's like he's running for Columbian drug lord.

I will not vote for this man, ever.

mccullough said...

Christie wants to go Snowden on China

buwaya said...

"His foreign policy plan is to murder the relatives of terrorists. Kill their children, kill their wives, kill their mothers, kill their babies. "

Well, the current administration does pretty much that, what with the collateral damage from all the dronings and such. Its a step in a more decent direction to warn them beforehand.

Spiros Pappas said...

Please stop. These terrorists' families are culpable.

eric said...

Trump is very likeable tonight. He is so easy going on the stage. He had a bad exchange with Bush, but since then, he has been stellar.

Rubio cut him down, but I don't think anyone noticed. He basically said, Trump doesn't know what he is talking about via the Nuclear Triad. And Trump reinforced that opinion by saying Nuclear was the most important, thus making no sense.

But who gets that? Probably not many.

And what they really see is him being a nice guy. Yucking it up with Cruz (who is talking too much tonight, ugh) and vowing to stick with the Republican party.

Trump is doing quite well. And I wish Carson were doing better.

And Rand Paul's cheering section is annoying me.

jr565 said...

So, I've been watching it so far off and on. and Christie has made some great points. As has Bush. As has Rubio.
Rubio discussing the triad nuclear defense and explaining how it works goes a long way to show he knows what he's talking about.
And surprisingly, bush came across strong tonight.
Cruz hit Rubio pretty strongly on immigration, but other than that he's been a dud.
Trump, as usual, has espoused nothing but pablum. Though he did get sllightly more nuanced on immigration.

traditionalguy said...

Cruz wanted to debate more than he wanted to communicate tonight. Sad.

The Donald had a near perfect tone tonight. Trump's problems have come more from Fox News' pro Bush agenda slimy, proud betrayals than from the CNN's straight pro Clinton agenda.

Original Mike said...

The Trump nuclear triad answer reassured me. I don't have to worry about his finger on the button. He doesn't know what the button is.

Chuck said...

Trump's closing statement sounded like something from one of his Miss Universe pageant contestants. I'd have a hard time stringing together 6 or 8 sentences without saying anything substantive at all.

Jack Wayne said...

Cruz wins with Trump second. All of them except Kasich better than Hillary.

Jack Wayne said...

Also, congrats to CNN for staging the best debate so far.

PBandJ_LeDouanier said...

Btw, Rubio didn't answer the Triad question.

His blah blah blah about land, sea, air made him seem as dweebish as he's ever been. No doubt, Hewitt was impressed with Rubio's answer. Too bad Hewitt's objective failed.

Ha Ha. Trump trumps the chumps.

David said...

"Trump says he will not run as a third party candidate."

Smart. As usual. And disappointing to journalists and Democrats. (Redundancy, I know.)

mccullough said...

I thought Christie won. He speaks clearly and directly

Anonymous said...

Rubio had ro explain to Trump what the nuclear triad was, oh my god.

Meade said...

Christie.

David said...

Chuck: "But I think all of the people on the stage -- excepting Trump -- might well be nice and personable people off the stage."

Chuck, you seem half right.

Personable? Sure. They're high level politicians.

Nice? Not likely. They're high level politicians.

But in this analysis half-right is totally wrong.

PBandJ_LeDouanier said...

I didn't think Meade would fall for Christie repeatedly explaining how he is battle fortified after being a post-9-11 lawyer.

OTOH, Christie blusters a lot: Meade's into that.

pm317 said...

I thought Christie did well too. And in past debates also.

David said...

Christie has a lot of talent. Too bad the media hate him.

walter said...

Rhythm and Balsamic said
Ted Cruz would look passable in make-up and drag.

12/15/15, 7:57 PM
Blogger Titus said...
__



Hey..I always love how so much public discourse is unavailable on "public" radio. All that was on was a bit on African folk tunes. Take.My.Money.

walter said...

Did Wolf bring out his best pen?

Anonymous said...

Trump and Cruz are trying hard not get into it with each other, but if and when it comes down to just Trump and Cruz, you'll see Cruz going after Trump in the same passive agressive way he went after Rubio. Trump will go after Cruz in an outwardly agressive way. It'll be great viewing.

MaxedOutMama said...

What happened that was big?

Nothing much, it seemed to me. I enjoyed watching Cruz and Trump dating, but otherwise, nothing much happened.

Bush was better, but still not in the running.

Rubio is losing me - he's too young and frenetic, and tonight I decided that he probably doesn't have a core. The twisting on immigration on top of the cognitive dissonance involved in some of his other proposals has taken him off my list. I think he would be lost in office. Kind of the Hispanic Republican version of Obama.

I still am okay with Kasich. I am getting to like him more and more.


Birkel said...

Half the alleged candidates cannot win the nomination under any foreseeable circumstances.

Basically, anybody Meade likes...

clint said...

"Spiros Pappas said...
Please stop. These terrorists' families are culpable."

Any lower age limit on that for you? The San Bernardino killers left behind an infant. What would you suggest we do with the child?


Trump on the nuclear triad was embarrassing. And going to Rubio straight after for the lecture on what it meant nailed that. At least for me. Of course, asking a question like that and then giving Rubio the follow up... that was probably the point. To let Rubio school Trump on defense. Looks like a CNN setup -- they're just smarter at it than Fox was.

walter said...

Did Carly bring puppies?

garage mahal said...

Rand owns Chris.

Donald owns Jeb.

Cruz owns Marco.

Ben self owns.

Tom said...

Between Cruz and Trump, one of them is going to get nailed by a discovered attack. It's like a giant game of nice chicken. And they're smart to play it. I don't like Trump but I have to say he's brilliant. And we also know Cruz is an opportunistic ass - but he's also brilliant. I don't know if this will be good for America but it does make for very interesting politics.

M Jordan said...

I thought Bush won. I'm surprised to hear myself say that but he was forceful and clear. Except for his closing which stank. Most of the closing stages were weak tonight.

Fiorina did well but managed to grate at times. Christie was okay. Kasich has Tourette's, I swear. Rubio was pretty good and I liked that he owned his immigration citizenship policy. Paul was very good but his whooping supporters need to go back to home room and work in their algebra. Trump? He's such a piece of work. But one thing that's consistent with him: you will begin hating him as soon as you begin liking him (and vice versa).

Cruz really failed tonight. Somebody above said he came as a debater and not an informer. True dat.

Biggest news of the night is that Trump vowed not to run as third party.

Jack Wayne said...

Clint, please wake up. Sherman destroying the South nailed down the Yankee victory. When Carthage was destroyed and salted, that nailed down the victory. When Truman decided to nuke Japan, that nailed down the victory. It's a straight-line computation that there as no "innocents" in a war zone. That is simply a conceit of the Ruling Class That Knows Better.

walter said...

I suppose it's the usual "lesser of evils" calculus..but I agree with Tom.

Jack Wayne said...

Why aren't debate viewers giving more credit to Cruz? Trump had a "Bernie moment" when he took dissension between him and Criz off the table? Ever seen a dog roll over and show his belly to the alpha dog? Was that Trump or Cruz? Well, Meade? You're the dog expert!

walter said...

The nuclear triad bit. Anyone think the other aisle would offer much insight? Maybe "Don't talk to me about ISIS" Berno?

walter said...

Or...more apt.."What difference does it make" Hil?

chickelit said...

Althouse wrote PLUS: The something big I thought I'd see was Cruz getting the better of Trump.

Beware a sheep in Wolf's clothing.

I thought Fiorina did the best.

wholelottasplainin' said...

"The Geneva convention requires uniforms for combatants. No uniform, no protection."

Agreed. WRT to civilians, read this:

"Article 4 defines who is a Protected person: Persons protected by the Convention are those who, at a given moment and in any manner whatsoever, find themselves, in case of a conflict or occupation, in the hands of a Party to the conflict or Occupying Power of which they are not nationals. >>>>> But it explicitly excludes Nationals of a State which is not bound by the Convention and the citizens of a neutral state or an allied state if that state has normal diplomatic relations within the State in whose hands they are<<<<."

ISIS fighters are non-uniformed. ERGO are not covered by the Geneva Conventions,ERGO they and the civilians under their control are not protected.

Pls don't give me the "we're better than that" bullshit. War upends that tidy little notions, with the outer limits of human behavior defined by the Geneva Conventions.

Killting ISIS civilians, ESPECIALLY those whom ISIS fighters hide behind, is NOT a war crime.

wholelottasplainin' said...

"Reince Pubis." That really says it all.

wholelottasplainin' said...

"Titus said...
Marco's done. Stick a fork in him."

Say, are you an official Exhumer of Dead and Rotting Clich├ęs"?

Jean Mate said...

That was very interesting debate.


http://www.itsallaboutthesearchbar.com/

Chuck said...

Who I liked in this debate:

~ Rubio. Seemingly the most/best time, and by far the most polished. The most ready for a general election and it seems that polls are coming around to the same conclusion, with Rubio widely regarded as the best opponent versus Clinton.

~ Kasich. And Dana Perino (one of FNC's best commentators) agrees with me. "His best moment in any of the debates [tonight when Kasich complained about the infighting]." He'd be a great, prickly, wonky, mature, non-threatening Ohio-winning running mate. The one guy with executive experience as well as Congressional/budgeting experience. Kasich has forgotten more about the workings of government than Trump can ever hope to know.

~ Cruz. Cruz did what Cruz does, and he did it successfully again tonight.

~ Paul. Composed. Poised. Smart. Clever. He's obviously not going to win, and I won't vote for him. I was not happy that he won the Kentucky Senate primary over a very fine opponent. But gosh I love listening to Rand Paul. And I am glad that the U.S. Senate has a Rand Paul.

Who I didn't like:

~ Trump. Nasty, and stupid, once again. A President who needs to be told about the nuclear triad. This is Inspector Clouseau territory. I'm wondering if Donald Trump is a real human being or if he is being played by a hologram of Peter Sellers.

~ Christie. Hey, did you know that Christie was the U.S. Attorney in New Jersey after 9/11? That may be why he was allowed to perform oral sex on President Obama in order to secure about $300 gazillion dollars in federal pork for the Jersey Shore after Really Bad Storm Sandy. Christie has all the smooth salesmanship of Paulie Walnuts.

~ Fiorina & Carson. I know that a lot of people pick who they will vote for as if it were the Dating Game. Is he nice? Is she attractive? How do they make me feel? These two identity candidates are nice people for whom I have zero ill will. And neither one has much to say about being President.

~ I have given up on Bush. There was a time, in 2013, when I was looking forward to Jeb being our next President. Jeb would be making this a good race and a terrific debate about real issues if Trump hadn't turned it into a carnival show.

Achilles said...

The question isn't whether Trump will run third party. The question is how hard are the GOPe going to try to torpedo him.

All of you people whining about the whole killing the families of terrorists thing need to talk to some 11B's(infantry) that have 1 or more combat deployments and had to interact with these people where they live. These terrorists don't grow up in a vacuum. In fact the families aren't enough. You need to take out the entire tribe. It isn't like one or two people just go crazy all of a sudden.

The target trees we built after we looked at them from a tribal point of view made a lot more sense. And yes, the women in those tribes are definitely a part of the problem.

cubanbob said...

Tom said...
Between Cruz and Trump, one of them is going to get nailed by a discovered attack. It's like a giant game of nice chicken. And they're smart to play it. I don't like Trump but I have to say he's brilliant. And we also know Cruz is an opportunistic ass - but he's also brilliant. I don't know if this will be good for America but it does make for very interesting politics.

12/15/15, 11:02 PM"

Consider one of them will be running against Hillary who is both an opportunistic ass and has no demonstrable brilliance.

Eric said...

Any lower age limit on that for you? The San Bernardino killers left behind an infant. What would you suggest we do with the child?

Find a nice, devout, Christian family to raise her.

Humperdink said...

I watched a bit of the debate. Boy, Jeb looks pretty pathetic up there. Flailing away. This format of 37 candidates (+/-) does not suit him.

Humperdink said...

I watched a bit of the debate. Boy, Jeb looks pretty pathetic up there. Flailing away. This format of 37 candidates (+/-) does not suit him.

Saint Croix said...

Btw, Rubio didn't answer the Triad question.

Yes he did. It's a nice question. Kudos to Hugh Hewitt for asking it.

Trump not only did not answer the question, he had no idea what the question was. That was Hewitt's intent, to expose the ignorance of Trump, and to showcase how much Rubio does know.

The scary thing, for me, is that the nuclear triad is largely irrelevant to our greatest threat--a nuclear Iran. The threat is not that Iran will attack us with an ICBM. No, the attack will be done in secret, with a suitcase bomb. You put the bomb in a car and drive it over the Canadian border, or the Mexican border, and park it in Washington D.C.

That's the threat. How are you going to stop that? So Rubio's answer shows that he has done his homework. But his homework is out of date, designed for threats in the 1950's. It's the 21st century, our threats are different now. A country with ties to terrorist groups, and nuclear technology, is an obvious and rather immediate danger. Saying that "Russia" or "China" is our greatest enemy shows a shocking lack of awareness.

Kirby Olson said...

What was Fiorina talking about when she started talking about the evolution of various forms of software and apps? Was she just showing that she knew the names of these various things? Did she have a point? I got lost. I liked it when she said gummint should ask private industry to help, because gummint is hapless.

Tank said...

As a NJ resident, for those of you who think Christie does well in a debate, I say: Christie does well in a debate.

clint said...

"Jack Wayne said...
Clint, please wake up. Sherman destroying the South nailed down the Yankee victory. When Carthage was destroyed and salted, that nailed down the victory. When Truman decided to nuke Japan, that nailed down the victory. It's a straight-line computation that there as no "innocents" in a war zone. That is simply a conceit of the Ruling Class That Knows Better.

12/15/15, 11:32 PM"

I'm not talking about collateral damage. Sherman did the right thing. Truman did the right thing. That's what Ted Cruz called for -- and I agree.

Donald Trump proposed something entirely different. He called for targeting the families of terrorists -- because maybe we can deter future terrorists if they know we'll track down and kill their loved ones. That's not tough or strong. And I absolutely don't support that.


"walter said...
The nuclear triad bit. Anyone think the other aisle would offer much insight? Maybe "Don't talk to me about ISIS" Berno?

12/15/15, 11:50 PM"

Sure. President Obama might helpfully point out that, "We have these ships that go underwater, nuclear submarines." (True quote.)


" Saint Croix said...

The scary thing, for me, is that the nuclear triad is largely irrelevant to our greatest threat--a nuclear Iran. The threat is not that Iran will attack us with an ICBM. No, the attack will be done in secret, with a suitcase bomb. You put the bomb in a car and drive it over the Canadian border, or the Mexican border, and park it in Washington D.C."

Nah. A suitcase bomb is extremely high-tech. It's the difference between a working vacuum tube and a microchip. What I'm afraid of is a Manhattan Project type big and clunky bomb -- one that would easily fit in a standard shipping container lined in lead to make it hard to detect. Any of our ports would be vulnerable.

traditionalguy said...

Turble Trump turned the lights onto the inane political narratives and the con men living by them, and suddenly athe best Bush of them all cannot get elected dogcatcher.

So blame Trump. And shoot the messenger.

Michelle Dulak Thomson said...

Chuck,

I mostly agree with your likes and dislikes. (Well, maybe not Paul, but he's a distinct outlier in this crowd and on this subject.)

To me Rubio seemed the clear winner, with Christie a rather distant second.

Can we think about narrowing the field some more? Obviously the B-Teamers are well out of it, though it doesn't stop them from trying. But we could lose Fiorina, Kasich, and even Jeb w/o much damage. Carson I'm not sure about; I don't know how high his numbers are, but in this last debate he was soft-spoken almost to the point of somnolence. Trump, Cruz, Rubio, and Christie are still serious contenders. I'm sure I'm leaving one out. Oh, of course, Paul. Leave him in, for the nonce.

Chuck said...

Maybe Scalia can hang on until 2021. He'll be 84/85 then. The next four years of a Clinton presidency will hurt, and hurt badly. It'll be perhaps 150 new Clinton district judges and 50 appellate judges, including probably two Supreme Court justices. At least. Let's hope for the "least." It won't be pretty; especially if the general election is a Democrat landslide and Republicans lose the Senate.

Chuck said...

Michelle, I don't mind the size of the field until we have some votes. I hate the power that polling is playing in all of this. I like voting. And counting votes.

Doug said...

Eric said Find a nice, devout, Christian family to raise her. What, a nice Jewish family wouldn't do?

Michael Edward McNeil said...

Nobody has been talking about what Trump was referring to when he said what he said. I'm no Trump follower; however I suspect that he (probably) has heard of the conventional “nuclear triad” (bombers, land-based ballistic missiles, and submarine-launched ballistic and cruise missiles) — but in this case got confused and thought he should be talking about the three kinds (triad) of weapons of mass destruction: known as ABC (atomic, biological, chemical), or NBC (nuclear, biological, chemical). If that's so, then despite his mistake, his statement makes sense: nuclear is the most important of the three (at present, though that's partly because ‘biological’ hasn't come in to its prime time yet via the latest genetic splicing technology, which has the potential to vastly out-danger nuclear — i.e., nuclear isn't infectious).

Chuck said...

Achilles: Let's be clear. Trump isn't being ridiculed for talking about being tough in war and accepting civilian casualties among our enemies. We've had that philosophy for years, and there isn't an single Republican candidate who wouldn't agree with that general proposal.

No; Trump's problem is that is tendency for reckless and stupid language has him talking about TARGETING civilians. No serious person thinks that way. Not in our civilization. Don't tell me about Ulysses S. Grant, or Harry Truman or Curtis Lemay. We all accept that war is bad; we don't target civilians. Not with the precision weapons we have today. Again, don't lecture me about civilians killed as collateral damage. I can accept all of that. We are targeting threats. Not families of suspects.

This isn't political correctness on my part. I'm not soft, and none of the other Republicans candidates are either. We're not insisting on fancy or esoteric language. I just refuse to play dumb for the sake of the Trump circus. Trump isn't being called out for "plain" language; he's being called out for dumb language.

Meade said...

David said...
"Christie has a lot of talent. Too bad the media hate him."

I know. The media hate him almost as much as do Instapundit commenters. But Christie really is the candidate most qualified to be next POTUS and, most important, he could win against Hillary.



Meade said...

Doug said...
"Eric said Find a nice, devout, Christian family to raise her. What, a nice Jewish family wouldn't do?"

Even better!

UNTRIBALIST said...

I'm leaning toward Ted based on conservative principles.

Yet Rubio caught Ted in an untruth (to be charitable) last night about his record. Most people would say he lied. Ted denied at the debate that he had ever considered legalization of illegal immigrants. Megyn Kelly played a clip from a Senate debate/hearing in which Ted said he was for legalization of illegal immigrants but not naturalization. That was news to me. And I am not happy that Rubio caught Ted in a fib.

It could be argued that Rubio is the most electable at this point.