May 16, 2010

"I’m acutely aware that we haven’t made love for several weeks now and each morning I wake up thinking 'I’m going to make an effort tonight.'"

"Then when the evening does come round I’m so exhausted from working and looking after the children that it’s as much as I can do to sit upright and watch a BBC drama, never mind find the energy to make love."

Now, wait a minute. It's way more trouble to sit up in bed and watch a BBC drama than it is to fuck. You're about 100 times as likely to fall asleep. The lies people tell — tell themselves — about sex are just astounding.

71 comments:

Pastafarian said...

"It's way more trouble to sit up in bed and watch a BBC drama than it is to..."

I respectfully disagree.

The act of physical love requires quite a bit of effort and concentration...at least for me.

Maybe one of us is doing it wrong.

Meade said...

Young lady, your language!

traditionalguy said...

The famous advice that the #1 sex organ in the human body is the mind applies here. If the BBC drama has more appeal to her than her spouse, then he needs to try conversation and tenderness right after he flips a hidden switch to screw up the TV set. All is fair in love and TV wars.

Ann Althouse said...

@ Pastafarian I don't see that you've articulated any point of disagreement with me. Do you mean to say that as between having sex and watching an hour-long British drama, you'd be more likely to fall asleep having sex?

Ann Althouse said...

If I were as tired as that woman claims to be and in bed with a drama on TV, I would be asleep within 5 minutes. Whereas I would never fall asleep in the first 5 minutes of sex. I'd probably stay up for the whole hour (assuming an hour-long show).

Pastafarian said...

No, I'm saying that after a long day of work, passively watching a TV show might be the easier of the two tasks.

If I'm very tired, then I'd probably rather watch a TV show than go for a five-mile run. It's not because I'm likely to fall asleep during the five-mile run, it's because the run involves much more exertion. And for me, a five-mile run is quite comparable to a bout with Mrs. Pastafarian, in terms of calories expended and time required.

rhhardin said...

She loves her husband but her marriage isn't a priority.

traditionalguy said...

A whole hour? That is one great mind you have there.

Moose said...

Well, you know, if you're a man and you don't want to fuck at the drop of hat - you're gay! Or defective! Or having an affair!

It's not acceptable that you might not want to for any other reasons.

edutcher said...

TV can be the most brain-dead thing you can do - no thinking, no effort, just absorb, but it will hold your attention. Sex can be very exhausting, especially if you're not rested enough to begin with.

Have to agree with Pasta - again. Clearly, Ann has that kind of gusto after a day of conlawproffing, but some women aren't as energetic (some barely move).

Meade said...

Young lady, your language!

Indeed!

(She's probably thinking, "I'll show them I'm not clipart!!!")

traditionalguy said...

OK , a whole hour that includes 20 minutes of after action pillow talk sounds more doable.

k*thy said...

Thank you, Pastafarian, I so knew what you meant, the first time. And, btw, don't forget about hormones. Mood swings are not anyone's friend...

Irene said...

If one has day-long anxiety about "mak[ing] an effort tonight" and then is "exhausted" by the end of the day, then one shouldn't postpone lovemaking until sleepy time.

ricpic said...

For a guy in his twenties or thirties that's the only way to get to sleep: first you squirt, then you sleep.

EnigmatiCore said...

"It's way more trouble to sit up in bed and watch a BBC drama than it is to fuck."

Wish the Mrs. felt that way. She loves to stay up (not even in the bedroom!) and watch whatever has been DVR'd.

It is not very much fun being second fiddle to Ryan Seacrest.

As to the good Professor's assertion- those giving you heck don't get that sex is not work. If it *is* work for someone, then something is wrong (and by that I don't mean "you're doing it wrong" but rather "there is something really wrong there").

And the quote provided gets to it. Sometimes, making love is energetic. But it does not have to be! Sometimes, sleepily giving the most tender of caresses with your most intimate of body parts without it being a grindathon is the perfect way to end a day.

danielle said...

'I'd probably stay up for the whole hour (assuming an hour-long show).'

show ?

therein lies the problem.

i'm with Pasta.

Methadras said...

It's easy to fuck. There are 6.25 billion people to prove it. Furthermore, the countless other times that people fuck for the sheer fun of it. People who make excuses about why they don't do it seem stupid.

Methadras said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Methadras said...

Ann Althouse said...

Whereas I would never fall asleep in the first 5 minutes of sex. I'd probably stay up for the whole hour (assuming an hour-long show).


Way to go Meade!!!

Ann Althouse said...

I don't get why people are assuming that passive things aren't exhausting. TV when I'm tired puts me to sleep. The passivity is the problem. I'm saying if that lady has the energy to stay awake for an hour of British TV drama, she has the energy to have sex. Ergo: Her excuse is bullshit.

Steve said...

rhhardin, I think you have it exactly backwards:

She loves her marriage but her husband isn't a priority.

Alex said...

And the quote provided gets to it. Sometimes, making love is energetic. But it does not have to be! Sometimes, sleepily giving the most tender of caresses with your most intimate of body parts without it being a grindathon is the perfect way to end a day.

Grindathons are in. Slow is out.

Alex said...

Ann - it's an excuse. Some people just don't like sex for a variety of reasons.

* it's icky - all those fluids
* body insecurity
* inability to reach orgasm

edutcher said...

Methadras said...

It's easy to fuck. There are 6.25 billion people to prove it. Furthermore, the countless other times that people fuck for the sheer fun of it. People who make excuses about why they don't do it seem stupid.

You obviously haven't passed twenty-five yet.

There was a great line from one of the Mary Tyler Moore spinoffs on the subject,

"Sometimes we have to decide if we're really in the mood or just want to go out for an ice cream bar."

I understand it more now than I did then.

sunsong said...

Sex is always a good topic :-)

One of the things that's been happening with young people - even here in Utah - is that they tend to live together for several years before marrying.

That seems to me to be a good idea and they can find out if they are a good match - in any number of ways. A relationship is more than sex, obviously, but it is part of it...and can be a great part of it.

My 88 year old mother - spent years lecturing middle-age and older folks about living well. When sex came up - she would say "use it or lose"

There is no reason that old people can't have satisfying sex lives.

So, it seems to me, if there is a problem - it is likely to be symtomatic of trouble in the relationship itself - rather than an isolated issue.

Relationships are difficult - but worth it. They go right to quality of life. And I don't think sex is a *must* - friends can have quality relationships - but if one person wants sex and the other doesn't - and wants it much more often than the other - it seems to me it would be valuable to work it out...or see if the relationship needs to change or end.

ironrailsironweights said...

This discussion is too dirty for me. I'll have to go look at something cleaner, like efukt.

Peter

Will Cate said...

This same article just keeps getting rewritten over and over -- plan it, make the effort, make time for it, etc. etc. I've been married for 26 years, this is all just "Happy Marriage 101" stuff for my wife and I. Not that I'm bragging. Well, I guess I am bragging, just a bit.

It did provide me with a new euphemism for getting in the mood: "dragging the canoe to the shore" ... heh

Steve said...

Will,

You better talk to the little man before you drag his canoe to shore.

EDH said...

I don't think I could stay awake for an hour of British TV drama, period, even if I was having mind blowing sex at the same time.

Synova said...

Unless sex is passive, I have to agree that passively watching a television show is way easier. And really, the point is to participate, no?

I can't quite bring myself to read the whole article. Did they ever get around to saying that if the morning is when this lady is motivated to have sex, then she ought to be having it in the morning?

Simple solution.

Synova said...

I also think that a whole lot of people underestimate just how emotionally exhausting small children can be.

The article says that the cuddling and stuff with little kids can take the place of cuddling with Daddy, and maybe that is so, but it's not that simple either.

I don't have much sympathy for women who put off their husbands, but it's entirely possible to be way too tired by the end of the day and for some odd reason people just don't think of wake-up calls or lunch dates.

Did the article ever mention lunch dates?

Trooper York said...

British people can't stay awake during sex let alone their boring ass TV shows.

Tell them to start working on brushng their teeth for crying out loud.

mRed said...

Personally, I remember the day I met my wife and think of that hallway, that part of the backyard or that rest stop. The hallway was yesterday.

The fact that I do not need effort and concentration tells me I do not just have a wife, I still have a bride.

Maybe gently we will go into old(er) age, but thankfully not so now.

Fuck, sex, love, it's all good because we have and like and understand each other.

Fuck on.

Synova said...

I realize this is in the realm of TMI, but even in my dreams I can't find the privacy to do it in the hall or backyard or rest stop or even in my own bed. (In real life, of course, there are locks on doors...)

My dream self has been rebelling lately with "who cares if we have an audience" but the dang audience keeps butting in and interrupting, demanding attention, and ruining all of my fun.

mRed said...

If you have an audience, replan. My point was passion for each other, not exibitionism.

Gutter, get out of it.

Trooper York said...

Those dirty limeys don't even call it fucking. They call it "rogering."

Who in their right mind would want to be Rogered?

MnMark said...

I'm glad MY mother doesn't write blog posts about whether she finds it tiring to "f*ck".

Synova said...

"If you have an audience, replan. My point was passion for each other, not exibitionism."

No... your point was spontaneity, which is different.

Mine was just a funny (if unnecessary) revelation of my entirely uncooperative subconscious.

Also, I'd like to add "and let the food burn" to my question if the article mentioned wake-up calls and lunch dates.

Synova said...

See, because, for some reason women think they shouldn't let the food burn... and for some reason men seem to find when she's cooking food to be the exact right time to get snuggly. So if you're the sort of woman who thinks that preparing an edible meal is important and you chase him off... it might be good if someone told you, "let the food burn."

mRed said...

"let the food burn."

Thank you. That is so funny. I bow to you ma'am.

I now understand what you were saying.

WV: rayin. Yep it is a "rayin" to shine on understanding.

former law student said...

I think the amount of effort involved depends on the woman. Is she simply " lying back and thinking of England"? Or is she "putting the canoe in the water and paddling and seeing what happens."?

William said...

There's such a thing as mult-tasking. I know for a fact that it's possible to get off during the long commercial breaks on SNL.

rhhardin said...

TV sets in the trash slide show.

Moose said...

There is also the old joke - your sex life progresses from the kitchen to the bedroom to the hallway.

In the beginning you'll have sex anywhere - the kitchen for example. Then later you'll have sex in the bedroom. Then later you'll have sex in the hallway - when you pass each other you say "fuck you!".

DADvocate said...

Any excuse....

Calypso Facto said...

The Bloodhound Gang said you could have the best of both worlds if you "do it doggie style so we can both watch X-Files"

DADvocate said...

traditionalguy - since no one's called you on it, he needs to try conversation and tenderness right, nice how you put the responsibility on the man when it's the woman who isn't upholding her part. Here's a woman too lazy to put forth extra effort and it's the man who needs to change.

Then later you'll have sex in the hallway - when you pass each other you say "fuck you!".

That's the marital version of oral sex.

ET1492 said...

Hitachi Magic Wand.
Doggy-style.
A little lube.

Quicker. Cleaner. Easier. Much better odds for orgasm.

It's the new missionary for us...

John Stodder said...

No one here has mentioned the effect of drugs, alcohol, stress and aging on the sex drive.

The people in that article probably fucked all the time, if they had the chance, in their late teens and twenties. Pretty much anything you do at that age has a hypothetical sexual cherry at the end of it. And I should add thirties and into your forties. But for both men and women, their hormones finally start giving way to the aforementioned environmental issues, and so the drive becomes more a matter of finding and sustaining it as opposed to containing it. Plus, after a certain number of years of marriage, the quality of the marriage plays into it. Do you have resentments you're not dealing with? They will effect your sex life with your partner. Do you still find them attractive? Do you feel secure with your partner?

We're like ships, the longer we're in the water, the more barnacles attach. You have to want to get rid of them -- prioritize both your relationship and your health -- and then the sex drive can return.

Kev said...

The article says that the cuddling and stuff with little kids can take the place of cuddling with Daddy, and maybe that is so, but it's not that simple either.

Not to mention that it doesn't exactly do much for Daddy that way...

Skookum John said...

@Meade: "Young lady, your language!"

Said he, with a shit-eating grin...

Skookum John said...

@Moose: "Well, you know, if you're a man and you don't want to fuck at the drop of hat - you're gay! Or defective! Or having an affair! It's not acceptable that you might not want to for any other reasons."

Yup. Mmm-hmm, that's about the size of it.

Skookum John said...

@Will Cate: It did provide me with a new euphemism for getting in the mood: "dragging the canoe to the shore" ... heh

Does that have anything to do with the "man in the boat"?

peter hoh said...

Well, the Colorado Potato Beetles weren't making any excuses; they were busy fertilizing eggs.

Two kills for one squish.

I hate f*@#ing Colorado Potato Beetles.

CatherineM said...

I have never understood women being too tired for sex. I have been exhausted, totally wiped out, but when my man makes a few good moves and hello! I somehow find the energy to do one more relaxing, pleasurable activity. I have to admit, when I am at that state of mind to just fall asleep the moment I hit the pillow, he has to take the initiative or I will fall asleep. However, if he does touch me in the right places...I find the energy and never regret it. It doesn't always have to be a workout to have good sex.

If I wanted to have sex or make sure my man was having his needs met, I would skip tv all together and always do.

AllenS said...

I love it when you talk dirty to us, Althouse.

exhelodrvr1 said...

Start the day with it; don't wait till you're ready to go to sleep!

spongeworthy said...

This is one of the things I don't get about women. They're not the ones doing all the work--what does exhaustion have to do with anything?

Sure, guys appreciate an active partner, but we don't require it. Not every encounter needs to be a toe-curler.

I've about concluded that it isn't so much that disinterested women don't want to have sex, but that they don't want us to get to have sex.

Fred4Pres said...

I laughed when Elenor equated sex with her husband to visiting the Tower of London.

What are they into?

bagoh20 said...

I'm a virgin ... as relates to BBC dramas. I respect myself too much let some limey have his way with me.

jayemarr said...

I'm glad to see a woman taking your position (er, no pun intended). My ex consistently pulled the "I'm too tired" routine with me; didn't matter what time of day it was, she was too tired.

You know what? I get tired too, but I also like to have sex. If I stopped liking to have sex, I'd damn well do something about it -- particularly if I was married.

If I'm ever out digging ditches all day on three hours' sleep I reserve the right to say I'm "too tired", but short of that... I'm with you, Ann. Metaphorically, of course.

Maddad said...

All those letters just to spell "I'm hot for Colin Firth." British people have an amazing way with language.

TW = trimi. You'll like me.

Methadras said...

edutcher said...

You obviously haven't passed twenty-five yet.

There was a great line from one of the Mary Tyler Moore spinoffs on the subject,

"Sometimes we have to decide if we're really in the mood or just want to go out for an ice cream bar."

I understand it more now than I did then.


In my head I'm 18. I'm ready to rock n' roll. I'm physically 41. I'm ready still ready to rock n' roll. My wife is 10 years older than I am. We have zero issues in the fucking department. Yeah, I can certainly understand the choices between wanted to spend an hour watching tv, going out for an ice cream bar as opposed to making love or even having hot, dirty, filthy sex. I can understand it, but I don't agree with it. TV nor ice cream bars imbue the level of pleasure that sex confers.

If people start treating sex like a chore who don't want to do it, then that's on them. We've been given a gift of pleasure that is meant to be used as means to shun the pains of the day. It's free (mostly), it's readily available, and it really doesn't take much to engage into it. We are hard-wired for its use. I just don't understand people who prefer to watch TV for an hour instead of make love for an hour (if they can). GO MEADE!!!

Nite Herder said...

The lady should just be happy she and her other aren't windshield wipers in love. A splatter of rain and they're suddenly "turned on", rushing toward each other madly, passionately, almost but not quite touching --- only to be pulled apart at the last moment. Its even worse on those hot summer nights when they can only lie there and stare at each other …

LIfe do get tejus, don't it?

urpower said...

We find on TV the people we'd rather be married to. (Illusions.)

visioneerwindows said...

Stuff like this I find pathetically hilarious, in part for the simple reason that during the years of my marriage to my second wife, we never could get enough sex - it was every day, three or more times a day, as if perhaps we were trying to make up for the lack thereof from out respective first marriages... and it was most often lovemaking, not mere quickies - we simply found each other extremely sexually desirable... and it always had profoundly enjoyable effects on how the rest of our relationship went over the years [until, it seems, she became to feeling very guilty over having so much enjoyment, when none of others she knew began to have even a partial of such pleasurings... the idea of being 'too tired for sex' seems utterly foreign [and, believe me, we worked long hard hours, being in the food service business, so that is not a valid excuse as far as I am concerned]... yes, the marriage did not last forever [8 wonderful years]- but for other reasons, for sure not this one...

robert said...

When you reach a certain age litigation takes the place of sex.

Revenant said...

It is amazing to me how many women refuse to hold up their side of the physical part of marriage and then whine when their husband sleeps with someone else.

Yeah, sure, wedding vows generally include a "forsaking all others" clause. But if one partner decides to curtail the physical aspect of marriage because she can't be bothered, she has already forsaken her spouse. And violated the "to have and to hold" and "to love and to cherish" parts, too. :)

MsMystical1 said...

I agree with Ann. If you are exhausted, doing something that does NOT stimulate you, i.e. watching an hour long show on TV, is torturous if you are trying to remain awake. Fucking your husband should stimulate your mind and body and wake you up. It sounds like Pastafarian just doesn't want to be bothered and is making excuses. Yet I'm sure she'd play the victim role of woman done wrong if her husband decided to fuck someone else. Why do so many people check out of relationships and never leave?

Michelle said...

doing the Dirty 6

will make it cooler!

DoggyLover said...

If you don't care much about your lover's enjoyment, then certainly it less work to have sex than watch TV. On the other hand, if you truly want to please your lover, then that requires a fair amount of energy and effort (certainly more than watching some mindless TV show).