May 27, 2017

"Don’t Judge Montana for a Single Body Slam."

A NYT op-ed by Sarah Vowell. I like Sarah Vowell, but this grated on me.

She's talking about all the diversity there is in Montana — "farmers; ranchers; miners; artists, including folk singers, though let’s not underestimate our potters; the inhabitants of two lefty college towns, Missoula and Bozeman, where I grew up; and the coastal refugees such as Mr. Gianforte...."

She goes on:
So what’s the tally — at least 14 varieties of Montanan? Fifteen if we include the summer roofers-winter ski bums affectionately known in my home valley as “dirt bags.” The dirt bags might look like a bunch of Hillary-voting hippies, but based on my five winters during the Reagan-Bush era tending bar at the local ski area, Bridger Bowl, they’re stingy tippers and therefore, I suspect, secret Republicans.
Has it ever been established that conservatives are worse tippers than liberals? Is that even a stereotype? I'm offended that this is offered up as a laugh line, as if, of course, NYT readers will get this. Presumably, it has more to do with the idea that Republicans don't support generous governmental spending, but that assumes that Democrats, who are generous with the taxpayers' money, won't be stingy with their own money.

Research shows that conservatives give more to charity than liberals give.

The liberal vanity about personal generosity, empathy, and goodness, is on display in Vowell's op-ed. I guess I could say it's funny, even if you don't believe the stereotype that Republicans are stingy, because you can laugh at the stereotype that Vowell embodies by saying that. And she keeps it personal. She says "I suspect." And we can picture her as the young bartender, noticing the tip is bad, and getting some solace out of thinking: must be a Republican.

She put him in her tip jar of deplorables. 

78 comments:

Bob Ellison said...

They don't tip in most of western Europe. Wonder why.

Bob Ellison said...

Ted Turner is the biggest land-owner in Montana. I'm not saying compensation.

AReasonableMan said...

Bob Ellison said...
They don't tip in most of western Europe. Wonder why.


Wonder no longer, it is because the workers are already paid a living wage.

David Begley said...

I can hardly recall such a minor incident getting so much air time and ink. Because. Press.

Maybe these clowns should do their jobs instead of being advocates for their political positions.

EDH said...

A little quick to leap to conclusions based on her own personal experiences, she also accused Pat Sajak of being a slave trader for asking "would you like to buy a 'Vowell'."

Humperdink said...

The generosity of lefties knows no bounds, especially when the source of their generosity is the taxpayer.

tcrosse said...

Tipping in France is called “service” and is most often included in your restaurant prices and hotel rates, i.e. service compris.

rhhardin said...

Pansy reporter meets banana peel. When is that not entertaining.

J Lee said...

Ms. Vowell's column reminds me of 25 years ago, when the Times and other New York media outlets would seek to gauge the pulse of the average Texan by using ex-Timeswoman Molly Ivins as their go-to person, and then were shocked by the results of the 1994 midterm election, when her close friend Ann Richards lost to George W. Bush for governor.
The op-ed here isn't so much seeking to provide an explanation for Gianforte's win as is the writer seeking to distance herself from her average fellow Montanan native and make the average Times reader feel good about their own beliefs, just as so many who live around Austin seek to do the same when taking to outlets like The New York Times about Texas -- in their minds, the state would be great if it wasn't for all those people who don't vote and think the way they do (in the vein of the old joke saying "I love humanity -- it's people I can't stand").

rhhardin said...

For Augustine charity meant thinking the best of others rather than the worst.

Charity meaning money is a modern development.

tcrosse said...

A cab driver in Vegas tells me the worst tippers are South Asians. The best tippers are the hookers.

Bob Ellison said...

One of my sons delivered pizzas. He says the rule is: five-dollar tip. One pizza, five dollars, five pizzas, five dollars. Maybe should be more for more pizzas or a long drive, but five dollars, according to my son, gets an OK from the delivery guy.

rhhardin said...

Kindness today is allowed only to institutions, not individuals, Vicki Hearne says.

Fen said...

What an ugly woman Sarah is. She's using the "let's not blame Montana" angle th blame stereotype and blame the people of Montana, buf sideways, like the catty bitches you find at NYC cocktail parties. (see what I did)'

"Who made your dress Kaylee? You really should talk to your girl. She made you a dress that looks like you bought it in a store" - Sarah, Firefly

And the reason I didn't tip Sarah Vowell is because she didn't swallow.

What a cunt. This is how you get more Trump, Sarah

Guildofcannonballs said...

I read on Reddit that blacks don't tip. I felt so dirty, so racist, so mean and horrible, but that is the truth of what I read, nevertheless.

All in all, it's a good thing the GOP is seen more as Steve Buscemi in Reservoir Dogs than that one dude from Gilligan's Island, so thanks NYT, you magnificent bigot.

Fernandinande said...

"Don’t Judge Montana for a Single Body Slam."

That's about as childish as that kiddy-article about "normalizing evil".

So what’s the tally — only one variety of New Yorker?

Two if we include the authors of self-aggrandizing light fiction and fake news unaffectionately known as "NYT scribblers". The NYT scribblers might look like a bunch of Democrat-voting cucks, but that's just because they are.

Martin L. Shoemaker said...

Can we judge Minnesota for a single body slam?

And yes, a sympathetic New York Times reporter later reported that Al Franken "only" used a wrestling hold to prevent a man from exercising his First Amendment rights, "destabilizing" him. In other words, battery, with differing witness statements.

Waiting for the Progressives to demand that Senator Franken step down...

Ann Althouse said...

"The op-ed here isn't so much seeking to provide an explanation for Gianforte's win as is the writer seeking to distance herself from her average fellow Montanan native and make the average Times reader feel good about their own beliefs, just as so many who live around Austin seek to do the same when taking to outlets like The New York Times about Texas -- in their minds, the state would be great if it wasn't for all those people who don't vote and think the way they do..."

Madison is the same sort of place.

Bob Ellison said...

Sarah Vowell did the voice for the girl character in The Incredibles.

For audio wackos: yes, it was obviously lowered in pitch and otherwise changed.

AReasonableMan said...


The best tippers are the hookers.


They are all stoned.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

And we can picture her as the young bartender, noticing the tip is bad, and getting some solace out of thinking: must be a Republican.

And..I can picture her as the young bartender who isn't getting a good tip because we can see her shitty attitude and see the bad service. Honey....it has nothing to do with politics. It really IS all about you.

Bay Area Guy said...

I spent a little bit of time in Missoula, Montana. Nice place! In the midst of vast country, you have a little college town with bars, cafes, and music. Lotta trucks with gun-racks, too. Nice folks. 15 years ago on a flight to Montana, my seat mate was so concerned that I was away from my pregnant wife and family, he insisted on driving me to my hotel, waiting for me to change, and taking me to his home for a BBQ'd trout dinner with his family. The kindness of strangers, I reckon.

The Left and the NY Times (I repeat myself) keep telling us these special elections are political bellwethers for what's going to happen to those dastardly Trump Republicans in 2018, but they keep losing. It's kinda humorous.

AReasonableMan said...

Guildofcannonballs said...
I read on Reddit


Must be true.

Expat(ish) said...

I've only ever driven through Montana, but I've done roofing (humping shingles up a ladder in OH summer heat) and I've known a lot of ski instructors over the years, so I can be pretty sure she wasn't calling someone a "dirt bag" who is in either profession.

The instructors would stiff her tip (and they are great tippers).

The roofers would probably punch her. Not really, they are old school guys, mostly. But her boss would have fired her, because roofers can drink. Not like drywall guys, but pretty good.

-XC

chickelit said...

"Madison is the same sort of place."

Do you mean that Madison is an island in a state of rubes? This is the polar opposite view of the LSD-inspired "Madison is 30 square miles surrounded by reality."

Rusty said...

The difference between a conservative and a liberal as far as generosity goes.
Old man on the median. Not even on the highway but the median in the Safeway parking lot.
He's got his little sign,"work?" We know that's just a formality. I roll down my window and the conversation goes like this"C'mere." Reaching in the arm rest well where I always toss my change. "Here." hand the guy a fist full of change. Him,Thank you god bless you." Me, " yeah. yeah,bug off, bye." The woman behind me hands him a bill and then proceeds to direct the old guy on exactly how the money is to be spent.
As a conservative I know that once you give someone something you no longer have the right to tell them what they can do with it. As a liberal once they give you something they think they you owe them. To a liberal "charity" is a loan. To a classic liberal charity is is an act between the almighty and themselves.

Rob said...

Smug condescension is the coin of the realm for outlets like The New York Times and The New Yorker. But be of good cheer. It's that kind of arrogance that caused The Deplorables to elect The Donald.

Fen said...

"I'm offended"

Good point, and you're right to be. She thinks her readers will find her stereotypes amusing because they are bigots. Like the jackass who expected me to laugh at his joke about "wetbacks" because I'm from Texas.

Thanks for reading the NYTs rag so we don't have to. I find it ironic that Mexican owned newspaper is complaining about Russian influence.

gg6 said...

The only thing such types are 'generous' with are the hefty portions of righteous snark they dish out to those who do not toe to their own inane line. What else is new in a NYT editorial?

traditionalguy said...

Here is a Tip: Love gives. Givers are the real Christians. Takers are those who have lost faith except in power and asserting their privileged status in the hierarchy. But to a point, they do need one another.

chickelit said...

Release the video!

RJ said...

Even in those now-long-ago days when I would listen regularly to NPR I switched it off immediately when Vowell came on.

Rene Saunce said...

No media outrage. Memory Hole.

William said...

Ever read about religious wars in the 17th century. People ascribed all sorts of virtues to members of their own sect and all sorts of vices to members of the opposing sect. In truth, there wasn't that much difference between them. I don't know the dynamics of what makes some people good tippers or other people cheat on their wives or other people physically accost reporters, but my guess is that the determining factor is not their political beliefs........I was more liberal when younger. Back then, I wasn't much of a tipper. Nowadays, I'm somewhat more conservative, and I like to tip generously. This has nothing to do with my political beliefs. I have more money now, and I'm not afraid of dying broke.

Bill Peschel said...

Maybe Vowell's afraid New Yorkers will adopt the Montana Handshake for use on their own politicians, like Pervert Weiner and Terrorist-Supporter Di Blasio.

It's beginning to sound like a good idea.

chickelit said...

@Rene Saunce: Thanks for that clip. A stark contrast indeed.

Rene Saunce said...

OT:
What’s more surprising about this story... that the alleged crime was charged in the first place or that you’re hearing about it at all?

On March 4th in St. Paul, Minnesota, a pro-Trump rally took place on the steps of the State Capitol rotunda. No sooner had the event gotten underway than liberal “counter-protesters” wearing masks showed up and began attacking the rally participants with mace, tasers, fireworks and fists. We’ve seen these tactics of violence and intimidation by the Left at Berkeley, in New York City and too many other places to list here, so the incident itself sadly isn’t all that shocking anymore. But this one came with a twist. One of the attackers was none other than the son of former Vice Presidential candidate Tim Kaine.


Big story hack press sure to ignore.

Criminal charges for Tim Kaine’s son over violent assault on Trump rally

Rene Saunce said...

When leftwing fascists show up with tasers, mace, masks, and rage - with the intent to beat you down and shut you up - why... that's "peaceful."

Media insist.

When R gets mad after being bullied and pestered by hack from hack-D press, it is a constitutional crisis, donchaknow.

Ambrose said...

NYT's paid digital subscription strategy is based on confirming the biases of a like minded audience.

AJ Lynch said...

What DBQ said at 8:47AM.

rcocean said...

Judging by the income tax returns: The Clintons, Gore, Kerry, and Obama gave little to charity compared to Dole, Romney and the Bushes. Don't know about McCain.

rcocean said...

I've met her type before. Working in some small town or mid-sized city, convinced she's superior to all the "Rednecks" and pining for the day she can leave and go to Seattle, NYC, or LA.

Sadly, many of these types just move to the nearest college town.

tcrosse said...

Nobody does smug condescension better than a Small Town person who moves to the Big City. I cite Garrison Kiellor as an example. They have scores to settle with the folks back in Podunk.

AJ Lynch said...

ARM said: "that's because Western Europeans are paid a living wage".

Living wage, affordable housing , affordable health insurance are all librul slogans that libruls can never precisely define.

What will you libruls do when being a conservative on campus becomes the cool thing to be? And it will happen because kids inevitably revolt against the forces of the dominant culture.

mockturtle said...

I am a generous tipper and a Conservative. She would probably just assume I am a Liberal if I left her a big tip. [Why do I get sucked into these asinine NYT pieces?!]

Gahrie said...

Madison is the same sort of place.

Every blue enclave is the same sort of space.

mockturtle said...

They don't tip in most of western Europe. Wonder why.

Because the tip is part of the bill, as a VAT [value added tax].

Clyde said...

I think I'd rather buy a Consonantt.

Fen said...

"They have scores to settle"

Well, they also are dying to be accepted by their new "friends" in the Big City.

Sarah Vowell is like a formerly fat loser recruited by the Mean Girls. She's going to give her new "friends" the skinny on her former fat loser girlfriends, betraying true friends to amuse new fake friends.

But the Mean Girls will still always regard her as a fat loser. Vowell will never really be accepted as one of them.

Danno said...

Blogger tcrosse said..Nobody does smug condescension better than a Small Town person who moves to the Big City. I cite Garrison Kiellor as an example. They have scores to settle with the folks back in Podunk.

You are correct on Keillor. Here is some drivel he wrote regarding his opinion on statues in DC, contrary to the title of his piece. To think WaPo pays him for this shit.

http://www.twincities.com/2017/05/23/garrison-keillor-taking-down-confederate-statues-should-be-just-the-start/

Bob Boyd said...

Maybe the dirt bags didn't tip her much because they picked up on the fact she considered them dirtbags.

Fen said...

I'm now wondering how much of Sarah's snark was due to peer pressure. I'm imagining all the outraged libtards in the office wanting to lash out in response to the "body slam" and failure to flip the seat to Dem.

Circling the cubicles but no one to attack because they are cocooned in a liberal bubble. No deplorables allowed.

Hey wait guys, isn't Sarah from that podunk state? "Oh Saaaarah!"

And so, a day after ridicule and sideways snark about her hillbilly roots, Sarah redeems her office cred by writing this nasty petty op-ed.

"Nice piece this morning Sarah. And hey, I hope you know we were just teasing you with all those Deplorable Spawn jokes"

Left Bank of the Charles said...

I love the way Vowell glides past her Jeanette Rankin name drop without mentioning that she was a Republican.

Fen said...

I always tip 20%, unless the service is bad. Then my wife steals the bill and pays with my card, tipping 20%.

Most my part time gigs in life were waiting tables and bartending, so I know the biz and have certain expectations.

One thing for sure, a female bartender getting light tips is doing it wrong. You have a wide range of roles available to play - cute young thing, efficient daughter type, compassionate tell me your problems mother, stern matriarch who gets it done. There is no excuse for a female bartender, so I'm guessing her attitude sucked and really stunk up the place. People don't like to drink and relax with a foul miasma clouding the bar.

Michael K said...

" it is because the workers are already paid a living wage."

tcrosse already answered this one. I guess ARM does not go to restaurants in Europe. The "tip" is involuntary. That why the service is often poor.

Mr. D said...

I always tip 20% and I leave the tip in cash.

Michael K said...

I read on Reddit that blacks don't tip. I felt so dirty, so racist, so mean and horrible, but that is the truth of what I read, nevertheless.

Larry Elders has done a couple of radio shows on this. He says the reason blacks often get worse service in restaurants is not racism. It's because they don't tip.

David Begley said...

Democrats tip more because they are better people. They are morally superior to Republicans. I mean Democrats want to save the Earth and your grandkids from certain destruction due to global warming. In the interim, Sharia supemeracists invade the West and Obama pays Iran to build nukes.

Michael K said...

Montana became fashionable about 25 years ago and movie people began to buy places, usually for summer. One movie producer, I've forgotten who, built a big house with multiple guest houses around it and fenced the whole thing off (of course).

The local conservation group contacted him and asked him to take down the fence because he had fenced off an elk migration route.

He told them to fuck off.

The politics have shifted a bit as more and more rich people bought places there. Wyoming has not had the same trends.

Colorado has been affected much more.

mockturtle said...

I recall an article showing that red states had much higher charitable spending than did blue states. This may be due to increased church attendance but it's still significant. Liberals only want to spend other people's money.

sunsong said...



Ain't No Cure for the Body Slam Blues

Michael Brand said...

I lived in Bozeman the same time Vowell was in high school. It was not a 'liberal enclave' back then. Solid Reagan Country - peanut shells on the bar room floor type place. The MSU campus had a solid blue collar attitude. Most political activism was marginal and background noise - definitely not at the Center of campus life. Most students focused upon the basics; writing term papers, drinking a few beers and getting laid.

Then came the flood of west coast refugees to Californicate the town....

Lucien said...

It only seems like conservatives are poor tippers because they order a shot & a beer, while the liberals order French wines (or, in a pinch, Italian (but not Chilean, 'cause they're still pissed-off about the whole Allende/Pinochet thing)).

Dust Bunny Queen said...

I always tip 20% and I leave the tip in cash.

Me too, because I want the waitstaff to be able to pocket the money and not have to pay taxes on it. None of Uncle Sam's business.

I also write CASH in the tip portion of the visa/charge slip to ensure that 1. they know I did leave a tip. and 2. no one can fill in a false amount or make a wise comment about not leaving a tip.

n.n said...

Diversity as in people, or diversity as in classes?

Conservatives are generally more charitable and presumably better tippers.

Republicans don't support generous governmental spending

Affordable may cost less than "free".

Let's see if the Republicans can realize revitalization, rehabilitation, and reconciliation, before we return to the status quo of reversing cause and effect, choice and conception.

3rdGradePB_GoodPerson said...

Althouse is funny.

As if pulling out the tipping thing is the important point re what people are supporting re society when they choose Rs v Ds.


"But I don't give a fuck who they screwin' in private
I wanna know who they screwin' in public
Robbin', cheatin', stealin'
White collar criminal
McDonald eatin', you deserve a beatin'
Send you home a weepin', with a fat bill for your
Caribbean weekend
For just about anything they can bust us
False advertising sayin' "halls of Justice"
You tellin' the youth don't be so violent
Then you drop bombs on every single continent
Mandatory minimum sentencin'
'cause he got caught with a pocket fulla medicine
Do that again another ten up in the pen
I feel so mad I wanna peaceful revolution"

Michael K said...

"Me too, because I want the waitstaff to be able to pocket the money"

I do, too. It hadn't occurred to me about writing "cash." That seems like it would give away the secret. Most waitresses are obliged to share tips with kitchen staff and busboys, etc.

I assume they can decide how to handle it. My youngest daughter worked as a waitress and then bartender (a promotion) all through college. She insisted I tip 25%.

Bruce Hayden said...

Where I am in NW MT, there doesn't seem to be that much variety. Most not that different from the rest of rural America, except maybe, out of necessity, a little more self-reliant, helpful, and nice. Hardworking. Mostly religious, but not obnoxious about it, like you find sometimes in the south. That is a southern thing, not a western one. Haven't spent much time in eastern MT, but for most of it, hard to believe that it is that different. The places that I find different are the big cities, and esp around the two college towns she mentioned - Missoula and Bozeman. And, of course, that is where much of the out of state big money has gone. Missoula is bad, but her Bozeman may have more weekend bicoastal ranchers who get between their penthouses and ranches in their private jets. But MSU is the land grant Ag school, so traditionally wasn't as wacko liberal as the University (in Missoula).

She obviously misunderstands ski bums. They tend to vote Democrat because they would rather play than work at real jobs, spending their lives (or part of it) in a nice local, doing fun stuff, than in a career. They tip well because they are in a tipping industry. At least the instructors do - some make a lot of money on tips. And even if they are in the non-tipping part of the industry, they inevitably either had a tipping job in the past, or have good friends who do.

Am I stereotyping? Yes, of course, but I was long registered to vote in a resort county (4 ski resorts, 3 decently large). It was routinely gerrymandered into a Dem district to make it safe. Currently, it is included with CO's two biggest universities that has elected the country's first married openly gay Congressman (yes - to another guy). He is as wacko as Schroeder and DeGette from Denver. Which is why it was so nice to be able to vote for a non-wacko leftist Congressman, and have my vote actually count.

Fen said...

Yes, liberals still don't get that outsourcing charity is not charity. The reality is they use other people's money to enslave minorities and the poor to State, trapping them as perpetually dependent on The Party.

Like with illegal immigration. They don't give a damn about latinos, they just want new marks to exploit, now that blacks are finally waking up to their new chains. Meet the new Bozeman same as the old bossman.

rehajm said...

Me too, because I want the waitstaff to be able to pocket the money and not have to pay taxes on it. None of Uncle Sam's business.

IRS does a good job getting paid taxes on tip income, cash or not. IRS checks employer sales with individual self reported tip income and if the two don't tie employers must allocate additional tip income on employees W2.

Pretty much don't bother with cash...

David said...

They don't tip in most of western Europe. Wonder why.

Wonder no longer, it is because the workers are already paid a living wage.


It is because the tip is included in the bill. The tip is included in the bill so the customers bear the cost of service not the owners of the restaurant etc. This is not required by law, just normal practice.

Many Europeans still tip the chambermaids in hotels.

David said...

"My youngest daughter worked as a waitress and then bartender (a promotion) all through college. She insisted I tip 25%."

Insisted? Was she paying her own tuition?

The Godfather said...

When I was a kid old enough to have enough pocket money to buy my own lunch occasionally, my father told me to tip 15% (which was the standard then) and explained how to calculate it in my head (divide the bill by 10 and then add half of that amount -- 20% is easier). I asked, Suppose the service wasn't really good? If it was REALLY bad, he said, you leave NO tip, but remember, the waitress needs those tips to live. You leave 15% unless the service is bad enough to leave nothing.

I'm skeptical of the claim that conservatives contribute to charity more generously than liberals. I suspect the real distinction is between church members and non-church members (and more conservatives than liberals are church members). It's not only that we contribute to the church itself, it's that we are constantly reminded, in church and through church-related organizations, to contribute to charities. I think it likely that liberal church members contribute at about the same rate as conservative church members. If there's a study that shows I'm wrong on this, let me know.

The Times piece that Althouse links to says that gays are the most generous charitable contributors. I suspect that's true of gays who don't have children. But if you have children, whether you are gay or straight, you contribute to the children (or grandchildren) to the extent that you are able before contributing to charities for strangers. And that is as it should be.

Comanche Voter said...

A silly bozette from Bozeman? Who knew? I don't know if Ms. Vowell is from Bozeman, or even from Montana, or just spent a few years there sucking up air. But she is a silly bozette writing 'humor' like this. Enough trash like this and the good folks in flyover country may need to start thinking about installing some anti-aircraft artillery in their backyards.

Michael K said...

"Insisted? Was she paying her own tuition?"

Are you kidding ? I'm still paying off student loans.

Cynicus said...

On the other hand, they literally were not liberal tippers.

PackerBronco said...

Republicans don't support generous governmental spending

How can it be generous when it's not your money?

JAORE said...

"of course, NYT readers will get this."

A sentence fragment with evergreen possibilities.