The rings are still not mainstream enough to be considered cool. When Ms. McMunn tells her peers that she is waiting for her husband, "people give me weird looks," she said. "I have gotten made fun of a lot." But the rings are catching on to the point where many wearers feel comfortable talking about them....Hmmm... this makes me think about the conversation we were having here yesterday in the comments to this post, about the military's "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy. Some people say that gay persons ought to just keep what is their private behavior to themselves. Everyone who makes the argument that gay persons shouldn't see any need to tell should also object to these rings that proclaim private sexual facts, right?
"I don't think Christian youth are hiding their beliefs as much as they used to," said Jerry Rady of ScriptureJewelry.com in Escondido, Calif.
"Before, it was in the closet, a lot of that stuff," said Nickolas Pfendner, the owner of ReligiousJewelryStore.com, based in Jamison, Pa. "Peers are starting to really appreciate and respect kids who make that choice."
Ring ceremonies, once modest affairs held in people's homes or in churches, now sometimes involve hundreds of participants and laser light shows interspersed with talk of pregnancy and the dangers of sexually transmitted diseases.
December 8, 2005
Purity rings.
Flaunting virginity.
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44 comments:
Hey, here's an idea -- wouldn't be great if EVERYONE kept all these private matters to themselves?
I don't consider other people's personal conduct behind closed doors to be any of my business, and frankly, I don't really want to know.
But if a large portion of our society decides it's going to put their sexuality on public display, then I see no reason why virgins can't express themselves this way as well.
People say that in public, but then, often times in a group at work or at play the talk turns to sex... So, it seems, many more people are willing to flap their yaps about sex and ask pointed, personal and specific questions. If someone says -- as in the 40-year old Virgin -- "When's the last time you had sex?" or whatever... and the person says "That's none of your business!" or "I don't talk about such matters! or blushes stammers, etc. The assumption is virginity. The rings can be pre-emptive strike against such awkwardness and the rudeness that follows.
Besides -- I put "NEW!" on my eBay listings -- why shouldn't a person advertise their condition? Like new, new, slightly used, gently used.... or perhaps mint, near mint, good, fair, poor like baseball cards... Perhaps we can have rings that reflect our "condition." Hmmm... there's a business idea there somewhere. perhaps not.
"Besides -- I put "NEW!" on my eBay listings -- why shouldn't a person advertise their condition?"
So you're goods for sale? You need to start wearing a ring that tells us what your penis size is.
Pardon, but I don't think any couple walking down the street holding hands is making any kind of implicit or explicit statement about what they do or don't do behind closed doors.
This has gotten totally out of hand.
A man and woman aka a married couple just by virtue of the fact that they publicly vowed their mutual love and devotion and then live together, perhaps produce some kids, and continue to live together, walk around together, rake the yard together and perhaps hold hands and even swing their arms in a carefree gesture aren't merely going about living their lives and minding their own business, they are, in the opinion of moonbats, making a statement about their sexuality which somehow denigrates gays and now, presumably also denigrates virgins????
Talk about Johnny One-Note. Will everyone please take a time out and go back in the closet, at least, for a little while, so we can enjoy a little peace on earth from those monomaniacs who can't seem to stop obsessing on me, me, me.
Ann,
I don't think such rings are much different than wedding rings. It tells others that the wearer is unavailable. Of course the ability of these rings to communicate would depend on how wide-spread the use becomes.
dbp
"You need to start wearing a ring that tells us what your penis size is.
That's what sports cars are for."
Yeah, but it's inversely proportional. It still works though. :-)
But, then, men lie about their penis size, just like women do about their breast size. I remember a scene from a movie, I think it was John Revolting (sorry, Trevolta), stuffing socks in his underwear. A bit juvenile, but not uncommon. Besides, what is important is erect size, and that hopefully doesn't show in public.
I've seen this for years in the circles that I've run in. I don't think it's that new. What's new is the ceremony - which seems like a really weird thing to attend.
I've always thought that it was more for the benefit of the wearer than for those around them. Like tying a yellow string around your finger to remind yourself, "No sexing allowed."
I'm slightly uncomfortable with the vague co-opting of 'oppressed' status here. I'm more uncomfortable with a gaudy ceremony which proclaims "I'm purer then thou art". Humility should be just as great, if not greater, a virtue as chastity
As for the rings themselves, I think they are fine. Nothing wrong with wearing something to express a commitment or belief, like a LiveStrong bracelet or such. And I don't mean that to trivialize the rings. I may or may not share the belief expressed, but I certainly respect it.
Well since this conversation has degenerated..I have been trying to deal with this article:
"Big brain means small testes"
http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn8429
Aside from the feelings of inadeqaucy generated by being slothful, monogamous, and smart, the article contains this gem:
“Perhaps monogamy is more neurologically demanding.”
I'm more uncomfortable with a gaudy ceremony which proclaims "I'm purer then thou art". Humility should be just as great, if not greater, a virtue as chastity
You said it much better than I could. I completely agree.
If it feels good, do it?
I remember my sister's best friend proudly showing off her "promise ring" when they were 14 years old. She had promised her parents and her church to stay a virgin til marriage. I, seventeen at the time, made a snarky remark like, "Isn't it a bit late for that?" and got shushed by my mother. Well, the kid was pregnant a year and a half later by a man 10 years her senior. She had two kids with him before moving back home because he beat her up. My sister went on, lil slut that she was, to get masters in architecture and succeed in her endeavors. She now lives in sin with her very loving, kind boyfriend, no doubt fornicating to her heart's content. Those rings are substitutes for good parenting and good education, and only advertise that fact to me.
I'm not pooh-poohing the rings. I'm just noting the connection to the debate about being openly gay. I think to be consistent, one ought to say everyone's sex life should be a matter of personal privacy, not to be flaunted, or that it's just fine for everyone to flaunt if they feel like it. Personally, I would keep my sex life private. I remember finding it disturbing to be visibly pregnant, because everyone could see that you had had sex. (Unless you wore an "It was artificial insemination" ring.) But you can do want you want.
Ann... OK. What the heck? Maybe the virgin ring is false advertising. Do you really want to start a trend of men wearing gaudy and huge rings?
The eBay thing was not not meant seriously at least not in the commercial sense. People send message by their attire and accessories all the time, that's not a controversial idea.
tcd,
I'm not 'poo-pooing the idea'. I think they are fine, just that some of the surrounding stuff is over the top.
Andrea, so the little 14 year old is responsible for being raped by a 24-year old? I never could get away with saying that. I see a lack of parental control. There would be a pregnancy followed by a murder of that 24 year old predator.
How Victorian of you.
As Ruth Anne's sister, and giver of the TLW (True Love Waits) ring to our 15 year old daughter, you have to understand the context in which the ring was given...it IS a personal matter and the ring didn't come with neon lights saying, "I promise to be a virgin until I marry." It didn't come as a "You have to wear this ring" from a parent trying to look good on the outside. It came after much private and personal discussions with our daughter about choices..and making good choices about a future partner,etc. Our daughter wears her ring with much humility and privacy. No one would know it's a PURITY ring....it's a personal decision that she made which prompted us to have the ring made for her...
And the TLW stands for True Love Waits...because (and I wish I would have learned this one in adolescence) LUST wants more but True Love WILL wait...
just a thought..
It's pretty simple:
This is what is appropriate for PUBLIC consumption:
1) A straight man talking about his spouse, his kids, his marriage, etc.
2) A teenage girl talking about how she enjoyed going to the movie with her boyfriend.
3) A twenty-something male talking about how he wants to find a wife.
4) A gay man talking about how he's looking forward to an upcoming vacation with his boyfriend.
5) A lesbian talking about how hard it is to meet a nice girl these days.
6) A bisexual man telling a friend how he's not sure if should date Mary or Joe.
Here's what's NOT APPROPRIATE for Public consumption. This stuff should be PRIVATE.
1) Any intricate details about your sex life.
Just because I'm gay provides no more details about my sex life than somebody mentioning he's straight tells about his sex life.
"Ann Althouse said...
I'm not pooh-poohing the rings. I'm just noting the connection to the debate about being openly gay. I think to be consistent, one ought to say everyone's sex life should be a matter of personal privacy, not to be flaunted, or that it's just fine for everyone to flaunt if they feel like it. Personally, I would keep my sex life private."
I tend to agree Ann, per my earlier post. Unfortunately, many in our society have already decided all these private details SHOULD be flaunted in public, whether we like it or not.
So I think there ought to be some uniformity in how "the rules" are applied on this.
If a hairy, 300-pound man can march in a Gay Pride parade wearing a strapless evening gown, I think it's okay for a straight 14-year-old girl to wear a virginity pledge ring.
I remember my mother telling me as a teenager that I didn't have to be confirmed into the Catholic church if I didn't want to. She then proceeded to hold the confirmation classes in our living room with all of my school mates. We talked and had heart felt discussions, but I knew I really had no choice. I would venture a guess that lots of girls with rings wear them for their parents. And I believe what Andrea said, the rings may more aptly represent poor parenting.
"you don't have a right to dirty up the small talk at the office water coooler just because the married people talk about their children."
Says you.
Poor you!
I wonder if criticalobserver is gay or straight?
Unfortunately, according to his rules, he can't actually answer that question without revealing intimate details about his sex life.
Am I wrong, or not too long ago wasn't the ear a ring was worn upon announcing you were Gay?
If that's not a myth, seems Gays were first.
No, wait, if you wore a ring on your left, ring finger that said you were unavailable(maybe). People sure talked a lot about their engagement ring and how they were in love forever!
We have symbols everywhere, let them wear their ring and have us think what we will. I can choose to believe it's meaning or not.
I wonder if they remove the ring after they have sex?
I doubt it.
It isn't any of your goddamned business, you sex-obsessed pervert, which is my entire point. Get your mind out of the gutter and stop trying to bring everyone down there too, you guttersnipe.
So gay. ;)
You boys need to learn to get along. Don't make me come in here and delete things.
Ha ha. Sorry Ann. I thought we WERE being nice this time.
Purity ring ad campaign:
"Never had a penis in your vagina? Never had your penis in a vagina? Let the world know! Choose from a variety of cool, new styles to signify your level of commitment. Display any type of purity from technical (genital only) to pristine (all orifices)."
Note: I have nothing against purity rings, and I greatly respect young people who decide to hold off on sex. I just think the literal meanings behind the rings are funny.
"Knock Knock"
"Who's there?"
"Penis"
"Penis who?"
"Uh... I really don't know where I'm going with this"
Everyone who makes the argument that gay persons shouldn't see any need to tell should also object to these rings that proclaim private sexual facts, right?
Yes.
Slocum, I hope (and suspect) that the though you believe the 'chastity as property' value system is bad, this does not imply that chastity per se is bad. Am I correct?
To my mind it's not inconsistent to say that one can advocate chastity without a need to trumpet one's own superiority through chastity. In my way of thinking there is very little in the way of moral absolutes on this issue. (Assuming competent consent, etc...) Some people are equipped to handle sex and some aren't. We can certainly offer advice based on our own experiences but freedom includes freedom to make mistakes.
Finally, in the abstract, I have to say that such 'pre-commitment strategies' are often not the best idea, as people are very bad at evaluating (and properly discounting) future risks and rewards.
My, I'm ramble-licious today...
verification word = bpeef.
"Everyone who makes the argument that gay persons shouldn't see any need to tell should also object to these rings that proclaim private sexual facts, right?"
Oddly enough, my initial reaction, when I started reading this post, was exactly that -- a mild revulsion. Indeed, those kinds of private sexual facts should be kept behind closed doors -- or at least limited to discussions among friends.
Or so I thought at first. When I thought about it a little more, it occurred to me that little rings and things like that could be a useful signal. Not so much for virginity, but as with marriage rings and whatnot. It would be nice, always, to be able to tell who is taken and who is not (and who is lesbian and who is not), and a ring is unobtrusive enough that it doesn't really force itself into your consciousness unless you're actively looking.
That said, though, public displays of affection of any sort make me feel vaguely uncomfortable -- even if it's just parent-child, really. Hand-holding between adults has always looked a bit peculiar to me, though all kinds of people do it. Those things are all very well in private, but in public? Mmm.
In the end, I suppose, I'm just extremely repressed, and wish everyone else were too. But I did have the looked-for reaction.
Um Slocum... the purity rings = girl = property is way off base. It's based on the Christian value found in the Old Testament and in the new Testament against adultery and fornication. Don't confuse immoral Positivist traditional addition under common law, etc. with true Christian virute.
The modern True Love Waits, etc. is under the premise that as a creature of the Creator you are valuable and not a pair of bowling shoes to be tried on by the general public. Why would anyone denigrate trying to keep oneself pure, avoid the pandemic of HPV, genital warts and pregnancy before one is ready to have a family? Afraid of standards...? (Not you in particular Slocum since I don't know you of course, but rhetorically...)
Also, the "my cousin/sister/best friend X didn't stay pure" is fallacious reasoning (no, not fellatious)
And then there's the masterband, mostly aimed at guys, telling/showing observers that the wearer hasn't, umm, pleasured himself. Now THAT I find really icky to know about.
I think Ann's original question was if it was inconsistant if we have our children wear a ring symbolizing abstainance while we ask gays to keep it to themselves.
In my opinion, there is no correlation. "Don't ask don't tell" applies only to people who voluntarily joined the military. Outside of a military context, I hope we all agree that anyone has the right to express themselves however they wish.
Considering STD's, unplanned pregnancy, and other health risk associated with promiscuity, it's interesting that a few people here are critial of this practice. I think it's an honorable idea.
http://nevermoreblog.blogspot.com/
This is utter bunk, because you leave out of the equation to whom you are talking. If you're talking to your friends, say whatever you want. But you don't have a right to dirty up the small talk at the office water coooler just because the married people talk about their children.
I am gay, but I'm also one of the married people (same-sex marriage is legal where I live). Is mentioning my husband "dirtying up the small talk" at the water cooler?
Thanks for posting, Amalia.
Well said Amalia. I am a Mom to five. My oldest daughter just graduated. She is a virgin by choice. She feels the same way as Amalia and we are glad of that.
We want all of our children to remain virgins until marriage. We want them to be able to give all of themselves to their future spouse. We have not handed out purity rings to our children. We are getting one for our daughter soon as she would like to have one and we have wanted to give her one but it has to come from a personal walk and decision if it truly has a significant meaning.
Will our other four wear purity rings? Time will tell. I would just as readily have my boys wear one as my girls. Wearing a purity ring does not ensure abstinence, but it is a wonderful reminder to the wearer of a path THEY have chosen to walk.
Get it right...Guys do wear the rings...It's amazing,
no...sad...that people will bash that which they don't understand, or were not able to accomplish in their own lives. They see others trying to live by Gods' standards...that which He has called us all to...and because they couldn't keep their legs crossed, or their pants on, and gave themselves up to the first little "hotflash" that came along, and continue to, they (in their guilt) feel they can now ridicule others who want to do the right thing. Some might say,"well, real men or women have sex"....Well,... so does my dog...but he doesn't have to live according to the same standards...but apparantly some of these would rather sleep around like dogs.
At any rate, these same young people who you
want to bash, to make yourselves feel better, or less "unclean", still have their virginity, and desire to stay that way until they are married, according to Gods' plan...something you can never say for yourself anymore. However, you might be really
surprised at the growing percentages of youth
who desire to stay pure...Hmmmm...Could this be
a sign of this Generation coming back to the "Heart of God"???? Yes...it could, and is...Oh No...
quick...somebody get a call in to the acl_...before they take over...Too bad...Jesus is coming back, and He is taking over...but there is still time to get it right...How about this...try talking to one of those"Purity ring" wearers, and ask them what makes them so convinced that they need to do this...and why they believe what they believe...
Have a blessed day.......
i love the idea of purity rings. i'm 21 now. and i wish i had of gotten a purity ring when i was younger. although i did wait until i was 20 to have sex. i always thought it would be better to wait on the guy i would marry. but as it turns out, that didn't happen. and now i've had sex with several different people. and i forgot who posted the comment about regretting the sex they didn't have vs the sex they did have. and in my opinion i definatly regret the sex i did have over the sex i missed out on while i was in the process of waiting.
and someone else had posted a comment about showing what "condition" the person was in. while i'm not sure if they intended that in a rude sort of way or not, but it was actually in a way something i had been thinking about. since i'm not a virgin, a purity ring doesn't really seem to fit me. but i really want a ring now to symbolize my newfound relationship with God and how i wish i could have my virginity back. but i wish there was a wring that was like a "new found purity/promise between me a God" to wait for sex until marriage" i'm just not sure what kind of a ring that would be. maybe something with just a simple scripture? but what scripture would most apply to that? any ideas out there?
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