May 21, 2013

"Top IRS official will invoke 5th Amendment."

"Lois Lerner, the head of the exempt organizations division of the IRS, won’t answer questions about what she knew about the improper screening — or why she didn’t disclose it to Congress, according to a letter from her defense lawyer, William W. Taylor III."

171 comments:

Mark O said...

Boom!

rhhardin said...

You self-incriminate when you file a tax return.

creeley23 said...

It's torches and pitchforks time.

rhhardin said...

It sounds like scandal containment to me.

Chip S. said...

Gonna be a long wait for those who intend to form no opinion until all the facts are in.

CEO-MMP said...

So does she actually have something to hide or is it just a smokescreen to gin up discussion/outrage for a while at which point there'll be a change of heart and...nothin'?

Mary Martha said...

So the good news is she does know about the Constitution...

Pastafarian said...

And yet...they claim that no laws were broken. That's odd.

I think this is the worst thing I've ever seen our government do: They've come after private citizens, for the crime of opposing them politically, with the life-destroying and unopposable power of the IRS.

Impeachment is not enough. This needs to destroy the left as a legitimate philosophy. This should tar them for all time.

MarkD said...

Should be grounds for dismissal. She has the right to refuse to incriminate herself. We have the right to decide that is not the kind of person we want in government.

X said...

drone this terrorizing bitch

rhhardin said...

As I recall, they're always getting gangsters on failing to declare illegal income rather than their murders and robberies.

The argument was made that you can't require people to report income from crimes because that would be requiring them to testify against themselves.

The counterargument was made that tax returns are absolutely confidential and not shared with other agencies so they can too require you to file.

So what happens to that argument today?

dbp said...

I can't remember now, but wasn't there some kind of rule requiring public officials to step down if they invoke the 5th?

If not, there ought to be.

Rabel said...

She's due to testify before Issa's oversight committee. If he doesn't bring her in and have her take the fifth on camera, he's as stupid as the democrats say he is.

Grant said...

Since I'm just a lowly peasant taxpayer, can someone answer how a government employee can invoke the 5th Amendment when she's called before the House Committee? Would this not be grounds for immediate dismissal? Help! I'm confused.

SomeoneHasToSayIt said...

Pastafarian said...
And yet...they claim that no laws were broken. That's odd.

I think this is the worst thing I've ever seen our government do: They've come after private citizens, for the crime of opposing them politically, with the life-destroying and unopposable power of the IRS.

Impeachment is not enough. This needs to destroy the left as a legitimate philosophy. This should tar them for all time.


And some still claim, with a straight face, that Fascism is not a phenomenon of The Left.

But it is indeed the Emerald City at the end of every Progressive Yellow Brick Road.

Chip S. said...

It's starting to look like a RICO investigation.

Methadras said...

She should be compelled via contempt of congress to testify or offer her immunity to testify. Pleading the 5th only implies guilt to not self-incriminate because in actual testimony you would end up incriminating yourself. I get why she's doing it, but if she is going to plead the 5th, and answer ever question by pleading it, then it will just be Kabuki.

Methadras said...

Grant said...

Since I'm just a lowly peasant taxpayer, can someone answer how a government employee can invoke the 5th Amendment when she's called before the House Committee? Would this not be grounds for immediate dismissal? Help! I'm confused.


We are all afforded the 5th amendmend as citizens regardless of employment. However, I do agree and think it's stupid that she be afforded 5th amendment protections.

SteveR said...

This will be characterized (not necessarily by her or her lawyer) as being necessary because the mean republicans are out to get her and will ring her up no matter what she says. In truth it’s the Administration that’s hanging her out to dry, “watch out, Bus!!”. Somewhere in the IRS is a blue dress with a stain on it

B said...

And so it starts. Shall we start a pool.

Who will be the person who invokes the 5th, starts getting incriminated by second parties, and cops a plea a la John Dean?

My money says not Lerner. Bigger fish out there.

B said...

Gonna be a long wait for those who intend to form no opinion until all the facts are in.

Not even then if the facts don't fit the narrative..

Michael said...

She has every right to plead the 5th and the panel will have every right to ask her as many questions as they wish. I believe she should be fired immediately with or without pleading the 5th but I also believe she should be sent to the slammer if she broke the law. This last possibility is the one that her lawyer is advising her on, not on reputational risks.

Michael said...

B: There are bigger fish, indeed. But there are also smaller fish, fish smaller than her, who have a lot to lose if they are shit canned or sent to jail. They are the ones who will squeal and do whatever is necessary to protect themselves and their financial status. They should be squeezed as well. Hard.

carrie said...

Can they offer her immunity so that she has to testify? Would the offering of immunity have to come from the DOJ?

Chef Mojo said...

Fine and dandy.

Make her plead the 5th in person to each question the committee has.

That's how it should be done.

carrie said...

Can they offer her immunity so that she has to testify? Would the offering of immunity have to come from the DOJ?

TosaGuy said...

Look beyond Donald Segretti, ahem I mean, Lois Lerner.

B said...

This is interesting. From Instapundit. If true it means the MSM can't/won't plug for the WH anymore.

JOURN-O-LIST CAVALRY TO THE RESCUE! Spotted: @joshtpm @CapehartJ @ezraklein & other lefty columnists headed into the West Wing as a group. POTUS coffee? Carney meeting? Anyone?

Watch for even-more-unified weaponized Administration-excusing talking points, coming soon to a publication near you!

Lem said...

That's music to my ears... not because this guy is part of the administration and the hope is that when people hear the invocation of the 5th they are still liable to think of the Sopranos, which Is not a far cry from the Godfather...

Its music to my ears because I though the 5th was dead.

Maybe I'm not paying attention but when was the last time anybody who is somebody took the 5th?

I mean, I'm summing this guy Is big... how big is he?... I guess I better read the article... like somebody says all the way in the back.

AllenS said...

Lem, it's a female.

Seeing Red said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Left Bank of the Charles said...

Does that mean she will resign?

Chip S. said...

AllenS, I think Lem meant to say fall guy.

In this case, I think goombah is a nice, gender-neutral term.

CEO-MMP said...

Resign? Removed?

Isn't this the chick that's already been removed by the half black prince?

Chip S. said...

CEO, you're thinking of the guy w/ a temp appt that was about to expire.

chrisnavin.com said...

Stay classy, Lois Lerner.

traditionalguy said...

The IRSTAPO offices are now under armed guard by Homeland Security...that's the guys who just ordered themselves 1.4 billion rounds of anti personnel hollow nosed 40 cal. ammo for target practice. It is clear now for whom those target bullets are intended.

The US Government of King Obama I is actually at war with Tea Party Patriots who are opposition to the King's Tax Collector. Can the Boston massacre be far behind?

chrisnavin.com said...

So far, I totally trust old Civil Rights folks, the 60's type feminists, greens, unions and reds to run our institutions.

Especially during a time of great economic stress and change.

They are the people they've been waiting for.

I'm just waiting for them to go away.

Seeing Red said...

The other chick is now heading up Obamacare/IRS implementation, hope they subpoena her.

What's summer without hearings?

B said...

Michael said...B: There are bigger fish, indeed. But there are also smaller fish, fish smaller than her, who have a lot to lose if they are shit canned or sent to jail.

That where the pressure will start. I suspect that it already has, the house already has depositions from the smaller fish in return for immunity, Lerner knows it, and know has no choice but to invoke the 5th. Wilson will be next to plead.

It will come down to a race to see who can angle for immunity in return for testimony.

Bill, Republic of Texas said...

SteveR said... This will be characterized (not necessarily by her or her lawyer) as being necessary because the mean republicans are out to get her and will ring her up no matter what she says.

We don't know anything about what happened but this threat is enough for her to take the 5th. I was really surprised the former commissioner testified to the Senate.

It looks like he has a very serious problem about his past denials of targeting Tea Party groups.

My guess would be he will get indicted for lying to Congress.

Sam L. said...

She will not allay suspicion.

Amartel said...

Haha, finally, a Constitutional amendment that the Obama Bureaucracy likes! Unexpectedly.

edutcher said...

To the average American, that's as good as a confession.

It probably shouldn't be (there will always be instances (help me here, Madame La Professeur) where pleading the 5th isn't an admission of guilt), but, given its track record going back to Frank Costello and friends, that's the way it's seen.

Real American said...

Another left wing Democrat putting her own greedy self interests ahead of her country. FOR SHAME!

Real American said...

She knows that if she spills the beans to Congress the Obrownshirts at the IRS (and other federal agencies) will all come after her!

Seeing Red said...

Via Wretchard, leaks all over the place!

It’s them low-level officials acting up again. The Blaze reports another leak. “The U.S. has apologized to Israel for leaking details of the attack in Syria. Senior administration officials said to their [Israeli] counterparts that they are examining the issue and that low-level [officials] were responsible for the leak. US officials told that they [will] review the matter. The leak forced Assad to react harshly.”


Barry Rubin, director of the Global Research in International Affairs Center, told TheBlaze, “It requires the Syrians to react officially rather than deny that it happened or that it was an accident. It forces Syria and Hezbollah and Iran to react officially and say they want to seek revenge, which makes things more dangerous for Israel.”

“Can you imagine if things were reversed and somebody did that to the U.S.?” he added....

lemondog said...

Barack H. Obama Foundation?

IRS official Lerner speedily approved exemption for Obama brother’s ‘charity’

Lois Lerner, the senior IRS official at the center of the decision to target tea party groups for burdensome tax scrutiny, signed paperwork granting tax-exempt status to the Barack H. Obama Foundation, a shady charity headed by the president’s half-brother that operated illegally for years.

B said...

It looks like he has a very serious problem about his past denials of targeting Tea Party groups. My guess would be he will get indicted for lying to Congress.

Lerner has to get immunity before she'll scuttle Wilson. Wilson needs to negotiate a deal before she does to avoid indictment and the only thing he can offer that will serve is the head of the next one up the chain.

Nixon had ballsy minions but these mooks aren't stand up guys.


Jerome said...

'"She has not committed any crime or made any misrepresentation but under the circumstances she has no choice but to take this course,” said a letter by Taylor to committee Chairman Darrell Issa'.

If she has not committed a crime, how could her testimony tend to incriminate her? Is her mouthpiece admitting that he has advised her to lie to Congress?

SteveR said...

We don't know anything about what happened but this threat is enough for her to take the 5th. I was really surprised the former commissioner testified to the Senate.

If the buck stopped with her I'd go with the criminal explanation, regardless the left will make it about politics.

B said...

Someone kept the carbons.

Rabel said...

There is ample precedent for pleading the fifth before congress.

For example.

edutcher said...

On a related front:

Carney compares questions about the Silver Haired Angel of Death and her shakedown to questions about the Messiah's birth cert.

None of this is going away and, supposedly, the HHS thing is about to heat up. The Angel of Death always did her Lefty act behind closed doors before, but she ain't in Kansas no more.

poplicola said...

CEO-MMP said...
"Resign? Removed?

Isn't this the chick that's already been removed by the half black prince? "
5/21/13, 4:46 PM

They promoted her. She now is in charge of the IRS division that oversees Obamacare. (not a joke)


The hearing should be interesting, since she isn't good at math, http://twitchy.com/2013/05/10/math-is-hard-awful-irs-spokeswoman-admits-shes-also-not-good-at-math/ maybe she'll accidentally invoke the 1st or 7th Amendment instead of the 5th and we'll get some information.

Drago said...

Jerome: "she has not committed a crime, how could her testimony tend to incriminate her?"

Her testimony would tend to incriminate Obama.

He is the only one that admin members will fall on their swords to protect.

B said...

Carney compares questions about the Silver Haired Angel of Death and her shakedown to questions about the Messiah's birth cert.

So now we know the directives the Journolisters got.

Try to marginalize the people wanting explanations and accountability for a runaway administration by casting them as conspiracy nuts.

If that doesn't work, try another marginalization ploy. Rinse and repeat until something sticks.

They're hoping there's still enough support in the MSM to run with something if it seems like it might work. Wishful thinking if the WH press corp is any indication.

bpm4532 said...

Maybe we should look for signs of smoke coming from the building as they destroy evidence.

bpm4532 said...

Perhaps we should be on the lookout for shipments of shredders into IRS buildings.

MadisonMan said...

She has that right. It doesn't look good.

Michael K said...

Blogger Chip S. said...

"

It's starting to look like a RICO investigation."

Yup. That's my hope. There is no sovereign immunity for this. She should be prosecuted along with her colleagues. The rats will flee and rat out the superiors.

bpm4532 said...

I sense lots of hard drives being erased.

poplicola said...

correction to my previous post:
Lerner does not head the Obamacare division. That's Ingram, who also should be intereting to hear from. She was in charge of the Exemptions office during the targeting.

John said...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsWVzTK0__s

Bobby Hoffa vs Jimmy Kennedy.

Pure comedy gold, I tell you.

One of those fights where you want both scumbags to lose.

As someone else once said: "We dodged a huge bullet when Bobby didn't"

John Henry

John Henry

AllenS said...

After she pleads the 5th the first time, the next question needs to be: "Have you ever audited someone who plead the 5th? If so, what did you do?"

doustoi said...

What does a transparent administration look like?

CEO-MMP said...

CEO-MMP said...
"Resign? Removed?

Isn't this the chick that's already been removed by the half black prince? "
5/21/13, 4:46 PM

They promoted her. She now is in charge of the IRS division that oversees Obamacare. (not a joke)"


That's right. Thanks.

doustoi said...

What does a transparent administration look like?

poplicola said...

CEO -- I posted a correction but it has vanished. I was mistaken, Lerner is not the one in charge of the ACA implementation, that is Ingram.

Lerner did say that she is bad a t math though.

Eric said...

They should offer her immunity and continue onward. If she still refuses to testify they should throw her ass in jail for a long, long time. This is a pretty serious matter that cuts right to the heart of good governance.

President-Mom-Jeans said...

Where are all the trolls on this?

Waiting for all those journolisters to bring back the new marching orders from the West Wing meeting today?

Pathetic.

CWJ said...

Chip S. Said

"Gonna be a long wait for those who intend to form no opinion until all the facts are in."

Ha. That will suit phx just fine.

kcom said...

The Nixon click is ticking louder and louder.

Is there a Godwin's law equivalent for Nixon?

edutcher said...

If there isn't, the Lefties will try to invent one.

Remember the phrase, "Absolute moral Authority"?

Lem said...

Lem, it's a female.

Oh yea?

Well, I'm happier still.

Amartel said...

Hey, kids, it's the 5th Amendment: For when both plausible and implausible deniability just aren't good enough.

Haul her ass in and make her do it on TV. Then put it on a loop and make fun of her endlessly. That's what gets the attention of low info voters, abusive taunting. Then haul her staff in and question them. Give them immunity, not her. Don't let up. Don't back down. These fuckers were relentlessly pursued the Bushies and celebrated when Scooter Libby got sent to prison (prison!) for misstating facts about the outing of an undercover progressive political operative.

Methadras said...

B said...

This is interesting. From Instapundit. If true it means the MSM can't/won't plug for the WH anymore.

JOURN-O-LIST CAVALRY TO THE RESCUE! Spotted: @joshtpm @CapehartJ @ezraklein & other lefty columnists headed into the West Wing as a group. POTUS coffee? Carney meeting? Anyone?

Watch for even-more-unified weaponized Administration-excusing talking points, coming soon to a publication near you!


Andrew Sullivan should be pissed beyond all reason that they will be getting on their knees to receive the Royal Phallus while he only gets to dream about it as he stares at his gold plated knee pads that haven't been used yet.

Methadras said...

G. Gordon Liddy must be laughing his ass off right now.

kcom said...

Pathetic.

Isn't it, though.

Original Mike said...

"Haul her ass in and make her do it on TV. Then put it on a loop and make fun of her endlessly. That's what gets the attention of low info voters, abusive taunting."

Isn't that out of the Alinsky playbook?

Saint Croix said...

Let's give that "Obama is like Nixon" tag a workout!

Mark in Spokane said...

If leadership within the IRS will not cooperate with Congress as it investigates the abuses within the agency towards conservatives & Tea Party groups, then I don't see any option other than the appointment of a special prosecutor to investigate what happened.

Matthew Sablan said...

... Small potatoes?

Chef Mojo said...

Methadras, I was thinking the same thing.

Cedarford said...

Mary Martha said...
So the good news is she does know about the Constitution...

=============
She may not, but her paid shysters sure do.

sinz52 said...

poplicola: "since she isn't good at math, ... maybe she'll accidentally invoke the 1st or 7th Amendment instead of the 5th and we'll get some information."

(based on an old Honeymooners episode)

Maybe she'll invoke the 18th Amendment and show up inebriated.

Matthew Sablan said...

If I were the people asking questions and heard this, I'd say: "Fine. Whatever."

Then issue subpoenas for all the documents. Not ask nicely. Subpoenas. They want hard ball, they've got it.

ricpic said...

I'm convinced that Mussoli....er, Obama will tough it out.

Cedarford said...

AllenS said...
After she pleads the 5th the first time, the next question needs to be: "Have you ever audited someone who plead the 5th? If so, what did you do?"

===================
Quite nice, AllenS. You ought to send that crack on to Issa and Co., telling them be free to use it if they think it is a pithy or funny retort.
I agree with the idea of mockery, of public laughing at the tax collectors caught playing dirty, now twisting in the wind until the Obamite zealots are smoked out.

AllenS said...

Thanks, C4. I've been on jury duty this month, and it's very frustrating for me to sit there and not get to ask the questions.

With me in the courtroom, there doesn't need to be very many people, because I'd make a good judge, jury, and executioner.

Icepick said...


Impeachment is not enough. This needs to destroy the left as a legitimate philosophy. This should tar them for all time.


Please, if Stalin murdering millions didn't tar the left for all time, this certainly won't. Fuck it all, if the goddamned French Revolution didn't tar the left for all time, this won't.

AllenS said...

On the 9th of this month, during a trial, I had all I could do to remain in my seat, and not jump up and yell: "That's a fucking lie."

AllenS said...

Me, Lois Lerner, a board and some water. That's all it would take.

edutcher said...

Icepick said...

Impeachment is not enough. This needs to destroy the left as a legitimate philosophy. This should tar them for all time.

Please, if Stalin murdering millions didn't tar the left for all time, this certainly won't. Fuck it all, if the goddamned French Revolution didn't tar the left for all time, this won't.


You're not dealing with the same thing here. We're talking Soft Compliance, not Le Regne de Terreur or the Purges. This is a crime family and not only they, but the Democrat Party as a whole, has to be associated with the economy.

There needs to be a crash (which appears to be coming). If the country goes bust as these clowns are being shown up for their many crimes, then you have cause and effect in the mind of the low info voter.

This is what turned most Germans off National Socialism - complete collapse. What's coming may not be quite that bad, but it may well be bad enough.

Now if we just could tie some of these scandals to Chuckie Schumer's AmnestyCare...

AllenS said...

That should read "there doesn't need to be very many people involved in the process".

Course, you probably knew that.

Paco Wové said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Panachronic said...

When a government official takes the 5th in response to questions about how he/she has been doing her job, termination from employment should be automatic.

Fletch99 said...

AllenS-

On the 9th of this month, during a trial, I had all I could do to remain in my seat, and not jump up and yell: "That's a fucking lie."

Reminds me of this.

Paco Wové said...

"Where are all the trolls on this?"

My own personal, informal barometer of how damaging the leftosphere thinks any given issue is... is the inverse of how long and how intense the response from the usual suspects is on the appropriate Althouse thread. As you imply, their silence is very, very loud.

AllenS said...

What's that from, Fletch?

Ignorance is Bliss said...

For those suggesting that they offer her immunity for her testimony, I think it's too early for that. They need to know where she is in the food chain first. You don't want to offer her immunity, then have her testify that the whole thing was her idea.

Give it time, start at the bottom, and work your way up.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

My best guess, if they ever track it back to who gave the order, it will have come from a congressional Democrat or a member of their staff leaning on the IRS.

Ex-prosecutor said...

Actually, the clip is from the greatest movie of all time, "My Cousin Vinnie."

Illuninati said...

edutcher said
"There needs to be a crash (which appears to be coming). If the country goes bust as these clowns are being shown up for their many crimes, then you have cause and effect in the mind of the low info voter."

It doesn't appear that is how things are going down. The economy is muddling through without any evidence of an immediate collapse. The damage Obama has done to our country in the Middle East is devestating but no one seems to care.

Once people start to think about themselves as members of a race or class at war with everyone else, the society can deteriorate a great deal without the "low information voters" changing -- provided they think they are getting even with the groups they have learned to hate. Venezuela and Argentina are wealthy countries which fell into this trap. We are following them down the drain.

People who have studied government in Argentina indicate that Obama could be a clone of Kartchner. His misuse of government power for his political ends is exactly the same as her misuse of power. Obama and most Democrats think their most dangerous enemies are conservatives not foreigners ofr Jihadis. They are at war with us. Their obsession with guns signals that they expect their war to become a shooting war soon.

Seeing Red said...

Ohhh, was just reading Chicago Boyz and RICO the IRS, we're talking big$$$$

And the AZ dems might be complicit.

The 5000 person “high end” plaintiff number for the suit may in fact be very low. The IRS asked one Tea Party group — Albuquerque Tea Party — to provide information on the “Marianne Chiffelle’s Breakfasts.”

Marianne Chiffelle is 83-year-old great-grandmother and a naturalized citizen. She was once held in a World War II Imperial Japanese internment camp in the Dutch East Indies. She is a retiree who helps organize informal 9 a.m. meetings for members of the Bernalillo County Republican Party at a local Golden Corral restraunt.

How the hell did the IRS know that the “Marianne Chiffelle’s Breakfasts” existed?

This is a smoking gun that Arizona Democratic party affiliated campaign officials are involved in the IRS criminal conspiracy.

Methadras said...

The vilification of Darrel Issa will continue.

edutcher said...

President-Mom-Jeans said...

Where are all the trolls on this?

It's tough to do talking points when every day brings a revelation that blows them all to Hell.

Illuninati said...

There needs to be a crash (which appears to be coming). If the country goes bust as these clowns are being shown up for their many crimes, then you have cause and effect in the mind of the low info voter.

It doesn't appear that is how things are going down. The economy is muddling through without any evidence of an immediate collapse.


You need to stop drinking the Kool-Aid. This is part of the whole "Resistance Is Futile" garbage we've heard ever since the "election".

For about a year, people have been pulling out of the markets (The Blonde and I heard something similar today, talking to our financial advisors). Worse, the same conditions that led to the housing crash in '08 are being re-created.

Workforce participation is its worst in over 30 years and there are more Americans on food stamps than there are Spaniards in Spain. And we have yet to experience the "train wreck" that is ObamaTax.

edutcher said...

And this:

Demos support IRS harassment, Republicans and independents don't .

Ignorance is Bliss said...

educher-

I know it is hard to keep track, but your link is about the AP phone records scandal, not the IRS scandal.

edutcher said...

Sorry about that.

The main point, however, is that the Demos tell everybody how they're the guardians of Constitutional rights.

This blows that one right out of the water.

Illuninati said...

Edutcher said:
"You need to stop drinking the Kool-Aid. This is part of the whole "Resistance Is Futile" garbage we've heard ever since the "election"."

I have no intention of giving up. The reason the Democrats are obscessed with guns is because they know there are many of us who will not surrender. But I don't think a crash will hurt the Democrats with their base. It will just give them another crises to exploit.

The low information voters will not ever come around to us no matter how much things deteriorate. They are already polarized into groups who worry about what will benefit themselves and their group. If their group can gain an advantage by bringing the country down, that is what they will do.

edutcher said...

Never said you did, but the Borg rap is all we've heard out of the Left, not to mention a good many people on the right the last 4 or 5 months.

One thing to keep in mind about a real crash - sooner or later, priorities will have to be set when revenue dries up; as the workforce gets smaller, so does revenue and the drones want their bread and circuses.

The low information voters will not ever come around to us no matter how much things deteriorate. They are already polarized into groups who worry about what will benefit themselves and their group. If their group can gain an advantage by bringing the country down, that is what they will do.

I think you confuse the low info types with the Lefties that feed off them. If the goodies stop, they'll want to know why. They're not about bringing down the country (the Lefties are, but they're not), they don't think that deeply. They just think the party will go on forever and can't imagine it might not (this is what's going on in Greece and elsewhere).

They're not anti-America, they've just been indoctrinated to think this is owed them. If the party ends and the only people to blame are the Demos, these are the ones who will turn and rend.

It's happened before.

Michael Haz said...

Isn't 'Fid Amendment' a rapper? The WH claims she said that she "played the Fid Amendment."

At least that's what Chris Matthews explained.

Paddy O said...

Oh sure, that amendment they'll respect.

phx said...

Never said you did, but the Borg rap is all we've heard out of the Left, not to mention a good many people on the right the last 4 or 5 months.

One thing to keep in mind about a real crash - sooner or later, priorities will have to be set when revenue dries up; as the workforce gets smaller, so does revenue and the drones want their bread and circuses.

The low information voters will not ever come around to us no matter how much things deteriorate. They are already polarized into groups who worry about what will benefit themselves and their group. If their group can gain an advantage by bringing the country down, that is what they will do.

I think you confuse the low info types with the Lefties that feed off them. If the goodies stop, they'll want to know why. They're not about bringing down the country (the Lefties are, but they're not), they don't think that deeply. They just think the party will go on forever and can't imagine it might not (this is what's going on in Greece and elsewhere).

They're not anti-America, they've just been indoctrinated to think this is owed them. If the party ends and the only people to blame are the Demos, these are the ones who will turn and rend.

It's happened before.


The scandals are making some of you truly delusional.

Mark said...

It's also making concern trolls concerned.

phx said...

Yeah, when you guys start talking bananas together it's a little disconcerting. Get a reality check.

President-Mom-Jeans said...

So nothing on Lerner lawyering up and pleading the 5th, eh Phx?

How moderate of you. Wherever it leads right?

Silly twat.

For King Putt's sake, I hope the paid hacks come up with better spin/squirrel! than what you are selling here.

phx said...

What do you think my reaction is going to be? I never even heard of the woman before today.

President-Mom-Jeans said...

Of course you never heard of the woman before day. Ah yes, your willful ignorance schtick, how predictable.

Heaven forbid you read a news article, or follow any of the links on the IRS scandal over the last 11 days posted on Althouse.



glenn said...

They need to grant her conditional immunity and ask her if she knows Colleen Kelly,

phx said...

Heaven forbid you read a news article, or follow any of the links on the IRS scandal over the last 11 days posted on Althouse.

I see. This is my duty to read newspapers?

phx said...

As I said some of you have slipped into delusion. Or someone slipped me a mickey and my compatriots have turned into clowns.

President-Mom-Jeans said...

No little drone, there is no duty to be an informed citizen. Just keep shilling for your affirmative action idol, and be sure to vote democrat and the Obama phones and freebies will keep flowing.

You certainly have no duty to be informed about the threads you are constantly commenting on, but don't expect not to be called out for the vapid braindead twat that you are when you do so.

phx said...

You certainly have no duty to be informed about the threads you are constantly commenting on, but don't expect not to be called out for the vapid braindead twat that you are when you do so.

I'm pretty informed on your methods.

glenn said...

"What does a transparent administration look like?"

Dunno but I can see right through this one.

phx said...

Good luck.

phx said...

Of course you never heard of the woman before day. Ah yes, your willful ignorance schtick, how predictable.

ROFL You're like a prosecutor from a Gene Wilder movie.

phx said...

Fuck me. Where did the liberals go in this place??

Chip S. said...

They're keeping a low profile b/c, unlike you, they're at least dimly aware of what's going on.

phx said...

They're keeping a low profile b/c, unlike you, they're at least dimly aware of what's going on.

What, are you guys taking people out and having them shot yet?

President-Mom-Jeans said...

Why don't you try reading the article that Althouse linked to for this thread, then rub those two brain cells in your head together and see if you can contribute something on topic?

Or you can continue with your thread derailment, but to no avail, as the real fun comes tomorrow at the hearing. I look forward to that thread.

phx said...

Why don't you try reading the article that Althouse linked to for this thread, then rub those two brain cells in your head together and see if you can contribute something on topic?

Or you can continue with your thread derailment, but to no avail, as the real fun comes tomorrow at the hearing. I look forward to that thread.


You know, I will respect the first reasonable and coherent comment to me from Pres-Mom-Jeans that I can remember or at least that I noticed. It's a valid request.

phx said...

Why don't you try reading the article that Althouse linked to for this thread, then rub those two brain cells in your head together and see if you can contribute something on topic?

The implicit respect is actually a thing of beauty. That's the way a brother would talk to you.

CWJ said...

phx - nothing if not predictable. Without smug you've got nothing.

exiledonmainst said...

Just popping in - I see phx the hypocrite and liar is once again commenting on things he is willfully ignorant of. But he wants you to know you're all fascists and stuff.

Because he's a moderate who "leans left." But no, no, if Obama did something wrong, he'd certainly want Obama frogmarched out of the WH! Yes, indeed!

The only problem is that Obama could rape phx's mother live on World News Tonight, and phx would need more information before he could come to any conclusions. We can't rush to judgment. Maybe that wasn't Obama fucking momma, it could be a Republican wearing an Obama mask. Yes, that's probably it.

phx said...

We can't rush to judgment.

Well geez exiledonmainst tell me when the deadline is and I'll be sure to get my judgment right in to you.

I didn't know you were collecting the judgments.

phx said...

fascists

MCD said...

Okay, here's a thought: Let's sic the Justice Department on the IRS.

When any IRS employee goes rogue or acts on orders from above to persecute an unpopular group (Tea Party, Communist Party, whatever), let's fire the employee, terminate his/her pension and ban that person from any government employment for life.




phx said...

That was supposed to be said <>

phx said...

sotto voce

MCD said...

Okay, here's a thought: Let's sic the Justice Department on the IRS.

When any IRS employee goes rogue or acts on orders from above to persecute an unpopular group (Tea Party, Communist Party, whatever), let's fire the employee, terminate his/her pension and ban that person from any government employment for life.




phx said...

Anyway Pres Mom-Jeans had a good comment, good thought. Respect.

Michael K said...

Lerner has a previous history of harassing groups she doesn't like. When she was at the FEC, she was quizzing the Oliver North family about prayers:

Q: “What did you mean in paragraph 2, about thanking -you and your wife thanking Pat Robertson for kind regards?”

A: “Last time I checked in America, prayers were still legal. I am sure that Pat had said he was praying for my family and me in some correspondence or phone call.”

Q: “Would that be something that Pat Robertson was doing for you?”

A: “I hope a lot of people were praying for me, Holly.”

Q: “But you knew that Pat Robertson was?”

A: “Well, apparently at that time I was reflecting something that Pat had either, as I said, had told me or conveyed to me in some fashion, and it is my habit to thank people for things like that.”

Q: “During the time that you knew Pat Robertson, was it your impression that he had - he was praying for you?”

O: “I object. There is no allegation that praying creates a violation of the Federal Election Campaign Act and there is no such allegation in the complaint. This is completely irrelevant and intrusive on the religious beliefs of this witness.”


No wonder she is taking the fifth.

Mark said...

phx, you've certainly convinced me you're a moderate.

Can't be bothered to keep up with the news.

Always willing to give the Administration any benefit of a doubt that isn't currently resting in a smoking crater.

Calling anyone who disagrees with you fascists

Yep, no concern troll here.

If you're doing a job, do it better. If you aren't then slap yourself a few times just to see if it helps.

Inga said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
exiledonmainst said...

"What, are you guys taking people out and having them shot yet? "

Oh, yeah, that's not phx calling people fascists.

That's just moderate, left-leaning (but still eminently reasonable!) phx just waiting until the evidence comes in. Because, really, it has to be the fault of the Republicans. No leftist could possibly....hey, wait a minute, guys, what, exactly did the IRS do wrong here?

I'm sorry, I haven't been keeping up. I don't know all the details or anything, but the Republicans are wrong. Because. They just are. I know they are.

I'm reasonable! I'm honest!

exiledonmainst said...

phx, I'm sure PMJ has been awaiting your respect.

phx's respect is like an NIHIL OBSTAT from the Vatican. PMJ, you have been approved as having an acceptable opinion.

Go forth and sin no more.

MayBee said...

Susan Mcdougal.

Miss Emily said...

The ugliness of these clowns is astounding.

edutcher said...

Looks like DOJ was looking at multiple (as in 5) Fox reporters' records.

phx said...

The scandals are making some of you truly delusional.

I see phx sobered up enough to find the keyboard.

As for my comment, ever take a look at Greece the last few years?

AlanKH said...

TSA the IRS!

AlanKH said...

Am I the first person to use "TSA" as a verb?

Rusty said...


The scandals are making some of you truly delusional

No. It's the economics of the thing.

phx said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
phx said...

Why don't you try reading the article that Althouse linked to for this thread, then rub those two brain cells in your head together and see if you can contribute something on topic?

What is there to contribute? Do you think she's tied to Obama?

phx said...

phx's respect is like an NIHIL OBSTAT from the Vatican. PMJ, you have been approved as having an acceptable opinion.

Don't get carried away. I didn't say you'd done anything to earn my respect.

phx said...

phx, you've certainly convinced me you're a moderate.

Can't be bothered to keep up with the news.


That probably is a good reason to be moderate in your opinions, isn't it? The rest of you folks who are way more informed can keep your extremists opinions.

Always willing to give the Administration any benefit of a doubt that isn't currently resting in a smoking crater.

You seem to conflate "waiting for the facts to come out" with "always willing to give the Administration the benefit of a doubt"

Calling anyone who disagrees with you fascists

Not anyone.

jim murray said...

Flat tax. No deductions. No IRS. No chance.

Rusty said...

You seem to conflate "waiting for the facts to come out" with "always willing to give the Administration the benefit of a doubt"


I suppose it's a step up from "waiting for the administration to finish its investigation."

Matthew Sablan said...

Phx, you'll need to work on your recall if you want to argue with people; this can't be the first time you've heard of Lerner unless you just ignore what is written in other threads you've responded in.

Which is cool; I just go to Ace's site for the comments.

Matthew Sablan said...

"Do you think she's tied to Obama?"

-- It is -his administration.- By the very definition of being a part of the executive branch, and a senior member at that, -yes.-

Matthew Sablan said...

Also, so long as her promotion goes through, it is clear to me that the administration doesn't mind what she has already admitted to doing, or which further actions have definitively proven.

That is: 1) Standing by and letting viewpoint discrimination happening; 2) Lying to Congress about when she knew about things; 3) Planting a question to pre-empt the IG report while dishonestly presenting it as an honest response; 4) Lying in response to questions while representing the IRS.

So, if Obama wants to make a clean showing for good government, she needs to go.

Matthew Sablan said...

"It probably shouldn't be (there will always be instances (help me here, Madame La Professeur) where pleading the 5th isn't an admission of guilt),"

-- In general, refusing to speak to the cops is the same as pleading the Fifth. There's nothing wrong with it; even if you are innocent, if you fear that you might say something that could cause you to be convicted, even if you aren't guilty. For example, admitting you were in a building a murder occurred in, even if you did not kill the person, could get you convicted, so my understanding is you could plead the Fifth and force the prosecution to prove you were there through some other means.

gerry said...

Maybe we should look for signs of smoke coming from the building as they destroy evidence.

Habemus papam!

Eustace Chilke said...

Looks to me like this could be their Thermopylae and she thinks she's the three hundred. The fastest route to the White House could be through her but it's very unlikely to be the only way.

phx said...

Phx, you'll need to work on your recall if you want to argue with people; this can't be the first time you've heard of Lerner unless you just ignore what is written in other threads you've responded in.

You are right.


Amartel said...

Okay, why does she get to plead the Fifth AND talk about how she's "done nothing wrong." It's one or the other. I've had clients plead the Fifth and they don't get to give a big speech, they don't get to selectively decide what they can talk about and not talk about. If you plead the Fifth your testimony is over.

joshua nigman said...

Mr.President, Your friends asked that I deliver this message to congratulate your administration on their IRS operations......

Dies ist die sehr Essence meiner Heimat Deutschland. Es wird von großem Wert sein, für alle meine Kameraden, die an der Hoffnung, dass Nazi festhalten Regel ist tot. Obama müssen wir vielen Dank für die wunderbare Kunst der gestapo Taktiken, die Sie innerhalb der US-Regierung installiert haben und die Stilllegung der Demokratie. USA = Nazi Deutschland.

Amartel said...

Ha. One of the Republican representatives made the same point. "Republican Rep. Trey Gowdy objected, saying that the committee should operate like a courtroom, “and she just testified, she just waived her Fifth Amendment right to privilege.”"

H/T Daily Caller.

Objection overruled by ranking douchetool Elijah Cummings because somehow the 5th Amendment operates differently in the House of Reps than in a courtroom. Somehow.

HA said...

Lerner has valid reasons to plead the 5th. The Obama administration is going to need a patsy to take the fall for the IRS scandal. The JournoList hacks have already huddled and are calling for her head. She needs to protect herself from being set up by Obama's henchmen.