May 14, 2007

"Just, please, go back to doing something else. Do literary theory. Get upset about Imus. I don't know. But stop talking about Iraq!"

Eli Lake tells the netroots to shut up about Iraq.


Code Red said...

brilliant! bravo!

JWS said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
johnstodder said...

Well, good for him. I hope he doesn't mind being called a wanker, a brownshirt, a fucktard, a rethuglican, and stupid. Suggesting, as he does, that the netroots' influence is overblown will earn him a furious response.

One thing he doesn't have to worry about: A coherent argument that counters him. Masturbatory name-calling is pretty much all they've got.

hdhouse said...

this passes for what? journalism?

he decries that the blogs can't influence politics and he wonders why?

geezzeee he looks like the world's original tightass.

Doyle said...

I like Eli Lake, but neocons don't get to tell anyone what they can and can't say, or how much they can say, about Iraq.

It's sort of the price you pay for supporting the worst foreign policy disaster in US history.

But who knows, maybe Eli and Crazy Ann Althouse will successfully silence those nasty antiwar bloggers. I recommend holding your breath.

Fritz said...

He's right. Arab death culture has been around long before Mohammed and we must show those moderate Arabs that our liberal democratic ideals are stronger than the violent extremists. I don't know how indicating our willingness to leave as a strong signal we will stand with the liberals? Nothing has pleased bin Laden more than a female Speaker leading that charge.

Eli Blake said...

Happily, I have a 'B' that he doesn't have.

Code Red said...

Relax guys, you're getting worked up over nothing! Though, I do agree with the "opinions are like assholes" response to turds like Eli. ;)

No offense Eli! Remember, Jesus loves you, and thats all that matters.

Code Red said...

Sorry for sounding a bit trollish this afternoon, I guess I've been in a mood! My last comment was unnecessary, I'll try and behave myself.

Tim said...

"It's sort of the price you pay for supporting the worst foreign policy disaster in US history."

Only proving the capacity for willful ignorance is indeed infinite, possibly matched only by hyperbole.

Imagine how dangerous the liberal Left might be, if they were only a tenth as smart they believe themselves to be.

Michael said...

hdhouse: geezzeee he looks like the world's original tightass.

Eli is a friend of mine. I have hung out with him on three continents. You have obviously never met him.

Michael J. Totten

hdhouse said...

Tim: OK. Name a worse foreign policy disaster? (besides Viet Nam).

Michael...did you find him a tight ass?

boston70 said...

What would be helpful is Eli maybe wrote a handbook on what bloggers can talk about and hand it out to everyone so they can abide by him.

All these bloggers with their opinions is just wrong and should only talk about things Eli thinks they should talk about.

Better yet maybe bloggers should pass their opinions by Eli and then he can approve or not approve what gets posted and things would work out so much better.

He is serious!

boston70 said...

Does Eli think these bloggers are that influential? They hate Hilary and Obama said he went on Kos and described it as nothing new and just about what he expected.

Are they as influential as say Pat Robertson? Pat Robertson, who many conservatives have said has lost his influence must still have quite a bit of influence. Bush hired 150 graduates from Regent Law School (rated a 4th tier law school). That sounds like influence.

Code Red said...

The decision probably had more to do with God and the Bible rather than Pat Robertson himself. As controversial a figure as he is at times, he lends a lot of weight to any issue that conservatives are interested in.

AlphaLiberal said...

I listened to all I could stand but I still don't know who Eli Lake is or why I should care. (The written word has it's advantages- better skimming to miss dreck).

The guy talking on the phone has great confidence in the Bush Gang's ability to run an occupation competently.

No such luck. The Cheneyites have taken a "to the victor go the spoils" attitude toward the occupation.

The dumbest thing has been the rebuilding contractors who brought in cheap immigrant labor in an unstable country where people need jobs.

This is how dumb and greedy they are. Don't exepct a best case scenario from the Bush Command.

AlphaLiberal said...

Hey, Ann, you could suggest to your talkingheads friends that they label the speakers. Lay text over it, or wear name tages or something.

Tim said...

No, hdhouse, you cannot unilaterally take Vietnam off of the list of candidates worthy of Doyle's designation, "worst foreign policy disaster in US history."

Doyle's statement, presuming he understood and meant what he wrote in his carefully considered, fully informed and unqualified designation of Iraq as "worst", was inclusive of all U.S. foreign policy disasters, not excluding Vietnam.

Or do you not understand the meaning of "worst"?

Like I said, imagine how dangerous the liberal Left might be, if they were only a tenth as smart they believe themselves to be.

Tim said...

"Don't exepct a best case scenario from the Bush Command."

This is illogical.

hdhouse said...

Tim, you might hope that we are only a 1/10th as smart as we are but, alas, we are 10 times smarter than the average bear.

frankly, by the time President WooWoo leaves office no one will dispute that the judgements of WooWoo and Vadar, Perle, Wolfi, Rummy, et al, might be so designated as the collectively dumbest bit of statecraft in this history of the republic.

but as it is now, if you think this is such a hot idea, then i'll see your 1 and you can bet against my 10.

candy from a baby. caaaaaandy from a baby.

Michael said...

hdhouse: Michael...did you find him a tight ass?

No, not at all. He is loud, gregarious, funny, and weird. He laughs at himself a lot, and you can see him doing it in this very video.

Nor is the Republican he's made out to be here. Eli has a split political personality, which is partly what he was getting at when he said he wouldn't mind the netroots pushing for universal health care, etc.

He sums up his position on Syria and Iran by saying "no more invasions, dude."

But, you know, put him in your right-wing monster box if it makes you feel better. I don't care because I don't know you. I just had to stick up for my friend here. As you were.

Michael J. Totten

PatCA said...

Hey, johnstodder, good list of epithets. It was fun watching the loyal opposition try to craft a comment without their favorite words!

There's always scatology, as we see, when the going gets tough.

I have nothing to add to Mr. Lake's statements because I agree completely with him.

Tim said...

"...if you think this is such a hot idea..."

O.k., I realize this will be difficult for you to grasp, but there are other assessments besides "worst," and "such a hot idea" to be made regarding Iraq and our actions there.

I readily concede doing so requires a level of nuance John Kerry (and seemingly you too) can only dream about on his best days.

That is, to be clear, the kind of nuance appreciated by any run of the mill, standard freshman at a non-competitive state college taking her first course in international relations.

Ann Althouse said...

Alpha: The names of the speakers are directly above the pictures.

Fen said...

worst foreign policy disaster in US history.

US decision to invade Canada, leading to the British sacking of the capitol.

US Ambassador April Gillespie casually remarking to Iraqi official that the US did not consider Kuwait to be under its protective umbrella.

Jimmy Carter's Camp David Accords and Iranian Hostage Crisis

Jimmy Carter's Agreed Framework with North Korea

Allowing the Soviet occupation of Eastern Europe

The policy of D├ętente with the Soviets, extending the Cold War


Iraq is not a disaster. People like Doyle want it to become one, solely for political revenge. There's a word for that, and its not Copperhead.

hdhouse said...

good Fen. Just keep on the medications. I do get quite a chuckle out of you though. Frankly, I wouldn't pay all those people any mind who think you are useless putz so hopelessly afoul of dogma and fact free silliness. Its people like you who make it possible for people like me to get some humor out of the world.

Crimso said...

"I wouldn't pay all those people any mind who think you are useless putz so hopelessly afoul of dogma and fact free silliness"

Oh, God, the irony is killing me yet again.

Pogo said...

Eli Lake's advice is sound, but not likely to be employed. The anti-victory left has defined its core being in such a way that only a humiliating US withdrawal will be sufficient.

Sufficient for what? They don't say.
What comes after failure in Iraq? They don't say that, either.

But merely challenging the efficacy of such a demand apparently makes him a right-winger, not unlike how Ann Althouse is so inaccurately described. That practice has caused a decline in the left's support for Hillary, so it's hard to argue the practice in absent some power.

Fen said...

hdhouse: good Fen. Just keep on the medications. I do get quite a chuckle out of you though.

Likewise. No rebuttal from you, no intelligent debate - just blind assertions and personal attacks whenever you are backed into a corner.

Fen said...

What comes after failure in Iraq? They don't say that, either.

Katrina exemplifies their approach - retreat from responsibility, back to the days of partying and corruption, ignore the after action reprots of Andrew, and when the storm surge hits they'll complain about the lack of buses and blame everything on someone else.

Then funniest part is that if a Dem wins the Presidency, he/she will come out and give the usual based on intelligence reports I didn't see before, I've changed my stance in Iraq, we're going to see it through, and the partisan hacks on the Left will go silent.

Same way the "homeless" problem magically disappears when a Dem takes office.

Michael said...

Lake doesn't say "stop talking about Iraq" full stop exclamation point. He says "stop talking about Iraq at least in this way." It's the difference between "shut up" and "rethink what you're saying."

Dewave said...

It's sort of the price you pay for supporting the worst foreign policy disaster in US history.

Good lord. I'd always suspected lefties had a rather poor grasp of history, but it's always surprising to have demonstrated just how poor it is.

The Iraq War has been, thanks to the unflagging efforts of the American Media, a significant Domestic Policy disaster, but it doesn't even rank in the top 3 foreign policy disasters.

The Vietnam War, the War of 1812, Jimmy Carter's string of gaffes, all caused grater damage to America's reputation and more loss of American life. Then of course there is accomodating the Soviet Union and not taking a firmer stand against Saddam in the first Gulf War (which would have, naturally, removed the need for round 2)

I'm curious to know how the Iraq War has been the 'greatest' foreign policy disaster. What qualifications are you using? It's clearly not American loss of life, nor is it the rise to power of Anti-American leaders in Europe. It's not the fact that our capitol was burned or that scores of Americans have been held hostage for over a year.

Ah but silly me. I had forgotten. The Iraq War happened while Bush was in office, and thus it automatically leaps to the top of the list. No thought or reason required, just the all consuming blinding hatred of Bush. Carry on!