No moment in the 2016 presidential campaign has cried out more for a unifying candidate than the police shootings of two black men last week and the ensuing national uproar, followed by the shocking sniper ambush that killed five police officers in Dallas.Neither Trump nor Clinton, it seems, has what it takes to do what, it seems, America needs now. Clinton "lacks the public emotion, oratorical skills and reputation for honesty to persuade large numbers of Americans to see things her way." And Trump is "sowing division and hatred" and "electrif[ying]crowds... through provocations."
And no other moment has revealed more starkly how hard it is for Donald J. Trump and Hillary Clinton to become that candidate....
What's missing? Why is racial discord the problem of the summer of 2016? If anyone has what it takes to unify the country over race it is Barack Obama, who is President right now and who has been President for 7 1/2 years. If it makes any sense to be deciding the current presidential election on this issue, if this longed-for capacity is something that can possibly exist, then Barack Obama would be doing it now and would have been doing it for years.
Before you push us to judge whether Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump would do better in bringing us together in racial harmony, Mr. Healy, please say a few words about why President Obama has failed. Of course, neither Clinton nor Trump inspires hope for a new opportunity at racial harmony. That's what Obama did in 2008. He was ideal for that issue and we voted for the hope. Now, so many years later, things seem even worse. Can you analyze how that happened? Because that did happen. I don't see how we can begin to think about what more Trump or Clinton could do unless we understand why President Obama failed.
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413 comments:
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The Dow Jones Industrial Average.
Thank heavens Obama was there to spike the football when he was voted into office and put a stop to any thought of investing retirement funds in that 'risky' stock market!
Hey, great!!! #200 comment.
@Bruce Hayden,
Interestingly, Catholic Blacks do not seem to have nearly the problems that their non-Catholic brethren have.
As happy as I, a Catholic, would be to claim that the faith had some ameliorative influence, I tend to think it's because black Catholics are in the majority Caribbean or immigrant-right-out-of-Africa blacks.
If I had to pick one aspect of Catholic culture that helped Catholic blacks it would be the Catholic educational system, which not only helped pull blacks out of ghetto poverty but also helped pull the Irish, Italians, Poles, etc out of their "ghettos", too. In days of yore, Sister Mary Elephant had no compunction about beating your sorry ass into line no matter what your race was.
As an interesting example of this history, I give you my first communion class photograph from 1964 from a town of 45,000 in Northern Alabama. Notice the number of black kids.
You should watch the speech in full, it is a master class in acknowledging a great wrong and then pouring oil on troubled waters, greatly aided by the grace of the victims and their families.
Okay, I've watched the speech in full. Typically Obama-esque preening about what "we" in the AME do, and then some dishonest descriptions of what his political opponents intend.
If that piece of nastiness acknowledging a great wrong (that as always, only others, but not Obama, commit) is the best Obama's ever done, it just tells you how small the man is.
The Gingrich/Clinton Welfare Reform was a step in the right direction, but that progress was not only discarded by Obama and the Pelosi Dems, but we seem to have moved significantly in the opposite direction.
This statement is complete and utter bullshit. There has been no significant change in welfare programs (other than to reduce benefits even further) in the eight years of the Obama administration. To blame any of the perceived further slippage of the black community in the last eight years on increased government assistance is objectively nonsense.
I think a factor in black failure the past 50 years is the miserable education most black kids get.
It has gotten worse with the anti-white and anti-accomplishment attitude of black kids now.
I wish we could go back to reform schools to separate out the kids who want to learn and get an education from the thugs, male and female.
A friend sent me this Althouse Post. Its nitpicking of an NY Times writer for failing to knock Obama for bringing racial healing to America thus leaving it to an incompetent Trump and HC to do what he failed to to annoys me because it puts all the blame on Obama for the failure. He should have walked on water because his critics, like Herod in the musical Jesus Christ Superstar, all sneered that he was the new Messiah. Well, If the old Messiah, son of God, couldn't make us play nicely, it seems unfair to demand that the black son of a white Kansas mother put an end to a 300-year history of race problems without any help from the other side of the political aisle.
That other side?
At his first address to Congress he was interrupted with a cry of "liar." The Senate's GOP leader said his party's first job would be to unseat Obama in 2008 after a honeymoon that ended with Obama's taking the oath of office. To that end the blue states all enacted identification requirements assuring that poor and minority voters would have a harder time casting future ballots. But racial disharmony is all the President's fault.
My Mother always told me it takes two to have a fight. The readers of this blog remind me of the circle of kids you always find at a fight in a playground and they are pretty much on the same side. They are big on catcalls but not so big on reflection. Althouse, What are you doing to help fix America's sorry racial history besides tossing out chum?
B.H.
It's a fact that electing a black President agitates racists. So, it's only logical to assume that electing BHO should cause more racist angst. Expecting less is what is illogical.
Regarding black folks feeling that they're not treated fairly by their interactions w/ the government (often police), it seems like cameras are causing some cons such as Gingrich and Lewis to realize that this is a problem that should be fixed.
In addition to cameras there have been stories from black cons (e.g. Julius Caesar Watts) that probably add to some sort of eye opening.
Btw, wouldn't it be a conservative, holding gov accountable, POV to make police departments document how their policing impacts people relative to race? Don't cons think it's odd that police departments are so opposed to making this metric knowable? Saving costs is the usual reason for not doing so. But, if Hillary said that it's too expensive to have all sorts of Congressional staff and FBI spend whatever it takes to find that she sent 1 email with a subsection of text that was correctly marked "Confidential" and 2 emails that (according to State) had subsections that were incorrectly marked "Confidential," would that be cool w/ cons?
[Btw, since all the other classified info email chains included HRC receiving info on her private server, why aren't cons calling for the prosecution of the senders of this information? These folks knowingly sent this stuff outside of the classified transmission paths that are setup by State. If cons truly believed that HRC's one Confidential sent email is a big deal, they'd be really worked up about all the folks sending her more classified stuff, more often. At least some of these cons should make a little fuss about this to hide the the fact they're only motivated by politically going after HRC. Dopes are as dopes do.]
Does anyone really think that it's a coincidence that, at the exact moment that Democrats could no longer suppress the Black vote, they decided to buy it? No one ever said LBJ wasn't a master politician. Shame about that crazy old Asian war.
zactly
At his first address to Congress he was interrupted with a cry of "liar."
It was petty and divisive...and prophetic.
"At his first address to Congress he was interrupted with a cry of "liar." The Senate's GOP leader said his party's first job would be to unseat Obama in 2008 after a honeymoon that ended with Obama's taking the oath of office. To that end the blue states all enacted identification requirements assuring that poor and minority voters would have a harder time casting future ballots. But racial disharmony is all the President's fault."
Thank God GWB never had to put up with such dissension from the loyal opposition. A Brother just can't catch a break.
rehajm said...
Thank heavens Obama was there to spike the football when he was voted into office and put a stop to any thought of investing retirement funds in that 'risky' stock market!
You guys need to get your story straight. According to Michael K the stock market is a gigantic bubble about to burst and destroy the economy as we know it. According to you naive investors should have their money in there. And, you failed to distinguish social security from retirement fund. Other than that, good effort, appreciate your input.
Not mentioned anywhere in this discussion are the effects of drug use on the inner city. How much disposal income in the inner city is spent on purchasing drugs? What happened to this issue? Very little is said about it anymore. Is that because drug use (and trafficking) has declined?
disposal = disposable
PB&J at least the Republicans are sufficiently sentient to recognize that Clinton committed over 30,000 individual crimes, each on with a possible sentence of two years and that is before the national security aspects. If you really want to take this to it's conclusion then it's time to indict Obama as well.
Harry this may come as a shock to you but every Republican member of Congress won each of their own elections and they ran against Obama and his progressive policies.
"I think a factor in black failure the past 50 years is the miserable education most black kids get.
It has gotten worse with the anti-white and anti-accomplishment attitude of black kids now."
I wonder if our local governments are having a big part in making it hard for folks in bad neighborhoods to do better. E.g. Philando had been pulled over more than 50 times for small infractions. And, even after a lot of dismissed fees he was charged with a total of at least $6500 in penalties.
Even for rich folks $6500 is some what noticeable dough. And a lot of municipalities are quick to sell these debts to collection companies who are even quicker to start adding penalties that can really jump up the costs. [I recently had to deal with a parking ticket for a car I'd sold a couple weeks before the ticket was assessed. I ignored the first notice because I knew I didn't own the car. Then two months after I sold the car I had to have an assistant make calls and send faxes to make the whole thing go away. That was really annoying.]
For people barely getting by it's got to be hard to come up w/ many thousands of dollars. And, the DOJ did say that Ferguson policing was structured to target folks for fee generation rather than purely focusing on protecting and serving. We can't have poor people driving around w/ broken taillights and other infractions, but it's a good thing that they have some sort of a car to drive to work instead of looking for handouts or being criminals.
"There has been no significant change in welfare programs (other than to reduce benefits even further) in the eight years of the Obama administration."
A number of eligibility rules and reforms, especially work rules, have been gutted.
the Obama Administration issued a directive declaring that states no longer need comply with the law’s work standards. Contrary to media reports, the Obama Administration is not merely “tweaking” the law’s workfare system. Rather, HHS explicitly asserts that it will lower the number of recipients who are required to work or, even worse, allow states to bypass the law’s work requirements entirely. The Administration is turning welfare reform on its head by jettisoning the legislative goal of reducing welfare caseloads. Under the Administration’s new welfare performance standard, the pre-reform welfare system is judged a rousing success and the 1996 welfare reform is a failure.
That's only one. Illegals are now getting all sorts of benefits.
"According to Michael K the stock market is a gigantic bubble about to burst and destroy the economy as we know it"
I'm not sure your exaggeration is valid but we have seen two bubbles in the past 16 years. The internet bubble that ended in 1999 and left Bush with a recession, and the real estate bubble that Greenspan thought would cancel out the effects of the internet bubble.
We've never had this level of debt before.
M.K.
That was the federal government allowing the states more discretion when spending dough from from D.C..
So, cons are in favor of that. Could you show us how this laboratory of experimentation worked out? That is what happened in the states that made such changes in welfare relative to those that didn't make these changes?
Presumably, you can prove that these changes resulted in a disaster. Right?
Harry Welty said...
At his first address to Congress he was interrupted with a cry of "liar."
I thought speaking truth to power was supposed to be a good thing.
Bruce, you touch on an important point about the loss of our Christian principles and practices. We have turned God out of our culture in favor of new, destructive gods and it certainly has resulted in chaos.
At his first address to Congress he was interrupted with a cry of "liar."
Yeah, that's right! We should let the president do what he's supposed to do in a state of the union address --- insult the judiciary branch right to its face!
/sarc
I'm sorry, but trying to maintain that the Obama administration's enemies have a lock on vindictive pettiness is a fool's errand. Even Obama's supporters admit he's thin skinned.
I doubt I could prove anything to you Ritmo.
The desire to believe can suppress even facts,
Michael K: There are few examples of genuine structural racism as blatant as the favoring of teachers' union seniority rules over young blacks’ education.
"the favoring of teachers' union seniority rules over young blacks’ education."
Excellent example but even worse is the anti-education theme of "acting white" which must be coming from parents.
Personally, there are vast numbers of the American public I don't want to be unified with: chiefly "liberals" (and by that I mean of course "tax-happy, coercion-addicted, power-tripping State fellators"), and the blocs they cater to: ghetto trash, barrio trash, etc.
And, you failed to distinguish social security from retirement fund. Other than that, good effort, appreciate your input.
...and that's a defense of leftie failed policy how?
@AA Excellent analysis. You pretty much said all that needed to be said on the topic.
At his first address to Congress he was interrupted with a cry of "liar."
Because, as no-one has disputed, he lied.
When Democrats say that calling a liar a liar is racist, they're arguing that dishonesty is inherent in blacks. Most Republicans disagree.
And, you failed to distinguish social security from retirement fund.
I didn't realize I was required to, but I don't have to 'distinguish'- the fact lefties described the stock market as 'risky' and are proud of polices that avoid it speaks volumes.
rehajm said...
...and that's a defense of leftie failed policy how?
No one has suggested that you can't put your retirement funds into the stock market. Social Security is the last resort, when all else in life has failed. As Michael K points out, it is probably best to not bet it on the stock market, which is subject to bubbles and manipulation.
Blogger PBandJ_LeDouanier said...
"I think a factor in black failure the past 50 years is the miserable education most black kids get.
It has gotten worse with the anti-white and anti-accomplishment attitude of black kids now."
I wonder if our local governments are having a big part in making it hard for folks in bad neighborhoods to do better. E.g. Philando had been pulled over more than 50 times for small infractions. And, even after a lot of dismissed fees he was charged with a total of at least $6500 in penalties.
Even for rich folks $6500 is some what noticeable dough. And a lot of municipalities are quick to sell these debts to collection companies who are even quicker to start adding penalties that can really jump up the costs. [I recently had to deal with a parking ticket for a car I'd sold a couple weeks before the ticket was assessed. I ignored the first notice because I knew I didn't own the car. Then two months after I sold the car I had to have an assistant make calls and send faxes to make the whole thing go away. That was really annoying.]
For people barely getting by it's got to be hard to come up w/ many thousands of dollars. And, the DOJ did say that Ferguson policing was structured to target folks for fee generation rather than purely focusing on protecting and serving. We can't have poor people driving around w/ broken taillights and other infractions, but it's a good thing that they have some sort of a car to drive to work instead of looking for handouts or being criminals.
7/10/16, 2:42 PM"
See which party is running those municipalities.
"Acting white" didn't originate as a criticism of Blacks seeking success. It comes from the resentment ghetto Blacks have against Blacks who, having achieved some measure of success, ran as fast and far from the 'hood as they could. After all that Black solidarity rhetoric, those left behind felt betrayed and now police their peers for any sign of similar aspirations. The Black underclass continues to sink because the Black middle-class wants no real contact with it.
Not that I blame them.
The dysfunction seen in black families didn't start three or four generations ago. It began when slave 'families' were torn asunder by the slave owners.
And once these families were torn asunder hundreds of years ago, blacks will never be able to form stable nuclear families again because they're just not smart enough -- says a liberal.
The idea that a president can unify a fractured nation is self-evidently ridiculous. It epitomises the totally unrealistic ideas that so many Americans have about the presidency.
He was ideal for that issue and we voted for the hope. Now, so many years later, things seem even worse.
They're not worse, silly Good German. He just ripped the blinders off.
I doubt I could prove anything to you Ritmo.
I didn't comment in this thread prior to this post. Is Dr. Kennedy hearing head noises again?
They're not worse, silly Good German. He just ripped the blinders off.
I always enjoy Ritmo's comments. They're the perfect demonstration of how Progressives have evolved from lying about Blacks to justify hating them, to lying about conservatives to justify hating them.
But to address the point - Obama didn't rip any blinders off - he dishonestly pretended that any criticism of his vast flaws were racist, because his ego and agenda matter more to him than the wellbeing of the country.
...he dishonestly pretended that any criticism of his vast flaws were racist...
Everything you're too stupid to understand is a lie, I suppose. So explain your own lie above. What did Obama ever say or do to cast your "criticisms" (whatever they were, and never-minding the unprecedented disrespect you showed him) as racist? Including your unprecedented attempt to sink his presidency... which was never done as blatantly as you did to him.
This should be fun.
Seems to me this is your own guilt talking. Finally.
...wellbeing of the country.
Ignorance is bliss, I agree. Not the same as "wellbeing".
Have to support Michael K on the stock market being in bubble phase. The Fed has driven "Investors" into stocks in the hopes they might get some kind of return. Stocks are ridiculously overpriced given the state of the world's economies. Bonds are essentially a loss about the same as putting your money under the mattress.. I think the bursting of the bubble is not going to be as bad as the two he mentions, but it is bound to burst.
There is no doubt in my mind that historians will fault Obama for his divisiveness - both racial and general.
What happened to the post -war black neighborhoods depicted by Walter Mosley? It certainly wasn't slavery.
Remember Hillary needs a great black turnout to win. The D's will do whatever it takes rhetorically to incite black voters.
I doubt I could prove anything to you Ritmo.
I didn't comment in this thread prior to this post. Is Dr. Kennedy hearing head noises again?
I can't keep track of all the lefty anonymous commenters. Half are "Unknown" and you and PB are so similar in your narrow view and your constant insults that I get you confused.
It actually is kind of amusing to see the juvenile insults that you all think are so clever.
I guess it's best to ignore all of you.
Everything you're too stupid to understand is a lie,
And there we have the subtext for every Ritmo comment ever. By his own admission, things too complicated for his below-average mind to understand must be lies.
So explain your own lie above.
Not a lie - just something you're too stupid and/or honest to acknowledge. Obama campaigned in 2008 on the basis of any opposition to him being "because he doesn't look like those other presidents", and has followed it up with recurring false accusations of racism (rather than opposition to dishonesty) being in America's DNA.
Ignorance is bliss, I agree.
I defer to your demonstrated familiarity with ignorance.
"There is no doubt in my mind that historians will fault Obama for his divisiveness - both racial and general."
Is the idea that historians will say BHO was mean to whites and cons?
I doubt it. The current con party with its soon-to-be-official-leader Trump and the large part of it in Congress that come from extremely safe districts, who are by definition rewarded for divisiveness, are undeniably, proudly divisive vs president blackenstein (as they see him). Why would historians ignore this? Why would they ignore the views of the population as a whole, i.e. the difference between Congressional approval and POTUS approval?
Anywho, con pols would look better to historians if Trump would cut off (including no more re-tweets) Twitter relations w/ Alt-right folks.
Maybe cons here and elsewhere think that the Alt-right POV will be vindicated by future historians.
Yikes.
I can't keep track of all the lefty anonymous commenters.
Here's some advice: Read the caption to the top left of the comment. It will give you a piece of information known as "the commenter's identity."
Of course, this shouldn't be difficult for an average person. But Dr. Kennedy, the sloppiest of surgeons, thinks that his sloppy lack of consideration for the most basic of courtesies should be an easily overlooked trifle - given how much esteem he demands that everyone else grant his vaunted presence and comments. What's a bad case of sloppy commenting when it comes to someone who should obviously be as worshipped as His Majesty, Captain Kennedy?
We are lucky to have his eminence grace our presence.
"For people barely getting by it's got to be hard to come up w/ many thousands of dollars" This is why, after the first infraction, he did everything in his power to avoid the next 49. And avoided calling attention to himself as a gangbanger online.
By his own admission, things too complicated for his below-average mind to understand must be lies.
It was irony, and was stated to the asshole who provided no evidence for his introductory accusation of lying against all progressives.
I am allowed to call you an "asshole," am I not? One never knows with you touchy conservatives, which insults are allowed and which are forbidden to be uttered to your sensitive souls. Of course, it's a one-way courtesy with you guys, who can accuse others of lying but never be accused of it, in turn!
We already knew how touchy you were about insults relating to your intelligence. Or lack thereof. Oh wait, did I say that? Didn't want to touch off another conservative sensitivity festival. This really stellar and illuminating conversation he enticed me with will never get off the ground now. Oh dear.
"So explain your own lie above."
Not a lie - just something you're too stupid and/or honest to acknowledge.
It's great to repeat an unproved and insulting assertion (of the same sort to which you object) when you couldn't even defend it the first time. If you guys are good at anything, it's repetition. What a pity that autism has no cure.
Obama campaigned in 2008 on the basis of any opposition to him being "because he doesn't look like those other presidents",
Here's a lie - a definite attempt at misleading at the very least. He pastes what I assume to be a quote and glues it onto his own unevidenced assertion just to make the case. No professional or serious person asserts things by shoehorning in actual evidence or a quote with his own words, let alone his own idea. But the very intelligent and very honest dildo machine known as "Pookie Number 2" did just that.
...and has followed it up with recurring false accusations of racism (rather than opposition to dishonesty) being in America's DNA.
Right. The DNA of America's non-racism was apparently not to be found in its black slavery or relegation of second to third-class citizenship to blacks, but in other, mysterious unseen sources. Special places that only "Pookie Number 2" has access to.
Any other societies that weren't racist prior to the 20th century? Let alone founded upon it? Or just America?
Do let me know. Assuming your secret sources allow for that.
"Ignorance is bliss, I agree."
I defer to your demonstrated familiarity with ignorance.
Deference is your default mode of operation. Just not to reason or evidence.
Those things you hate and actively assault.
It was irony, and was stated to the asshole who provided no evidence for his introductory accusation of lying against all progressives.
First, it was stated byan asshole,not toone. And not about all progressives, just the dishonest shits like you.
The quotes from Obama were neither hidden nor subtle. Only progressive dishonest shits like you pretend that he didn't say them.
Deference is your default mode of operation. Just not to reason or evidence.
Those things you hate and actively assault.
Another false accusation to justify your hatred. Well done, you dishonest shit. Made my point so deliciously clearly.
I think it's time for you to stomp off and tell us you hate us all again.
"This is why, after the first infraction, he did everything in his power to avoid the next 49. And avoided calling attention to himself as a gangbanger online."
It may make sense to identify this guy as a bad guy relative to driving infractions, or some sort of online-gangster (whatever that is.) OTOH, there are a lot of folks at the school where he worked who said he was a great guy.
To me, some poor dude (of any color) who shows up to their lame job is doing something good, even if their car operating obligations weren't satisfactory. As a law and order type of person, I'm open to the idea that this guy shouldn't have been on the roads, even if that means he would lose his job, which would make him a leach on society. But, obviously there's a downside to this outcome.
And, regardless of the questions associated w/ this guy working and getting to work by driving, I have not yet seen any justification for an officer killing this guy. Presumably more facts will come out over time.
Social Security is the last resort, when all else in life has failed.
It is an actuarial certainty Social Security will fail.
The quotes from Obama were neither hidden nor subtle.
Even the parts you added to them? Those things that you inserted into the same sentence as the quote, but without those quotation marks?
First, it was stated byan asshole,not toone.
Oh, I see! You're playing language games by reassembling prepositions. Interesting. But I wasn't the one who accused progressives of lying. You did. Rearranging prepositions doesn't change that, you LIAR.
Also, it's good to know that your reference to the "evolution" of "the Progressives" was selective. Even though no one uses language in that way. Which progressives were lying about blacks then or about conservatives today and which aren't, given how much you apparently like to slice and dice them all up into different factions? (Even without alluding to doing that).
And not about all progressives, just the dishonest shits like you.
Oh, right. "the Progressives" was a reference to me. Or people like me. So hard to follow someone as precise with his language as "Pookie Number 2".
Well done, you dishonest shit. Made my point so deliciously clearly.
Interesting sense of gastronomy you have there, juxtaposing the vulgar word for fecal excrement with the word "deliciously." Can we add "sanitary cooking" to the long list of things at which you clearly don't excel? My, my, I'd hate to know anything more about your eating habits. They sound absolutely disgusting.
But so are your mental habits.
I think it's time for you to stomp off and tell us you hate us all again.
I think that you're a worthless person. But then, you think that most flourishing human lives are worthless, anyway. So I guess I'll allow myself to feel comfortable with your worthlessness.
ARM
If the definition of the middle class is those holding assets in 401K or other retirement accounts it has shrunk considerably from those who would self identify as being in that category.
As to the market I think we are safe for now. Capital can go into equities or into bonds. Europe is generally paying negative rates, in other words you pay the bank to hold your money. With political uncertainty and an attendant craving for yield in which direction do you think capital flows for the time being? And with capital gushing into the safety of the US which is actually paying interest the likelihood of higher rates in the near term is also quite low. So equities look pretty good, especially dividending ones.
Lamar Gonna Set You Straight....
I'm Lamar, and I'm a Young Black Man, Proud and prone to Anger Issues. I can't help it: living amongst all these White People with their Little White Problems just makes me Angry. Try MY Problems, Bitches...
You white people are all Racist. I get i: I'm racist, too. It's just that I'm hated by a helluva lot more people than we Blacks can ever dream to Hate in return. Ooooh, oooh: you Whites are hated by 10% of the Population. Weak-ass bitches: try being hated by 90%...
That is BLACK MATH, motherfuckers. For you Zero is an abstract concept on some bitch-ass Math test: for us it is our fucking Lives...
Ain't it enough that we Blacks hate the Mexicans, too? Can we not share and fucking build on that? I mean: we Blacks have been here a lot longer, we paid our Dues. Now the Mexicans are your new Nigger? Really?
You think you got Problems? Fuck You.
I am Laslo.
One of the problems faced by failed Dem controlled cities is a collapse of their tax base, as ther defined benefit pension plan costs have skyrocketed. Detroit is bankrupt, likely to be followed by others. I don't think that anyone can see how Chicago digs itself out of the whole made by generations of machine politics. One of the clever ways that these cities have found to try to close their funding gap is to nickel and dime the residents with various fines - for speeding, for illegally parking, rolling through stop signs, mishandling garbage, failing to recycle, etc. And then paying surcharges and interest on top of that. Unfortunately, the people who are hurt the worst by this are the working poor, who are disproportionately minorities. Again the problem is the same - electing Democrats who continue to get reelected by promising to overspend in order to buy votes.
Pookie Number 2 said...
has followed it up with recurring false accusations of racism (rather than opposition to dishonesty) being in America's DNA.
Once again, here is the actual quote.
Obama: I always tell young people in particular: 'Do not say that nothing's changed when it comes to race in America — unless you've lived through being a black man in the 1950s, or '60s, or '70s. It is incontrovertible that race relations have improved significantly during my lifetime and yours, and that opportunities have opened up, and that attitudes have changed. That is a fact.
What is also true is that the legacy of slavery, Jim Crow, discrimination in almost every institution of our lives — you know, that casts a long shadow. And that's still part of our DNA that's passed on. We're not cured of it.
I think most people would agree with this. It has nothing to do with political opposition to the president.
Michael said...
If the definition of the middle class is those holding assets in 401K or other retirement accounts it has shrunk considerably from those who would self identify as being in that category.
As usual with economics there is no universally agreed upon definition of the middle class, but there is broad agreement that it has shrunk. I think it is pretty hard to argue that someone is middle class if they lack the financial resources to save for retirement. To be dependent upon social security for support in retirement is a pretty precarious position to be in. As Detroit showed quite clearly, it is easy for governments to renege on financial promises to retirees.
ARM, I don't think it's what he said that matters. It's what the hard left hires,especially in DoJ and EPA and Labor Dept do.
It will take years to get the Marxists out of the federal bureaucracy.
A lot of it began with Bush. When the Democrat Senate refused to approve his hires, he left DoJ full of Clinton appointees.
A couple of years later, when he and Gonzales realized what an obstacle they were, they fired the US Attorneys and the Democrats tried to make that an impeachment cause of some sort.
Clinton fired them all his first week and there was very little compliant.
It's amazing that guys like Bruce Hayden seek to link Detroit's situation to anything other than the downfall of its only major industry and deliberate (and unusual) decision to prevent any system of mass transit linking suburb to city - as facilitated renewal in every other major urban center.
But like other conservatives, these are the guys who believe themselves uniquely fit to govern. After giving us a major global depression (causing world war, fascism in Europe and the most notorious genocide in history), they decided to retreat to the same regulatory regime, and then feign amusement once a version of nearly the same economic calamity was repeated.
Hate people! Hate the large population centers that best demonstrate their power and creative potential!
But seek to lead them, nonetheless. By any means necessary.
It's an interesting philosophy, to say the least.
I think most people would agree with this. It has nothing to do with political opposition to the president.
American "conservatives" are very unusual in adamantly denying that their own country's history matters.
"American "conservatives" are very unusual in adamantly denying that their own country's history matters."
On the contrary, American conservatives believe that the unique history of the United States of America provides the basis for American exceptionalism.
"American conservatives believe that the unique history of the United States of America "
American conservatives at least know the history. Too many lefties think Zinn is history.
But like other conservatives, these are the guys who believe themselves uniquely fit to govern. After giving us a major global depression (causing world war, fascism in Europe and the most notorious genocide in history), they decided to retreat to the same regulatory regime, and then feign amusement once a version of nearly the same economic calamity was repeated.
If Hitler was a conservative, he would have put the Kaiser back on the throne. If Mussolini was a conservative, he would have put Viktor Emmanuel back on the throne.
You really should try to understand a topic before you voice an opinion on it, R&B. Having strong opinions about something you know little or nothing about is the best definition of the word 'bigotry.'
it's a confluence of conditions, certainly deindustrialization, collided with welfare and the collapse of the society in urban centers,
actually we are fairly aware that jim crow, more than slavery, was perhaps a mortal wound to the body politic, without it web dubois wouldn't have endorsed wilson, toyed with fascism, settled with marxism for one,
"Hundreds of years?" Try a hundred thousand. Black Americans on welfare have reverted to the cultural/genetic patterns of their African lineage in the fertile African savannah: Mothers have children with a series of roving high status men, and do all the economic work of providing and the (relatively light in such a culture) work of rearing. Men compete for temporary sexual conquests by engaging in physical or musical or verbal combat. Low status men only reproduce through opportunistic rape. Sound familiar?
If Hitler was a conservative, he would have put the Kaiser back on the throne. If Mussolini was a conservative, he would have put Viktor Emmanuel back on the throne.
Exactly! Nothing conservative about those two.
Michael said...
ARM
If the definition of the middle class is those holding assets in 401K or other retirement accounts it has shrunk considerably from those who would self identify as being in that category.
As to the market I think we are safe for now. Capital can go into equities or into bonds. Europe is generally paying negative rates, in other words you pay the bank to hold your money. With political uncertainty and an attendant craving for yield in which direction do you think capital flows for the time being? And with capital gushing into the safety of the US which is actually paying interest the likelihood of higher rates in the near term is also quite low. So equities look pretty good, especially dividending ones.
And there was QE.Which artificially bolstered the bottom line, But that's all anbove ARMs head All he knows is Obama!
On the contrary, American conservatives believe that the unique history of the United States of America provides the basis for American exceptionalism.
I would assert that only conservatives READ history.
The fascist states of early 20th century Europe were an entirely new and radical development. Until the French Revolution, history was thought of as the revelation of God's plan for man in time. The fascists came up with the idea of history as the eternal struggle of nations (or races) against one another to control resources. The Marxists came up with their quasi-religious dialectic.
The major 20th century political figure who was closest to the definition of a conservative was Churchill.
If Hitler was a conservative, he would have put the Kaiser back on the throne.
Lol. Oh Hitler was waaaaaay more conservative than that! He wanted to put Arminius on the throne!
Do you know who Arminius was? Does your history go back that far? (I doubt it but let's try).
Hitler was essentially a German paganist, and one who wanted to replace every political convention since German tribes defeated Rome nearly two millennia ago with what came before it. Blood oaths, fuehrerprinzip, etc. The guy, with the help of Wagner, thought that if he could channel a pre-law and order, pre-Christian society that rallied most effectively around a military dictator whose principle strength was to rally barbarian tribes to war, then national glory could be the only result!
Of course, neither the right nor the left is immune from atavistic revivalism, and Hitler did what most effective national tyrants do in appealing (initially, at least) to a broader swathe of the population than simply one fringe or the other.
But he definitely wanted to shelf every step of moral progress in rallying around his precious German tribalism. And of course, genocide and a, shall we say, less "restrained" sense of national bloodlust got a lot less criticism back in the day.
I won't argue that he didn't merge complaints emanating on both the right and the left in both getting into office, as well as once in power. Just as Trump is doing today.
But it's impossible to pretend that Hitler represented a call to moral progress without discarding the works of every serious moral philosopher ever. Tribalism was the game, not moral philosophy.
In any event, you misread me anyway. I didn't say Hitler was a conservative. I said that conservative dismissal of economic policy was what led to the Great Depression. And the Great Depression was the principle event (along with the Versailles Treaty) that led to the rise of Hitler.
I would assert that only conservatives READ history.
A monkey can read.
Learning is more than just reading.
Learning history means that you can't try to pretend that you can control it, or only pay attention to institutions or folk sayings or "common" sense or mob sentiment while ignoring all new scientific findings.
Conservatives HATE that. At least in America they do.
Burning witches was a conservative policy. It had been recommended for centuries.
Sometimes things change. Conservatives give lip service to acknowledging that, but are notoriously horrible at identifying when or how things should change.
Rusty said...
And there was QE.Which artificially bolstered the bottom line, But that's all anbove ARMs head All he knows is Obama!
Rusty seeking attention once again. Here you are little fellow, some attention.
"If Mussolini was a conservative, he would have put Viktor Emmanuel back on the throne."
Exactly! Nothing conservative about those two.
What a crock of shit. Mussolini sought and found justification for his fascist movement in the same Roman word and concept that allowed for a dictator to rule Rome during times of military distress. His symbol was a bundle of sticks featuring an axe - the same fasces that symbolized the power over life and death, that was carried by lictors in front of magistrates. This was about two thousand years ago.
You are proving how ignorant you are. It's embarrassing. Or it would be, if American conservatives knew what shame was or how ignorance comes across to others.
Let me answer your question Ann. It’s because you are a racist. I don’t mean that in a bad way. You just never saw below the color of his skin. You figured a black man who made soothing noises would be a unifier. If he had white skin you would have questioned his association with the Reverend Wright, but because his skin was black you looked away. If he had white skin you would have questioned his association with the Bill Ayers, but because his skin was black you took his word that he was just a guy in the neighborhood. If he had white skin you would have questioned his credentials to be President, but black skin and a good speech were all the credentials he needed. If he had white skin you would have looked into his radical background in college, asked if he had mellowed and wondered about his grades, but because his skin was black his history didn’t matter. Racism of the Ann Althouse kind; the soft bigotry of low expectations, gave us eight of governance by 1960s radicals that have turned the clock back so far in race relations that the possibility of a race war now exists. Don’t blame Healy; he’s a Yellow-Dog democrat. Blame Ann because she and her sisters and brothers gave us this day.
@ARM, except that Rusty's right and you're wrong. The whole point of the multiple QEs was to boost the stock market at the expense of older people who get essentially in the way of interest on their savings. My late mother in law, after she retired, was able to live frugally, but not uncomfortably, on the interest her money made in CDs and savings accounts. Today she'd have to burn principal.
Don't be like Hillary Clinton. Try to learn from your mistakes.
"Burning witches was a conservative policy."
It was a human policy to burn witches, not a 'conservative' policy. The great radicals of the 17th century believed in burning witches. So did the great conservatives. Geez. It wouldn't kill you to crack the spine on a book once in a while, R&B.
Mr. Healy, please say a few words about why President Obama has failed
Did Obama every really want to succeed, or was his campaign simply crafted on words that aging Baby Boomers would find appealing?
Aging Baby Boomers who worked oh so long to bring equality to the Nation, failing all along the way. Then along comes a clean and articulate (and black!) Obama, promising to do what they've been trying and failing to do for years.
So burning witches wasn't a longstanding, dare I say "institutional", policy, Terry?
In any event, minor point. I notice you stopped taking issue with the other ones.
Progress, I suppose. At least for a conservative.
Or whatever you call yourself.
Big Mike said...
@ARM, except that Rusty's right and you're wrong.
This is a ridiculous response. Where did I say anything about QE? I was merely commenting on little Rusty's need for attention. Don't you think it's cute? Come on ladies and gentlemen, a big round of applause for Rusty.
Your analysis of fascism is exceedingly shallow, R&B.
By your lights, Mussolini should have had the Italians living in caves, and hunting with bow and arrow.
A nation is a unique narrative shared by a group. Mussolini used symbols to reinforce group identity because group identity was essential in building his corporate state. The mythic history served the state, not the other way around.
In 1919, Mussolini and a few others founded the Fasci di Combattimento in Milan. Some highlights from their program:
The End of the Draft.
Repeal of titles of nobility
A minimum wage
The nationalization of all arms and explosives industries.
The seizure of all goods belonging to religious organizations and the abolition of episcopal revenues.
The obligation of the states to build "rigidly secular" schools for the raising of "the proletariat's moral and cultural condition."
Forcing landowners to cultivate their lands or have them expropriated and given to vets and farmers' cooperatives.
Wow, that sounds just like the GOP platform, doesn't it?
George Bernard Shaw - Ritmo, ever heard of him? He wasn't famous for his conservative politics - was a big fan of Mussolini. That was before GBS became a big fan of Uncle Joe.
Such inconvenient truths...such willful leftist ignorance of history.
A large progressive tax on
Ah, the burning of witches! Hysteria. See also campus rape culture.
And of course, the National Socialists and the Fascists were such big believers in small government and the rights of the individual.
By your lights, Mussolini should have had the Italians living in caves, and hunting with bow and arrow.
Oh, so now you say that conservatism is actually not a political ideology, but a call to revert to ancient technologies and living standards.
I've never heard that one before, Terry. Maybe you're on to something.
A nation is a unique narrative shared by a group. Mussolini used symbols to reinforce group identity because group identity was essential in building his corporate state. The mythic history served the state, not the other way around.
Blah blah blah. Yes he channeled ancient national mythology (and reality!) to foist a 1st c. AD political reality onto a 20th c. movement. Thank you that's exactly what I said. Conservatives do this all the time.
Shorter Patrick Healy:
"We have a unity problem - 'some guys over here' think all their problems are because of 'those guys over there.' And I, Patrick Healy, have loftily taken to the pages of the New York Times to tell you that we can't fix that problems because of 'those other guys over there'"
I was merely commenting on little Rusty's need for attention. Don't you think it's cute? Come on ladies and gentlemen, a big round of applause for Rusty.
Clap.
Clap.
Yawn.
Can someone comment on why Gary Johnson has zero press? I mean, Ralph Nader in 2000, with half Johnson's votes, was all over the press.
like the esser wing of the party founded by drexler, the nazis, the catholic center party were the conservatives of the day, and they collapsed with bruning, then stalin went after the social democrats, because he saw them as the main opposition to him,
The whole point of the multiple QEs was to boost the stock market at the expense of older people who get essentially in the way of interest on their savings.
I don;t think they intended to devastate the older middle class. They are just random victims of policies that benefit the "credentialed class." They don't really care.
Remember that the 1927 equivalent of QE might have been OK but Ben Strong had the temerity to die and leave the Fed in the hands of lesser men.
Sort of like Barney Frank and Chris Dodd, whose principle talents seem to lie in the direction of "waitress sandwiches."
Debating R&B is a waste of time. I would sooner argue with my basset hound.
PBandJ_LeDouanier said...
"I wonder if our local governments are having a big part in making it hard for folks in bad neighborhoods to do better."
My God, you have a point there. But it would be helpful if you applied that point to the Democratic controlled cities where education for blacks, crime, drugs and segregation are worst by far. The failure of liberal-progressive politics in America's cities is one of the major historical developments of the post-WW II era. Now cities are "recovering" because young white people want to live there in affluent ghettos. In a world of accountability, there would be some political consequence for that.
Opps, I forgot to mention another highlight from the Fascist platform:
A large progressive tax on capital that would amount to a one-time partial expropriation of riches.
Yep. Sounds real conservative to me.
My quotes are coming from a book called "Mediterranean Fascism 1919-1945" by Charles F. Delzell, if you're interested in my sources.
they say you get the commenters you deserve but I think you deserve better
I reccommend reading "Mein Kampf" for a very clear exposition of the roots of his ideology. There is very little Germanic mysticism in it, Hitler didnt roll that way.
Some of his followers had a bit of Renfair going on, but that was leftover 19th century romanticism not unique to the Nazis.
Did he also comb his hair in the morning, exiled?
So glad you were able to put your talking point out there. Being anti-tax and pro-wealthy favoritism (especially when asking much of the rest of the country) is not conservative anywhere in the world but as an American ("It could be me!") quirk. Other countries don't relegate national sacrifice to only the already most heavily burdened, the way you prefer us to do.
"The dysfunction seen in black families didn't start three or four generations ago. It began when slave 'families' were torn asunder by the slave owners."
Incorrect. There were two books written about that, one terminating in 1025, and the pther in 1930, that showed the black family was intact.
What damaged the black family was housing segregation in the north, strecthing across whole neighborhoods, not just between main streets and side streets, which permitted differential law enforcement in what became segregated black neighborhoods, rom what law enforcement was in white neighborhoods.
The police was bribed to ignore crime by the Mafia or other organized crime, and there were also useful idiots, otherwise known as liberal judges, who were appointed to positions of authority by political machines. This way heroin could be sold to poor people.
The high crime rate damaged the black family. The crime came first - the damaged family life came later.
Fascist slogans in Italy in the early '20's"
"The land to him that works it!"
"To every worker the entire fruit of his sacred labor!"
Yep. Conservative.
Face it, if Ritmo lived in Milan in 1920, he would have run, not walked, to get his very own black shirt.
Let's make sure to let everyone get their RNC talking points out there. All history must be viewed through the lens of what seemed to work so well for Republicans prior to the age of Trump.
Everybody now. Go on. Spew away. Get your Classic RNC on. Mussolini was an Obamaite. (But never retweeted his quotes).
I know you can do it.
"I can't keep track of all the lefty anonymous commenters."
MK can't keep track because he's a senile old fool on a good day!
And he's totally obsessed w/Ritmo even when he's not flipping burgers at McDonald's! ie all the time.
>
His bigger obsession is being glued to Althouse 24/7. Damn pathetic but it does provide him with a daily release of pent up con frustrations.
Seriously MK, what do you hope to accomplish at a 95/5 con echo chamber? Rhetorical.
>
Keep on keepin' on old fart ...
Is the gun-dildo bitch done yet? How much shit does she have to spew to make any sane person believe that appealing to your own nation's political norms from two thousand years ago is "progressive?"
Whatever makes you feel better. It's all about your emotions. And Reince Priebus'.
That's important seeing as how you're doing your best to fascistly fall in line behind Der Great Konservatif known as Don Drumpf.
ndspinelli said...
Obama is conflicted on race. He is embarrassed by inner city blacks.
He's not particularly keen on non-inner city blacks either. I remember reading an account of his first encounter with the CBC after he was elected Senator. Jeremiah Wright who accompanied him to the gathering said he couldn't wait to get away from them, especially the women who draped themselves over him and made it clear they were at his service. According to Wright, Obama was thoroughly disgusted by the whole encounter.
It would appear that except for hobnobbing with celebrities, the only black folks he can abide are upper class blacks like ValJar and the rest of the Vineyard colony. Sadly for him, though, as a member of the enclave explained one year when the island was preparing for the annual First Family visit, "He's not one of us, but he's welcome." He would so love to be one of them but even though he's risen higher than any black man ever, he knows he never can be and I believe it really sticks in his craw. The best he can hope for is that one of his daughters will marry into the tribe.
But he saves his real antipathy for whitey. I think he hated his mother and despised his grandparents and regards the rest of us with disdain and resentment. He's motivated more by the idea of degrading whites than lifting up blacks. He never intended to bridge any racial divides.
Obama is at heart a community organizer, a hustler. We were fed a bunch of malarkey about how he exists on a higher plane than the rest of us while, in fact, that couldn't be farther from the truth.
Really, R&B, if you hate conservatives so much, what are you doing on this blog? Unless, of course, you are a TROLL.
Ann has wonderful commenters.
That's why she gets (what? seven?) vicious trolls and mobies.
The fact that they must be insane adds to my amusement.
If you use Chrome, get "killfile active".
One doesn't miss out on their colorful antics since their most amusing lines are quoted and ridiculed.
Win-Win!
LOL,gee, I can hardly see those goal posts, R & B, you've moved them so far away.
Again, tell me what is conservative about big government collectivism.
Or wait, don't, since it will just be your usual poorly educated, badly thought out bundle of cliches, juvenile insults and smug sophistry masquerading as knowledge.
I don't hate conservatives. I just hate lies and like reality.
Althouse is not a conservative. (Though she panders to them). I don't have to be one. either.
You like her because she gives false credibility to the lies you like to tell yourselves.
But some conservatives prefer truth.
They're the ones that I'm interested in.
The bitch is now lecturing me on how it must have been a liberal/progressive - (take your pick, I'm sure she doesn't know the difference there, either) - who wrote a book called Leviathan.
That must be embarrassing. But again, it's probably too much for me to presume that she possesses the capacity for shame or to know how her ignorance comes across to others.
Of course, I bring facts and Mr. Small Balls brings insults. You can't disprove one thing I said so of course you have to scream and spit like a dyspeptic toddler.
Why don't you stomp your little feet and screech ""I HATE YOU!!!" like you've been known to do and show us once again what a little nothing of a man you are, you hysterical ninny.
It's amusing to me.
" I just hate lies and like reality."
OK sweetie, point out the "lies" in my posts. I even provided the source for my quotes.
That was the Fascist Party platform in 1919. It was not conservative.
That drives you into incoherent rage (not that it takes much).
Because you "hate lies." Uh huh. Sure.
So let's recap shall we:
According to con's Obama is the worst president in history and hates white folk with every fiber of his being. Whereas Hillary is an evil, lying, inefficient/inept $$$ grubbing train wreck when she's not stealing candy from babies.
2008 = Obama easily elected.
2012 = Obama easily re-elected.
2016 = Hillary leading in the polls over a bigger "Republican" train wreck.
Talk about pent up frustrations ... thank goodness Althouse provides a daily platform for majority cons to release their anger.
I feel your pain!
Of course, I bring facts and Mr. Small Balls brings insults. You can't disprove one thing I said so of course you have to scream and spit like a dyspeptic toddler.
I disproved plenty of what you said. (Not that it was necessary. Any lukewarm IQ'd individual would have know the answer). You were too dumb to know that a conservative literally wrote the book on "big government" - at least insofar as powerful is a proxy for "big" - whatever big means. Literally. He wrote the book. Name that book. Can you name it? I named it. It has a name that means "whale" - you know, because whales are small creatures. Can you name the philosopher?
Of course you can't. You're a fucking dishonest moron who's not worth addressing. Your immorality is grating.
It's amusing to me.
Cause you're a sociopathic chimp who claps at the misery she spreads. You are incapable of making anyone happy and can therefore only take pleasure in bringing others down to your own miserable level.
Just totally not even worth addressing. The posts stand on their own - as do the replies to the very unworthy criticisms.
"Seriously MK, what do you hope to accomplish at a 95/5 con echo chamber? Rhetorical."
Actually, you could go to other blogs which I frequent. Right now, I am waiting for dinner and have been reading "Living Well Is the Best Revenge, " by Calvin Tompkins. I have read a lot of books about the Murphys.
Earlier today, I was reading "The Mighty Eighth," about the 8th Air Force in WWII.
My own two books are doing modestly well on Amazon.
Two weeks ago, I was in Chicago and visited the graves of a couple of ancestors, one of whom died in the Civil War.
In two weeks we will drive to Oregon to visit my wife's son who is doing very well building custom houses. His son builds custom Porsches at his uncle's custom Porsche shop in LA.
In September, we will go to Alaska and stay at the Denali Backcountry Lodge for a few nights.
Last fall, I was at Ypres and Waterloo for the 200th anniversary of the battle.
Now, it's your turn. Tell me how you are educating yours elf abut the world.
"You're a fucking dishonest moron who's not worth addressing.
Just totally not even worth addressing."
"Cause you're a sociopathic chimp who claps at the misery she spreads."
If I've spread any misery your way, I will certainly clap at that. You deserve all the misery you get.
In fact, I love the idea of spreading misery to assholes like you. As the late great Florence King said, "I don't suffer fools and I like to make fools suffer."
So I'm retiring for the evening a very happy woman.
Ta ta, sweetie!
Please, Michael K! No need to explain yourself to a TROLL. He's not worth it.
Shiloh,
I'll never forget the look on Carl Rove's face when Obama won again in 2012. The complete meltdown, denial, shock and hurt all rolled up in that pudgy face. I'm sure after the election in November the Althouse cons will find this blog's comments sections a safe place to vent...again. Maybe we'll see another "autopsy", from the RNC.
Again, ignorance is bliss.
Still can't name the philosopher who wrote Leviathan, his philosophy, or what it was about.
But can name an obscure and meaningless plank in a platform from like 1920.
Your stupidity is offensive. And you've admitted that you prize negative attention over saying anything intelligent.
Take pride in your fellow, self-identified "conservative," commenters.
Oh, and I do think it most amusing that Ritmo's idea of "spreading misery" is disagreeing with him and pointing out facts which contradict his opinions.
Wow, what misery!!! Almost like Stalin or Mao or Pol Pot or Che or Chavez - oh, wait, those are your boys. They didn't like anybody disagreeing with them either.
Should be Karl with a K.
MK returned to talk to me er His bigger obsession is being glued to Althouse 24/7.
And he never misses a chance to tell the world how accomplished he is just like his present day obsession Trump ... and all this while he's waiting for dinner.
>
And think of how much richer he'd be if he got 5¢ every time he said he would never/ever talk to Ritmo again!
He can't keep track of names 'cause he's soooo busy multi-tasking. Or some such nonsense.
Hobbes, ahole. And so what?
I prefer Burke and Tocqueville. You can go back to your copy of "Marx for dummies."
Nice to see you cozying up to Shiloh, her/she/ze of the serious daddy issues. Shiloh who doesn't give one shit about how corrupt Hillary is. Neither do you, really, Ritmo. You're just a phony.
moderation how does it work, the trolls are easy enough to tell, shiloh, ritmo, elaine smithee, gizmo, those come readily to mind, what does hobbes have to do with fascism,
Love that three-part troll harmony.
"And think of how much richer he'd be if he got 5¢ every time he said he would never/ever talk to Ritmo again!"
Add to that all the times MK said he was leaving this blog and never coming back, LOL!
Oh, and I do think it most amusing that Ritmo's idea of "spreading misery" is disagreeing with him and pointing out facts which contradict his opinions.
Like a little girl who bites, scratches, and pulls hair, you haven't done or said anything legitimate.
It's a fact that you can't name who it was that wrote Leviathan, what their political philosophy was, or how it relates to your own - and contradicts everything you just said.
But you do remember 20th century names, like a wanna-be historian who got what she knows from People magazine.
A historian or political philosopher can read this thread and easily figure out who's misled, and who's the idiot.
But then, she already admitted that she has no capacity to illuminate. Only to annoy. And women wonder why they're not taken seriously and only make so much to the dollar. I think it's people like you they can blame that on.
"He can't keep track of names 'cause he's soooo busy multi-tasking. Or some such nonsense."
Shiloh, why the insults ?
Tell me about your eduction and how you know so much about the world ?
Come on, we know you are brilliant and know everything about everything.
I'd hate to think you are parroting half educated fools at Vox or TPM.
Shiloh who doesn't give one shit about how corrupt Hillary is. Neither do you, really, Ritmo. You're just a phony.
Oh you know me so well, person who admits she cares not for the truth, only to annoy.
I think it will be great once your blood sister Hillary gets in and can, for at least another generation, give women like you the bad name that you so richly deserve.
Every dark cloud has a silver lining.
@shiloh, Obama is not the worst president in history -- that would have to be Buchanan. Obama is only second-worst. But it does bother me a little that I've lived through two of the five worst, meaning Carter and Obama. Both Democrats, fancy that.
"I'll never forget the look on Carl Rove's face"
Ah lovable turdblossom as I would have liked to seen Althouse expression since she was fairly certain Willard Mitt would win quite easily.
The 2012 election nite thread was highly entertaining. Indeed, all 1,609 comments.
Fond memories ...
rove is a rather dense journeyman condottieri, whose achievements were a tie against manbearpig, a fellow almost entirely made out of win, and a slight win over lock jaw lurch, the treasonous swiftboat pilot, who did a good basenghi act during iraq, allowing the quagmire narrative to proceed, one of his cunning cunning plans was trying to impart info to matt cooper for which he had to step down, and almost went to jail, and the funny thing is he never learned anything from the experience,
"Add to that all the times MK said he was leaving this blog and never coming back, LOL!"
No, Inga. How could I pass up the opportunity to match wits with you ?
I sometimes sign off when Ritmo gets too crude or insulting but that is just for the day.
I read about four or five blogs. I used to read and comment at leftist blogs like Wash Monthly but they can't tolerate disagreement and I gave up. The juvenile insults kind of resemble yours.
Obama is not the worst president in history -- that would have to be Buchanan. Obama is only second-worst.
Time to send this one on the political historians.
I can't wait for November here at Althouse. It'll make 2012 look dull.
"Please, Michael K! No need to explain yourself to a TROLL. He's not worth it."
No, consider me a teacher and missionary to the unwashed.
He/she seems to be ignorant and not as nasty and juvenile as Ritmo, for example.
Ritmo seems at time to show some education but is so angry and bitter that there just is no point in reading and responding.
MK now talking to invisible people? Do you hear voices too?
I long for the days of Garage Mahal.
I used to read and comment at leftist blogs like Wash Monthly but they can't tolerate disagreement and I gave up.
You're hardly the worst at this but there are many self-identified conservatives who disagree simply for the purpose of being disagreeable. (See the troll above). A number of non-conservatives have acquired this reflex since so many of you do such a poor job of policing your own and calling out bullshit when you know it to be bullshit. Partisans are generally hacks, but again - check out the chick above and let me know how her discrediting of anything honest you could write is worth any non-conservative's time. Especially now that the looneys have taken over the asylum. The sane ones are no longer in charge - they've jumped ship a la George Will, etc.
MK sees himself as the Great White Father.
Ritmo seems at time to show some education but is so angry and bitter that there just is no point in reading and responding.
I just don't like hypocrites. You go on with irrelevant personal insults as often as anyone but with you it's to save face rather than any legitimate offense taken at twisting words out of context or derailing a legitimate and important point.
narciso wants to get rid of all the libs er trolls er libs so Althouse would be a 100% con echo chamber !!!
ok, let's take a vote as the sheepish con majority easily has the few stray libs beat.
Yea, 5% minority is totally threatening to the feeble con majority.
When you find yourself in the majority it's time to pause and reflect! ~ Mark Twain
Titus, the hog taster is more honest than these two.
I doubt most of the cons here would last a day on a liberal blog, they'd be running back to the bosom of the Althouse blog or others like it.
Jon, are you feeling neglected again?
I realize you're unimportant. But that's your problem. No one else's.
"No, consider me a teacher and missionary to the unwashed."
MK's on a mission from god! Quite admirable.
>
"Shiloh, why the insults?"
Irony alert!
no I recognize you're a fool, probably a knave, but I'm speaking of profanity like lazlo employs on occasion, and is even aimed out at our host, who must realize she made a serious mistake, endorsing someone who taught the some lives matter (critical race studies) as a substitute for law,
the atlantic banned me, for interfering with sullivan's fixations, and that of his kramerica intern conor f, atrios for pointing out the flaws in the plame narrative, the reason blog for reasons I can't recall,
Irony alert!
He's a hypocrite. A very self-righteous hypocrite.
He's probably used to getting everything he wants in the darkened O.R. while he was feeling around inside people's bodies, barking orders at nurses, throwing things at orderlies.
He's having a hard time adjusting to normal life - where common courtesy is a two-way street and no one bows to anyone else based just on how far inside other people's insides they put their hands.
Bring back Amanda!
Ive been on liberal blogs since the Usenet days (pre blog).
The usual end was I was banned, or told to leave.
Not generally given to personal insults, and I have a thick skin. However, the liberals were most unwilling, generally, to enter a dialectic, nor was it usually possible to establish facts. For instance a claim about the predictive value of CBO projections (for some reason a popular issue during budget arguments, when there was a budget to argue about) was denied without research, and when incontrovertible evidence was presented it would be dismissed as unworthy of rebuttal. The big failing in every case is a lack of good faith.
I was banned from a "Current Affairs" forum at a reality tv site (2003-2006), Shocking! It was more of a life achievement award than an actual banning.
The rules and regulations were quite extensive ie no bad language, no disrespect etc. etc.
Over half the cons here wouldn't have lasted a month.
I digress.
MK definitely has that God Complex thing going on. I'm pretty sure the medical staff around him despised him, based on his behavior here to anyone who he thinks may be a liberal, who he thinks are beneath him.
Good on you narciso. Atrios was a pit of villainy.
Sullivan was, well, low quality really.
Unknown: "I doubt most of the cons here would last a day on a liberal blog, they'd be running back to the bosom of the Althouse blog or others like it."
Always nice when the denizens of leftist-posters-only blogsites and creators of safe spaces chime in.
Robert Cook is a great read, moar Cookie!
this was before we knew they were part of the journolist, something we are told isn't still happening, discus unfortunately draws out the strigoi, but so does haloscan,
now would it be too far afield, to make parallels between the bpo and the npa, of your native phillipines, the former is not necessarily maoist, although I don't think they have philosophical objections,
Yeah, I wouldn't last a day on a liberal blog, I'm not interested in discussing genitalia, and where this and that part goes into which holes. Ewww.
MK definitely has that God Complex thing going on. I'm pretty sure the medical staff around him despised him, based on his behavior here...
The tell is that if you cheekily bestow upon him the phrases of of greatness and wonderment that he thinks he deserves and that best describe him, he doesn't know how to respond. It's like he thinks you're finally validating him in the way that he craves.
And that essay of his on "My Upcoming Summer Vacation" (9:03 PM) was interesting, but highly arrogant. But of course he can't see that.
Yeah, I wouldn't last a day on a liberal blog..
No Jon, you just can't follow a coherent thought. You'd be there for like four minutes before waving your hands and going, "GET ME MY RITALIN! AAAARRRGHHHH! I CAN'T TAKE THIS RATIONAL DEBATE THING! I NEED SOMEONE TO TELL ME WHAT I'M SUPPOSED TO BE FOR OR AGAINST!"
Roberrt Cook's comments are always substantive Jon, unlike yours. He is also treated like shit by the charming cons here despite his excellent contributions. But he, as the rest of us libs who hang in here, don't internalize it as we consider the source
"Unknown/ Inga making a fool of herself again with five and ten year old stories about minuscule groups that never did anything but talk."
As Big Mike, and perhaps others, have noted NONE of these groups have been invited to the White House - certainly not in the time I've been alive. I'll ignore Robert Byrd (D-West Virginia) here.
None are routinely advisors to presidents or presidential candidates.
None have network television shows or are on the payroll of major networks as commentators.
And All are generally dismissed as terrible, warped individuals by both left AND right.
But other than these, and similar, factors, Unknown is correct, no difference, no difference at all.
"You go on with irrelevant personal insults as often as anyone but with you it's to save face rather than any legitimate offense taken at twisting words out of context or derailing a legitimate and important point."
Well, if you consider comments on your MacDonald's job insults.... :)
"He's probably used to getting everything he wants in the darkened O.R. while he was feeling around inside people's bodies, barking orders at nurses, throwing things at orderlies."
Actually, the nurses liked me because I never got excited.
"I'm pretty sure the medical staff around him despised him, based on his behavior here to anyone who he thinks may be a liberal, who he thinks are beneath him."
No, I get along pretty well with lefties who aren't given to crude insults.
I don't require anything but courtesy and enjoy discussing things like airplanes and computer programming, which I did a long, long time ago.
I have lots of interests besides politics.
R&B, I missed that 9:03 comment of MK's. He tries just a bit too hard there, as if he has something he feels he must prove to us. I'm not impressed in the least.
NPA was explicitly Maoist from its beginning. It was refounded as a new left group with no overt contributions from the old Moscow aligned Communist Party.
They certainly were Maoist when we were dealing with their legal branch, 1983-86. I met the NPA proper several times, once, in Albay province, being their "guest" for a night.
What they are now I dont know.
There you go again, Michael K.
MIchael K,
You require nothing but courtesy? Who do you think you're fooling? It is most often you who first directs an insult toward a liberal commenter who hasn't addressed you in any way shape of form. If you want respect, give respect. Didn't your parents teach you that? Don't be surprised when libs push back Michael, it's human nature, but you being God....
right Al Sharpton and his protege, Joy Reid, tourette's syndrome, I know is msnbc a real network, a query, on fox, you have jehmu greene and jesse jackson's charming daughter,
on cnn, do you have an hour, they slopper over the somelivesmatter activists like they were marmaduke,
Actually, the nurses liked me because I never got excited.
You're divorced, aren't you?
Was it your exciting personality that did it? ;-)
I put the smiley face there just like you did because I guess that means, "I'm joking!" Which of course absolves me of any personal annoyance you may feel at my having insulted you.
;-)
Now be courteous to me.
apparently the new president, duterte is not unamenable to meeting with them, but the islamists have really filled the vaccuum specially in mindanao, abu sayyaf and moro liberation front, I won't abbreviate for obvious reasons, how did you get out of not being a guest?
You know, it's good these kids have a hobby.
Pecking at a keyboard beats getting into fights at Trump rallies.
Safer too.
Maybe MK thinks it's a personal affront to him that liberals dare express an opinion here in the comments sections and that's why he most often responds to a liberal commenter in an insulting manner right off the bat. He behaves as if he has an ownership here, last I looked it was Althouse's blog.
Well, may I suggest that the first step in having a decent argument is to ignore the other fellows insults, and address whatever is substantial in his point, or rebuttal. It may even pay, in an environment where there are at least a few reasonable participants, to expand and clarify his case for him, if he presented it poorly. Then you can proceed to hold up your end of the argument.
Be a good example.
After some time you may aquire credibility.
Unknown: "But he, as the rest of us libs who hang in here, don't internalize it as we consider the source"
Your astonishing courage is duly noted.
Not as remunerative though.
I understand the traveling protesters make 3K each appearance.
Well, it looks like Jon and a few others are left here talking to themselves.
Thread's dead.
Time of death: 10:20 CST.
"Not as remunerative though.
I understand the traveling protesters make 3K each appearance."
Trump only paid $50 for the actors that filled out the crowd when he deescalated for his big announcement. Those actors are in the wrong business.
The Moros have been making trouble for over 400 years, under various organizations and the cheiftain of the day. Its nothing new at all.
Duterte comes out of the bloody frontier of Visayans and Moros. Consider him a frontiersman with half-breed relatives and connections with the tribes.
Our party was detained until the NPA could establish our bona fides with Manila, as not representing any official agency. In fact we were there on private matters. It was clear that, at the time, the NPA information network was extremely well organized. They had tracked our movements over three provinces, knew when and where we had been on any road, who we had visited, and where we intended to go.
I get the impression that this network, these days, isnt what it was.
the dynamics of how left activists move to direct action is of interest to me, like the sds weatherman, the baader, the lc/brigatte, et al.
BREAK TIME!
I mean DOWNLOAD FROM THE BORG TIME!
Uh-oh! It's that time of night.
Eerie, isn't it?
that was a particularly prolific time, before colonel rowe's encounter with them,
Maybe they're getting a new insult module.
The current one is pretty weak.
The NPA ethic of the time (early 80s) was very much in the Maoist spirit, it was quite cult-like among the leadership anyway, these were devoted fanatics. They had sacrificed everything for the cause, and they spoke mainly to each other.
Modern American PC doesnt describe it, in their case. There wasnt an ounce of selfishness.
Their followers were much more the typical lads looking for excitement and willing to follow whomever. They were quite easy to "turn" when things got serious. Its notable that the NPA never really got into high casualty combat with the security forces.
If you want a description of the NPA, Bernard Fall on the "monks" of the Viet Minh is on the money; except with the NPA this would just describe the leaders.
The twins usually post instantly after anything I say.
Probably listening to a mandatory live podcast.
Tick. Tock.
so they were more like the huk in the magsaysay period,
when one has a genuinely interesting conversation you ignore the strigoi,
Agreed.
Long Strigoi strategy meeting.
Huks were different.
The Huks were more of a local phenomenon. They were on the whole not as ideological and less fanatical, though they did have a good bit of that. Their leadership wasnt like the NPAs, mainly radicalized university students. Also the Huks were unique to Central Luzon areas where there were large scale agricultural holdings, in particular Tarlac and Pampanga. It was the grievance over land that drove them. Elsewhere agriculture was mostly smallholders.
The NPA was driven entirely top-down by ideology. It was much more widespread, with some presence at least in most provinces, but never commanded near as many men as the Huks.
This is all relative of course, and it has long been the tradition for dissatisfied men to turn "tulisan", a compound of bandit and rebel. Huks and NPA are, in part, just a modern manifestation.
Of course, by the time I was paying attention the Huks were gone, so I have no personal experience. Some of my relatives had dealings with Luis Taruc
@Unknown: you conveeeniently failed to mention that the militia you referred to were acquitted on almost all counts.
http://articles.latimes.com/2012/mar/28/nation/la-na-hutaree-acquit-20120328
"In a sharp rebuke, a federal judge Tuesday acquitted seven members of a Michigan militia of plotting to overthrow the U.S. government with weapons of mass destruction — crimes that could have landed them in prison for life.
The ruling is an embarrassment for the government, which secretly planted a paid informant and an FBI agent inside the Hutaree militia four years ago and contended that members were armed for war in rural southern Michigan. Nine members were arrested in 2010. One previously pleaded guilty, and one was found incompetent to stand trial.
U.S. District Judge Victoria Roberts said federal prosecutors, who rested their case last week, failed in five weeks of trial to prove that the Hutaree had a specific plan to kill a police officer and attack law enforcement personnel who showed up for the funeral."
Obama didn't fail. It is proceeding exactly as he planned. He's an activist at heart, and this is what activists do: stir the pot, then take political advantage of the ensuing chaos.
it's very interesting I read one profile of the npa by a post reporter, which had the usual idealization of the movement, like matthews did with fidel, or bonner with the fmln,
Did you hear a "Yoink!"?
I did.
apparently there was a rectification campaign in the early 90s, where they purged suspected infiltrators then they resurged with alex boncayo in the 00s
the last was from a memoir written in tagalog, by one of the witnesses to the rectification campaign,
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