January 19, 2012

Debate tonight, at 8 Eastern Time... and it's an important one.

Perry's out, which means there are only 4 candidates left, and — have you noticed? — only one candidate with experience as a state governor. Plus, there's all the new dirt on Newt, who just got endorsed by Perry, and semi-endorsed by Palin, and we just found out Santorum won in Iowa. It should be great fun. Hang out here.

1. Gingrich floats out, blimp-like. Santorum looks loose and happy. Citadel kids sing the national anthem beautifully. Santorum and Romney sing along, but Paul and Gingrich do not.

2. Intros: Rick Santorum thanks the people of Iowa. Mitt Romney tells us about his family, "the joy of my life." Gingrich notes he's a Georgian, "at home in the South." Ron Paul says he's "the only U.S. veteran on the stage tonight."

3. Sad-face Newt is asked about the Marianne interview and "open marriage." Newt's "appalled that [John King] would begin a debate on a topic like that." We all "know personal pain." To bring up this subject is "despicable." He's "astounded" that CNN would begin a debate with "trash like that." And don't try to blame ABC. "I am tired of the elite media protecting Barack Obama by attacking Republicans."

4. Do the others think Gingrich's past personal failings are an issue? Santorum believes in forgiveness, both from a religious and an American political perspective. Romney: "John, let's get on to the real issues. That's all I've got to say." Paul is proud that his "wife of 54 years is with me tonight."

5. Romney is going to defend capitalism. And: "We're going to stuff it down [Obama's] throat."

6. (My son John is live-blogging here.) Much attention to the subject of returning veterans.

7. If we repeal Obamacare, what happens to the people with pre-existing conditions and young people who are able to be on their parents' insurance to the age of 26? The important thing is to get rid of Obamacare, Romney says, but "we'll make it work" — through markets. Gingrich says the way to help young people is through jobs. Santorum says Romney and Gingrich don't "present the clear contrast" to Obamacare (because of their health-care activities in the past — "playing footsies with the left").

8. Romney contrasts Romneycare to Obamacare and takes credit for having shown he cares. He Romneycares. Santorum lights into him. "You don't draw a distinction that's going to be effective for us."

9. Gingrich says: "I was wrong and I figured it out. You were wrong and you didn't." Santorum's all: It took you 12 years. Not good enough!

10. Ron Paul — he's the doctor — wants to talk about the larger issue government involvement in  medicine, which even Santorum has supported. All the programs will go bankrupt, he says.

11. Santorum "Newt's a friend. I love him. But at times, you've just got sort of that worrisome moment that something's gonna pop and we can't afford that in a nominee. We need someone... I'm not the most flamboyant" — hmmm — "and I don't get the biggest applause lines here, but I'm steady, I'm solid, I'm not going to go out and do things that you're going to worry about." Meade says "It sounds like he's trying to talk his dad into giving him the keys to the car."

12. I say: "Santorum's on fire." Then: "He is flamboyant."

13. Santorum plays the "I was there card" against Newt. In Congress, Gingrich "was thrown out by the conservatives... I knew what the problems were. It was an idea a minute. No discipline. No ability to be able to pull things together." Santorum takes credit for "blowing the lid" off a scandal that Gingrich knew about and did nothing about for 12 years.

14. Gingrich defends himself, which sets up a careful statement by Romney about how we need someone who hasn't spent most of his career in Congress. Romney professes amusement at the way Gingrich takes credit for so much that happened during the Reagan administration, but Reagan's autobiography only mentions Gingrich once.

15. Lots of talk about releasing tax records. Romney does a much better job of talking about the subject than he did at the last debate. His best point: He's not ashamed of his success in business.

16. A question about SOPA. Gingrich: "You're asking a conservative about the economic interests of Hollywood." Let the copyright holders pursue their own remedies. Romney: "The law as written is far too... threatening to freedom of speech." It would have a depressing effect on the internet. "I'm standing for freedom." Ron Paul: "I was the first Republican... to oppose this law." Santorum opposes the law but thinks the rights of copyright holders should be protected, and the government does have a role. "I'm for free [sic] but... property rights should be respected."

17. If you had your campaign to do over, what would you do differently? Gingrich would throw out all the "regular consultants" and forget about trying to figure out how to be a "normal candidate." He'd go straight for his big ideas and he'd use the internet to get them out. Romney would work harder to get 25 more votes in Iowa "that's for sure." More seriously, he'd have spent less time talking about other Republicans and more talking about Barack Obama. Santorum wouldn't change a thing. He's amazed at his own success, which was "an affirmation to me of the great process we have." Ron Paul would speak "a little slower" and improve his message delivery.

If you watched tonight's debate... who won?

pollcode.com free polls 


mesquito said...

Aye you saying I need to start watching these goddam things?

Sprezzatura said...

"Hang out here."

Obviously this is the place to be.

Where else will an analyst equate the hair color of a speaker to the content of their comments?

Drinking game ideas?

Sprezzatura said...

Newt says "extraordinary" = drink

Palladian said...

I need to drink to listen to anything Newt says.

Crunchy Frog said...

Looks like the Hag Bomb backfired (just like the Schwarzenegger Gropegate did, courtesy of the LAT). If I was married to her, I'd damn sure want out too...

wv: nerspit

Sprezzatura said...

Drink if Romney proves Krugman's right by:

attacking Obama for apologizing for America, which he didn’t, on making deep cuts in defense, which he also didn’t, and on being a radical redistributionist who wants equality of outcomes...

Paul states he's for decriminalizing drugs and/or prostitution = drink

Santorum says he won Iowa = drink

Lyssa said...

I haven't watched one in a while, because I've been crazy busy with work. I still am, but got through the worst of it today.

Now that Perry's out, I can whole-heartedly root for Romney. Gingrich, Santorum, and Paul are all unacceptable in my eyes (though I'd still give them McCain-style grudging support if they face off against Obama, of course). (I'd still consider voting 3rd party if it's not Romney, in protest, but that's only because I live in a very not-swing state.)

WV: joycat

Beta Rube said...

Crunchy is right. The rantings of a bitter ex who looks like she got hit in the face by a bag of nickels carries no weight.

Maybe Newt will wonder aloud why the same crew that covered for Edwards is delighting in bringing up old news about him.

Palladian said...

... of course I've had to drink continuously for the last 4 years to bear the current occupant of the White House, so...

edutcher said...

The real question is can Newt have a night as good as he had Monday and will Milton be better prepped?

Newt has to have Herman Cain-level performances from now on.

Crunchy Frog said...

Looks like the Hag Bomb backfired (just like the Schwarzenegger Gropegate did, courtesy of the LAT). If I was married to her, I'd damn sure want out too...

Maybe, but remember, a lot of people are watching female turnout. This is the state recently governed by Mark Sanford and, as I saw on another blog, "people are all out of forgive" down there.

pbAndjFellowRepublican said...

Drink if Romney proves Krugman's right by:

attacking Obama for apologizing for America, which he didn’t, on making deep cuts in defense, which he also didn’t, and on being a radical redistributionist who wants equality of outcomes...

In other words, the truth.

garage mahal said...

Yea Obama: he's, well....you know! He's, well, done..... duh! Garble garble.... arrrrrghh.

Oh that's right. Something with light bulbs!

Sprezzatura said...

Drink if any candidate talks about a tax cut plan that increases the deficit.

Triple drink if they blast BHO for deficit spending w/in ten seconds of discussing their deficit increasing tax plan.


Palladian, at least on election day you were drinking in style.

BTW, what's your current go to choice?

mesquito said...

I predict that tomorrow at least one of the candidates will be found to have said something racist.

Toad Trend said...

"Maybe, but remember, a lot of people are watching female turnout. This is the state recently governed by Mark Sanford and, as I saw on another blog, "people are all out of forgive" down there."

Maybe. What ex-spouse doesn't throw their 'ex' under the bus? Incredibly tedious and predictable and the timing is not coincidental. Yeah, politics is dirty, so are your uncle Jerry's magazines that he hid under the bed.

I think people are tiring of double standards and there is alot at stake in this election.

I'm not so sure 'Milton' has it in him to go 15 rounds with the dem destruction machine and their accomplices in the MSM.

I think Newt or Santorum would be better choices to trade blows with the destroyer-in-chief. We shall see.

edutcher said...

pbAndjFellowRepublican said...

Drink if any candidate talks about a tax cut plan that increases the deficit.

Since cutting taxes increases revenue, unlike raising them, the deficit would tend to fall when the money came in.

Funny how that works out.

You can always catch PB&J in a lie because he always tells the same ones.

chickelit said...

@Pj: Sorry, I stopped giving Krugman after he stoked AlphaLibera's theory. link

And didn't he publish a column of screed once which disappeared?

Sprezzatura said...


how much will revenue be increased if we cut taxes to zero?

Palladian said...

"BTW, what's your current go to choice?"

Well, someone gave me a bottle of Ardbeg (which I love) for Christmas, so I've been drinking that, and I always have some Laphroaig around, along with my usual gin drinks.

Tonight, it's pink gins.

Sprezzatura said...


He took a huge hit in my mind after I read that Return of Depression Econ book (the old version from quite a while back). It made predictions that turned out to be wrong (I read it a bit after it was published, so I knew how things turned out).

garage mahal said...

I'm Mitt Romney, I'm married, and I fuck my wife!

Lyssa said...

Damn, whoever gave Newt that opening must really be in his camp. Talk about giving him a great opening.

chickelit said...

Sounds like garage has already been drinking!

garage mahal said...

Get government out of the way!


I'm Full of Soup said...


Drinking continually for 4 years? But Obama has only been in office for exactly 3 years tomorrow.

garage mahal said...


Repeal something.


[going to be a long night]

edutcher said...

pbAndjFellowRepublican said...


how much will revenue be increased if we cut taxes to zero?

I don't recall anyone talking about ending taxation unless that's going to be the Lefties' last desperation ploy to win the election?

Robert Cook said...

Is it really in doubt any longer? The Republican candidate will be Mitt Romney. Was there ever really much doubt?

garage mahal said...


chickelit said...

@garage: Hush. We must not let in daylight upon Solyndra's magic.

caplight45 said...

Slightly off topic. Watched Fox news for the first time in a year to catch up on the Marianne Gingrich thing. Hadn't seen Shep Smith in over a year. He looks horrible. Gaunt and aged.

First debate I've watched.

Heather said...

Palin didn't endorse Newt as much as she said, “don't let Romney run away with the primary”.

I really don't see much difference issue wise between Romney and Newt. Romney has the discipline that Newt lacks. Newt has the passion and street fighter mentality that Romney lacks.

Revenant said...

The Republican candidate will be Mitt Romney. Was there ever really much doubt?

Sure there was. He was the presumptive candidate, certainly, but once upon a time so was Hillary Clinton.

I'm Full of Soup said...

I am concervative and from Penna and I can't figure out how that whiny pussy Santorum ever got elected to anything.

Revenant said...

Since cutting taxes increases revenue

Not really.

Cutting taxes AND spending provides economic stimulus, which over time improves the revenues you'll get from those new, lower tax rates.

But in the short term, revenues fall. And if you finance the tax cuts with borrowing, there's little more of a stimulative effect then there is when the government borrows money and spends it -- the borrowing crowds out other investment.

The only time revenues rise from reduced rates if if the original rates are on the wrong end of the Laffer curve. Ours aren't, and haven't been since at least WW2.

MadisonMan said...

I can't figure out how that whiny pussy Santorum ever got elected to anything.

Who did he run against?

Must've been someone far worse.

sakredkow said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
bagoh20 said...

"Drink if Romney proves Krugman's right"

What is this an AA meeting?

Oh yea, I guess it is.

Masscon said...

Whats with the music on CNN am I watching UFC or a debate on the next leader of our country

Writ Small said...

Romney is so much improved versus the last debate. He has taken several pages from the Newt debate playbook and it has really upped his game. Santorum seems to have realized this, too, is is coming across so angry. It's all slipping away. His skin is shiny from sweat. Fighting mad, he is.

It is really down to Newt and Romney.

Lyssa said...

I don't care a bit about tax returns, but Romney seems like he's flailing here. I'm not following his logic.

I'm Full of Soup said...

Romney is smart to plan to put all his returns out at one time.

Newt made $3.1 Million in 2010. I would like to know how much was drawn from the Beltway govt teat.

ricpic said...

Hadn't seen Shep Smith in a year. He looks horrible. Gaunt and aged.

Agreed. AIDS?

shiloh said...

Santorum was elected to the senate in the 1994 Rep wave election. He received 49.4% against Harris Wofford, who was recently appointed to the position in 1991.

carry on

Jose_K said...

Newt. Rubio 2012

Jim said...

Funny, I thought Romney was worse on the tax returns tonight, not better. Very slick and phony. Chris Christie is right, he should get them all out now.

traditionalguy said...

Mr Cardboard Man is stiffening up on the simple Tax release of returns issue. That is surprising, but it shows Romney's mental scope of handling problems that he hasn't planned to the T.

Mitt is saying that bad Government is the problem, and that therefore we need a President with less experience in working to restrain bad government.

Newt replies that Jimmy Cater was bad government, but that putting in Reagan's good government era is what gave Tycoon Romney the chance to become wealthy. Then Romney sneers at that idea.

Frankly Romney is an asshole. He is just like the "Lawyer Haters" who blame the lawyers in the very legal system that creates their chance to deal in private property rights and become wealthy as if they are geniuses like him.

After 40 years of helping such arrogant assholes use the legal system to steal from lesser represented people, I cannot stand hearing that attitude that lawyers and good government leaders are the problem. He is just another in a long line of envious, anal retentive dickheads who claims to be unbeatable. Well I have beat a few of them.

He wont get my vote.

Sprezzatura said...

Althouse tells us that Romney did a much better job re taxes this time.


I guess that it's possible he wasn't expecting this question last time. But, how can he not have a preformed, coherent answer this time? In fact there should have been a "zinger" ready to launch, in addition to a strong answer. But, no. Just flailing.

I don't get it. The guy is constantly spewing the same canned lines, why no lines re taxes?

I have a theory. In this situation his words would be tied to actually DOING something. The Romneybot is only programmed to do words, i.e. to blather. When it comes time to actually act, where there will be consequences: the system melts down.

sakredkow said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
ricpic said...

Romney: We're gonna stuff it down Obama's throat.

Wait, isn't that Reggie Love's job?

LilyBart said...

Either the media should dig through everybody's 'trash' or stick to the topical issues. What bothers me is the double standard of digging through the Republican's trash - but going easy on the democrats?

The media didn't seem to want to talk about Obama's rather troubling real estate transaction (purchase of his Chicago Mansion). I know enough about Real Estate to know that that transaction looked (ethically) bad.

Nathan Alexander said...

@ Revenant:
Keynes theory is thoroughly discredited.

We absolutely are on the reduced revenue side of the Laffer curve.

Comparing our tax rates to WWII is ignorant...loopholes and perks and different implementation of property taxes made taxes before, say, 1970 completely different than now.

But I'm impressed with how confident you sound announcing complete nonsense as if it were fact.

ricpic said...

Shiloh tells us all to "carry on." Yes, we would gladly carry on without smug shiloh and his ilk but THEY WILL NOT TAKE THE HINT and exit the premises.

Nathan Alexander said...

Personally, I'm fine w/ Romney as President. He's not my first choice, but the President will matter much, much less than getting conservative control of the Senate and increasing the conservative majority in the House.

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

"You're asking a conservative about the economic interests of Hollywood."

Wow. And lol.

Even though Gingrich would sink a national ticket quicker than Goldwater, and is as abrasive as sandpaper on a hemorrhoid, he does come up with some awesome, direct, and pointed lines.

As my whimsy leads me.. said...

Watching the four of them reminds me of the Belmont Stakes after the Derby and the Preakness have dashed the dreams of the other horse owners.


Peter Hoh said...

Gingrich wants to turn the primary into a referendum on the media gettin' all up in his business.

Sprezzatura said...

Is it just me, or does the con to non-con ratio seem odd in this thread?

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Well, one thing you can say about the Republicans: They will certainly go out with a bang. Thank Jezebel Gingrich got into this thing. They may not know how to govern, but they have certainly ridden the wave of the televised entertainment era all the way to the shore. The only thing left for them to do is to change the symbol from an elephant to a beached whale.

edutcher said...

The Republicans govern just fine.

Ritmo confuses them with the Obamatrons, who want to rule.

shiloh said...


ricpic is upset w/me because I corrected him in a previous thread.

Get over it!

btw, no need to shout little buddy.

traditionalguy said...

Phx..Yes it is very ironic which was my point. We are bound by our legal ethics to represent our client's interests.

But some clients are so self centered that they really believe they are entitled to buy you and your skills and that alone makes them smarter and better men.

It only makes them mistaken about the skill that was necessary to make them into winners...it was not theirs but was the professional's diligence that usually made the difference... other than their inborn deviousness skills in tricking widows and orphans into trusting them in bad deals.

mccullough said...

With only four candidates left, they each get more speaking time now. Newt's shrillness is very grating now that he speaks a lot more.

traditionalguy said...

Hi Ritmo. You always crack me up.

The beached whale would be a great campaign emblem for Newt. But beware of silver tongued beached whales

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Geez ed, I'm pretty sure that the average voter will be VERY interested in believing that your semantic quibbles matter to him.

In any event, never hire someone whose primary objective is to destroy the organization he says he'd like to lead. That kind of self-destruction is best left to self-immolating monks.

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Thanks for having a sense of humor, TradGuy. Some of these folks here could sorely use one. Yes, I appreciate Newt's cracks and zingers. It's good that he's there to shake things up. And the point about Hollywood was true. Why should he care? At least when he's honest, he can often get to the lingering point, the elephant in the room, that no one else sees. Some of the time, at least. Whatever other faults he has, which I'm not excusing.

edutcher said...

Note Ritmo ducks the question.


shiloh said...

"Note Ritmo ducks the question."

edutcher, most rational folk ignore you altogether. But some of us have empathy! :)

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Note that eductcher's too dense to realize that voters don't care about his question!

Not surprised!

Writ Small said...

Found something to cheer from each guy up there.

Only Santorum thought to put in a word about intellectual property rights? OK, the law is clearly bad, but so is ripping off artists. Also, his "made it to the final four" speech was pretty moving. I don't know about his strategy of attacking everyone. That's a tough sell.

Paul has really grown on me through this campaign. He makes the debate more interesting by his economic ideas, and having a really ideals-based philosophy. Never going to vote for the guy because of his defense stance, but I can't help like the guy. His kick the abortion back to the states was right on. His "overly sensitive" comment to Santorum, however, was devastating.

Newt was fantastic per usual. Of course the questions about Newt, on which Santorum surprisingly kept punching Newt in the sensitive areas, don't relate to his debate skills.

Romney was much improved. If this performance had been the last debate, he wouldn't be trailing Newt in SC. Unashamedly defending success and the free market - finally!

Still, I think Newt probably wins SC and three go to Florida.

pm317 said...

Everybody thinks they need Newt because he will be great in debate against Obama. What makes them think Obama will agree to many debates? What makes them think that is all that is required of a Republican candidate? Also, did anybody see how great Hillary was in debates in 2008 (with one hand tied behind her back) and how the media protected Obama?

AmPowerBlog said...

I think Romney won, but here's the video of Newt response to his wife's allegations: 'Does Angry Bellowing Help Newt Gingrich in South Carolina's Primary?'

pm317 said...

Newt and Santorum are on Greta. Where is Romney?

Chip Ahoy said...

how much will revenue be increased if we cut taxes to zero?

That is an incredibly stupid question. If you are invoking Laffer then you already know the answer is the same answer as when you tax at 100%.

garage mahal said...

Invoke Laffer? Or laughter?

Supply-Side Hero Arthur Laffer Sued for Hyping Ponzi Scheme

Sprezzatura said...


I think that they both did CNN too. But, not Romney.


Hillary was a very flawed candidate. Beyond some amazing investments in Arkansas, running the disastrous HC reform, authoring legislation to name a Post Office, and dodging bullets in Bosnia, she did very little.


Cons forget that there is a left side of the Laffer curve. That is, if you believe the theory, there are also rates that are below the most efficient tax rate.

Not that I'm in favor of being at the most efficient tax rate, I'd like to be below that.

traditionalguy said...

The Newt meme at CNN is Saint-orum's label of Newt as Grandiose.

The Obama networks are injecting mental illness as Newt's problem and trying out one idea after another.

Maybe Newt is autistic... or a high functioning asschaser or something.

Finally CNN's panel admitted that Romney is a doubles hitter, Saint-orum hit a triple tonight, but only Newt always swings for the fences and hits it out unless he whiffs.

The labeled him The Babe Ruth of politics. That is actually very perceptive on many levels. Ruth and Gingrich seem to have had similar struggles through life and both are braggarts.

But in the immortal words of Deon Sanders, " It ain't bragging if you can do actually it."

The Great White beached whale is swimming again and the theme from Jaws is playing.

pm317 said...

pbAndjFellowRepublican said..

Put a sock in it about Hillary. Everyone knows how Obama had to be carried over the finish line. Hillary, flawed candidate, my foot. There are millions including Republicans who are wishing that she was the one winning in 2008.

I have not followed your comments but vaguely remember others jumping on you for taking the Dem side. If you are a Dem, shame on you for repeating the rightwing talking points on Hillary.

pm317 said...

The Obama networks are injecting mental illness as Newt's problem and trying out one idea after another.

Obama will (at least try to) destroy Newt with this line of attack. Then again, Newt may be more ready (than Romney) to spill secrets about Obama so carefully protected by the media. So it will be a bloodbath.

edutcher said...

Interesting. First shiloh and Ritmo flatter themselves and the rest of the Lefties by trying to stake a specious claim on rationality.

Then they want to ignore the difference between governing and ruling by saying nobody cares.

Lots of people care.

Otherwise, they wouldn't spend their time here denouncing the Democrats.

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Lol. Then they can have her, pm. She started out in life as a bitter Republican, and never got over her fascist tendencies or her petty grievances -- probably starting with the memories of her asshole of a father. In case it wasn't evident. Plus, she's as flimsy with straight answers as Romney.

So basically, as relative with the truth as Romney, and as mean and bitter as Gingrich.

I can see why you think she's your type.

GetReal said...

Newt's little hissy fit about questions regarding his marriage was completely ridiculous. That fat asshole spent how many years making someone else's marital problems the central topic in American politics? Not to mention that he's a pasty bag of crap that virtually pioneered the field of attack dog politics.

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Does anyone know what edutcher's trying to say?

My redneck-to-English translation device is out of batteries.

Cedarford said...

Thought Romney did well. The disappointment with Romney is that he is not the neck vein bulging rabblerouser amping up the Rep rubes in the audience with insincere populist red meat and the perfect "zinger". But that is his promise - calm, competent, not going to push the button if some Chinese leader slights him at a meeting. Will not give 101 great ideas like Newt, but will only give 11. The difference is Newt will not deliver on 99 of the 101 great ideas, while Romney will work all 11 and succeed in implimenting 9 of them.

Santorum had some very good moments grilling Newt, but then he got all excitable and sweating and was stepping it it with a lame attempt to hit Romney on RTL and Ron Paul.

Ron Paul is like Herman Cain to me. I like him. I also don't want him in the Oval Office.

We will see how Newts attempt to blame the media for his marital problems and covering his wife's interviews plays out. If South Carolina voters are steered off Newts ethics and morality problems simply by pointing the finger at "The Media Elites".

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Great. The Nazi's with Romney and has points to award for everybody. But he wouldn't vote for the black guy, who dropped out anyway. Now that the blog has finally heard from our resident Stormfront.com commentator, the evening is complete.

traditionalguy said...

@ Getreal....Good shot. But you are not up to date. Newt's repulsiveness and lustful habits are the everyday accusations that fit most men.

The meme of the campaign is Newt's mental illness. Try to add to that.

Newt has a temper, as CNN and Romney can attest to.

Newt thinks Grandiose ideas, and he really means them.

Newt don't care. He is a political honeybadger.

Newt frightens most women. And strangely, he frightens Mitt Romney too. Mitt the frugal man just spent four million dollars in one week slandering Newt to the edge of political death in Iowa of all places.

Newt would rather keep two women and not divorce either of them. That even frightens reformed Mormons over at the Temple in Salt Lake City

Newt don't care.


Sprezzatura said...

"while Romney will work all 11 and succeed in implimenting 9 of them. "

Will he work at them w/ the same effectiveness he's displayed as he's working w/ the only non-verbal promise aspect of his campaign, i.e. releasing his tax returns?

How did you like his reason for not disclosing the tax returns today: that the Ds could use the information against him? Does that make voters more or less worried that there could be something damaging in there?

Do you think that he'll succeed in passing his tax cut that adds $600 billion to our deficit?

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Best summary of Newt's contribution to the debate: "Gingrich: Obama is a dangerous Alinsky Manchurian candidate who can only be stopped by my world-historical genius."

edutcher said...

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Does anyone know what edutcher's trying to say?

My redneck-to-English translation device is out of batteries.

Ritmo plays dumb.

He does it so well.

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Do you think Newtie gave himself a stiffie when he told the reporter to stay out of his (three-way) affairs?

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

Let's see if the dialectizer can make sense out of what edumacutcher (Ashton Kutcher?) is trying to say:

Interestin'. Fust shiloh an' Ritmo flatter themselves an' th' ress of th' Lef'ies by tryin' t'stake a specious claim on rashunality.

Then they be hankerin' t'igno'e th' difference between govahnin' an' rulin' by sayin' nobody cares.

Lots of varmints care.

Otherwise, they'dn't spend their time hyar denouncin' th' Democrats.

Sprezzatura said...


Both Romney and Gingrich new that they were going to be grilled about a particular issue, taxes and whoring respectively.

Obviously Newt had the more difficult problem. So, why did he hit it out of the park while Romney flailed w/ his much simpler issue?

Did Romney convince you that the specifics of Romneycare add up to a good health care program?

Sprezzatura said...

new or knew

LilEvie said...

Romney's note to self: never let the word "maybe" cross your lips.

The rest of the debate he was on fire, defending Bain, Robama care, states caring for veterans, and he even got in some humor. Pales only in comparison to the superheated Newt.

wv: nobil - you betcha!

gadfly said...

So -- Althouse, are you watching Nightline now?

I don't suppose that anyone will ask Marianne about her buddy, Sarkis Soghanalian, the arms dealer.

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

If Newt had just torn off his clothes, charged the reporter, chased him across the auditorium, and rassled him the floor, I think he'd have made his point just as easily.

Do not get in between a man and his three-ways.

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

I'm not offended by old, white, fat, Southern people either, Colonel.

I just never knew that three-way sex was such a big hit with them.

Ritmo Re-Animated said...

These Republican debates practically write themselves.

Writ Small said...

Obviously Newt had the more difficult problem. So, why did he hit it out of the park while Romney flailed w/ his much simpler issue?

Good point.

Funny, though, that everyone up there admitted that as of the last debate - just a few days ago - none of the guys hitting Romney over releasing his return had released theirs. What a bunch of poseurs.

Newt was smart enough get his released - procrastinating college student style - a few minutes prior to the next debate. Santorum was reduced to saying he couldn't get to his home computer. Weak.

So yeah, Newt hit home run on the on the open marriage thing, but the Romney tax story is done. Newt just won round one. The media are by no means done with him.

Michael Haz said...

I listened to the debate on satellite radio while driving in far northern Wisconsin.

Hearing the audio, not seeing the video makes a big difference. It sounded like there, sometimes four, candidates were serious, thoughtful, and focused.

Newt body slammed the Marianne question and John King at the same time. That answer may have propelled him into the lead in SC.

Mitt seemed calmly in command...until he waffled and muffed the income tax return question. A better answer would have been "I'll release my income tax returns one day after President Obama releases his college transcripts."

Santorum sounded thoughtful and serious, and at times clearly bested Mitt and Newt. I think he moved form 'junior partner' to 'full partner'.

Ron Paul was entertaining, if nothing else. He has good ideas intermixed with crazy in just the right proportion to keep himself in the primaries a while longer.

It sounded like Romney slipped a little, Gingrich and Santorum gained a little, and Paul continues to circle Mars.

William said...

Gingrich successfully attacked the CNN reporter, but he did not successfully defend his marital record. It is what it is, and lots of people, e.g. me, will hold it against him. Santorum is ok, but he seems too earnest and sincere. Too much choirboy in his persona. I like Ron Paul a great deal, and I like him more after each debate. But I've never been tempted to vote for him. For me, Romney won the debate not by the force of his arguments or the magnetism of his personality but simply because he looks like the smartest, safest grown up in the room.

Sprezzatura said...

Do any of the Romney fans feel like his references to the text of his 2010* book is weak proof that he's truly dedicated to his current flops, rather than his earlier flips? I noticed him use this tactic at least twice tonight.

What is the proof that he's dedicated to his current immigration POV: it's in his book.

What is the proof that he's dedicated to his current abortion POV: it's in his book.

If only Kerry had written his flops in a book he would have been okay.

*Technically he'll only refer to the newer version. The one that doesn't include the health care line that suggested accomplishing the same thing for everyone in the country.

Mr. Romney’s aides have said the book was merely updated to reflect the “climate” of politics in early 2011, including the passage of Mr. Obama’s health care legislation. Nothing to see.

Sprezzatura said...

Romney paraphrase:

Vote for me because I have a book that carefully says what I thought you wanted to hear. And, don't forget that I made sure that my gardeners were legal because I knew that would look good too.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Everybody thinks they need Newt because he will be great in debate against Obama. What makes them think Obama will agree to many debates?


Obama merely has to say that he is much too busy to debate. Or that there is some sort of manufactured, suddenly important, event that precludes him from debating.

Shorter Obama....you can't make me. You ain't the boss of me!

There is no guarantee of an Obama anybody debate match up.

But....it would be a spectacle to behold. Obama the master of um ah um, debating Gingrich who rarely, if ever, uses interjections to take up space in the mental to verbal process.

It would be a thing of beauty.

Writ Small said...

"My own preference would be to let each state fashion its own program to meet the distinct needs of its citizens. States could follow the Massachusetts model of they choose, or they could develop plans of their own. These plans, tested in the state 'laboratories of democracy' could be evaluated, compared, improved upon, and adopted by others. But the creation of a national plan is the direction in which Washington is currently moving. If a national approach is ultimately adopted, we should permit individuals to purchase insurance from companies in other states in order to expand choice and competition.

"What we accomplished surprised us: 440,000 people who previously had no health insurance became insured, many paying their own way. We made it possible for each newly insured person to have better care, and ultimately healthier and longer lives. From now on, no one in Massachusetts has to worry about losing his or her health insurance if there is a job change or a loss in income; everyone is insured and pays only what he or she can afford. It's portable, affordable health insurance — something people have been talking about for decades. We can accomplish the same thing for everyone in the country, and it can be done without letting government take over health care."

Here's the full text of the original, hard-cover Romney book. In the second edition, he modified the last sentence to minimize the bit about it being a model for everyone. Fair enough. He backpedaled in a direction more acceptable to Republicans not happy with Obamacare.

But read the entire two paragraphs. He is making an argument entirely consistent with federalism and states rights. Most any conservative would find almost nothing objectionable as originally written - in full context. You try things out at the states to find out what works and what doesn't. Mass was an experiment. Obamacare - nationalizing the solution before the experimentation is done - is a disaster. That's why Romney can support his own state plan (which I do not) and be opposed to Obamacare. Not seeing the problem.

el polacko said...

does anybody doubt that newt would tear obama a new one in debate ? my fear though is that newt could come off/be painted as a 'typically mean' republican and give obama some sympathy votes. i also wonder if newt's take-no-prisoners debate style would translate well into the presidency. between his ego and his predilection for 'going off' he might be more difficult to deal with than we would like. on the other hand, romney's congenial, businesslike demeanor can seem robotic and dull but may serve us well in the oval office, assuming that he can make his case against obama impressively enough to get him there. i'm standing at the crossroads, wondering which way to go.

Alex said...

Romney: We're gonna stuff it down Obama's throat.

Finally we have a streetfighter to take on the thug occupier in the White House.

Alex said...

guys - I told you garage would be insufferable until Walker beats the recall. He's going to show up here blasted drunk night after night. Garage - please don't get cirrhosis.

Alex said...

Ritmo obviously hates white southerners but then I guess he might approve of the Michigan-er Romney. After all, he's solid Midwesterner.

Revenant said...

Keynes theory is thoroughly discredited.

We absolutely are on the reduced revenue side of the Laffer curve.

Three points about those two sentences:

1. They are unrelated to one another.

2. The first sentence is, in addition, unrelated to anything I wrote.

3. The second sentence is hilariously wrong. Tax revenues have never, in living memory, gone up in response to a tax cut. Oh, they *eventually* go up, but they do that following tax hikes, too -- historically, our economy tends to grow no matter what Congress gets up to.

Revenant said...

Obama merely has to say that he is much too busy to debate. Or that there is some sort of manufactured, suddenly important, event that precludes him from debating.

There's also the little fact that the "Gingrich will rule in debates" plan only works if (a) Gingrich really is good in debates and (b) the public cares. If both of these things were true, wouldn't Gingrich be doing better than 27%?

So far Gingrich has done quite well debating Republicans, in front of pro-Republican viewers. But remember the last time he had to win over the nation as a whole with his arguments? Yeah, me too -- Bill Clinton kicked his ass up one side of Washington and down the other for most of the 1990s.

Astro said...

"If we repeal Obamacare, what happens to the people with pre-existing conditions..."

... Obamacare did nothing to help me get medical insurance for my wife, who has a pre-existing condition, once COBRA ran out.
I'm now convinced that accepting company-sponsored health care is a bad idea, in the long run. Best just to buy your own health insurance directly and not have to worry what would happen when you lose your job.