Meade gives 2 responses, in quick succession:
1. "Todd digs that."
2. "It's not very Margaret Thatcher-looking."
August 7, 2012
"Look how Sarah Palin is dressing these day!"
I say, when I see this.
Meade gives 2 responses, in quick succession:
Meade gives 2 responses, in quick succession:
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249 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 249 of 249harrogate said...
Freeman,
"...People love those two...."
...you paint with a pretty broad brush...
This omission, this use of "People" while I am sure innocent on your part, dovetails with her "real Americans," "real Virginians" schtick that, in addition to being obviously absurd on its face, I thought rather nasty.
8/7/12 2:17 PM
RLY harro? Funny that saying "people" is divisive" and saying "some people, such as conservatives" is not? I would say at worst Freeman's use of "people" as opposed to "some people" or "many people" or "people I know" might be overbroad, but to pick nits like that, you must be hungry.
I also think the stuff about "the nastiness of real this and that" is overblown, purposefully so. It's like rooting for your team - e.g., "real baseball" is played by the Yankees, not the Mets. It's hyperbole.
The only people who would take it seriously are the bums who get in the very occasional stadium fights. Since of course sports violence is so very much more prevalent in Europe, and since leftists seem always to be looking to Europe, maybe there's a connection to why a liberal takes that so much more to heart than a conservative...
...or a woman than a man, going back to the Althouse apologies thread. A conservative wouldn't know you felt all dehumanized and sheeit till you smacked him upside the head with the 2x4 - a feat the liberal is never far from nor reluctant to do.
That's to the extent that it is heartfelt. As something that you do not truly feel, but find expedient to say, it would of course be standard operating procedure, so carry on, I guess.
Blogger garage mahal said...
I always thought Christine O'Donnell was much more likeable.
8/7/12 2:56 PM
Will I have to go far, garage, to look up old posts to see how you shat on her, because she was on the wrong side? No, right?
There's gotta be a word for it...
In Iowa when a country girl gets all gussied up they are referred to as "Hee Hawt". I think that is appropriate in this case.
Did you see that woman's shoes?
*whispers* Matching pumps for a colostomy bag. *convulses an imaginary hairball*
Nichebvo,
Speaking of nasty, that was quite the little number you did on what I wrote. Here's what I wrote:
"Isn't it more the case that some--ok, to be fair, a lot--of the people who identify as *conservative* love them, want to defend them, do things for them, etc?"
See the difference? Maybe not. Sad, if you really don't. Anyway, I wrote it that way because that's what I meant.
Among some (but not all) of the people who identify as conservative, Palin has certainly earned and continues to earn the effect Freeman describes. But, among people who identify as liberal, she certainly does not have that effect, at all. So ideology matters, here--she'd be the first to admit it, I bet.
Those people who view themselves as independent, it seems that they neither love nor loathe Palin. So her populism doesn't seem to be so earth-shatteringly effective there, either. But then, that's not her target audience. She very much knows her audience, and that is why she is so strong rhetorically.
This is all basic stuff, Nichevo. As for the "real Americans" stuff, what a shocker you don;t think that's nasty. Color me super duper shocked.
Also, Freeman, I could have gotten closer to Huckabee, you saw he was a "regular guy" or whatever...but his policies were all wrong, so I didn't fall for it. Palin in addition to her charisma happens to be right. She's probably in a 90% confidence interval of policy concordance with Krauthammer, Sowell, WFB types. She just wraps it in a prettier package with bigger bows ;>
Huckabee is the one at whom Obama would have been fair to target the "lipstick on a pig" remark, not Palin. Palin is true blue. Huckabee is a RINO squish even if a likable, plausible one. Palin, for good or ill, really is who she is and does not hide or deny it. Not to say she is doctrinaire -
does she contradict herself? Very well then, she contradicts herself. She is large, she contains multitudes -
but I see none of the weasel in her.
I came up with a short list of people who I have that same visceral, defensive feeling about,
I think, at least for me, that includes those that I feel are unfairly being criticized with over the top piling on and viciousness unrelated to the points the person is attempting to make. The pouncing on trivialities to the exclusion of ANY positives or good points the person may have.
It resembles a pack of rabid dogs attacking a cat or a group of cruel people taking pleasure in the tormenting of an animal or another person for the sheer pleasure of being able to inflict the torment. When I see this....I feel compelled to defend.
I may not agree with the person and I may agree with some of the negative comments. Palin's voice IS like fingernails on a blackboard...but....that doesn't mean that the concepts that she is espousing are not worth thinking about or listening to.
To focus on the trivial trappings, such as what shoes she wears, what her clothing looks like, evidences to me a closed mind and an unwillingness to think and consider.
Will I have to go far, garage, to look up old posts to see how you shat on her, because she was on the wrong side? No, right?
Actually if you looked I bet you would find me sticking up for O'Donnell.
Care to take the challenge? If you lose you must apologize.
"Step up your game" were the words the preceeded Bloody Sunday.
I tried the link 3 times and only got the article.
And lest anyone think that my defense mechanism is just for conservatives....I felt the same way about Hillary and the shameful treatment she was getting from the Obama machine and the MSM. It was disgraceful and should not be tolerated.
Harrogate, hit a nerve, did I? Didn't mean to. Not that that is an apology. I was going for brevity.
And no, I don't think "full context" is full of win for you. My precis was pretty good. Again you are the one who needs to drill down and put people in shiny metal boxes, because it is necessary for your side that these compartmentalizations be made. My experience among libs and independents is more mixed than yours, anyway - even grudgingly there is often some admiration. As for haters, they gotta hate.
But the Democrats need people - "their" people, if you like - to know that they are not to like Sarah Palin. Maybe those among the indies and libs, who feel a flowering of "Cool! when they see or hear her, could be moved.
THIS MUST NOT BE ALLOWED TO HAPPEN. Never forget it! You don't like Sarah Palin!! Don't even try!!! Das ist ein Führerbefell!!!!
As for the "real Americans" stuff, let me know when your pussy stops hurting. No nastier and certainly less personal than "lipstick on a pig."
DBQ
I feel the same thing for Hillary from time to time. When she's being attacked unfairly. But, most of the time she's just despicable. I even feel a little twinge for Biden occasionally. When I think he just sincerely says something that gets an over-reaction.
garage, O RLY? I'm prepared to take your word for it, if you do say so.
It seems odd to me...but then perhaps O'Donnell amused you more and threatened you less. But okay, maybe some aversive triggers in Palin were absent in O'Donnell, according to your tastes. Or maybe her tits are bigger? I didn't look.
Anyway what's a Congressperson more or less? Palin in the Oval Office or a heartbeat away is a BFD, in Biden's words. I admit Palin's voice is not all that and any Easterner will sound less grating, you betcha. But Palin represents a much bigger thing. I believe that she would bring real, stupendous change to Washington, if possible.
Yeah, it took Obama to make me realize that Hillary! wasn't the worst person in the world.
It seems odd to me...but then perhaps O'Donnell amused you more and threatened you less
O'Donnell is quirky and funny.
Palin to me is just shrill, mean, and a phony. YMMV.
And yes I did stick up for O'Donnell, in real time.
Indeed, Palin has courage. But what are we talking about here?
She's weathered a tsunami of vile public vituperation, nastiness and ridicule directed at her and her family, mudslinging and obsessive prying from so-called "journalists." She didn't cower and withdraw from the public sphere, but had the chutzpah and shrewdness to turn that "vortex" to her advantage, financially and politically. Every nasty crack by a Letterman fuels her celebrity more, which in turn nets her more lucrative TV gigs (e.g. on FOX or NBC), paid appearances, reality TV shows for her and members of her family, etc. And that celebrity wattage provides a megaphone for her political views, largely good messages IMO (the best of the Tea Party platform), and strengthens the power/ leverage of her endorsements.
That does take courage. But by some of those metrics, Hillary Clinton, Rush Limbaugh, Donald Trump, Angelina Jolie, and Kim Kardashian all have courage too-- and I'm not about to compare any of them to Patton or Churchill. Or to Thatcher or Reagan.
When I think of Patton and Churchill, I think of the kind of resolve tested by the most unimaginably staggeringly awful moments of WWII-- all but defeated, yet these men stuck it out, through the valley of death, and won.
Whereas Palin resigned her governorship. Yes, I know, she had to because of the legal bills caused by malicious ethics complaints, etc.; but the fact remains, she quit. Quit the office to which the people of Alaska elected her. And then enthusiastically embraced a lucrative career as a political celebrity rather than politician.
Look, that may well have been a very astute move. And not just in a self-serving way: perhaps she calculated that she could do more to advance the political causes she cares about (hence what she considers the good of her country) out of office as a celebrity than as a beleaguered governor of Alaska.
But I still wouldn't call that move Patton-like or Churchillian.
Palin is great in many ways, but IMO talking about her as if she were Joan of Arc only validates her skeptical detractors.
Nichevo,
What you refer to as "context" is really just a matter of whether you know how to read well. If you really think that Sarah Palin has significant crossover appeal to liberal people, that they think "Cool" when she comes to town, then make that case, if you can. I think it is a ridiculous case, but whatever floats your boat.
You just got it all wrong is all. Other than that, your "take" on what I wrote is spot on.
As for your attack on me personally, you're a big tough guy, yes? All manly. On the internet. To what tired stereotypes you descend in your writing.
BTW. Politicians, of course, attack each other personally all the time, and play dirty, and voters and commenters attack them personally too, and at times it even can be very entertaining, even if unfair. I myself have delighted in some of the attacks on Obama; including one that took place on this very thread.
It does, though, seem to me a little different to me, when a politician says, very publically, and says it again and again and again to the point that it is a big part of that politician's official watermark, as it were: that *these* voters, these that agree with me, are the real Americans.
But you say it is hyperbole. Fine, maybe in the end, it was hyperbole, and continues to be hypebole as she continues to invoke this language. Maybe Sarah Palin does not really think that, maybe those who adore her so, do not really think that. Maybe she just thinks those who vote against her party, her ideas, are simply wrong. I am not sure which is worse, if she means it or if she knows it is absurd and nasty but thinks she can use it for mileage. But it aint nearly as pretty as she is, either way.
harrogate, I think an important part of the context you're missing (or minimizing) is what Palin was reacting and responding to: Obama's remarks about "bitter clingers."
Liberals heard Palin's speech and accused her of waging a culture war, a war against "elites" or whatever that doesn't include them as "real Americans." But the context for Palin's speech was a culture war started by Obama and his supporters and the MSM: they were the ones who'd fired rhetorical shots at Americans, Americans they contemptuously characterized as gun-crazy hicks, hillbillies, bigots, racists, fundamentalist wackos.
Palin was not attacking "elites" but elitism. The really insulting, offensive elitism of Obama's remarks (and of course decades of just such insulting elitism toward red state "fly over country" from the MSM, academia, etc.) Palin's remarks about "real Americans" wasn't about excluding "other" Americans but celebrating the dignity of those Americans Obama had otherized as "bitter clingers."
Because most liberals find nothing objectionable about Obama's "bitter clingers" statement, they'd naturally misinterpret the rhetorical dynamic of Palin's speech: they only see an attack on them (on liberals), and don't recognize that what Palin was denouncing was their (liberals') culture war attack on "us"-- "bitter clingers."
Harro, now you've just lost the plot. Would you feel better if I had said "stop whining?" Aww, mommy make it all better.
No, I think you pretty much realize that you are losing, and want to escape like a squid in an ink-cloud of butthurt. Actually your whole contribution to this thread reads like an exercise in projection.
Nichevo:
You argue that Palin has crossover appeal to liberals and think you are winning? See? Palin is definitely not dumb. But your argument sure as hell is.
Or, if Obama gave speech after speech saying that only voters who agree with him are "real Americans," you'd be okay with that? Sure you would, you big brave manly boy.
You're Dismissed.
For the record, this is what Obama said to an audience in San Francisco:
You got into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing’s replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton Administration, and the Bush Administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. And it’s not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren’t like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.
The Man of Steel T-shirt seems rather appropriate for a Steelman cookout.
Perhaps it's in the definition of "real" Americans. If by "real" Americans Palin means those who honor the founders and consider the constitution as the best foundational document for individual freedom and liberty, without arbitrarily changing it or calling it a living document then she's right about who the real Americans are.
I don't get the warm and fuzzies about politicians - Palin included.
I like Palin because she hasn't screwed up. That's it. She walked onto the world stage, told me what she was about, and stuck to it.
I'm easy to please.
How she looks has never seriously come into it,...
DBQ said what I had to say, including the fact that some things are so incredibly obvious (semi-politician dressing for the crowd) that they needn’t be said. Lord knows the article itself doesn’t deserve serious analysis. It’s more fun to talk about shoes, honestly.
She's like Huckabee.
I see where you are going with this. Personally, I’m not big on Huckabee but I know some people were. The only time I really liked him was the day Tucker was supposed to resign and didn’t; I thought Huckabee’s comments were pretty funny. Anyway, Huckabee didn’t have the persecution angle going; instead he’s got the whole Baptist preacher/storyteller thing. With Palin, it’s hard to ignore the fact that people went BSCrazy the second she showed up. It was fascinating and I think it made some women identify with her more.
It’s interesting that they’ve both decided that there is more money and success in going a different route than straight up politics. I think it’s smart of both of them and exactly what I expected her to do. She’s making money and still influencing politics (which she obviously cares about) with her ideas. I think Huckabee is in it for the money, personally, but I’m sure he is interested in his ideas as well.
Sweet Sarah as a subject never has a thread < 200 posts.
Remember this golden oldie?
Sarah Palin is, at the most visceral level, something the left can't stand: a publicly Christian woman who is absolutely 100% comfortable with her sexuality, and yet acts consistently with untenable beliefs like: you shouldn't abort your Downs child. You shouldn't have sex outside of marriage, but if you do, you shouldn't abort the baby and you should forgive your daughter. You should strive to uphold a certain standard, knowing that it's impossible, and not pretend to have succeeded, and not come down too hard on others who don't succeed.
The "contradictions," which only exist in the heads of the left, nearly cause them to explode. For the rest of us, the obvious comfort with her sexuality just leaves us staring and talking because, let's face it, it's rare and fun to talk about.
It's summertime, probably 112 degrees and she was at a cookout for a candidate. She was dressed up more than I would have been. ive me shorts, tee shirt and sandals, my uniform.
I'll shut up now. I can see you folks want to keep dreaming your dreams of Sarah, the woman of the people. I need to get out somewhere where it's a bit more stimulating. Enjoy your slumber.
Ann, you continue to be rude on this subject, as if you expect everyone to have a four year BS fine arts degree. What's obvious to your highly trained eye is probably not obvious to most people.
But you have to give more than "See, that's obvious!"
That's like me saying "Hey, it's obvious there are more irrational numbers than rational ones." I learned that in my second quarter (of my first year) of college, and can still prove it. But I'll bet you don't have a clue.
Throw us a bone. What are you thinking? She's still young enough? She's the friend you would like to go and buy shoes with? She's not going to steal your boyfriend?
As far as Sarah Palin manipulating me, she can't help but do it, and I can't help but let her. It wouldn't get my vote for anything, but her spunk, vigor, that she stood up for what was right in Alaska, and that she continues to buck the status quo would.
Ann, you continue to be rude on this subject, as if you expect everyone to have a four year BS fine arts degree. What's obvious to your highly trained eye is probably not obvious to most people.
But you have to give more than "See, that's obvious!"
And some things are SO obvious that they don't really warrant in depth discussion. You are assuming that your audience consists of people who are operating at the current educational level of your college students.... which is abysmal.... when most of the commentors seem to be working professionals, semi retired professionals, business owners: and who were educated when an education meant something.
"...beware of any occupation that requires a change of clothes." Care to guess?
Of course, Mr Walt Whitman, fighting pretentiousness then...Sarah Palin fighting it now.
If the shoe fits...wear it...and she does, very nicely.
The picture of that outfit reminds me of hoochi-hoop-gate.
Anyone else remember that?
She didn't wear the hoop earrings again during the campaign. I think that *today* she'd choose differently, as they say, and refuse to take them off.
Excellent thread. Thoughtful and astute comments, especially those from the women here, whom, I think, did a great job of keeping Sarah in perspective, and context.
Personally, I believe Ann should come back and offer some sort of apology to the commenters after dismissing them as "... dreaming your dreams of Sarah...". Such reflects poorly on the Professor, after such a sane and rational discussion as above.
The picture of that outfit reminds me of hoochi-hoop-gate.
Anyone else remember that?
She didn't wear the hoop earrings again during the campaign. I think that *today* she'd choose differently, as they say, and refuse to take them off.
In case people are wondering why I haven't switched my hat avatar.
"She's like Huckabee. She has a grasp of populism the way he does. People love those two. People want to defend them, want to do things for them, feel honor and duty tied up in them somehow."
I don't care for Huckabee (a big government liberal with a social conservative quirk, near as I can tell,) but I understand the appeal of Huckabee.
I don't know why someone would object to Freeman's statement.
Anyhow, really, who doesn't know that Palin is wealthy now? She'd be called out for being fake if she wore cheep shoes. She's always been a runner, so we all know her fitness is not for our benefit. Of course she's aware that she's always got to be ready for photographs and she'll look thinner in the super high heels. That's easy to sympathize with as well.
Wearing the campaign T-shirt is a signal that she's not too proud to be campy for a cause.
In case people are wondering why I haven't switched my hat avatar.
Heh. Touché.
The left and the MSM hate Sarah for being proud to be a parent. They hate her for loving her kids, especially the "imperfect" ones. They hate her for being beautiful, and for being faithful to her husband. And mostly they hate her for exposing them to be the pathetic, petty, hypocritical people they are.
I admire Sarah because she is everything they are not.
My dear Lady! Look what you have done. You jealousy and hypocrisy knows no bounds. You cannot abide that your commenter's love another more than you. They are revolting. Of course you have always thought so. You just never let the mask slip. Perhaps I should send you some Adhesive X so that your mask of tolerance might remain intact.
The green eyed monster is a poor mistress.
Remember the example of Geli. It will not end well.
I love Sarah. I love her deliberately slightly white trash look because it is a poke in the eye with a sharp stick to exactly those people I'd like to poke. Courage and I don't give a crap what they think - yep, I love her.
No, seriously, harrogate, WTF are you on about? Look, I thought we covered this, if you buy the more expensive toilet paper, you won't get splinters.
Yes, courage, in a word. "Follow me!" This is what "leading from behind" isn't.
Or, as Althouse put it, in her post of August 6, 2012
("At the end of the day, the biggest impact you can make in anything is through kids."
Said the children's surgeon, who died yesterday in Lake Michigan, saving children.
Posted by Ann Althouse at 1:17 PM
Tags: children, death, drowning, surgery)
23 comments:
Ann Althouse said...
...If I try to save these 2 children, I might drown, and as a result many more children might die, therefore it's best for children for me to preserve myself and allow these boys to struggle for their own survival without my assistance.
8/6/12 1:47 PM
Who would think like this, and who wouldn't?
The one who does is smarter, right?
The one who doesn't is stupid, right?
The type who doesn't should be subordinate to the type who does, right?
My Caribou Barbie has a BBQ outfit. I wonder if her G.I. Todd has a sports car parked in the Dream House.
As someone already said, no way to know if those are expensive shoes-this style has been knocked off for 5 years-and capri pants? pahleeze. She is so Mall of America.
And some things are SO obvious that they don't really warrant in depth discussion. You are assuming that your audience consists of people who are operating at the current educational level of your college students.... which is abysmal.... when most of the commentors seem to be working professionals, semi retired professionals, business owners: and who were educated when an education meant something.
Sorry Dust Bunny Queen, unless you can tell me why there are more irrationals than rationals in the number system in your own words (go ahead and cheat), I'm not going to be intimidated by your BS.
There is a ton of human knowledge out there. The human brain is massive, and has all kinds of angles. You can't develop them all.
God, I hate stupid people.
Yes, I know she looks good. She looks great. But the idea that this look is too "something" for her is crazy.
She got her mall on.
God,
Dante hates stupid people.
But especially people who don't know rational from irrational numbers.
Can he do that? Are you intimidated by his BS?
Way to go, Meade. Ann shows you a picture of hot Palin, you go Schwingg! with a little too much enthusiasm, and then you quickly retreat to "She's no Maggie Thatcher."
The only things Sarah is manipulating are men's cardiovascular systems.
My friend, a realtor in Alaska, knows Sarah Palin and has worked with her. She told me long ago that Sarah Palin is "the real deal".
I was flying to Anchorage the day Palin was interviewed by Glenn Beck, when he was at Fox. In Salt Lake, where Delta has a hub, this very petite woman who looked a lot like Palin walked by to board, wearing the same spike-heeled boots that Palin was wearing in that interview. Then, a guy who looked very much like Todd Palin walked by. Well, I'm no Sherlock, but I mentioned to my husband that Todd and Sarah Palin were on our plane. The thing I noticed, was that even in 3-4" spike heels, she was shorter than me, 5'5". She is incredibly petite. Dynamite and small packages comes to mind.
As to the expense of her shoes? Until very recently, she shopped at a consignment store in Anchorage for her clothes, even as Governor. I would not be surprised if those shoes were not ferociously expensive (I wouldn't know how to research that). So, good on Sarah for being able to wear those shoes (even though I think they are oogly). Hope she doesn't break an ankle, and keeps making liberal and RINO heads explode.
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