June 20, 2012

"I have realized that I am not really all that conservative, I just hate the double standard in the mainstream media."

"Six Hundred newspapers would blare Fast and Furious on the front page every day if Bush were in office. President Obama has managed to win office while the NYT and Wash Post are still in business, and can carry the water for him. They will be gone soon, but for now, this will be a 2 day story, 'nothing to see here, keep it moving.'"

So says Fprawl, in the Fast and Furious/Executive Privilege thread.

61 comments:

edutcher said...

No, F&F, like Ol' Man River, just keeps rollin' along.

That's what scares this Administration. They can't shake it, largely because of the Blogosphere.

And, if it goes where most of us think, it will be because of that Army of Davids in PJs refusing to give up on it.

Chuck66 said...

The New York Times had Abu Grave (however you spell it) on the FRONT PAGE of their paper for...I think it was 36 consecutvie days.

Tom Spaulding said...

President Obama has managed to win office while the NYT and Wash Post are still in business, and can carry the water for him.

Everyone who voted for the blatantly incompetent, un-vetted, un-tested rookie carried water for him. The water carriers were legion BEFORE the election.

It's WHY he "managed to win".

Tea Party at Perrysburg said...

Hey, the truth is that they could have made this go away, if they wanted to, by producing the documents. Instead they've promoted it. So there's definitely a "there" there.

tim in vermont said...

This wasn't a story when the President of Mexico was furious about it at the "Three Amigos" summit. It won't be a story now.

tim in vermont said...

"Excelsior of Mexico City reported that President Felipe Calderon bitterly brought up Operation Fast and Furious, a U.S. government operation that permitted Mexican drug cartels to smuggle thousands of weapons into drug-war-torn Mexico. This blunder has wrought mayhem on Mexico and cost thousands of lives.

The mainstream U.S. press has kept those questions out of the official press conferences, while Obama has feigned ignorance to the Mexicans and hasn't even apologized.

In short, the summit was a diplomatic disaster for the U.S. and its relations with its neighbors north and south."

http://news.investors.com/article/606670/201204031900/obama-alienates-mexico-and-canada-over-energy-trade-and-weapons.htm?p=full

But remember, this is a *non story*.

America's Politico said...

Look, it is clear to me, but may be I need to spell out. We just do not care for the GOP. We will do whatever it takes to support our greatest POTUS.

We will dismantle, disrupt, and defeat the GOP.

For this task, we are unanimous. We in the MSM, whether it is NYT, NPR, PBS, or MSNBC, we are totally driven by our affection, our respect, our awe of our President. We do no like to support a change of horse in mid-stream.

Support the MSM. Support the POTUS. We are truly the One and Only.

garage mahal said...

"Six Hundred newspapers would blare Fast and Furious on the front page every day if Bush were in office

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?.

As Jay would say - "Where were you then!"

John M Auston said...

this will be a 2 day story

Where? At CBSABCNBCCNNNPRMSNBC?

Who cares? They no longer determine what is news, or how long it stays news, or whether the folks find out about it.

They couldn'tbe more irrelevant.

kcom said...

"The New York Times had Abu Grave (however you spell it) on the FRONT PAGE of their paper for...I think it was 36 consecutvie days."

This is the case for media bias. Although sometimes it's a matter of active manipulation (hello, MSNBC) much of the time it's simply a refusal to adequately cover stories that might make Democrats look bad. There's hyperventilation over the merest whiff of a problem when a Republican is involved and active avoidance of coverage when it's a Democrat in the spotlight.

Today a president is claiming executive privilege on an issue that (as I read on another blog) NBC News had only ever mentioned for the first time the other day. And which they only spent 30 seconds on. Even though the story has been ongoing since late 2010. They tried to ignore Weinergate, too, and if it was up to them, John Edwards would still be rockin'.

Comanche Voter said...

Now I happen to believe (based on no evidence whatsoever--but beliefs are like noses--everybody has one) that the planning for this liberal wet dream ran pretty high in the Department of Justice. Let's gin up a little gun running operation in the hope that we can prove the need for more controls on gun sales--and maybe invalidate the Second Amendment. It's the kind of slipshod second rate theorizing that you can expect from a bunch of politicians playing at being Cabinet Secretaries.

And they've been trying to cover it up ever since things blew up in their faces.

I don't necessarily believe that this was something that directly involved The Bamster. He's too busy playing golf to get involved in such petty conspiracies.

But he did appoint Holder--and now he's worried that Holder going down will harm his reelection chances.

So in a truly brilliant move The Bamster invokes Executive Privilege--thereby insuring that some of the stink from this mess now belongs to The Bamster.

Of course that theory goes out the window if The Bamster was in fact directly involved in planning this fiasco instead of simply appointing a silly tool like Holder.

tim in vermont said...

I am assuming then, Garage, that it is your contention that the Obama is covering up for the Bush administration?

SteveR said...

Nice try garage. Pay closer attention to all the facts, not just the ones that fit your agenda. Start with the timing of the documents being requested by Congress. I won't ask you to stretch beyond that.

Matthew Sablan said...

"Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?"

-- Only in the broadest painting possible. The parts about not actually tracking the guns and not making arrests and killing Mexican citizens were all new. Oddly enough, those are the things people are raising issue with.

TWM said...

"Six Hundred newspapers would blare Fast and Furious on the front page every day if Bush were in office

"Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?."

Like the man said, if Bush were president this would be on the front page of every newspaper. Not to mention all the networks, including Fox News.

Justlike the economy, garage, it's Barry's now and he has only made it worse.

traditionalguy said...

Garage....The reason Holder/Obama are stonewalling this with your help is because it is not what the Bush ATF had in mind at all.

How stupid do you think we are?

This was a mass gun running operation with no tracking done other than the initial purchases at gun dealers shops despite their objections that the Obama ATF overruled giving no reasons.

The GOAL was starting a War in Mexico that would require the Crisis of shutting down the gun dealers where the first sales were bothered to be tracked from.

The Mexicans and the UN were put into a place to demand that Obama shut down the Second Amendment rights of Americans as pawns in this leading from behind game.

That's also spelled T-R-E-A-S-O-N!

Now can you understand today's desperate Executive Priviledge assertion?

tim in vermont said...

This is about lying to congress, anyway. Did Bush lie to congress about "Wide Receiver"?

Tom Spaulding said...

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?.

No.

Next question.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?


No.

But thanks for participating.

edutcher said...

tg, treason involves giving aid and comfort to the enemy in time of war.

Take your meds and calm down.

Matthew Sablan said...

One big difference is that Bush's program had buy in from the Mexican government. How's that smart diplomacy working for you?

Jay said...

And of course a gun grabber from Chicago brings up an alleged "gun show loophole" at the hearing.

These people are despicable.

Matthew Sablan said...

Also, dead bodies. Wide Receiver had, uh, zero, I think. F&F: More than we can accurately estimate.

Rose said...

We lost a border agent. The Mexican people lost many, many, many more, something Obama does not care one whit about.

If you're hispanic, and still thinking about voting for Obama, faux amnesty or no, this ought to give you pause.

kcom said...

The single most egregious story of the MSM ignoring a Democratic scandal was their absolute refusal to investigate Barney Frank and the Democrats role in the housing bubble and the tanking of the US economy. They (and Obama) can yammer on all they want about President Bush, but until they cover the travesty wrought by Barney Frank and his ilk and report on it honestly then it's pretty hard to take them at all seriously when they start throwing blame around for the economy.

Also, Jon Corzine "disappeared" $1 billion of his clients' money. When's the last time you saw a story about that, or a clamor for his arrest, or any interest at all in the MSM? What was the outcome of that story? Anybody? Anybody? Bueller?

Tom Spaulding said...

Does it never strike the Libs here how odd it is that we conservatives seemingly know their postions AND our postions on every issue better than they do?

Do they not realize that to hold an opinion that can be defended, you must first subject it to internal scrutiny and ask yourself the accuracy of the assumptions and conclusions that got you there, and consider the sources?

Do they not understand that we strive to factor in our own confirmation bias and are vigilant about keeping it out of our opinions as best we can?

Do they not welcome new information from all sources and change their views if the info is relevant?

Do they not watch MSNBC and FOX? Listen to Rush and NPR? Read Dowd and Steyn? Krugman and Krauthammer?

Because I'm very tired of responding to them as if they do.

tim in vermont said...

"Do they not realize that to hold an opinion that can be defended, you must first subject it to internal scrutiny and ask yourself the accuracy of the assumptions and conclusions that got you there, and consider the sources?"

A Dr Jonathan Haidt did some research on this. He asked Liberals and Conservatives to describe the other's position. He is an admitted liberal himself, BTW. He found that liberals were unable to do it, yet conservatives were.

He described the usual liberal response as "reject first, ask rhetorical questions later!"

You will see that pattern a lot.

You can read his edge.org article, which as a conservative, I found fascinating, even if he wrote it from the point of view of advancing the liberal agenda.

http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/haidt08/haidt08_index.html

Aridog said...

garage mahal said...

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?.

So what? The question is about NOW, not then. Typical prog they hit back first Defense.

Logic: John Dillenger robbed backs way back when, so we can rob banks today, because it is all Dillinger's fault.

Christopher in MA said...

tg, treason involves giving aid and comfor to the enemy in time of war. Take your meds and calm down.

I'd argue that supplying guns to drug cartels involved in overthrowing the Mexican government is an act of war, but that's just me.

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?

Wide Reciever, started under Bush, included tracking devices on the walked guns. Fast and Furious began under Obama and did not include tracking devices.

Wide Receiver was shut down when the tracking failed. Fast and Furious continued until a whistleblower exposed it.

Now go get your shinebox, you hack.

Original Mike said...

"The single most egregious story of the MSM ignoring a Democratic scandal was their absolute refusal to investigate Barney Frank and the Democrats role in the housing bubble and the tanking of the US economy."

This.

Original Mike said...

"Do they not realize that to hold an opinion that can be defended, you must first subject it to internal scrutiny and ask yourself the accuracy of the assumptions and conclusions that got you there, and consider the sources?"

That's why we watch The Crazy Channel.

MisterBuddwing said...

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?.

As Jay would say - "Where were you then!"


Where were YOU? Or is it your position that Fast & Furious doesn't matter, and never mattered?

tim in vermont said...

THis is going to be a long few months for Garage. I hope he holds up, at this rate he is going to end up like one of those old grass stained baseballs with the thread of the seams worn down, and one day, somebody knocks the cover off of it, and this time, nobody bothers to wonder where it went....

Just sayin..

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?


If you mean "start" by firearms in Wide Receiver being equipped with RFID tracking devices, and launched in 2006 but shut down in 2007, then yeah.

But of course you have no interest in facts or the truth. You're just looking for an excuse to justify the indefensible and your inability to criticize Obama in any manner what so ever.

Jay said...

MisterBuddwing said...


Where were YOU? Or is it your position that Fast & Furious doesn't matter, and never mattered?


Oh yeah. On Monday he was mr. "fuck this" and "fuck that" in another beclownment meltdown.

Carnifex said...

Garage, suckin' the sweat off of Zero's nutsack. Are you still a man Garage? Or has all that choom sweat made you a mindless O-bot.

I would consider tryin' to subvert the Constitution as treasonous.


And does everyone recall this?


Recounting a March 30 meeting between Brady, her husband Jim and White House Press secretary Jay Carney, The Post reports:


During the meeting, President Obama dropped in and, according to Sarah Brady, brought up the issue of gun control, “to fill us in that it was very much on his agenda,” she said.

“I just want you to know that we are working on it,” Brady recalled the president telling them. “We have to go through a few processes, but under the radar.”

Among the measures discussed:


How records get into the system and what can be done about firearms retailers. Her husband specifically brought up the proposed ban on large magazine clips…

ricpic said...

America's Politico said...

We are truly the One and Only...glub glub glub.

Carnifex said...

Ps

I'm gonna' make the prediction that the "executive position" post hits an Althouse record for comments...Blogger gold in them thar' hills.

Ken said...

garage,

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?.

No.

Christopher in MA said...

[i]This is going to be a long few months for Garage.[/i]

Yes. And how sweet that is. An epic, and well deserved, "butt hurt."

Amartel said...

"I have realized that I am not really all that conservative, I just hate the double standard in the mainstream media."

Never been a Democrat but was an "independent" (person who doesn't know WTF about politics and government but thinks they do) in my early-mid 20s and became increasingly conservative, esp during Clinton I, after I noticed the double standard in the media. It made me start paying attention to politics and government.

The double standard in the MSM has only gotten more and more obvious since that time, due as much to the ineptitude and bankruptcy of the current admin, for which they must clumsily apologize and disguise, as to the increasing power of the conservative voices in the MSM. Now a lot more people are hearing an honest assessment of both sides. Uh oh libs, time to push "bipartisanship" and complain about "polarization"!

Ken said...

garage,

there are two differences between the Bush and Obama administration and their operations. At least three of four operations conducted under the Bush Administration, Wide Receiver, Medrano and Hernandez, were conducted by co-operating with Mexican law enforcement authorities. There was no effort by the Obama administration to co-ordinate with Mexico on Fast and Furious.

The next difference is the most important. There were no casualties as a result of any Bush administration efforts. As the result of Fast and Furious, one US Border Patrol agent Brian Terry and possibly Jaime Zapata have been killed, along with hundreds of Mexican citizens.


Get your head out of your ass. It's tired to continue to blame Bush for everything. Be a fucking man and take responsibility for your own fucking stupidity for helping to elect a complete buffoon as president who promptly selected the most anti-American staff, including the most anti-American AG, in history.

garage mahal said...

But of course you have no interest in facts or the truth. You're just looking for an excuse to justify the indefensible and your inability to criticize Obama in any manner what so ever

And the number of times you've criticized Romney is zero. Under your own commenting rules, your opinion is invalid. Nice try though. I think I'll also give Holder and Obama the same benefit of the doubt as you give Scott Walker. Just let the slow wheels of justice turn!

edutcher said...

Rose said...

We lost a border agent. The Mexican people lost many, many, many more, something Obama does not care one whit about.

If you're hispanic, and still thinking about voting for Obama, faux amnesty or no, this ought to give you pause.


They've paused.

IDB's Andrew Malcolm confirms

Dead.

Cat.

Bounce
.

Methadras said...

How does this version of executive privilege work? Holder won't release any implicating relevant material and tries to keep it contained in Justice so it doesn't bleed out to Urkel. Threatened with contempt, then Urkel steps in and becomes his shield? There is no way you can't say this is payback.

Methadras said...

Folks don't worry. Garage McDoucheknuckle will find a way. Any way to shove his head up his ass even further. With him, it's completely and totally probable. What a dunce.

Christopher in MA said...

I think I'll also give Holder and Obama the same benefit of the doubt you give Scott Walker.

Note, of course, that garbage completely ignores the thorough trashing of his imbecilic "Bush did it, too!" bleat.

But that's typical for a mendacious hack without shame, honor or integrity.

Methadras said...

garage mahal said...

Just let the slow wheels of justice turn!


Why, are you going to dive right under those wheels to give your incompetent CiC and the rest of his administration the traction they are desperately seeking? Your stupidity is the daily highlight of why I come here. The ability to ridicule you, how you think, and your insipid ideology is one of my daily treats.

Methadras said...

Christopher in MA said...

But that's typical for a mendacious hack without shame, honor or integrity.


Woah, woah, woah. That's way to much credit than Garage deserves.

Dante said...

Maybe if fprawl and the rest of the nation hadn't been brainwashed with half truths, distortions, lack of information, etc., he, and much of the country, wouldn't think of themselves as not conservative.

tim in vermont said...

" I think I'll also give Holder and Obama the same benefit of the doubt as you give Scott Walker. Just let the slow wheels of justice turn!" Garage

Reject first, ask rhetorical questions later is close this time, often, as above they just use some kind of rhetorical flourish that avoids further engagement.

So, Garage? Were the Dan Rather TANG memos authentic? You still holding on to that one too?

Trochilus said...

Charles Hurt, a columnist with the Washington Times, was just on television with Greg Jarrett of Fox, and in the course of their discussion they broached an amusing twist in this story -- the possibility that the White House will now be able to actually use this assertion of "Executive Privilege" in "Fast & Furious" to create yet another distraction from a full-throated public discussion of the problems of jobs and the economy!

Just imagine ... Chris Matthews, Lawrence O'Donnell, Ed Shultz, Andrea Mitchell, Mika Brzezinski, and indeed the entire hydra-headed cackle of Obama shills over at MSNBC, all now rallying around the famous Al Sharpton mantra, calling for the creation of a "movement of resistance!"

"But resist we MUCH! We must, and we will MUCH ... about ... that ... be committed!"

Brings tears to your eyes, no!

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

And the number of times you've criticized Romney is zero. Under your own commenting rules, your opinion is invalid.


Idiot:
Romney didn't implement Fast and Furious.

Duh.

rcommal said...

Garage: I really would appreciate it if you would address the differences in implementation of Fast and Furious and the operations under President Bush. It seems to me they are both real and significant. If you don't think so, why not? If you do see that, why not acknowledge it and focus on either why you think it's still not a big deal or that you think the probe into it is tainted (or whatever it is you do think is the offset), or both?

Christopher in MA said...

You'll have better luck getting pigs to fly, rcommal. Garbage has nothing but snark and stupidity. A bag of wind, as Robert DeNiro said in The Untouchables.

Rusty said...

garage mahal said...
"Six Hundred newspapers would blare Fast and Furious on the front page every day if Bush were in office

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?.

As Jay would say - "Where were you then!"


If you cared to do a little research it was called operation "gun runner" all the firearms were minutely documented and a tracer chip was installed on each firearm. When it was found out that the tracer chip could be damaged by rough handling the operation was discontinued for fear that the forearm would then be untraceable.
"Fast and Furious" belongs to this administration.
What makes this heinous that there was no attempt to track the weapons taken over the boarder. That makes a lot of people complicit in Brian Terry's murder. Plus the fact it was a cynical attempt to effect domestic policy through the deaths of Mexican nationals.
No even you can claim this is no big deal.

yashu said...

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?

Holder retracts his claim that Bush team knew about Fast and Furious gunwalking.

bgates said...

Didn't the F&F failop start under Bush?

Fast & Furious, the insane plan to release guns into Mexico with the expectation that they would be used to murder people and the hope that outrage over those murders could be used to destroy the Second Amendment, started under Obama.

In the broader sense in which you're using the term - American guns entering Mexico with the knowledge of the American President - it started under James K Polk. Who was also a Democrat.

Ken said...

garage,

And the number of times you've criticized Romney is zero.

Stop trying to change the subject! And when was the last time Romney authorized a gunwalking case that resulted in hundreds dead in order to justify gun control policies?

Trochilus said...

To those (including until today Attorney General Holder) who keep trying to suggest that "Fast & Furious" began under Bush, and/or that Bush and his A.G. knew about it, no, it did NOT begin under Bush, and they did NOT know about it.

"In a second major retraction over its version of the the gun-walking scandal, the Justice Department has retracted Attorney General Eric Holder's charge in a hearing last week that his Bush administration predecessor had been briefed on the affair.

In a memo just released by Sen. Chuck Grassley, the Iowa senator reveals that Holder also didn't apologize to former Attorney General Michael Mukasey for dragging him into the Fast & Furious scandal that is headed for a major legal clash and likely contempt of Congress charge against Holder.
. . . ."

Trochilus said...

Sorry, yashu, just saw your link to the Examiner story at 6/20/12 2:07 PM when I went to look at my own new comment relinking the story.