Rick Esenberg, president and general counsel of WILL, said the suit is over the district continuing to honor the contracts it has with MTI that include provisions not allowed under Act 10 now that the law has been upheld by the Supreme Court. He pointed to provisions regarding employer contributions to health care premiums and fair-share payments as examples.Whether the lawsuit succeeds or not, it puts a spotlight on Mary Burke. Some people may like the way it makes her look, but it is Scott Walker who has been trying to focus attention on Mary Burke’s role as a member of the school board.
Paul Secunda, a Marquette University Law School professor and director of its labor and employment program, said the lawsuit is likely not to be successful. “Rick and his organization are trying to make political points. You’ve got your opponent down and you go for the kill, that’s their strategy right now,” he said. “I don’t see anything unlawful the teachers are doing. They’re allowed to stay under their current bargaining contract.... It might not be permissible after the contract expires. But given that this case was just decided by the Wisconsin Supreme Court ... it’s very unlikely to succeed... They negotiated their current contract when the fate of Act 10 was still up in the air."
Just last week, Walker issued a news release saying that Madison "will be the only school district left in the state out of 424 to ignore [Act 10] and not take advantage of Governor Walker’s reforms into the 2015-16 school year." So it seems that Walker sees this as a good issue for him and would like to smoke Mary Burke out on it and to tie her to Madison, with its old out-of-the-mainstream image, even as she's trying to portray herself as a practical, sensible businesswoman. See:
And... she loves Reagan!
Everybody loves Reagan.
Posts
85 comments:
I agree, this lawsuit is more political than practical.
And this is a good move for Walker politically. If he wins the lawsuit, he gets great headlines and score points with his base. If the lawsuit isn't successful, he can whine about Dane County Judges and score points with his base.
There is no way Scott Walker can lose with this gambit. Well-played, indeed.
hmm, are those secret routers still in operation?
...but it is Scott Walker who has been trying to focus attention on Mary Burke’s role as a member of the school board.
The case was filed by the Wisconsin Institute for Law and Liberty...
John Doe III in 3, 2, 1...
Paul Secunda... said the lawsuit is likely not to be successful. “... They negotiated their current contract when the fate of Act 10 was still up in the air."
So what if the fate of the act was up in the air? If the law was on the books, and was not later found unconstitutional, then the law should apply. If this up in the air doctrine applies then what's to stop someone from filing another lawsuit against Act 10 just as the Madison teacher's contract expires. Then they can sign a new contract while the act is again up in the air.
Note, I'm not making any prediction about the fate of the lawsuit. But I don't see the argument for the law not applying.
John Doe III in 3, 2, 1..
This would John Doe V. John Doe III should be about the WEDC's shady dealings and John Doe IV should look into the Walker campaign coordinating with Media Trackers.
Assuming, of course, we have any campaign finance laws left in the state after the federal judges have their say. And that is a pretty big assumption.
"Assuming, of course, we have any campaign finance laws left in the state after the federal judges have their say."
Oh, that it were so.
Mary Burke has exactly the wrong instincts and disposition ( as evidenced by her support of the unnecessary and ill advised transfer of money from the taxpayers of Wisconsin to the cadillac benefit packages of teachers) to push back, on behalf of the State of Wisconsin, against Federal encroachment on State's Rights. Especially if the Fed's dangle taxpayer money as a carrot.
It seems to me the only hope for Esenberg in this suit is in the line: "They negotiated their current contract when the fate of Act 10 was still up in the air."
They would need to show some kind of bad faith. They knew this rule change was coming, they didn't like it, and they rushed the negotiations to get in ahead of the cutoff. Otherwise, it's just a question of, do you honor your contracts or not? I doubt WILL or Blaska want to paint Burke's opposition as being against the integrity of contracts.
It's a furious Walker PR run this week.
Gotta hide what happened in court on Tuesday and try to get ahead of today's massive document dump from Milwaukee County.
"The Milwaukee County Executive's office has released another batch of records from the John Doe investigation into Scott Walker's administration when he was county executive."
7 gig of emails from Walker's term as County Exec. As he always acted within the right and never did anything wrong on official email, this shouldn't be a problem right?
The Dems love Lincoln too but for political reasons, they'll do and say whatever it takes for them to get elected. The elected Dems don't emulate Reagan.
"Gotta hide what happened in court on Tuesday"
Like Judge Easterbrook calling the John Doe gag order screamingly unconstitutional?
Mark: "7 gig of emails from Walker's term as County Exec. As he always acted within the right and never did anything wrong on official email, this shouldn't be a problem right?"
Can we see all of the emails/phone logs/notes from the investigators over that same period?
Since the left claims they always acted within the right and never did anything wrong in official communications this shouldn't be a problem, right?
He called it `screamingly unconstitutional'? At what point in the audio did he make this clearly stated decision?
"Mark said...
7 gig of emails from Walker's term as County Exec. As he always acted within the right and never did anything wrong on official email, this shouldn't be a problem right?"
LOL. prosecutors had these for years, and found no wrong doing by Walker, what do you think Corky? Do you think that after millions spent, and thousands of man-hours, that they missed something? What a moron.
Maybe you and garage can jerk each other off while you await the results.
@Mark: I couldn't make the link to the audio that Althouse gave us work. Here's a link to a newspaper article. It's near the end.
http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/federal-judges-question-why-john-doe-issue-before-them-b99347371z1-274535381.html?ipad=y
If the Madison schools still buys its healthcare through the captive union healthcare program and hasn't open bid it, then a failure to perform fiduciary duty claim would hold merit. Other schools, free of the extortive prices charged (funneling profits to the union) have saved money with new plans and been able to hire new teachers, increase pay, or reduce taxes.
A face like an old shoe, she has.
...she's trying to portray herself as a practical, sensible snowboarder.
If the Madison schools still buys its healthcare through the captive union healthcare program and hasn't open bid it, then a failure to perform fiduciary duty claim would hold merit. Other schools, free of the extortive prices charged (funneling profits to the union) have saved money with new plans and been able to hire new teachers, increase pay, or reduce taxes.
I think WPS (Is Matthews still on the Board of WPS? I don't think so) is not still an option (at cheap to the teacher prices), and most of them have switched to an HMO-type coverage.
This is what I think I've heard at Sporting Meets over the past couple years, and I have a faulty memory.
While we're at it, can we see all the emails from the IRS?
Afterall, if they didn't do anything wrong...
Everything has to be above board and transparent. Milwaukee prosecutors must release their side consider it discovery.
Why does that doc dump remind me of Palin? What a waste of money.
It's a furious Walker PR run this week.
Fun week. Walker just cut an ad of him....in a grave? LOL.
The filing fees alone should eliminate budget deficits in Wisconsin.
Blacks invented filing fees.
lawsuits I hope will succeed
Blacks invented mead.
Which probably resulted in Meade.
Drago said...
Blacks invented filing fees.
Good anticipation skills!
Does being from and associated with Madison hurt Burke with the voters from the rest of the state?
said...
Blacks invented filing fees.
Blacks are owed eleventy billion quadrillion dollars in reparations.
Blaska should prevail. The judgement that Act 10 is not unconstitutional applies to the law from the time it became law. The fact that one Dane County judge mistook its legality for something else does change the date the law went in to effect.
This is not 'more political than practical', unless you think there is zero monetary consequence.
This is not 'more political than practical', unless you think there is zero monetary consequence
When Act 10 was voted upon in the Assembly we were told by Walker and the Republicans that it had no financial affect on the state.
If they weren't being truthful when they said that then, due to a quorum not being present at the time, Act 10 was illegally passed into law.
It had little impact on state budgets. Local ones were helped a lot by it.
Does being from and associated with Madison hurt Burke with the voters from the rest of the state?
I'll say no, based on the fact that Baldwin and Doyle were both from Madison, and they were elected to state-wide office.
There might be people who won't vote for them -- but because they're Democrats, not because of where they're from.
It had little impact on state budgets
Scott Walker stated Act 10 saved the state over $225 million in annual savings dues to higher pension contributions from state workers, and over $82 million a year from making state workers pay more for their health insurance
http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/new-policies-saved-taxpayers-1-billion-walker-says-9354895-148535795.html
Scott Walker talks out of both sides of his mouth, depending which way the wind is blowing.
"So it seems that Walker sees this as a good issue for him and would like to smoke Mary Burke out on it and to tie her to Madison, with it's old out-of-the-mainstream image, even as she's trying to portray herself as a practical, sensible businesswoman."
Mary Burke has said that public employees should pay something for their health insurance.
Question for School Board member Ms. Burke:
Why aren’t Madison teachers paying something for their health insurance?
Clearly, this WILL group and David Blaska should be audited by the IRS.
"MadisonMan said...
Does being from and associated with Madison hurt Burke with the voters from the rest of the state?
I'll say no, based on the fact that Baldwin and Doyle were both from Madison, and they were elected to state-wide office.
There might be people who won't vote for them -- but because they're Democrats, not because of where they're from."
I'm not saying "no" is wrong, but I don't think these are good examples...Tammy was a Congressperson first, of course in a very liberal district, and was elected in the state wide vote in a presidential year. Does she win without riding Obama's coattails?
Doyle was also fortunate, Tommy quit to work for Bush, and Tommy's brother took 10% of the vote as an independent hurting GOP McCallum. It is unlikely Doyle wins if not for that.
Er, this could be really bad news for Burke if it turns out that the school board was allowing the teachers to purchase their health insurance through the union and the pre-Act 10 price. What too many folks even in Wisconsin don’t know is that the collective bargaining allowed the teachers to purchase health insurance through a union insurance subsidiary at a cost $400 per month greater than what the state’s competitively selected insurance company charged other state and local employees for the same coverage. After the passage of Act 10, the union insurance subsidiary lowered its rates to equal the state-selected provider’s rates.
But if Burke’s school board allowed the union to purchase more expensive, but equivalent, insurance, Walker’s campaign ought to point that out. $400 per month is $4800 per year, multiply that by the number of teachers and you’ll arrive at the figure that the school board is wasting.
Too few people understand that this one provision of Act 10 has save the state’s taxpayers million$.
@SC Mike: I never understood how they got away with it.
"What too many folks even in Wisconsin don’t know is that the collective bargaining allowed the teachers to purchase health insurance through a union insurance subsidiary at a cost $400 per month greater than what the state’s competitively selected insurance company charged other state and local employees for the same coverage."
Unless there has been a change since 2008, John Matthews, veteran executive director of Madison Teachers Inc. — the teachers' union — has also sat, as a paid member, on the board of Wisconsin Physicians Service, provider of the costly health insurance plan Madison school employees pay nothing for.
Scott Walker talks out of both sides of his mouth, depending which way the wind is blowing.
Said about every politician, so....
madisonfella: "Scott Walker talks out of both sides of his mouth,..."
A lefty says this after obama reverses just about every foreign policy/terrorism policy that was put forth in the last handful of years.
Precious.
"Unless there has been a change since 2008, John Matthews, veteran executive director of Madison Teachers Inc. — the teachers' union — has also sat, as a paid member, on the board of Wisconsin Physicians Service, provider of the costly health insurance plan Madison school employees pay nothing for."
Nothing to see here. Move along, move along ....
Why aren’t Madison teachers paying something for their health insurance?
They aren't getting the health insurance as welfare, rather it earned via their labor.
Why does Meade and so many other Walker supporters claim that a teacher's work isn't considered "something"?
"Unless there has been a change since 2008, John Matthews, veteran executive director of Madison Teachers Inc. — the teachers' union — has also sat, as a paid member, on the board of Wisconsin Physicians Service, provider of the costly health insurance plan Madison school employees pay nothing for."
Prima facie evidence of coordination for financial gain.
When will the investigation start? Should armed agents show up at Mathews doorstep, fully SWAT-ted out at 3am to obtain "evidence"?
Notice how Drago, like all the righty automatons (not everyone can be a general after all, the world needs ditch diggers too) simply resets to the Null Position and reiterates all of his baseline talking points about Obama when the going gets tough.
Predictable, inevitable, and simply precious.
madisonfella said...
They aren't getting the health insurance as welfare, rather it earned via their labor.
Ah, no. Sorry. Not the case at all.
They negotiated it, prior to any labor. And having done so, it now is unrelated to (meaning, they still get it), to the quality of their 'labor'.
Exactly why things are a hot mess in the public schools.
"Whether the lawsuit succeeds or not, it puts a spotlight on Mary Burke."
It's a totally frivolous lawsuit, as explained by Secunda.
If Walker wants to attack her for "not taking advantage of Act 10," well hell, why not, fire away with the ads.
But the lawsuit exudes pettiness, and it seems likely to me that Walker himself stands a good chance of being associated with that pettiness if the case gains traction in public conversation, even though (wink, wink) it's "not his lawsuit."
They aren't getting the health insurance as welfare, rather it earned via their labor.
Why does Meade and so many other Walker supporters claim that a teacher's work isn't considered "something"?
So, the private company employees, who have to pay for their own insurance at a rate approaching 100% of the time, aren't working?
Teachers have specifically more difficult jobs than anybody else on Earth?
madisonfella, I'm sure garage appreciates you riding to his rescue.
He certainly needs it.
SomeoneHasToSayIt: "They negotiated it, prior to any labor. And having done so, it now is unrelated to (meaning, they still get it), to the quality of their 'labor'"
Precisely what the left likes about it.
Disassociating the quality/value of someones work and the compensation for that work is fundamental to the lefts agenda.
It really helps when those who receive these benefits for low quality performance so readily donate to the dems.
It's almost like public sector unions are a mistake or something.
But the lawsuit exudes pettiness, and it seems likely to me that Walker himself stands a good chance of being associated with that pettiness if the case gains traction in public conversation, even though (wink, wink) it's "not his lawsuit."
Walker isn't bringing the suit.
How would it make HIM look bad?
Are you aware that he is not responsible for the actions of every single person in Wisconsin?
It's a totally frivolous lawsuit, as explained by Secunda.
Totally impartial source there. Director of Labor and Employment Program at Marquette reeks of disinterested observer.
So, the private company employees, who have to pay for their own insurance at a rate approaching 100% of the time, aren't working?
Of course they are working, nobody said otherwise. Would you say that they need to start giving "something" to the company in exchange for their paycheck?
"Why does Meade and so many other Walker supporters claim that a teacher's work isn't considered "something"?"
Ask Mary Burke. She is the one who said:
"I do believe [state employees] paying a fair share of health care and pension costs is something we needed in order to be able to balance the budget."
madisonfella: "Would you say that they need to start giving "something" to the company in exchange for their paycheck?"
They do give "something": they contribute a portion of their compensation package for health coverage, and that contribution is deducted from the determined TOTAL VALUE of their work product for the company.
State employees, including teachers, "paying a fair share of health care and pension costs" is the part of ACT 10 that Mary Burke says she agrees with.
Ask Mary Burke.
Nice cop-out. Predictable, inevitable, and simply precious.
You are the one who asked "Why aren’t Madison teachers paying something for their health insurance?", so I'm asking you: Is a teachers work considered "something" or not?
What's even worse, thanks to the dems and obamacare, is that the private sector employees are having to cough up more and more out of pocket to deal with all the BS obamacare regs:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2014/09/10/yes-you-are-paying-a-lot-more-for-your-employer-health-plan-than-you-used-to/
It just means less and less money in the pockets of private sector employees.
I know I know.
That thought makes a lefties heart just flutter with excitement!
Nice cop-out.
A teacher's work is something, but it is not something they are paying.
madisonfella: "Nice cop-out."
Quoting lefties accurately is a "cop-out".
And racist no doubt.
It's not a cop out. It just isn't relevant what I think of teachers' work.
Mary Burke sits on the Madison School Board. Mary Burke is running for governor. Don't cop out by asking me for my opinion.
Ask Ms. Burke what she meant.
Meade: "It's not a cop out. It just isn't relevant what I think of teachers' work."
You don't understand.
Mary Burke said what she said.
It makes the left uncomfortable.
Therefore it's "change the subject" time!!
More importantly, madisonfella, ask Ms. Burke how she squares that statement with her two votes, as a school board member, to extend contracts with MTI which do NOT have Madison teachers paying something more for their health insurance and pensions?
Ask Ms. Burke what she meant
If I have a chance to do so, I will. Just like I'm asking you what you meant when you said Madison teachers need to pay something in exchange for their health insurance.
Were you simply repeating a talking point without knowing what it actually meant?
Therefore it's "change the subject" time!!
The guy who is constantly bringing up "OBAMA!!" whenever he has painted himself into a corner really said that?!
LOL! Truly, there is no shame at all among the right wingers.
madisonfella: "The guy who is constantly bringing up "OBAMA!!" whenever he has painted himself into a corner really said that?"
LOL
Never happened.
Just like this never happened:
Madisonfella: "Just like I'm asking you what you meant when you said Madison teachers need to pay something in exchange for their health insurance."
Meade didn't say it.
He quoted Burke.
Deal with it.
Ask Ms. Burke what she meant
"If I have a chance to do so, I will. "
Good. And if you get the chance, follow up by asking her why Madison is the only school district out of 424 left in Wisconsin to ignore the law and not take advantage of Governor Walker’s reforms? All the way through 2016.
A little voice is telling me that madisonfella has no intention of questioning Ms Burke about her publicly stated positions.
Never happened.
Kind of silly to make claim you never brought up Obama when it is right here in front of everyone.
Meade didn't say it. He quoted Burke
So it was Mary Burke that said "Question for School Board member Ms. Burke: Why aren’t Madison teachers paying something for their health insurance?" and Meade had nothing at all to do with that statement?
I actually think you are right about one thing: Those were not Meade's words. Obviously he was repeating something handed down to him and that is why he is unable to explain what was meant by the question.
madisonfella: "Kind of silly to make claim you never brought up Obama when it is right here in front of everyone."
I'm sorry but that was the Washington Post who published the article regarding obamacares impact on private sector employees which is quite topical on this thread. I merely directed you to it.
You don't have to read it.
Especially since it exposes more lefty lies about obamacare.
Which brings us back to your lying about what Meade wrote.
Seems like a theme with you.
madisonfella: "Those were not Meade's words."
Correct. It was Mary Burkes political policy point.
You have no problem with Burke, why do her words and policy positions bother you so?
"Why aren’t Madison teachers paying something for their health insurance?"
That is my paraphrase of what Ms. Burke said here:
Are there any parts of ACT 10 that you agree with?
Yes, I do believe [state employees] paying a fair share of health care and pension costs is something we needed in order to be able to balance the budget.
Feel free to paraphrase it differently if you think Burke meant something else.
Meade: "Feel free to paraphrase it differently if you think Burke meant something else."
No no no.
The point here is to AVOID drilling down into what Burke meant and shift the conversation onto more "comfortable" ground.
And Meade, you are not cooperating with madisonfellas plan.
"Totally impartial source there. Director of Labor and Employment Program at Marquette reeks of disinterested observer."
Well, either what he is saying is true or it isn't. "They negotiated their current contract when the fate of Act 10 was still up in the air" is true. So is "They’re allowed to stay under their current bargaining contract" and "It might not be permissible after the contract expires."
So he could be Satan for purposes of this discussion, and he'd still be 100% right.
As for the "it's not Walker's suit" line. Haha. Come, we are not children here.
That is my paraphrase
So not your words at all? You're still insisting that it was Mary Burke who typed out "Question for School Board member Ms. Burke: Why aren’t Madison teachers paying something for their health insurance?"
Precious. Simply precious. You and Drago make a great pair.
"So not your words at all? You're still insisting that it was Mary Burke who typed out "Question for School Board member Ms. Burke: Why aren’t Madison teachers paying something for their health insurance?"
Precious. Simply precious. You and Drago make a great pair."
I don't get why you're having such a hissy fit. Meade isn't even giving his opinion here. He's asking to hear from Mary Burke on what she actually believes.
At the very least, we should all agree that clarity from our politicians is better than agreement.
All too often we vote for someone when all we've heard are platitudes. Let her be more specific.
madisonfella said...
So, the private company employees, who have to pay for their own insurance at a rate approaching 100% of the time, aren't working?
Of course they are working, nobody said otherwise. Would you say that they need to start giving "something" to the company in exchange for their paycheck?
9/11/14, 6:14 PM "
Put the pay and compensation packages for teachers on the ballot and then you will find out what the taxpayers, the ones who are the ones who have to pay and then you will see how they really value their work.
Meade isn't even giving his opinion here.
When someone asks "Why aren’t Madison teachers paying something for their health insurance?" it strongly implies that the opinion of that person is that teachers are receiving their health insurance for nothing. When asked to clarify, he started claiming that those words weren't even his.
I'm not sure why he felt the need to backpedal so quickly, but there is no doubt he is disowning what he wrote earlier.
madisonfella, move out of town, please. sully another city.
Just like I'm asking you what you meant when you said Madison teachers need to pay something in exchange for their health insurance.
Sounds like he's agreeing with Burke's formulation.
So, again, you might want to ask Burke.
Well, either what he is saying is true or it isn't. "They negotiated their current contract when the fate of Act 10 was still up in the air" is true.
Using that logic, one can file a suit against a law they don't like to nullify it entirely for a while since it's fate is "up in the air".
That is absurd.
As for the "it's not Walker's suit" line. Haha. Come, we are not children here.
Don't see Walker's name listed as the plaintiff. Can you present evidence to the contrary?
When someone asks "Why aren’t Madison teachers paying something for their health insurance?" it strongly implies that the opinion of that person is that teachers are receiving their health insurance for nothing.
Again, sounds like you beef is with Burke, who said that and not Meade who simply asked the question she claimed to support.
Burke said they need to pay something for their insurance. Before you vote for her for Governor --- and, let's be honest, you're going to vote for her --- shouldn't you ask what she meant?
Or do you assume that she's just lying about her opinions to placate the rubes out there?
Both options seem problematic.
Sounds like he's agreeing with Burke's formulation
Sounds like he is agreeing with somebody but he has no idea at all what he is agreeing with.
Yeah, that seems about par for the course.
sounds like you beef is with Burke, who said that and not Meade
Can a beef only be directed at only one person? If I have the same chance to interact with her as have had with him then of course I'll ask her to explain what she meant. Hopefully she won't tuck her tail and run for the hills like Meade did.
Can a beef only be directed at only one person?
When one person is a candidate for governor and the other is the husband of a law professor and a web site commenter, then yeah, there really is only one beef that makes any sense.
Meade can do approximately squat about this. Burke, on the other hand, is seeking to have significant power over this.
If I have the same chance to interact with her as have had with him then of course I'll ask her to explain what she meant. Hopefully she won't tuck her tail and run for the hills like Meade did.
Meade is conversing with you.
Burke? Not so much.
Let me know how your questioning of her goes. I'd be fascinated.
Question: If she won't answer your questions, will you still vote for her?
Because if you will, then you don't have a beef with the position.
---get ahead of today's massive document dump from Milwaukee County.
Oh geez is it time for ANOTHER massive document dump again?
Tuesday, August 05, 2014 8:12 a.m. CDT
UNDATED (WSAU-Wheeler News) 34 more files will be made public this month from the John Doe investigation into the recall elections of Governor Scott Walker and G-O-P state senators.
A number of files from the John Doe were released a few weeks ago. (that would be July for Garage!!!!) They included a prosecutor's theory that Walker and top Republicans illegally coordinated the 2011-and-'12 recall elections
You guys and your secret routers and massive dumps. Woo hop!
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