January 11, 2011

"It's the nature of the house churches that worries Iran. It's all about possible converts."

"It's a very specific and pinpoint strike by Iran."

25 comments:

Pogo said...

The Christian-Free Lawmaker Zone Act

edutcher said...

Can't trust those damned Christers.

Always turning the other cheek and loving their neighbors.

Next thing you know, they'll want everybody to be like that.

1jpb said...

In Iran, like Pakistan, I think we'd all be labeled as avowed liberal[s].

R.L. Hunter said...

This can't be true, Islam is the religion of peace love and fluffy bunnies.
If these criminals had been allowed to spread their violent rhetoric someone might have been killed.

Michael said...

I think that, if the Iranian people can ever get rid of this regime, they will drop Islam. I don't know if they will become Christian but the regime has thoroughly discredited Islam. I have read speculation about this elsewhere.

tim maguire said...

That's the problem with being a minority religion in a theocracy. No matter how protected your status, you still exist at the pleasure of the leadership and are a convenient scapegoat in difficult times.

traditionalguy said...

The love of God is a concept which seems to Islamic captives as welcome as water to a man dying of thirst. These dealers in the water of God's love are destroying the cruel Islamic ideology. Grace by faith in Jesus does remove the legal claims of Mohamed's god to kill everyone.

Paddy O said...

I think the communists tried this too.

As long as the Christians in Iran don't make this about politics, there's a curious hope even in the midst of the persecution. In China, for instance, house churches are a surprisingly large phenomena, increasingly pointing towards the Far East as the next center of the global Christian faith.

In Medieval Japan, however, the burgeoning Christianity did have a political element to it, and was pretty much wiped out.

That's the way of Christianity in the midst of persecution since the days of the Roman Empire. Turning the other cheek often means the blood of martyrs becomes the seed of the church.

But I do pray for those in Iran facing a long season of incredible persecution. Given the increasing dissatisfaction with the religious leadership there, it'd be interesting to see if Iran becomes a place of Christian renewal in coming centuries.

Centuries. These sorts of things always have to be big picture.

prairie wind said...

I've said it before: Our next president had better have some serious foreign policy background. As much as I like Sarah, I don't think this is her. But who?

Revenant said...

Actually, Paddy, the problems Christianity ran into during its early years in Japan and Rome weren't because Christians failed to stay out of politics, but because staying out of politics is impossible in nations where the official religion and the government are one and the same.

To a Roman, religion = culture = government. You couldn't refuse to offer at least token homage to Roman gods without repudiating the government itself. The same essentially held for feudal Japan, where the shogunate enforced a particular pro-government faith and suppressed others.

It seems to me that Iran's much like Rome and Japan, in that you can't possibly be Christian without implicitly rejecting the legitimacy of a Muslim theocracy. At best, you can believe that the government is entitled to its authority but totally wrong about the basis for that authority.

Almost Ali said...

As much as I like Sarah, I don't think this is her. But who?

John Bolton

Also: UN Ambassador John Bolton is "very seriously" considering running for president in 2012…

bgates said...

Our next president had better have some serious foreign policy background.

The most compelling rebuttal Obama made against any of the vast array of arguments marshaled against him was against that one, when he said that judgment was more important than experience. He was right; an Obama who had served decades in the Senate would have made a better President only in that he wouldn't be limber enough to show such profound obeisance to foreign tyrants. You know what you call somebody who Democrats think has the years of foreign policy experience that leads to success in international relations? "Joe Biden".

Palin's judgment is sound. If a candidate emerges with equally sound judgment and superior experience, fine - but as you say, who?

Paddy O said...

Acccccccctually, Revenant there's intentional politics and resistant politics. In Feudal Japan there was both a move by the West to influence the politics through the priests, as well as decided geographic, and thus competing loyalties. When a winning side wishes to take care of a foe, they take care of a religious affiliation. Even more, the Western nations used their own religious and political battles in their attempts to gain influence in Japan, leading to all kinds of sad persecution, that was religious but had decided political goals.

With Rome, not sacrificing was a political act of sorts, but if you read all the writings of the early church you know they were intentionally not trying to make it political. They repeatedly say they prayed for the emperor, etc. They made a strong point saying they were good citizens, in support of the order of the Empire, and their lack of sacrificing was intentionally a religious and not a political act.

We see this throughout church history with some movements being explicitly political and other movements being perceived as political but then intentionally moving to avoid political action. For instance, George Fox implemented a strong pacifism with the Quakers so as to intentionally avoid being lumped in with the many various overtly political religious movements of 17th century England.

David said...

About 6,000,000 more of those pinpoint strikes and they will have their very own holocaust. Now its just a nice little cloudy persecution, with a 60 percent chance of murder over the weekend.

AST said...

But we mustn't be judgmental towards these people, since they have a different religious tradition that we do. Right?

Sooner or later these people are going to be in another all out war with somebody. We shouldn't be appeasing them.

Hoosier Daddy said...

Well Aquavelvajad said Iran doesn't have any gay people. Maybe they want to get rid of Christians too.

Revenant said...

They made a strong point saying they were good citizens, in support of the order of the Empire, and their lack of sacrificing was intentionally a religious and not a political act.

To the *Christians* it was a religious and not a political act, sure. The point is that, to the Romans, saying "it is a religious act, not a political act" was like saying "I didn't have sex with your wife, I just fucked her a couple of times".

That's the situation Iranian Christians are in. You can't be non-political as a member of a minority religion in a theocracy, because your faith itself has major political implications.

Kirk Parker said...

Michael,

"I don't know if they will become Christian..."

Word of mouth says they are at quite a high rate. Reports like this give such rumors increased credibility.



Almost Ali,

Oh dear. Really? John Bolton is fabulous, and I think he would do a great job (just imagine his first meeting with the likes of Ahmedinajad.) But as his first elective office? No matter how much we despise "career politicians", starting at the top just ain't gonna happen.

Kirk Parker said...

Yeah, what Rev said at 9:27pm. We have a Chinese exchange student staying with us, and--despite his moderately good English skills--he was completely unable to explain to us what the big deal with Fulan Gong was, in a way that made any sense to us. Some kind of disloyalty something something...

Kirk Parker said...

Oops, shoulda looked it up before I hit "Publish".

It's Falun Gong. No disrespect meant, fellas...

Almost Ali said...

Kirk Parker,

I suspect John Bolton is actually angling to become Secretary of State.

The GOP ticket is forming.

Kirk Parker said...

Bolton at State? Well, that sure passes the "annoys the right people" test! :-)

Fen said...

Sooner or later these people are going to be in another all out war with somebody. We shouldn't be appeasing them.

They already are. Iran is funding trips for Hezbollah memmbers to Venezuala (Chavez). They undergo a 6-month immersion where they learn to pass as Latino and then enter America with the rest of the illegal aliens.

WMDs. Coming soon to a city near you.

And of course, when NYC is decimated by Anthrax or Sarin or a dirty bomb, Obama will blame Palin for it.

Class factotum said...

No matter how much we despise "career politicians", starting at the top just ain't gonna happen.

Yeah because Obama had tons and tons of time as a politician.

Kirk Parker said...

Class,

1. I'm talking about what is, not what should be.

2. If you think the media will promo Bolton in the same way they did for Obama, then sure he's got a chance this time around.