Althouse: "Spend enough time speaking to women who are taking testosterone — specifically, in very high doses — and you start to notice that they sound messianic."

October 22, 2025

"Spend enough time speaking to women who are taking testosterone — specifically, in very high doses — and you start to notice that they sound messianic."

"They’re often talking fast and intensely; they’re amped up; they’re describing what they clearly consider a miracle drug; and they have no intention of lowering their dose, despite the unknown risks or some problems with facial hair. After all, how can they worry about facial hair when they feel so alive?"

From "'I’m on Fire': Testosterone Is Giving Women Back Their Sex Drive — and Then Some/There is no F.D.A.-approved testosterone product for women. Insurance won’t cover it. Many doctors won’t prescribe it. It’s become a cultural phenomenon" (NYT)(free-access link).

76 comments:

Achilles said...: Men are adding estrogen to their TRT regimens as well and they get better results than estrogen blockers.

There is a new wave of medicine coming.

The old ways of expensive pharmaceutical drugs and food pyramid bullshit are going to be considered just as stupid as blood letting in a few years.; 10/22/25, 11:44 AM
Joe Bar said...: Oh boy. The women on this site are gonna be on a tear.; 10/22/25, 11:48 AM
Beasts of England said...: ’After all, how can they worry about facial hair when they feel so alive?’

Walking on sunshine?; 10/22/25, 11:50 AM
Derve said...: Oh, and you should see the clit growth!
You go girls!; 10/22/25, 11:50 AM
rhhardin said...: Male drive with female brain wiring.; 10/22/25, 11:51 AM
Quaestor said...: A good B movie plot lurks here. Bella Abzug: The Harridan that Returned from the Grave Rate R for language.; 10/22/25, 11:51 AM
Derve said...: Achilles said...
Men are adding estrogen to their TRT regimens as well and they get better results than estrogen blockers.

There is a new wave of medicine coming.
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You can't put the genie back in the bottle no matter what legislation gets (temporarily) passed in some states. #Science #Freedom It's not for everyone, of course.; 10/22/25, 11:52 AM
Derve said...: Thanks for turning my comments back on, meade!; 10/22/25, 11:52 AM
tcrosse said...: Isn't testosterone the toxin in toxic masculinity?; 10/22/25, 11:53 AM
AlbertAnonymous said...: Good news is: She'll want you more, like every day

Bad news is: She'll start to look and act like a man, and that man will want your more, like every day...

Wasn't there a thing when viagra first came out that claimed it'd increase your sexual abilities, but that it might make you go bald? All the consternation from guys who wanted some help but didn't want to lose their "manly manes"...

Bald guys were like, 'cool, gimme gimme gimme'; 10/22/25, 11:56 AM
Aggie said...: Whoever it was that created those animations needs to lower their dose.; 10/22/25, 11:58 AM
ChrisRet said...: Family member was prescribed mild dose of testosterone dealing with post menopause issues. She didn’t take it very long, before quitting. She said it made her feel full of rage all the time.
My own opinion, men have to deal with this growing up, the feeling sometimes that they need to smash everything. That’s part of adolescence. Society has evolved to channel that aggression and civilize young men. When that fails we get feral packs of males aka gangs.
Giving this to young girls to change gender is crazy.; 10/22/25, 11:58 AM
Derve said...: Family member was prescribed mild dose of testosterone dealing with post menopause issues. She didn’t take it very long, before quitting.* She said it made her feel full of rage all the time.
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Testosterone doesn't make you "hairy" if that is not your genetic predisposition: if the men in your family are not hairy. Ditto with "rage" and agressiveness. If your menfolk are not riled up and angry, your women likely will not be on small doses of T either...

Testosterone can be stabilizing. Like you don't really give a shit about what might have frustrated you before... "it's all good. Don't let the little things get to you..." Sounds more masculine than feminine, and nobody is more "messianic" than a middle-aged mother who is always right and cannot admit errors or that the world is changing and she isn't changing along with it because She Knows! the one true way.

Who does that remind you of? You on low-dose T, annie? *wink*

* She likely did not like the secondary side effects: if she's dark, the noticable "peach fuzz" on the face, or the bigger clit, or body hair, or deeper voice...; 10/22/25, 12:05 PM
Wince said...: Spend enough time speaking to women who are taking testosterone — specifically, in very high doses — and you start to notice that they sound messianic.

“And a trifle too satanic”?; 10/22/25, 12:05 PM
Doc g said...: Pediatrician here. The difference between a drug and a poison is typically the dose:like Botox. These women by self medicating are sometimes using dangerous doses leading to bad side effects like hair loss, deeper voices, changing clitoris size etc. if you want a higher sex drive only just limit the dose properly. For men we get testosterone therapy at 200-300 mg every two weeks. That causes minimal side effects. The endocrinologists and ob/gyns just need to figure out the right dose of the creams. These women are winging it just like guy bodybuilders at the gym relying on illegal dealers; 10/22/25, 12:05 PM
Narr said...: I prefer women who get their testosterone the old-fashioned direct injection way.; 10/22/25, 12:15 PM
gilbar said...: " they’re describing what they clearly consider a miracle drug"

now, give some thought to WHY little girls are pretending to be boys.; 10/22/25, 12:17 PM
tommyesq said...: " they’re describing what they clearly consider a miracle drug"

Yet they spent the last 25 years trying to beat it out of adolescent boys.; 10/22/25, 12:21 PM
Joe Bar said...: There was a similar article on, I think the NPR site. It was about a trans-man whole described her experience with male hormones. IIRC, she de-transitoned.; 10/22/25, 12:21 PM
Ambrose said...: Maybe men and women can completely switch places, like the magnetic poles.; 10/22/25, 12:32 PM
Inga said...: This is so gross, taking testosterone to amp up one’s sexual desire? If she doesn’t mind facial hair, she should just wait for menopause.; 10/22/25, 12:46 PM
Yancey Ward said...: They should take meth like Inga.; 10/22/25, 12:59 PM
Derve said...: Ambrose said...
Maybe men and women can completely switch places, like the magnetic poles.
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Later in life they kinda do. Like inga said, the women often end up with facial hairs once the estrogen levels naturally drop, and ... have you seen the boobage on some of the boomer men these days?? It all sags: testicles, breasts and all... nttawwt. We still love 'em. lol (until they replace you w/a dog because you refused to change your ratty t-shirts all those years and wouldn't keep the cats off the food places...); 10/22/25, 1:20 PM
Derve said...: now, give some thought to WHY little girls are pretending to be boys.
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or why a lot of "boys" want the puberty blockers early before they can choose to go on estrogen at 18...; 10/22/25, 1:22 PM
Gospace said...: It’s become a cultural phenomenon.

In other words- a bunch of upper income white women are doing it.; 10/22/25, 1:22 PM
Jamie said...: I have been on a form of HRT for about eight years now - bioidentical hormone pellets, implanted subcutaneously (with basically lidocaine, incision about a centimeter long, 10 minutes at my gynecologist) every four months. The hormones delivered by the pellets are estrogen and testosterone; because I still have all my parts, I must also take progesterone orally, daily, to mitigate the risk of uterine or ovarian (one or both - honestly I don't remember) cancer. The pellet dosage is adjusted based on annual blood tests (and would be adjusted if I experienced any bleeding or spotting). I must get annual mammograms instead every two years or whatever the recommendation is now, but my insurance does cover the mammograms (though not the pellets or progesterone) - maybe because I had one abnormal one years before? I don't know.

Anyway. How can I put this delicately? Oh, screw it:
On the pellets, I have a sex drive. Not on them (or in the couple of weeks at the end of a 4-month pellet cycle), I pretty much don't. But the sex drive I do have is like what I had in my 40s, maybe - just about any man I've ever known would be sorely disappointed if he were taking T to get that.

I conclude that the dose I'm getting is not what this article is about (though I suppose those here might say I talk fast and furiously and sound messianic). The benefits I appreciate most are much less fatigue, better weight control, improved skin elasticity. I look and feel like a middle-aged woman rather than (I imagine) an elderly one.; 10/22/25, 1:24 PM
Derve said...: If trans men can access treatment early enough, you can suppress breast growth eliminating the need for mastectomy. "But kids don't know that early who they are!" Yes, they do.

The whole problem with the trans craze in kids is parenting. A chid who "suddenly" presents as the opposite sex, or who is following a trend at the school, is NOT the same as the child who has been exhibiting (to the parents) "odd" or "non-conforming" gender behaviors since as long as they began behaving and exhibiting preferences.

If your kid always gets what they want, never hears no, and runs your house, those are the ones who tell tales and later scream that they were wrongly transed.

If your child had cancer, would you want them to wait until age 18 to access cancer care just because the Smith's daughter down the street claimed she had cancer and was trying to insist she access cancer care/chemo she did not need? Ditto with some of the lesser states' push to ban gender therapy medical/hormonal treatment for young trans people w/gender dysphoria.; 10/22/25, 1:26 PM
Derve said...: Curious Jamie: what was the medical condition that allowed your doctor to prescribe hormone therapy at your relatively young age? You just asked for it? Libido help? What's your medical condition that got you access to the controlled substances?; 10/22/25, 1:28 PM
Inga said...: “They should take meth like Inga.”

Yancey Boy a man in his 60’s, unmarried, no children and still living at home with his elderly mama still sleeps in mama’s room on a trundle bed.; 10/22/25, 1:30 PM
Derve said...: Inga said...
This is so gross,
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I don't really believe you were a nurse. They just don't comment on other people's medical conditions like that. You don't even say that about somebody's Botox injections, Ozembic prescriptions, or boob jobs anymore. We respect other people's medical care, even if we'd never choose it for ourselves. Glad you're not in the profession anymore and can only influence your grandchildren, inga.; 10/22/25, 1:30 PM
Derve said...: Yancey Boy a man in his 60’s, unmarried, no children and still living at home with his elderly mama still sleeps in mama’s room on a trundle bed.
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So what if he does? Your son drowned himself to get away from you. Dish it out, eat it back up?; 10/22/25, 1:31 PM
Derve said...: YOu folks do know... everybody's hormone levels are different? Some women naturally have higher T levels than others, though not to the level of men without supplementation. (I wish the NYT article had included numbers: the specific T-levels of some of the self-reporting women telling stories. The woman who couldn't control herself and had to pull over for "car sex". lol. Tall tales like that abound, but made it readable if you can't hack dry scientific literature, I guess. Readers are tearing up the illustrations in the comments section though...); 10/22/25, 1:33 PM
Disparity of Cult said...: "Ah, the sex thing. I'm glad that part of my life is over."

- Greta Garbo; 10/22/25, 1:35 PM
Inga said...: “I have been on a form of HRT for about eight years now - bioidentical hormone pellets, implanted subcutaneously (with basically lidocaine, incision about a centimeter long, 10 minutes at my gynecologist) every four months. The hormones delivered by the pellets are estrogen and testosterone; because I still have all my parts, I must also take progesterone orally, daily, to mitigate the risk of uterine or ovarian (one or both - honestly I don't remember) cancer. The pellet dosage is adjusted based on annual blood tests (and would be adjusted if I experienced any bleeding or spotting). I must get annual mammograms instead every two years or whatever the recommendation is now, but my insurance does cover the mammograms (though not the pellets or progesterone) - maybe because I had one abnormal one years before? I don't know.”

Yikes, I don’t know why you are receiving this sort of HRT, but Tylenol seems a lot less scary.; 10/22/25, 1:36 PM
Howard said...: It's the lack of adequate free testosterone that causes toxic masculinity. Look at the porky pig mug shots of the young Republicans whom were recently outed by a disappionted office seeker.; 10/22/25, 1:42 PM
Howard said...: Yes, exogenous hormones and various environmental factors can reduce testosterone levels in women, while byproducts from "engines" (air pollution/combustion) are a contributing environmental factor.; 10/22/25, 1:44 PM
Howard said...: Yes, emerging evidence from human and animal studies suggests that good gut health, characterized by a wide variety and balance of beneficial bacteria, is associated with increased endogenous testosterone levels in both men and women.; 10/22/25, 1:46 PM
FormerLawClerk said...: Notice how there's no photos of these fat whores allegedly getting so much dick now that they're men.; 10/22/25, 1:48 PM
Howard said...: Interesting. When I was a old teenager, the rumor was that chubby girls were more Randy then skinny ones.

Yes, obesity lowers endogenous testosterone in men, but it tends to increase it in women. In men, obesity is associated with lower testosterone levels due to mechanisms like reduced sex hormone–binding globulin (SHBG) and altered gonadotropin secretion. In women, particularly with abdominal obesity, the body tends to develop a condition of functional hyperandrogenism, meaning higher androgen levels.; 10/22/25, 1:50 PM
Inga said...: Was it my imagination or did some evil entity stop by briefly to pass noxious gas?🤢; 10/22/25, 1:52 PM
Jamie said...: Inga @1:36, because I couldn't stay awake, mostly. The fatigue i experienced was debilitating. But it is also very protective from heart disease, which runs in my family, osteoporosis, and several cancers. See the latest literature - not the specious one that caused so many women to stop their HRT because of poor study design.

Tylenol is working well for my post-surgical nighttime knee pain, though, for what that's worth.; 10/22/25, 2:02 PM
Inga said...: “Inga @1:36, because I couldn't stay awake, mostly. The fatigue i experienced was debilitating. But it is also very protective from heart disease, which runs in my family, osteoporosis, and several cancers. See the latest literature - not the specious one that caused so many women to stop their HRT because of poor study design.”

Interesting. My daughter who is 53 started HRT recently and loves it. I do worry about breast cancer for her though. I must’ve had the mildest menopause ever, I had absolutely no adverse effects except for an occasional hot flash. I’m so happy to be post menopausal now.

“Tylenol is working well for my post-surgical nighttime knee pain, though, for what that's worth.”

That’s good! Sounds like you’re recovering well!; 10/22/25, 2:09 PM
Aggie said...: Well...... For the record, regardless of its efficacy or the other bothersome side effects, the world is generally a better place when there are more horny women on the loose.; 10/22/25, 2:16 PM
Ampersand said...: Women naturally produce testosterone from their ovaries and adrenal glands, leaving concentrations in the range of about 8% of the male concentration.
I am male. There was a time in my early 20s (about 9 months or so) when I was doing lots of weight lifting and eating high protein meals. I feel fortunate to have survived that period. I became quite aggressive, and was on a bit of a hair trigger. I would put myself in danger as a skier and as a driver for no good reason. Testosterone is dangerous for the person who has high levels, and for the people around that person. I wonder what testosterone levels are found in these transgender shooters.; 10/22/25, 2:27 PM
FredSays said...: Just what I was looking for, sex with Barnum and Baileys bearded lady.; 10/22/25, 2:45 PM
Leland said...: Love how they minimize “unknown risks” with a joke about facial hair. That’s the way NYT, lead your female audience down the road of hormonal experimentation for the heck of it.; 10/22/25, 2:49 PM
n.n said...: A woman's libido is more consequential than her health. Her taxable state of income doubly so. Cultural progress is not limited to social liberalization and performing human rites. The experiments will proceed.; 10/22/25, 3:12 PM
Achilles said...: Doc g said...
Pediatrician here. The difference between a drug and a poison is typically the dose:like Botox. These women by self medicating are sometimes using dangerous doses leading to bad side effects like hair loss, deeper voices, changing clitoris size etc. if you want a higher sex drive only just limit the dose properly. For men we get testosterone therapy at 200-300 mg every two weeks. That causes minimal side effects. The endocrinologists and ob/gyns just need to figure out the right dose of the creams. These women are winging it just like guy bodybuilders at the gym relying on illegal dealers

What is interesting about this comment is that it mirrors what doctors are currently doing with ozempic.

People have been taking GLP1s for a while now at an order of magnitude lower dose than what doctors are starting people at.

It seems to me that our health care system is being run by a group of people at the top who want to lower the world’s population. There are no real sources or institutions that can be trusted right now.; 10/22/25, 3:26 PM
Kirk Parker said...: FredSays,

It turns out that bearded lady is looking for *you*. What a happy coincidence!; 10/22/25, 3:29 PM
Assistant Village Idiot said...: No you know why manics refuse to take their Depakote; 10/22/25, 3:49 PM
YoungHegelian said...: despite the unknown risks or some problems with facial hair.

Oh, oh, ladies, it's all fun and games until the facial hair goes down to your testicles!

I'll stop now.; 10/22/25, 3:53 PM
Ann Althouse said...: If you keep reading the article you'll get to the other hair problem: going bald!

There's also the problem of developing a male-sounding voice.; 10/22/25, 4:10 PM
Derve said...: If you keep reading the article you'll get to the other hair problem: going bald!
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Only in families with male pattern baldness. Maybe the men in your family have only a receding hairline? Gals can always style their hair around that... tradeoffs at higher doses. Read the comments on that article for even more stories about how these ladies on t are responding... that's how you learn. Collecting stories, and not stopping at the ones the NYT writer collected. (ie/teh one lady who self reported needing sex so badly she had her husband stop the car. lol. It's all personal stories for the most part, that whole report. How much do YOU trust the women tellign the stories or the reporter trying to make her article "readable"? Go read the comments... one lady reported THICKER head hair on T. Hormones affect everyone differently. I think the gist was, "if men have these products available -- estrogen too, why is the research/approval so slow for you menopausal women? Why do you ladies accept that? Demand the science be done in this country, like elsewhere in the world?); 10/22/25, 4:17 PM
Derve said...: Plenty of women have deeper voices, ann. It's not such a bad thing. Women have alopecia too without supplementing with T. You don't have to choose it... clearly that untamed white man is important to you. But hair loss and even a deep voice are not the reach drawbacks. (The issue didn't address it much: higher hemoglobin and red blood counts in your CBC could lead to more strokes. There's a reason those on estrogren live longer than those with higher testosterone levels, men and women...); 10/22/25, 4:19 PM
Derve said...: REAL drawbacks, rather...; 10/22/25, 4:20 PM
Derve said...: Oh, oh, ladies, it's all fun and games until the facial hair goes down to your testicles!
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I'd bet the hair in their ass cracks would bother them more myself...

And a chest and tummy with light baby hair actually keeps you warmer, fwiw. The face too!; 10/22/25, 4:21 PM
Derve said...: FredSays said...
Just what I was looking for, sex with Barnum and Baileys bearded lady.
-----------
I don't get it myself, but you'd be amazed at how many young transman are getting pounded in both holes by "straight" guys. They both seem to like it and are consenting, so...; 10/22/25, 4:23 PM
Derve said...: Howard said...
It's the lack of adequate free testosterone that causes toxic masculinity. Look at the porky pig mug shots of the young Republicans whom were recently outed by a disappionted office seeker.
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I would bet my life that most of the guys in Trump's administration, from JD to RFK to Hegseth to Sean Duffy on down are using T supplementation. You can see it in their faces. Women too. Stay off T if you don't want more creases in your face, honestly. The trans women are smarter to choose estrogren supplements for their faces and inners (they'll live longer) but a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do.

It's contagious in the Trump guys in DC, I would bet... It's like pot: when you know what it smells like, you can smell it. If you don't, you wonder what that roadkill animal scent is...; 10/22/25, 4:26 PM
Derve said...: I wonder what testosterone levels are found in these transgender shooters.
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I would bet the person in Tennessee who shot up the religious school they attended never supplemented with a day in their life... Look at the pictures and the distress expressed in their diaries. She NEEDED help, needed to have her hormonal levels tested (for PCOS, for one...). Look at Caster Semenya... she really was more than a joke. Science says we accept that all people are not the same, and some need medical treatment to help them.

We're doing just the opposite in this country. Good luck everyone.; 10/22/25, 4:31 PM
Biff said...: rhhardin said...

"Male drive with female brain wiring."

There must be a few sci-fi novels that start with that premise.; 10/22/25, 4:42 PM
NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...: Biff said...

rhhardin said...

"Male drive with female brain wiring."

There must be a few sci-fi novels that start with that premise.

One word: Heinlein.; 10/22/25, 4:48 PM
Iman said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 10/22/25, 5:32 PM
Derve said...: You don't have to choose it... clearly that untamed white man is important to you. But hair loss and even a deep voice are not the reach drawbacks.
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doh! manE, not man. lol@typo...
reaL, not reach; 10/22/25, 6:05 PM
Ann Althouse said...: Do you know what raw materials are used to manufacture pharmaceutical testosterone? I happened to look it up as I wrote this post and I was absolutely stunned.

And pharmaceutical estrogen is made from the same 2 things. (And the answer is not horse urine.)

I was amazed!; 10/22/25, 6:25 PM
The Vault Dweller said...: "Do you know what raw materials are used to manufacture pharmaceutical testosterone? "

I wonder what happens if they use the kind that has the Marshmallows baked on?; 10/22/25, 6:48 PM
Ampersand said...: The two sources:yams and soy beans.; 10/22/25, 7:12 PM
effinayright said...: So...these testosterone-taking chicks would not be eligible to participate in the Olympics as women, but a guy who used meds and a had a lopadicfromy to become a "woman", can compete against natural women.

Beam me up, Scotty!; 10/22/25, 7:38 PM
Bruce Hayden said...: “My daughter who is 53 started HRT recently and loves it. I do worry about breast cancer for her though.”

Partner started HRT (Esterdial) at 28, 40 years ago. No problems. She started as a result of a full hysterectomy, as a result of ovarian cancer. She didn’t want to go through menopause with young kids at home. Her gynecologist told her that the big problem with HRT is with ovaries- if they are still producing estrogen. Also, you don’t want to have your HRT estrogen competing with bad estrogen from obesity. According to him, No breast cancer risk if the only estrogen is coming from the HRT.

She also was taking a small dosage of testosterone, for sex drive, until her partner went through male menopause in his early 60s. She quit it because it just left her frustrated.; 10/22/25, 8:12 PM
Bruce Hayden said...: “ What is interesting about this comment is that it mirrors what doctors are currently doing with ozempic.

“People have been taking GLP1s for a while now at an order of magnitude lower dose than what doctors are starting people at.”

Been on Olympic for a couple years now. Works great. Lost 30 lbs, which got A1C down to 6 (from almost 8). On probably the lowest dosage. You’re supposed to double the dosage after a month. Nope. So, the pharmacy keeps tying to get me to refill early. Primary care always asks about increasing dosage. Nope again - as long as my A1C is that low, why do it?; 10/22/25, 8:20 PM
Iman said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 10/22/25, 9:17 PM
Achilles said...: Ann Althouse said...

Do you know what raw materials are used to manufacture pharmaceutical testosterone? I happened to look it up as I wrote this post and I was absolutely stunned.

And pharmaceutical estrogen is made from the same 2 things. (And the answer is not horse urine.)

I was amazed!

People are starting to learn that Cholesterol is vital to human body function and to our health in general.

Statins are obviously and glaringly evil and pure poison.; 10/22/25, 11:04 PM
Achilles said...: Bruce Hayden said...

“ What is interesting about this comment is that it mirrors what doctors are currently doing with ozempic.

“People have been taking GLP1s for a while now at an order of magnitude lower dose than what doctors are starting people at.”

Been on Olympic for a couple years now. Works great. Lost 30 lbs, which got A1C down to 6 (from almost 8). On probably the lowest dosage. You’re supposed to double the dosage after a month. Nope. So, the pharmacy keeps tying to get me to refill early. Primary care always asks about increasing dosage. Nope again - as long as my A1C is that low, why do it?

I don't know where they started you at but my guess it was egregious.

People have been starting at 0.1-0.25 mg a week for a long time with excellent results. Escalations were usually to 0.5 g a week and rarely got to 1.0 g a week.

I think they are trying to purposely injure people with them so they can get them banned because they cannot actually patent them. Eventually people will notice these have been around forever.

You can get 10 mg of semaglutide for ~250$ and that would last you for ~40-50 weeks at a normal dose.; 10/22/25, 11:22 PM
Craig Mc said...: The vagaries of the endocrine system mean some women have more natural testosterone than others. Yes, it makes them more sexually aggressive, but also makes them risk-takers.

One mere slip of a pretty blonde I knew had to take drugs to keep facial hair at bay. The risk-taking was notable. One too many risks as it happened.

As someone said above, it takes years for men to manage their testosterone-fueled instincts. Hormones are not toys.; 10/23/25, 2:03 AM
Derve said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 10/23/25, 3:30 AM
Rusty said...: Shorter. What could possibly go wrong!; 10/23/25, 8:41 AM
Leland said...: effinayright @7:38pm, F'in right.; 10/23/25, 9:04 AM