July 13, 2012

What happened to all the manly men?

The NYT asks a bunch of people, including Natasha Scripture, who says:
Come to think of it, I haven’t met a manly man in quite some time. Maybe because most of them live in Montana. Or Texas. Or Sicily! They’re certainly rare sightings in New York City because here the abundant local species seems to be the metrosexual.
Oh! Metrosexual. I haven't seen that word for a long time. I'm thinking it fell out of fashion because... Barack Obama? But it's reviving because somebody at the NYT thinks Obama is manlier than Mitt Romney. (He just points at a name on a list and a guy half a globe away explodes — to smithereens.) But, no, maybe it's not that. Maybe it's "50 Shades of Grey" being a big bestseller and somebody at the NYT inferring that their female readers are tired of less manly men, so it's time to bring back the old epithet. Or, hell, maybe ladies are reading "50 Shades of Grey" because of Barack Obama. Whatever. Anyway, back to Natasha Scripture (love the name):
And as much as I can appreciate a man who knows his sashimi, the more carnal, female side of me wants to see him tuck into a heaping plate of meat and potatoes; and to toss aside the cologne and let pheromones take charge. Yes, gentlemen, you’re allowed to sweat in my divine presence.

Also, when it comes to so-called manly traits, I would be kind of a masochist if I didn’t want a man with some level of emotional availability. But please, is it too much to ask that he not cry on a first date?...

I hope we don’t become so much like each other that we end up essentially morphing into one androgynous being. That would just be plain weird.
Lots of things are weird. Like longing for masculinity, then calling yourself "divine" and dispensing precise instructions for just enough but not much manliness. But it's not so weird to sigh about how everyone you think you might want is somewhere other than on the small island where you live. But what can you do? Go to Montana?

There are 7 other essays in this NYT set....

Mark Simpson, author of "Metrosexy: A 21st Century Self-Love Story," says:
Continuing to fret about [manliness] means men being sold prissy lists of “manly” dos and don'ts. Or reactionary ideology, such as the mendacious “menaissance.” Or a dodgy daydream of a “manly” past, such as an impossibly pretty, fastidious advertising creative, who is also a basket-case army deserter. And entirely fictional.
What? Those are words, and I know what they all mean. But I don't know what they mean together. Presumably: Stop thinking about it.

Joel Stein,  author of "Man Made: A Stupid Quest for Masculinity," says:
I got messed up by my feminist mom in the 1970s, who taught me that gender was a social construct. I can’t believe that social experiment went on as long as it did, since it’s clear by month six of having a child that William does not want a doll....
His boy is masculine. Problem solved for Joel Stein.

Still 5 more essays, but that's it for me.

137 comments:

gerry said...

I'm a lumberjack...

chickelit said...

Yes, gentlemen, you’re allowed to sweat in my divine presence.

She knows how to engender the gag reflex.

Nathan Alexander said...

Here's the thing:
Women are never satisfied.
If you give them everything they want, they complain you are a pushover. If you aren't a pushover, they complain you are a jerk.

On the balance, it seems better to be a jerk. You get complained about just as much, but they are less likely to leave or cheat on you.

Now, not all women are like this.

But enough to make it frustrating.

Women are saved by the number of men who are able to look past all the bullshit and love them anyway.

IMHO, of course.

edutcher said...

The woman has delusions of adequacy.

Not to mention femininity.

Ann Althouse said...

Metrosexual. I haven't seen that word for a long time. I'm thinking it fell out of fashion because... Barack Obama?

The ultimate metrosexual. He's only tough when he knows the mob is behind him.

PS If the Gray Lady really did get the outbreak of manliness in Gotham it says it seeks, such as occurred on 9/11 and immediately thereafter, the staff would fill the front pages with concerns about the country reverting to Fascism.

traditionalguy said...

I know what. She needs an I-Tablet set for a quick Meyers-Briggs test for every Metrosexual du jour she meets until she finds a man in disguise.

Then she needs to quickly surrender to him. He can become her patriarch later after she buys him a new man's wardrobe plus boots.

Rusty said...

Every woman wants a sensitive man until the water softener goes tits up.



" If they don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy."

Red Green

KJE said...

I'm a single dad to a 5 1/2 year old boy, he lives with me most of the time.

Growing up, I wasn’t involved in, or forced to do things, that made me sore (cheifly hard physical work). I came into doing all that later, and it changed a lot of things about me in terms of my personality when I finally did. It was a rough transition when I was 28.

I think boys need that, it helps them become men, as opposed to becoming a stereotypical man-child, living with a parent and addicted to video games.

Regardless of what my son turns out to be as an adult, it's my responsibiltiy to society to ensure that he doesn't turn into that man-child.

This year, He gets a Red Ryder BB gun for Christmas...

DADvocate said...

And as much as I can appreciate a man who knows his sashimi, the more carnal, female side of me wants to see him tuck into a heaping plate of meat and potatoes; and to toss aside the cologne and let pheromones take charge. Yes, gentlemen, you’re allowed to sweat in my divine presence.

I don't know what sashimi is.

My steaks always weight at least 16 oz.

I never wear cologne.

I sweat any where I want.

I would consider Natasha's presence anything but "divine."

rehajm said...

The manly men are still around Natasha. They are with other women. Manly men don't allow the feminists to decide for them who they should be attracted to. They select based on their own criteria. And they aren't attracted to you.

Now go pick someone out the crowd of emasculated, spandex bike shorted douchebags the feminists created

prairie wind said...

Yes, gentlemen, you’re allowed to sweat in my divine presence.

Um, NO.

yashu said...

"What? Those are words, and I know what they all mean. But I don't know what they mean together."

Don't know what they all mean together either, but if it helps any, "a dodgy daydream of a 'manly' past, such as an impossibly pretty, fastidious advertising creative, who is also a basket-case army deserter" is a reference to "Mad Men."

Yeah, doesn't help much.

AllieOop said...

Women ARE attracted to masculine men, but if a man thinks that being a knuckle dragging troglodyte is being a real man, they won't last with most normal women. Shades of Grey is fiction.

garage mahal said...

You know how I know you're a metrosexual? Because you're a metrosexual? And you can tell who other metrosexuals are?

Rocketeer said...

The reason these women don't know any "manly men," is because manly men don't want to know them.

ndspinelli said...

Most of the manly men are saying "fuck these eltist, feminist, bitches." They go out, eat a good steak dinner, and then have an escort spend the night w/ them. Less drama and better sex.

Chip Ahoy said...

You have a bunch of NYT essays and that's all well and good but so what, I found a cache of NYT crossword puzzles. There's like, hang on, get info, 120 of them in there.

I did one yesterday. It was so easy I was like, it this a Monday puz or what? No wait, there were two yesterday and one was fine. A big one about quotations.

"If I were two faced would I be wearing this one?" Abraham Lincoln, duh.

"It's not easy being green" Kermit the frog, duh duh double dog duh.

"Wit is educated insolence" Aristotle, okay didn't know that one.

"Nobody wants justice" Alexanders Howitz or is it Alexander Showitz, don't know 'im.

"Every time a friend succeeds I die a little" Gore Vidal, I like this guy more and more.

"You'd be surprised how much it costs to look this cheap" Dolly Parton, a big ol' gimme if I ever saw one.

"I used to be Snow White but I drifted." Mae West, another gimme.

"By the time we made it we've had it" Malcolm Forbes.

Wasn't that fun? All the rest of the crap is filler.

TMink said...

Moving to Montana soon, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

Trey

bagoh20 said...

And people wonder why I'm still single. Who wants to buy the cow, when they have heads on both ends now days.

All the manly men have been swept up by gay bottoms. They know how to be a real woman.

Jay Vogt said...

". . .somebody at the NYT thinks Obama is manlier than Mitt Romney. (He just points at a name on a list and a guy half a globe away explodes — to smithereens.)"

Seriously? There is nothing less "manly" than that

Darcy said...

Obama manlier than Romney?

HahahahaHA! Wow. Are they trying hard.

No. And I don't consider Romney all that manly.

LarsPorsena said...

Blogger ndspinelli said...

''Most of the manly men are saying "fuck these eltist, feminist, bitches." They go out, eat a good steak dinner, and then have an escort spend the night w/ them. Less drama and better sex.''..and they don't want to sleep over.

Rocketeer said...

The popularity of "50 Shades of Grey" isn't evidence that women want manly men. It is evidence, however, that women like really shitty pap written at a fifth grade level. Nothing more, nothing less, and honestly, didn't we already have that evidence given the popularity of "The Da Vinci Code"?

Jay Vogt said...

I knew there would be a Frank Zappa reference in the first dozen posts.

bagoh20 said...

I bet Chuck Norris could conquer the entire island of Manhattan with nothing but a spatula. If he did it nude, he wouldn't even need the spatula.

Rocketeer said...

"Moving to Montana soon, gonna be a dental floss tycoon."

Montana, maybe. West Virginia's off the list though.

yashu said...

Come to think of it, I haven’t met a manly man in quite some time. Maybe because most of them live in Montana. Or Texas.

An unstated implication here is that a lot of those longed-for manly men would be (gasp!) Republicans.

garage mahal said...

The reason these women don't know any "manly men," is because manly men don't want to know them.

The phrase "it's who you know" never made any sense. It's like you said, it's who wants to know you.

For instance, I "know" Salma Hayek.

Freeman Hunt said...

(He just points at a name on a list and a guy half a globe away explodes — to smithereens.)

Manly like Caligula in The Robe.

Darcy said...

@Rocketeer It's complicated. But you're really close to the truth. Women want manly men. They want to be led. But they will test the heck out of that leadership and try to wrest control almost constantly unless they are truly being led well. And we are pummeling the leadership out of our young men and cheering on the controlling young women.

It's pretty sad.

bagoh20 said...

Bumper sticker:
"Real women don't vote for metrosexuals"

Would that get your car keyed?

Rocketeer said...

For instance, I "know" Salma Hayek.

You and me both, brother. You and me both.

Or as my brother says: "I halfway know lots of famous people. I know them, but they don't know me."

chickelit said...

AllieOop said...
...if a man thinks that being a knuckle dragging troglodyte is being a real man, they won't last with most normal women.

Allie sounds like one a da Butt Sistahs: Sock it to me!

AllieOop said...

Darcy, you know I love ya, but how about an equal partnership? I personally don't want to be led all the time, it's nice to have a guy be decisive and not always defere to the woman, that is a turn off, but to be led, hmmm, you know me ;)

Rocketeer said...

Allie Oop: not doing the Lindy Hop.

Also out: East Coast, West Coast, Shag, Savoy, Hustle, Cha-Cha, Viennese Waltz, and virtually every couples dance.

Darcy said...

Yeah. We're gonna disagree here, Allie. ;-)

holdfast said...

I believe the correct term for Obama was explained by the noted philosopher, Sir Mix A Lot:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LH7bzcYVeps

What's truly fantastic is that his ode to Barry was actually on the "B" side of his much better known paean to Michelle:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csNPRjNlzec

AllieOop said...

She was going to sock him, but changed her mind......

AllieOop said...

Rocketeer, I dance divinely and I insist the man leads and doesn't stomp on my toes.

chickelit said...

She was going to sock him, but changed her mind......

As women are want to...

Pogo said...

"...how about an equal partnership?"

I prefer either a limited liability partnership or a theocracy.

YoungHegelian said...

Whenever I read the online personals for yucks (for yucks, people -- there's that sacramental vow thing, ya know?) you know who I end up admiring?

The chicks who post stuff like "Since I was 15, I've always wanted to go cowgirl on a foot long, black, kosher hot dog."

At least these women know what they want!

@Darcy/Allie On behalf of all the men on the forum, that ranks as the most boring cat fight in history. Not even one "Beee-yatch!". please do better next time, mmmmmkay?

Balfegor said...

Re: Jay Vogt:

". . .somebody at the NYT thinks Obama is manlier than Mitt Romney. (He just points at a name on a list and a guy half a globe away explodes — to smithereens.)"

Seriously? There is nothing less "manly" than that


Haha, it is the Emperor on his throne in the Death Star.

Re: Darcy:

Obama manlier than Romney?

HahahahaHA! Wow. Are they trying hard.

No. And I don't consider Romney all that manly
.

Me neither. I don't think Romney has particularly tried to project an image of stereotypical "manliness" either -- it seems like half the human-interest news articles I've seen re: Romney mention how horribly "unathletic" he is (there are 1.2 million hits on Google for unathletic Romney), but he hasn't done the usual thing, which would be to gin up some kind of sports game ("game of sport"?) to demonstrate his manly athleticism. I mean, the stories about his wife's illness almost play up his domesticity -- cooking (badly) for the family and so on.

ndspinelli said...

Real men don't dance, unless they're drunk.

chickelit said...

...how about an equal partnership?

Chemists long ago parsed the nuanced difference between equality and equivalency. Insofar as chemistry is like sex, the distinction holds.

Darcy said...

We'll mud wrestle in pudding next time, Young Heg.

@Nick Oh, yes they fucking do. ;-)

Rocketeer said...

Real men don't dance, unless they're drunk.

I can only tell you that if it hadn't been for dancing, I would have missed out on, er, "spending time" with a lot of very lovely girls in my younger single days, and that I'm glad I was completely sober when I was, er, "spending" it.

AllieOop said...

Darcy, so long as we don't have to wear scary blue masks like Seven Machos wears.

YoungHegelian said...

@Darcy,

We'll mud wrestle in pudding next time, Young Heg.

Gosh, Darcy, would you please? Thanks so much! You're just swell

chickelit said...

Me neither. I don't think Romney has particularly tried to project an image of stereotypical "manliness" either -- it seems like half the human-interest news articles I've seen...

Could it also simply be that someone is trying to project Bush-type swagger onto Romney? The left desperately wants to keep running against Bush…

chickelit said...

@Darcy swore: @Nick Oh, yes they fucking do. ;-)

Are you talking about ballroom dancing?

YoungHegelian said...

Re: Romney & manliness

When one is worth over 250 million, I don't think it is truly necessary to have pheromonic sweat or an enormous schwannstucker to be considered an "alpha male".

Balfegor said...

Re: chickelit:

Could it also simply be that someone is trying to project Bush-type swagger onto Romney? The left desperately wants to keep running against Bush

Maybe? But these articles are written by professional journalists, so you'd assume they're largely pro-Obama. It may be that they're all just sort of bowled over that a Republican candidate is willing to admit he's totally unathletic because that's so contrary to the false mental image of Republicans that they have (to wit, that Republicans = jocks).

edutcher said...

AllieOop said...

Women ARE attracted to masculine men, but if a man thinks that being a knuckle dragging troglodyte is being a real man, they won't last with most normal women. Shades of Grey is fiction.

Oop knows no nurses.

Darcy said...

Obama manlier than Romney?

HahahahaHA! Wow. Are they trying hard.

No. And I don't consider Romney all that manly.


Actually, unless you're looking for Rambo, the Romster is a pretty good man.

He has the rep of being honest and honorable, he's raised 5 boys that seem to be straight arrows, and he's stood by his wife when a lot of other guys in his bracket would have gone looking for a trophy.

That's a pretty good man to me.

Freeman Hunt said...

(He just points at a name on a list and a guy half a globe away explodes — to smithereens.)

Manly like Caligula in The Robe.


Little Boots had the excuse of being highly traumatized as a child.

LordSomber said...

There must be a lot of unopened pickle jars in Manhattan. And huge spiders back there behind the toilet.

AllieOop said...

I know no nurses? What is THAT supposed to mean?

If it means your wife the blond is happy being married to you and you call yourself a troglodyte......well she has my sympathies.

Rocketeer said...

Little Boots had the excuse of being highly traumatized as a child.

Actually, the analogy still holds. It's just that the presidency is no place to be working out your daddy issues.

Icepick said...

Yes, gentlemen, you’re allowed to sweat in my divine presence.

If he wore shorts maybe he wouldn't sweat as much.

Jason (the commenter) said...

All the manly men are either married or gay.

Pogo said...

Do manly men still use Irish Spring?

"Manly, yes, but I like it too"

Eric said...

The sort of background that produces "manly" men isn't the sort of background that can produce an income large enough to rent a nice place in Manhattan. I'm sure she does know manly men, but she looks right through them because they don't clear the (conscious or unconscious) income hurdle.

Sure, there are exceptions. But they're rare, and she's already living in a place where the ratio of single women to single men is tipped heavily against her.

Michael K said...

"This year, He gets a Red Ryder BB gun for Christmas..."

Why not a .22 ? Teach him to shoot. I got my first gun at age 9. Went pheasant hunting with my father that year. I had to carry my gun unloaded and walk the fields with the men. And one woman, my cousin who liked men.

I was almost drowned at age 9 when we were on our way to a duck blind on the Illinois River and a tug boat pushing a barge too fast passed us. The guide grabbed me. I still wasn't allowed to shoot but I was allowed to freeze. At noon, my father went back into the woods to cook hamburgers for us. When the smell got out, we had every hunter on the island hanging around. While he was cooking, he shot two ducks flying overhead with his 12 gauge magnum.

When I was 14, I got five pheasants in about 5 seconds, when the flock got up. I saw my father bag two pheasants with two shots from a 28 gauge side by side shotgun. He was a great wing shot.

I am so glad I'm not trying to grow up now and I do worry about my grandson. He and my son and I spent last Saturday aboard the USS Iowa on its first day open.

You do what you can. It's tough these days when any peep of masculine fun is descended upon by an avenging horde of femiNazis.

Jason (the commenter) said...

It's disingenuous to look at single men and say they represent all men. Most men aren't single.

Metrosexuals = leftovers.

Pogo said...

Generally, US liberal culture made manliness a sin, a crime or a behavioral disorder requiring medication.

We have not yet declined to the point of Sitzpinkel however.

AllenS said...

"Hi, Natasha Scripture, my name is AllenS, and I have four tractors and a dozer. Wanna fuck?"

edutcher said...

AllieOop said...

I know no nurses? What is THAT supposed to mean?

If it means your wife the blond is happy being married to you and you call yourself a troglodyte......well she has my sympathies.


Many nurses (I'd say at least half the ones I know or The Blonde has introduced me to) seem to see marriage as a reclamation project to save some lowlife. It astounds me how many college-educated women will say, "I do", to some drunk

A lot of nurses who are divorced, including my one and only, have a raft of horror stories about the sack of slime they were dumb enough to marry.

And Oop, as usual, calls names without evidence - a strong Lefty trait.

I'm the one who rescued her.

rcocean said...

What happened to all the Manly men? They are all reading Althouse - not the New York Times.

rcocean said...

BTW, where can I find a "Real Woman"?
Can Natasha Scripture give me a pointer?

SteveR said...

Well played Allen S.

leslyn said...

I'm surrounded by manly men every day.

The best part (yes, there's a best part) about getting a broken ankle was being chair-carried by two insistently solicitous big guys back to my office.

Personal observation: Real manly men tend to be nice toward women. Not suggestive, not patronizing, just--nice.

I cracked jokes the whole time. I do that when I get overwhelmed....

Unfortunately it's all lookee no touchee. Sigh.

leslyn said...

gerry said...
"I'm a lumberjack..."

gerry, I think that line actually goes, "I'm a logger...." (Ray Stevens. :)

rhhardin said...

Nobody's mentioned math.

AllieOop said...

"Many nurses (I'd say at least half the ones I know or The Blonde has introduced me to) seem to see marriage as a reclamation project to save some lowlife. It astounds me how many college-educated women will say, "I do", to some drunk

A lot of nurses who are divorced, including my one and only, have a raft of horror stories about the sack of slime they were dumb enough to marry."

God lord Edutcher, nurses are not all marched out of nursing school with identical personalities. Do not presume to tell me I know no nurses because your own experiences do not match mine.

My husband was a Pediatrician, HARDLY some scum of the earth. If your wife was "rescued" by you, that says something right there.

Eustace Chilke said...

All I know about what's in the NYT is what other people read and talk about in the NYT. This includes just about everything on network news I guess. I might not notice if the paper went tits up. Except it would be in the news. I suppose this means that real men are not reading the NYT. I'm puzzled sometimes how a place and an institution so unlike the rest of the country can be the focus of so much conversation about how wrong headed they are and still keep going. I keep reading that they're losing money. Let's hope so.

jacksonjay said...

Hell, we still got pussy-whipped men in Texas! Some of em won't wear shorts cause their wives don't like em!

jacksonjay said...

God Knows that State College could use some "real men"!

Blue@9 said...

This kind of conversation is so goddamn lame. What's a "manly man"? I guess it's something akin to a "real woman".

Remember everyone, a "real woman" isn't skinny or attractive. That's what the feminists tell us. "Manly men" are... what? Don't eat sushi? Don't take showers?

Sheesh, it's this attempt to define some idealized type (always idealized by some magazine editor or "cultural commentator") that leads to botox-face and metrosexuals who wear women's jeans.

Stop with the nonsense about lumberjacks and eating meat and potatoes. You're just falling into the trap of allowing these nuts to carve out some neat definition of masculinity. One of the "manliest" guys I know sings to his wife every night. It's not about what you wear, what you eat, or any other preference or external signalling. Ignore the noise and just be who you are.

Rusty said...

Real manly men tend to be nice toward women.


Yes we do. But we don't tend to crap either.

rcocean said...

"I'm puzzled sometimes how a place and an institution so unlike the rest of the country can be the focus of so much conversation about how wrong headed they are and still keep going."

Along with the WSJ and the WaPo, the New York Times is *the* elite newspaper in the USA. God help us. Except on business and politics its the best "we" got. Sad. Grim. Pathetic.

MrCharlie2 said...

I'm a lumberjack and I'm okay
I sleep all night and I work all day
He's a lumberjack and he's okay
He sleeps all night and he works all day

I cut down trees, I eat my lunch
I go to the lavatory
On Wednesdays I go shopping
And have buttered scones for tea

I cut down trees, I skip and jump
I like to press wildflowers
I put on women's clothing
And hang around in bars

...

Darcy said...

@edutcher

Romney is manly enough! Agreed. I wasn't really meaning to put him down. His style is a little too..I dunno, for my taste, but yeah. He's apparently got great character.

Oso Negro said...

Natasha Scripture should go for a real-crosscultural experience - one that might even qualify as traveling and attend a United States Marine Corps boot camp graduation at Parris Island.

jacksonjay said...

How about Vlad the Putin? Is he a "manly man"? Is his demeanor and appearance an important part of who and what he is? Does he dress (or undress)in a way to portray strength?

Blameless Barry vs. Vlad the Putin

Michael K said...

"A lot of nurses who are divorced, including my one and only, have a raft of horror stories about the sack of slime they were dumb enough to marry.""

Nurses, in my own experience, do tend to find men who need fixing attractive. I think it's an occupational hazard.

Women doctors often marry men in relatively blue collar professions. Lots of police, firemen and paramedics. Sometimes it is because their schedules fit well with child care. One of my prettiest medical students married her high school boyfriend, an auto mechanic.

I think the manly thing might be working there, too. What about Meade, Ann ? Any correlation ?

themightypuck said...

Unmanly men have bosses. Manly men have customers.

themightypuck said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Blue@9 said...

Heck, look at this dude:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audie_Murphy

5'5", 110 lbs, wore plenty of greasy "product" in his hair, and probably couldn't grow a beard for the life of him.

If you put him in a lineup with George Clooney, I bet 100 out of 100 women would say Clooney was manlier.

Both were movie stars, but this guy also won the Medal of Honor, killed 200+ Germans, and probably saved the lives of hundreds of Americans.

So who is/was actually "manlier"? Why are we still playing this game?

AllieOop said...

Hmmm, well perhaps I am not representative of the "a lot of" nurses, men who "need fixing" would NOT be attractive to me.

chickelit said...

So who is/was actually "manlier"?

Audey Murphy.

Why are you still playing this game?

Carol said...

Haha, came to *Mantana* many years ago, because LA was going gay..found a manly man.

He's outside building the new deck right now.

chickelit said...

AllieOop said...
Hmmm, well perhaps I am not representative of the "a lot of" nurses, men who "need fixing" would NOT be attractive to me.

This comment lacks clarity and grace.

AllieOop said...

How so Chickie?

Blue@9 said...

Why are you still playing this game?

Because people still get caught up in defining masculinity by the exterior dressing. Metrosexual vs. lumberjack, dancing, sushi, etc.

The best thing I've read here is from edutcher:

the Romster is a pretty good man.

He has the rep of being honest and honorable, he's raised 5 boys that seem to be straight arrows, and he's stood by his wife when a lot of other guys in his bracket would have gone looking for a trophy.

That's a pretty good man to me.


Yup. All the exterior shit can be faked or bought. Character and integrity are the real deal.

caplight45 said...

Michael K said...
"A lot of nurses who are divorced, including my one and only, have a raft of horror stories about the sack of slime they were dumb enough to marry.""

If the unit my wife has worked for sixteen years is any indicator nurses often, often, often are attracted to fixer-uppers. Never works. Nicest bunch of ladies married to the biggest bunch of losers and abusers you have ever seen.

As to the gist of the article I can only say that as a member of the Protestant Evangelical clergy who am I would be loathe to argue with Scripture.

KJE said...

Why not a .22 ? Teach him to shoot. I got my first gun at age 9. Went pheasant hunting with my father that year. I had to carry my gun unloaded and walk the fields with the men. And one woman, my cousin who liked men.

I'll have to verify with my Dad, but I think I got my first .22 when I was 7, maybe 8. My boy will be about a two weeks short of 6 this coming Christmas. A Red Ryder is plenty for that age.

No one in my family wants for guns. My gunsmith father already built my son his first bolt action deer rifle, for when he's 12.

The point isn't the gun, it's to raise my son to do things that are masculine.

At times that may involve chasing a soccer ball or playing in little league. But to raise a man, I'll have to ensure he has a broader range of life experiences than youth sports alone.

It's going to mean getting wet when his tent collapses in a rain storm in the Boy Scouts. It's going to mean being respectful and helping his elders and the less fortunate. It's going to mean following, but also learning to work with, and even lead a group.

Its going to mean learning to dance and to cook. It's going to mean learning to drive a stick shift and a motorcycle. It's going to mean reading, Tom Sawyer, the Diary of Anne Frank, 20000 Leagues Under the Sea, and Jack London novels.

It's going to mean learning something related to the trades, whether or not he goes to a 4 year college someday. It's going to mean wearing a belt, and his pants at the proper setting. It may even mean military service.

It's going to mean making a plan and following through with it, even when it hot, or it's snowing or raining...

It's not just about the gun. That's a small part of it.

David R. Graham said...

The men she thinks are in Montana work at things she no doubt abhors. And, they already have wives or girl friends. She's writing cloud castles.

AllieOop said...

Oh never mind Chickie, I hadn't read the Clarity and Grace blog post yet.

bagoh20 said...

Audey Murphy's story is just amazing. What a life in 45 years. What a country that it could foster such a life.

leslyn said...

KJE,

I've known several single fathers with primary custody of their children. They've all done wonderful jobs with their kids. It sounds like you are too. Keep on keeping on.

bagoh20 said...

KJE, That sounds just right. I wouldn't be surprised if your son does great things, but regardless, he will undoubtedly have a happy life.

David R. Graham said...

"PS If the Gray Lady really did get the outbreak of manliness in Gotham it says it seeks, such as occurred on 9/11 and immediately thereafter, the staff would fill the front pages with concerns about the country reverting to Fascism."

A+

"Now go pick someone out the crowd of emasculated, spandex bike shorted douchebags the feminists created"

Queers?

"knuckle dragging troglodyte"

Infantryman?

"I bet Chuck Norris could conquer the entire island of Manhattan with nothing but a spatula. If he did it nude, he wouldn't even need the spatula."

Yup.

"And we are pummeling the leadership out of our young men and cheering on the controlling young women."

Hogwash.

"I prefer either a limited liability partnership or a theocracy."

Bargaining?

"Chemists long ago parsed the nuanced difference between equality and equivalency. Insofar as chemistry is like sex, the distinction holds."

Brilliant!

"When one is worth over 250 million,"

Pocketchange.

"My husband was a Pediatrician, HARDLY some scum of the earth. If your wife was "rescued" by you, that says something right there."

Taunt.


"Hell, we still got pussy-whipped men in Texas! Some of em won't wear shorts cause their wives don't like em!"

:-)

"Ignore the noise and just be who you are."

Yes!

"So who is/was actually "manlier"? Why are we still playing this game?"

Really!

"Yup. All the exterior shit can be faked or bought. Character and integrity are the real deal."

Yup.

"It's not just about the gun. That's a small part of it."

Correct.

David R. Graham said...

The attack on men by queers and feminazis is integral with the attack on The Latin Church ("Western Civilization") by Afro/Mohammedan Imperialists. As Reynolds says, they lop off heads; and implies: make fear, get their way. Ultimately, they will not succeed. Reality is a mighty, indomitable fortress against self-promoters, a bulwark never failing ... because it IS. Fighting, privation, starvation, sorrow and death loom ahead. Women could have stopped this, but their jealousy, fear and anger impelled its advent. Now it has to be undergone.

AllieOop said...

Stopped what?

Carnifex said...

@KJE

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly."--Robert Heinlein

@AllieOop

He's sayin' that the "Sexual Revolution" promulgated by NOW, and "feminine justice" has emmasculated the defenders of our civilization for shorter political power, and we are seeing the beginnings of a death match between modern civilization, and a stone age theocracy with one side underhanded.

Even today NOW sits silent over the abuses women suffer under Islam. They would rather keep Roe V Wade law, than admit that it's a good thing for the R's to keep Islam in check. Better a few more dead babies today than suffer the indignity of acctually having to suffer for your own promiscuous behavior.

There ain't gonna be no freedom under the veil sister.

Palladian said...

and to toss aside the cologne and let pheromones take charge.

Silly bitch. There is currently no evidence that humans even produce pheromones, and there's no agreement on whether humans even have a vestigial vomeronasal organ (the organ in animals that can detect pheromones), and even those who say we do don't think it's functional or "connected up".

I though New York was part of the "reality-based community".

Palladian said...

David R. Graham said... "The attack on men by queers and feminazis is integral with the attack on The Latin Church"

I'm a "queer" and a man you sack of ecclesiastical shit. I don't attack men, I fuck them.

Although you write with the incoherence of someone who recently suffered a traumatic brain injury, I'm not going to be charitable and let your twaddle go unanswered.

leslyn said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Carnifex said...

Some people, well, let's be honest, ill-informed liberals, think that the "War on Terror" is GWBush's fault. If they actually spent some time learning instead of emoting, they would know that the US has been fighting Islam for over 200 years. Jefferson owned one of the first Korans printed in English, and he read it to discern the mind of the enemy.

This was never the start of a new war, but merely the latest scrimmage of a war that has lasted centuries. Liberals can't think in terms that long. They are the mayflys of politics, eaten and used by all who would gain true power.

Here's one for you smarter types...try to imagine the waste of money we have had since 9/11 trying to "protect" our skies. HSA, TSA, screenings, and whatnot.

You wanna know what would really work? Putting a redneck with a .45on every flight. Hell, you wouldn't even have to pay 'em. Just give 'em free tickets round trip for a vacation. Oh! and carte blanche to shoot any MF'er who moved towards the cockpit door.

We shoulda rebuilt the twin towers, only bigger, bombed Mecca, and Medina, well I was gonna say back to the stoneage but...And announced "WE'RE BAAACK!!!"

Oh! that muslim congressman who is claiming 9/11 was hard on muslims because of the backlash? Fuck you and your pedophile prophet. Now that PSU is outta the child raping bidness who will Allah pull for?

leslyn said...

"I bet Chuck Norris could conquer the entire island of Manhattan with nothing but a spatula. If he did it nude, he wouldn't even need the spatula."

What I can't figure out is why he would use a spatula.

Palladian said...

And to address the topic (such as it is), I hate the stupid jaded bourgeois romanticizing of the "rustic" ideal of masculinity, as if "manliness" is only embodied in an ill-mannered, sweaty-crotched, mucous-spatting pituitary case.

Any man worth being called a man is not ignorant of culture, food, music, art, math, or indeed anything else he wishes to pursue in this world. Masculinity is expressed in being a master of your world, and being comfortable in that role.

All this nonsense about "real men don't know about sashimi" is a bunch of simplistic lukewarm shit deployed to stuff column inches in the women's section of the New York Times.

leslyn said...

Carnifex,

Even today NOW sits silent over the abuses women suffer under Islam. They would rather keep Roe V Wade law, than admit that it's a good thing for the R's to keep Islam in check. Better a few more dead babies today than suffer the indignity of acctually having to suffer for your own promiscuous behavior.

Am I reading this right? Are you saying that Muslim women should die, particularly if they don't look or act like traditional Muslim women?

And that Dems are willing to overlook religious murder so that they Muslims can keep religious murder?

Tell me I'm wrong.

I can't just put it down to really strong painkillers that are making you rabid and incoherent.

Carnifex said...

@Palladian

I'll take your word on the pheromone thing but with a grain of salt, we aren't that different from the rest of the natural world.

Although it just struck me, might that have to do with the aquatic theory of human evolution? Do cetaceans have pheromones?

People also are trained to ignore "natural" signals. Do they ignore the pheromones/dismiss the pheromones, or not produce them at all? I'll ponder these...while I sleep ;-)

Palladian said...

I'll take your word on the pheromone thing but with a grain of salt, we aren't that different from the rest of the natural world.

Carnifex, it's true, there's no identified pheromone known to be produced by the human body, and no plausible, biological way we could detect them.

People confuse pheromones and pheromone detection with smell; they're totally different mechanisms, handled by different physical structures in animals that use both.

People that like human body odors are not attracted to pheromones, they're attracted to scents with which they have, for whatever reasons, positive associations.

Carnifex said...

@leslyn

No I'm sorry I wasn't clear.

Islamic women today live like animals under an abusive theocracy that treats them as less than animals, and every Planned Parenthood, and NOW chapter stands silent and watches, rather than call them out on it. You can't even call it cowardice because there is no physical threat that could be applied in a Western Democracy. It's below cowadice. At best I see it's a "I got mine, fuck you" type mentality that permeates liberal leftist thinking to its core.

Because if they did stand up to the muslims, that would mean the right was right. it was right to fight, it was right to invade, it was right to judge. And if it was right then the war detractors were wrong. You know who. I don't have to list them. But if the detractors were wrong, you'd have to approve of the "other side" the one that wants to stop "expresslane abortions". Stop the abbatoirs that occur for killing innocents. That thinks EVERY life is precious, not just a womans with a working vagina. You'd have to be a ....REPUBLICAN!!!(insert scream here)

So they sold their sisters souls and bodies for a few decades of political power. Hope you liked it.

Carnifex said...

@Palladian

Cool. learn something new every day I say. wish I wouldn't forget 2 things though ;-(

bagoh20 said...

"What I can't figure out is why he would use a spatula."

The tool most often seen in the hands of real men in Manhattan is the spatula.

Carnifex said...

See... forgot leslyns second point about D's. Yes leslyn. A democrat will get in bed with anyone or anything no matter how vile, if they are assured of that vileness' vote. Period. Dot. End of statement.

As proof, I offer you...any evening newscast.(from any outlet you desire. it doesn't matter)

I'm not even going to offer my usual R's to it too...they don't. R's get villified, mocked, and run outta town. D's just throw a party.

Unknown said...

I can be anything a woman wants me to be, as long as I get laid and bolt in the morning.

Carnifex said...

@Bagoh

You mock the Norris, but remember these words of wisdom...if you don't see Chuck Norris, you may be seconds away from an embarassing death. If you DO see Chuck Norris, you may be seconds away from an embarassing death.

Carnifex said...

here's an althouse poll i'd like to see. the manliest man that posts on althouse, Meade excluded because of his cheesecake shots from yesterday(which I found oddly disturbing)(j/k)Really because he's playing with "house" money.

leslyn said...

Thanks, Carnifex, for clarifying. But just because you like a plank doesn't mean you have to buy the whole platform.

bagoh20 said...

It would be an honor to have Norris tear a melody of vertebrae from my torso and wave it with a howl at the moon.

bagoh20 said...

I'd probably vote for Palladian.

I mean him and Norris meet in a dark alley and someone is getting fucked, and I'm not sure who.

leslyn said...

Carnifex, I decided I should know how NOW treats Muslim women, and I found this:
2011 Convention, Breakout Session, "Behind the Veil: Islam and Women's Rights"
2012 Convention, Workshop, "How to Fight Hate Crimes and Other Forms of Racism," including the murder of Shaima Alawadi.

I'm not sure what kind of connection you're making with Planned Parenthood, but I found protests against Planned Parenthood by Muslims.

I think your premise, if I'm correct, that women are willing to trade away Muslim women in order to keep Roe v. Wade is just wrong-headed.

Palladian said...

I mean him and Norris meet in a dark alley and someone is getting fucked, and I'm not sure who.

It ain't me, and it ain't Norris; I'm not into geriatric action.

SCOTTtheBADGER said...

Pogo, in re: sitzpinkel, do you go to CDR SALAMANDER's site? He had a posting about that a couple of weeks ago.

Micheal K: One of the most fun .22s out there is the S&W M&P15-22. That gun is so much fun it is illegal in Mass., CA., and New York, (because it has a magazine that holds over 10 rounds).
IOWAs are magnificent ships, aren't they, we here in WI love our own BB-64, The Big Badger Boat, the USS WISCONSIN.

Rusty said...

Rusty said...
Real manly men tend to be nice toward women.


Yes we do. But we don't tend to crap either.



But we don't tend to take crap either.

The Crack Emcee said...

Hi,

I'm The Crack Emcee and I write a blog called "The Macho Response," started back in those mean ol' Bush-clearing-brush days when being a manly man was something few others would or could claim, and (heavens!) no one would actually admit to desiring.

I can see the future,....

Quaestor said...

Allie Oop wrote:
[But] how about an equal partnership?

Just how does a democracy of two work?

Big Mike said...

But it's reviving because somebody at the NYT thinks Obama is manlier than Mitt Romney.

You're sh*tt*ng me, right?

leslyn said...

Rusty said...

Rusty said... Real manly men tend to be nice toward women. Yes we do. But we don't tend to crap either.

But we don't tend to take crap either.

Thanks, Rusty. It makes sense now. [tears of laughter_]

You're right. In the second version.

Phil 3:14 said...

Carnifex, I decided I should know how NOW treats Muslim women, and I found this: 2011 Convention, Breakout Session, "Behind the Veil: Islam and Women's Rights" 2012 Convention, Workshop, "How to Fight Hate Crimes and Other Forms of Racism," including the murder of Shaima Alawadi.

Was that at the Riyadh convention ?

Ben said...

They SAY they want manly men, but they'll be the first in line to harp on you when you step out of line or don't want to talk about your feelings.

If you want a different kind of man find a different way of meeting them.

leslyn said...

Ben said,

"[Women will be] the first in line to harp on you when you step out of line."

Ben, I'm not clear, how picky is this "stepping out of line?"

Ben said...

Depends on the relationship I guess. On my first date with my wife she was impressed when my car got rear ended by some 16yo kid and I didn't fly into a rage and handled the situation calmly and got back to the date without obsessing about my car.

Fast forward 15 years and my carefree attitude and focus on the important things instead of the small details means I take the kids to the beach when the weather is perfect instead of cleaning the house.

Life is too short to worry about scratches on car bumpers or a few dishes in the sink and a floor that waits 24 hours to get mopped.

It's the same thing for any relationship. The manly hunter and fisherman might get complained at for having a deer head in the freezer until he gets around to mounting it himself, etc.

mbiggs said...

Believe me...the manly men aren't in Montana...I haven't found any yet and I've lived here my whole life.

mbiggs said...

Believe me...the manly men aren't in Montana...I haven't found any yet and I've lived here my whole life.

Kevin said...

I'm nearly 31 and love cross-dressing. I love makeup and dresses and feeling sexy in my 5 inch heels. When dressed as a guy I love my skinny jeans and form-fitting tees. I might match that with a pair of womens sneakers or even--eeek--a pair of tall Uggs. Yes, the ones with the cute little buttons.

But guess what?? I do it because I want to! I'm not going to stop doing what I enjoy because some women out there, be they the majority or minority of women, think it's silly or feminine. I still enjoy steak and potatoes (with a salad) and I can change a tire...sometimes. I may not be most women's dream guy but I can live with that. I will continue to dress up as a female and go out in public (which takes balls) as well as rock my purple shorts. On top of that Ican wear a uniform and carry a gun for work.