August 21, 2016

"We've created government systems that maintain human beings in poverty and ignorance so that politicians can count on their votes."

"And that is a crime against morality.... Blame is assessed and pressed like hot iron into the flanks of the rich, or of 'corporations,' and others with means, a moronic and frightening misunderstanding of how jobs are created. It is as if 'The Big Rock Candy Mountain' has become economic policy. And by such logic all we must do is lower the rich into a giant cauldron, add salt and bay leaves and boil them down for soup to soothe the neighborhoods on fire... What isn't discussed enough when riots happen and neighborhoods burn is the one thing most common to all these decaying urban tinderboxes. They're run by Democrats. Baltimore is a Democratic city, Milwaukee is a Democratic city, Chicago, Detroit, and on and on. This is a most inconvenient truth. This is what binds them."

From "Road to urban despair paved by Democrats," by John Kass in The Chicago Tribune.

88 comments:

Wilbur said...

Another song on the same theme is "Rainbow Stew" by Merle Haggard.

Eric the Fruit Bat said...

I think that's what's called preaching to the choir.

Eric the Fruit Bat said...

So it's entertainment, broadly construed.

DrSquid said...

That democrat city leadership leads to corruption and despair is not a new idea, but perhaps one whose truth will be more recognized as the evidence continues to grow. I hope DJT can find the right rhetoric to convince voters of this, but I don't think "What do you have to lose?" is quite it.

BTW, Big Rock Candy Mountain was the favorite song of my father-in-law, a dyed in the wool socialist. He enjoyed it without irony.

Diogenes of Sinope said...

The Left are the real oppressors keeping the poor on their liberal plantation.

Rednecks by Randy Newman

Last night I saw Lester Maddox on a TV show
With some smart-ass New York Jew
And the Jew laughed at Lester Maddox
And the audience laughed at Lester Maddox too
Well, he may be a fool but he's our fool
If they think they're better than him they're wrong
So I went to the park and I took some paper along
And that's where I made this song

We talk real funny down here
We drink too much and we laugh too loud
We're too dumb to make it in no Northern town
And we're keepin' the niggers down
We got no-necked oilmen from Texas
And good ol' boys from Tennessee
And college men from LSU
Went in dumb - come out dumb too
Hustlin' 'round Atlanta in their alligator shoes
Gettin' drunk every weekend at the barbecues
And they're keepin' the niggers down

We're rednecks, rednecks
And we don't know our ass from a hole in the ground
We're rednecks, we're rednecks
And we're keeping the niggers down

Now your northern nigger's a Negro
You see he's got his dignity
Down here we're too ignorant to realize
That the North has set the nigger free
Yes he's free to be put in a cage
In Harlem in New York City
And he's free to be put in a cage in the South-Side of Chicago
And the West-Side
And he's free to be put in a cage in Hough in Cleveland
And he's free to be put in a cage in East St. Louis
And he's free to be put in a cage in Fillmore in San Francisco
And he's free to be put in a cage in Roxbury in Boston
They're gatherin' 'em up from miles around
Keepin' the niggers down

We're rednecks, we're rednecks
We don't know our ass from a hole in the ground
We're rednecks, we're rednecks
And we're keeping the niggers down
We are keeping the niggers down

mikee said...

Hey, imagine what the result of a Hillary term will do to advance the causes of social justice, economic equality, and racial harmony. We'll all be living in a Democrat-run hellhole one year from now, so can we all riot against the person in charge?

Fernandinande said...

What isn't discussed enough when riots happen and neighborhoods burn is the one thing most common to all these decaying urban tinderboxes.

Pesky Asians.

ndspinelli said...

John Kass tried to warn us about Obama. And, Big Rock Candy Mountain was part of the superb soundtrack in O' Brother Where Art Thou. Speaking of great movies and soundtracks, I highly rate a flick I saw last night, Hell or High Water.

Tommy Duncan said...

The case he is making is hard to refute when heard outside the establishment paradigm.

The normal mocking Democrat response of "ha ha the evil, racist Republican wants your black vote" doesn't play well against Trump. His anti-establishment, non-PC campaign is immune to the usual liberal responses.

Sebastian said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sebastian said...

"urban despair." Who's despairing? When people choose to live a certain way for more than half a century, when politicians use the same policies by the same party for more than half a century, when most people who matter get enough of what they want for more than half a century, when voters in the despairing places vote to keep the conditions of "despair" in place, when anyone with any sense has been leaving the so-called despair for more than half a century, driven out by exploiters of "despair," when on a national level one large wing of one large party with all the media cheering on wants more of the policies that produce the so-called despair, then the despair is not despair. It's what they want.

n.n said...

The use of redistributive change and long-term smoothing functions (e.g. welfare) without a robust abortion policy is part of an economic doctrine for trickle-up poverty. Normalization or promotion of the "spoiled child" syndrome destroys human dignity and sabotages moral development.

AReasonableMan said...

This concern trolling for poor blacks rings false. The group failing most dramatically at the moment are poor rural whites, who reliably vote Republican.

Michael The Magnificent said...

What is it with lefties and taxing corporations, so that they pay their 'fair share'?

Hillary! has a commercial running in Wisconsin where she promises to raise the corporate tax rate so corporations pay their fair share, which is followed without a hint of irony that she'll also slap an 'exit tax' on corporations that relocate to other countries. Given that America's corporate income tax rate is the third highest in the world, I'm not sure how much higher we can raise it before all of the corporations that can relocate, do. They'll face the choice of paying one of the highest corporate tax rate in the world year after year, or take a one-time hit on the way out the door, taking their jobs with them.

AprilApple said...

ARM - How do you explain city after city - urban area after urban area - ALL controlled solely by democrats for 60+ years and these cities are all in ruin and decay?

AprilApple said...

ARM - political corruption is mainly a democrat deal.

"You know this. There are schools that don't work and haven't for decades, schools where teachers are overwhelmed, where children arrive thoroughly unprepared, where too many parents are indifferent.

Political corruption is an epidemic, a hidden tax upon urban economic wastelands, where there are no jobs for people who aren't trained and educated for work."




The inability for democrat faithful to admit their party is corrupt is a big part of the problem.

AprilApple said...

Who runs the public school system in America? Republicans? Hardly. Democrat own government run schools.
Republicans want charter schools and school choice. Democrats want the status quo. Democrats want the corrupt teachers union to take our schools and flush them down the toilet. Keeping students stupid helps democrats. Maintaining the Teacher's Union-Democrat party mega-billions slush fund -- trumps it all.

CWJ said...

"This concern trolling for poor blacks rings false. The group failing most dramatically at the moment are poor rural whites, who reliably vote Republican."

People like coal miners?

Rusty said...

AprilApple said...
ARM - How do you explain city after city - urban area after urban area - ALL controlled solely by democrats for 60+ years and these cities are all in ruin and decay?

You won't get an answer. ARM is an idea man. Not a facts man.

rhhardin said...

They don't suffer from poverty so much as no dignity.

Blacks will always underpeform whites on the average owing to average IQ differences; but dignity is unrelated to IQ. Blacks can do as well as whites there.

The dole and political envy robs blacks of dignity, in the form of don't even try for good character, you're entitled.

AReasonableMan said...

None of you seem willing to address the fact that poor rural white society is the group that has most clearly collapsed in recent decades. That is a Republican failing just as much as the problem for urban blacks is a Democrat failing.

AReasonableMan said...

Rusty said...
Not a facts man.


This is a little rich coming from someone who completely screwed up the facts on the uninsured rates just the other day.

CWJ said...

Republicans put coal out of business? Not the current administration? Who knew?

Fernandinande said...

rhhardin said...
but dignity is unrelated to IQ.


Cite?

Big Mike said...

None of you seem willing to address the fact that poor rural white society is the group that has most clearly collapsed in recent decades. That is a Republican failing just as much as the problem for urban blacks is a Democrat failing.

@ARM, how about if you toddle down to Appalachia and explain to UMW rank and file why it's the Republican's fault that the Democrats have a war on coal.

rhhardin said...

but dignity is unrelated to IQ.

Cite?

Levinas _Totality and Infinity_

Charles said...

Coal should be put out of business... its more expensive and not as efficient is natural gas. That's the future not coal. This is happening in spite of not because of government. And natural gas also has a benefit of being much more environmentally friendly than coal by a long shot and is the major reason our carbon output has fallen dramatically.

Gahrie said...

The group failing most dramatically at the moment are poor rural whites, who reliably vote Republican.

In what community(ies) are White people killing each other in double figures every week?

Yes poverty affects more white people than Black, and their are many dysfunctional White communities....but none as dysfunctional as our inner cities.

Gahrie said...

None of you seem willing to address the fact that poor rural white society is the group that has most clearly collapsed in recent decades. That is a Republican failing just as much as the problem for urban blacks is a Democrat failing.

I blame both rural and urban poverty on government dependency and failing government schools...which party is responsible for that?

AReasonableMan said...

Bleeting about coal isn't going to get you very far. Detroit has been more severely affected by the decline in the auto industry in that region. That has a lot to do with Republicans.

AReasonableMan said...

Gahrie said...
I blame both rural and urban poverty on government dependency and failing government schools...which party is responsible for that?


First of all, this is largely BS. The schools can't fix failing families, but even so it is republicans that control the schools in rural white areas.

AReasonableMan said...

Charles said...
Coal should be put out of business... its more expensive and not as efficient is natural gas. That's the future not coal. This is happening in spite of not because of government.


Exactly, a classic case of market forces.

AprilApple said...

ARM - The unions killed the auto industry - or - democrats.

AprilApple said...

Gahrie

In what community(ies) are White people killing each other in double figures every week? (No answer from ARM)

Big Mike said...

Bleeting [sic] about coal isn't going to get you very far. Detroit has been more severely affected by the decline in the auto industry in that region. That has a lot to do with Republicans.

The Republicans are the reason for the decline of the auto industry in Michigan? How so? I would point a at Democrat policies that make it financially rewarding to build cars elsewhere. Is it not because of NAFTA that my wife's Ford was made in Mexico? And who signed NAFTA? Was it not Hillary Clinton's spouse?

chickelit said...

The adverse effects of the one party structure on state politics, in short, have been borne most heavily by the disadvantaged elements of the population, by "have not" persons who score low on the characteristics just cited. It is well to remember, in connection with subsequent analysis in this paper, that economic conservatives have a considerable stake in maintaining politics at a low level of clarity and coherence.

More here

Sindler's classic analysis works well for city government.

AprilApple said...

Read the link, Arm. The biggest problem in America is leftwing lies and the inability of throne sniffing democrats to admit their party is corrupt.

Big Mike said...

Charles said...
Coal should be put out of business... its more expensive and not as efficient is natural gas. That's the future not coal. This is happening in spite of not because of government.

Exactly, a classic case of market forces.


@ARM, so you are perfectly willing to go down to Appalachia and explain this to UMW rank and file after all? Please do not fly to get there as one should not be increasing one's carbon footprint.

AReasonableMan said...

April, whites would do well to address their own vast problems before obsessing about the problems with blacks. Rural, poorly educated whites are doing very badly under Republican leadership. That is a fact. You can ignore it but it doesn't change the facts.

chickelit said...

If Dems can kill-off coal, they can also kill steelmaking in the US. Win/win for them.

chickelit said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
chickelit said...

AprilApple said...
Read the link, Arm. The biggest problem in America is leftwing lies and the inability of throne sniffing democrats to admit their party is corrupt.

Just imagine the size of Hillary's throne print -- enough to allow several faces down there for olfactory sensation

AReasonableMan said...

Gahrie said...
In what community(ies) are White people killing each other in double figures every week?


White people are already killing themselves at this rate in many rural communities.

CWJ said...

"Coal should be put out of business... its more expensive and not as efficient is natural gas. That's the future not coal. This is happening in spite of not because of government."

In spite of? You write that as if government were trying to prop up coal instead of hastening its demise. Funny how government is so confident in market forces that it feels the need to jump in and push them along to its desired outcome. Your use of the word "should" suggests the old cynical observation about ideas so good they need to be mandatory.

John said...

Blogger Charles said...

Coal should be put out of business... its more expensive and not as efficient is natural gas. That's the future not coal.

So why do you think coal needs "to be put out of business"? If what you say about natural gas is true, won't it go out of business naturally?

Why does the govt need to kill it rather than just letting it die?

I am assuming that you mean govt here. I don't see any other entity that can put coal out of business.

No subsidies for coal, NG, oil or any other form of energy including solar, wind, hydro etc. of course.

John Henry

Achilles said...

Gahrie said...
In what community(ies) are White people killing each other in double figures every week?

"White people are already killing themselves at this rate in many rural communities. "

Citation please.

Yancey Ward said...

I hope DJT can find the right rhetoric to convince voters of this, but I don't think "What do you have to lose?

Yes, it is unlikely to be enough. I think Trump probably needs to take more risks in this regard.

ARM,

I grew up in one of those declining white hell-holes you wrote about- they were also largely run by Democrats at the state and local levels- largely still are at the local level. History matters. However, your framing is ridiculous right off the top. It is far safer and pleasant to live in Kimper, Kentucky (or any other poor, rural white area in decline) than it is to live in any black inner city neighborhood. If you really believe otherwise, I think you are ignorant and foolish. You can't find a place in rural white America as depressing as Detroit, or South and West Chicago. It may eventually happen, but it will happen because the policies of Detroit and Chicago spread like a cancer.

John said...

I find this article amazing. Not that it is anything new, many people including me have been saying this for 20-30 years.

What I find amazing is that it appears in a major, mainstream, newspaper.

Did Trump, in his recent speeches, give the media permission to talk about this?

I expect to see more along these lines. Some of it defensive, no doubt: "Yes, the cities have turned to shit under 50 years of Democrat rule. But if Republicans had been in charge it would be much worse!! And it's all the Republican's fault anyway!!!"

To which the response should be, "How could it possibly be worse?"

I look forward to some interesting discussions.


John Henry

John said...

Perhaps the decline in Detroit is because the legacy American car companies make shit cars and have since the 30's. They survived because they had an oligopoly.

As soon as Americans had a choice, they abandoned Detroit in droves. Witness the success of VW beginning in the late 50's. A piece of crap car that even Germans would not buy but way better than anything coming out of Detroit.

I've had nothing but Mitsubishis and Nissans (plus 1 Subaru and my current Hyundai) since 1985. These cars are just getting broken in at 150,000 miles. Very low maintenance and repair cost. My Brother in law was still driving my 1985 Subaru in the early 2000s 50 miles a day to work each day. It had over 350,000 miles on the clock when the clock broke. I'd be surprised if it didn't have 400m+ when it gave up the ghost.

John Henry

AReasonableMan said...

Achilles said...
Citation please.


"In the hardest-hit places — 21 counties arrayed across the South and Midwest — the death rate has doubled, or worse, since the turn of the century for white women in midlife.

In Victoria County, Tex., a rural area near the Gulf Coast, deaths among women 45 to 54 have climbed by 169 percent in that time period, the sharpest increase in that age group of any U.S. county. The death rate climbed from 216 per 100,000 people to 583."

AReasonableMan said...

Yancey Ward said...
It may eventually happen, but it will happen because the policies of Detroit and Chicago spread like a cancer.


How do they spread like a cancer into states controlled by Republicans? Haven't we been told for years now about how successful Republicans have been in gaining control of local and state government?

John said...

7-8 years ago I was spewing CO2 on a plane and my seatmate was a Texan road contractor. He was building roads in Wyoming and flying home on weekends. HE started telling me about his Ford pickup. Sounded like a pretty nice, very high end, ride. All the bells and whistles, top of the line.

He was very impressed with Ford's service. His engine had blown up twice, in about a year. Fixed under warranee both times, they gave him a loaner etc!

I wanted to ask but poiliteness forbade, why he would own a car where the motor would blow up even once?

I love my Japanese service. I almost never have to use it. I do get my Hyundai serviced (oil etc) at the dealer and they do a great job, fair price and fairly quickly. But repairs? 75,000 miles in 5 years and other than a shock that went bad no repairs yet. Not even a tuneup.

Fuck Detroit and the govt auto companies.

I said at the time and still believe it, the very worst thing that ever happened to the American auto industry was Carter "saving" Chrysler in 79.

John Henry

PB said...

An economic surety: If you want more of something subsidize it. If you want less, tax it.

LBJ felt that the Great Society programs would keep the blacks voting for Democrats for 200 years, though he used the N-word instead of blacks.

PB said...

Ford as govt auto company? I thought they didn't get any bailouts?

As to Ford trucks, they've had some engine problems in recent years that result in very expensive repairs. I haven't bought a vehicle from a US company in years and that one was used.

I highly endorse Honda and particularly Honda engines.

Gahrie said...

, but even so it is republicans that control the schools in rural white areas.

Bullshit. The teachers, aides, administrators and school boards are dominated by Democrats, even in rural areas.

Gahrie said...

White people are already killing themselves at this rate in many rural communities.

Even if true...that wasn't the question.....you are either a very poor reader, or are making a very poor argument.

I asked:

In what community(ies) are White people killing each other in double figures every week?

Jupiter said...

"What isn't discussed enough when riots happen and neighborhoods burn is the one thing most common to all these decaying urban tinderboxes. They're run by Democrats. Baltimore is a Democratic city, Milwaukee is a Democratic city, Chicago, Detroit, and on and on. This is a most inconvenient truth. This is what binds them."

Yeah, well, San Francisco is also run by Democrats. And although they do a lot of stupid things in San Francisco, they don't riot and burn their own neighborhoods. No, the common factor here is black people. That's what they have in Chicago, Detroit and Baltimore that they don't have in San Francisco. Great big slums full of black people.

Jupiter said...

AReasonableMan said...
"April, whites would do well to address their own vast problems before obsessing about the problems with blacks. Rural, poorly educated whites are doing very badly under Republican leadership. That is a fact. You can ignore it but it doesn't change the facts."

ARM is having a stopped-clock moment. Whites would indeed do well to stop worrying about fixing what can't and won't be fixed, and start considering whether it may still be possible to prevent the Left from destroying our nation and enslaving our children.

Jupiter said...

For over fifty years, the Left has been using the pathetic condition of American blacks as a justification for reducing the freedom of all Americans, and steadily increasing governmental control of every aspect of American life. "Civil Rights" was the justification for the governmental seizure of all property used in commerce, the abolition of freedom of contract, and the acceptance of overt racial discrimination in policy and law. It is long past time to say "Enough!".

Big Mike said...

White people are already killing themselves at this rate in many rural communities.

And you substantiate this assertion with what facts and figures? Victoria County, TX? According to Wikipedia the median per capita income in Victoria County is $38,732, which compares favorably to Dane County, WI (median per capita income $33,473).

Look, most of us on this thread know (there may be some newbies) that you are merely repeating talking points from some George Soros-funded organization. But you really ought to personally vet some of these talking points before you make an even bigger fool out of yourself than usual.

AReasonableMan said...

White's current performance is even worse than the current numbers suggest. Unlike blacks, whites had stable, economically viable communities, which they then destroyed. Most blacks have never lived in the kind of communities whites took for granted thirty years ago. Cheap labor, union bashing and out-sourcing, all espoused by white Republicans, has destroyed large swathes of white communities.

AReasonableMan said...

Gahrie said...
I asked:


Irrelevant. Different forms of self destructive behavior, one is not better than the other.

AReasonableMan said...

Big Mike said...
According to Wikipedia the median per capita income in Victoria County is $38,732


Doesn't this make white failure even more reprehensible? White people eating, drinking and drugging themselves to death when they could lead decent lives?

Big Mike said...

In Victoria County, Tex., a rural area near the Gulf Coast, deaths among women 45 to 54 have climbed by 169 percent in that time period, the sharpest increase in that age group of any U.S. county. The death rate climbed from 216 per 100,000 people to 583."

I don't see how you get from that factoid to "White people eating, drinking and drugging themselves to death when they could lead decent lives?"

You're just phoning (phony-ing?) it in now.

AReasonableMan said...

Why else would they be dying at young ages? Despair, at the crappy degraded culture that whites have created?

HoodlumDoodlum said...

AReasonableMan said...None of you seem willing to address the fact that poor rural white society is the group that has most clearly collapsed in recent decades. That is a Republican failing just as much as the problem for urban blacks is a Democrat failing.

I'll address it, ARM. You're not wrong--looking at recent trends the rural poor white cohort has done worse and is failing in really terrible ways (increased drug use [heroin & meth], increased crime, decreased stable employment). Poor urban blacks have been at the low end of those social measures for a long time, so the baseline is worse for them, but poor rural whites are declining more quickly. You and Kass are both correct.

You are correct that the Republican party hasn't done enough to acknowledge or address this scary trend among people who should be reliable Republican voters. I have speculated that this explains a lot of Trump's popularity with that group--the group itself seems to blame a lot of its problems on lack of jobs due to foreign competition and illegal immigration as well as increased costs/taxes/social problems also due to illegal immigration. Trump was the only primary candidate who seemed to say the kinds of things they wanted to hear about those issues. That group feels "establishment" GOPers haven't looked out for their interests and/or have betrayed them, so they want an outsider---thus Trump. It's a theory, anyway.

It's not really accurate to say that the Right hasn't been talking about these problems recently. Kevin Williamson of National Review wrote much-discussed articles about the problems of that group and argued that they have to admit and start solving their own problems [he actually says that those communities are so dysfunctional they deserve to die] and JD Vance's book Hillbilly Elegy (NYTimes review) has been much-discussed over the last month or so.

I don't think it's fair to say Kass is concern trolling--he's not wrong on the facts and although, as you point out, the problems he points out aren't the only problems that exist they are still real problems. I won't accuse you of concern trolling re: poor rural whites, so you shouldn't accuse Kass of concern trolling re: poor urban blacks. You're both right. Fair?

AReasonableMan said...

Hoodlum, not trying to bash poor whites, ala Williamson. But, it is important to not pretend that these problems are purely the province of urban blacks. Although it is important to emphasize personal responsibility it is also clear that there are larger economic trends that are proving devastating for a large swathe of the population, black and white. Both parties have contributed to this, which is why I have generally be supportive of Trump. Not because I think he would be a very effective president but that he is willing to address some of these issues from the perspective of the people most negatively affected by the relatively sudden changes in our economic system.

Terry said...

My paper printed this in its editorial section today:
"http://www.progressive.org/authors/rep-mandela-barnes"
The Real Answer to Milwaukee’s Woes

Pity the poor white person who lives in Mr. Barnes' district. Mr. Barnes does not represent you, because you are not Black, and your race is the most important thing about you.

Terry said...

Ah, America! Land of opportunity, Where the streets are paved with gold!
If you were raised in a stable, upper middle class family and you have a graduate degree!
Meaning that the US is just like everywhere else in the world. I don't think that it was always like this.

rehajm said...

What is it with lefties and taxing corporations, so that they pay their 'fair share'?

It stems from a belief there's no sympathetic victim.

When you tax a corporation if the tax doesn't just destroy the business model and the company folds, the corporation reacts in one of three ways, or a combination of them:

It raises the price of goods or services, which lowers the standard of living of the firm's customers

It reduces wages and salaries or benefits of employees lowering their standard of living, or it fires some employees or freezes hiring.

It offers lower profitability to shareholders reducing their standard of living.

In summary: there's no such thing as a free lunch.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Fernandinande said...
rhhardin said...
but dignity is unrelated to IQ.

Cite?

8/21/16, 9:48 AM

Cite? Do you really think that, say a janitor with an IQ of 90 is incapable of having dignity or of taking pride in being self-sufficient and doing a good job?

Amadeus 48 said...

ARM's desparate lashing out to create false equivalents signifies the power of this line of argument by the GOP. He is frantic to change the subject to Harlan County KY so that we won't think about the South Bronx, North Philadelphia, Baltimore, Cleveland, Detroit, Benton Harbor, Chicago, St Louis, Milwaukee, Kansas City, Compton, Oakland...
Time to hold the Dems accountable for the lives they have destroyed, the poverty they have created, the despair they foster. Black voters can help themselves by giving the GOP their votes.

The Cracker Emcee said...

"This concern trolling for poor blacks rings false. The group failing most dramatically at the moment are poor rural whites, who reliably vote Republican."

Poor Whites, as opposed to working-class Whites, are not voting Republican. If you don't know anyone from either group, the distinction may be lost on you.

Rusty said...


Blogger AReasonableMan said...
Bleeting about coal isn't going to get you very far. Detroit has been more severely affected by the decline in the auto industry in that region. That has a lot to do with Republicans.

No. sadly. No it didn't.

AReasonableMan said...

Amadeus 48 said...
lashing out to create false equivalents


Not equivalency, whites are doing worse.

Rusty said...

The ten poorest counties in the US are in Appalachia. What has been happening in Appalachia to keep these people poor?

HoodlumDoodlum said...

AReasonableMan said.... But, it is important to not pretend that these problems are purely the province of urban blacks. Although it is important to emphasize personal responsibility it is also clear that there are larger economic trends that are proving devastating for a large swathe of the population, black and white. Both parties have contributed to this,

Full agreement, ARM. Well said.

Not equivalency, whites are doing worse.

"Worse" is tough to quantify in the sense that it's difficult to find suitable baselines for comparisons. Certainly the decline of some rural poor white communities lately has been more precipitous.

Unlike blacks, whites had stable, economically viable communities, which they then destroyed. Most blacks have never lived in the kind of communities whites took for granted thirty years ago.

Right, that's what I mean about baselines. Bad now and having been bad for a while vs. previously so-so and getting worse quickly now. The "they" in your sentence, though, is obviously a big point of contention.

It is also true that many urban (largely black) communities have seen significant increases in certain types of violent crime in the most recent few years--good #s on those are just coming in now.

There are plenty of problems to go around, unfortunately.

The Cracker Emcee said...


"Not equivalency, whites are doing worse."

Doing worse than they were, yes. Doing worse than underclass Blacks, not even close.

I'm sure the Brothers appreciate that you're minimizing their plight, though.

AReasonableMan said...

The various problems in black communities seem to have bottomed out in the early 90s. Other than the violence rate, which declined significantly, while still remaining high, nothing much seems to have improved since then or gotten significantly worse. It is more or less a terrible steady state.

Poor whites, on the other hand, seem to still be on the steep part of the curve. Things are still getting worse and there is no reason to believe that they will not continue to get worse for some time since none of the underlying causes are improving.

This basic dynamic no doubt accounts for the difference in black and poor white assessments of their future prospects. For blacks things are marginally improving whereas for poor whites things are clearly getting a lot worse.

AReasonableMan said...

HoodlumDoodlum said...
"Worse" is tough to quantify in the sense


This was overstated out of irritation. The current trend is worse.

Titus said...

Not all democrat cities are dumps. Milwaukee and Detroit definitely. Boston is thriving. The real estate market is hot. Skyscraper new condo buildings are everywhere. The cities population continues to grow and unemployment is a very low.

We r the most educated city in the us


How is rural republican USA doing. Well their children all left to find jobs in the democrat cities.

AReasonableMan said...

Titus said...
Not all democrat cities are dumps.


NYC is also doing well with a high percentage of minorities. Poverty is the problem. NYC and Boston are rich.

Terry said...

The elephant graph: https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2016/08/the-elephant-in-the-room

Sammy Finkelman said...

It's not really that consciously cynical, or even correct.

People are kept in poverty to provide jobs, not votes.

Paul said...

Government Cheese lyrics by Rainmakers:

Give a man a free house and he'll bust out the windows
Put his family on food stamps, now he's a big spender
no food on the table and the bills ain't paid
'Cause he spent it on cigarettes and P.G.A.
They'll turn us all into beggars 'cause they're easier to please
They're feeding our people that Government Cheese

Give a man free food and he'll figure out a way
To steal more than he can eat 'cause he doesn't have to pay
Give a woman free kids and you'll find them in the dirt
Learning how to carry on the family line of work
It's the man in the White House, the man under the steeple
Passing out drugs to the American people
I don't believe in anything, nothing is free
They're feeding our people the Government Cheese

Decline and fall, fall down baby
Decline and fall, said fall way down now
Decline and fall, fall down little mama
Decline and fall, decline and fall

Give a man a free ticket on a dead end ride
And he'll climb in the back even though nobody's driving
Too ******* lazy to crawl out of the wreck
And he'll rot there while he waits for the welfare check
Going to hell in a handbag, can't you see
I ain't gonna eat no Government Cheese

Rusty said...

Sammy Finkelman said...
It's not really that consciously cynical, or even correct.

People are kept in poverty to provide jobs, not votes.


If they had jobs they wouldn't be in poverty. I'm reminded of the quote from LBJ in reference to the Great Society. "We'll have these niggers voting Democrat for the next 200 years."
What was the Great Society doing for blacks in 1969 that wasn't being done in 1959?

Bad Lieutenant said...

Although Sammy is shaky and often unclear if not duplicitous, a charitable interpretation would be that he means jobs as in poverty farming, working the systems built up to manage property and the poor. The administrators of the Great Society. What would they all be doing without the Great Society programs?

Unknown said...

ARM's desperate attempt to blame the rural white problem on the Republican party is true, to some extent.

The real issue is the same as it always has been: the destruction of the family and strong moral values. The Democrat party destroyed the black family. They have been desperately trying to destroy all families, and now they are succeeding. The plight of rural whites (and I live in a rural white area) can be traced directly to the same things that have destroyed the black family: telling women they are sluts, open acceptance of bastardy, the destruction of social prejudice against government welfare and the concurrent erasure of the work ethic, and the poisonous scourge of blaming fathers for everything.

This is just as destructive to whites as it is to blacks. Democrats stand for all of the above: how women are worthless except if they spread their legs and kill their kids, etc. That having sex-- any sex-- is the highlight of humanity. That welfare is acceptable. The idea that you depend on someone else for your success. Too many divorces and child support payments, etc. The promotion of selfishness, above all. Democrats love all of this.

Of course, we cannot overlook the US government's active hostility to rural America. Especially Democrat's active hostility to rural America. But then, I'm in Utah, where the Federal government is literally trying to destroy rural Utah by making it illegal to even visit most of the state. They actively seek to ruin any form of economic activity that we rural types can do. You know, resource extraction, mining, agriculture, timber, or tourism. All things the Federal Government is explicitly trying to destroy. Because people like ARM think they know better than we do how to run our land.

Rural Utah's problems are in great measure caused by Democrats like ARM, who actively want us to die out.

--Vance