August 12, 2017

"After the [white nationalist] rally at a city park was dispersed, a car plowed into a crowd near the city’s downtown mall, killing at 32-year-old woman..."

"Some 35 were injured; at least 19 in the car crash, according to a spokeswoman for the University of Virginia Medical Center. The authorities did not immediately say whether the episode was related to the white nationalists’ demonstration, but several witnesses and video of the scene suggested that it might have been intentional. Chief Thomas said that a suspect had been taken into custody and that police were treating the episode as a criminal homicide. Witnesses said a crowd of counterdemonstrators, jubilant because the white nationalists had left, was moving up Fourth Street, near the mall, when a gray sports car came down the road and accelerated, mowing down several people and hurling at least two in the air."

The NYT reports.

President Trump said (NYT):
"We condemn in the strongest possible terms this egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides... It’s been going on for a long time in our country. It’s not Donald Trump, it’s not Barack Obama."

After calling for the “swift restoration of law and order,” Mr. Trump offered a call for unity among Americans of “all races, creeds and colors.”
And:
“We ALL must be united & condemn all that hate stands for. There is no place for this kind of violence in America. Lets come together as one!”
Some people think this "on many sides" nonspecificity is a problem. For example, Chuck Schumer: “Until @POTUS specifically condemns alt-right action in Charlottesville, he hasn’t done his job.”

224 comments:

1 – 200 of 224   Newer›   Newest»
Fabi said...

Of course Schumer is trying to score cheap political points. Film at 11:00.

Assistant Village Idiot said...

You mean like Schumer does when it's leftist violence?

mockturtle said...

Most articles indicate that the counter-protesters initiated the violence.

Hagar said...

Fox's Mckelway mentions the counter-protestors looked to be as heavily armed as the "white supremacists."

madAsHell said...

I just don't understand people that would participate in a protest. It's not like the protest is going to have a happy ending, and we all go home feeling like our time was well spent.

It's almost as fruitless as commenting at Althouse.

Big Mike said...

Has Schumer condemned the antifa's violent counter protest? One side showed up hoping for a fight. If people had ignored them, they'd have gone home. But the other side showed up just as eager for violence. Amazing that only one person was killed. McAuliffe thought he could ride the Virginia governorship into the White House. Not if he can't restore order.

Tommy Duncan said...

It would be good if people like Schumer would wait until we know what actually happened before offering criticism.

Mary Beth said...

Did Schumercondemn leftwing violence when Steve Scalise and the others were shot?

Michael K said...

Like ARM on this blog, the left is invested in the myth that "right wing violence" is the problem.

The worst part of this is that left wing violence makes a lure for nutcases to come out with these neo-Nazi things looking for a fight.

It escalates and people get killed. Not nearly as many as it will be after some more hysteria. I wonder if, as usual, TV and media people are more numerous than demonstrators.

Bob Ellison said...

"antifa", what a crock. That's a juvenile name for idiots who think they're fighting evil, even without acknowledging that evil exists.

Hey, antifa, show your face. You're a fa, antifa.

rhhardin said...

Hatred is okay. Lots of people hate Schumer for example. But they're not trying to kill him, just ridicule him. Maybe they can bring him around.

Not likely so long as the news has its audience, though. Too tempting for him.

Mac McConnell said...

So what happens when the driver that drove into the crowd turns out to be an 18 years old doper living in his father's basement and driving his father's car, who just happens to have anti-Trump postings on his social media?

I imagine these Antfa bloc get togethers have great dope and easy Bohemian women.

rhhardin said...

Trump would do well to come out against stupidity, starting with the media and its audience.

rhhardin said...

Big hatefest today, violence, noise, come one come all. We have cameras and national attention available.

Help us out. We're dying over here. Big news dry spell.

Mac McConnell said...

The Left is not going to like these new "protest" rules they've normalized.

rhhardin said...

Protest, antitest and syntest.

Renee said...

"I just don't understand people that would participate in a protest. It's not like the protest is going to have a happy ending, and we all go home feeling like our time was well spent.

It's almost as fruitless as commenting at Althouse."


But I am actually reading and listening to your opinion, which is nothing like these protests.

Renee said...

My question was Tim Kaine's son present at these protests?

Renee said...

@ Mac, the owner of the car is a registered republican.

AReasonableMan said...

I actually feel a bit sorry for President Dumb-Genes in these situations, human empathy is not one of his strengths.

harrogate said...

Whomever the attacker identifies with--left, right, whatever--he has committed a terrorist act.

Some are sanguine about a "coming hot war." Others seem less so, but want to somehow suggest that such events are warranted.

Sad!

Matthew Sablan said...

Which one is it? From an actual source.

Scott said...

White Nationalists and Anti Fascists.

Dumb and Dumber.

ad1980 said...

I previously posted "/pol/ has already identified the guy. He's, unsurprisingly, a leftist." But it appears /pol/ got it wrong. Deleted the post.

Feste said...

~
Yes, "wait until we know what actually happened before offering criticism."

Renee said...

"White Nationalists and Anti Fascists.

Dumb and Dumber."

So you are siding with White Nationalist, because they are 'dumb' and not 'dumber'.

Brookzene said...

Nice words but this guy built his reputation on being as confrontational as he could possibly be while staying legal. You can't be both ways about this, you'll be defined by your behaviors.

Bob Loblaw said...

I haven't heard Schumer condemning the "day ending in 'y'" violence from the left. Whatever can he mean about Trump not doing his job?

Brookzene said...

I actually feel a bit sorry for President Dumb-Genes in these situations, human empathy is not one of his strengths.

That's for sure. He says it because that's suddenly how he's feeling in this moment. Tomorrow it will be completely different. It's like he's the only one who doesn't know that.

Hagar said...

"White nationalists" is kind of a funny designation.
Nationalist is a derogatory term now?
Most nations are strongly in favor of nationalism - at least where their own nation is concerned.

harrogate said...

Matthew,

I don't think anyone knows yet. But I gotta say, I'm scared and have been for a while. I see zero reasons for optimism.


Hell, I'm sort of old at this point so personally it's like whatever. But our kids all deserve so much better than the shitstorm we've turned this country into, IMO

rcocean said...

Latest is that the driver is an anti-Trump open borders type. Just what you'd expect. 90% of all violence comes from the Left. The people against "hate". LoL.

If we hear no more about the driver/killer from the MSM, you can take it as confirmation.

If he turns out to be Alt-right or a "Nazi" - you'll be seeing his face on TV for the next week.

rehajm said...

Fortunately Schumer never had Trump's job.

Scott said...

Renee, you're practicing the inane faux-calculus that progressives use to determine which tribe a person that they don't know belongs to.

Tribalism is killing this country. And today in Virginia there are actual dead people.

And if you put a gun to my head and I had to choose, I would say that the Antifa tribe is marginally stupider. If they were grownups, they would let the White Nationalists demonstrate their silly narcissistic shit to a bored community. Instead, the Antifas, by violent virtue signaling, elevated the White Nationalists. That is definitely stupider; unless that was a submerged motive, in which case Antifa was diabolically stupider and even less patriotic.

And I apologize for taking your jape seriously.

Rusty said...

Michael K @ 6:32
They're just butt-hurt because they thought they had the monopoly on violence. They can't stand when the unapproved other stand up for themselves.

rcocean said...

This is how the MSM and Left fucks up America.

Couple of right-wingers or "Nazis" decide to protest something in ONE Town in a country with 320 million.

Should be local story.

But of course, the Leftist have to show up with 10x the people and cause violence. THis gives the MSM the excuse to plaster it all over the news, and make it the most important topic - Ever, ever.

At bottom this is a minor story, but the Left and the MSM make it a world-wide story.

Narayanan Subramanian said...

How many Americans know that the Iranian crowd would start chanting when TV cameras would light up for 'America held hostage'?

Did ABC / Ted Koppel ever show the embassy at other times or from other angles?

Fortunes and reputations have been built gulling Americans for the past century.

HT said...

Holy shit. All hands on deck in Charlottesville. That video is horrific.

Leora said...

I don't expect a fair account of what happened any where in the press but this is what it looks to me. Some obnoxious but initially peaceful idiots were protesting the removal of a Confederate statue by marching while holding Tiki torches and Confederate flags. Some sported Nazi regalia and some were dressed in a paramilitary fashion.

This group was attacked by the same sort of folks who shut down conservative lectures on college campuses - many of them with their faces covered. They used pepper spray, aerosol sprays lit on fire, and baseball bats as shown in pictures posted on Twitter. Some twitters state that the local police were instructed not to interfere with the attacks which were responded to by the marching group who carried various baseball bats and flag poles with violence. Though some of the protestors had firearms, there were not reports of shooting.

The permitted protest was shut down by police as the result of the brawling and the initial group was leaving the area while the Antifa/BLM/etc thugs celebrated by blocking the street and bashing peoples' cars with bats as well as chanting "Fuck the Police" as the police tried to clear the area. I don't know if there was any damage done to buildings and cars in the area but I'd bet there was.

One of the guys in a car apparently lost it and accelerated into two other stopped cars - probably intentionally but maybe not. About 19 people were injured in the crash and one woman was killed. The police detained the driver and took possession of his automobile. I suspect that all the injured were blocking the cars as they tried to leave. I have seen some twitter reports indicating the driver was not a Trump supporter.

There were additional riot related injuries requiring hospitalization affecting about 15 to 20 people. Two police officers were killed in a helicopter crash that was related to the demonstration but not apparently caused by demonstrators on either side. This is being reported as Neo-Nazi violence kills 3 and injures more than 30 and that is not truthful.

Trump's statement blaming all sides looks on the money to me.

Rabel said...

This is the latest headline from AP. If that "linked" doesn't set off your bullshit meter you should get it checked. Two deaths were from the horrible police helicopter crash. The third was from the Dodge driver whose identity hasn't been released.

"Officials: White nationalist rally linked to 3 deaths"

rcocean said...

Here's another thing.

The fact that you, or chuck schumer, or Orin hatch, "Hates Virginia Nazis" means jack shit.

We've got 100 problems that are 10x more important than "Virginia Nazis".

But people sure do love to preen and boast about hating "hate".

Its like living in 1933 Weimar Germany and having people rattle on about how they "hate" the Kaiser.

Tyrone Slothrop said...

Some of us saw this coming a long time ago. When we are told endlessly that black lives matter but white ones don't, that to even say that all lives matter is unforgivably racist, when Obama's DOJ does not merely countenance black rioters but encourages them, we should expect that white people will learn the power of identity politics.

Of course this does not justify white racism or violence, but it does mean that this awful situation could have been avoided if the left had not been glued wrist and ankle to division as a tactic, and anti-white racism as a strategy. Contrary to what Stanford sociology professors might teach, whites are not born racists, but if you force them onto that field they will play the game.

Rabel said...

"Whomever the attacker identifies with--left, right, whatever--he has committed a terrorist act."

Nothing to worry about:

"We can absorb a terrorist attack."

B. Obama 2010

MayBee said...

I'm very confused about who the players were in all of this. I get there were white nationalists. But then who were the counter protesters? I saw guys in green helmets and uniforms fighting with guys in black shirts.

I tried to watch CNN to find out, but they are so busy condemning Trump for saying "many sides" they can't be bothered to explain who was involved.

HT said...

I tried to watch CNN to find out, but they are so busy condemning Trump for saying "many sides" they can't be bothered to explain who was involved. Good God, then watch Fox.

n.n said...

White nationalists or nationalists who are white, white Hispanic, white black, etc.?

There was a similar narrative spun by the SPLC et al about militias, until they encountered black Americans leading and the [class] diversitist narrative was decapitated, dismembered like an "other" in an ISIS adventure or a baby processed by the Planned Parenthood corporation.

MayBee said...

And yes, that car attack is horrific. I bet the nazi idiot who did it (I'm assuming) sits around and hates on muslims when one plows a car into a crowd. And now he's just the same as them.

(I also don't get the competition to label something "terrorism". It's almost like "terrorism" is an adjective that means "the worst kind of crime") rather than an action with a motivation behind it. It's as if any hate crime is now terrorism. I think it's a way to get back at people who call attacks by muslims 'terrorism", and want to make other people just as bad. But that isn't how it works. Columbine was horrible, but it wasn't terrorism. Sandy Hook was just about the worst thing ever, but it wasn't terrorism)

Angel-Dyne said...

Hagar: Most nations are strongly in favor of nationalism - at least where their own nation is concerned.

Ordinary citizens of nations tend to be in favor of nationalism - i.e., they think it's the job of the leaders they elect to look after their interests. But among the upper governing castes of Western nations, "nationalism" and "nationalist" have been dirty words for quite some time now.

It's a bit of a puzzle what people who equate any meaningful level of national identity and national sovereignty with Naziism are doing running, ya know, nations, but most people in the West don't seem to have quite caught on to the reality that most of their "national" leaders don't believe in sovereign nations, and don't have any particular sense of duty to the people who elect them. You think "nationalism" having taken on a completely derogatory connotation in that caste would've clued people in, but no.

n.n said...

This could be the inauguration of Trump, but, curiously, not Obama who promised redistributive change. I wonder what difference that makes.

HT said...

"Columbine was horrible, but it wasn't terrorism. Sandy Hook was just about the worst thing ever, but it wasn't terrorism"

Wow. So who said those two atrocities were terrorism? OTOH, I thought the DC sniper was an example of terrorism.

Feste said...

SFGate (Old San Francisco Chronicle)

”Protesters call for Oakland demonstration against white supremacy";

“A group calling itself Bay Area United Against White Supremacy planned the ‘emergency solidarity demo’ for 7 p.m. at 14th Street and Broadway ....”

The sidebar streaming video caught my attention in the same article: “15 Kids from 11 Countries Left Children's Fairyland with Citizenship," hosted by "The U.S. Citizenship & Immigration Services," because “this is what makes America Great.”

Oakland is enjoying a partial renaissance, rejuvenating old houses in old neighborhoods. Some look pretty neat. I'll watch to see who shows up for the emergency solidarity demo. If it turns out that a white supremacist drove the car way yonder that killed and injured people, look for a closure of the Oakland Bay Bridge as people march both ways (from San Francisco) and meet in the middle.

n.n said...

Fortunately, American nationalism does not discriminate by "color of skin", as the nation of South Africa does in its progressive constitution. The right-wing in South Africa is a relic of [class] diversity times in a progressive era, past, present, and future.

Ken B said...

When will people learn not to shoot from the hip when they get initial reports? Trump did not (he often has in the past), and good for him. His task right now, before the dust settles is
1 express condemnation of violence and hatred
2 not complicate the job of local officials
3 not prejudice future proceedings
4 not inflame passions

He's done exactly that. Maybe in a few days he will need to say or do more. But now is not a few days hence.

HT said...

"The hate and division must stop, and must stop right now."

That's gonna be tough for him.

Clyde said...

Those "some people" are the ones who think that the left-wing Antifa types just showed up to sing "Kumbayah." In other words, they are ignorant half-wits. Both sides showed up prepared to play violently, and they got what they came for. And yes, the left-wing Antifa types are just as bad as the Nazi/Klan/White Nationalist types. Both are hateful and intolerant extremists, two sides of the same evil coin.

Dave Begley said...

Could Schumer just shut up for once?

harrogate said...

May Bee,

I agree with you about columbine and sandy hook .

To me, terrorism is when you attacks civilians to achieve a political point. Those horrific events were just evil madness that I can't even wrap my head around, any better than I can understand terrorism

eric said...

Looks like the guy driving the care was a registered Republican from Ohio who is an Alt Right Trump supporter. Or so the media is telling me.

Here is what happens next.

Step 1: Demand Trump denounce the right over and over and over again. Each time he does, or any Republican does, make sure to say it isn't enough.

Step 2: Make sure to link everyone on the right to this one guy who will most likely be convicted of murder.

Step 3: Point out that if it weren't for the existence of Republican and Conservatives and White People, this never would have happened and today would have been a nice, loving, peaceful day.

Step 4: Denounce anyone who points out that the protest was peaceful and there were no issues until the counter protesters showed up. Don't mention that BLM and AntiFa don't need any counter protesters to show up in order for the riots to begin.

Bay Area Guy said...

Assymetrical warfare:

1. When the Left wants to rally, they just march and rally. Their opponents don't show up to "protest" their rally.

2. When the Right wants rally, often the Left shows up to "protest" the rally - and sometimes heated words turn into violent acts.

The solution is to show up for your own causes, but resist the impulse to protest your opponent's rally.

Angel-Dyne said...

Tyrone Slothrop: Contrary to what Stanford sociology professors might teach, whites are not born racists, but if you force them onto that field they will play the game.

Actually whites are "born racist", just like every other flavor of human is. So the problem isn't that Stanford sociology professors teach that per se. (It would be rather refreshing if we could accept, study and discuss this universal human tendency like sane civilized people, instead of having ceded the field to hustlers and deranged people.)

No, the problem is that "Stanford sociology professors" are virulent haters of whites (or just broken mental cases, if they're white) who've been hiding behind a big reeking pile of pseudo-scholarship to pursue an anti-white agenda. And geez, it's not as if these days they're making much of an effort to hide it anymore, either.

roesch/voltaire said...

As David Duke stated the Trump supporters are making their voice and physical self heard and felt.

Michael K said...

That's for sure. He says it because that's suddenly how he's feeling in this moment. Tomorrow it will be completely different. It's like he's the only one who doesn't know that.

This does no one any good. .You may think you are clever to join the Trump bashing lefties but this is not solving a single problem.

Blacks are moving south to get away from anarchist cities ruled by leftists like Emmanuel and DeBlasio.

I get you don't like Trump. He is the President. You can campaign for his opponent in 2020.

You people have no idea how to run a country or how to run anything.

The initial word is that he is a lefties Antifa supporter. If that were true the police in a leftist city like Charlottesville would act exactly as they have. That city is a college town like Berkeley or San Jose. The police get orders to leave the left wing rioters alone.

We all know that, even you.


Michael said...

Why do only lefties know what David fucking Duke has to say? Weird as shit. They hear his every word. LOL

Matthew Sablan said...

It's a shame that Trump began his efforts to keep violence from getting out of hand with canceling a campaign event, only to be rewarded with more violence, so he decided, "Screw it. They want a fight, we'll give it to'em."

And now, here we are.

Paco Wové said...

"As David Duke stated the Trump supporters are making their voice and physical self heard and felt."

As are his opponents, RV.

Big Mike said...

@HT, yes and no on the DC sniper. It had the look of terrorism, however there is a theory that the random attacks were to disguise their murdering John Muhammad's ex-wife, who lived in Maryland. It's a plot out of Agatha Christie: hide a deliberate murder inside a group of random murders.

@Leora, superb summary that fills in some blanks on the mainstream reporting. May I commend you?

@roesch, "David Duke" is a dog whistle that only mange-ridden mitts like you can hear.

Big Mike said...

Mutts

HT said...

Blacks are being priced out of more than a few cities.

NYT: The Charlottesville street fights were the latest in a series of tense dramas unfolding across the United States over plans to remove statues and other historical markers of the Confederacy.

This is probably not going to get any better any time soon. It is extremely extremely difficult for Southerners. And I mean extremely. It seems that the decision came all of a sudden.

A couple of years ago, the then-governor of Alabama removed the confederate flag from the capital. That was a good decision. But the more we have name changes (schools, streets, etc) the more we have statue removals, the more difficult this is going to be. Mitch Landrieu sometimes sounds discordant to me, and though I don't know what the answer is, his prescription is a little hard to take.

Crimso said...

WaPo has identified him. Strangely, they give no info other than name, age, and last known residence.

Dr Weevil said...

Why do lefties think anyone David Duke endorses is ipso facto despicable, and when did they decide to think that? Duke endorsed Obama nine years ago. Did that make Obama despicable? I'll give you a hint: even if Obama is despicable (he is), it's not because of Duke's endorsement.

Angel-Dyne said...

roesch/Voltaire: As David Duke stated the Trump supporters are making their voice and physical self heard and felt.

Considering the long string of violent and murderous lefties you (by your own logic, not mine) should be flagellating yourself for, it's a wonder you have any free time to pop by and so generously preach about other people's guilt-by-association.

Nice of you to take time out of your busy self-mortification schedule like that, r/V.

Tyrone Slothrop said...

Michael said...
Why do only lefties know what David fucking Duke has to say? Weird as shit. They hear his every word. LOL


Dog whistle.

HT said...

It had the look of terrorism, however there is a theory that the random attacks were to disguise their murdering John Muhammad's ex-wife, who lived in Maryland.

And there are all sorts of psychological, emotional reasons people decide to commit suicide and murder others in the name of ideology. Just because there's that angle does not mean it was not also politically motivated.

Angel-Dyne said...

Crimso: WaPo has identified him. Strangely, they give no info other than name, age, and last known residence.

Well, who knows, but unless he was driving it ironically, I'm inclined to assume that a guy driving a Dodge Challenger was a neo-Nazi, not an antifa, if it has to be one or the other.

Kansas Scout said...

Democrats are overinvested in keeping radical conflict going while Trump is President. They have coddled the "Antifa" people and fail to condemn them. This is a deliberate attempt to make nation ungovernable so they can "come to the rescue" claim the mantle of "normal" and regain power.

Titus said...

David duke spoke today from Charlottesville praising trump. Do any of u deplorables reading anything other than fox and breitbart?

roesch/voltaire said...

You can see the Dog Whistle on Red State which has the video with this quote:DUKE: This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back. We’re going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump. Because he said we’re going to take our country back, and that’s what we’re going to do.
For the record I have stated on this blog and other places that I am against violent protests and terrorism no matter who commits the acts. While I was protesting the war etc, I never noticed that the police left lefties alone-- I would suggest that history shows just the opposite.

Paco Wové said...

Titus: lay off the poppers, dude. You're not making sense.

Paco Wové said...

"For the record I have stated on this blog and other places that I am against violent protests and terrorism no matter who commits the acts."

That's nice. It would be even nicer if you were against indiscriminately tarring your ideological opponents.

Renee said...

"David duke spoke today from Charlottesville praising trump. Do any of u deplorables reading anything other than fox and breitbart?"

And according to the election results, lots of Obama voters shifted their praise for Trump as well. Your point?

Michael K said...

While I was protesting the war etc, I never noticed that the police left lefties alone-- I would suggest that history shows just the opposite.

And they left you alone as you were spitting on returning veterans ?

Jupiter said...

"For example, Chuck Schumer: “Until @POTUS specifically condemns alt-right action in Charlottesville, he hasn’t done his job."

Well, there is something to be said for specificity. And the reality here is that a group of self-identified White people decided to have a rally, protesting the racial hatred being spewed at us by Left Fascists, and a bunch of Left Fascist thugs decided they were not going to allow that. They armed themselves, and they attacked the White demonstrators. I think Trump should have specifically condemned the armed Leftists.

I suppose it is progress of a sort that Chuck Schumer finally recognizes who won our last Presidential election.

Dr Weevil said...

r/v (8:26pm):
If "the war" is Vietnam, that was a long long time ago. There are numerous contemporary examples (especially in college towns) of the police leaving the left alone while arresting the right, or allowing the left to beat up the right with impunity. Charlottesville looks like an example of the latter. If newspapers can be trusted (year, I know), the Nazis were heavily outnumbered, there was a lot of violence, 15+ people were hospitalized NOT including the ones hit by the car, and there was one (1!) arrest - the driver of the car. What the Hell were the police doing the rest of the day? Encouraging the Antifas to attack the Nazis? Sure looks like it, and an awful lot of people on my Twitter feed are gloating about 'punching Nazis' and admiring the picture of the shirtless black guy using an improvised flamethrower on a Nazi, laughing about Nazis with bleeding faces, sneering at Nazis lying on the ground getting the tear gas washed out of their eyes, laughing at Nazis getting their improvised shields stolen and smashed, and generally vicariously enjoying anti-Nazi violence. I find them as contemptible as the Nazis - more so if the rumor is true that they didn't have a permit, while the Nazis (as everyone agrees) did.
No matter how revolting someone's politics are, it's not illegal for them to demonstrate, to carry disgusting signs, or even to carry torches. Assaulting them is still wrong.
Anyone who doesn't see this might want to consider what would happen if the shoe were on the other foot. I think Bill Ayres - an actual unrepentant terrorist - is an even worse human being than David Duke. Would it be OK to beat him up, or attack him with a flamethrower, at his next booksigning? How about Noam Chomsky - a truly contemptible man? Peter Singer, who thinks it's OK to kill babies? Someone on my twitter feed alleged that the woman killed by the car was a member of the Wobblies (Industrial Workers of the World), a violent revolutionary gang of union thugs since 1905. Does that make it OK to run over her? It would be really nice if the left would step back from the idea that violence is perfectly OK as long as it's aimed at the right.

Big Mike said...

@Titus, I care less about what David Duke has to say than I care about what you have to say. And I don't give a damn what you have to say.

Angel-Dyne said...

r/V: For the record I have stated on this blog and other places that I am against violent protests and terrorism no matter who commits the acts.

What is this in response to? You appear to be implying that there are people here who aren't?

Regardless, as a response to anything that anybody's said here it's a complete non sequitur.

So I'll ask you again, since you're all excited about David Duke and appear to believe he has some inherent connection to all "Trump supporters": Considering the long string of violent and murderous lefties you (by your own logic, not mine) should be flagellating yourself for, how do you have any free time to pop by and so generously preach about other people's guilt-by-association?

While I was protesting the war etc, I never noticed that the police left lefties alone-- I would suggest that history shows just the opposite.

Yeah, 'cause the best way to get at the truth of what's going on right now is to filter everything through a Boomer haze of memories of events from 40 years ago, ya daft old bugger.

Dr Weevil said...

Titus should probably have read my 8:09pm comment - just 13 minutes before his - and thought about it before writing his. It might have saved him the embarrassment.

D. said...

"David duke spoke today from Charlottesville praising trump. Do any of u deplorables reading anything other than fox and breitbart?"

fu keith ellison!

Birkel said...

I am aware that a person named David Duke exists. Other than the standard guilt by association argument that Leftist Collectivists want to make, who the hell gives a shit about him? I

What makes David Duke interesting or informative about anything?

And why date yourself by constantly referencing a 1980s, no talent, no nothing nobody? Is that how you attract new voters?

Makes no sense to me.

mockturtle said...

I think everyone who can read [we can no longer assume] should read several good books on the French Revolution. We all need to realize what a small but precipitous step it can be from civility to barbarity.

Hagar said...

Well, I have no intention of leaving off my nationalist sentiments for Norway, the country of my birth, and I can hardly do less for my adopted country, the United States of America.
It is a rather weird place all right, but I love it!

HT said...

Wow, Scott Adams thinks no one really gives a shit about some statue. He says it was a sporting event disguised as a political event. How out of touch can you get. Entertainment. Yes, people used to watch the battles in the Civil War from their front porches. Ergo, sporting event. “Statues are not important.”

mockturtle said...

Protests aside, removing Lee's statue is a terrible idea. Not for political but historical reasons he should be remembered and even honored, as he was, by all accounts, an honorable man. Yes, most of my ancestors fought for the Union, too, but mainly because they happened to be living north of the Mason-Dixon line.

Unknown said...

So will Trump be brave enough to say "white supremacist terrorism"? He sure was adamant about saying "radical Islamic terrorism".

I doubt it. These are his people.

HT said...

o will Trump be brave enough to say "white supremacist terrorism"? He sure was adamant about saying "radical Islamic terrorism".

Unknown, if it is proven that the driver was a white supremacist, I hope so. Did he call the baseball field shooter a leftist terrorist?

Paco Wové said...

"White Nationalist" seems to be the preferred label – so what are these people advocating for? A separate "white" country? Tossing out the darkies? What?

Mark Kleiman said...

Police have arrested James Alex Fields, age 20, of Maumee, Ohio.
Registered Republican.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/james-alex-fields-jr-idd-as-charlottesville-suspect

Howard said...

Did you hear about the cop copter crash. The two dead troopers were part of Gov Terry Mcauliffe personal detail. Since Mcauliffe was the Clintons bag man for years, one has only to renember Vince Foster and Seth Rich to realize this could be designed by Hillary to discredit the truly patriotic Americans who bravely carried the torch of liberty last night. Ya gotta wonder...

Unknown said...

A Civil Rights investigation is being opened by the DOJ. Hmmmm, what could that mean?

Howard said...

Fields is a Pillsbury Dough-boy with a long and tight haircut... I heard that he actually work for Wasserman-Schultz and was doing undercover counter-intel for the Uniparty. They sure nailed the demographic and body-type to make him the perfect alt-right imposter. Benghazi!

Lydia said...

Ted Cruz, doing it right:

"It’s tragic and heartbreaking to see hatred and racism once again mar our great Nation with bloodshed. Heidi’s and my prayers are with the loved ones of those killed and injured in the ongoing violence in Charlottesville. The First Amendment protects the rights of all Americans to speak their minds peaceably, but violence, brutality, and murder have no place in a civilized society.

The Nazis, the KKK, and white supremacists are repulsive and evil, and all of us have a moral obligation to speak out against the lies, bigotry, anti-Semitism, and hatred that they propagate. Having watched the horrifying video of the car deliberately crashing into a crowd of protesters, I urge the Department of Justice to immediately investigate and prosecute this grotesque act of domestic terrorism.

These bigots want to tear our country apart, but they will fail. America is far better than this. Our Nation was built on fundamental truths, none more central than the proposition 'that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness'.”

Ralph L said...

This riot brought to you by Google, to get us off the front page.

Unknown said...

"At a time when such ugliness took place in the hometown of founding father Thomas Jefferson, Trump had a golden opportunity to condemn the violence and speak out against the white supremacists and white nationalists, many of whom supported him in the election against Hillary Clinton. The country needed the leader of the nation to forcefully call out these ugly — and un-American — interests."

https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/editorials/2017/08/12/amid-violence-virginia-president-trump-failed-test-leadership

mockturtle said...

Police have arrested James Alex Fields, age 20, of Maumee, Ohio.
Registered Republican.


And the Pulse killer was a registered Democrat.

mockturtle said...

Ted Cruz, doing it right:

Thank you, Lydia! Yes, best comments so far by a public official.

chickelit said...

"Registered Republican" doesn't mean what it used to. I'm pretty right wing and support Trump yet I'm not a "registered Republican."

mockturtle said...

BTW, I heard part of McAuliffe's press conference and he soundly condemned the right-wind protesters but nary a word against the violence of the Antifas.

chickelit said...

I forget -- what did Shuck Choomer say about the Pulse killer? Probably nothing.

chickelit said...

@mockturtle: that's because he actually condones the Antigua violence.

chickelit said...

@Unknown: Trump was right to call the Charlottesville violence many sided because it is.

Bob Loblaw said...

Trump had a golden opportunity to condemn the violence and speak out against the white supremacists and white nationalists...

Which are mostly a creation of the media. They're the Emmanuel Goldstein of American politics. Why should Trump speak out against a tiny number of nutcases when 90% of the violence comes from a much larger group on the left?

sakredkow said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Unknown said...

"CHARLOTTESVILLE, Va. (AP) -- A white nationalist blames police for the violence that erupted before and after a rally where he was scheduled to speak before it turned deadly.

Richard Spencer told The Associated Press on Saturday that he doesn't take responsibility for the violence and accused state and local police of endangering lives in how they handled the rally.

Spencer said that he "did not attempt to engage in any kind of violence. So the idea that I could be held responsible is absurd. It's like blaming the fire department for a fire.""

http://www.weau.com/content/news/Hundreds-face-off-ahead-of-white-nationalist-rally-440039273.html

Bob Loblaw said...

And why, when it's left wing or Islamic violence, are we constantly reminded not to jump to conclusions "before all the facts are in", but all we have here is a name and that he might be a registered Republican. Or not.

Bob Loblaw said...

Richard Spencer told The Associated Press on Saturday that he doesn't take responsibility for the violence and accused state and local police of endangering lives in how they handled the rally.

That seems pretty reasonable if it was anything like Berkeley the cops stood around while the leftists attacked.

YoungHegelian said...

@BobL,

I think it's pretty safe to say that neither the Righties nor the Lefties can be held responsible for a freakin' police helicopter crashing. Why are those two deaths "linked" to the protests. Talk about yer "Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc" fellatios.......

Angel-Dyne said...

Ingabot @10:37 PM:

Thanks for the link Ingabot. That was the stupidest piece written re Charlottesville that I've yet come across.

"There is no room for violence from any group, including Antifa. But on this day, it was all about white supremacists, neo-Nazis and white nationalists."

That's abysmal, even by DMN standards.

tl;dr: Trump "failed in a test of leadership" because he did not take advantage of "a golden opportunity" to reinforce our narrative.

Unknown said...

Angel Dyne, mow down any leftists yet, oh well, there's always tomorrow, you alt right white nationalist sack of shit.

YoungHegelian said...

@Unknown,

Yoo-hoo! We still don't know what happened with the car crashing into the crowd yet. We might want to wait for the results of a police investigation before we start using the musings of our febrile imaginations to start insulting each other.

Unknown said...

Oh, no doubt that he was a leftist, running down other leftists! Yes that makes so much sense.

chickelit said...

I'm surprised that Steve Bannon hasn't been blamed yet for Charlottesvile. Isn't he solidly alt-right?

Unknown said...

Angel Dyne is a proud alt righter here in Althouse threads. And she is a sack if shit, with my apologies to the sack if shit for comparing it to Angel Devil.

chickelit said...

Steve Bannon must still be secretly controlling Trump, right unknown?

YoungHegelian said...

@Unknown,

Stop being such an arrogant shit, U!

The driver may have been in fear for his life, because, you know, of the lefty fuckers walking around with baseball bats & the like. He may have panicked & done really stupid things. Which is generally what happens when people panic.

Unknown, that Antifa assembly on that street was unlawful. The cops had shut down all demonstrations for the day. If there's a bat dent on that guy's car, he's gonna walk. Just wait.

Angel-Dyne said...

YoungH: Yoo-hoo! We still don't know what happened with the car crashing into the crowd yet. We might want to wait for the results of a police investigation before we start using the musings of our febrile imaginations to start insulting each other.

Oh, I thought she had just mis-formatted and mis-posted that here instead of the "most beautiful sentences" thread.

"Angel Dyne,
mow down any leftists yet?
oh well, there's always tomorrow
you alt right white
nationalist sack of shit."


Pure poetry.

Unknown said...

"Unknown, that Antifa assembly on that street was unlawful."

So they deserved to be mowed down!

"If there's a bat dent on that guy's car, he's gonna walk. Just wait."

I'm quite sure the bodies bouncing off his car left many dents in it.

Unknown said...

Here's another sentence for you Angel Devil. How about you change your avatar to a nice picture of Hitler.

Unknown said...

You rightists feel all united now?

Angel-Dyne said...

I'm not sure I fully appreciated the rhythmic genius here. Maybe better:

"Angel Dyne,
mow down
any leftists yet?
oh well, there's always tomorrow
you alt right
white
nationalist sack of shit."


Do you do slams, Inga?

YoungHegelian said...

@Unknown,

So they deserved to be mowed down!

Do you ordinarily let people just crowd around your car in the middle of streets where there's supposed to be traffic?

I know this is difficult for lefties to comprehend, but if you are unlawfully in front of a car & you get smushed, well, that's just too bad for you. Pedestrians walk on sidewalks. Cars drive in the street. When those rules aren't followed, bad shit happens. It isn't difficult.

Unknown said...

"The violence in Charlottesville, Va., on Saturday at the “Unite the Right” protest against the proposed removal of a statue of Confederate Gen. Robert E. Lee was irrefutably rooted in racism, and bore disgusting echoes of Nazism. For evidence, look no further than the Hitlerian “blood and soil” and “Jews won’t replace us” chants during a pre-protest rally Friday night by a Tiki torch-bearing parade of overwhelmingly white men.

And to erase further doubt, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke watched the violence unfold Saturday and declared that the white supremacy movement — which is what he represents — was at “a turning point.” Added Duke, “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”

So how did we get here? It’s easy to blame the hatred and divisiveness that spilled out of the Trump campaign. But truth be told, he tapped into a current of American political and social beliefs that has been around for generations. The detestable views on display in Charlottesville reflect the worst of America — a nation that rose on the backs of slaves, that banned the Chinese from entering, that in some places restricted the sales of homes to white people. Yes, we as a nation are more than that. But we are also that.

Trump, to his detriment, has emboldened this rise. He missed a sterling opportunity to strike a different, more presidential, note Saturday with a milquetoast condemnation that failed to call out the racism that propelled Friday’s march and Saturday’s violence. We are a nation increasingly divided politically, economically and ethnically, divisions he has exploited and thus helped exacerbate. The weekend’s skirmishes and utterances ring of 1930s Berlin — though the nation is far from descending into fascism — and the 1950s desegregation battles across the South. They also mark a failure of political discourse and the political system, which is supposed to mediate our political differences, not accentuate them."

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/editorials/la-ed-charlottesville-racism-trump-20170812-story.html

Unknown said...

"For evidence, look no further than the Hitlerian “blood and soil” and “Jews won’t replace us” chants during a pre-protest rally Friday night by a Tiki torch-bearing parade of overwhelmingly white men."

Angel Devil's peeps.

Renee said...

Every week dozens of African-American die from gun violence. More wounded. No outrage

White supremecists with tiki torches protest a statue, all of white social media stands up against them..

Renee said...

Sounds crass and all, but something irks me a lot. I mean I actually care, but it's easy to stand up against the tiki torch guys, actually addressing the violence affecting African Americans is a harder task, that white people rather not really think about.

chickelit said...

@Renee: it's because people like unknown actually want black people to die. It's also why they're so pro-abortion. They'll never admit it, but it's true.

YoungHegelian said...

@Unknown,

So how did we get here? It’s easy to blame the hatred and divisiveness that spilled out of the Trump campaign.

You mean, like, when a rally by the Republican candidate for president was, in a major American city run by the former Chief of Staff of the Obama administration, shut down by lefty thugs, & the police did nothing?

Or, when, in a monolithically controlled Democratic state & a Democratic town, after a rally, Trump's supporters were forced by the police who were supposed to protect them, to run a gauntlet of protestors to get back to their cars?

I think President Trump can be forgiven for not seeing the Alt-Righties as the only villains in this morality play.

Craig said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Craig said...

"Every week dozens of African-American die from gun violence. More wounded. No outrage."

That last bit is obviously false.

Craig said...

chickelit said...
@Renee: it's because people like unknown actually want black people to die. It's also why they're so pro-abortion. They'll never admit it, but it's true.

--

What deep delusion!

Unknown said...

"What deep delusion!"

Precisely.

chickelit said...

Can someone please explain the "Jews won't replace us" chant? It sounds a bit false flag. Why would a "white nationalist" worry about Jews replacing him or her? What do they mean, exactly? In the work place? It makes little sense. Why aren't they railing against Mexicans or other illegals?

Craig said...

Blogger YoungHegelian said...
@Unknown,

So they deserved to be mowed down!

Do you ordinarily let people just crowd around your car in the middle of streets where there's supposed to be traffic?

I know this is difficult for lefties to comprehend, but if you are unlawfully in front of a car & you get smushed, well, that's just too bad for you. Pedestrians walk on sidewalks. Cars drive in the street. When those rules aren't followed, bad shit happens. It isn't difficult.

---

Man... This is just lunacy. There's so much wrong here. The insane bit you think difficult for lefties to comprehend obviously runs afoul of both morality and the law. Also, it is simply false that the rules are that pedestrians stay on sidewalks and cars on the street. Lots of exceptions to the former, which is obvious to anyone who has been on an American road. And, of course,I eagerly await your evidence that all of the people hit by the car here were unlawfully in front of his car (which you obviously don't have).

Just vicious, tendentious lunacy...

chickelit said...

Show us the outrage, Craig.

Renee said...

Come on, look at your social media feeds.

chickelit said...

@craig: I believe the Glenn Reynolds is on record suggesting that anyone caught in a crowd surrounding their vehicle feeling threatened should accelerate. You should take up your legal beef with him. I'm confident that he knows more about the law than you do.

Dr Weevil said...

Judging from my web-reading today, the Nazis were in fact chanting "You won't replace us" most, if not all, of the time. It's possible that they substituted "Jews" now and then, but it seems more likely that they were either misheard (it's easy to assume the worst of Nazis) or misrepresented (it's easy to lie about Nazis and be believed). People who state as fact that it was "Jews" not "You" are liars or fools.

Craig said...

Blogger YoungHegelian said...
@BobL,

I think it's pretty safe to say that neither the Righties nor the Lefties can be held responsible for a freakin' police helicopter crashing. Why are those two deaths "linked" to the protests. Talk about yer "Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc" fellatios.......

---

I don't think you understand post hoc ergo propter hoc.

Craig said...

Blogger chickelit said...
@craig: I believe the Glenn Reynolds is on record suggesting that anyone caught in a crowd surrounding their vehicle feeling threatened should accelerate. You should take up your legal beef with him. I'm confident that he knows more about the law than you do.

---

Ahahahahahahahaha. Come on. This is more lunacy. Do better than "I believe." Find it. I did. He wasn't offering some account of Virginia law. And even if you wrongly thought he was, as he made clear about his point, he wasn't defending the crazy point that was offered upthread. Do better.

YoungHegelian said...

@Craig,

And, of course,I eagerly await your evidence that all of the people hit by the car here were unlawfully in front of his car (which you obviously don't have).

The entire antifa assembly was illegal from the get go. The only folks that had a permit were the righties. The cops had shut everyone down for the day. This was, by all standards, an illegal & menacing assembly. In the fucking middle of the road, where they had already stopped two cars --- remember what the guy ran into? So, yes, when all those factors are added together, I think that the marchers were cruising for a bruising.

If the driver intentionally tried to kill those people, put him away for a long time. But, I think there's a very good chance he's gonna walk, for all the reasons I listed above.

So, are you gonna go play in traffic now?

Craig said...

Blogger Dr Weevil said...
Judging from my web-reading today, the Nazis were in fact chanting "You won't replace us" most, if not all, of the time. It's possible that they substituted "Jews" now and then, but it seems more likely that they were either misheard (it's easy to assume the worst of Nazis) or misrepresented (it's easy to lie about Nazis and be believed). People who state as fact that it was "Jews" not "You" are liars or fools.

---

I can easily imagine that people misheard "You" as "Jews". But it wouldn't surprise me if some of the same people chanting "Heebs will not divide us" (there's footage of that chant on youtube, if you're so inclined to verify) might not have also chanted the variant of the replace us with Jews as the subject. I don't think it would be foolish to think someone who is complaining about Heebs might also complain about Jews...

YoungHegelian said...

@Craig,

I don't think you understand post hoc ergo propter hoc.

And you don't understand "sense of humor", do you?

Dr Weevil said...

Craig:
Were the people in the street chanting "Who owns the street? We own the street!" or weren't they? And were they intentionally blocking traffic, making (e.g.) the two other cars that were hit go about 2 mph, so they could look in every car and see if there were any Nazis inside? And what did they plan to do if they spotted any? Pull them out and beat them? Even if your car doors are locked, if you can't leave the area because you're blocked in by crowds you're unwilling to run over or by other cars and people have rocks or baseball bats, they can break into your car and kill or maim you if they want to.
There have been 'demonstrations' (meaning riots) in several US cities just the last couple of years by BLM and Antifas in which people have been held hostage and forced out of their cars - even an 18-wheeler in one case (NC, I think, a year or so ago) was set on fire as the driver ran for her life.

chickelit said...

In Craig's fervid mind, the helicopter was only there because the the protests were there. Therefore, Trump is ultimately to blame for the copter crash.


You're getting boring and predictable, Craig. Please either come up with better comments or release your profile so that I learn more about you personally.

Craig said...

Blogger YoungHegelian said...
@Craig,

And, of course,I eagerly await your evidence that all of the people hit by the car here were unlawfully in front of his car (which you obviously don't have).

The entire antifa assembly was illegal from the get go. The only folks that had a permit were the righties. The cops had shut everyone down for the day. This was, by all standards, an illegal & menacing assembly. In the fucking middle of the road, where they had already stopped two cars --- remember what the guy ran into? So, yes, when all those factors are added together, I think that the marchers were cruising for a bruising.

If the driver intentionally tried to kill those people, put him away for a long time. But, I think there's a very good chance he's gonna walk, for all the reasons I listed above.

So, are you gonna go play in traffic now?

---

Ahahahaha. This is the best you've got? Man, weak sauce. You (in error) tried to trot out a fallacy earlier. But here you're committing another. You've got evidence that all 20 struck people were members of an illegal antifa assembly, that all 20 struck people were illegally there and menacing? Bring it, joker.

Craig said...

Blogger chickelit said...
In Craig's fervid mind, the helicopter was only there because the the protests were there. Therefore, Trump is ultimately to blame for the copter crash.


You're getting boring and predictable, Craig. Please either come up with better comments or release your profile so that I learn more about you personally.

---

You're real bad at reading. I didn't say Trump was to blame for the helicopter crash. I said the helicopter crash claims were not a post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy. If I'm so predictable, you should at least be able to figure out what I've said after I've said it (since you seem to think you know what to expect before). But you can't.

chickelit said...

@craig: I would have searched for and found the Reynolds cite were I not device limited tonight: iPhone.

Unknown said...

Does the perpetrator of this crime get to take the law in his own hands and be judge, jury and executioner to the people "illegally" in the street? Do you fools even know what you're saying? Listen to yourselves. Deplorable.

SukieTawdry said...

Aw, but it was such a delightfully demonstrative demonstration before the Antifa crowd showed up and started making trouble. The "blood and soil" chants, Nazi salutes and torches, colorful touches all.

I've had people all evening insisting that I eventually will have to choose my side. I'd have to be nuts to choose to side with any of these reprehensible people. And President Trump better clearly mark the distance that exists between him and the Richard Spencer crowd (I presume that distance does exist). The left and its mouthpiece media have been waiting for a rally of this type to come along for a long while. That it concluded with mayhem and death is icing on their cake. This is going to be very unpleasant.

Craig said...

Blogger chickelit said...
I forget -- what did Shuck Choomer say about the Pulse killer? Probably nothing.

8/12/17, 10:45 PM

---

If only Google existed, you'd learn that he called the Pulse killer a "terrorist."

YoungHegelian said...

@Craig,

What evidence will convince you?

Do you think that the antifa folks had a permit? Do you think that they were all unarmed in that crowd?

How many armed members does there have to be in a crowd before a trapped driver can fear for his life?

By my lights, just one.

Craig, just shut up, & let the police do their work. If the guy's guilty, put him away. We simply do not know what happened in toto yet. But, don't start writing out a martyrology for a bunch of lefties who have quite a list of mischief under their belt just yet.

chickelit said...

@The part about me saying you blamed Trump for the cuter crash was not poor reading -- it was mind reading. But go ahead and deny you thought that. I'd like to get it on record.

Fabi said...

The alt-righters have finally used a vehicle to kill as many women as Ted Kennedy!

Craig said...

Craig, just shut up, & let the police do their work. If the guy's guilty, put him away. We simply do not know what happened in toto yet. But, don't start writing out a martyrology for a bunch of lefties who have quite a list of mischief under their belt just yet.

---

You're not very good at this. I didn't take a stand on the guy's guilt (though I have my suspicions). _You_ took a stand. Now you're the one saying, "Oh, shoot, we shouldn't take stands until the police do their work." You should keep notes on the things you say so that it is easier not to get tripped up.

Craig said...

Blogger chickelit said...
@The part about me saying you blamed Trump for the cuter crash was not poor reading -- it was mind reading. But go ahead and deny you thought that. I'd like to get it on record.

---

Man, you're something else. I don't have a view on Trump and the helicopter crash, but congrats on being self-deluded.

GoldRush Apple said...

I don't know Unknown's political affiliation, but whatever it is he sounds an idiot.

Unknown asks "You rightists feel all united now?"

Because everyone who says they are on the right are alt-right and support Nazis and white supremacy. You're an idiot and I say that as an ex-leftist.

Dr Weevil said...

Someone in my Twitter feed reported that the one person killed was a Wobbly, a member of the Industrial Workers of the World, hard-left union thugs from way back. I don't know if that's true, but the person who said it thought it was a good thing to be, so I strongly suspect there were Wobblies there, and I'm pretty sure they would kill someone without hesitation if they thought it would advance their cause and they could get away with it.

Of course, craig has either forgotten or is pretending not to know that the way these 'demos' work (as we saw very clearly in Berkeley) is that the thugs hide behind a wall of useful idiots, pop out and club people or spray them in the face with Mace, and then jump behind the not-so-innocent human shields to escape. The human shields know that's what they're doing, and share their guilt.

Craig said...

Blogger Fabi said...
The alt-righters have finally used a vehicle to kill as many women as Ted Kennedy!

---

You do realize the alt-righters killed 168 people with a truck in 1995.

Craig said...

"The human shields know that's what they're doing, and share their guilt." Bullshit, on all fronts.

Fabi said...

Welcome aboard "hidden profile" Craig!

Achilles said...

It is fun watching the leftists condone Antifa violence AGAIN.

Good job guys. Another AntiFa mob attacks a group of people and you again blame their victims.

And of course Robert Spencer and David Duke are there. They are the only Trump supporters the media will ever talk about. I wonder why? Nobody on the right gives a shit about them. It is only lefties that follow them around... imagine that.

Craig said...

(And, yes, I know the term "alt-right" post-dates 1995.)

Dr Weevil said...

I'll take Craig's 12:25am comment as putting him in the "pretending not to know" camp rather than the "has forgotten" crew. I wonder if he's a human shield himself, or possibly prefers to do the clubbing and spraying himself.

GoldRush Apple said...

@ Dr. Weevil: BLM/Antifa wouldn't let a 8+ month pregnant woman in her car through once. The police got word of this, talked to her, and just shrugged their shoulders. They didn't help her (because they were told to stand down by the city's mayor I believe). Those blocking her car said it was necessary to get their message across and gave zero f_cks about her condition and her unborn.

But somehow I'm suppose to be blistering mad about this Virginia's incident. So made like Unknown.

Craig said...

I'll take Craig's 12:25am comment as putting him in the "pretending not to know" camp rather than the "has forgotten" crew. I wonder if he's a human shield himself, or possibly prefers to do the clubbing and spraying himself.

---

I'll take this comment as your concession that this thread is too complicated for you to follow.

Fabi said...

You do realize that it wasn't a car that killed them, Craig, but a bomb -- the vehicle in that case was incidental.

Craig said...

Fabi,

I can't wait for your analysis of "used to kill" which does not include "used in order to cause another to die" or "used with the causal upshot that another died." This should be real good.

Unknown said...

"And I say that as an ex-leftist."

Bullshit.

chickelit said...

@Fabi: I sincerely doubt that "Craig" is new here, so no welcome from me.

chickelit said...

Newbies just don't show up here with the same axe to grind against the same people. It's one of the quirks of Althouse.

YoungHegelian said...

@Craig,

You do realize the alt-righters killed 168 people with a truck in 1995.

You mean, the "alt-righter" who primary defender in the press was Gore Vidal?

You use a political term to describe Timothy McVeigh & crew that is an anachronism, like calling Jacobins "Marxists. Do the Alt-Righties claim McVeigh, or support what he did? If so, provide proof. If not, stop making shit up.

Craig said...

Blogger chickelit said...
@Fabi: I sincerely doubt that "Craig" is new here, so no welcome from me.

---

I'm not new. I've been reading the blog since early 2004, at least. And the right-wingers paranoia around here that anyone who objects to them is just some earlier objector is something else. You guys trot it out like it would be bothersome to me (I don't care what internet accounts you think I have), and you trot it out as if on the wide old internet there aren't more than one or two people who aren't far right politically.

chickelit said...

@fabi: isn't it obvious that the Enola Gay killed those people in Hiroshima?

Dr Weevil said...

Anyone who has been here since early 2004 would know that some of the most voluble lefties have changed names and pretended to be different people many times. Calling it "paranoia" when "right-wingers" notice that is stupid or dishonest. So is the pretense that most of us here are "far right": you have to be pretty far left to find any of us who've been arguing with Craig "far right" as opposed to just right of center.

chickelit said...

@craig: Congrats on holding your tongue for 13 years. What made you want to cut loose tonight?

Craig said...

Blogger Dr Weevil said...
Anyone who has been here since early 2004 would know that some of the most voluble lefties have changed names and pretended to be different people many times. Calling it "paranoia" when "right-wingers" notice that is stupid or dishonest. So is the pretense that most of us here are "far right": you have to be pretty far left to find any of us who've been arguing with Craig "far right" as opposed to just right of center.

---

We'll have to agree to disagree about how far to the right the comments threads on Althouse are. They are far, far to the right. Professor Althouse is herself, best I can tell, right of center, and the commentators swing much further than she does.

And, man, you guys just can't read. I didn't say it was paranoid for you to notice anything.

Craig said...

Blogger chickelit said...
@craig: Congrats on holding your tongue for 13 years. What made you want to cut loose tonight?

---

I've commented before. If you figure out how your iPhone works, you could verify that.

holdfast said...

When White Supremacists fight AntiFa, it's pretty much a "no humans involved" situation - and if they want to kill each other, have at it. Or maybe a giant sinkhole will open up if we're truly lucky.

I have zero sympathy for either side here.

But I would note a couple of things:

1) Lee fought a MUCH more honorable war than, say Sherman. Sherman was fighting for the right side, but he fought a brutal war, unlike the gentlemanly Lee.

2) The Left and their fake-anarchist allies/false front seemed to think that they would have a monopoly on street violence forever. Sorry guys, eventually the other guy will punch back.

3) The SON of the Democrat candidate for VP was arrested and charged for being a violent thug, but that's not news. But Trump's statement is too anodyne for some tastes so clearly he endorses "hate". Obama endorses the violent BLM and the race-baiter Kendrick Lamar, but that's all good.

4) Did the Dems prostrate and flagellate themselves when one of Bernie Sanders campaign workers decided to massacre the GOP Congressional baseball team? Nope, they didn't - their MSM allies/masters had if off the front pages in about 24 hours.

YoungHegelian said...

@Craig,

They are far, far to the right.

No, we're not. Unless you consider David Brooks to be "The Right".

Very little shows up here that couldn't show up in Reason, National Review, or The Weekly Standard. Now, if you consider those "far right" publications......

So, tell us, Craig, honestly --- what political magazines do you read?

Fabi said...

A poor attempt at deflection, Craig. The vehicle was not an active element to the destruction.

Fabi said...

That's perfect, chickelit!

Dr Weevil said...

Craig writes:
"I didn't say it was paranoid for you to notice anything."

Just 9 minutes after writing:
"And the right-wingers paranoia around here that anyone who objects to them is just some earlier objector is something else" (emphasis added).

Looks like someone is making pedantic distinctions-without-a-difference. Oh well, time for bed. I won't be missing much not reading any more from someone who doesn't have a fucking clue what "right-wingers" think.

Craig said...

@YH

I read most of them again with a great appreciation for the press, for the media. Specifically, any of them that have been in front of me over all these years.

But you're right. The comments are significantly to the right. My initial far right bit was about many of those comments that get responses from the moderates and left-wingers here. I should not have read over (and then endorsed) Weevil's characterization of what I said as the claim that "most of us here are 'far right.'"

Unknown said...

"Very little shows up here that couldn't show up in Reason, National Review, or The Weekly Standard. Now, if you consider those "far right" publications......"

Oh, is that why when anyone links to these publications they are told that these publications no longer represent the right?

Craig said...

@Weevil:

Maybe with a good night's sleep, you'll be a better reader!

Angel-Dyne said...

Sukie Tawdry: I've had people all evening insisting that I eventually will have to choose my side. I'd have to be nuts to choose to side with any of these reprehensible people. And President Trump better clearly mark the distance that exists between him and the Richard Spencer crowd (I presume that distance does exist).

Sukie, Spencer is an opportunistic attention whore who's been marketing himself as the "leader" of the "alt right" for a while now, and he's got some very willing customers in the media. Nobody, including the president, has any obligation to play the left's and the media's eternal "dance monkey dance" game, "distancing" themselves from whatever dubious nazi-larping clowns decide to attach themselves to the right. And there will always be unsavory characters doing that, in every goddamned news cycle.

You will notice that the left, with its abundance of bad actors, never plays that game. Ever. They never apologize, they never disavow, they never take responsibility. And nobody in the media or of any status in public life ever asks them to.

You do have to choose sides. But you don't have to choose from the menu the left shoves under your nose.

Bad Lieutenant said...

people chanting "Heebs will not divide us"


Shia LaBoeuf was there?


In the late 1980s, when NYC was at the heights of its sewerdom, my sister and I (she had just got her license) were driving to the Queens Central Library in Jamaica, New York, which is a terrible neighborhood. We stopped, or were stopped by, a policeman and asked directions or something like that. Anyway, the policeman told us that if someone threw a blanket over the windshield, she should just step on the accelerator and get away and never mind who she hit. Apparently this was a current carjacking technique. So yeah, you can run people over if you have to.

I think that intentionally blocking traffic is a criminal if not a terrorist act and people who do it should be shot in the street. I wish that Trump supporter who got pulled out of his car and beaten by that gang had rammed his way through instead.

The left should understand something very well. They are despised as thoroughly as they despise. And they are inferior in numbers, weapons, character, and skill. The only thing keeping them from being hunted down with dogs is the law, and not just the law, the civil structure of which law is a key part. These people want to flout the law, because reasons. They should understand how that's going to work out for them. Not well. Just like 150 years ago when they tried to leave the Union.

This was a random act. The next step is for four clean-cut young men with AK-47s to get out of the car and fire into the mob until the traffic is cleared.

Craig said...

"The left should understand something very well. They are despised as thoroughly as they despise. And they are inferior in numbers, weapons, character, and skill. The only thing keeping them from being hunted down with dogs is the law, and not just the law, the civil structure of which law is a key part. These people want to flout the law, because reasons. They should understand how that's going to work out for them. Not well. Just like 150 years ago when they tried to leave the Union."

I'll buy the despising line, but otherwise: so much crazy here.

Bad Lieutenant said...
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Bad Lieutenant said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Bad Lieutenant said...

Craig, I don't see why you say that. Except that it's uncomfortable truth and leftists don't deal very well with uncomfortable truth. Have you ever heard the saying, if it's stupid but it works it's not stupid? Well, if it's crazy but it's true it's not crazy.

Craig said...

@ BL:

_That_ is what took three tries?

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