November 4, 2012

"Live Free — Gary Johnson for President."

That was the graffiti on campus today:



(Zeus thinks the movie's about him.)

Maybe libertarianism is catching on amongst the younger people.

Untitled

We walked all down State Street and around the Capitol Square to see if there were any Obama-related activities in anticipation of his visit tomorrow. We saw lots of barriers and paraphernalia getting set up...

Untitled

... but no sign of any people pre-celebrating Obama. Presumably, they'll be lining up before dawn, ready to stream around the Capitol and into photo-op formation.

84 comments:

PatCA said...

Nice sentiments, but if you vote for Johnson to live free, you will live under Obama, and be less free.

Hammond X Gritzkofe said...

Got an email this morning from brother's wife "imploring" me not "waste" my vote on a third party. My reply:

Already done voted early, for Gary Johnson.

The Libertarian creed - fiscally responsible, socially tolerant, the party of individual responsibility - is where my heart lies.

Of the two major parties, both sell Government rather than individual responsibility. Republicans are a bit better with fiscal responsibility; neither is very socially tolerant. Both work hard to limit minority political access (ballot access rules, California's top-two primary rule,
gerrymandering).

Same story as Rome at the end of the republic. There are genuine
representatives of the oligarchy, and there are renegade oligarchs
who pander to the mob. Both are in politics for personal gain.

The only answer I can see is: "If ya don't like what they do with the
power, then don't allow them to have it." It does require an educated, informed electorate, courageous and confident enough to live by their own decisions in life. That's asking a lot, I know.

Anyhow, I might have voted differently were I in PA. Romney seems likely to win TX.

Someone wrote in to Glenn Reynolds: "Mitt Romney is not my first choice for President - not even my second or third - but I will crawl over broken glass to vote for him."

- shu

dreams said...

Low enthusiasm for Obama will mean lower turn out on election day. Expect less enthusiasm than you seem to be expecting.

I blame Obama fatigue.

Ali Karim Bey said...

The word at the Wash-Post (see the story by Dan and another by Dana) is the following:

- GOP are spreading FALSE information that Romney is ahead or gaining.

- The correct predictions ARE ONLY by Nate Silver, Esra Klein, and Sasha Issenberg. WHY? Because they know the statistics behind Americans voting patterns.

THUS, why I am suddenly getting nervous that every-one in the GOP is spreading FALSE information.

THUS, the race is over. Obama has won.

Thoughts?

Ali Karim Bey said...

Furthermore, the Nate Silver Company has mentioned on the NYT that:

WI, PA, FL, VA, and OH are going to Obama.

SO, explain how Romney is ahead or winning.

Every-one says GOP is spreading false information.

GOP says Nate is not right.

BUT, he is talked about my every-one who is any-one.

SO, he must be right. THus, I must cry on Tuesday as Romney lost and my vote was wasted.

Right?

pm317 said...

"Much to the chagrin of the Obama campaign, Studentsforobama.org is not supporting Obama’s reelection efforts. Instead, the site greets visitors with a video message from a college student explaining why he supported Obama in 2008 but is opposing him in 2012. {......}
In an exclusive interview, John Cassil, a student activist heavily involved with studentsforobama.org, stated, “Being on campus for the last four years, I’ve seen student orientation take a turn from liberal leaning to libertarian leaning, with political affiliations more closely mirroring that of the Republican Party.” A senior at Clemson University majoring in management, John is troubled by the foreign policy stances of the Obama administration. As John noted, “our relationship with Israel has suffered greatly the last four years which is why I’ve become actively involved with the Young Jewish Conservatives and the Republican Jewish Coalition.”"

MadisonMan said...

The daughter and I were on the Square today too, and she's planning on going tomorrow. Fortunately, her busy class day is Tuesday. She told me she has to get up super early to vote (same-day registering to change her voting address back to home from the dorm where she doesn't live anymore).

@dreams, I would blame election fatigue.

Dan said...

What, the liberals are going to shut down the Capitol again tomorrow?

edutcher said...

Much as I respect voting your principles, a vote for Johnson is a vote for Choom.

And, of course, the movie is about the dog. It's always about the dog.

PS Shame on you!

Keeping all that beautiful sunshine all to yourselves.

Ann Althouse said...

"Much as I respect voting your principles, a vote for Johnson is a vote for Choom."

I think there are some young people who would vote for Obama but are switching to Johnson.

dreams said...

Election fatigue works too.

Lem said...

The power was out today and it came back... hopefully for the last time... today.

We have two Sandy relocated newborns at the house... milk issues is a worry.

Our local gasoline station just opened for the first time this morning and the line is going for about seven blocks.

BDNYC said...

Voting for Johnson in a non-competitive state cannot in any way be regarded as a vote for Obama. I would hope in a swing state like Wisconsin that Johnson will steal young votes that would otherwise stay home or vote for Obama.

campy said...

Johnson ballots will be easy for Team Zero to steal, since the libertarians probably won't have poll watchers guarding them.

rcommal said...

Oh, I don't know. I think there's always been a contingent of young going for libertarianism (if not the Libertarian, given historical voting rates among that age group, period). I certainly can remember many from back in my college years, starting in '79.

rcommal said...

I'm not putting down libertarianism among older people, or younger for that matter. Got a goodly streak of that myself, and, in fact, if I weren't in a swing state I might very well be voting for Johnson. Living in a non-swing state does make somethings easier and, truth be told, I'm rather looking forward to that in one sense.

Zachary Paul Sire said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Zachary Paul Sire said...

Will the Althouse/Meade marriage survive if/when Obama wins a second term?

Since it was Meade who convinced Althouse to convert to the teabagger movement and to ultimately vote for Romney, will an Obama win cause too much strain on a marriage that's contingent upon one agreeing with the other politically?

Will an Obama win cause Althouse to resent Meade (e.g., "Damn you, Meade, you convinced me to switch my vote and now I look like a loser!"), or will it cause Meade to resent Althouse (e.g., "Damn you, Althouse, if it weren't for your support of Barry back in 2008, we wouldn't be in this mess in the first place!")?

Either way, unless Romney wins (and every battleground state poll says he won't), it looks like Althouse will be heading to divorce court for a second time. And Obama will be headed for a second term.

rcommal said...

Dang, Zachary, making it awfully personal, aren't you? And the notion of marriage awfully shallow...

dreams said...

Does anyone think there will be rioting if Obama loses?

rcommal said...

Watch out for the bait!!!

DUUUUUUCK!!!!!!!!

Lem said...

Wisconsin State Journal flips for Romney

Lem said...

And the notion of marriage awfully shallow...

As longs as is equally shallow..

Hammond X Gritzkofe said...

Oh yes, there will be rioting if Obama loses. The mob will always do that. Some property destruction, will be over in a day or so.

What's more worrisome is the possibility an anti-communist revolution if Obama wins. That could be long lasting and really destructive.

Kirby Olson said...

He hasn't visited New York State at all since the hurricane. We're clobbered here. Electricity still not on below 34th street.

Long Island is a complete ruin.

Where is Bam? He's out in the toss-up states. It makes me want to toss up.

New York is in Bam's column. NJ was a bit more dubious, so he had to visit.

But it's Madison that calls to him because he needs Wisconsin.

dreams said...

If Obama wins, his transformation of our country into a socialist welfare state like Europe will continue.

Chuck said...

Dear Ann and Lawrence;

While the EasyLeader device is probably good for training young dogs, I think that Zeus would be a lot happier (and he will not pull your arm off) with this device:

http://www.petsolutions.com/C/Dog-Harnesses/I/Gentle-Leader-Easy-Walk-Harness.aspx?utm_source=nextag&utm_medium=comparison&utm_term=59006779&utm_campaign=nextag

Labradors wearing that kind of harness, will not pull and tug the way they sometimes do with a leash attached to their collar.

I say this based on hundreds of happy hours walking with Labradors.

JohnJ said...

“Either way, unless Romney wins (and every battleground state poll says he won't), it looks like Althouse will be heading to divorce court for a second time.”

What a stupid, mean-spirited post. It almost distracted me from what I was going to comment on, which is Romney’s stump speech.

I saw Romney again this morning in Des Moines. His stump speech and presentation were terrific--alternately moving, philosophical, inspiring and witty; the crowd loved it! Also, the affection of the crowd for Romney, himself, was overwhelming. That’s new, at least to the extent I witnessed this morning. The crowd kept calling him back as he tried to leave and he obliged two or three times--hand over his heart, waving, pointing, shaking hands. Very moving!

I’m still pessimistic about Ohio. But, I do wonder whether this kind of excitement and apparent commitment is maybe underrepresented in the polls.

I sure hope so.

dreams said...

I think those east coast liberals like Nate Silver and the others or in a bubble. They don't live in the real world.

edutcher said...

Don't know if this is OT or not (largely because I'm not sure what the T is), but does anyone else get the feeling Tuesday could turn out like the Walker recall?

Ann Althouse said...

Much as I respect voting your principles, a vote for Johnson is a vote for Choom.

I think there are some young people who would vote for Obama but are switching to Johnson.


I think you're right. Ron Paul was very popular on campuses during the primaries.

dreams said...

Does anyone think there will be rioting if Obama loses?

I'm going to be careful where I go the rest of the week.

PS Consider this post by Donald Douglas, a sometime commenter here. Barone said the Romster made no moves in Jersey, but Jersey south of Trenton is essentially a Philadelphia suburb. Any move in SE PA is a move at South Jersey.

North Jersey we know about.

clint said...

"Much as I respect voting your principles, a vote for Johnson is a vote for Choom."

I would have said that -- until he wrote that he's voting in Texas. Now, if he were in a state that might be close, that would be different.

I've voted third party before, when I knew my state's electoral votes were in the bag.


"I think there are some young people who would vote for Obama but are switching to Johnson."

I know a baby boomer in California who's switched from Obama to Johnson. It's all about the war.

Lem said...

Take a look at Obama ad libbing again... off prompter... he goes into professor mode and loses the audience.

el polacko said...

young people who could easily switch their votes from obama to johnson make a case for raising the voting age.

'small government'...'individual responsibility'...who does that sound more like, obama or romney??

rather than cast a vote for a libertarian candidate with NO chance of winning, why not vote for romney and help to move the republicans in the libertarian direction in which they are already headed?

leslyn said...

A sense of humor is unfortunately rare onvthis blog. I doubt Althouse and Made are worried about their marriage.

madAsHell said...

All my impressions of Wisconsin are derived from this blog. I can't understand why Obama is visiting Dane county.

Shouldn't he be visiting in the hinterlands of Wisconsin??

dreams said...

I first saw people like Obama in the Air Force, he is a bullshitter, he is the bullshitter, just winging it because he doesn't know what he's doing.

leslyn said...

When Obama wins, you don't have to worry about white people rioting either:

Message to White Voters.

leslyn said...

madAsHell said... All my impressions of Wisconsin are derived from this blog. I can't understand why Obama is visiting Dane county. Shouldn't he be visiting in the hinterlands of Wisconsin??

He was there Nov.1.

ricpic said...

Muddling through will never be good enough for Libertarians who are idiot perfectionists.

borgjess said...

'small government'...'individual responsibility'...who does that sound more like, obama or romney??

Not much like either IMHO.

Since I live in Kansas, I'm perfectly free to vote my conscience. I'm voting for Johnson. I can't make him win, but I will be able to vote without holding my nose.

Hammond X Gritzkofe said...

“...rather than cast a vote for a libertarian candidate with NO chance of winning, why not vote for romney and help to move the republicans in the libertarian direction in which they are already headed? “

In my observation, the trajectory of Republicans - albeit at a lesser rate than Democrats - has not been in the libertarian direction.

Some years ago I conceived the idea that the duty of Legislators is not just to initiate laws, but to be the curators of our body of laws. That means culling out obsolete laws and failed programs.

When Congress ends a session with fewer laws on the books than at the start, I will cheer and consider voting for one of the incumbents. Not until then.

Hammond X Gritzkofe said...

“...rather than cast a vote for a libertarian candidate with NO chance of winning, why not vote for romney and help to move the republicans in the libertarian direction in which they are already headed? “

A mark in the Libertarian column is the clearest indication I can give to both Republicans and Democrats that "here is one vote you will only get when you do more than pay lip service to fiscal responsibility and social tolerance; think about that for the future when you might need that vote."

Cedarford said...

edutcher said...
Much as I respect voting your principles, a vote for Johnson is a vote for Choom
=====================
You forget that a hell of a lot of the little Choomer pothead libertarians that ordinarily would have voted for the Kool Guy -
Will be voting for pro pot legalization Gary Johnson instead. So Johnson is a wash in the Presidential election.


What would have doomed Romney in a close race would have been Ron Paul running and taking away a good chunk of Tea Party people - or some Fundie Goober that would have siphoned off the right to life, "rape is God's Will and so you must bear the rapist' blessed baby", and evolution denying evangelicals.

clint said...

Off-Topic question for the Wisconsinites on this blog: What's the political leaning of the Madison Wisconsin State Journal?

I always have trouble figuring out which newspaper endorsements are surprising, and which are routine.

Hammond X Gritzkofe said...

...a lot of the little Choomer pothead libertarians that ordinarily would have voted for the Kool Guy -
Will be voting for pro pot legalization Gary Johnson instead.


Not all who favor legalization are tokers. The insane "War on Drugs" drives much of the loss of liberty and expansion of police powers in recent years.

If we as a society want to eliminate use of a particular substance - cocaine, pot, alcohol, tobacco, coffee, whatever, it can be done by simply standing any and all users or purveyors against a wall and shooting them.

If we as a society are not ready to do that, then for cris'sake fucking let it be.

I live close to Mexico and weep for what our drug laws have done that beautiful neighbor.

I'm a decade or so too young for personal knowledge of Prohibition, but not too stupid to understand that it didn't work.

FedkaTheConvict said...

All my impressions of Wisconsin are derived from this blog. I can't understand why Obama is visiting Dane county.

Shouldn't he be visiting in the hinterlands of Wisconsin??


Its all about the "optics" right now. Obama was here in Wisconsin on Thursday and Saturday (with Katy Perry) and he couldn't even fill the Delta Center in Milwaukee.

He wants to create the impression of momentum tomorrow by having a large crowd show up.

Carl said...

I've never met a genuine young libertarian -- just a bunch of muddleheads who really want dope legalized and are pissed and bored that elections seem to turn on Old Fart issues, like taxes (which they mostly don't pay) and Social Security/Medicare (about which they don't care, since The Singularity will occur first and they'll be living forever, in perfect health, anyway).

The proof is that when you ask them whether they also are good with DRM and shrink-wrap licenses, whether laws shielding assets from credit-card companies should go, or whether Apple should be able to charge all the market will bear in the iTunes store -- they rapidly rediscover the value of Big Government, at least when it comes to protecting their sacred cows.

I tend to think if you've a good heart, a sound character and good mind, you're probably a liberal when you're young. What else? You naturally want the world to work out well, and you imagine a few simple rules imposed on all could do the trick. I think it takes decades of experience before you sadly realize the limitations of top-down planning, and the unpredictability of people, and grow conservative.

As Churchill said (among others), if you're not liberal when young, you have no heart, and if you don't turn conservative with age, you have no brain.

MadisonMan said...

What's the political leaning of the Madison Wisconsin State Journal?

Well, they endorsed Obama in '08 and Clinton in '92, but other than that they usually endorse the Republican (I was surprised they endorsed Pocan).

They are somewhat conservative, for Dane County, meaning they are very liberal for the rest of the Country.

clint said...

Thanks, MadisonMan.

Bob Ellison said...

I'm sympathetic to your feelings, Hammond X Gritzkofe. We've got plenty of reason to doubt that our individual votes matter that much, so we surely might as well go and vote for candidates and parties that we actually like.

Romney by seven. That result will shock a lot of people. Not Gary Johnson, though. He's a good guy, and I wouldn't mind a bit if he were elected.

If Obama somehow wins, he will contribute more to the destruction of the Democratic Party. A few Democrats are already thinking this. If we win this thing, we're sunk for a generation.

Bob Ellison said...

Let me just add, way off-topic: if you're thinking of buying a generator, do it.

wyo sis said...

Carl
That's why the way campaigns callously use the youth vote is so upsetting. It contributes to the exploitative atmosphere that seems to be everywhere. Even when young people seem to know what they're doing they're usually just saying what they think people want them to say. The coarsening of the culture starts with coarsening young people.

edutcher said...

Has anyone seen this off Breitbart:

Crowd walks out on O at VA rally?

Rabel said...

The Madison visit is a pretty smart move by tha Obama campaign.

Wisconsin could turn on a a thousand or so student votes. Or not, but that chance plus the big crowd for the network news makes it a good choice for election eve.

Original Mike said...

Who do the young think are going to pay for all the profligate spending?

Get a clue, younglings.

Shawn Levasseur said...

So it's okay for me to vote my concience so long it doesn't affect YOUR favorite candidate.

Y'know I should be able to just vote, and not have to play some guessing game on how everyone else is voting. (Insert pitch for Instant Runoff Voting here.)

I hope Gary does have enough votes to be "Blamed" for one or the other's loss. (as Ann has pointed out, he's just as likely to "take" votes from Obama) Maybe the national press will actually mention him once in a while.

EDH said...

... but no sign of any people pre-celebrating Obama.

Meanwhile, events over the next two days in Boston are likely to leave me exhausted.

Aerosmith commemorates their start at their old apartment on Commonwealth Ave with a free concert tomorrow, and Boston is ground-zero for the Romney campaign.

The Aerosmith appearance, near Althouse's old Boston haunt, is in no way an endorsement or rally for Romney, as the band is mixed politically, although Joe Perry is a pretty outspoken conservative.

Notice how the leftist "El Globo" downplays the significance of Romney's election night.

Boston Police prepare for Aerosmith concert in Allston and Election Day rally by Mitt Romney

Aerosmith plans to perform outside 1325 Commonwealth Ave., the apartment building where the band got its start. A plaque will be unveiled at noon, then the band will play until 1 p.m...

Romney plans to hold an election night rally at the Boston Convention and Exhibition Center. Outside the center, Summer Street will be closed starting at 6 p.m.

purplepenquin said...

Much as I respect voting your principles, a vote for Johnson is a vote for Choom.

Utter fuckin' bullshit. A vote for Johnson is a vote for Johnson, and anybody who says otherwise is simply trying to suppress the vote.

This sense of entitlement that the folks who worship at the altar of the TwoParties knows no bounds. Your political parties have to EARN our votes - despite what ya beleive, ya'll don't automatically own 'em.

And a vote for a third/fourth party in a swing state has a lot of effect...study a lil' history about how Womens' Suffrage or Prohibition was passed in America and maybe you'll begin to understand how huge changes are brought about in our country.

sleepless nights said...

I think of libertarian as a young person's game.

There were always quite a few left-leaning libertarian types among Silicon Valley young professionals, for example though I notice their numbers are far reduced in the current batch of 20-somethings.

Because libertarianism is a philosophy that favors the strongest in the name of freedom, it often becomes miserly, cruel, or hypocritical as a person gets older and weaker and/or their loved ones get older and weaker, or were never strong to begin with.

Either they are employed and well-funded by the government in some way, including higher education or defense-industry research, or their corporate employer is tied into government funding, or they benefit from a union, or they lean heavily on government programs such as medicare/social security/disability as they age to the degree that they really couldn't survive without them and so leave themselves open to charges of hypocrisy. (Ironically, Hollywood is really one of the more brutal, least government-dependent industries out there.)


Sorun said...

"And a vote for a third/fourth party in a swing state has a lot of effect...study a lil' history about how Womens' Suffrage or Prohibition was passed in America."

Yeah, and the big third-party issue of 2012 is: Give the finger to the vast center of the American electorate.

Not a good enough reason. I suppose life sucks out on the margins of American politics, but that's your problem, weirdo.

Hammond X Gritzkofe said...

Perhaps our gracious hostess might one day sponsor a discussion on parliamentary forms of government.

Our British cousins seem to have settled into a two party dynamic, but I am thinking there is less suppression of minority parties than with our system.

There it's enough to elect one or two M.P.s if such are needed to form a coalition government.

The equivalent here would be something like the Free State Project - much more of a challenge to bring off.

bagoh20 said...

Generation after generation tilting at windmills. It doesn't matter why you vote for a third party, because nobody really cares once you do. You become a non-voter. If the parties knew who you were they wouldn't even talk to you, or try to move you. If I thought Johnson could win, I'd vote for him, but once I realize my first choice can't win, the next best use of my vote is to support the one going in the right direction, regardless of how slowly or indirectly he's getting there, and my vote supports his mandate, and thus the direction I want. With that same vote, I'm also reducing the mandate of the worse guy if he happens to win.

1) You don't send any message if nobody cares. 2)Anytime your principles don't include some pragmatism you are admitting you don't really care what happens, and you aren't serious, except maybe in the crafting of your self image.

I'm a libertarian , and I'll be voting Romney, because it's hard to get less libertarian than Obama.

Revenant said...

Nice sentiments, but if you vote for Johnson to live free, you will live under Obama, and be less free.

I'll really be bummed if Obama ends up winning the election because Romney voters throw their votes away on him instead of biting the bullet and pulling the lever for Gary Johnson. :)

Honestly, though, we'll be less free four years from now under Romney, too, just like we were less free after eight years of Bush. Obama would be worse, but that's the nicest thing you can say about Romney.

EDH said...

Did anyone hear Bill Clinton's "when I got caught with my hand in the cookie jar" remarks at the Obama rally?

Revenant said...

Yeah, and the big third-party issue of 2012 is: Give the finger to the vast center of the American electorate.

The "vast center of the American electorate" supports running massive deficits to support low taxes paired with massive entitlement spending. They're like irresponsible drug addicts, basically.

After a while, it gets tiresome being their enabler. The passive-aggressive threats about what will happen if we don't help them get a new fix start to ring hollow after a while.

Is being a responsible citizen a fringe position? Yeah, unfortunately, these days it is. But maybe if we curtail the co-dependent relationship with the irresponsible majority, things will improve. Probably not, of course. But given a choice between inevitable death via creeping totalitarianism, and a one in a million shot at something better -- why not take the shot?

Obama has been awful, but his is a difference of degree, not of kind. We've had a century of Presidents and Congresses who have uniformly curtailed freedom for Americans. It can't go on forever, one hopes.

Michael K said...

"In my observation, the trajectory of Republicans - albeit at a lesser rate than Democrats - has not been in the libertarian direction.""

That's what the Tea Party is about. The lefties, like my daughter and her husband who I took out to dinner last night for her birthday, are convinced the Tea Party is a social movement. That's because they get their information from leftist sources and friends who have also never been to a Tea Party rally.

Go to a Tea Party event and you will see. But you won't.

purplepenquin said...

Not a good enough reason

Of course it ain't good enough, 'cause most strawmen aren't as good as the actual&real reasons. Everyone I know that is voting either Libertarian or Green..and there are quite a few...are able to state exactly why they are doing so, and saying "fuck you" to their neighbors ain't it at all.

The War on Drugs (especially medical marijuana) is the biggest reason I hear from folks voting outside the Duopoly...and with polls showing ~50% of all Americans saying "legalize it" I don't think that can be considered a fringe issue anymore, can it?

Some folks are also uptight about certain aspects of the War on Terror (Gitmo still being open & President being legally allowed to order an assassination against American citizens are brought up a lot). Two pals also make a big deal about overhauling the Federal Reserve.

Since both the Dems and the Repubs are basically in lockstep on those issues, what other choice do those people have?

garage mahal said...

What's the political leaning of the Madison Wisconsin State Journal?

Wisconsin media is remarkably friendly to Republicans. Really, there is literally nothing Republicans could complain about.

purplepenquin said...

It doesn't matter why you vote for a third party, because nobody really cares once you do

If it is a close race, and a 3rd party got enough votes to cover the difference, then rest-assured that the losing political party cares a lot about why those people voted the way they did...'cause they wanna bring 'em back into the fold next time.

That aside, didn't you say that there is no way Romney will win the popular vote in your state anyways? If that is true (andImaybeconfusingyouwithsomeoneelse) then your vote for him is just as "wasted" as what you claim a vote for Johnson is...no?

wyo sis said...

If there is ever a realistic chance of a Conservative Tea Party candidate winning I'm going to vote for him/her.
But, we live in a two party system and recent history, (the past 40-50 years) shows us that 3rd party candidates usually cause a split that benefits the other side.
Bringing libertarian candidates up from the grass roots has a better chance of getting us to a more libertarian government in the long run.
The left got the country to the leftist country it is now by growing liberal Progressivism slowly and steadily.

yashu said...

Obama has been awful, but his is a difference of degree, not of kind.

Frankly, I think this is bullshit. Or your bar for a difference in "kind" is a theoretical difference beyond any actual political real-world American reality. But we've had that (friendly) argument before, so I won't get into it again. :)

Anyway, this has been posted elsewhere for days now and most of you might have already seen it. But to anyone who leans more to Romney than Obama but is planning on voting third party or not voting at all, Bill Whittle has something to say to you.

bagoh20 said...

"That aside, didn't you say that there is no way Romney will win the popular vote in your state anyways? If that is true (andImaybeconfusingyouwithsomeoneelse) then your vote for him is just as "wasted" as what you claim a vote for Johnson is...no? "

I'm in CA, so it doesn't change anything at all, but as I said, the best you can do is contribute to or neutralize the winner's mandate. A vote for the third party throws away both your vote's choosing the winner and affecting him after he takes office. It is truly wasted.

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RoBanJo said...

Yes, the 1917 flu afflicted the young more heavily too.

purplepenquin said...

The only wasted vote is the one not cast.

Can someone please tell me how voting for one of the losers helps neutralize the winner's mandate but voting for a different one of the losers is throwing your vote away? 'cause that doesn't make any sense at all.

I'm also curious to know what a person should do when both candidates are strongly opposed to how the voter feels on an important issue. Should they really vote against their principles rather than vote for someone who does beleive as they do?

Hammond X Gritzkofe said...

Go to a Tea Party event and you will see. But you won't.

Actually, have been to more than one, including a 4 hour drive to see the event in Austin.

Might have voted for a Tea Party candidate, but there were NONE on the ballot. Libertarians had candidates at near half the positions.

When the Tea Party first emerged as the TEA (Taxed Enough Already) Party, I thought/hoped they might invade the Libertarians to take advantage of Libertarian's ballot access work.

Instead they seem to have settled in as a grumpy fraction of the Republican Party.

My impression from the local meetings is they are collectively statist on social issues (drugs, abortion, sexual orientation) and individually possessive of their social security and medicare.

Rusty said...


My impression from the local meetings is they are collectively statist on social issues (drugs, abortion, sexual orientation) and individually possessive of their social security and medicare.


Hmmmm.
Must have different priorities in Austin.
For years, even before the Tea Party, I have been asking the Social Security Administration if they would please return the money I have already sent in.
Turns out they don't have it.

Hammond X Gritzkofe said...

Thoughtful words from Wyo Sis.

Bringing libertarian candidates up from the grass roots has a better chance of getting us to a more libertarian government in the long run.

The L.P. got and retains ballot access by running candidates for State level offices (where, yes, there's not a snowball's chance of actually winning). But rarely candidates at County races.

Why?

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عراقنا
شات العراق
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جات
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منتدى عراقنا

Andru Luka said...

nice sharing.......

golden apple said...

Golden Apple Raj Nagar
Manju J Homes has Come up With an Excellent Features and Location, Grand Project With the Name Golden Apple Raj Nagar Which offers Affordable Homes in New Delhi/NCR Ghaziabad.

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Contact-

NH-58, Near IMR Institute
Meerut Road Raj Nagar Extension Ghaziabad

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Rajnagar Extention said...

Ready To Move, Property in Raj Nagar Extension
Ready To Move, Property in Raj Nagar Extension at Ghaziabad Offers Budget Homes With Facilities that Fulfil the Aspirations and Demands of Today's Home Seekers. It's Connectivity to Other NCR Regions.
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Contact-
Raj Nagar Extention
Call us- 9811109971, 9953932722, 9811172672
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VinayKr. Singh said...

Golden Apple Homez in Raj Nagar

Golden Apple Homes was founded by a group of Delhi Ncr's top reputed developers with the sole objective of providing a flawless living destination for people with higher aspirations of better living within their limited budgets.
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Contact: Vinay Kumar
Raj Nagar Extension Ghaziabad NH 58
Mobile:- +91-9818410411
+91-9654565636

rajnagar8 said...

Ready to Move Raj Nagar Extension Call@-9953932722

Raj Nagar Extension is a one Stop Destination for a Wide Range of Ready to Move Flats in Ghaziabad. Located on main NH-58 Ghaziabad, Most Affordable City of Delhi NCR.
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Call Us: +91-9811109971, 9953932722,
9811172672
http://www.rajnagarextension.com