July 12, 2012

WaPo Fact Checker is "considering whether to once again take a deeper look at this, though it really feels like Groundhog Day again."

It's the old Romney-departure-from-Bain story:
There appears to be some confusion about how partnerships are structured and managed, or what SEC documents mean. (Just because you are listed as an owner of shares does not mean you have a managerial role.)
Why's everyone digging around in this again: "Millions of dollars of attack ads by the Obama campaign are hanging in the balance. "

ADDED: Here's how the Obama campaign is exploiting this story in email received at 8:07 pm this evening. The subject line is "Romney's Bain lie exposed":

The more everyone finds out about Mitt Romney's finances, the more questions they have. Perhaps that's why he's hiding as much as he thinks he can get away with.

Today, The Boston Globe reported that Romney was still running Bain Capital two years after he claims he left the firm, directly contradicting his campaign's denial that he was involved in deals that led to layoffs, bankruptcies, and American jobs getting shipped overseas.

It's a pattern of secrecy, and this is just the latest example of him trying to hide the truth from voters. There are a number of issues in play right now -- questions to which voters deserve answers:


1) Why won't Romney come clean about his taxes? He seems intent on being the first presidential nominee in over 30 years to keep his financial records hidden from the American people. Earlier this year, Governor Romney hedged when asked if he'd follow the precedent set by his own father, George Romney, and release multiple years of tax returns. After pressure from fellow Republicans, Romney released one year -- 2010 -- which raised many more questions that full disclosure would answer. Here's why that matters: Presidents make important decisions for this country, and Americans ought to know the motivations behind those decisions.

2) Who are the secret supporters raising millions for his campaign? I'm not talking about the shadowy outside groups -- I'm talking about the people in charge of raising money for Romney's campaign and the Republican Party. Romney refuses to reveal his fundraising "bundlers," something even George W. Bush did when he ran for president. Why is that important? Because we'd never know whether these "bundlers" were getting special consideration in decisions made in a Romney White House.

3) What's up with this corporation in Bermuda? One of the Romneys' assets revealed in his 2010 tax returns is a corporation that had previously been transferred to a blind trust the day before he took office as governor. The single year of taxes he's released shows that at some point it was moved back into Romney's sole ownership. What's going on? And, crucially, what's the purpose of having a corporation in a known tax haven like Bermuda in the first place?

4) Why did he have a Swiss bank account? Even his closest allies, like Republican House Speaker John Boehner, can't explain why any American running for president would have ever kept his money in a secretive Swiss bank account.


5) When exactly did he stop running Bain? Today's Globe story sheds light on the two years he now claims he wasn't running the firm. According to legal documents Mitt Romney signed and filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission, he was the sole owner, chairman of the board, CEO, and president of Bain Capital, drawing a salary as an executive until late 2001, and legally responsible for decisions the company made until that time. The Romney campaign denies this report is true, but the SEC documents with Gov. Romney's signature are hard to refute. If he was in charge, it means his role in deals that led to layoffs, bankruptcies, and outsourcing is much deeper than he has admitted to date.

Please forward this email and share this with everyone you know who cares about the outcome of this election.

Everyone deserves the right to judge for themselves whether Romney's motivations, experience, and perspective are what they want in a president. But Mitt Romney doesn't want people to have the information they need to make those judgments.

More to come,

Stephanie

Stephanie Cutter
Deputy Campaign Manager
Obama for America

153 comments:

SteveR said...

The Obama campaign couldn't care less about the truth of this issue. Just keep throwing it out there.

Andy R. said...

What America is looking for right now is a shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties, unclear corporate relationships, money stashed in various foreign bank accounts and who refuses to release his tax returns.

MadisonMan said...

Well, I don't really care if he was running it then or not. But I'm sure political ad-makers do. And I guess that's what's important?

chickelit said...

Sorry Andy ol' boy, but Baingate is boring.

rehajm said...

Ned Ryerson ??!!!!

Patrick said...

As Andy notes, we are to care more about what Romney does with his money than what the President does with ours.

As he further demonstrates, the campaign against Romney will consist of innuendo, unproven charges, repeated enough that many ignorant people will buy it. As Andy further demonstrates.

Jaske said...

Andy forgot religious nut and racist, but I'll let it slide.

Andy R. said...

This New Yorker article does a good job of describing the tension between Mitt "Scrooge McDuck Vulture Capitalist" Romney and Mitt "Presidential Candidate" Romney:
ROMNEY AND BAIN CAPITAL: THE SECRECY IS KILLING HIM

The weird thing is that it seems oddly counterproductive for Romney to maintain this wall of secrecy and obfuscation and deceit, because that is what is causing this drip drip steady stream of articles trying to understand even the most basic details about Romney's business scheming.

chickelit said...

Andy R. said...
What America is looking for right now is a shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties, unclear corporate relationships, money stashed in various foreign bank accounts and who refuses to release his tax returns.

What Andy is looking for right now is a dead girl or a live boy in a hotel room. Of course he would applaud the latter.

leslyn said...

Uh oh. WaPo. Romney looks like a sad puppy/dog in that picture.

YoungHegelian said...

@AndyR

"shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties...unclear corporate relationships"

Actually, not. For someone who's in a high-roller position, what Romeny was involved in was pretty standard. One can hold large amounts of stock without executive input, as the WaPo article states.

"money stashed in various foreign bank accounts..."

There is absolutely nothing illegal about this. Every family of mutual funds has a "foreign companies fund" so that people can invest in fast growing foreign markets. Millions of Americans invest their savings in funds like this every day. Why is what Romney did any different?

And that's not quite right about the tax returns. he has released what is required by law. (see here. I see no reason why he is morally bound to help the Democrats with their fishing expedition. Do you?

damikesc said...

Its odd given that this was investigated when he ran for Governor.

Apparently, Obama is a Bain Truther. Romney should ignore it. As Bush saw with AWOL, no evidence is enough.

machine said...

Mitt Romney: I was paid $100K a year to be the Chairman, CEO, and President of Bain, but I was not responsible for anything bad that it did...

Convenient...

Beta Rube said...

Romney has made the terrible mistake of having a real job and being a success.

Andy and the Obama worshipers prefer unemployable Community Organizers (who were apparently sick the day they taught economics).

EMD said...

Success is failure.

War is peace.

campy said...

Mitt Romney: I was paid $100K a year to be the Chairman, CEO, and President of Bain, but I was not responsible for anything bad that it did...

Barack Obama: I'm being paid $400K a year to be the President of the US, but Bush is responsible for everything bad that I'm doing...

bgates said...

What America is looking for right now is a shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties, unclear corporate relationships, money stashed in various foreign bank accounts and who refuses to release his tax returns.

There was one in the Hamptons just last weekend.

trumpetdaddy said...

Those internal Obama polls must be really bad if they are going to this level of absurdity in bloody July, when no normal, non-political American is even paying attention.

That speech yesterday in Houston that Romney gave must have moved some needles in the data, because the hysteria from the Obama campaign and the media (BIRM) is hilarious today.

edutcher said...

When the WaPo has to revisit an old story, the numbers must be really going south.

Witness the WaPo's own poll that says the Romster leads Choom by 15 among independents in a sample weighted D-33/R-24.

Andy R. said...

What America is looking for right now is a shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties, unclear corporate relationships, money stashed in various foreign bank accounts and who refuses to release his tax returns.

As opposed to the shady and secretive small c communist and hack politico with murky business ties like Tony Rezko, unclear corporate relationships like Goldman Sachs, money acquired because he was connected to the Chicago machine and who refuses to release his health records or academic transcripts?

That guy?

machine said...

Mitt Romney: I was paid $100K a year to be the Chairman, CEO, and President of Bain, but I was not responsible for anything bad that it did...

See the above retort.

Chef Mojo said...

Poor hatboy is all butt hurt because there's no there, there.

This is the sort of minutiae that gets lost in the campaign. When the little black god brings it up, all Romney has to do is call him a liar, which he's starting to do on other subjects.

Obama makes the accusation. Romney calls him out for the little liar he his. Works for me! Since Obambi has blown every ounce of credibility as far as independents go, his Bain accusations are about as useless as a limp dick in a whorehouse.

Need me to explain that one to you, hatboy?

Michael said...

There is plent of evidence that Romney was out when he said he was out. SEC filings have a way of bein accurate and Bain clearly did not list him post his departure as having any management role.

Andy R. said...

This is the sort of minutiae that gets lost in the campaign.

Another Poll Shows Bain Attacks Are Working

One of the more fascinating aspects of the Althouse commenter crew is how out of touch some of you are. This is most apparent to me when it comes to gay rights, where it's not so much a matter of people being right or wrong, but people having no idea what is going on in America.

I think this Romney Scrooge McDuck vulture capitalism issue is another example of people here being out of touch. I'm not sure why people were deluded enough to think a politician whose primary (only?) selling point was a secretive career getting unfathomably wealthy with sneaky and suspicious business dealings would make a good candidate in this climate.

Erika said...

Those internal Obama polls must be really bad if they are going to this level of absurdity in bloody July, when no normal, non-political American is even paying attention.

Word. I read political news and opinion every day and I can't muster up a giveacrap about Bain whatever.

Andy Freeman said...

> Mitt Romney: I was paid $100K a year to be the Chairman, CEO, and President of Bain, but I was not responsible for anything bad that it did...

If we were talking about a $100k do-nothing public employee do-nothing jobs ....

However, since this is his money, I can see why folks are concerned.

FWIW, $100k is the going rate for a mid-level engineer in Silicon Valley. Do you folks really think that working CEOs at successful private equity firms have salaries that low?

Larry J said...

Andy R. said...
What America is looking for right now is a shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties, unclear corporate relationships, money stashed in various foreign bank accounts and who refuses to release his tax returns.


Or

What America has right now is a shady and secretive president with murky political connections, unclear personal relationships, a fabricated past, tax money poured on political cronies and campaign bundlers and who refuses to release any information about his past.

I care far more about than than Romney's financial matters. Obama is the worst kind of crook and liar.

John said...

Lying about his political opponents and hiding his own past has always worked for 'the one' before... why not try again?

Tim said...

"What America is looking for right now is a shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties, unclear corporate relationships, money stashed in various foreign bank accounts and who refuses to release his tax returns."

It is a risible act of extreme hubris for the extremely out of touch to declare what America is, or is not, looking for.

Kinda like gay guys telling other guys what to look for in a woman.

As if...

John said...

Bain attacks are working...
Bain attacks are working...
Bain attacks are working...
On the count of three you will wake and remember nothing.

Jay said...

There appears to be some confusion about how partnerships are structured and managed, or what SEC documents mean.

Translation:

The facts aren't on the side of the left, so they'll lie with impunity.

Beta Rube said...

Wow, I was just going over Obama's college transcripts...oh wait, sorry, my bad.

bgates said...

people having no idea what is going on in America

So vote for the guy who thinks the private sector's doing fine.

You know what Barack Obama's most influential supporters call a visit to George Clooney's Lake Como palace? "Slumming".

Jay said...

Andy R. said...
What America is looking for right now is a shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties, unclear corporate relationships, money stashed in various foreign bank accounts and who refuses to release his tax returns.


Yes!!!

I mean, what you said is like so accurate!

Really, it is!

dbp said...

The same guy convinced that Romney is a crook is also convinced by nebulous polling data. quelle surprise.

Jay said...

Andy R. said...


One of the more fascinating aspects of the Althouse commenter crew is how out of touch some of you are


HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

Says the mentally disordered homo who's daily "in touch" reading consists of left wing blogs.

You're the voice of "the people" silly boy!

You are!

bgates said...

It's slightly irritating (though completely in character) for all of young Andrew's criticisms to be lies.

On the other hand, it's funny to think that even if they were all true, Romney would still be the better choice by a wide margin.

The Democrats can't even make up a villain half as bad as their real guy.

Jay said...

Andy R. said...
I'm not sure why people were deluded enough to think a politician whose primary (only?) selling point was a secretive


And, you're so "In touch" that you have not the foggiest clue as to what Mitt Romney did at Bain capital or elsewhere.

But hey, the ads are working!

Really, they are!

DADvocate said...

(Just because you are listed as an owner of shares does not mean you have a managerial role.)

Duh. Incredibly sad that this needs explaining. I guess when you have idiots like Andy R out there you should bring the discussion down to pre-school level though.

"Shady and secretive" describes the most transparent presidency in history of Barack Fuckin' Obama. Being real open about Fast and Furious for starters. Encourages thuggish behavior. Blacks with billy clubs at the polls are OK, but ask for an ID? OH, NO!!

Yeah, I want a president who's never made an honest dollar in a real job and has no clue about the economy instead of a man who has a long record of success in private industry and public service.

Jaske said...

I'm not sure why Andy keeps using the "Scrooge McDuck" description, comparing Romney to an animated Disney stereotype is silly.

Jay said...

Quinnipiac survey shows married voters prefer Romney, 51% to 38%. And, Obama losing ground with single women from 2008.

Obama attracting just 29 percent of non-college white men.

Note, Obama is down with every demographic being polled from 2008.

Synova said...

I'm not sure why "Scrooge McDuck" is an insult.

garage mahal said...

After seeing 25 yrs worth of tax records Romney handed over to him in vetting VP candidates, it's no wonder McCain chose Palin over Romney. That didn't stop Willard from trying again though. I wonder if he'll run again?

Synova said...

The fellow took his three nephews into this home, after all.

I particularly remember the comic book where all of his money went to everyone else and he was poor and everyone quit working. No one was at the grocery store to sell food; no one was at the gas station to sell gas; everything just shut down. Everyone had bunches of money but no one could buy anything with it.

chickelit said...

Jaske said...
I'm not sure why Andy keeps using the "Scrooge McDuck" description, comparing Romney to an animated Disney stereotype is silly.

It is odd. Why not just go for the original Dickensian character? My theory is that "Scrooge" reminds Andy of "dirty" sex somehow and the "McDuck" part sounds vaguely anti-corporate--sort of like "Chimpy McHaliburton" did. It must resonate at OWS circle jerks.

Coketown said...

What America is looking for right now is a shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties, unclear corporate relationships, money stashed in various foreign bank accounts and who refuses to release his tax returns.

But why bring John Corzine, Rahm Emmanuel, Elizabeth Warren, David Axelrod, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, into this? For fucks sakes, put a list of investment bank board members next to a list of Democratic politicians and nobody could tell the difference.

Fen said...

Oh cool... because I don't know what to believe... unless it has "fact check" in the accreds. Then it must be true, yes?

Curious George said...

"Chef Mojo said...
Poor hatboy is all butt hurt because there's no there, there."

Don't jump to conclusions. It might just be because Andy is a bottom.

Fen said...

Andy R. I'm not sure why people were deluded enough to think a politician whose primary (only?) selling point was a secretive -

Still waiting on Obama's transcripts, records, etc...

Fen said...

No, Andy has to be parody of a self-loathing biggoted gay

bagoh20 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
bagoh20 said...

Go for it dudes. You're having a great year. What could go wrong with another poorly thought-out plan.

If the Obama campaign said that Romney would make a great President, THEN I would have substantial doubts about the man - even about his very existence.

Sigivald said...

Synova said (About the FAR MORE IMPORTANT issue of Scrooge McDuck economics): I particularly remember the comic book where all of his money went to everyone else and he was poor and everyone quit working. No one was at the grocery store to sell food; no one was at the gas station to sell gas; everything just shut down. Everyone had bunches of money but no one could buy anything with it.

Well, very rapidly they'd just see an inflationary effect, or a vast influx of labor he hadn't made exaggeratedly wealthy, who'd provide the services he'd just made it not worth their while to provide.

Alternatively, if immigration was prohibited, demand for services would rapidly bid up prices, effectively causing roughly uniform massive inflation throughout Duckburg.

(See, this is a million times more important than Andy's babbling. We can actually learn some Economics here!)

edutcher said...

Andy R. said...

This is the sort of minutiae that gets lost in the campaign.

Another Poll Shows Bain Attacks Are Working


Yeah, a whole 2 points, according to Gallup, who also says the ones in the swing states that favor Choom are less enthusiastic.

And linking an article that features a poll with a split of D-33/R-24 isn't exactly going to scare anybody.

PS Fen, Jay,

don't be too hard on Hatman - he has a terrible ailment.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

The weird thing is that it seems oddly counterproductive for Romney to maintain this wall of secrecy and obfuscation and deceit,

Just because you aren't capable of understanding something as complicated as how Partnerships and LLCs are structured or how corporate governance works doesn't mean it is a wall of secrecy. It just means you don't have the ability or willingness to understand.

Being a large or even majority share holder in a partnership or LLC doesn't make you the executive in charge.

Shanna said...

Mitt Romney: I was paid $100K a year to be the Chairman, CEO, and President of Bain, but I was not responsible for anything bad that it did... when I wasn't running it.

IF people are having trouble understanding 'even the most basic details about Romney's business scheming' maybe it is because they are stupid.
v

Sigivald said...

Fen: Half of the "wow" factor of Fact Checker (WaPo) and FactCheck.org siding with Romney is that they're not exactly biased in his favor, typically.

I've normally found FactCheck.org to be neutral or very-slightly-left, and the WaPo Fact Checker has been dinged by the right plenty of times, in my experience.

So that's meaningful, that they're coming out and saying this is Not A Thing without any weaseling.

Michael K said...

"The weird thing is that it seems oddly counterproductive for Romney to maintain this wall of secrecy "

Only in your mind, hat boy. Only in your mind.

garage mahal said...

If the Obama campaign said that Romney would make a great President,

I wonder how many people truly feel that Romney would make a great president? 17%? That's if they were answering honestly of course. Romney is feeling the the full on frontal assault from the Obama campaign right now. It took Romney three weeks to even begin to respond to the battering Bain ads running in the rust belt. They got caught flat footed from attacks made on Romney almost two decades ago.

How did this guy make 250 million dollars? I bet every righty feels like vomiting today, and I don't blame them.

edutcher said...

Hey, garage, nothing like making up your own poll responses.

Michael K said...

"There is absolutely nothing illegal about this. Every family of mutual funds has a "foreign companies fund" so that people can invest in fast growing foreign markets. Millions of Americans invest their savings in funds like this every day. Why is what Romney did any different?"

The stupid Democrats (There have to be other Democrats) passed a bill they call FATCA and the Swiss have reacted by kicking out all American citizen accounts even they are Swiss residents. Smoot Hawley had the same idea. Fortress America. Only the fortress is keeping us in, not out.

If Obama, by some ill chance, be re-elected expect lots of surrendered citizenship.

Michael K said...

"people having no idea what is going on in America. "

You certainly don't.

bagoh20 said...

"I wonder how many people truly feel that Romney would make a great president?"

I'm sure a lot of people either disagree with or are not satisfied with his politics, but as to being competent to be President, he's extremely well qualified by any measure, and everyone knows it.

He may even get Michelle's vote.

Michael K said...

"That didn't stop Willard from trying again though. I wonder if he'll run again?"

Yeah, for re-election.

bagoh20 said...

"How did this guy make 250 million dollars?"

The old fashioned way: He earrrrrrned it.

I don't know if it's true, but I heard yesterday that although his non-college-educated dad
made a fortune from nothing and left it to Mitt, that he then gave most of it away and started from relative scratch. If that's true, it's a very impressive qualification to me. Does anyone know if it's true?

Coketown said...

Ah! OMG! I just love GM's new picture! (Is it new? Surely that quality of irony doesn't go unnoticed for long!) It's just dripping with condescension! I mean, if there's one thing worth sneering at, it's patriotic imagery! O how the Left adores this country! That must be why Democrats haven't lost any seats in congress since Obama's glorious election! The Left just can't hide the deep adoration it feels for this nation--and believe me, we notice.

Blessings!

Jay said...

garage mahal said...
Romney is feeling the the full on frontal assault from the Obama campaign right now...
How did this guy make 250 million dollars?


HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

The election is in November, and few people are paying attention.

Also note: Romney is raising more than he's spending and Obama is spending more than he's raising.

Gee, which person made $250 million?

PS: Obama remains effectively tied with Romney in every major poll out in recent days -- Gallup, Rasmussen, ABC, CNN/Opinion Research, Washington Times -- in spite of the fact that the Obama campaign has massively outspent the Romney campaign so far

Idiot.

Matthew Sablan said...

So, is this going to be a false but accurate thing? I hear that's a thing fact checkers can claim now. Also: True but false. Poor fact checkers; burned all their credibility trying to protect those in political power, now they realize that some bridges are just too far, even for them.

Well, maybe next time the fact checkers in journalism can be real fact checkers all the time. It's unfortunate they had to learn the left sees them as a tool and that's it. But, hey, live and learn.

Jay said...

PS Fen, Jay,

don't be too hard on Hatman - he has a terrible ailment.


Yep.

That was a good article!

Paul said...

"I wonder how many people truly feel that Romney would make a great president?"

Jeez he only has to be a mediocre president to be a huge upgrade from the current destroyer in chief.

Simply not belonging to the Cloward Piven camp is enough to get my vote.

yashu said...

Half of the "wow" factor of Fact Checker (WaPo) and FactCheck.org siding with Romney is that they're not exactly biased in his favor, typically.

Exactly, Sigivald.

I don't understand. Did Andy & Garage here miss out on the salient fact that the WaPo fact checker corroborates Romney and dismisses the Obama campaign's slander?

And yeah, it's undeniable that for the Obama campaign to accuse Romney of "felony" (now he's not just an offshorer, but a felon!) is clearly slander. Not that I'm surprised-- this is just the kind of thing I expect from the Obama campaign.

Doesn't matter if it's a false or groundless accusation. All that matters is its efficacy-- confusing and deceiving enough voters about Romney for Obama to win.

ddh said...

George Mahal said

I wonder how many people truly feel that Romney would make a great president? 17%?

The real question, George, is how many people think that Romney will make a better president than Obama. That hurdle isn't very high, and I think even Jimmy Carter (!) could surpass the One.

Synova said...

"Also note: Romney is raising more than he's spending and Obama is spending more than he's raising."

Something about this statement deserves a second and third look.

Revenant said...

Its a sad day for the Democrats when even the Washington Post is calling them a pack of liars.

Henry said...

The most interesting thing about that fact check is how it highlights the suddenness in Romney's decision to salvage the Salt Lake Olympics.

I'm sure he had ulterior motives that Andy R. can tease out for us (this'll look good on my resume) but the story is still one of a sudden, personal decision to respond to a crisis.

I'm sure that garage will enlighten us as to the fact that Romney saved the Olympics by getting Federal money, but boys, your attacks on Romney are really dull potatoes. The interesting thing is how quickly Romney made that decision and what it says about his personality.

p.s. Now Crack will tell us the Mormon church ordered him home. Oy veh.

Jay said...

Synova,

Check out this article.

Obama's campaign has 700 full time employees!

Henry said...

Andy R. -- You do realize that the New Yorker article you linked to leads with the Boston Globe report that WaPo debunks?

Maybe you should just stick with blind assertions.

yashu said...

I'm no oracle, but from what I've so far come to know about Romney, I'd say that yes, IMHO he has the potential to be a great POTUS.

Not the kind of POTUS with messianic rhetoric who'll consult with historians to find out what kind of things he should do and what slogans he should use to be deemed a "great POTUS"-- aiming to appear visionary/ unprecedented/ historic. As Obama has done.

But the kind of POTUS who's eager to get to the task at hand-- not the campaign or the victory but the challenging work of POTUS-- and will do his best, given his skills and competency and resolve, to fulfill what the job of POTUS at this moment in time calls for-- making decisions for the sake of the country, not for the sake of his "legacy" or the adulation of the MSM, liberal academic intelligentsia, bien pensant political class, etc.

tim in vermont said...

Personally, if Romney could run both Bain and the Winter Olympics at the same time, then, as far as I am concerned, he should be declared president by acclamation.

jr565 said...

machine wrote:
Mitt Romney: I was paid $100K a year to be the Chairman, CEO, and President of Bain, but I was not responsible for anything bad that it did...

Convenient...

Barack Obama: I was elected president and have run the country for almost four years, but am not responsible for anything bad that happened. It's all George Bush's fault.



Convenient...


(actually looks like someone posted something very similar.)

Jay said...

Ha Ha Ha Ha David Gergen on CNN saying that several Democrats are telling him this attack is a bad idea.

And he referenced FactCheck.org

JohnJ said...

WaPo:
UPDATE: Fortune obtained the offering documents for a Bain Capital Fund circulating in June 2000, as well as a fund in 2001. None of the documents show that Romney was listed as being among the “key investment professionals.” As Fortune put it, “the contemporaneous Bain documents show that Romney was indeed telling the truth about no longer having operational input at Bain -- which, one should note, is different from no longer having legal or financial ties to the firm.”

Ahem!

garage mahal said...

Ha Ha Ha Ha David Gergen on CNN saying that several Democrats are telling him this attack is a bad idea.

And he referenced FactCheck.org


CNN and Factcheck.org.

Okay then.

That's like 10,000 people

Calm the fuck down!

We got this. I can just feel it!

Old Dad said...

The hysterical lefties hyping this nonstory don't know shit about corporate governance. When this idiocy comes crashing and burning down around them, and it will, they'll be glad that they tried this asshattery in the middle of the silly season.

Know how I know for dead solid certain that this one is DOA. Excitable Andrew Sullivan is suggesting that it could be "the turning point" in this election.

Game, set, match Romney.

elkh1 said...

Whatever Romney did, he did not use my money. He did not give billions of taxpayers' money to his crony billionaires: Kaiser, Soros, Buffett, to name a very few.

He did not send my money to Finland to make electric cars, or to China to setup GM factories, or give Chrysler to the Italians.

Revenant said...

Garage used to be better at this routine, didn't he? Maybe I'm just feeling nostalgiac. :)

Quaestor said...

Synova wrote:
I'm not sure why "Scrooge McDuck" is an insult.

When I was a tyke I really enjoyed those "Uncle Scrooge" comic books published by Goldkey. My friends all liked Superman, Batman, the X-Men, and especially your friendly neighborhood Spider-Man, while I had little patience for the idea of flying without wings or engines, tunneling through the Earth, throwing whole planets, and super powers generally. (Though I did buy the Fantastic Four, my guilty pleasure)

"A book about talking animals - ha-HA!" they taunted. To which I replied, more likely than a man gaining all the powers of a spider through the agency of a radioactive spider bite without acquiring any arachnoid anatomical features, or words accessible to the eight year old mind to that effect. When Superman faces a problem he applies his "super strength" or his "super breath" or his "x-ray vision". When Scrooge McDuck faces a problem he applies money (his money, mind you) and brains, much like any successful real-life entrepreneur.

Also I noticed that those miraculous parthenogenetic ducklings -- Huey, Dewey, Louie and Kabloowie (originally four, but one self-destructed explosively) -- were safer and better educated under the care of Unca Scrooge than while in the hands of the "other uncle", that raging control freak with anger issues and a severe speech pathology*. I think Disney invented Scrooge McDuck just to give the boys a decent home life. He taught his charges the virtues of hard work, determination and thrift. Not bad in my book, and sorely needed in our next president if we're to survive as a nation.

So askewhatguy, go ahead and use "Scrooge McDuck" as a nickname for Mitt Romney. In fact, I welcome it. And I'll continue to use Obama's well-earned nickname, i.e. that intellectual fraud and closet socialist, if you don't mind.

*It's well-known to the cognocenti that Donald Duck (USN Machinist Mate 2nd Class, retired) acquired his impediment on April 12-13, 1945. Duck was serving aboard the Porter-class destroyer USS George W. Canvasback (one of three USN ships crewed exclusively by talking anatidates), on radar picket duty 60 miles north of Okinawa, when the ship came under attack by Japanese kamikazes. MM Duck manned (or it is ducked?) his battle station, the midships twin Bofors 40mm, damaging or destroying at least seven Zeros. He stayed at his battle station 36 hours without relief or sleep, sometimes operating the gun mount solo. For his gallant action MM Duck was awarded the Navy Cross. Unfortunately MM Duck became one of the hidden wounded, afflicted by PTSD for the rest of his life; his operatic tenor voice lost forever.

Bruce Hayden said...

Like this: Romney camp: Obama's staff 'out-of-control'

"President Obama's campaign hit a new low today when one of its senior advisers made a reckless and unsubstantiated charge to reporters about Mitt Romney that was so over the top that it calls into question the integrity of their entire campaign," Mr. Rhoades said in a statement. "President Obama ought to apologize for the out-of-control behavior of his staff, which demeans the office he holds. Campaigns are supposed to be hard fought, but statements like those made by Stephanie Cutter belittle the process and the candidate on whose behalf she works."

Ms. Cutter is a long-time political operative who worked for Sen. Edward M. Kennedy, worked for Sen. John Kerry's campaign in 2004 and now works for Mr. Obama.

Gahrie said...

I'm just glad that Romney doesn't have any divorce records to be unsealed.

Synova said...

Quaestor, that was brilliant. :-D

Michael K said...

"We got this. I can just feel it!"

Just like you felt the Walker takedown. It took you couple of weeks to reappear. In November, I expect we won't hear from you for a month.

Paul Zrimsek said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
bgates said...

I wonder how many people truly feel that Romney would make a great president?

There's a school of thought that says Presidential greatness isn't simply a quality of the man, it must be revealed through reaction to a crisis.

Which means at least that Romney will have plenty of opportunities to be great, given the tremendous number of catastrophes he's going to inherit from the feckless Obama administration.

Phil 3:14 said...

And I hear he is a member of the Trilateral Commission !

ddh said...

And I hear Romney is one of the Illuminati and a member of the Bilderberg Group, and he is the secret leader of Opus Dei. I'm sure Lyndon LaRouche is available to consult with the Obama campaign.

edutcher said...

Quaestor said...

I'm not sure why "Scrooge McDuck" is an insult.

When I was a tyke I really enjoyed those "Uncle Scrooge" comic books published by Goldkey.


And, before 1963, published by Dell, Ann's sister.

bagoh20 said...

I think people will have very little problem with Romney's Mormonism despite how strange some of the teaching is, but I wonder how people would feel about a Scientologist.

AMDG said...

For Libtards lies and hypocrisy in the pursuit of power are not only acceptable, they are considered sacraments.

gk1 said...

This is a mistake for obama but I am overjoyed to see it. I think they learned the wrong lesson about the "swiftboating" of Kerry in 2004. Throwing easily debunked slander from your campaign team is a sign of weakness not toughness. After this blows up in their face they will try a less direct slander. They are so shrill so early. Are the internals really that bad? This is "Der Undertag" bad

Bruce Hayden said...

This is a mistake for obama but I am overjoyed to see it. I think they learned the wrong lesson about the "swiftboating" of Kerry in 2004. Throwing easily debunked slander from your campaign team is a sign of weakness not toughness.

Probably because the Swift Boat claims could not be debunked, no matter how hard their allies in the MSM tried. Plus, the claims were somewhat bolstered by Kerry's anti-war actions shortly after his service in Vietnam. And, our "war hero" candidate, almost eight years later, has not released his military records, despite making multiple promises to do so (most likely, I think, because those records would probably show that he was terminated from the Navy either for failure to serve his reserve duty, and/or for conduct unbecoming an officer).

Jake Diamond said...

Another day, another set of lies from serial liar Mitt Romney.

It looks like Romney is becoming the new Dick Nixon.

Roger J. said...

From a purely tactical point of view, this type of slander is best employed in Mid October. I do think that Mr Obama's campaign staff is incompetent.

tim in vermont said...

Jake,
Dale Carnegie used to say that the listener associates the words that a speaker uses to describe another with the speaker himself more than the he does the target.
- TiV

Rusty said...

Revenant said...
Garage used to be better at this routine, didn't he? Maybe I'm just feeling nostalgiac. :)


Yeah. He's just phoning it in now. Not as funny as when he was chewing on the scenery.


And the " He's rich so he must have stolen some of that from me." envy is never a pretty thing.

Rusty said...

Jaske said...
I'm not sure why Andy keeps using the "Scrooge McDuck" description, comparing Romney to an animated Disney stereotype is silly.


It's because Andys interior life is an animated cartoon complete with sound effects.

Rusty said...

Synova wrote:
I'm not sure why "Scrooge McDuck" is an insult



What's funny in kind of a sad way is that the inhabitants of the left side of the bell curve really believe that people with a lot of money have a room in their house were they keep it hidden.

Jake Diamond said...

Tim,
I don't give a damn about anything salesman Dale Carnegie said. However I am amused to see Republicans scramble to explain away Romney's truckload of lies.

Tank said...

campy said...
Mitt Romney: I was paid $100K a year to be the Chairman, CEO, and President of Bain, but I was not responsible for anything bad that it did...

Barack Obama: I'm being paid $400K a year to be the President of the US, but Bush is responsible for everything bad that I'm doing...


Comment of the year.

Listen. Zero has been lying, distorting and misleading all of his political life. His campaign, his white house staff, his friends in media continue to do the same for him.

I saw part of O'Reilly last night, and he had on a rep from the NAACP. The guy lied over and over for ten minutes non-stop and never shut up. The most remarkable lying fillibuster I've ever seen on O'Reilly. The perfect Zero representative.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...


CNN and Factcheck.org.

Okay then.

That's like 10,000 people


What the hell is this drivel even supposed to mean?

Note that you're entirely uninterested in the facts of the matter.

Chuck66 said...

Andy says:
“What America is looking for right now is a shady and secretive businessman with murky business ties, unclear corporate relationships, money stashed in various foreign bank accounts and who refuses to release his tax returns.”

Change “businessman” to “Jew banker” and reread Andy’s post. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Jake Diamond said...

Jay,
The Romney campaign doesn't want to discuss the facts of the matter. The facts of the matter show that Romney is lying.

The best option for the Romney campaign is to continue to filibuster while demanding apologies. For Team Romney, fake outrage and concealment of the relevant facts is the best defense.

Jake Diamond said...

Change “businessman” to “Jew banker”

Republican party supporters get uglier and dumber every year.

Chuck66 said...

Jake, the Democrats hatred of "secretive greedy businessmen" is right out of their playbook from 70-80 years ago when they went on rants about how Jew businessmen secretly control the banks, department stores, etc.

There are web sites today like Jew Watch which devote much space to the evil Koch Brothers.

Jay said...

Jake Diamond said...
Jay,
The Romney campaign doesn't want to discuss the facts of the matter. The facts of the matter show that Romney is lying.


Only someone as stupid as you would type that in a thread which links to the Washington Post fact checker pointing out that Romney is not lying.

Bravo!

Jay said...

The facts of the matter show that Romney is lying.

You can produce no one iota of evidence for this idiotic claim.

Jake Diamond said...

Jake, the Democrats hatred of "secretive greedy businessmen" is right out of their playbook from 70-80 years ago when they went on rants about how Jew businessmen secretly control the banks, department stores, etc.

Bullshit.

Jake Diamond said...

You can produce no one iota of evidence for this idiotic claim.

It's not an idiotic claim, and there's plenty of evidence to support it.

You must have pretty damn poor reading comprehension if you think the Washington Post article concludes that Romney isn't lying.

Here's just one example from the article that proves Romney has been lying:

In 2011, Romney, as a presidential candidate, filed a public financial disclosure form, under pain of perjury, that stated:

“Mr. Romney retired from Bain Capital on February 11, 1999 to head the Salt Lake Organizing Committee. Since February 11, 1999, Mr. Romney has not had any active role with any Bain Capital entity and has not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way.”


The same article lists evidence of Romney's involvement in the operation of Bain Capital entities between 1999 and 2002:

[W]e have identified at least six filings that Romney did sign during this period: a April 13,, 1999 13D filing by Pirod Holdings regarding an investment in Rohn Industries; a Jan. 3, 2000 13D filing by VMM Merger Corp. regarding an investment in VDI MultiMedia; a Feb. 14, 2000 13G filing by Bain Capital Fund IV regarding Wesley Jessen Visioncare; a Feb. 13, 2001 13G filing by Bain Capital Fund VI regarding Integrated Circuit Systems; a Feb. 14, 2001 13G filing by Bain Capital Fund VI regarding ChipPAC; and a November 12, 1999 13G filing (first reported by Mother Jones) by Bain Capital Fund VI regarding Stericycle.

From this it's readily apparent that Romney is guilty of perjury.

There are plenty of other holes in the Romney-Bain deceit (such as his "retirement" salary, awarded prior to his retirement), but I'll give you a chance to try to rationalize why Romney's lies aren't really lies. It should be fun watching you squirm.

Jay said...


From this it's readily apparent that Romney is guilty of perjury.


Dummy:

You missed this part:

"The part about lying to the SEC is absurd"

Now why do you think you did that?

Jay said...

You must have pretty damn poor reading comprehension if you think the Washington Post article concludes that Romney isn't lying.


Dummy, you missed this part:

Fact Check to Obama Camp: Your Complaint is All Wet


Now why do you think you did that?

Jay said...

has not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way.”


Nothing you posted indicated Romney was involved in the operations of Bain Capital.

Bain partner Steve Pagliuca - a DEMOCRAT - tells CNN: Mitt Romney left for Olympics 2/1999 and "has had absolutely no involvement"

Note: your utter cluelessness and gullibility does not mean anyone is "lying"

Idiot.

Jay said...

From this it's readily apparent that Romney is guilty of perjury.

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

I bet he is!!!

Really!

Note:

In explaining the SEC documents filed in 2000 and 2001, Pagliuca said, "Due to the sudden nature of Mr. Romney's departure, he remained the sole stockholder for a time while formal ownership was being documented and transferred to the group of partners who took over management of the firm in 1999. Accordingly, Mr. Romney was reported in various capacities on SEC filings during this period."
...
To be clear, all four of the sources voiced professional loyalty and personal respect for Romney. And all four have a vested interest in defending the work of Bain. But they were consistent in describing Romney's departure as abrupt and in saying they could not recall him around the office in the months that followed.

Two highly reputable arbiters of political debate -- The Washington Post's fact-checking arm and FactCheck.org -- also on Thursday stood by their earlier findings that Romney stepped away from any active role at Bain when he accepted the Olympics post. And Fortune reported that it obtained private Bain documents that support the Romney account.


You have not one utter effing clue as to what those documents mean.

Don't worry stupid, it isn't a lie if you believe it

Jake Diamond said...

You missed this part:
"The part about lying to the SEC is absurd"
Now why do you think you did that?


Yeah, you've proved again that your reading comprehension is pathetic. The perjury reference is to Romney's 2011 public financial disclosure form, which you'd have understood if you had read and processed the information from the article which I repeated in my post.

Clearly you aren't very bright.

Jay said...

From this it's readily apparent that Romney is guilty of perjury.


HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

Do Bain SEC documents suggest Mitt Romney is a criminal?

Not According to the Washington Post

Jay said...

The perjury reference is to Romney's 2011 public financial disclosure form, which you'd have understood if you had read and processed the information from the article which I repeated in my post.


Um, the Washington Post was clear on the matter, you abject imbecile.

Again, you have not the foggiest clue what these SEC filing said or mean.

But you are gullible.

So you have that going for you.

Jay said...

perjury reference is to Romney's 2011 public financial disclosure form, which you'd have understood if you had read and processed the information from the article which I repeated in my post.


The Washington Post Addressed this.

You being unable to speak to that fact speaks volumes.

Jake Diamond said...

Nothing you posted indicated Romney was involved in the operations of Bain Capital.

Actually it does, but you're apparently too stupid to comprehend that Romney's statement that he had "not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way" is contradicted by the fact that he was involved in Bain Capital filings.

You see, dunces like you don't seem to understand what you read. Romney's signatures on the Bain Capital filings demonstrate that he definitely WAS involved in Bain Capital operations at least marginally. Therefore his statement is untrue.

Please keep squirming, though. I enjoy watching you double down on stupid trying to invent an excuse for Romney's serial lying.

Jake Diamond said...

Poor stupid Jay is now reduced to introducing red herrings, appeal to authority and argumentum ad nauseam. Since he can't argue the facts, he tries to filibuster. Typical Republican denial.

The facts are straightforward:

1. Romney states under penalty of perjury that he has no involvement whatsoever with any operation of Bain Capital or any of its entities in any way after 1999.

2. Filings signed by Romney after 1999 show that he was involved, at least marginally, with Bain Capital operations.

3. Romney is guilty of perjury.


Keep squirming Republicans!

Jay said...

Filings signed by Romney after 1999 show that he was involved, at least marginally,

I love how you just made this up out of whole cloth.

"Marginally"!

Yes!

Remember, it isn't a lie if you believe it!

Rusty said...

The same article lists evidence of Romney's involvement in the operation of Bain Capital entities between 1999 and 2002:

[W]e have identified at least six filings that Romney did sign during this period: a April 13,, 1999 13D filing by Pirod Holdings regarding an investment in Rohn Industries; a Jan. 3, 2000 13D filing by VMM Merger Corp. regarding an investment in VDI MultiMedia; a Feb. 14, 2000 13G filing by Bain Capital Fund IV regarding Wesley Jessen Visioncare; a Feb. 13, 2001 13G filing by Bain Capital Fund VI regarding Integrated Circuit Systems; a Feb. 14, 2001 13G filing by Bain Capital Fund VI regarding ChipPAC; and a November 12, 1999 13G filing (first reported by Mother Jones) by Bain Capital Fund VI regarding Stericycle.

From this it's readily apparent that Romney is guilty of perjury.


No. What it looks like is a former active exec. exercising his stock options before taking off.
It's about what I would expect from a journalist.

Jay said...

Actually it does, but you're apparently too stupid to comprehend that Romney's statement that he had "not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way" is contradicted by the fact that he was involved in Bain Capital filings.

Um, signing a piece of paper does not demonstrate you are involved in operations.

Again, you have no clue what these documents say or mean.

And you're relying on leftists just as dumb as you to translate them.

Note:
The Democrats at Bain Capital dispute your claim.

The Washington post in 2 articles disputes your silly claim.

Also note: Massachusetts Democrats tried to keep Romney off the ballot in the 2002 GOV race saying he had been living and working in Utah.

Keep flailing

Jay said...

Jake Diamond said...
Poor stupid Jay is now reduced to introducing red herrings, appeal to authority and argumentum ad nauseam. Since he can't argue the facts, he tries to filibuster. Typical Republican denial.


Except there are no "red herrings" from anyone but you.

You have not any clue at all, what those doucments mean.

If you did, you wouldn't be saying the silly bullshit you are.

The Washington Post cleared this all up, yet for some bizarre reason you refuse to read it.

Gee, I wonder why?

Jake Diamond said...

What it looks like is a former active exec. exercising his stock options before taking off.

Poor Rusty is having problems with chronology. If Romney was involved in these filings "before taking off," then he was still active at Bain Capital after 1999. Oops!

Jake Diamond said...

Remember, it isn't a lie if you believe it!

This is the basis of Jay's argument. He is desperate to believe Romney hasn't lied, so he denies facts to make it so.

It's a perfect example of modern Republican denial in action.

Jake Diamond said...

Um, signing a piece of paper does not demonstrate you are involved in operations.

Oh, poor Jay doesn't understand corporate responsibility re: the SEC.

Bain Capital had a regulatory obligation to make those filings. The filings are part of its operation. By signing those documents, Romney established that he was familiar with the details of the specific filings and was therefore involved in Bain Capital operations, at least marginally.

It's not as if Romney was signing a birthday card for a company employee. Nor was Romney obliged to sign those documents if he had no involvement whatsoever in any Bain Capital operations.

So keep squirming, Jay. It's sad that you can't make a better argument, but with the facts against you, maybe you're doing the best you can to try to wish away the facts. Good luck with that.

Jake Diamond said...

The Washington Post cleared this all up, yet for some bizarre reason you refuse to read it.

Jay hereby stipulates that he accepts as fact anything that appears in the Washington Post.

Speaking of which, according to the Washington Post, Romney has a higher Pinocchio rating than Obama. Therefore Jay must believe that Romney is a big liar than Obama.

Now watch Jay squirm again.

Jay said...

Jake Diamond said...

This is the basis of Jay's argument. He is desperate to believe Romney hasn't lied, so he denies facts to make it so


Except you've presented no facts.

Jay said...

Jake Diamond said...

Jay hereby stipulates that he accepts as fact anything that appears in the Washington Post.


That would be false.
But what is comical is the person making this assertion believes, without understanding, anything Mother Jones prints on this matter.

Your lack of self-awareness and irony is both comical & tragic.

Jay said...

The filings are part of its operation.

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

I bet they are!

Really, you like know so much about this.

You do!

Jay said...

Jake Diamond said...


So keep squirming, Jay. It's sad that you can't make a better argument, but with the facts against you, maybe you're doing the best you can to try to wish away the facts. Good luck with that.


I love your continued use of the word "facts" as if you're even tangentially familiar with these documents, what they mean, or what Bain Capital is or does.

But hey, you're "right" because Mother Jones says so!

Thorley Winston said...

I wonder how many people truly feel that Romney would make a great president?

Based on their respective job histories and performances, I think that it’s much more likely that Mitt Romney would make a great president than Barack Obama could eventually rise to the level of a mediocre one.

Thorley Winston said...

When I was a tyke I really enjoyed those "Uncle Scrooge" comic books published by Goldkey.

Me too, the Donald Duck and Uncle Scrooge comics read more like an episode of Jonny Quest or a Hardy Boys adventure than the afternoon cartoons that most people are more familiar with. Scrooge would hire Donald and his nephews to go on a quest to some exotic location to find some long-lost artifact while battling some unscrupulous rival or solve a mystery.

kennymac said...

Wow, Jake Diamond is demonstrating some weapons grade stupidity here. I just love it when ignorant jackasses cop "i'm smarter than you" attitude to someone who actually does have a fucking clue.

Jake Diamond said...

Except you've presented no facts.

Poor dumb Jay is in denial.

Jake Diamond said...

So Jay doesn't believe everything that appears in the Washington Post? I guess he should stop using the Washington Post as the basis of his appeal to authority logical fallacy then.

Jake Diamond said...

Oh wow! Jay thinks SEC filings are optional! That's really funny and fits perfectly with my theory that Jay is an ignorant clown.

Let's keep this simple--perhaps not as simple as Jay, but simple enough for a small child to understand.

Question: Did Bain Capital and its entities, as part of their operational activities have a responsibility to meet SEC filing requirements?

Answer: Yes.

Question: Was Mitt Romney involved in helping Bain Capital and its entities in these operational activities relating to SEC filings after 1999?

Answer: Yes, as evidenced by his signature on the SEC filings.

Question: Did Mitt Romney file a public financial disclosure form in 2011, under pain of perjury, that stated that he had "not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way?"

Answer: Yes, it is a matter of public record.

Conclusion: Mitt Romney lied about having no involvement whatsoever in Bain Capital operations or the operations of its entities.

Conclusion: Jay is in denial, and also incredibly stupid.

Recommendation: Jay ought to hire a small child to explain this to him.

Jake Diamond said...

I love your continued use of the word "facts"

Thank you. It would be really swell if you'd address these facts at some point. Denial may keep you happy inside your bubble, but it doesn't constitute a rebuttal.

Jake Diamond said...

But hey, you're "right" because Mother Jones says so!

I'm right because the facts are on my side.

I haven't read the Mother Jones article, but since it seems to agitate you so much, I'll have a look.

Jake Diamond said...

Wow, Jake Diamond is demonstrating some weapons grade stupidity here. I just love it when ignorant jackasses cop "i'm smarter than you" attitude to someone who actually does have a fucking clue.

And yet kennymac doesn't dispute any of the facts and can't form a rebuttal.

It's really sad to see the dreadfully poor reasoning skills of people like Jay and kennymac.

Rusty said...

What sometimes happens at large -even small- corporations is that a CEO,CFO company officer of any flavor is kept on the rolls at a reduced salary until they can find another job, or as an honorarium, or to keep their knowledge on tap. They are no longer involved in the day to day company processes, but are available to advise the company.
If you're ignorant of how corporations work it's easy to see how this misunderstanding can happen.

Andy R. said...

What sometimes happens at large -even small- corporations is that a CEO,CFO company officer of any flavor is kept on the rolls at a reduced salary until they can find another job, or as an honorarium, or to keep their knowledge on tap. They are no longer involved in the day to day company processes, but are available to advise the company.

A Losing Battle
Running my own little company and him being a bona-fide high-flyer, I never imagined I’d be in a position to teach Mitt Romney a basic lesson about corporate governance and running a business. But here goes: The CEO is in charge and he’s responsible for what happens in the company.

This is not only morally true; it’s legally true. If Bain had committed bad acts during the period in question, Romney would undoubtedly be on the hook for it, regardless of whether he’d done the bad acts personally or even known about the bad acts. Whether you were paying attention or not would be and is irrelevant. And just as irrelevant if you’d delegated your responsibilities to someone else. Just doesn’t matter. You’re CEO, you’re responsible. End of story.

(It’s a separate and interesting question why an acting CEO was never appointed if Romney was off in another state for years working full-time doing something else.)

To say that you were CEO, owner, Chairman of the Board and all the rest and yet had no responsibility for anything that happened just amounts to elaborate buck-passing. And that’s why this is a losing battle for Romney. Every technical argument about delegation, lack of knowledge and everything else just drives home the point.

kennymac said...

Poor reasoning?!? several commenters have already tried to explain to you that those documents you listed as proof of your argument do not mean what you think they mean. Clearly you impervious to reason.

Revenant said...

My goodness, Talking Points Memo agrees with Obama's talking points?

Well. I guess that settles it. Romney's in big trouble now. :)

Jake Diamond said...

They are no longer involved in the day to day company processes, but are available to advise the company.
If you're ignorant of how corporations work it's easy to see how this misunderstanding can happen.


If you're suggesting a scenario like this occurred at Bain, then you're confirming that Romney lied.

Jake Diamond said...

Poor reasoning?!? several commenters have already tried to explain to you that those documents you listed as proof of your argument do not mean what you think they mean.

Poor Kenny,
While it's true that many Althouse readers have shrieked "you don't understand those documents!!!!" the truth of the matter is that
(a) none of you have examined my understanding of the documents,
(b) none of you have offered an opinion as to why you believe those documents are irrelevant, and
(c) none of you have addressed the facts I presented and the clear line of reasoning that follows from those facts.

Now, I am perfectly willing to read a thoughtful explanation of why any of you believe those documents are irrelevant (e.g., why they do not represent work product of Bain Capital and its entities), but I seriously doubt any of you will produce such an explanation. It's pretty damn clear that your response and the responses of other Romney supporters are purely defensive and irrational. I understand that you're upset to have to defend yet another Romney lie, but your indignation does not constitute a reasoned response.

So, if you want to explain how Romney signature ended up on Bain Capital SEC filings even though Romney swore he had no involvement of ANY KIND in Bain operations, please make your case. But enough of the filibuster, ok? I'm not going to keep replying to your empty-of-content comments.

Synova said...

Question: Was Mitt Romney involved in helping Bain Capital and its entities in these operational activities relating to SEC filings after 1999?

Answer: Yes, as evidenced by his signature on the SEC filings.


Just wanted to say... all this says, AT ALL, is that he was involved in the SEC filings and signed papers for the SEC filings.

"Operational activities relating to" is a restrictive clause, grammatically.

I know nothing about how businesses are organized, but using this, assuming it's an accurate quote, as proof that Romney was involved in the operational activities of the company, making decisions or what a normal person would understand as "operational activities" of the company, is simply not supported by what is said there.

All the affirmative answer to the question as phrased means, is that he was consulted, at the very least, to sign some papers for required SEC filings, which he may have been required to do. Nothing else can be assumed from the phrase "operational activities" as it is stated, not in the *answer* but in the *question*.