January 6, 2017

"Five people are dead and a shooting suspect is in custody Friday after a lone gunman opened fire at a baggage claim area in Florida's Fort Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport..."

"... shooting some people in the head without saying a word, witnesses and investigators said."
The suspect in custody was identified as Esteban Santiago...

"The shooter was a passenger on a Canadian flight with a checked gun," Broward County Commissioner Chip LaMarca wrote on Facebook. "He claimed his bag and took the gun from baggage and went into the bathroom to load it. Came out shooting people in baggage claim."...

"It was very surreal," John Schlicher, a witness, told Fox News. "He did not say a word." He described the shooter as a slender man with dark hair, likely in his 30s, wearing a Star Wars T-shirt.
ADDED: "In Nov. 2016, Santiago-Ruiz walked into an FBI office in Anchorage and claimed he was being forced to fight for ISIS, law enforcement sources told CBS News. He was sent to a psychiatric hospital after police were called, sources said."

119 comments:

eric said...

He is already being described as "White Hispanic"

Very disgusting of our racist media.

Mike Sylwester said...

There's always a possibility that you might die unexpectedly and suddenly.

Static Ping said...

Withholding comment until the facts become clear.

Drago said...

Static Ping: "Withholding comment until the facts become clear."

Prudent.

Larry J said...

Static Ping said...
Withholding comment until the facts become clear.


That's always a good policy. A very high percentage of the news reports on the day of attack turn out to be wrong (fake). We should know more in a few days.

Paul said...

Esteban Santiago? From Canada????

Wearing a star-wars t-shirt?

Yea, let's wait. I have no idea... illegal? Mexican Mafia? Or what.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

Withholding comment until I can find some fact that can be twisted to conform to my preexisting agenda.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

Had I just spent several hours on a flight full of Canadians there's no telling what I would do...

AReasonableMan said...

I am guessing that he was a gun owner.

Drago said...

AReasonableMan: "I am guessing that he was a gun owner"

I'm guessing it was a "gun-free zone".

Drago said...

It's very important to some that law abiding citizens be disarmed in order to make the criminals that much more secure in their own safety while committing offenses.

Greg Hlatky said...

If white, blame whites and Christians.

If black, blame racism and whites.

If Muslim, blame guns and the US.

If a veteran, blame Trump, Bush 43, Bush 41, Reagan, Ford, Nixon and Eisenhower.

Drago said...

It's a good thing no law abiding citizens were armed otherwise the shooter might have been harmed!

Drago said...

Remember, when someone starts shooting law enforcement is only minutes or hours away.

mockturtle said...

I'm guessing he carried a stolen ID.

AReasonableMan said...

Drago said...
I'm guessing it was a "gun-free zone".


Armed cops everywhere in an airport.

Drago said...

ARM: "Armed cops everywhere in an airport."

Define "everywhere".

And feel free to take your time.

Unknown said...

I still think it will prove to be an Islamist, even after the Hispanic name.
And I predict that the left will scream about how racist we all are for not knuckling under to Islam immediately.

--Vance

AReasonableMan said...

Drago said...
Define "everywhere".
And feel free to take your time.


Apparently you have never flown from a modern airport. You should try it sometime. Flight is very liberating and much faster than the horseless buggies you are used to.

Drago said...

Unknown: "I still think it will prove to be an Islamist, even after the Hispanic name."

Lots of crazies in the world. You can never tell.

One thing is for sure, all those crazies and ARM want an unarmed law-abiding populace.

eric said...

Turns out he wasn't flying from Canada and he wasn't on air Canada.

The facts will come out, eventually. But if you're in the news business, you don't have time to wait for facts. Quick! Speculate!

Drago said...

ARM: "Apparently you have never flown from a modern airport. You should try it sometime. Flight is very liberating and much faster than the horseless buggies you are used to."

It's much shorter to just admit you either cannot or won't define "everywhere" in terms of airport security personnel and their deployment orientations.

Jon Ericson said...

One God

Drago said...

Jon, is that supposed to be the gunman?

Jon Ericson said...

Yup.

Drago said...

5 dead and 8 wounded.

Good things the police were "everywhere" otherwise this could have gotten out of hand.

AReasonableMan said...

Good thing guns are so readily available.

AReasonableMan said...

You really should visit an airport a practical demonstration is much better than some dry description. Cops ... everywhere.

Jon Ericson said...

Police were able to apprehend Santiago-Ruiz without having to fire their own weapons when the gunman apparently ran out of bullets.

Law enforcement said he was found with an active military ID and is an American citizen, born in New Jersey. Previous known addresses include Penuelas, Puerto Rico and Anchorage, Alaska.

They add that in November 2016, he walked into an FBI office in Anchorage claiming that he was being forced to fight for ISIS. He was sent to a psychiatric hospital.

In 2011 or 2012, he was investigated by Homeland Security Investigations for child porn. Three weapons and a computer were seized, but there was not enough evidence to prosecute, according to law enforcement sources.

Santiago also has a record for minor traffic violations and was evicted in 2015 for not paying rent.

The suspect wasn’t hurt in the incident and no one else was taken into custody.

Drago said...

AReasonableMan: "Good thing guns are so readily available."

Define "readily available".

Take your time and try to improve on your "everywhere" performance.

AReasonableMan said...

Gun owner, shoots people. How is this news?

Drago said...

AReasonableMan: "You really should visit an airport a practical demonstration is much better than some dry description. Cops ... everywhere."

We are discussing a practical demonstration of your "everywhere" comment which just occurred.

The results speak for themselves.

Again, for ARM, the good news is the shooter was not harmed.

AReasonableMan said...

Gun owner, has mental health issues, How is this news?

jaydub said...

ARM: "Armed cops everywhere in an airport."

There are 5 dead and 8 wounded that would probably attest that "everywhere" does not include baggage claim and surrounding restrooms at Ft Lauderdale airport.

AReasonableMan said...

Gun owner with mental health issues shoots people. Dog bites man.

AReasonableMan said...

jaydub said...
There are 5 dead and 8 wounded that would probably attest that "everywhere" does not include baggage claim and surrounding restrooms at Ft Lauderdale airport.


No. It would mean that it all happened very quickly in a crowded airport where cops or anyone else shooting would have resulted in more deaths.

Drago said...

Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Drago said...

ARM: "No. It would mean that it all happened very quickly in a crowded airport where cops or anyone else shooting would have resulted in more deaths."

Noted combat and firearms expert ARM chimes in.

Thanks Field Marshall!

Drago said...

If I were the suspect, I would certainly immediately opt for the "I'm an Islamist and I've been triggered by Western society!"

That would ensure instant leftist support and might even land him the cover of Rolling Stone.

Drago said...

ARM is ignorant of current US Law. Dog bites man.

Curious George said...

"AReasonableMan said...
Armed cops everywhere in an airport."

Cops aren't everywhere at airports. And the fucker ran out of bullets. Ran out of bullets!

AReasonableMan said...

So your argument is that all the mentally deranged gun owners are breaking existing law, they were aided in this law breaking by someone else and both parties should have all gun rights rescinded and be jailed. How are we defining mentally deranged for the purposes of this argument? Would the insane belief that more guns are making us safer count?

eric said...

CBS news is reporting he is ISIS.

eric said...

Blogger AReasonableMan said...
Gun owner, shoots people. How is this news?


It's not.

Terrorism though? Now that's news.

Michael K said...

ARM is not worth a response his posts are so insane.

"I'm guessing he carried a stolen ID."

I suspect that a military ID might be necessary to check a bag containing a gun but I could be wrong (unlike ARM).

My daughter is an FBI agent and takes her gun along but has to declare it.

An early, and probably wrong, guess from the story is a psychotic with a stolen ID.

Drago said...

ARM, given the embarrassing rhetorical position you have put yourself in, it is understandable that you lash out.

Why don't you sit down, have a nice cup of tea, and ponder this more before you do more harm?

Drago said...

For the record, I'm going out on a limb and assert that all ISIS members or sycophants are mentally deficient.

ARM will not like that. Not one little bit.

eric said...

I suspect that a military ID might be necessary to check a bag containing a gun but I could be wrong (unlike ARM).

CBS news is saying he was discharged from the Alaskan national guard in 2016. It was a general discharge for unsatisfactory conduct. This was back in August.

Drago said...

Would it be considered bad form to suggest that any mention of an ISIS affiliation for this shooter is likely to be a "triggering" event for leftists like ARM?

AReasonableMan said...

How about the belief that Assange is telling the truth about his sources. Would that count?

Drago said...

Eric: "CBS news is saying he was discharged from the Alaskan national guard in 2016. It was a general discharge for unsatisfactory conduct. This was back in August".

Air Canada claims the shooter did not fly with them and that no gun was checked and or transported today.

eric said...

Blogger Michael K said...
ARM is not worth a response his posts are so insane.


What?!

He is a reasonable man. It's right there in his name! How could you dare say otherwise?

Btw, I happen to be funny, good looking, and smell great. I just couldn't figure out how to put all that into my name.

Drago said...

AReasonableMan: "How about the belief that Assange is telling the truth about his sources. Would that count?"

ARM, I think you are posting on the wrong thread.

Kirk Parker said...

"I suspect that a military ID might be necessary to check a bag containing a gun"

Nope. No special id required at all, though (my turn to speculate) if the TSA person handling the firearm check-in suspects you are a Prohibited Person™ things could get interesting very fast.

I'm very sceptical of the Air Canada part if it includes any kind of stop in Canada (as some stories are claiming)

AReasonableMan said...

What about the belief that the Republicans have a coherent, politically viable plan to replace Obamacare? Would that count?

mockturtle said...


The photo Jon posted [it is being floated on various web sites] shows the subject showing the ISIS sign. So maybe this 'Estaban' identifies as a Muslim. Ya think?

eric said...

Blogger mockturtle said...

The photo Jon posted [it is being floated on various web sites] shows the subject showing the ISIS sign. So maybe this 'Estaban' identifies as a Muslim. Ya think?


He walked into an FBI office and said he was being forced to fight for ISIS.

Then they yelled at him and said, "You idiot! We don't have time for this! Didn't you hear? The DNC has been hacked by Russians. Russians!"

Jon Ericson said...

FORT LAUDERDALE (CBSMiami) — Federal law enforcement sources said the suspected gunman in a deadly attack at Fort Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport got into an argument during his flight from Alaska to Florida.

They’re now investigating whether that’s what set off a shooting rampage that left 5 dead and 8 others wounded.

Esteban Santiago-Ruiz, 26, took a flight from Alaska to Florida Friday with a stop in Minnesota, officials said. Somewhere along the way, he got into an argument.

According to Broward Commissioner Chip LaMarca, Santiago-Ruiz arrived from a flight with a gun that he checked in.

“He claimed his bag and took the gun from baggage and went into the bathroom to load it. Came out shooting people in baggage claim,” LaMarca said.

Earlier reports claimed Santiago-Ruiz came in on a flight from Canada. On the company’s Twitter account, Air Canada confirmed that no one by that name was on their flight.

Air Canada flights arrive to Terminal 2, where the shooting took place.

Jim at said...

"I am guessing that he was a gun owner."

I'm guessing you'd be happier if he ran them over with a truck, instead.

AReasonableMan said...

Jim at said...
I'm guessing you'd be happier if he ran them over with a truck, instead.


Don't think a truck would fit in a suitcase, making it difficult to immediately act out your murderous impulses. It would require a bit of planning, during which time you might come to your senses. Fortunately guns everywhere removes that impediment.

Jon Ericson said...

The brother of the man who has been tentatively named as the suspect in a deadly shooting at a Florida airport says the suspect had been receiving psychological treatment while living in Alaska.

Bryan Santiago tells The Associated Press that his family got a call in recent months from 26-year-old Esteban Santiago's girlfriend alerting them to the situation.

Bryan Santiago said he didn't know what his brother was being treated for and that they never talked about it over the phone.

He said Esteban Santiago was born in New Jersey but moved to the U.S. territory of Puerto Rico when he was 2 years old. He said Esteban Santiago grew up in the southern coastal town of Penuelas and served with the island's National Guard for a couple of years. Puerto Rico National Guard spokesman Maj. Paul Dahlen said that Santiago was deployed to Iraq in 2010 and spent a year there with the 130th Engineer Battalion, the 1013th engineer company out of Aguadilla.

Drago said...

AReasonableMan: "What about the belief that the Republicans have a coherent, politically viable plan to replace Obamacare? Would that count?"

It's understandable that after you've embarrassed yourself you would want to change the subject.

Jon Ericson said...

Esteban was "fighting with a lot of people" during his time in Alaska, Bryan Santiago told NBC News, saying he was having relationship issues and arguing with his girlfriend and others. The girlfriend told Bryan that his brother was "receiving psychological counseling in Anchorage."

Static Ping said...

So the current theory is ISIS terrorist and nuts. That's new.

We'll see if any of this holds up by tomorrow. It won't shock me if 90% of this is wrong. How the fake news media will spin this is easy to predict though. They have a flow chart.

n.n said...

The gun is presumed guilty of committing mass abortion outside of a government-sanctioned abortion chamber. Under Pro-Choice/diversity, all guns of similar color will be censured for the foreseeable future.

Drago said...

ARM: "Don't think a truck would fit in a suitcase, making it difficult to immediately act out your murderous impulses."

Reports are that the gunman did not fly to FLL.

Lets continue to allow ARM to pursue his "infinite monkeys" technique and see if he can, after a period of time, actually alight on a real fact or coherent argument.

Odds are against it of course, but hope springs eternal.

Jon Ericson said...

Federal law enforcement sources told CBS News the shooter got into an argument on one leg of his travel from Alaska to Florida. The accused shooter was on a Delta flight during the second leg of his trip to Fort Lauderdale, sources said.

Broward Commissioner Chip LaMarca told CBS4 the shooter claimed his bag at the baggage claim area then took the gun from his bag before going into a bathroom and loading his weapon. He then reportedly came out of the bathroom and began shooting people in the baggage claim area. The accused shooter apparently ran out of bullets and sat down on the ground and waited for law enforcement to come and collect him.

Michael said...

ARM

LOL. I flew a miserable 150,000 miles last year. I am in airports all over the bloody globe. In the US you will find plenty of armed police officers clustered around the TSA stand inside security. Leaning. Plenty means two or three. Might find one or two strolling around in the ticketing area. Hardly any in the concourses.

Michael K: Easy to check a gun. When you check in at the counter where you check your bags you tell them you have a gun in your bag. They will ask you to pull it out to confirm and then they fill out a little tag which they put inside your gun case. Even in California it is relatively easy. No problem at all in more gun familiar states.

readering said...

Fortunately these types of incidents will end on January 20.

Rhythm and Balls said...

I blame Trump.

Michael K said...

"Even in California it is relatively easy. No problem at all in more gun familiar states."

OK. I didn't know that. Thanks. When my daughter takes hers it is in her carry on.

Curious George said...

"AReasonableMan said...
No. It would mean that it all happened very quickly in a crowded airport where cops or anyone else shooting would have resulted in more deaths."

Like all lefties everywhere state an opinion as fact. But I'll play. What good is having armed cops "everywhere" if they simply are going to wait until the perp is out of bullets, sits down, and waits to be cuffed?

Dude, you are a clown.

AprilApple said...

Hey ARM - were the e-mails showcasing Clinton money grubbing and money whoring proven to be manufactured? nope. E-mails were all real.

Assange did us all a favor by showcasing the disgusting hypocrisy of the corrupt democrats known as the Clintons.

AprilApple said...

48 vets kill themselves every day.

8 years of Obama.

holdfast said...

A person with mental health issues and a propensity for violence was attracted to radical Islam. That's really quite shocking!

In this case I don't think it's a choice between Muslim terrorist or mentally deranged - it's clearly both. And it's not shocking that someone with violent tendencies seems out a religio-political belief system that is more than ready to channel and embrace those tendencies.

On the upside, since becoming a psycho killer, his ethnicity has been upgraded to "White Hispanic"!

holdfast said...

"Federal law enforcement sources said the suspected gunman in a deadly attack at Fort Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport got into an argument during his flight from Alaska to Florida.

They’re now investigating whether that’s what set off a shooting rampage that left 5 dead and 8 others wounded.

Esteban Santiago-Ruiz, 26, took a flight from Alaska to Florida Friday with a stop in Minnesota, officials said."


These bloody millennial Hillary voters just don't know how to deal with a difference of opinion in a rational matter.

tcrosse said...

I blame George W. Bush.

Bruce Hayden said...

I suspect that a military ID might be necessary to check a bag containing a gun but I could be wrong (unlike ARM).

Not really an issue. Each airport is a bit different, but mostly you take your bag to the ticketing agent with the unloaded gun in a TSA locked box. You tell the agent, and they have a form that you fill out that essentially tells them your name, phone, and flight info. At least with SWA, they attach the form to your gun case. I then lock the bag with another TSA lock. At some airports, that is the end of it for you - the agent takes the bag, and you see it again at the destination airport. Denver though has you escorted over to a TSA room, where you stick around until your bag is x-rayed. You can apparently have loaded magazines in the locked gun case, or in your suitcase, or just boxes of ammunition (but no loose ammo). And, the gun had better not be loaded. Overall though, pretty painless. I would worry a bit more with a checked long gun - because you can typically tell what it is. But, with handguns in your checked luggage, there is nothing external to identify your bag as containing the gun.

Of course, this may all change with this shooting. Wouldn't be surprised if TSA tried to ban all checked firearms. Better solution, I think, would be more police presence in the baggage claim area.

ndspinelli said...

And Cheney. And Scalia. Wait..

Jon Ericson said...

A law enforcement official says the Florida airport gunman told the FBI in November that the government was controlling his mind and was forcing him to watch Islamic State group videos.

The official was not authorized to discuss an ongoing investigation by name and spoke Friday on condition of anonymity.

The official says agents in Anchorage completed their interview with 26-year-old Esteban Santiago and called the police, who took him for a mental health evaluation.

The FBI's Anchorage field office said in a statement that it was aware Santiago was an Anchorage resident and that it was assisting in the investigation, but it declined to comment further.

AReasonableMan said...

Drago said...
Reports are that the gunman did not fly to FLL.


Jon Ericson said...
Federal law enforcement sources told CBS News the shooter got into an argument on one leg of his travel from Alaska to Florida.


Up to this point I have tended to side with the argument that 'Drago' and 'Jon' were two sock puppet emanations from a single (mildly disturbed) mind. Of course, this could be a clever ruse to throw us off the trail ... Nah.

Lauderdale Vet said...

I'm just kind of waiting for the dust to settle. Lot of noise out there.

HT said...

Conservative?

If white, blame mental illness.

If black, cultural pathology.

If Muslim, terrorism.

If a veteran, mental illness and the VA.


If a gun, blame anti concealed carry laws or gun free zones.

Paul Zrimsek said...

Liberal?

Blame availability of guns for 72 hours, then revert to denying that you want to make guns less available.

Harold said...

AReasonableMan said...
jaydub said...
There are 5 dead and 8 wounded that would probably attest that "everywhere" does not include baggage claim and surrounding restrooms at Ft Lauderdale airport.

No. It would mean that it all happened very quickly in a crowded airport where cops or anyone else shooting would have resulted in more deaths.


One more death- that of the bad guy. Non-uniformed concealed carriers have a very low rate of hitting innocent bystanders when deciding to draw their weapons and fire. Hitting innocent bystanders seems to be a specialty of big city police departments.

And from what I've read, the responding police department followed the old outdated playbook that says to organize and move in slowly, which maximizes death to civilians, instead of the new one that says- MOVE IN AND DO YOUR DAMN JOB! I paraphrased that last part...

harryo said...

The reason cavemen all carried clubs, is they didn't have a failed Homeland Security, or the failed Federal Government to protect them.

Since guns can be checked in baggage, there should be security available in the baggage claim.

If I was the Mayor, I'd be asking for resignations, or fire the worthless security.

Francisco D said...

This strikes me as a case of decompensation into serious mental illness.

We decided 30+ years ago not to treat serious mental illness as a danger to society because we wanted to protect individual dignity (and save a few taxpayer dollars). The other arguments are bullshit.

Just as "Three Mile Island" terrified people about the most efficient and safest form of energy, "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" convinced people that mental institutions are cruel and archaic.

I have asked many of my (almost exclusively ultra-liberal, college educated and depressed) patients, "How many people died at Three Mile Island"? The responses would amaze you.

ARM, check it out on Google before you respond - just to save yourself the embarassment.

Drago said...

ARM, rolling out the "sock puppetry" deflection ploy.

I must say, that's a rather pedestrian maneuver.

Jon Ericson said...

Hey, Plasterhead! I'm just re-posting the news as it becomes known.
Tell us about your voices! What do they say?

harryo said...

If Carrie Fisher is remembered for one thing, it should be her personal endorsement of electric shock therapy.

Paul Ciotti said...

Francisco D: "I have asked many of my (almost exclusively ultra-liberal, college educated and depressed) patients, "How many people died at Three Mile Island"? The responses would amaze you."

What did they say?

Paul Ciotti said...

Eric: "He is already being characterized as a 'white Hispanic.'"

What is the media trying to do--take the stigma off Hispanics and shift it onto whites?

Francisco D said...

Paul,

Most of the older patients are smart enough to understand that it is a trick question. They change the subjects ASAP. The younger ones are often bewildered and give wildly varying estimates.

Kirk Parker said...

Bruce @ 6:56 PM,

Have they changed the procedure recently? Last time i did this, you had to have a TSA lock on the luggage, but the internal locked pistol case was supposed to be openable *only by you*. That's part of the purpose of the personal check -- the agent visually verifies that the handgun real-life *is* in a locked case.

Kyzernick said...

I fly into and out of that exact airport at least once a year, every year since 2011.

I can tell you 100% there are never a serious number of police officers near baggage claim. I recall them strolling through maybe two times out of the 6 that I've been there, and aside from that there are some near the TSA checkpoint upstairs, and some outside but usually only at the departures area. There are traffic cops outside but not always near the entrance (sometimes in their cars), and with traffic noise it might not be easy to hear stuff happen inside. At best, it would probably be a 20 to 30 second response time for any coordinated law enforcement opposition, more if the perp got lucky. Perhaps there were officers and he got them first, but I'd bet he had a fairly long opposition-free window, especially seeing as how he had time to reload.

The caveat here is that I only ever see Terminal 1 on the regs because I always fly Southwest One time I did fly Delta, also from Minnesota, because they were actually cheaper - though it required a 2 hour layover and 2 flights to get there. Pretty sure that was terminal 2, and for that trip I was flying solo so I got pretty tipsy on the layover while getting numbers at one of the bars from some local girls who were also heading to FLL. Can't rightly say what that police presence was when I picked up my bags. My guess is Terminal 4 has the most cops, since that's the international one and I think has customs too.

Gojuplye said...

The shooter was deployed to Iraq with the Wisconsin National Guard. The 1013 Combat Engineering unit is out of Medford, WI. He was a member of a mostly Puerto Rican unit. Lot of guys in the area knew him personally and are dumbfounded by this.

Curious George said...

"Kyzernick said...
I fly into and out of that exact airport at least once a year, every year since 2011.

I can tell you 100% there are never a serious number of police officers near baggage claim. I recall them strolling through maybe two times out of the 6 that I've been there, and aside from that there are some near the TSA checkpoint upstairs, and some outside but usually only at the departures area. There are traffic cops outside but not always near the entrance (sometimes in their cars), and with traffic noise it might not be easy to hear stuff happen inside. At best, it would probably be a 20 to 30 second response time for any coordinated law enforcement opposition, more if the perp got lucky. Perhaps there were officers and he got them first, but I'd bet he had a fairly long opposition-free window, especially seeing as how he had time to reload."

Incorrect. We have it on good authority by ARM, who wasn't there, and has never been there, that armed police "are everywhere." We also know that they didn't do anything because it all happened very quickly in a crowded airport where cops or anyone else shooting would have resulted in more deaths. Because once again, he wasn't there and never has been.

AReasonableMan said...

Curious George said...
Incorrect.


Tendentious argument. The poster acknowledges that there a cops everywhere. Is there one cop per passenger? No. Are there a hell of a lot of cops? Yes. Exactly how oppressive do you want out police state to be?

Rusty said...

" The poster acknowledges that there a cops everywhere. Is there one cop per passenger? No. Are there a hell of a lot of cops? Yes. Exactly how oppressive do you want out police state to be?"

This from the stricter gun control advocate. Fewer cops. More armed citizens.

Lauderdale Vet said...

Regarding security in the baggage claim area, I live 4 minutes from the airport and go frequently to drop off and pick up family members all the time.

No, there isn't a lot of security. You can park your car in the garage and head into baggage claim as easy as going to the grocery store. There wouldn't even be an easy way to implement it.

Do we really want to live in that kind of world? Honestly, having a few more police officers on patrol is all I hope they learn from this.

Also, I carry. It would be nice to not have to disarm in the parking garage, too.

Curious George said...

"AReasonableMan said...
Curious George said...
Incorrect.

Tendentious argument. The poster acknowledges that there a cops everywhere. Is there one cop per passenger? No. Are there a hell of a lot of cops? Yes. Exactly how oppressive do you want out police state to be?"

Keep digging that hole ARM. What a clown.

AReasonableMan said...

The hole that has been dug is by the guns everywhere morons. Not making us safer.

Yancey Ward said...

I found the dynamics of the news releases interesting, and if you had given me the details, I would have predicted them to evolve in exactly the way they did.

Everyone's first instinct on hearing of the shooting was that it would turn out to be an Islamic terrorist. I am 100% certain that Bill Nelson made his statement as quickly as he did because he thought the man's name and military ID made it certain that it wasn't Islamic terrorism- Nelson couldn't wait to shoot down that meme. If the shooter had been named Mohammed, you can be sure Nelson makes no statement to the press. Going further, if the shooter hadn't had the military ID, I think Nelson also keeps his mouth shut because the name was Hispanic.

AReasonableMan said...

Yancey Ward said...
Everyone's first instinct on hearing of the shooting was that it would turn out to be an Islamic terrorist.


No. Roughly 50:50 that it was some whack job proud American gun owner.

mockturtle said...

Dis-ARM says: No. Roughly 50:50 that it was some whack job proud American gun owner.

Are you trolling, or what? Can you cite an instance where an NRA member has committed mass murder?

AReasonableMan said...

Where do I say NRA member? The NRA facilitates these whack jobs, they don't necessarily join the organization. Blood on their hands nonetheless.

Drago said...

Blogger AReasonableMan: "The hole that has been dug is by the guns everywhere morons. Not making us safer"

Lol

Just yesterday ARM was regaling us with how safe it was in airports since armed officers are "everywhere".

Today it's a different tale, told by a fool, ending where it inevitably must.

#WhenNarrativesCollapse

Rusty said...

Lauderdle Vet @ 11:28

A reasonable solution. The man was obviously mentally disturbed and known to the FBI. I can only suppose that fear of the ACLU kept him on the streets and armed.
And No, ARM, Their blood is soly on the hands of the man and those that knew he had mental problems and did nothing. Your favorite boogie man, the NRA is not responsible for how you or anybody else behaves.
NRA = hate speech.
grow up.

mockturtle said...

Blood on their hands nonetheless.

What unmitigated horseshit! I suppose the signers of our Constitution have blood on their hands, too.

AReasonableMan said...

Any gun deaths over and above the rate of gun deaths found in equivalent countries like Britain, Canada and Australia are due to the lunacy of the NRA and its adherents.

Rusty said...

AReasonableMan said...
'"Any gun deaths over and above the rate of gun deaths found in equivalent countries like Britain, Canada and Australia are due to the lunacy of the NRA and its adherents."

There aren't any other equivalent countries. We are unique.
FWIW Italy is a civilized country and has a higher homicide rate by firearms than we do. When you deduct gang and drug homicides from the stats you're safer here than in Great Britain.

AReasonableMan said...

Rusty said...
There aren't any other equivalent countries. We are unique.


Complete crap

FWIW Italy is a civilized country and has a higher homicide rate by firearms than we do.

Nonsense. Italy is 0.71 Homicide by firearm rate per 100,000 pop versus 2.97 for the US. And, Italy is not my idea of a safe country to live in.

When you deduct gang and drug homicides from the stats you're safer here than in Great Britain.

This is just stupid. Every country has gangs and drug related homicides.

AReasonableMan said...

And you didn't address the main point - the NRA has blood on its hands.

Bad Lieutenant said...

No, ARM. The guy could have done as much damage with a car. Or a nail file.

The problem is not dangerous objects.

The problem is dangerous people.

Who has the blood on their hands, is whoever has made it so difficult to monitor and control psychologically disturbed people. The leaders of the deinstitutionalization movement have much to answer for.

AReasonableMan said...

More self serving crap. Deinstitutionalization has occurred in every western country. No more excuses. The NRA kills.

Rusty said...

AReasonableMan said...
Rusty said...
There aren't any other equivalent countries. We are unique.

"Complete crap"

No it's not. See what I did there.

"FWIW Italy is a civilized country and has a higher homicide rate by firearms than we do.

Nonsense. Italy is 0.71 Homicide by firearm rate per 100,000 pop versus 2.97 for the US. And, Italy is not my idea of a safe country to live in."

I'll dig up my sources and compare.





When you deduct gang and drug homicides from the stats you're safer here than in Great Britain.

This is just stupid. Every country has gangs and drug related homicides."

Not to the extent that we do because of our open southern boarder. And if you examine the FBI crime stats you'll see that it's true. if you aren't involved in the illegal drug trade or a gang member(or are a bystander in Chicago) your chances of getting shot are reduced to insignificance.

You remind me of those rabbis in charge of the Warsaw ghetto who wanted to be reasonable and accommodating to the nazis in charge. So when the nazi commandant demanded 10,000 people for the trains to the concentration camps the rabbis had their enforcers round up ten thousand children. Taken, of course, from the orphaned and families who could no longer feed their own. Totally reasonable. Children produced nothing. Children were just mouths to feed. Perfectly reasonable to ship them off. Except that everyone knew what their ultimate destination was. Perfectly reasonable though. Under the circumstances.

AReasonableMan said...

It is certain your opponent has no rational argument once he brings in the Nazis. Your facts were wrong and the NRA kills.

Rusty said...



Blogger AReasonableMan said...
It is certain your opponent has no rational argument once he brings in the Nazis. Your facts were wrong and the NRA kills.


You're being unreasonable.

Rusty said...

You're being unreasonable,