I'm happy with this choice. Aren't you?
ADDED: "Trump chooses Sen. J.D. Vance, a former critic, as his vice-presidential pick/Vance is a rising star in the party who has closely aligned himself with Trump in recent years, after criticizing him forcefully in 2016" (WaPo)(free access link). Excerpt:
ADDED: "Trump chooses Sen. J.D. Vance, a former critic, as his vice-presidential pick/Vance is a rising star in the party who has closely aligned himself with Trump in recent years, after criticizing him forcefully in 2016" (WaPo)(free access link). Excerpt:
While Vance is now one of Trump’s most steadfast allies, he was previously critical. He wrote in an Atlantic opinion piece in July 2016 that Trump was “cultural heroin” for the masses....
He declared Trump “unfit for our nation’s highest office” in an August 2016 New York Times op-ed headlined “Why Trump’s Antiwar Message Resonates with White America.” Vance also sent a message that year to his law school roommate, Josh McLaurin, saying that he went “back and forth between thinking Trump is a cynical asshole like Nixon who wouldn’t be that bad (and might even prove useful) or that he’s America’s Hitler.” McLaurin had reached out to Vance about writing an opinion piece together at the time.
“I never could have dreamed during those exchanges in 2016 that he would end up being one of the principal reinforcers of Trumpism only a few years later,” said McLaurin, who is now a Democratic state senator in Georgia....
AND: I'm glancing around elsewhere and keep seeing this theme: Vance used to criticize Trump. The old criticisms are repeated. But we've all heard criticisms of Trump, and here's someone who knew and felt the criticisms, but he came around. And he's going to be telling us, eloquently, how he came around.
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211 comments:
1 – 200 of 211 Newer› Newest»Good day for the Buckeyes!
Very happy.
Ecstatic.
I'm thrilled beyond words.
"Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio, Minnesota..." JD will campaign hard in those states and Trump will win them if the Dem cheating can be kept to a minimum.
I'm happy.
Imagine a Vance-Harris VP debate.
A total and complete beatdown.
Yes. And for you diversity lovers, his wife is Indian, so her and Kamal share some heritage. And she's a lawyer.
"I go back and forth between thinking Trump is a cynical asshole like Nixon who wouldn't be that bad (and might even prove useful) or that he's America's Hitler," he wrote privately to an associate on Facebook in 2016.“
JD Vance
I'm pleased.
(Any day that Karl Rove is so upset that he is practically foaming at the mouth on national TV is a good day. Rove sees his list bit of hold on the GOP party slipping away. Needless to say, he is not happy)
I think J.D. Vance is a good pick. I won't say I'm excited about him being the VP candidate, but I'm not worried about it. I think of the names that were bandied about the only other one I felt similarly about was Marco Rubio. Most of the other I had some reservations about but could have been persuaded to like them. The notable exception is Nikki Haley who I do not want to see involved at all in Government. She has shown herself to have authoritarian instincts and I do not trust her and do not think I could be persuaded to. I would have been on the fence about Tulsi Gabbard as well. I don't think she is manipulative or has authoritarian instincts like Nikki Haley but she was a Democrat for a long time so I suspect some of her fundamental values are more aligned with Democratic policies than Republican so I would be apprehensive about how she would approach certain issues.
I wil say though that J.D. Vance at 39, does strike me a little on the young side, though not disqualifyingly so. This also seems to highlight a difference between the parties in their structures. It seems a lot easier for younger folks and outsiders to climb the ranks in the Republican party than it does in the Democratic party.
Biden’s press secretary just said they will continue to call Trump a threat to democracy. So much for toning down the rhetoric.
Q: why did not JDVance able to recognize a fellow hillbilly in Trump earlier?
JD and Vivek were in the same class at Yale Law. They were friends used to watch Bengals games together. Small world.
So Inga, I guess he decided Trump's a cynical asshole like Nixon who wasn't that bad and even proved useful. I can get behind that. That's pretty much the best we can hope for today. The Democrats and most of the Republicans are much, much worse than that.
Roger von Oech said...
Good day for the Buckeyes!
Yep, we will get new Senator.
Yes, Inga: Vance didn't like Trump back then. And I was not in Trump's corner back then either.
My first choice in 2016 was Wisconsin's governor. But he flamed out by using GOPe "advisors." And Cruz, my next choice, just doesn't have the charisma.
And then Trump proved us all wrong by beating Hillary and then you leftists went mad. Still have gone mad. I'm sure you are upset that Trump is alive today.
So I changed my mind and Vance has changed his mind too. Apparently Trump can forgive people for being against him in the past.
The best part is all the screaming coming from the likes of you and Tom Nichols, showing that Trump made the best choice here.
I mean, I'd rather Trump picked zombie Pinochet, but we can't have everything....
I mean, I'd rather Trump picked zombie Pinochet, but we can't have everything....
Ha ha, agreed! Franco would do, too.
“Today is not just some isolated incident. The central premise of the Biden campaign is that President Donald Trump is an authoritarian fascist who must be stopped at all costs. That rhetoric led directly to President Trump’s attempted assassination.”
JD Vance
Of course Trump would choose him after he said this.
"Juris Doctor" Vance is a huband, father, and veteran, an accomplished individual who honors the American spirit. He is a worthy running mate and presumptive successor.
Inga has found a new object for her boundless hatred. Her cup runneth over.
Unlike professional politicians, Trump isn't looking for the usual "checks all the political boxes" type of running mate, or Yes-man assistant. He's choosing someone who has the traits to be his successor.
"Imagine a Vance-Harris VP debate."
Finally we can laugh more than she laughs.
This selection doesn't make any difference in my vote. I would have crawled across broken glass, if necessary, to vote against Biden and the Democrats. I voted for Trump in the last two presidential elections and in this year's Florida presidential primary, even though that was already a fait accompli. I like President Trump and will vote for him enthusiastically in November.
A couple of days ago Trump received a wake-up call that he won't live forever. He may also have concluded that if a crazed gunman can't stop him from becoming President, neither can pathetic old Biden and the pathetic old media. So he picked a VP who he believes is most likely to continue his legacy after Trump finishes his last 4 years of Presidency.
I don't know much about Vance except for his book, but based on that he seems to be an original thinker who cares about people who have been ignored by the "establishment", and who has a good understanding of what those people need.
I don't know. JD sounds like he'll go where the wind blows. Then again, if Trump wins, he's only going to be President for one term. Maybe JD can use this opportunity to find his true voice. A lot of people don't get a second chance like this. I hope he doesn't blow it.
JD is Peter Thiel’s guy. That changes the whole power dynamic in my opinion.
Just don't make me listen to their speeches. Actual virtue is good but I don't want to hear about it.
Contemporary Democrats and their shit policies are enough to curl sentient peoples’ hair, Igna.
They were enough to straighten out J.D. Vance.
Inga quoted...
"I go back and forth between thinking Trump is a cynical asshole like Nixon who wouldn't be that bad (and might even prove useful) or that he's America's Hitler,"
Like Inga, Vance was probably taken in by the rhetoric of the media. He had nothing else to base his opinion on. But UNLIKE Inga, he was able to let facts and reality adjust his perception and no longer believes the media lies.
In 2016, I was anti-Trump. I too got my information about trump for the MSM. I have since changed my mind because I am a rational and thinking human being that looks at the evidence.
In 2015 Trump was not a Fascist, Hitler-like person. He was friends with all the big wigs. Then he ran for president. He didn't change, the media's portrayal of him changed.
Imagine, Inga, if your reputation and status in the world was entirely defined by influential people who hated you? How would you combat those lies?
How many times do you think Vance will be confronted with that Hitler quote and we'll get to hear his excellent answer?
#TrumpPicksFatherHusbandVeteran as VP is trending on X.
graduated from Ohio State University
Never heard of it. (Why, yes, I'm a Michigan fan! How did you know...?)
Picking a running mate who was previously harshly critical of you is as American as apple pie. Kamala accused Joe of keeping schools segregated. GHW Bush complained about voodoo economics. Pretty sure that list goes on.
One by one people change their minds about Trump or the threat he represents. Vance was an early convert. He’s a smart guy. I think he’s a great pick. He’s a great communicator.
I think Vance is a bit of assassination insurance for Trump. If the kill Trump now, and I fear they'll try again, they get Vance. The left and never trumpers seem to loathe Vance.
I, too, was initially against Trump. I thought he wouldn't play in the Midwest since he was from NYC.
But I saw him at a rally at a Sioux City high school. I talked to the people at the rally. I saw how he interacted with the crowd. I wrote a long essay about this at Power Line.
I changed my mind. As John Maynard Keynes said, "When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?"
Trump is Legally Blond = I hope Vance is not snooty bf Warner
James D Vance will be 40 in 19 days. So he is mature enough. Teddy Roosevelt was a VP at 42 at this stage. And JFK was President at 43.
And this dude has beaucoup leadership talents. Just watch him.
"Imagine a Vance-Harris VP debate."
A test of JD's character? How does he treat someone perceived... less smart than him.
I mean, it's alright. But then I don't understand getting stoked about a VP unless you have McCain/ Biden circumstances. A relative moderate who works on appealing to the working class. Nothing wrong with that.
Thomas Massive would have been a better choice, but then I hadn't considered him at all. So it's not a huge deal.
Gretchen said...
JD is Peter Thiel’s guy.
=================
according to Sundance Thiel’s FBI asset/informer!
deep state wins
"Thomas Massive"? How big is he?
Market's gonna be wild. Fact is Trump was doing great until the terrible luck of covid. Now that it's behind us he can do great again.
Start by extending the TCJA...
A common theme on X this afternoon is that Kamala will destroy him in debate...
Dr Weevil said...
"Thomas Massive"? How big is he?
7/15/24, 4:44 PM
Well, he is kind of a big deal. Admittedly JD Vance has more credit with the Silicon Valley types, who would likely be very upset with Massie. Ah well, Trump has never felt like sprinting away when he can simply walk.
""I go back and forth between thinking Trump is a cynical asshole like Nixon who wouldn't be that bad (and might even prove useful) or that he's America's Hitler," he wrote privately to an associate on Facebook in 2016.“
I was not a Trump supporter in 2016 (though I did vote for him in November). Then I watched the guy as President.
Performance matters. In fact, it's the most important thing.
“Today is not just some isolated incident. The central premise of the Biden campaign is that President Donald Trump is an authoritarian fascist who must be stopped at all costs. That rhetoric led directly to President Trump’s attempted assassination.”
Demonstrably true.
I’m ok with the choice. Resigned, perhaps. But I didn’t like bis senate campaign—too many times he said the kind of tin-eared things said by politicians who don’t believe what they’re saying but say it anyway because polls or focus groups told them they should.
His turn-around on Trump has the same scent of opportunism.
That said, there are so few people of working class background in Washington; I can console myself with the knowledge that he is one of them.
Biden is so horrible in so many ways. His tax plan if reelected includes taxing unrealized gains. Really?
Surely the markets will melt if implemented.
I truly understand what he means when he says he is staying because he wants to finish the job. I wish more Americans would
Narayanan said...
“Gretchen said...
JD is Peter Thiel’s guy.
=================
according to Sundance Thiel’s FBI asset/informer!
deep state wins”
It’s always possible that the consummate deal maker made a deal with the deep state.
tim maguire said...
His turn-around on Trump has the same scent of opportunism.
7/15/24, 4:49 PM
I was about to make a comment about all the disadvantages of killing all the opportunists in Washington.
Anyways, they wouldn't have tried to murder PDJT if they thought a Vice President could hobble him.
Yeah. I don't think noting Vance was critical but came around is going to make Trump look bad. Rather, it will show Trump can win over his critics. That will contrast with Biden, who is gaining critics. Either the media wants Trump now (he's does make them money) or they are stupid, which is hard to decide.
I threw up in my mouth a little when I voted for Trump in 2016. If the other choice hadn't been Hillary, I would not have done it.
Eva Marie said...
It’s always possible that the consummate deal maker made a deal with the deep state.
7/15/24, 4:51 PM
Do you think the CIA (or certain foreign agencies) will be sleeping terribly comfortably after Saturday's display? I'd certainly be wary if I were them.
Another step away from the neocon fake republicanism of Bush, Romney, and McCain. I am happy!
Why he had a certain view seven years ago
If you read "Hillbilly Elegy" or at least saw the movie, JD Vance is understands the struggles of America's forgotten working class. He likes the fishermen, not the Pharasees.
Plus Karl Rove and Dick Cheney hate the guy. I like the choice.
Ohio is Trump's. But does JD Vance help him get Pennsylvania, and other rustbelt states.
Probably not Wisconsin. We are too corrupt. Our liberals are a special kind of crazy.
Love the choice.
"How many times do you think Vance will be confronted with that Hitler quote and we'll get to hear his excellent answer?"
Not enough. That tiger trap will catch so many unsuspecting journos that they'll just back away and throw mud.
He'll pick off his full quota until that happens.
Notice Trump skipped over Generation X. Vance was born in 1984 or 1985.
We have been shamefully selfish and irrelevant.
Some people want to argue that taking an umbrella with you yesterday means you have to take an umbrella today and take an umbrella tomorrow. A better way is to look to see if it is raining.
"It’s always possible that the consummate deal maker made a deal with the deep state."
my uncomfortable feeling, I hope he got more in the deal than just the office.
"The left and never trumpers seem to loathe Vance."
I wonder what the LLRs think of him. We'll never know…
I remember when Ronald Reagan picked George HW Bush to be his VP there was some talk about all the unfavorable things Bush had said about Reagan (voodoo economics and so on) when they were both running for the nomination, how it was going to be used against the ticket but that went nowhere. They won in a landslide.
It's intra-party squabbling, both sides do it, it's just part of politics. Kamala was critical of Biden's record on integration when they were both running for the nomination in 2020.
How many times do you think Vance will be confronted with that Hitler quote and we'll get to hear his excellent answer?
Everyone is welcome. And many eyes have been opened. Rejection of the establishment is not easy. Let's see how many Democrat loyal minorities defect this November.
But I'm proud to say I've been on the Trump Train since "Only Rosie O'Donnell."
Biden is so horrible in so many ways. His tax plan if reelected includes taxing unrealized gains. Really?
Also nationwide rent control, and a government cap on how much you can sell your house for.
This senile idiot, this blowhard plagiarist from the bottom quintile of a third-tier toilet law school, who never once earned a nickel that didn't come from taxes paid by the rest of us, has not the smallest clue where prosperity comes from. He is corrupt beyond the wildest dreams of Nigerian oil ministers, and a pervert to boot. He is no more capable of running this country than that equally foolish former bus driver Maduro who runs Venezuela, and if we re-elect him we will look more like Venezuela than America in four more years.
Joe Biden represents the very worst of America. He's scum, the party that put him in power is scum, and anyone who'd vote for him is a fool.
It all seems to be coming together for a humiliating Mondale-in-1984 repudiation of these enemies of America, and with any luck it will include big majorities in the House and Senate. We are cooked if we cannot destroy the Democrats for a generation.
Vance has the magic ingredient called courage. And he doesn’t need money from China or Soros. So he is free to do the right thing. Which only matters if Trump is no longer able to be President. Otherwise VP is a non office other than breaks ties in Senate.
"I go back and forth between thinking Trump is a cynical asshole like Nixon who wouldn't be that bad (and might even prove useful) or that he's America's Hitler," he wrote privately to an associate on Facebook in 2016.“
Some of us grow and learn and change our minds over eight years Inga.
You still think the pee tapes were real.
But wait! There's more! This morning Trump called for the Biden administration to provide Secret Service for RFK Jr. This afternoon DHS Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas announced that going forward RFK Jr would, indeed, received Secret Service protection.
I made this comment late on your previous post about waiting on the VP announcement, but it is more relevant here:
I'm very happy that Vance was picked. He has a compelling background story as the son of a single mother who was a drug addict. (I agree with Meade; everyone should read "Hillbilly Elegy".) He understands the working class, rural America, and the toll of opioid addiction. He also served with distinction in the military and credits it with putting him on a path to success. He won scholarships to Ohio State and to Yale Law School, and is a bright and well-respected lawyer. His wife is also a Yale Law School grad. His mentor at Yale was professor Amy Chua (of Tiger Mom fame) who has been a big influence on his fearlessness in the face of the woke left. And he's only 39.
Bravo, Trump, for picking Vance!
Has Inga forgotten Kamala called Biden a racist When asked later she responded, "It was a DEBATE (cackle, cackle)? And then it was on to the next subject.
"Biden is so horrible in so many ways. His tax plan if reelected includes taxing unrealized gains." Yep - he's a dolt. Not to mention he wants national rent control.
Ann Althouse wrote, And he's going to be telling us, eloquently, how he came around.
Professor. When are you going to tell us all, eloquently of course, as is your usual writing, how you finally came around??
Inga said...
"I go back and forth between thinking Trump is a cynical asshole like Nixon who wouldn't be that bad (and might even prove useful) or that he's America's Hitler," he wrote privately to an associate on Facebook in 2016.“
JD Vance
Gee, what could have happened since then to change his mind? We got 4 years of seeing what Trump would actually be like in office, then 4 years of seeing what the other side is like in office, plus a bonus 8 years of seeing everything that was done to sabotage Trump's presidency. J.D Vance is a rare person in America - an adult who is willing to reconsider his earlier opinions.
Hillbilly to Ivy League is the Bill Clinton story once again, right? Women loved Bill Clinton.
Vance has said he “was wrong” about Trump. In an interview this month on Fox News Channel, he was asked to explain his past criticism.
“I didn’t think he was going to be a good president,” Vance said. “He was a great president. And it’s one of the reasons why I’m working so hard to make sure he gets a second term.”
At last! A candidate the ladies can throw their panties at…
Inga said...
"I go back and forth between thinking Trump is a cynical asshole like Nixon who wouldn't be that bad (and might even prove useful) or that he's America's Hitler," he wrote privately to an associate on Facebook in 2016.“
JD Vance
You do know that intelligent people can evolve in their thinking? I thought not.
1. Ann Althouse said...
“How many times do you think Vance will be confronted with that Hitler quote and we'll get to hear his excellent answer?”
Vivek will help him with that. And who knows, his answer may be so excellent it even convinces Inga.
2. doctrev said…
“Do you think the CIA (or certain foreign agencies) will be sleeping terribly comfortably after Saturday's display? I'd certainly be wary if I were them.”
You may be right about that.
This week is a week for great optimism.
Trump/Vance 2024
"This morning Trump called for the Biden administration to provide Secret Service for RFK Jr. This afternoon DHS Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas announced that going forward RFK Jr would, indeed, received Secret Service protection."
With this weekend's assassination attempt, the Biden Administration's shameful behavior was no longer tenable.
I'm happy with this choice. Aren't you?
Since RealClearPolitics aggregate odds have you voting for Trump at around 3.7% what are you happy with?
A) Vance will not help Trump, so that is a good thing
B) I so want to see a Vance - Harris debate.
C) I had money on it and got a nice return: "I'm betting on J.D. Vance..."
D) I actually like Vance as a standard bearer for GOP 2028 because, even though I won't vote GOP, I won't be as unhappy with him in the Whitehouse compared to others.
All Vance has to do when confronted with his past opposition to Trump is to quote Keynes (I think it was): “When I get new facts, I change my mind. What do you do?”
Meanwhile the MSM has to figure out whether to run with Vance views from eight years ago or the claim that Trump is a thin-skinned egotist. The journos are conferring even as we speak.
Yes, I am happy. Donald Trump picked someone who reflects the political realignment that has been happening. The Republicans are becoming the party of the blue collar, the middle class, Main Street after the Democrats abandoned those people for the academic crowd and pressure group faction crowd.
It could have been worse. Trump has a weird liking for Ivy League grads who were Never-Trumpers and now (pretend?) to support him. At least it wasn't Governor Bumstead, a complete zero, or Senator Scott, who's a neocon stooge.
On the plus side, Mitt Romney has stated that he dislikes Vance so much, he doesn't like sitting next to him. I think Hawley would've been a better VP and President, but I guess Trump wanted someone to help win the Midwest.
I am fine with Vance as VP. It does take him out of the running to be president in 28. Though it probably puts him in the running to be the losing presidential candidate in 28.
I am probably reading too much into this but I am happy he picked a senator since the VPs primary job is to be president of the senate. There is a lot of what demmies might call "mischief" that a VP can get into if they are willing to use their powers. The Senate President has more access to levers of power than the Senate Majority Leader. IF THEY ARE WILLING TO USE THEM.
Might Vance be the man to be an activist Senate President?
One can hope.
If he is successful in becoming a "Master of the Senate", as LBJ was, he is not term limited. He could be Vivek's VP in 28 and 32, someone else's in 36 and 40 and so on into a ripe old age. Amassing more and more power each year.
As I said, one can hope. Please don't burst my bubble.
Cynic that I am, what I suspect will really happen is that he will get presidential stars in his eyes, get the 28 nomination, lose and never be heard from again.
I really need to reread Master of the Senate. Just ordered the Kindle version via the portal. I had just started Knock Off and was a dozen pages in but that will have to go back in my virtual pile for a few days.
John Henry
Not sure where to add this, but Mayorkas now approving RFK Jr. USSS protection. The Biden Administration really whiffed on not making that announcement as part of Biden's speech last night. Trump called them out on it, and as noted at Instapundit; it now looks like Trump is running the Administration by merely suggesting what should have been done yesterday.
If Trump wanted a loyal VP, he could have chosen someone who supported him on the Jan 6th recount. that would include Hawley and Rick scott. Why pick a blank slate like JD Vance?
This wont end well. But look at Trump's picks on everything else. If you're loyal to him, you wont get the job. Better be a backstabber and then pretend to like him. Bill Barr and General Milley went that route. Mittens almost got the sec of state job.
I was hoping for but didn't really expect Dr Ben Carson. A fine, decent, man who like Donald Trump actually has a proud record of non-political achievment.
Also a member of my church. (Or at least my denomination)
John Henry
"Hillbilly Elegy" is available on Netflix. Wife and I plan to watch it again after dinner tonight.
The media four years in the future:
"If only VP Vance would be reasonable and moderate like that the statesman George W Bush."
The media in eight years:
"Why can't President Vance be more like that great liberal Republican Trump?"
THE Ohio State University.
I was worried about anyone else. Burgum and Vivek were Pence 2.0.
I've been assured that Donald Trump will prosecute, imprison, possibly execute, and if necessary send SEAL Team 6 to take out his opponents, so Vance had better keep his head on a swivel!
Vance. hasn't triggered any of my BS detectors at this time. But then again, I believed Bill Clinton when he wagged his finger. An important lesson for me.
You know who else has come around? Elon Musk.
In 2023, in interviews with Walter Isaacson for his bio (terrific read, BTW) he was really harsh on Donald Trump the man and President Trump.
He is all in now and has been for a couple months at least.
He also, with X, has the worlds biggest bullhorn or bully pulpit. Or perhaps bullyhorn.
Even people like Inga will eventually figure out that fascism is not the way and will renounce it. In her case it might take another 20-30 years and I worry she may not have enough time.
John Henry
Vivek was among the strongest
You know, with Vance, we could go from a Vice President who is half-Indian to a Vice President whose better half is fully Indian.
I live Vance, but VP is a heartbeat away from the biggest executive job in the world. I'd prefer someone who's got executive experience, but then I prefer governors over senators generally.
Vance is going to get full Qualyle treatment.
I’d like to see the young man Vance doing them6 rallies a day giving Trump some rest. The standard Trump rally speech gets old anyway without an enemy like Hillary. And Lying Demented Creep Biden is not much of an opponent anymore.
"graduated from [The] Ohio State University"
As did my father, class of 1942. Left the farm to go to college, graduated with a BA and Navy lieutenant's uniform. Two weeks to go home and say goodbye to your mother, then off to WWII. He's still living, and I expect he'll be a supporter of JD.
Ann Althouse said...
"Imagine a Vance-Harris VP debate."
Finally we can laugh more than she laughs."
Althouse for the win. After her comment, everything else said ( including this ) is superfluous. Bravo!
I was not enthusiastic about Vance. Sundance at CTH was suspicious but CTH can get a bit carried away. I am also concerned about that RINO Governor appointing his replacement.
I am glad it was not Vivek. Give him a good visible powerful position in the Trump administration and build him up for president in 28.
I am a fan. I am glad he is not going to be wasted on the Vice Presidency.
JD Vance is a fine choice. Basically just another politician but one of the better ones and perhaps as good a VP as it is possible to get.
John Henry
"On the plus side, Mitt Romney has stated that he dislikes Vance so much, he doesn't like sitting next to him."
That is a plus indeed.
Vance is going to get full [Quayle] treatment.
Quayle got a bum rap. I've spoken to him a couple of times and have been pretty impressed with his insight and fund of knowledge.
He didn't have a great debate against Lloyd Bentsen, and the trivial "potatoe" thing was blown out of all proportion by the talk-show comedians. (Not to mention that the teacher in that class full of kids had spelled it that same way on his cue card! Sabotage?)
He was clearly of above average intelligence, a patriot, more conservative than Bush Sr., and a decent guy who could have handled the Presidency if it had come to that.
That said, I think Vance has more native intelligence than all but a handful of nationally known politicians. He's a truly eloquent writer, and seems to be able to hold his own in front of a TV camera. I look forward to seeing him rise to the occasion. What a great American story he has to tell, the modern equivalent of a Lincoln or Jackson.
Hey guys. The Convention is going live. Even Fox News is allowing platform for Trump’s campaign people. And they are good speakers. Tucker Carlson mentioned that a courageous leader gives his followers heart. Yeah that’s true.
Very happy! And his wife is super accomplished. I also like people with ambition and it's clear he's ambitious.
MSNBC is not doing well holding their punch tonight. They are lost dealing with reality outside their narrative bubble and angry slanders.
Is it pea soup or clam chowder
Wikipedia says he's used 3 different surnames (Vance being his mother's). Odd how many recent national political figures have done similar: Ford, Nancy Davis, Clinton, Gingrich, BO.
Dang, Biden just had the worst debate performance in history.
Kamala: Hold my beer.
Trump is Legally Blond = I hope Vance is not snooty bf Warner
JD Vance's thought on Trump have pretty well mirrored my own. I thought he was the worst possible choice of the Republicans in 2015 Nomination cycle. Then the media started lying about him and I started defending him on just a factual basis. He's grown on me. He deserves a second term and he's not going to put up with the media's bullshit this time.
Just please give him a republican house and senate to work with.
As noted elsewhere, in 4 years, we (Republicans) will have a very deep bench.
The VP candidate's first job is to help get the ticket elected. After that he can fade into obscurity, cutting ribbons and attending funerals. I think Vance is well suited to the first task, because he knows how to turn an argument.
Hassayamper said...l
“Quayle got a bum rap. “
Completely agree. I even think that US would be in better shape if Quayle was President instead of Clinton.
All the tricks played on Quayle will be played on Vance and then some.
Yeah, plenty of Republicans told the truth in 2016 and then repented, with Rubio, Cruz, Lee, and Graham coming to mind at once.
I would have liked Stefanik, as long as we’re going for younger less experienced people. Avoids the 2-white-guys problem. And it would be priceless to watch her take apart female journolists and Harris. Plus she would be a constant dare to the D’s to talk about Israel/Hamas. More broadly, she’s an exemplar of the urban ethnic whites who used to be the backbone of the Dem party.
I’m glad it wasnt any of the South Asians. Blacks really hate the H1B’s. An Indo/Pak/whatever VP would erase the gains Trump’s been making with blacks. Even Mrs Vance will probably shave some off.
Speaking of race, a redneck VP will help solidify the white working-class vote, and even the Hispanic vote, since within a generation most of them marry Anglos. Can’t ever say it out loud, but the intended audience will get the message. Instead of scrambling for 13% of the population, grab as much of 70% as you can.
And a Vance/Harris debate should help with the Trumpzilla effect by proxy: any scolding by faces of color and voices of accent just makes Trump stronger. One “I’m speaking” and it’s all over.
JSM
JD Vance’s support for UAW should surprise no one, given his life experiences
This could boost his support in Racine & Superior. Dane County is a lost cause for any Republican.
Politics makes strange bedfellows. I'm reminded of Kamala Harris beating up on Joe Biden in the Democrat primary debates in 2020. She plaintively told Joe "I was that little girl on the bus". Which, according to the media was a devastating blow to Joe and his hopes. A little while later Jim Clyburn arranged the shotgun marriage that got Joe the Democrat nomination, and Kamala the Veep slot. That's the way of these things.
Of course the media, scurrilous as ever, is now bringing up every bad thing Vance ever said about the Bad Orange Man. Get a life you press bozos.
Meantime over at MSNBC, Nicole Wallace is yelling that she can't wait for Harris to debate Vance because, "She will wipe the floor with him." Wallace was smokin' some strong ganja this afternoon. Vance was editor of the Yale Law Journal. Harris went to a B plus law school--not quite first tier. And she flunked the bar exam the first time she took it. Somehow I don't think that the Queen of Word Salad will do so well against the former hillbilly.
he wrote privately to an associate on Facebook in 2016.“
It is currently July, 2024. Do try to keep up.
He (Vance) was my first choice. I am looking forward to him destroying journalists.
I have had reservations about JDV in the past.
It seemed to me that he made his mark by airing his family's dirty laundry and he misjudged Trump's character initially, and I disapproved.
However, I am unburdened by what has been and believe that he has "come around" and is now genuine in his support for Trump and the MAGA agenda and that he will be a highly effective surrogate as the campaign continues and will become an outstanding VP.
Trump/Vance 2024!
Coulda sworn I posted answering in the affirmative. Anyway I like Vance for many reasons and Trump only needs to repaint two letters on the old Trump-Pence plane.
It just occurred to me that there are a lot of Ohio State alums out there and they are very loyal.
Darkisland said...
You know who else has come around? Elon Musk.
In 2023, in interviews with Walter Isaacson for his bio (terrific read, BTW) he was really harsh on Donald Trump the man and President Trump.
He is all in now and has been for a couple months at least.
He also, with X, has the worlds biggest bullhorn or bully pulpit. Or perhaps bullyhorn.
This is going to be an interesting election because for the first time the American people are going to get news and events completely unfiltered.
Republicans always got bigger bounces from their conventions than Democrats and the best hypothesis was that the Republican Convention was the first time people saw Republicans unfiltered without some regime toady in the media telling you how bad they were.
Look at all of the first hand information we are getting surrounding the assassination attempt.
It is all happening on X.
We are seeing real time video that makes the SS failure so blatant and obvious that they will not survive this. All of the information is being disseminated on X. No filters.
Does anyone think this would have happened before Elon bought X? What pictures do you think we would have seen if X was not free of Regime censorship? What do you think the narrative would have been at this point?
X is a fundamental change in how our society works.
In the small world department, Vance worked after law school as an associate at Sidley Austin, the law firm where Michelle and Barack Obama met when he was a summer associate and she an associate.
"X is a fundamental change in how our society works."
Anyone else remember conservatives complaining about censorship on Twitter and being snarked at by the leftards "Well, go get your own place to talk"?
Good times.
Chuck left and Inga returned.
He is extremely good looking. And rumored to wear eyeliner.
The people I know who have met Vance say that he is highly intelligent but without the arrogance / insecurity that often goes with high IQ, so he doesn't feel the need to show off constantly. After he gave a reading and then sat in on a few classes, what I kept hearing was not about his eloquence or his "passion" (which is what most people say about speakers), but what a good LISTENER he was in Q and A sessions.
If you were to go through the comments above and delete every one that is a talking point (which you could see from reading other comment sections around the web), I think you'd find that the only real critiques are lack of large-organization executive experience (i.e., what Obama and Biden also lacked) and the worry about the Peter Thiel connection--which I can't tell if it's even a real connection or if they were just both "venture capitalists" in the Bay Area and then Thiel gave a lot of money to his Ohio campaign. Every single story about this absolutely reeks of dishonesty, so I just don't know. In general Thiel is usually the single free-market economics guy in any Bay Area tech or V.C. gathering--or rather the single guy who will speak up for free markets: all the others are rapacious capitalists in practice but say all the nice progressive things.
(Thiel was at the law school when I was in Journalism school at Stanford (90-91), and we were in a media law class together: he was a good debater and wasn't a whiny bitch about Journalism M.A. students being in the class like some law students were. He was still very active in the Stanford Review even though he had graduated undergrad in '89. The only specific argument I remember is when both he and I were the only two people in the room willing to argue that New York Times vs. Sullivan was a poorly argued decision because there was no definition of what a "public person" was and the ruling should have been only applicable to "public officials." I'm pretty sure he feels even more strongly about this now. I dislike that he used the word PalantÃr for what he has used it for, but other than he doesn't seem like a horrible bogeyman).
So I'm sticking with Vance being absolutely the best pick (Youngkin would be my second choice): Burgum is from a tiny state and seems squishy; Healey is a war-mongering dimwit and they'd assassinate Trump as soon as they could if she were V.P.; I'm afraid that Scott is actually gay and that this would be used to sandbag him at the worst time by the oh-so-tolerant left, creating a distraction; De Santis' campaign was so appallingly awful that he was a NO, plus Deep State suspicions; I also don't trust Rubio not to turn into a Bushy squish.
There are new videos out of clips from a post-shooting Biden interview with Lester Holt.
And, Man, just awful. On NBC!
Kamala might be the nominee after all.
Although, I think that was already my guess, post-debate.
The slope is getting steeper.
4D Chess! DJT knows his administration will resonate with America and, he knows JD will build on that. Thus, for the foreseeable future will the Donk/Prog/Marxist/Islamic wannabe's be constrained, if not eradicated (politically of course).
There's a saying in these here parts where I live - "Pressure bust a pipe."*
Put pressure on a dementia patient and the busting will be accelerated.
*I hope none of the several more finicky grammarians around here weren't harmed by exposure to the quote.
"Kamala might be the nominee after all."
A Trump/Harris debate would be quite entertaining.
Readering: "Yeah, plenty of Republicans told the truth in 2016 and then repented, with Rubio, Cruz, Lee, and Graham coming to mind at once."
You claim to be some sort of lawyer, don't you?
So lets break your moronic comment down:
"Plenty of republicans told the "truth" in 2016"...about what they believed Trump might be about in 2017/18/19/20?
How can one tell the "truth" about soothsaying hypotheticals.
I mean, its well established how many of you psychos on the left hold yourselves out as mind-reading savants, but the normies dont buy into that BS.
As with many Trump critics in 2016, they watched, learned and came to understand the actual truth, not your lefties serial Hoax Mesh "truths" and adjusted accordingly.
Its beyond hilarious you buffoons really think you can relaunch everything from a decade ago as if history hasn't laid bare your lies.
I'm watching the RNC through the instagram lens of a work colleague who is a delegate, and she seems to be having a grand old time.
"Its beyond hilarious you buffoons really think you can relaunch everything from a decade ago as if history hasn't laid bare your lies."
If they could learn from history, they wouldn't be leftists.
The next four months should be interesting. I wonder what the "October Surprise" will be. I just hope it isn't another shooter.
"A Trump/Harris debate would be quite entertaining."
Laughing just thinking about the possibilities.
@Original Mike (5:23), what you wrote in your comment is true, but Mayorkas could have (should have) announced yesterday or first thing in the morning. Announcing that RFK Jr. will (finally!) received Secret Service protection after Trump demanded it makes it look as though Trump shamed him and Joe Biden into doing the right thing.
As perhaps, indeed, he did.
. . . so I was right. Vance was a good choice.
They're going to have to pull him out.
NBC. Hope it plays.
Michael K: "The next four months should be interesting. I wonder what the "October Surprise" will be. I just hope it isn't another shooter."
Long range US weapons attacks into Russia, potentially Moscow, in an attempt to move to large scale war with the russians.
And bird flu.
And the millions of unvetted military aged male illegal aliens allowed to waltz freely into the US from enemy nations conducting terrorist ops inside the US, providing an excuse for the New Soviet Democraticals to target domestic political opponents.
As an Ohioan, my concern is two fold. One we are already set to lose our Senior senator to election loss. Sherrod Brown could have retired with a positive legacy, but had to try one election despite his age. He is unlikely to work in again especially given Biden/Harris as the primary ticket. Two, when Trump/Vance wins, we will have to live through the process of replacing Vance as well.. I was looking forward to the end of this election.
I wasn,t overly excited when Vance was elected but time has shown him to be a good responsive Senator. As to him in a debate with Harris? One of the big complaints about Harris is that she does not do her homework. Vance doesn,t have a lot of experience, but he has demonstrated he is a hard worker and will study what he doesn't yet know. He is going to get accused of "picking on" Harrs if they debate. I wouldn't blame him if he skipped it.
Biden interview live now in California. Joe Biden is a big dummy. Kinda sad if it wasn't so disgusting.
So Inga weighs in with a couple of quotes of dubious contextual value, and presents them with
above-it-all irony. Truly a earth-shattering gotcha moment.
What actual insight do you have to add, Inga?
My main concern is the loss of a seat, and an articulate, effective thinker, in the Senate. I don't agree that Vance is necessarily the best choice - but then, I recognize that I'm not privy to the factors under consideration that drove the choice, so....
I think Vance has been chosen because he's the best recipient of the legacy going forward. Trump has 4 years ahead of him. Vance will be in his mid-40's by then, and he does have an excellent temperament for that role.
Well Powerline returned to their true colors: Vance no good, too young, jumped over boomers, he is anywhere near ready for prime time, Vance reflects the poor judgment to which Trump is occasionally prone. and on and on.
They're going to have to pull him out.
NBC. Hope it plays.
I'm watching it now on MSNBC, where the ladies think Biden is once again "sharp as a track," apparently.
He's repeating his usual slanders - Charlottesville, Jan. 6, two police officers died, "vermin," all the hits. As Lester points out, several times, he wasn't exactly bringing down the temperature.
When asked if he'd heard from the head of the Secret Service, he replied, "Oh, I've heard from 'im." I listened to it several times and it definitely sounds like that to me. Lester saved him - "You've heard from her?"
I will say that his political instincts remain intact.
Remember when Kamala called Biden a racist?
Pepperidge Farm remembers.
Vance.....but what a good LISTENER he was in Q and A sessions.
This is exactly what hear from miriad people who have met Trump for the first time. He listens. It may be that is what influenced Trump's decision.
Gusty Winds said...
Notice Trump skipped over Generation X..
We're a small generation and have been capped by the longevity of the much larger Boomer Generation ahead of us. Not to mention the decaying husks of the Silent Generation still hanging on.
Millennials being the offspring mostly of the much larger Boomer Generation are simply more numerous and moving up at younger ages alongside Gen X.
If you use Strauss and Howe's definition, however, we've already had a Gen X President. (Much earlier than the Silent Generation managed it. If Biden hadn't been nominated or lost in 2020 there might not have been any Silent Generation Presidents.) Barack Obama was born in 1961, the first year of Gen X by their reckoning.
"He is going to get accused of "picking on" Harrs if they debate."
I'm listening to an extended interview of Vance right now (on FoxNews).
Vance/Harris debate is going to be a bloodbath.
"…Mayorkas could have (should have) announced yesterday or first thing in the morning. Announcing that RFK Jr. will (finally!) received Secret Service protection after Trump demanded it makes it look as though Trump shamed him and Joe Biden into doing the right thing."
Agreed.
Vance being interviewed by Sean Hannity.
He is covering every topic known to man.
He is fluent and well versed on everything.
"We're a small generation and have been capped by the longevity of the much larger Boomer Generation ahead of us."
Just hang on a little longer and you'll get your turn to enjoy the bullseye. Eat healthy and exercise.
Once again we get a pig in a poke, a question mark as Republican VP. why Republican presidents refuse to choose well known/popular Senators or Governors with a long track record is beyond me.
Ford chose Dole instead of Reagan
Reagan chose Bush
Bush gave us Qualye
Romney gave us Ryan
McCain gave us Palin
Trump has given us Pence and now Vance (only in office since Jan 2023)
Probably the only exceptions were Kemp and cheney - who were well known but not very popular. Plus, Cheney had left Government in 1993 and so had Kemp. Republican Presidental candidates are always trying to pull a fast one, or just don't care.
Forgive me if this is repetitive - my husband is telling me that Musk just pledged $45 million a MONTH to Trump's campaign.
I rarely watch any cable news, and that includes Fox. But I've been watching the live interview of J.D. Vance. He's not just smart. He's very personable and likeable, something that's not commonly found in a Republican. His life story is the classic American Dream and will resonate with blue collar America.
Overall, a formidable presence. A brilliant choice. The Democrats are going to have a tough time trying to handle the future comparison between Vice President candidates. Do they have a "mercy rule" for VP debates? This is going to be ugly.
Is there an agreed to VP debate? Harris might decline. She'll need an excuse. Hitler is already taken, but she could compare Vance to Goebbels.
He's repeating his usual slanders - Charlottesville, Jan. 6, two police officers died, "vermin," all the hits.
I could only bring myself to watch long enough just to see whether Dolt pushed back on the Charlottesville slander. Of course he didn't, just smiled and moved onto the next question.
Tucker Carlson is on the dais - wouldn't it be something if he were the next press secretary?
TRUMP, TRUMP HE’S OUR MAN, IF HE CAN’T DO IT, VANCE CAN.
MSNBC is re testing their old Putin is really happy because Vance like Trump does Moynawant to escalate the War with Russia over Ukraine. Clearly pro USSR.
Reported that Harris called Vance to congratulate and said she agreed to debate on August 13, one of the two dates previously discussed between the campaigns, the other being this month. Both dates were before the Democratic convention.
"Tucker Carlson is on the dais - wouldn't it be something if he were the next press secretary?"
Oh, please!
Harris did fine against Pence, and she has debate experience in California, and in the 2020 presidential primary (famously going after Biden).
I don't think Pence is a very good debater.
Harris did fine against Pence, and she has debate experience in California, and in the 2020 presidential primary (famously going after Biden).
Was that the "I am speaking!" debate? I can't remember.
I dunno. It would be interesting to hear two younger people debating policy rather than whatever the last debate was. (No, Trump did not lie 28 times. Don't be silly. But it was just so painful to watch our current president be so feeble and lost.)
I look forward to it.
O. Mike, is your "Oh, please!" More of an "Oh, puh-LEASE," or an " Oh, pleasepleasepleaseplease!" Naturally either is cool with me - I'm just wondering.
I am fairly agnostic on Carlson myself. I would enjoy seeing him up there though - he Knows Too Much and would Take No Sh*t.
But we've all heard criticisms of Trump, and here's someone who knew and felt the criticisms, but he came around. And he's going to be telling us, eloquently, how he came around.
Yep. Every time Dems hit him with that, he gets to hit back with "this is why I changed my mind."
Rather than being the "hitman", this VP gets to be the positive uplifting messenger
Oh, pleasepleasepleaseplease! Pretty please with sugar on top!
Tucker vs the White House Press Corp would be epic.
planetgeo said...
I rarely watch any cable news, and that includes Fox. But I've been watching the live interview of J.D. Vance. He's not just smart. He's very personable and likeable, something that's not commonly found in a Republican. His life story is the classic American Dream and will resonate with blue collar America.
It's also going to resonate with those suburban voters who've been moving D. A lot of them would like their kids to go to Yale Law, too
"Our Resident Dullard Inga said:
Of course Trump would choose him after he said this."
Kamala called Biden a racist months before being named VP you dumb c***
Tucker vs the White House Press Corp would be epic.
I would love it. What a change from the perpetually barely hanging in there KJP! Not going to get my hopes up though.
I'd be surprised if Tucker would do it, but he might just consider it fun.
Wait until the usual suspects notice that Senator Vance is a convert to the Catholic religion (and to the 'wrong' sort of it, too, not to Mr Biden's Father Drinan's nonsense version).
I haven't much to say, except that Vance is young, still learning and changing. I hope Trump gives him jobs that will build up his experience. It will be interesting to see how he develops, he might have some interesting ideas for staffing. Hiring is always something of a crap shoot, so only time will tell.
If I had my druthers, Eisenhower would be in the running, not least because of the way he handled the Mexican workers who had come into the country during WWII. You don't hear much about that, a mark of how well he handled it.
My wife asked me why every mainstream outlet is going with "Vance, once a critic of Trump..." framing. "It makes it look like Trump can convert people to his point of view, and if makes it look like Vance can learn from mistakes."
I don't really have a good answer. Does anyone? (I mean besides the obvious that it's a talking point that someone put out). Is the media just being really stupid in thinking that they can black-pill some of Trump's voters who they imagine can't handle the idea that Vance once criticized the God-Emperor? Or are they thinking that they'll have the excuse to endlessly repeat Vance saying the same things that have been said about Trump a million times already? Do they really think that this is some kind of 3rd-grader hypocrisy-trap?
I am genuinely confused, as it seems, well, a rather bold strategy. But let's see how it works out for them.
JD warmed up to Trump. So?
You leftist hate-cultists sure are a-holes.
“Every bad person I’ve ever met in a lifetime in Washington was aligned against JD Vance.” -
@TuckerCarlson
.
I started thinking Trump might be OK around the time of the golden escalator descent, late spring 2016; not out of any great gift of prescience but because I was a faithful reader of "Spy" Magazine circa 1991 - which publication nailed every conceivable Trump foible, counter-and-clockwise. After "Spy" there was nothing salacious or startling to report about the guy: finance, girls, parties, lines, limos, NY City, discos - laid out like Sunday brunch. Around that time, I was a subscriber to Ricochet, basically a front-row, hospital-delivery-room birthing of the grotesque Never-Trump baby. It was ugly. Poor Mona Charen. I tried to tell my fellow Ricochet conservatives/Republicans - what it was like to live in the Leftoidal Cloaca Maxima that is Seattle - like being trapped in an impermeable, never-ending loop of NPR Radio with no hope of anything normal, free, easy, fun, non-political in sight, except an occasional glimpse of Mount Rainier. Maybe a blustery, slightly kooky, sort-of patriotic, sort-of conservative ex-playboy, non-politician might not be such a bad throw of the dice after all the Monsters of the Deep on offer? I was not missed at Ricochet.
Summa cum laude
vs
Summa cum loudly
Readering said...
Harris did fine against Pence, and she has debate experience in California, and in the 2020 presidential primary (famously going after Biden).
Just 2 Democrats debating each other. No real shocker that Pence helped Harris out because they were on the same team.
The only time Harris debated someone that was not a Democrat POS was when Tulsi Gabbard ended her campaign.
Dex Quire said...
I was not missed at Ricochet.
You were missed. Nevertrumpers are just too dumb to know what they lose when they ban people.
Intelligent people who speak their minds get banned from places like Ricochet and Powerlineblog.
I'd a rather he chose Ben Carson, but JD seems like he's a pretty smart guy.
Interesting.
Tucker likes Vance and thinks this is a good thing.
The way the 'trad conservatives' are screaming, I'd say Trump made a good choice.
Everyone wants a 'perfect' candidate, a 'perfect' VP pick by their standards. But what you've got are humans - not angels, not characters in a book, not creations that magically take on all the best aspects with none of the flaws.
And how's that work out? You had McCain, Romney - either 'perfect' candidates or 'Hell, it's his turn, let him run.'
So - Trump? Vance? Yeah, that works pretty well for me.
Achilles said...
Dex Quire said...
I was not missed at Ricochet.
You were missed. Nevertrumpers are just too dumb to know what they lose when they ban people.
Intelligent people who speak their minds get banned from places like Ricochet and Powerlineblog.
7/16/24, 12:41 AM
Absolutely true.
My wife asked me why every mainstream outlet is going with "Vance, once a critic of Trump..." framing.
So they can paint him as some stupid flibbertigibbet, the same way the media looks at all Republicans. (Quayle part 2, anyone...?!)
As we speak Inga is marshalling her army of cats led by general mittens. Each has a first and last name and will be shortly filling out mail in ballots.
Readering. You guys went out of your way to destroy all the the other republican candidates. You figured Trump was such a doofus nobody would take him seriously and Hillary was shoe in.
You were wrong. You have been wrong for a very long time. And yet you never question why your wrong.
What a refreshing choice. A guy who pulled himself out of poverty by sheer will and determination. He is the son of a drug addict whose father left him at 6. He joined the military and then used the GI bill to attend college. He got into Yale Law School and became a successful lawyer and businessman. His wife is lovely, and his kids are too cute. He is articulate, bright and is a good-looking guy. He speaks for the working man of every race. I didn't know much about him until watching an interview he had with fox news morning show. He impressed me greatly, as did his wife. The left would be going after anyone who Trump picked. Their rage and hatred already got one Trump supporter killed. I don't think the media realizes that their words are meaningless now to most of the country. They already forget the assassination attempt on Trump. But we haven't.
JAORE said...
Has Inga forgotten Kamala called Biden a racist When asked later she responded, "It was a DEBATE (cackle, cackle)? And then it was on to the next subject.
Pepperidge Farm remembers.
Rusty said...
Readering. You guys went out of your way to destroy all the the other republican candidates. You figured Trump was such a doofus nobody would take him seriously and Hillary was shoe in.
I agree with the last half of that 'graph but not really the first part. The Democrats helped Trump mostly by holding their fire and giving him a platform via their media adjunct but the rest of the Republican candidates formed a circular firing squad in the 2016 primary, too.
Hassayamper:
This senile idiot, this blowhard plagiarist from the bottom quintile of a third-tier toilet law school, who never once earned a nickel that didn't come from taxes paid by the rest of us, has not the smallest clue where prosperity comes from. He is corrupt beyond the wildest dreams of Nigerian oil ministers, and a pervert to boot. He is no more capable of running this country than that equally foolish former bus driver Maduro who runs Venezuela, and if we re-elect him we will look more like Venezuela than America in four more years.
Well said.
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