August 9, 2007

"Meat is no longer murder.... meat is strategy."

To attract men -- it's all about attracting men! -- women now eat -- look out, it's a NYT Style piece! -- steak!
Ms. Wilkie was a vegetarian in her teens, and even wore a “Meat Is Murder” T-shirt. But by her 30s, she had started eating cow. By the time she placed the personal ad, she had come to realize that ordering steak on a first date had the potential to sate appetites not only of the stomach but of the heart.

Red meat sent a message that she was “unpretentious and down to earth and unneurotic,” she said, “that I’m not obsessed with my weight even though I’m thin, and I don’t have any food issues.” She added, “In terms of the burgers, it said I’m a cheap date, low maintenance.”

Salad, it seems, is out. Gusto, medium rare, is in.

Restaurateurs and veterans of the dating scene say that for many women, meat is no longer murder. Instead, meat is strategy. “I’ve been shocked at the number of women actually ordering steak,” said Michael Stillman, vice president of concept development for the Smith & Wollensky Restaurant Group, which opened the restaurant Quality Meats in April 2006 on West 58th Street. He said Quality Meats’ contemporary design and menu, including extensive seafood offerings, were designed to attract more women than a traditional steakhouse. “But the meat is appealing to them, much more than what I saw two or three years ago at our other restaurants,” Mr. Stillman said. “They are going for our bone-in sirloin and our cowboy-cut rib steak.”
Let me number my thoughts:

1. Is one of the "concepts" Mr. Stillman has "developed" getting newspapers to run articles that promote steak restaurants to women? He's already got the steak restaurant designed for women, based on what looks like the longstanding problem of women shunning steak restaurants and thinking men who pick them as the site for a date aren't very considerate.

2. I can attest to the fact that editors have been telling women for decades that men will find them appealing if they eat with "gusto." I'm sure I read this dating advice in Glamour and Mademoiselle back in the 1960s. Don't pick at your food. Demonstrate your joie de vivre and your sexual prowess with enthusiastic cheeseburger gnawing.

3. "Bone-in sirloin and our cowboy-cut rib steak" -- don't forget the bone. Symbolic messaging via steak works best with the bone in.

4. Order the onion rings too. They will drive him mad with passion. That's not in the article. That's just my advice, girls. Women who stress heathy veggies... they're not as womanly as you.

4. Is Stillman related to Dr. Irwin Stillman, author of "The Doctor's Quick Weight Loss Diet," the 1967 book that was all about dieting by eating only protein. You couldn't even eat any starches, any fruits or vegetables -- not even lettuce -- and the only cheese permitted was cottage cheese or farmer's cheese, but you could eat all the fish and meat you wanted. So if you want to go out for a nice dinner, you know where you have to go: a steakhouse.

5. "I’m not obsessed with my weight even though I’m thin" -- I'm sure that's true of Ms. Wilkie, but I'm also sure that's what all the anorexics say.

Back to the article:
In an earlier era, conventional dating wisdom for women was to eat something at home alone before a date, and then in company order a light dinner to portray oneself as dainty and ladylike. For some women, that is still the practice. “It’s better not to have a jalapeño fajita plate, especially on the first date,” said Andrea Bey, 28, who sells video surveillance equipment in Irving, Tex., and describes herself as “curvy.” “You don’t want to be labeled as ‘princess gassy’ on the first date.”

But others, especially those who are thin, say ordering a salad displays an unappealing mousiness.
Yeah, the fat girls -- you can find them in Texas -- are only worried about farting. The thin girls -- who are not equipment salespersons but editors -- have higher level strategic thinking:
“It seems wimpy, insipid, childish,” said Michelle Heller, 34, a copy editor at TV Guide. “I don’t want to be considered vapid and uninteresting.”

Ordering meat, on the other hand, is a declarative statement, something along the lines of “I am woman, hear me chew.”
You have to be thin but disguise all the traits that keep you thin. Chomp into that meat -- it's a great way to say you're interesting.
In fact, red meat on a date has become such an effective statement of self-acceptance that even a vegetarian like Sloane Crosley, a publicist at Random House, sometimes longs to order a burger.

“Being a vegetarian puts you at a disadvantage,” Ms. Crosley said. “You’re in the most basic category of finicky. Even women who order chicken, it isn’t enough.” She said she has thought of ordering shots of Jägermeister, famous for its frat boy associations, to prove that she is “a guy’s girl.”
"I am woman," indeed.
“Everyone wants to be the girl who drinks the beer and eats the steak and looks like Kate Hudson,” Ms. Crosley, 28, said.
The NYT can't recommend bulimia, but you must be living in some obscure town named Irving if you can't read between the lines there.
Not all red meat, apparently, is equal in the dating world. The mediums of steak and hamburger each send a different message. Dropping into conversation the fact that steaks of Kobe beef come from Wagyu cattle, but that not all steaks sold as Wagyu are Kobe beef, demonstrates one’s worldliness, said Gabriella Gershenson, a dining editor at Time Out New York. It holds the same currency today that being able to name Hemingway’s four wives held in an earlier era.
Wagyu. The boys love it when you say Wagyu. Wagyu.
Hamburgers, she added, say you are down-to-earth, which is why women rarely order those deluxe hamburgers priced as high as a porterhouse.

“They’re created for men who want to impress women, so they order the $60 burger, then they let the woman taste it,” Ms. Gershenson said. “The man gets to show off his expertise and show that he can afford it.”
The symbolism is complex, no? So the man has something the woman lacks, and there's something about it that will make her want to taste it, and he'll let her. But come on, where's the "expertise" here? The restaurant has hamburgers for men who want hamburgers, but you can't go to this place and not pay full price for the meal, so it's $60. The man is an "expert" at spending money. Now, the "concept development vice president" who gets the editors to repeat this theory, he's got some expertise.

The end of the article gets around to the subject of what women think of a man who wants to eat steak and quotes one woman saying, "It crosses my mind they’ll probably die early." The suggestion is that this is a bad thing: "Gentlemen, be careful. Real men, it seems, must eat kale." Like there aren't women who date rich old guys and think, good, he'll go quickly.


hdhouse said...

Then the question is do men find women who order a big slab of meet to attract men attractive? Is this a trait or a ploy or both?

May I have a hint of your email Ann Althouse? One can't write you with an issue without an email.

David said...

Pick up the bone and nibble on it, and you'll definitely get a second date. Crack it and suck out the marrow and you'll die alone.

Eat your onion rings slowly and lovingly and you'll get a proposal of marriage right then and there.

MadisonMan said...

Prof A, I really enjoy the way you dissect these ridiculous style pieces.

A kiss on the hand may be quite continental,
But Ribeye is a girl's best friend.
Tofu may be grand but it won't pay the rental....

vet66 said...

I expect some female vegans I know to order free-range zuccini when we are out for a meal. Political statements regarding food seems pretentious to me when most of the world goes to bed hungry every night.

Grilling the waiter about dolphin-free nets, free-range chicken, cramped calf pens, etc., is a testament to the Gatsby's among us who play the idle rich card in the religion of finicky.

Anonymous said...

Irving, Texas is a suburb of Dallas. Not terribly obscure, since it's the current home of the Dallas Cowboys, but I bet you don't watch much football.

Eva said...

Yes, but Irving is an undesirable suburb.

Roger J. said...

Professor A: thank you for reviewing the style section of the NYT so I dont have to wade thru it and parse it as you do so ably! It continues to be obvious why the NYT is decending in well deserved oblivion. What utter garbage--they must be working hard to fill their decreasing page size.

Ann Althouse said...

"May I have a hint of your email Ann Althouse? One can't write you with an issue without an email."

It's in the sidebar, as ever.

"I bet you don't watch much football."

Yeah, and damn, I should pretend I do, so men will love me.

Palladian said...

"Yeah, and damn, I should pretend I do, so men will love me."

As ever with "Style" (née Women's) section pieces, it's not about women who enjoy things like steak, it's about women who pretend they do in order to either attract men or in the case of other, similar articles, make other women jealous.

GPE said...

Dropping into conversation the fact that steaks of Kobe beef come from Wagyu cattle, but that not all steaks sold as Wagyu are Kobe beef, demonstrates one’s worldliness

Say what? Beef - it's what's for dinner. And it's that simple. Wagyu - it's what's in the fish tank when it needs to be cleaned.

Meade said...

If not tofu,
Babe, we'd have to hit the store,
Kale alone is really such a bore,
I'd have to make a roux,
If not tofu.

Victor said...

Steak eaters generally have bad breath. A not too pleasant body odor as well.

So, no not more attractive.

Palladian said...

"Dropping into conversation the fact that steaks of Kobe beef come from Wagyu cattle"

I would immediately get up and leave the restaurant if my dinner companion "dropped" something like that into the conversation.

Der Hahn said...

“Being a vegetarian puts you at a disadvantage,” Ms. Crosley said. “You’re in the most basic category of finicky. ...

bzzzzt, wrong answer.

Ordering a meal to make a political statement, impress your date, or any reason other than *you expect to enjoy the meal* makes you finicky, babe.

Justin said...

Mel said...

Irving, Texas is a suburb of Dallas.

Damn. You beat me to it.

I will never understand why residents of the Dallas-Ft. Worth metroplex insist on such specificity. It's Dallas. Even if you live in Irving or Richardson or Grapevine, it's all Dallas. I can understand if you're talking to someone from Arlington and want them to know what part of the metroplex you're live in. But if you're talking to the New York Times, it just makes you sound like a hick, hence Althouse's "obscure town" comment.

It's a pet peeve of mine.

amba said...

This is a great post. Why only nine comments?

Maybe because it leaves nothing left to say?

"The NYT cannot recommend bulimia ..." "Fat girls -- you can find them in Texas -- are only worried about farting ..."

Women are so ridiculous.

amba said...


Is that to the tune of "If Not For You"?

Skeptical said...

You say Irving instead of Dallas because it's a good ways from Dallas to Irving. If I live in Vienna, Virginia, or Rockville, Maryland, I'm not going to say I live in Washington, DC. It would be misleading. They're distinct places. Ditto with Irving and Dallas.

Hey said...

Skeptical: you're not being specific enough... there are all sorts of distinct places within Dallas!

Or you could admit that as you get further away, the less distinction that needs to be made. In your neighborhood you mention your corner, in your city you mention your neighborhood. Within the US, you mention your metro area or your state; while outside the US you might mention your state if it's big enough (Kalifornia...).

Melinda said...

So this is what I've got to look forward to now that I've been re-singularized: Learning "The Rules" from Smith & Wollensky.

Jeremy said...

Thanks for pointing me to what may be the dumbest thing I've read all week. Well, the dumbest published thing, at least.

ricpic said...

Trust me, men don't get all the nuances. Just wear a low cut dress.

Bender R said...

You chicks really do make this much harder than it needs to be.

Just order whatever the hell you want! You think any real guy cares or even notices what you are getting, other than to steal a bite or two if it is good?

It really isn't that tough.

oldirishpig said...

There is a great line in Hairspray, where Walken says to Travolta: "Babe, it took me five years to realize you were flirting!" If all this strategizing over a meal is really going on, I now know why I am happily single.

Kyle said...

The thing that everyone missed is that ordering food on a first date is one of the first indications of whether a girl is going to be "high maintenance" or "low maintenance."

If she orders a steak at first she'll probably be ok at a friend's barbeque or not seriously balk at a cheap diner or taco Bell at 3AM

Christy said...

I never saw much sense in ordering steak at a restaurant. It is the easiest thing in the world to fix at home. I'd rather order something I'm less likely to fix successfully at home. Meatloaf, for example. I've never ever cooked a meatloaf fit to eat. Maybe if I ground Kobe ....

KCFleming said...

Oh, just forget the menu-based strategery. It's much sexier to take a bite of his meal. Married now 23 years, and that still gets me.

But if what you want is food, order whatever you want. Just don't tell him why. Please. Just don't.

Peter Hoh said...

I can't keep my starlets straight, so I confused Kate Hudson for Kate Winslett, and was rather impressed that she -- Kate Winslett -- was being held up as having an ideal female form. I, for one, would rather be sharing steak with Ms. Winslett.

Note to Ms. Heller: Nothing says insipid like being a copy editor at TV Guide.

Joan said...

I love steak, and carbs kill me. If I want to stay slim, steak's what I should be eating.

All this strategizing and scheming over what a dinner order means -- I am so, so, so happy I'm not out there in the dating world. Way back when, I never made it that complicated. I've always liked food too much to give a thought to what my date would be thinking about what I ordered, except for not ordering the most expensive thing if he was picking up the tab.

Maxine Weiss said...

I can't imagine accepting money from complete strangers, in exchange for acts---whatever those acts may be. I'd feel so degraded.

The complete debasement of soliciting online funds, and then having to perform like a trained seal.

There is a name, we call a woman who accepts money from complete strangers...

Many years ago, I used to model dresses so that the men could see what they looked like on their wives.

But, that was a long time ago.

Doug said...

It was a decade back that women would smoke cigars to prove to men that they were the ideal "Something About Mary" kind of chick. A few years later, the lame trend was for women to act bicurious to turn men on, so they would make out with other women at the bar.

I don't think I am that unlike other men, I really do prefer authenticity to pretention, trickery, and phoniness.

Smilin' Jack said...

Ladies: if a man is paying the slightest atention to what you're eating, you need to undo another button.

Unknown said...

Interviewing single women for winning dining choices on first dates seems misplaced. Why not interview recently married women instead?

Anthony said...

Meat schmeat. Cleavage, a short skirt, and nice black high-heeled boots will do twice what chowing down on cow will.

Gedaliya said...

If God didn't want us to eat cows he wouldn't have made them out of steak.

Tibore said...

You know, I'd just laugh at this story if it weren't for semi-personal experience. One of my buddies a few years back was impressed with a previous girlfriend because, on one of their early dates, she not only ordered a steak but finished the whole damn thing.

All I remembered thinking was "This is sexy, how?".

But then again, I myself am oddly bothered by dates that hardly eat anything. It's like we go through the hassle of figuring out a restaurant that works best for both, but she still doesn't want to participate in the fun of eating. That's sort of a put-off. Some of the best conversations I've experienced have been over some of the best meals I've had, restaurant or no, and not trying to enjoy the restaurant is akin to not trying to enjoy the date. Things tend to go downhill from there.

Re: $60 burgers from Wagyu beef,

I would kill the chef that would stoop to such idiocy. I agree with Anthony Bourdain - either they're grinding the castoffs that nobody wants despite what sort of beef it is, or (if they use good cuts), they're taking the best textured, most tender, and highest priced meat out there and turning it into hamburger, destroying the qualities that make it famous. That's just stupid. Grind some choice chuck and sirloin; you can make a killer burger from just that, but for the love of God don't use semi to super expensive stuff like Wagyu! You are not getting anything extra from doing so.

Plus, if I ever blew 60 bucks on a damn burger, I'd expect my date to not only be unimpressed, but to pull out a gun and let me have it right there and then. Buying a $60 burger is being a poser. Buy the damn $99 porterhouse at the Chicago Chop House if you want to blow stupid amounts of money on meat, because you actually get something in return (maybe not $99 worth, not in my opinion, but you still get something good in exchange). But don't buy a $60 wagyu burger unless you want to be known as a damn stupid fool.

Oh, and what palladian, ricpic, bender, pogo, doug, jack, et. al. were obliquely getting at: Yes. Agreed. On a date, just order what you really want and be yourselves. Authenticity is what makes dates enjoyable, not trying to figure out what dish is going to turn me on. That just seems so... I dunno... calculating... If I ever picked up that a date was doing that, I don't know if I could enjoy being there at that point.

Oh, and Anthony: Hell yeah!

Smilin' Jack said...

...said Michelle Heller, 34, a copy editor at TV Guide. “I don’t want to be considered vapid and uninteresting.”

Well, if that's your purpose, I'm not sure just ordering a steak is going to be sufficient to overcome the TV Guide thing.

Roger J. said...

for the men who dont want to spend a bundle on a date's meal, date women who have had bariatric surgery. Really low cost dates.

KCFleming said...

I dunno, Smilin' Jack, copy-editing can be quite salacious, wanton even.

Wait. Not copy editing.
What was it?

Bissage said...

Take heed, oh my brethren!

Be not deceived by these cunning ladies, for one steak dinner does not a carnivore make.

Getteth thee a butt-sniffing dog.

For it is truly written, the nose knows.

GeorgeH said...

Victor said...
Steak eaters generally have bad breath. A not too pleasant body odor as well.

Only to a vegetarian.

Men want a carnal woman.
What could be simpler?

Christy said...

Remember Jennifer Beals eating lobster in "Flashdance?"

jeff said...

"“They’re created for men who want to impress women, so they order the $60 burger, then they let the woman taste it,” Ms. Gershenson said. “The man gets to show off his expertise and show that he can afford it.”"

Impress them that you're an idiot.

Kevin said...

So the man has something the woman lacks, and there's something about it that will make her want to taste it, and he'll let her.

You are having way too much fun with this, Ann!

knox said...

Wagyu. The boys love it when you say Wagyu. Wagyu.


knox said...

This was almost as good as the Greenwald deconstruction.

Revenant said...

This is somewhat off-topic, but I suspect those "Meet the Meat" ads you often have on your blog are counterproductive.

I think the picture is supposed to disgust us and make us question the beef industry, but that steak looks delicious to me.

KCFleming said...

My grandfather was a butcher during the Depression. They'd dress meat taken in during hunting season, make sausage, smoke ham, etc.. He had just a simple sign on his shop, like Pogo's Meats.

When my dad was in high school, he convinced Grandpa to put a bigger sign on the truck. My Dad painted the new sign to read
You can't beat our meat.

It took a little while for Grandpa to figure that out, and then nearly filet his son.

Freeman Hunt said...

I think the picture is supposed to disgust us and make us question the beef industry, but that steak looks delicious to me.

Same here. In fact, I didn't bother to read the ad for weeks, and I always thought the picture was advertising one of those mail order steak packed in dry ice places.

As to the article: The idea that women are just now eating steak is ridiculous. I've ordered medium rare steak since I was a child because that's what we ate at home. When I go out to dinner with my husband's family, every single female--young or old, single or married--orders steak. Big deal.

Anonymous said...

Pogo- funny, serious, and always on point in a perfectly worded way. Please write a book, will you?

Meat as strategy is just a variant of you are what you eat, women and men judging the other by menu selections. Nearly makes me not to want to date, again, but only almost. I’d much rather be considered over how I remove the spinach from between my teeth and judge him by how he tells or doesn’t tell me about such inconsequentials. Trusted, loving consideration is a million times sexier than contrivance and phony signalling via restaurant orders and the rest.

Steak is good, but bloody rare matters of the heart are more delicious.

Anonymous said...

"Bloody Rare Matters of the Heart" would have been the perfect title for the NYT piece.

Egg salad, ho!

Synova said...

I thought it was an iron thing.

My daughter begs for a steak when we're out, even when I've told the kids the plan is to make do with stuff from the appetizer menu (Going someplace more expensive than McDonald's and then not eating all the food purchased bothers me.) And I have to agree. It's not just that I like red meat, it's that I crave it sometimes, just like a pregnancy induced craving of odd things, and I think it's because women need what red meat has.

Though I suppose a One-a-Day with Iron might do as well.

lee david said...

This thread is cracking me up.

On the subject of first date restaurant signals. Let me give a couple from a guys perspective.

1. Order something you enjoy and enjoy it. We both know that we aren't eating at home. The idea is to enjoy the meal and the company. If a guy senses that your order is based on anything else(besides reasonable price) he will think that you are a phony and he is wasting his time and money. The question of table manners is another story and a subject for book. (many have been written)

2. A thoughtful question about the preparation of a dish might signal a discriminating taste but, playing twenty questions with the waiter and asking for 3 substitutions is the fastest way to tell a guy that you are an insufferable, self centered, high maintenance pain in the *ss.

Roger J. said...

Lee David: amen to your number 2; you have described my 3d ex wife to a tee :)

blake said...

My wife had been raised to order the cheapest thing on the menu. I called her on it once when she ordered something she didn't particularly like and she fessed up. It took years to get her out of that habit.

Of course, that was a short-sighted strategy on my part....

lee david said...


I thought a couple of times before I posted that number 2. After all, I don't really want to discourage people from being what they are on the first date. It's a lot cheaper and less disappointing to find these things out early, if we are looking for a mate, finding out is why we date in the first place.

Hey said...

Lee David: on number 2 the controlling variable is whether the subjects about which they are like that matter to you. Someone who doesn't enjoy red meat or red wine is going to be unpleasant to live with, no matter the rest of their personality, since I enjoy both and making two different meals is a sure way to kitchen hell. On other subjects that aren't key aspects of my life, it's negotiable.

Carnivores may smell bad, but non-asian people who are vegetarians are annoying, smug, self-righteous prigs. Asian people who come to vegetarianism are fine to live with or be around (though sometimes restaurants are a pain), since they're comfortable with you going to hell/being reincarnated as a vile bug for your karmic sins and have no need to evangelicize the issue.

SGT Ted said...

Wagyu. The boys love it when you say Wagyu. Wagyu.

oooh Ann! U maek me Hotz!

reneviht said...

It makes more sense to read this like a guide for a game than for advice on developing successful relationships. I don't think I have the confidence for playing dating games like this, but I can see how someone would find it fun.
Not sure how I'd react to a lady who treated me like a game. On one hand, I can't stand phoniness. On the other, I like strategy games.

KCFleming said...

When the eyes say no but the lips say Wagyu, well honey, don't even get out of the car.

KCFleming said...

guene made my whole day!

Chip Ahoy said...

I dated a woman who could eat a steak that weighs an entire pound. She ripped through it like an animal. Me, four ounces max. On the other hand, when it came to spices and anything the slightest aromatic, and she was all, "Don't put any garlic on that!" The things she complained about! Feta, gyros, anything seafood, Mexican, wheat, herbs, an entire list of vegetables each x'd out permanently for absurd reasons. Here's the thing that got me; she absolutely had to sample whatever was on my plate, even if we went to the same place often and she could order it any time she wanted.

Kirk Parker said...

"[My email is] in the sidebar, as ever."

Well, "ever" is a lot shorter than you might have guessed, because it sure doesn't seem to be there now.

Ann Althouse said...

Maybe the "-" in "e-mail" is making it harder to find on the page. I thought it was better to put it in. But my email address has always been in the sidebar and is there now.

Kassie Hartman said...

I was really bothered by this thread yesterday. I do agree with the people that say it doesn’t matter WHAT you eat as long as the date goes well but I don’t know about the rest of this. I think you’re all giving this article and the people in it way too much credit for being complicit in its thesis. I have been called before to comment on a subject I found pretty stupid but have answered the questions anyway. So to attack someone because they work at TV Guide – and probably have a bigger paycheck than you do and are the ones taking out the men – or because they’re a vegetarian and made a funny comment, is kind of ridiculous. It seems apparent to me that this is a Styles section piece and is not a subject that HAUNTS these women.

Kirk Parker said...

Oops, my stupid.

I searched for the domain part of your old email address, thinking (rightly) that it would appear on the page a lot less frequently than 'email' or even 'mail'. But yes, a little patience searching through all the instances of the latter, and I see your new gmail one is there, right where you said it was...

various buts said...

what's particularly galling about this sort of piece being in the "paper of record", is that it's so condescending and more aptly placed in mid-60s version of "cosmopolitan". i'm no feminist, but i'm somewhat disgusted by the way this is written as if it's not enough to be onesself. several commenters have made the point, and i wholeheartedly agree, that all any of us want, male or female, straight or gay, is to enjoy the meal with a real person and have a fun date. the writer, and by giving their editorial approval, the times' editorial staff, are telling women that they need to scheme and strategise for their dates, with the sole purpose of getting the man to like them.

hello?? ick!! how can they talk about the bush administration's record on women's rights when they're trying to drag women back into the post-war years with this drivel.

it reminds of the scene in "the world according to garp" when the neighbor's family is posing for a holday photo and the mother tells the future ellen jamesian, frenchie(?), "smile. if you don't smile, you'll never get a husband!"

Sarah said...

I'm also sure that's what all the anorexics say.

Are you sure?

Ridiculous article. Like we don't have enough food anxiety already.

Unknown said...

I was very upset with the way the author quoted me in that article. The way I was approached was completely different from the way the story came out. I don't eat to strategize on how to catch a man. I choose to eat salad or lighter foods in the evening to be healthier. My independence, intellect, and sense of humor is what attracts men to me. I made my comment as a joke. I thought the whole subject matter was vain, but funny. I just think it's funny that some pasty old white chick from Wisconsin takes one comment to judge me and and other girls from Texas! I am a very curvy, sexy, colleged eduacted bilingual black female who is ok with her body image and intellect. No I am not perfect, but I am proud of who I am and what I represent.

Ann Althouse said...

a_bey: I understand that about you, but my sarcasm is aimed at the NYT. Thanks for insulting me though!

Unknown said...

I guess one graduates to a new level of social importance when a complete stranger who knows very limited information about you insults you on the internet! We've both managed to accomplish this milestone today! If you should ever find yourself in DFW doing a story on "fat" girls in Texas, look me up. I'll treat you to lunch. My "Gassyness" won't be an issue for me between 12-2pm CST :)

Best regards,


eeeniebean said...

Am I the only one who suspected/hoped that the "Meat is Murder" reference was, in actuality, to a Smiths t-shirt?

If so, admitting that you listen to the Smiths is much more interesting conversation-fodder than whether you eat steak. And if you can talk about how the album-cover image was an altered version from the film "In the Year of the Pig?" Well, then we have something to talk about.

Oh, but wait, I forgot.. we women apparently have to consider the strategic impact of mentioning a band on a date! Heaven knows I wouldn't want to give the impression that I'll be high-maintenance by referring to songs that convey, *gasp*, emotion! Or seeming too political by casually referencing (even though I haven't seen it) a anti-vietnam-war film.

How can people expect dating to spawn a compatible relationship if they don't act like themselves on those dates? Isn't compatibility tricky enough without adding obfuscation and moving targets to the mix?

Ann Althouse said...

A Bey, again, what I'm doing here is comically restating what the NYT wrote as a way of criticizing it for writing about people the way it does. I'm not purporting to say anything about you. I assume you were portrayed unfairly.

a_bey401 said...


I appologize for my previous comment. The personal attack I made against you was tacky and classless. I let my pride and ego get the best of me. I was just stunned by the backlash of the article. I took it way to personal.

Ann Althouse said...

A Bey, it's quite all right, and thanks.