Althouse: Giuliani's rollback.

February 23, 2015

Giuliani's rollback.

In the Wall Street Journal.

If you care. I think it's all a lot of blather about rhetoric, including rhetoric of a kind Obama himself uses, and I'm sick of wasting time on it.

44 comments:

garage mahal said...: I don't know for sure if Scott Walker is a pedophile or not. I'll leave that to others.; 2/23/15, 10:22 AM
Ann Althouse said...: Here's Obama calling Bush "unpatriotic" just for running up the debt over a period of 2 presidential terms.

By Obama's own standard, Obama is unpatriotic.; 2/23/15, 10:31 AM
Ann Althouse said...: And as mentioned in the first post this morning, Obama said Edward Snowden was not patriotic.; 2/23/15, 10:32 AM
traditionalguy said...: Obama is a true Patriot...of Muslim Iran. There is nothing Mr snake in the grass won't do to fundamentally transform the Middle East that had Israel dominant over the Religion of Peace.; 2/23/15, 10:35 AM
wendybar said...: http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/al_gore_called_president_bush_un-american_in_2002/

Where was all the crying when Al Gore called George W. "Un-American??????"; 2/23/15, 10:38 AM
Roy Lofquist said...: The rollback doesn't matter. It's like the turd in the punch bowl - you can remove it but the party is not quite the same afterwards.; 2/23/15, 10:40 AM
bleh said...: Ann Althouse said...

Here's Obama calling Bush "unpatriotic" just for running up the debt over a period of 2 presidential terms.

By Obama's own standard, Obama is unpatriotic.

Ah, but Bush ran up the debt for the good of Halliburton and Big Oil and so on. Obama only ran up the debt for good causes like green energy and labor unions, and also to repair the prior damage done by Bush. That newspaper column in defense of Obama practically writes itself, Althouse.; 2/23/15, 10:40 AM
Anonymous said...: The difference is simple.

When Obama calls President Bush unpatriotic, it's true. Nothing at all wrong with saying something that's true.

But when someone calls Obama unpatriotic, it's false. And lies are bad.; 2/23/15, 10:46 AM
Michael K said...: I read it and he makes a good point that doesn't really matter. The reaction to his words has far outgrown the actual statement. I thought it was an awkward phrase at the time. However, I keep think of the ABSCAM cartoon (Maybe Ramirez) of Congressmen running to a giant dollar bill like flypaper.

The Democrats are running off the cliff and Walker, not Giuliani, is the beneficiary.; 2/23/15, 10:51 AM
Big Mike said...: You aren't the only one sick of it all, Professor. This is why Milbank's column is rebounding against him.; 2/23/15, 10:53 AM
F said...: Walker a pedophile? Ask Reid -- it takes one to know one.; 2/23/15, 11:04 AM
Wince said...: Obama has been president for over six years now. Unlike the attacks on a potential candidate, the power and threat of Giuliani's comment was its ability to define succinctly what people have already come to know in their hearts intuitively from Obama's style of governance.

In that sense, the reaction to Giuliani's comment was a Rorschach test. For those who knew what RG was saying, either you agreed or you feared that it would ring too true to too many people. For the latter, the former was too much of a threat to ignore, so they went into indignant, Obama is blessed by his enemies mode.

But his WSJ piece isn't that much of a walk-back and it does an even better job of connecting what he said to what a lot of people think.

Keeping this debate alive is not in Obama's interest. Watch the pro-Obama camp to sue for peace in the debate, but reach back to use the "Rudy is nuts trope" the media has constructed for them as a shield against future discussion.

And words are funny. You'd have to agree that "love" is a fairly high standard. Ironically, I think there would have been less of a reaction had Giuliani used the locution that Obama "isn't particularly fond of America," even though that term brackets an even lower level of patriotism.

To me, I'd say Obama thinks of America as his "fuck buddy". You know, "a buddy you get to fuck."; 2/23/15, 11:13 AM
Ann Althouse said...: The invocation of pedophilia is unwise if you care about Hillary, given that Epstein business re Bill.; 2/23/15, 11:16 AM
Brando said...: Whether a Red Stater like Bush or a Blue Stater like Obama is "patriotic" means nothing--both obviously love their "country" but they have different conceptions of what the country is. Obama sees those who are not part of his base--such as white southern conservatives--as an embarrassing, negative part of his country (as I'm sure a Red Stater would view the Latte Left hugging the coasts). What's more important is the impact of the president on the country at large--is the country better or worse off due to or in spite of the president's efforts?

I'd prefer a president who had secret disdain for America and its people but pursued policies that strengthened us over a president who genuinely loves us all but drives us into a ditch.; 2/23/15, 11:22 AM
Anonymous said...: The outrageous outrage only works when you have Republicans who feed into it.

Just like the shutting down the government stuff works. It's not because the Democrats have the upper hand in the media, although that is part of it. It's because there are so many Republican willing to go on camera and debase themselves before the media in order to win approval.

It's disgusting.; 2/23/15, 11:56 AM
jr565 said...: Do we think Reverend Wright loves America. When you say "God Damn Amerikkka" are you actually expressing love of Amerikkka?
Now Obama didn't say that specificially but he was in that church for 20 years hearing such rhetoric.
It would be fair to say that if you think God Damn Amerikka is not controversial, and that's the circle you run in that your love of America may not be your run of the mill type of love.
When his wife says that his election was the first time she ever felt proud of her country, it makes you wonder how she felt prior to the election.
WHen Obama says americans cling to their guns and religion, it makes you wonder how he really thinks about such clingers.
When his whole reason for running is to fundamentally transform America it makes you wonder how much love is there?

If America were a girlfriend and Obama married her but then forced her to get a nose job and a boob job and start having her dresslike Beyoncé., the wife might at some point wonder whether the husband did in fact love her. Or only enough that he wanted her to be something else.; 2/23/15, 11:57 AM
Skyler said...: The "rollback" is "Not Found Error 404," so I guess that means he didn't roll back?; 2/23/15, 12:04 PM
Mark said...: Same here, Skyler.; 2/23/15, 12:26 PM
Hagar said...: "Loving the country" and "patriotism" is not quite same thing, though they generally run together.

I think it is possible to patriotically do what you think is best for the country without particularly loving it, and and you can love the country and still betray it.

There also was something else that the media blowhards inferred from Giuliani's remarks that I think is not justified, but I don't remember what it was at the moment.

There is a lot of sloppy language and confused concepts in what you hear on TV or read on line.; 2/23/15, 12:32 PM
Bilwick said...: I've probably said this before in these comment sections, but Obama, like other members of the "liberal" Hive (and by "liberal" I mean of course "tax-happy, coercion-addicted, power-tripping State-fellators"*)loves the US the same way some trailer-trash wife-beater on COPS loves his little woman. "Honey, you know I love you, but sometimes when you don't listen to me I get so mad I gotta smack you around just to keep you in line. You know I hate doing that, so why not just do what I say?"

But a better analogy is that Obama and other "liberals" are like some woman who gets engaged to, or even marries, a guy who is very different from the kind of guy she has been waiting for, so she browbeats and henpecks himn constantly, and in general makes herself and that poor schmuck misterable hoping to re-mold him into the kind of guy she really wants to be with. Obama and other statists should just "marry" Cuba or Sweden or some other kind of statist paradise-on-earth, and just leave the Land of the Free to those of us who, you know, actually value Freedom.

*you know, like "garage mahal"; 2/23/15, 12:41 PM
Fandor said...: Rudy forgot to remember something.

"Never apologize, never explain".; 2/23/15, 12:46 PM
Brando said...: In fairness, you can love something and still criticize it and want to improve it. If Obama were criticizing the culture of entitlement or the constant pleas for government to solve every problem or the general decadence in our culture, I doubt most on the Right would have a problem with that. He just happens to criticize the country from the Left.

I don't think it was the "patriotism" comments that got Guiliani in hot water, though--it was more the "he didn't grow up like you and me" comments that many have unfairly assumed to be racist. (After all, Obama's background is unlike that of the typical black American as well). It doesn't make the comment less stupid, though--being brought up overseas and associated with foreigners hardly means you'll be less devoted to America. In my own experience, living overseas for a few years in my childhood if anything made me far more appreciative of my country, in part because I found myself having to defend it more to foreign kids who didn't understand it.

Obama's conduct as president is worthy of a great deal of criticism, but not loving his country? I don't buy that.; 2/23/15, 12:49 PM
garage mahal said...: Funny hearing Walker drones rail about statists. Um that's you dumb-ass.; 2/23/15, 1:01 PM
Jonathan Card said...: "...and I'm sick of wasting time on it."

Good call.; 2/23/15, 1:21 PM
Michael K said...: "The invocation of pedophilia is unwise"

Did anyone here call garage "wise?"; 2/23/15, 1:34 PM
Bilwick said...: So you don't like statsts, garage mahal? If so, why do you keep coming across as such a State-fellator? You might want to start communicating better.; 2/23/15, 1:41 PM
traditionalguy said...: Patriotism is love of country. That makes the question what Obama's Loves:

Obama loves Iran. Obama loves zero American co2 emissions. Obama loves gun control. Obama loves removing the border with Mexio that stops the immigration flood. Obama loves unilateral American nuclear disarmament. Obama loves to minaturize the US Military. Obama loves eliminating NASA space programs. Obama loves a Nationalized Health system like England suffers under.

Nobody can say he's not Patriotic.; 2/23/15, 1:46 PM
Mark Caplan said...: It's shameful to even hint that Obama does not love his country. Kenya is such a lovely place. What's not to love?; 2/23/15, 2:23 PM
Drago said...: Pedophile? Why bring Billy Clintons close personal pals into this?

Why, only some backwoods rural hick would do something that dumb.

That won't help the lefties narrative (that was for Steve Uhr) at all!; 2/23/15, 2:25 PM
garage mahal said...: Not saying Scott Walker is a pedophile. I just don't know either way. He says he loves kids. I'll let others decide.; 2/23/15, 2:27 PM
Drago said...: Yes garage. You've already said that.

Aren't you the clever little boy!

Here's a cookie. Now run along. I understand someone is showing a super 8 film of the big middle school football game!; 2/23/15, 2:58 PM
Revenant said...: If Scott Walker were a pedophile, we'd have evidence of it by now.

Similarly, if Barack Obama loved America, we'd have evidence of it by now. :); 2/23/15, 2:58 PM
President-Mom-Jeans said...: Bitchtits appears out of fat air to get his Walker Derangement Syndrome on.

Excited to be living in a Right to Work State, chubby?; 2/23/15, 3:09 PM
cubanbob said...: Obama loves America-the America of the famous New Yorker cartoon. The rest of America, not so much.; 2/23/15, 3:26 PM
Anne in Rockwall, TX said...: I'm confused. Where did Garage come up with the pedophilia angle? Was that in another thread I missed?; 2/23/15, 3:58 PM
Drago said...: Texas Annie: "I'm confused. Where did Garage come up with the pedophilia angle? Was that in another thread I missed?"

You haven't missed anything other than the resident automatons attempting to create and/or extend meme's negative to Walker.

Like machine a few days ago using claiming in several posts that Walker had "taken the 5th".

The idea is simply to use those terms over and over and over again so they show up in searches.

Hillary! has a pedophile problem with li'l Billy.

And lo and behold, what do we see? Garage "randomly" choosing to use "pedophile" as an attack on Walker.

I'm sure there is no connection whatsoever.; 2/23/15, 4:59 PM
jr565 said...: garage wrote:
Not saying Scott Walker is a pedophile. I just don't know either way. He says he loves kids. I'll let others decide.

Well, if you have evidence suggesting he might be a pedophile then bring it forward. The difference between that charge and the one where Obama doesn't like his country is that in the latter case, there is an actual suggestion that it's true.; 2/23/15, 5:02 PM
Sebastian said...: "Hope and change" was hardly an expression of true love.; 2/23/15, 5:18 PM
Mick said...: How can you look at yourself in the mirror "law prof"? So ensconced in the Ivory Tower of academia, you barely notice the massive destruction that the Usurper Hussein Obama has unleashed on America-- or is it merely Cognitive Dissonance?
You, a "law prof", voted for and still apologize for a Usurper. You find righteous criticism of the Usurper "uncivil", in the face of what Obama obviously is--- which is certainly not a "creature of our own". He is a foreign virus unleashed upon the land.
Guliani merely fears for his family's life, because now the Chicago thugs are threatening him and his family--- that the way friends of the Usurper roll.

Wake up.; 2/23/15, 6:15 PM
iowan2 said...: I dont know if Bill Clinton is a pedophile. I do know if you hang around a barber shop, you will get a hair cut.
We DO know where Bill is hanging out. Thats in the fact category.; 2/23/15, 6:32 PM
FullMoon said...: Aren't Christians the same people the left claims are science deniers? Believe the earth is 6,000 years old? Do not believe in evolution?
Is Obama a science denier?; 2/23/15, 6:40 PM
The Godfather said...: Look, I saw today that some mainstream news outlet has published several quotations from Mr. Obama to the effect that he loves his country. That ought to end the debate. Obama would never say something if it weren't true, would he?; 2/23/15, 8:31 PM
Achilles said...: garage mahal said...
"Not saying Scott Walker is a pedophile. I just don't know either way. He says he loves kids. I'll let others decide."

We have zero evidence Walker is a pedophile. We have quite a lot of evidence Hilary's husband is a pedophile though. Possibly only a lecher if they were 17...; 2/24/15, 1:33 AM
Bilwick said...: garage mahal probably wows 'em at the Mensa coventions.; 2/24/15, 2:10 PM