June 3, 2017

The reason I only have 1 post up today (until this one) is that I stopped to watch Bill Maher's show (which I had recorded).

I'd seen that he was the latest target in the game of Destroy a Comedian, and I wasn't interested in playing the game. We need our comedians, and if they're any good, they're going to offend us now and then. Maher does his show live, and he's got to jump at jibes when he sees them, and often he's childish or edgy or low.

I needed to watch the whole thing, and that took a while, because I have a sort of real-live, in-the-room, blogger-and-commenter thing happening here, and it takes a long time to watch the whole show. There's pausing and conversation and rewinding and innumerable points to be made — and not just about Maher's "Work in the fields? Senator, I’m a house nigger" response to Ben Sasse's invitation to come out to Nebraska and "work in the fields with us."

Meade and I weren't just talking about that, but about the entire interview with Ben Sasse, who was there to talk about his book — "The Vanishing American Adult" (which I've blogged about before). Sasse was doing a great job holding his ground and seeming like a smart, attractive, independent politician, and it will be a shame if people only want to talk about Maher's zinger with the bad word, but that's what we do these days. Because Sasse is right, adulthood is eroding.

Ooh! Maher said a bad word, Mommy. Punish him! 

And then there was a panel discussion, a completely unbalanced panel with what seemed to be 3 hopped-up Trump haters: Eliot Spitzer — isn't he supposed to be in prison? — Rebecca Traister — author of that NY Magazine Hillary hype, "Hillary Clinton Is Furious. And Resigned. And Funny. And Worried." — and Jim VandeHei — a co-founder of that new media effort Axios, which aspires to fix what's wrong with media, but might be bad. These 3 jiggled and fidgeted and spluttered. The best part was when Traister, effusing, made a reference to Hillary Clinton redirecting her fundraising "hose." Maher — with almost nothing but facial expression — called attention to the pun, and Traister tsked at him. Meanwhile, sitting between Traister and Maher was Spitzer — Client 9 — but Maher resisted the edgy joke there. He didn't say "Eliot, you know about hos" or anything like that. The panel stumbled on.

In the middle of the panel, there was the most substantive, intelligent part of the show, a little interview with a man named Tristan Harris, whose bottom-of-the-screen identification read: "Former design ethicist, Google." He had a lot to say about the great power of manipulation possessed by Google and Facebook and Apple and the ethical problems of the attention-manufacturing business. But that set up a question Maher threw to Traister and Traister seized the opportunity to chatter manically and we never got back to Harris.

The morning was getting late and the cool breeze in real-life world wasn't going to last. I got out for a long walk. But now I'm back and I see that Maher has apologized:
"Friday nights are always my worst night of sleep because I’m up reflecting on the things I should or shouldn’t have said on my live show. Last night was a particularly long night as I regret the word I used in the banter of a live moment. The word was offensive and I regret saying it and am very sorry."
If it were up to me, I'd say fine. The word wasn't directed at anybody (other than at Maher himself). It was mostly just laughing at the idea of Bill Maher working in a field. Worse that the "n-word" itself, in my view — if you want to take racial matters seriously — is that he used slavery in a lighthearted way.

For a different perspective, here's what Malcolm X said about the "field Negro" and the "house Negro" (via "Five (Other) Times Bill Maher Was Racist, Islamophobic, or Sexist"):

So you have two types of Negro. The old type and the new type. Most of you know the old type. When you read about him in history during slavery he was called "Uncle Tom." He was the house Negro. And during slavery you had two Negroes. You had the house Negro and the field Negro.

The house Negro usually lived close to his master. He dressed like his master. He wore his master's second-hand clothes. He ate food that his master left on the table. And he lived in his master's house--probably in the basement or the attic--but he still lived in the master's house.

So whenever that house Negro identified himself, he always identified himself in the same sense that his master identified himself. When his master said, "We have good food," the house Negro would say, "Yes, we have plenty of good food." "We" have plenty of good food. When the master said that "we have a fine home here," the house Negro said, "Yes, we have a fine home here." When the master would be sick, the house Negro identified himself so much with his master he'd say, "What's the matter boss, we sick?" His master's pain was his pain. And it hurt him more for his master to be sick than for him to be sick himself. When the house started burning down, that type of Negro would fight harder to put the master's house out than the master himself would.

But then you had another Negro out in the field. The house Negro was in the minority. The masses--the field Negroes were the masses. They were in the majority. When the master got sick, they prayed that he'd die. [Laughter] If his house caught on fire, they'd pray for a wind to come along and fan the breeze.

If someone came to the house Negro and said, "Let's go, let's separate," naturally that Uncle Tom would say, "Go where? What could I do without boss? Where would I live? How would I dress? Who would look out for me?" That's the house Negro. But if you went to the field Negro and said, "Let's go, let's separate," he wouldn't even ask you where or how. He'd say, "Yes, let's go." And that one ended right there.

So now you have a twentieth-century-type of house Negro. A twentieth-century Uncle Tom. He's just as much an Uncle Tom today as Uncle Tom was 100 and 200 years ago. Only he's a modern Uncle Tom. That Uncle Tom wore a handkerchief around his head. This Uncle Tom wears a top hat. He's sharp. He dresses just like you do. He speaks the same phraseology, the same language. He tries to speak it better than you do. He speaks with the same accents, same diction. And when you say, "your army," he says, "our army." He hasn't got anybody to defend him, but anytime you say "we" he says "we." "Our president," "our government," "our Senate," "our congressmen," "our this and our that." And he hasn't even got a seat in that "our" even at the end of the line. So this is the twentieth-century Negro. Whenever you say "you," the personal pronoun in the singular or in the plural, he uses it right along with you. When you say you're in trouble, he says, "Yes, we're in trouble."

But there's another kind of Black man on the scene. If you say you're in trouble, he says, "Yes, you're in trouble." [Laughter] He doesn't identify himself with your plight whatsoever.

147 comments:

Scott said...

Perhaps Bill Mahaer should not have, over the years, aided and abetted the construction of the petard upon which he was hoist.

Scott said...

Maher I mean. eye kant spel

Clyde said...

I'm glad that you're watching it so that we don't have to.

Seeing Red said...

After reading what you wrote, I'm wondering if BM said that to divert because Sasse was scoring points.

I'm a couple of generations removed from farm stock so my family doesn't work in the fields (aren't most farmers in this country white? And tractors made my lifestyle possible)

but I guess white privilege would be my mind not jumping automatically to slavery.

Especially since my state is a farming state.


Is BM in Cali? That's a huge farm state, I guess I really don't get the connection, unless all he sees are brown people working the fields.

If he gets out of his urban bubble.


I read awhile ago millenials are attending how to be an adult classes.

Seriously, what the boomers did to their offspring so that their offsprings' offspring aren't capable of taking care of themselves.

So sad.

rcocean said...

We "need our comedians". Really? No, we need funny comedians who don't hate 1/2 of the USA. Bill Maher's always been as funny as "Jock itch" - the only thing funny is his ugly face.

My only reaction to his house nigger comment was:

1) How weird that Sasse is talking about Nebraska farmers working their fields and Hollywood Bill Maher's reaction is to free associate to black slaves picking cotton. Yeah, I can understand a BLACK comedian doing that, but not a Rich Jewish Guy from Beverly Hills.

2) Why say "House Nigger" and not "House Negro" - wouldn't that be just as funny or unfunny? Strange that Nigger popped into his mind. Again, normal is he was black - but not when he's a Jewish white guy.

Kevin said...

"Perhaps Bill Mahaer should not have, over the years, aided and abetted the construction of the petard upon which he was hoist."

It's amazing how many articles you can read about this without the word Milo coming up once.

rcocean said...

Sasse of course is complete Cuck, and dumb as a post. He could have scored some points by being offended at the "N Word" but just sat there like a bag of rocks.

Dumb. But he is Rino.

tcrosse said...

No harm, no foul.

Tank said...

Sasse is a cuck.

I thought the joke was funny, but then, I'm ... ya know.

Rene Saunce said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Kevin said...

I have no problem with artistic expression. If Maher wants to say Nigger on his show, that's between him, his viewers, and his network. If Griffen wants to go after Trump during her routine, she's doing so with people who paid to watch her show.

I can choose not to participate.

Not everything is artistic expression, however. I believe Kathy Griffin was speaking when she pushed that photo out to the general public, not performing a comedy routine. I would like to protect her speech, which I strongly disagree with, but that's not the climate in which we live.

The left has worked itself into a frenzy over the idea that free speech is not a fundamental human right, but only something which the government is not allowed to interfere. They believe that "hate speech" not only can be shut down, but there is a morality in doing so. As long as its private citizen on private citizen, they don't believe you have a fundamental right to speak.

As long as this is going one way - lefties shouting down those they don't agree with - it's not going to get any better. Why would it? They get all of the benefit and pay none of the cost. It is only when their own rules (see how Maher handled Milo on his own show) are held up against their own behavior, that we might finally get a dialogue on why the first amendment contains fundamental human rights and not just guidelines for government behavior.

rcocean said...

"Eliot Spitzer — isn't he supposed to be in prison?"

Ha. I missed that in my first read trough.

Earnest Prole said...

I doubt if your new friends will be as merciful toward Maher.

Birkel said...

@ Althouse

When we are busy NOT destroying comedians, do you think on all the conservative, would-be comedians who cannot be destroyed because their careers were not supported in the entertainment industry? Or do those people simply not exist to you?

@ n.n.
Thoughts?

Kevin said...

"He could have scored some points by being offended at the "N Word" but just sat there like a bag of rocks."

Or he could have pointed out that, like the house negroes, Maher has sold out his Libertarian principles to enjoy a lavish lifestyle in Hollywood. I would have been fine with that.

Sasse put out several Tweets when he got off his return flight as to his embarrassment about how he handled the situation and what he wished he had done.

Rose Hughes said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Meade said...

"Sasse is a cuck.
I thought the joke was funny, but then, I'm ... ya know."

What -- a cuck socker?

Kevin said...

"Real Time host’s conversation with Nebraska senator Ben Sasse, who tweeted regret over not responding, will be edited to omit exchange in future airings."

We have always been at war with Eastasia.

Drago said...

Earnest Prole: "I doubt if your new friends will be as merciful toward Maher"

It's already been demonstrated time and again that Althouses "old friends" were not.

I don't blame you for avoiding that. It's....uncomfortable and certainly inconvenient for the point you are trying to make now.

rcocean said...

Althouse quoted from Malcolm X, but then "X" wasn't a historian. He never went to college. The loyalty of the "House Negro" is a bit of a myth. There were loyal slaves who identified with their Masters but most of them just pretended to be loyal till their chance came. Which is what you'd expect.

Southern Civil war narratives are full of "Traitorous Servants" who deserted to the Yankees - or spied for them - and left their white masters high and dry.

rcocean said...

Would Titus like some Sasse Cuck?

mockturtle said...

Malcom X was, after all, black. Which makes all the difference, like it or not.

Ann Althouse said...

"Althouse quoted from Malcolm X, but then "X" wasn't a historian."

He wasn't a historian, but at this point he is part of history. His idea as expressed there is part of the culture and it's the reference point for Bill Maher's joke. Doesn't matter if it gets the story exactly right. It's an idea that many people have internalized. There are a lot of things in American history like that.

Birkel said...

@ Earnest Prole
Same question to you. Were all those Hollywood Leftists "merciful" to all the potential conservatives who would like to be entertainers/writers/comedians/etc?

Did mercy begin to become important when it was Leftists who became threatened? Who? Whom?

mockturtle said...

Scott wisely observes: Perhaps Bill Mahaer should not have, over the years, aided and abetted the construction of the petard upon which he was hoist.

Exactly. He who lives by the sword, etc.

Rene Saunce said...

I watched a clip of Maher a while ago and he was going on and on about Trump and Russia - and how Trump and Russia stole the election from poor Hillary. No proof, just innuendo and lies. He's not a comedian, he's a propagandist.

I give him mild credit for occasionally standing up to the hypocrisy on his side, but those moments are rare.

As for the N word - my first thought was that the he/the left attach so much anger and rage at "whites" "the white working class" [who obviously worked with the Russians to steal the election from poor Hillary] - they feel nothing but self-loathing and shame for their own whiteness.

Clyde said...

For anyone who doesn't have time to scroll through the nearly 500 comments in the Kathy Griffin post below, here's a quick summary video:

Comment summary

Jack Wayne said...

It's too bad you got distracted by the shame of the day. I'm more curious about Sasse. He strikes me as a cardboard cutout Republican. There's no there there to me. But you expressed no opinion so I'm left with my own.

Lydia said...

How long before the main story is that Ben Sasse laughed?

RJ said...

Maher was always a poor comedian. He is not good enough to do actual comedy, which is why he went edgy.

R.J. Chatt said...

I just watched a little 18 second clip of the comment and my impression was that Maher was reacting to Sasse's invitation to come work in the field as if Sasse was a white slave owner. It was a sideways insult to Sasse and a definite insight into Maher's background. He's never put his hands in the dirt.

TWW said...

So, he's just a phony, a coward, or both. Ironically very similar in response to Griffin an very similar in substance to...well he's not funny... Griffin.

Birkel said...

Where are all the edgy, but not really funny, conservative comedians. Ann Coulter is the only one I can remember. Are there others?

Should we pre-miss all those comedians who were pre-destroyed?

Kevin said...

"How long before the main story is that Ben Sasse laughed?"

Ultimately it has to be how Trump has so damaged society that even the most thoughtful speakers on the left have been lead to say horrible things in response.

Some might even go as far as to say he made them do it, and therefore they shouldn't be held responsible.

JaimeRoberto said...

In a few months Ben Sasse will be known as the Republican Senator who appeared on stage with a comedian who used racially charged language.

While I think the joke was stupid, and I often disagree with him politically, I hope it doesn't cost Maher his job. If I recall correctly he has been one of the few on the left who has defended freedom of speech for his opponents. He might get hoisted on a petard, but it wouldn't be his own.

rhhardin said...

The joke used the two current senses of nigger; the underling, and the survivor rogue.

Maher works for management, but he is not of the management.

He survives on his wits against management, the rogue; while still being the underling of management.

As to slavery is always serious, that lacks the historical perspective. It's about economics. Enslaving is better than killing, in a hit them on the head and take their stuff economy.

The free market made that no longer sensible. A slave can contribute more to society working in his own interest than he can working as a slave.

The metaphor still works for the pre-free-market times. Better a slave than dead.

Georgia Lawyer said...

Diana West wrote an excellent book on the subject ("The Death of the Grown-Up") ten years ago. Sadly, things have worsened greatly since 2007.

rhhardin said...

Maher used to be a WNBC page. Imus used to set him up with girls.

rcocean said...

"Maher was always a poor comedian. He is not good enough to do actual comedy, which is why he went edgy."

Actually he went into politics. Because:

"Politics is show-biz for ugly people"

Angel-Dyne said...

AA: Worse that the "n-word" itself, in my view...

...is using the phrase "n-word" as if we were children. Is there any other slur or obscenity referenced in this childish way? We either replace the offending word or phrase completely ("he used an offensive racial slur", "she shouted an obscenity"), repeat the word outright, or, in some publications, use dashes. Rarely do we see "*-word" substituted for other sluts or obscenities (and it looks and sounds stupid then, too.)

There's something wrong with adults who regard the word "nigger", alone among all obscenities and slurs, with the fear and trembling of a bunch of primitives inadvertently overhearing curses that can only be handled by powerful shaman magic, not ordinary people. (And please spare me the "but but but it's a unique special evil power word because historical oppression". No, it isn't.)

— if you want to take racial matters seriously — is that he used slavery in a lighthearted way.

People only make light of and joke about things that they don't take seriously or don't care about? Absurd. Sorry, but I fail to see anything particularly offensive about Maher's crack. Cracks are funny or they're lame. They can be inappropriate for the context in which they're delivered, but we are talking American "comedy" tee-vee here, right?

Bob Boyd said...

Maher is so right that he's a house negro. And the Trump voters he has such contempt for are today's field negros.

NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...

rcocean said...

2) Why say "House Nigger" and not "House Negro" - wouldn't that be just as funny or unfunny? Strange that Nigger popped into his mind. Again, normal is he was black - but not when he's a Jewish white guy

Yep, kind of funny from a guy who has a penchant for dating black women.

Then again maybe not....

Drago said...

Jack Wayne: "It's too bad you got distracted by the shame of the day. I'm more curious about Sasse. He strikes me as a cardboard cutout Republican. There's no there there to me."

Sasse is a very intelligent and insightful scholar-type and thinker about our republic, its history and our place in the world.

He is also a thoroughly bland establishment guy who is completely unarmed in the current political battlescape that is American politics.

Despite all that he has been witness to, he still brings quill pens to the gunfight.

Drago said...

JaimeRoberto: "In a few months Ben Sasse will be known as the Republican Senator who appeared on stage with a comedian who used racially charged language."

In a few months Ben Sasse will be known as the Republican Senator who appeared on stage with a comedian and FORCED the comedian to use racially charged language.

Meade said...

"Some might even go as far as to say he made them do it, and therefore they shouldn't be held responsible."

Which brings us back to the theme of adult babies who can't seem to actually grow up.

NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...

Lydia said... [hush]​[hide comment]
How long before the main story is that Ben Sasse laughed?

There's already been people tweeting outrage because Sasse didn't immediately club Mahr to death one he said it.

http://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2017/06/03/mary-katharine-ham-slaps-back-at-people-mad-at-ben-sasse-because-bill-maher-used-the-n-word/

traditionalguy said...

What does Schwartz Negger mean in the German Master Race? That Austrian guy's name needs to be banned. Think of it as using the Ministry of Truth's memory hole.

The issue is not refusal to learn the manners of adults. The problem is a brutal fascism now practiced by the disciples of today's college Professors. Political Word Control is only the tip of the young mob's new methods.

Big Mike said...

I'd seen that he was the latest target in the game of Destroy a Comedian, and I wasn't interested in playing the game. We need our comedians, and if they're any good, they're going to offend us now and then.

No, we don't need Maher. Not at all. Not one little bit.

Jupiter said...

Thank you, Angel-Dyne, for that tiny mote of sanity in a frothing sea of PC idiocy. The prohibition on saying "nigger" (niggering, that is, while White) is intended to be a gotcha. By carefully avoiding using it, you signal your obeisance to our Nomenklatura masters.

Birkel said...

Whither all the comedians, funny or not, who would have been conservative but cannot be destroyed because they never became.

John said...

I don't see the big deal with what Mahr did. Doesn't bother me that much.

But Maher has been an asshole to the liberal/conservative side for years so I am more than happy that he is getting some comeuppance no matter the underlying reason.

If there is any justice in the world, he will lose his show and die of old age a penniless wino living under a bridge somewhere.

Old age = 80+. S0 20 years or so from now.

John Henry

tcrosse said...

I saw Maher do stand-up in the early 1980's, and he wasn't too bad, not to damn him with niggardly praise. So I won't denigrate his early talent.

Drago said...

NorthOfTheOneOhOne: "Yep, kind of funny from a guy who has a penchant for dating black women.

Then again maybe not..."

Lots of slaveholders did.

exhelodrvr1 said...

Maher is one of the few liberals who is honest about the danger of Islam, but otherwise he's an a-hole. Maybe after a few more liberals get sacrificed on the altar of PC, the country will come to its senses.

Naah - who am I kidding?

Drago said...

Look, everyone be careful NOT to put a crosshairs over Mahers HBO pic because THAT, ladies and gentlemen, is a bridge too far.

Drago said...

exhelodrvr1: "Maher is one of the few liberals who is honest about the danger of Islam,..."

That alone might be the reason many on the left will turn on him. Witness Inga here and her tireless efforts to obscure what the terrorists do.

rcocean said...

"Doesn't matter if it gets the story exactly right. It's an idea that many people have internalized. There are a lot of things in American history like that."

Yep, a fine old American tradition:

"This is the West, sir - when the legend becomes fact, print the legend."

The Godfather said...

If it were up to me, I wouldn't fire Maher for using that phrase, nor would I fire Kathy Griffen for that image. But then I wouldn't try to stop Milo or Condy or Betsy or whoever from speaking somewhere. Those of us who really believe in free speech face a challenge: We can apply our standards to speakers we disagree with and let them have a platform, or we can follow the leftists' rules for radicals and use their own arguments and tactics to shut up speakers we don't like.

Earnest Prole said...

Speaking of how childish our culture has become, how about those who view politics as a tribal left-right binary where “our side” and “their side” alternately rejoice in driving the enemy from the public square.

Here’s how the left goes about it. For those too lethargic to click, some headlines:

New York Daily News: “Five reasons why liberals should boycott Bill Maher”

Salon: “Bill Maher’s outrageous statements about Islam and Muslims are beyond the pale”

HuffPost: “How Do You Solve a Problem Like Bill Maher?”

Guardian: “A history of the Bill Maher's 'not bigoted' remarks on Islam”

Atlantic: “Bill Maher's Dangerous Critique of Islam”

The people most likely to be purged from our culture are those who’ve offended both the left and the right — in other words, the people who say the most interesting things.

Left Bank of the Charles said...

A smal irony: The Civil War was fought in no small part because the South wanted to take their slaves to Nebraska.

readering said...

Makes you wonder how regularly he uses the word off the air. I wish we could garner evidence.

Humperdink said...

Colbert = Cock holster
Griffin = Trump's bloody head
Maher = House nigger

Lefty comedians are an hilarious bunch.

Drago said...

Left Bank of the Charles: "A smal irony: The Civil War was fought in no small part because the South wanted to take their slaves to Nebraska"

To lots of places including Nebraska.

Why that's an "irony" is a bit elusive.

Drago said...

Earnest Prole: "The people most likely to be purged from our culture are those who’ve offended both the left and the right..."

But mostly those that have offended the left.

It's swell of Earnest to pretend its all "even steven".

Drago said...

Ugh: https://pjmedia.com/homeland-security/2017/06/03/breaking-possible-terror-attack-on-london-bridge-police-declare-major-incident/

Earnest Prole said...

But mostly those that have offended the left.

Agreed. Doesn't that make it even stupider?

Earnest Prole said...

Stupider and more childish?

Fred Drinkwater said...

"Need"?
We "need our comedians" a lot less than we need our competent CEOs, satellite engineers, bakers, plumbers, and religious charity workers.
You know: the do-ers, not the critics.
Maher, Fallon, Griffen, Colbert, Stewart, Fey, and on and on, are all worth less than the guy who comes over on a rainy Sunday afternoon to unclog your sewer line.

Michael K said...

“Bill Maher’s outrageous statements about Islam and Muslims are beyond the pale”

Meanwhile the Religion of Peace has struck again in London.

Van ran over 6 people on London Bridge and there was a subsequent series of stabbings.

Fred Drinkwater said...

Some reports indicate three attacks in London, at the Bridge, the Borough Market, and Vauxhall.

Drago said...

Earnest: Agreed. Doesn't that make it even stupider?"

Here's what I will say about that:a society cannot survive if there are different acceptable social and moral codes for different political persuasions.

Would I boycott or demand someone be fired for their comments? Until recently, no.

But we are in a place now where it's mostly one side getting gutted and without Mutual Assured Destruction I don't believe the left will return to it's senses.

And they might not even then but the right is coalescing around the idea of "okay, we will play by your rules".

This shocked the left when evangelicals went for Trump. Why is that? Because he will fight for them and they knew it, even if it's simply a political convenience.

The left demanded that evangelicals explain how they could seemingly abandon their values to support Trump. The answer was the bakers, the pizza joint, etc.

So, if Griffin and Maher and a dozen more have to pay the price to get the antifas to back off, so be it.

ALP said...

"Because Sasse is right, adulthood is eroding."

Timely. In today's Seattle Times is the following editorial headline:"In Seattle, it is taboo to be friends with a Republican?"

Am I the only one that gets a whiff of high school newspaper from that headline: "At Neighborhood High School, it is taboo to be friends with a jock?"

I was told years ago that newspapers write at an 8th grade level; I think the emotional/maturity level is about 7th-8th grade as well.

Earnest Prole said...

So, if Griffin and Maher and a dozen more have to pay the price to get the antifas to back off, so be it.

Yes, the antifas are smarting badly right now over their loss of Kathy Griffin.

Do you have any idea how dopey you sound? Antifas hate Democrats and Republicans equally, and they sure as hell don't care about Kathy Griffin.

Michael said...

One does not blurt out the word nigger unless the blurter uses the word privately. And believe me, Maher does. Always edgy out of his mouth. End of career out of your mouth. Listen to Paparazzi by Xzbit for another take on the forbidden word.

Michael said...

The antifas hate Democrats and Republicans equally? Well bless your heart. They seem to miss fucking up the Democrats.

LOL

Michael said...

I am getting a candle and teddy bear shop in London.

Drago said...

Earnest Prole: " Antifas hate Democrats and Republicans equally, and they sure as hell don't care about Kathy Griffin."

LOL

I'm lumping all the lefties under their shock troops. That's too bad if it hurts your feelings.

Matthew Sablan said...

"Real Time host’s conversation with Nebraska senator Ben Sasse, who tweeted regret over not responding, will be edited to omit exchange in future airings."

-- Makes me think Bill Maher's not so sure that the left will have his back.

Kramer is probably sharpening the long knives.

Drago said...

Right now we need to "weaponize" as many James Taylor songs as possible and translate them into Arabic.

Barring that, we need to let about 2 million more islamists in, give them additional cash, tell them America sucks and then let them ethnically purge entire sections of cities of non-muslims.

That's the only hope to keep the horrible and murderous republicans who are calling for Kathy Griffins head at bay.

Yancey Ward said...

Given where the criticism of Maher is coming from, I wish he had done this apology:

"I sorry, Massa!" That would have been hilarious, too (I thought his remark was funny, but then I actually have a sense of humor to work with).

Michael said...

Another terrorist attack, or should I say "suspected terrorist attack" in London. Dozens hurt, several killed. What could have caused these men to run down people on the London Bridge and then hop out and start slashing throats? Think! Someone will get to the bottom of it in time.

Just a thought. Have all ME residents of the UK wait until they are 50 to get a drivers license. We don't see members of the ROP over fifty going for the virgins.

Matthew Sablan said...

I wonder what Maher thought about the Mozilla guy getting fired. Oh, right. He made jokes about it.

Michael said...

Yancey Ward

Of course it was funny! But too fucking late. When you can get a CEO of a major company fired for contributing (years before) to a pro-life cause then you can get fired for saying nigger on t.v. because you think it is hilarious and edgy. No one has lost their sense of humor, they are just adjusting their fury to the new normal.

Earnest Prole said...

I'm lumping all the lefties under their shock troops. That's too bad if it hurts your feelings.

Childlike beliefs don't hurt my feelings. If you had the slightest acquaintance with antifa, you'd know their greatest hatred is reserved for leftists who believe progress is possible through the existing political system. It's been that way on the left for, what, a hundred years?

Michael said...

...their greatest hatred is reserved for leftists who believe progress is possible through the existing political system. It's been that way on the left for, what, a hundred years?

I see. And so they attack right wingers, conservatives and the private property of fellow citizens regardless of political affiliation.

William said...

It's worth noting that Frederick Douglass, Nat Turner, and Touissant were all house servants. A bright person looks for the ladder and then a way to climb it. I'm sure the brighter slaves looked to get on the big house gravy train. Their relationship with their master was a human relationship and was, like all human relationships, of infinite variety. Some were resentful, some were loyal........I recently read a biography of Cicero. At the end of his life, both he and his brother were put on proscription lists. If you were on a proscription list, you could be turned in by anyone even your slave. The slave would receive a hefty reward and his freedom. Cicero's brother was turned in by his slaves. Cicero's slaves lied to help conceal their master. We're antebellum slaves so much different than Roman slaves?

Gahrie said...

Childlike beliefs don't hurt my feelings. If you had the slightest acquaintance with antifa, you'd know their greatest hatred is reserved for leftists who believe progress is possible through the existing political system

Which why they spend all of their time attacking Leftwing protests and public speakers...right?

Laslo Spatula said...

I illustrated the concerns of this very same topic in a Cafe earlier this morning: comment reproduced here.

It was worth a try.

I am Laslo.

William said...

In Ireland, malnutrition was endemic and in bad years you starved. If you were a servant on one of the great estates, you were treated like dirt but you never starved or went hungry. Irish peasants actively competed to land jobs as domestic servants in the grand houses of their overlords. There were endless revolts, but the servants didn't murder the English in their beds.

Earnest Prole said...

Which why they spend all of their time attacking Leftwing protests and public speakers...right?

Indeed. If you had the slightest knowledge of antifa beyond their most recent appearance in Berkeley, you'd know they've spent the past eight years attacking nonviolent progressives and not the right.

Sebastian said...

"it will be a shame if people only want to talk about Maher's zinger with the bad word, but that's what we do these days." If by "we" you mean humorless culture-war-fighting progs policing their own plantation.

"Because Sasse is right, adulthood is eroding." If by erosion you mean deliberate excavation, explosion, and destruction.

"We need our comedians" Now that's funny. You mean, so we can laugh at progs making fools of themselves, realizing that the joke is on the jokers?

The point of of Maher's joke, as implied upthread, is to tag Sasse as a white slaveowner. All in good fun, of course. No prog would ever think of a GOPer as sorta kinda equivalent to a white slaveowner. The blowback is delicious.

Michael K said...

"they've spent the past eight years attacking nonviolent progressives and not the right."

I guess that's why they say they are attacking fascists,.
Nice of you to agree,

Earnest Prole said...

I guess that's why they say they are attacking fascists

Antifa believes anyone to their right is a fascist, just as the childlike commenters here believe anyone to their left is antifa.

Gusty Winds said...

Maher is a puke. He's belongs to some of those Eyes Wide Shut sex clubs. His one sided panels and liberal audiences are all the same.

When he said the 9/11 terrorists were courageous he was wrong and too stupid to know it. Courage is when you face danger and want to live and survive. You want to run away, but push forward.

The 9/11 terrorists were expecting 72 virgins in paradise as a reward. They sacrificed themselves, for themselves. That's not courage.

I'm sure somewhere in Maher's self absorbed fantasy world, he considers his use of the n-word as courageous. Yuk.

William said...

More venting: I'm sure Sally Hemings had a tough life, but the sexual servicing of her master wasn't the biggest problem in her life. Domestic servants were frequently used in such a way. Karl Marx knocked up his maid. Randolph Churchill is said to have gotten syphilis from one of his maids. Tolstoy ran his total to the thousands. Getting raped or coerced or having an affair--whatever you call it--was what happened to women in domestic service........I'd also like to take this opportunity to point out that Sally Hemings, even as a slave in America, had more rights to life than the free born wife of an African king. There was one king who went crazy after his mother died. He ordered several of his wives to be put to death, Another king found out his wife was cheating on him. She was one of several hundred, so you can see how that would happen. The book I read didn't mention how she was put to death, but the man involved had his arms and legs broken and then he was put upon the banks of a crocodile infested river. Perhaps because she was a woman they gave her a more merciful death.

Christopher said...

I'd seen that he was the latest target in the game of Destroy a Comedian

No, the game is "Kill the Witch" and it's a lefty game, and it won't stop being played until it is mercilessly used against the left. Power is the only thing they understand.

Earnest Prole said...

No, the game is "Kill the Witch" and it's a lefty game

Wait, which side are you on?

exiledonmainstreet said...

"No, the game is "Kill the Witch" and it's a lefty game, and it won't stop being played until it is mercilessly used against the left. Power is the only thing they understand."

Correct. I hate this game, but since the Left wants to play it, they need to have their own weapon turned on them.

Enjoy the world you made, lefties.

Earnest Prole said...

Enjoy the world you made, lefties.

ThinkProgress is already expressing regret. You guys really taught the left a lesson this time.

Gospace said...

We need our comedians, and if they're any good, they're going to offend us now and then.

From my friends from HS days, he was just as offensive, and in their opinion, just as unfunny in HS. Managed to spend 3 years in the same school building with him completely unaware of his existence. I don't think I missed anything.

Char Char Binks said...

Blacks need to get over themselves right about yesterday. They're not the only people who have ever suffered, and most of them are only suffering now from their own stupidity and racism. They're're insufferable. I know this upsets you, ARM, but I'm all niggered out.

Gospace said...

Comment from another thread: M Trumble said...
Who cares? If men and women aren't diddling, there are no children.

As I age (I'm soon to be 59) it is increasingly clear that the only contribution I have made is my child. I didn't cure a disease or put men on the moon. I"m just a guy! Who procreated and raised a great kid who will procreate!

We won!


Bill Maher is worth millions. Known by everyone, whether you want to call it famous or infamous.

I've been happily married 39 years, have 5 kids, and we're at 5 grandkids and growing. I won, he lost.

Tank said...

Meade said...

"Sasse is a cuck.
I thought the joke was funny, but then, I'm ... ya know."

What -- a cuck socker?


No no no, a covfefe !

Ken B said...

The furor is not about the word. That is a pretext. The issue is that Maher points out that Muslim terrorists are motivated by what their religion teaches.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Maher has dated black women and got in far hotter water over the nothing w/Dinesh D'Souza by rightly claiming that it was not morally courageous to lob cruise missiles at an enemy in sandals and robes and an RPG - an overreaction that he's now seen as very well vindicated for. It's pretty stupid to think he's a racist or spreading racism, but the power of the word in an insensitive context is too toxic for HBO to want to have anything to do with. Hopefully it will blow over but who knows.

As for this nonsense of his "petard", what petard is that? That he insulted conservatives and now they're the ones behind this uproar? Sheesh. Get a grip karmic overlords.

David said...

Althouse, Maher happd to apologize if he wanted to keep his job. Simple as that. In other words, he had to act like what he said he was.

Note that Sasse groveled too, with a long multiple tweet mea culpa for not Standing Up when he supposedly should had. It was a misstep by Sasse, who is gathering a following without having to deal with much pressure. If he ever gears up to run for President, expect to see that clip with portentous voice overs.

On the other hand, nobody got stabbed with 12 inch hunting knives.

pacwest said...

"Antifa believes anyone to their right is a fascist, just as the childlike commenters here believe anyone to their left is antifa."

I don't believe that is a true statement. I think everyone is just fighting to establish where the "center" is. They use the extreme examples to make points. Everyone does. The main things I notice are that the left of centers are unwilling to give ground for fear of being pushed to a point farther right than they are willing to go, and the right of centers are unwilling to give much ground because they feel as they have given too much already. Other than the true crazies and hopless. (10-20 percent?) I think the center is larger than most believe.

Check the wording of your sentence.

iowan2 said...

The conservatives I know, dont get offended at stupid entertainers attempt to be relevant.

But as has been pointed out, it is mandatory that conservatives hold the left to their own standards, and seek the same destruction of any person that strays for the PC world they created. Conservatives have been playing nice for decades, being the bigger person, thinking that eventually the left would get the hint. The left never gets the hint. Now its time to pull the pin on the grenade they throw into our camp and throw right back to them. The left must be held to their own rules.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

But as has been pointed out, it is mandatory that conservatives hold the left to their own standards, and seek the same destruction of any person that strays for the PC world they created.

Yes, this is important. After all, it's not like conservatives have any of their own standards. Better that they pretend to abide by someone else's. Even when they really don't.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Maher entered fame over 20 years ago by starting a show called Politically Incorrect. He's been inviting kooky conservatives on for decades with a platform for them to spew their silliness - especially without regard to political correctness. For anyone to say that this is a platform (PC) on which to play a political game against him is retarded bullshit. You can take out someone who takes on the left all you want, but the idiocy inherent in that is obvious - especially if you like criticism of the left and of PC, which Maher's a better exponent of than most anybody else. Talk about hoisting oneself by one's own petard.

Seeing Red said...

Commies do believe anyone to their right is fascist.

Of course, the Nazis were socialist.

Anti fa is Uncle Joe Stalin, they're ok with 35 million of their own dead. Gotta break some eggs, after all.

Jupiter said...

"Lots of slaveholders did."

According to genetic testing, one or two per cent.

The Cracker Emcee said...

"One does not blurt out the word nigger unless the blurter uses the word privately"

In my personal experience, absolutely true. I've known a truckload of White liberals who make all the right noises in PC company, but aren't a bit shy about saying "nigger" and making racist generalizations and jokes while among less judgemental folks. Not to pick on ARF, but he strikes me as exactly this type of liberal.

Jupiter said...

"I've known a truckload of White liberals who make all the right noises in PC company, but aren't a bit shy about saying "nigger" and making racist generalizations and jokes while among less judgemental folks."

In what sense are these people "liberals"?

Gospace said...

Jupiter said...
"Lots of slaveholders did."

According to genetic testing, one or two per cent.


I wouldn't call what the slaveholders did "dating.

Had an ancestral relative, not direct ancestor, have children with more then 20 slaves according to stories I've read. I've only been able to confirm 2. What did his father think of that? The father's will left him nothing, in writing, bequesting his inheritance to his legitimate son, and put in trust to be held by his brother to be used to educate the son. So while it happened, I don't think it was as common as many think. It didn't meet with societal approval.

James Smith said...

We need our comedians, Tim Allen has not been asked to comment.

Bad Lieutenant said...

We need our comedians

Do we? That's like saying we need our whores.

If you need to be exposed to humor, seek the society of witty people.

Bad Lieutenant said...

Not to pick on ARF, but he strikes me as exactly this type of liberal.

It's different for him/them. They mean well. They are ironic. They illustrate absurdity by being absurd. They illustrate the racism or the deplorables by demonstrating it.

YOU? You're fired.

William said...

We need our comedians. So true. I'm waiting to hear the first edgy joke about BLM, Nancy Pelosi, or Ahmad and his mighty clock.

Bad Lieutenant said...

Blogger rcocean said...
We "need our comedians". Really? No, ...

My only reaction to his house nigger comment was:

1) How weird that Sasse is talking about Nebraska farmers working their fields and Hollywood Bill Maher's reaction is to free associate to black slaves picking cotton. Yeah, I can understand a BLACK comedian doing that, but not a Rich Jewish Guy from Beverly Hills.


My only reaction to your comment is that AFAIK Maher is Catholic. As for "from," he may live in Beverly Hills, but I don't know if he was born there. But maybe you are more up on Bill Maher than I am.

Also, Malcolm X "house Negro/field Negro" dichotomy. But to be funnier he should have done it in dialect (i.e. "I'se a" not "I'm a").

Bad Lieutenant said...

Earnest Prole said...
Enjoy the world you made, lefties.

ThinkProgress is already expressing regret. You guys really taught the left a lesson this time.
6/3/17, 8:15 PM

Oh, Chuck, you're so deep, nobody even understands what you're trying to say anymore. I don't think this board is worthy of you.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

"Lots of slaveholders did."

According to genetic testing, one or two per cent.


In the new study, Dr. Gravel and his colleagues analyzed the DNA of 3,726 African-Americans who participated in three separate medical studies.

The scientists were able to pinpoint stretches of DNA in the subjects that originated on different continents. According to their calculations, the ancestors of the average African-American today were 82.1 percent African, 16.7 percent European and 1.2 percent Native American.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

So while it happened, I don't think it was as common as many think. It didn't meet with societal approval.

Are you fucking kidding me?

Slaveowners could beat and regularly kill their "property." No respectful Southerner was making a fuss about how the respectable planter down the road was fucking said property. Concubinage has a long, illustrious history among slaveowners from antiquity.

"God forgive us, but ours is a monstrous system and wrong and iniquity. Perhaps the rest of the world is as bad—this only I see. Like the patriarchs of our old men live all in one house with their wives and their concubines, and the mulattoes one sees in every family exactly resemble the white children—and every lady tells you who is the father of all the mulatto children in everybody's household, but those in her own she seems to think drop from the clouds, or pretends so to think.

Is there any piece of knowledge that conservatives just don't make up and pull from thin air?

Steve M. Galbraith said...

"My only reaction to your comment is that AFAIK Maher is Catholic".

Gosh, that's remarkable.

Maher is a vocal atheist. He's been one, if I recall correctly, since his late teens. He's 61.

Bad Lieutenant said...

Gahrie said...
Childlike beliefs don't hurt my feelings. If you had the slightest acquaintance with antifa, you'd know their greatest hatred is reserved for leftists who believe progress is possible through the existing political system

Which why they spend all of their time attacking Leftwing protests and public speakers...right?

6/3/17, 6:42 PM

The point is not what the Black Bloc does, it's who uses the Black Bloc. It's not that they go bongo in Berkeley, it's that Berkeley lets them.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

When a person signs up for a 23andMe genetic analysis, they can choose whether to make their data (with any identifying information removed) available for research. At the time when Mountain’s team compiled the database for their study, 23andMe had 500,000 customers, and about 80% of them had given their permission for their information to be used in that way. (Today, the company has about 800,000 customers.) That makes the data set used for the study “an order of magnitude bigger” than those usually used to examine population mixing, says Katarzyna Bryc, a population geneticist at 23andMe and lead author of the new paper.

The team started by looking at the average genetic ancestry of the three largest groups in the United States: European Americans, African-Americans, and Latinos. Those categories are based on how 23andMe customers defined themselves. But as you might expect in a country where different groups of people have been meeting and mixing for hundreds of years, the genetic lines between the groups are quite blurred.

“You see all of those different ancestries in each of these groups,” Bryc explains. The average African-American genome, for example, is 73.2% African, 24% European, and 0.8% Native American, the team reports online today in The American Journal of Human Genetics. Latinos, meanwhile, carry an average of 18% Native American ancestry, 65.1% European ancestry (mostly from the Iberian Peninsula), and 6.2% African ancestry.


GOOGLE can be your friend, too, American Conservative!

Bad Lieutenant said...

Steve, do you want a piece of this? Rcocean is a long-time anti-Semite on these boards, at least he is unfriendly to Jews. (Unfair, rc? Maybe you have your reasons but do I have the basic fact correct?)

As you probably know, anti-Semites don't let go because a Jew doesn't believe in Judaism, to them the disease is in the blood. So I simply wanted to inform Rcocean that Maher is not of Hebraic origin.

OK? Or do you need more on this?

Bad Lieutenant said...

Ritmo, what's your point with that? The intermarriage or interbreeding may have taken place well after 1865, in which case it would presumably not be objectionable to you. But since I just dinged Steve Galbraith for meddling with a conversation not involving him, perhaps I should shut up. I think it's a fair question though. Race-mixing was, I thought, a liberal goodthink now.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

As you probably know, anti-Semites don't let go because a Jew doesn't believe in Judaism, to them the disease is in the blood.

Thank the Inquisition's imposition of Limpieza de sangre for that one. Where one reason would no longer do, another was found.

I was listening to a broadcast the other day on cooking, when it was explained that the pervasiveness of pork in Spanish dishes originates from attempts to weed out the new Muslim and Jewish marranos from the supposed pure-bloods.

Bad Lieutenant said...

Yeah, we have much to thank Spain for. And yeah, they do kind of rock the ham test over there, but I do seem to find that in an awful lot of Europe there is pork centricity. The US distinctively and the Anglosphere generally seem to be pretty distinctive in their focus on beef.

I had imagined that those areas were poorer and smaller and less suited to the raising of beef cattle. Or something like that. Maybe it's that slaughtering a steer is a bigger commitment than killing a pig or sheep or goat. The further east you go the worse it gets.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Ritmo, what's your point with that? The intermarriage or interbreeding may have taken place well after 1865, in which case it would presumably not be objectionable to you.

Pardon me, but what frickin nonsense. Anti-miscegenation laws were rife in the south and taboos against it were commonplace everywhere else. Rape wasn't illegal within marriage (a relatively new concept, actually), let alone when done to a concubine. The tests show that black Americans with the most European ancestry are found in the north, which makes sense as they'd be the ones most likely to fit in (with lighter skin and less exclusion) and find it more natural to seek out opportunities among whites. The taboos - legal and otherwise - were on free-love race-mixing, not on the forced variety. White northern blacks have it within living memory to know if they'd had a legitimate white ancestor though, so that's not where the admixture generally originated.

Bad Lieutenant said...

Honestly I am now even more confused than when I posted that, and will let it go. With only this parting shot, that while it may all be rape structurally because the slave owner had the authority, when it comes to where the rubber meets the road, even a slave owner would probably be deterred by a slave girl who put up any sort of resistance i.e. squealing and crying and begging, inasmuch as there would probably be other slave girls who would see the advantages in consenting.

I figure this because I imagine, having never raped, that it would be hard for me to rape a chick even if I knew I would get away with it, because listening to her screaming and seeing the terror on her face would probably make my dick soft. Not to toot my own horn, but I prefer chicks who are begging for it, and I can get that.

So if you stereotype slave owners as psychos who are raping and dig that stuff, I'm wrong, but that probably was a minority and most slave-fucking slave owners, whether they regarded their slaves as human beings who happens to be under their control, or as property like cattle or fence posts, would probably not seek to injure their cattle or torment their fence posts.

This is all very complicated and becomes a big conversation and I can see easily being very wrong about all this. But rape qua rape, taking a woman without her consent, is not something that most people do. Whether the consent is sincere or valid may be another question.

Bad Lieutenant said...

Lol that wasn't really letting it go, was it? ;) Anyway, off to have some consensual sex with a willing woman, so check in with you later.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Even if it was a minority, that minority can spread quickly with enough raping. More women are raped than there are rapists, many more. Because they repeat-offend. Greatly.

I would hope most sane people find rape to be a total turn-off (apart from a bunch of women who are abnormally into power and dating psychopaths). But most people today I would think also find the idea of owning another person to be a total turn-off. Morals, moral sentiments, socially approved behaviors - all change. Sometimes quite quickly.

Birkel said...

What I most enjoy about the Leftist response to the Right's adoption of Leftist tactics:

The Leftists act like they can shame the Right back to some old standard. The Leftists pretend the Right does not understand game theory. The Leftists pretend that tit-for-tat is not the OPTIMAL strategy in a repeated game. The Leftists act like retaliation will hurt the Right instead of chastening the Left to stop their bull shit.

In an amazing consequence, the answer is ALWAYS that Leftists must accrue power and everybody else must always cede power. But only EVERY time.

Birkel said...

About that genetics conversation:
Given that it was announced that Egyptian pharaohs were more Caucasian that African, genetically, what does the percentage of identifiable Caucasian DNA do to prove rape here in America? I take no position on rape by slave owners. But there was trade and genetic mixing at the intersections of societies for all of human history.

Wouldn't everybody be surprised to find there was not a mixing of genetics?

Bruce Gee said...

D’Jango Unchained comes to mind, regarding the Malcolm X quote.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

I take no position on rape by slave owners.

I'm sure that for someone like you it's a very morally ambiguous thing.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Given that it was announced that Egyptian pharaohs were more Caucasian that African, genetically, what does the percentage of identifiable Caucasian DNA do to prove rape here in America?

American slaves were taken from WEST Africa, you doofus. Not Egypt. Geezus.

William said...

I'm not losing any sleep over poor "comedians" being targeted for un-PC behavior. What we are treated to as comedy these days is largely leftwing snark that attacks anything and everything to the right of Bernie. Sit back and enjoy the spectacle as the Left is made to live by its own rules (Griffen, Maher) with the additional special sauce of the left devouring its own (Maher). The enjoyment is enhanced is accompanied by a stiff jolt of whiskey.

whinehouse said...

The blogging of Ann Althouse is probably some of the best evidence of adulthood eroding.

Bad Lieutenant said...

Even if it was a minority, that minority can spread quickly with enough raping. More women are raped than there are rapists, many more. Because they repeat-offend. Greatly.

Okay...again assuming I had a point there...there may have been copious miscegenation in the Antebellum South. Doesn't mean the women were raped (i.e. forcibly), there could have been either negotiated consent or genuine attraction/affection.

The same probably obtains through history with any alpha or artificially/situationally empowered male having mass access to women-medieval lords with droit de seigneur, factory owners, studio executives with casting couches, Wilt Chamberlains, Jack Nicholsons, Donald Trumps...when massa is a star, you let him!

Anyway Jupiter said he thought 1-2%. You cited 16, 18% white genes in AfAm blacks. Then you said a few white slave owner rapists (or consent-negotiating slave-fuckers) could have done a lot of the siring. This is all actually not so contradictory. I also think the higher concentration of white DNA in Northern blacks is readily explained by more miscegenation in the North or the greater tendency of mixed blacks to move north.

Also does detail genetic analysis tell us whether a white ancestor was male or female? Or whether it was a pure white person mating with a pure black person or a quadroon breeding an octoroon?

Not that I have any idea how we got here...

But while here, even those nasty white American slave owners should get credit for one thing. The slaves were bred and increased. In Latin America and definitely in Araby, there was not so much miscegenation because mostly the slaves were killed, or worked to death, or segregated, or castrated, or in whatever way used up and not bred.

Humanity is messy.

Gospace said...

The Toothless Revolutionary said...
So while it happened, I don't think it was as common as many think. It didn't meet with societal approval.

Blah, blah, blah, blah....

Is there any piece of knowledge that conservatives just don't make up and pull from thin air?


What part of I have documented family history that shows the one son mixing it up with the slaves was disowned? Post 1865, when the southern states banned mixed marriages, I have documented ancestral family history of various white males living with and bearing children with blacks and mulattos. Rather openly, but sans marriage, since that was unlawful. But that family branch was prominent in the area they lived. And well to do. School teachers. doctors, lawyers... and apparently no one felt the urge to take them on. And in the first post war census, I see blacks, whites, and mulattos all with that family surname under the same roof, and clustered in houses next to each other.. The family matriarch apparently declared that if they were of her blood, they were her kin, despite their skin color. Don't know how peaceful it was under those roofs, but that continued through the next several censuses.

I'm sure what you described happened. But not everywhere. And certainly didn't meet with universal approval. The south was not monolithic in the treatment of slaves. From what I've read, slaves in Virginia were better off then slaves in Mississippi and Louisiana. Superficial reading; I don't dwell over it.

mockturtle said...

definitely in Araby, there was not so much miscegenation because mostly the slaves were killed, or worked to death, or segregated, or castrated, or in whatever way used up and not bred.

I think mostly they rounded them up and sold them to Western slave traders.

Bad Lieutenant said...

No, mock, they hunted in East Africa, as I think TTR was getting at.

Birkel said...

@ TTR

Your ability to twist and lie about anything anybody else posts is legend. Congratulations.

Bad Lieutenant said...

Well... Actually I do believe they got around. I seem to recall accounts of them raiding in Ireland believe it or not.