January 15, 2012

"President Obama and his family headed out to church this morning for the third time in a month..."

"... the latest sign that the president may be using religion to boost his image as the campaign heats up."

90 comments:

Jay said...

President Obama and his family headed out to church this morning for the third time in a month, the latest sign that the president may be using religion to boost his image as the campaign heats up.

Let us know how that one works out.

After all, talking about Rev Wright is forbidden.

Andy R. said...

Considering how the evangelicals are going to feel about voting for a Mormon, this might actually work.

Bob_R said...

Assuming that evangelicals will exercise the type of bigotry in the voting booth that Andy is displaying here might not be a good strategy.

Tom Spaulding said...

So, he's now running as an anti-gay marriage, small-government, terrorist killin' Christer from Jesusland?

Best Wishes!

sydney said...

Obama has rarely gone to church since becoming president. But last month he and his family walked across Lafayette Park in front of the White House to attend services at St. John’s Church. They attended Christmas services at a Marine Base in Hawaii and today were at Zion Baptist Church in DC.

The Marine base service was probably ecumenical, but one week Episcopalian, another week Baptist. Can you get any more polar opposite within Protestantism than those two traditions? Looks less like theological searching and more like vote searching. Wonderful thing about being a Protestant politician- you can go through all the diverse traditions to gather voters.

Tim said...

"Looks less like theological searching and more like vote searching. Wonderful thing about being a Protestant politician- you can go through all the diverse traditions to gather voters."

And people, sadly, will allow themselves to be duped again, despite the obvious record of Obama's insincerity toward faith and all-too-apparent inadequacy and failure in office.

Andy R. said...

150 Christians just got together to try to find anyone other than Romney to support. They claim his wacky religion only "was a side note."

This is what they had to say about supporting Romney:
"Based upon what participants said…if Rick Perry, Newt Gingrich, or Rick Santorum would clear the nomination there would be passionate support," Perkins said, "beyond that I can't necessarily say."

I hope you will all join me in regularly denouncing evangelicals for their bigotry throughout the campaign, as I have no doubt there will be regular stories about their intolerance for Romneybot's wacky religion.

Jay said...

Andy R. said...

Considering how the evangelicals are going to feel about voting for a Mormon, this might actually work.


In other words, you'll proudly vote for a President who goes to church for political reasons.

AJ Lynch said...

This report is not from an MSM outlet which would never write anything so cynical about Prez Obama.

Andy R. said...

In other words, you'll proudly vote for a President who goes to church for political reasons.

Sounds better than someone who is dumb enough to be a sincere Christian in the 21st century.

Chef Mojo said...

For his next trick: Tebowing in the Rose Garden.

Jay said...

Andy R. said...

Sounds better than someone who is dumb enough to be a sincere Christian in the 21st century.


Hilarious.

What is even funnier is that Obama considers himself a sincere Christian.

So does Biden.

And you'll vote for them.

The idiot in this scenario would be you.

Jay said...

Andy R. said...

Sounds better than someone who is dumb enough to be a sincere Christian in the 21st century.


Being a Christian is "dumb" but being a silly, ignorant liberal college kid writing stupid things on the Internet is intelligent!

Old Dad said...

Andy,

Read the First Amendment until you get it. While you're at it, read the whole damn Constitution. It's in English.

Andy R. said...

What is even funnier is that Obama considers himself a sincere Christian.

If he is going to church for political reasons, then I'll take what I can get. I consider organized religion a bigger problem than personal belief in jesus.

Andy R. said...

Read the First Amendment until you get it.

I'm familiar. You're going to have to explain why you think it's relevant to this conversation. Use your words.

chickenlittle said...

Andy R wrote: I hope you will all join me in regularly denouncing evangelicals for their bigotry throughout the campaign, as I have no doubt there will be regular stories about their intolerance for Romneybot's wacky religion.

Will you denounce the Sullivanists when they go off on Romney's funny underwear again?

Andy R. said...

the Sullivanists

What's a Sullivanist?

Maguro said...

The Marine base service was probably ecumenical, but one week Episcopalian, another week Baptist. Can you get any more polar opposite within Protestantism than those two traditions? Looks less like theological searching and more like vote searching.

At this rate, Obama will be speaking in tongues and handling snakes in a Pentacostal church next week and leading prayers at Westboro Baptist by the end of February. Might as well cover all the bases, I guess. Pascal would certainly approve.

chickenlittle said...

Andr R. wrote: Sounds better than someone who is dumb enough to be a sincere Christian in the 21st century.

You sound like one offensive, intolerant guy, Andy. I don't think you're serious, though.

chickenlittle said...

What's a Sullivanist?

You are. Because I say so. Just an observation.

Jay said...

I consider organized religion a bigger problem than personal belief in jesus.

Which is why you're voting for Joe Biden, proud Catholic, for Vice President.

Old Dad said...

Andy said:

"I'm familiar [with the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America]. You're going to have to explain why you think it's relevant to this conversation. Use your words.

No you're not, and no I don't have to explain shit to you. You proved my point. Use your brain.

Andy R. said...

No you're not

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Use your words.

Indigo Red said...

What's a Sullivanist?

A new political term, Sullivanists call themselves conservatives while seldom embracing conservative policies, always do so inconsistently, and believe that all issues are subordinated to uber-issue same-sex marriage.

I believe the term is a reference to Andrew Sullivan.

EDH said...

There are no atheists in a...

political race that's within margin of error of all the polls.

Bruce Hayden said...

I guess, I don't think that it is that strange. There are a lot of people in this country who profess to a religion, but do not practice it all that much, at least from a faith point of view. Politicians though pretty much have to appear faithful, even when they aren't. Maybe just so that we can trust them.

Who here really believes that Bill Clinton is a man of faith? Sure, he could talk like a Baptist preacher. But, he has never come across to me as someone who let his faith interfere with his ambition, or, really, his lust. On the other hand, I don't think that anyone can doubt the faith of Jimmy Carter. And, I suspect that most of the modern Presidents fall somewhere in the middle.

Obama's problems are that he really didn't pick an official Presidential church, and he is waiting until the last year to show that he is, indeed, devout. To be a bit snarky, I might suggest that the former was because he couldn't find a church comparable to what he had been attending with Rev. Wright that was politically acceptable to the voting public, at least for running for a second term.

What must be kept in mind though is that a Democrat can get his Presidential nomination a lot more easily than a Republican can, without evidencing a decent amount of faith. Note how Gingrich had to show his conversion in order to overcome to some extent the public perception of his moral failings over the years. I don't think that it is as important for Democrats, and just ramping up going to miscellaneous churches over the next year may be sufficient for Obama. We shall see.

Oligonicella said...

Andy, you're being a bigoted asshole.

edutcher said...

Just like Willie did after the name, "Lewinsky", became a verb.

Andy R. said...

150 Christians just got together to try to find anyone other than Romney to support. They claim his wacky religion only "was a side note."

Actually, it said social Conservatives. Those nightsticks to the head are having an effect.

PS Hatman shows us he can copy and paste (hey, it's a start on the road to rehabilitation).

Now he can tell us what an "establishment of religion" is.

PPS I hope he stopped long enough to notice that the phrase "separation of church and state" is missing.

richard mcenroe said...

Can anybody get video of the baptismal font boiling over as he passes? Cuz that would be awesome.

Old Dad said...

Andy said: "Use your words."

Old Dad said: "Go fuck yourself."

I think we are getting somewhere vis a vis the First Amendment.

Andy R. said...

Andy, you're being a bigoted asshole.

I don't like organized religion, including especially Christianity. Is that not allowed anymore?

GMay said...

Andy, do tell what problems you think organized religion poses to our society. Be specific and show your work.

Andy R. said...

Now he can tell us what an "establishment of religion" is.

There are a lot of ways that people misunderstand and misapply the first amendment. Unless any of you care to explain why you think the first amendment is relevant to this conversation, I'll assume you're doing the same.

Old Dad said...

'There are a lot of ways that people misunderstand and misapply the first amendment."

Name two.

Andy R. said...

Name two.

People like to claim that having their comments deleted from a website is a violation of their first amendment rights. I'm pretty sure that has happened here at Althouse in previous threads if you feel like digging around.

Other people think that because it says Congress will not be "prohibiting the free exercise thereof" of religion that it means we can have schools lead prayer services in the classroom.

I could go on and on listing the ways that people misunderstand and misapply the first amendment. Unless you're going to explain why you think the first amendment is relevant to this conversation, I'm going to assume you are doing the same.

Chip S. said...

People like to claim that having their comments deleted from a website is a violation of their first amendment rights. I'm pretty sure that has happened here at Althouse in previous threads if you feel like digging around.

I'm pretty sure you're wrong about this. What people have discussed a lot on this site is free speech. Constitutional guarantees are restraints on government action. There are more dimensions to restraints on expression than that.

For example, there's self-restraint, which involves the recognition that civility sometimes involves forgoing occasional opportunities to express one's prejudices toward others in the interest of social harmony.

You seem to value this trait in others more than in yourself.

chickenlittle said...

Andy R wrote: I could go on and on listing the ways that people misunderstand and misapply the first amendment.

I could too.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion,.."

I suppose that could exempt the other two branches of government from doing so--to the extent that we allow them to usurp Congress' traditional role(s). It's proably been gone through already though.

chickenlittle said...

Party Time!

Go Packers!

ricpic said...

Good to know there's a Goddamn America church in the vicinity of the White House our President can avail himself of.

Old Dad said...

"Other people think that because it says Congress will not be "prohibiting the free exercise thereof" of religion that it means we can have schools lead prayer services in the classroom."

Happens every day in all 57 states.

Andy R. said...

hey, Old Dad, are you going to explain why you think the first amendment applies to this conversation because it's looking more and more like you don't know what you are talking about and are avoiding answering the question?

MayBee said...

If he is going to church for political reasons, then I'll take what I can get. I consider organized religion a bigger problem than personal belief in jesus.

Because using religion for political purposes has never caused any problems! That's historical fact.

Old Dad said...

"hey, Old Dad, are you going to explain why you think the first amendment applies to this conversation because it's looking more and more like you don't know what you are talking about and are avoiding answering the question?"

No. I'm not sure why you've been posting about it.

Andy R. said...

No. I'm not sure why you've been posting about it.

Well, you popped in here with your grand announcement about the importance of the first amendment and now it's embarrassing seeing you refuse to explain why you think it's relevant, and I'm trying to save you the embarrassment.

bgates said...

If he is going to church for political reasons, then I'll take what I can get. I consider organized religion a bigger problem than personal belief in jesus.

If he's going to church only for political reasons (and he is), then he doesn't have a personal belief in Jesus.

On the other hand, the President's public display of support could be seen as bolstering organized religion.

Old Dad said...

"Well, you popped in here with your grand announcement about the importance of the first amendment and now it's embarrassing seeing you refuse to explain why you think it's relevant, and I'm trying to save you the embarrassment."

Well, I tried. It's your First Amendment right to keep hatin' on those wacky Mormons, and Jesus freaks. Hey,do you know the one about how many Jews you can fit in an ash tray?

Andy R. said...

Well, I tried. It's your First Amendment right to keep hatin' on those wacky Mormons, and Jesus freaks.

You tried what? To explain why you thought the first amendment was relevant to this conversation?

Is the reason you told me to read the first amendment because you want me to know that I have a free speech right to criticize organized religion?

Oh, and please do finish your jew joke. You've been doing such a great job of elevating the discourse around here so far.

edutcher said...

Andy R. said...

Now he can tell us what an "establishment of religion" is.

There are a lot of ways that people misunderstand and misapply the first amendment. Unless any of you care to explain why you think the first amendment is relevant to this conversation, I'll assume you're doing the same.


English translation: he doesn't really know, but he's had his head filled with a lot of Lefty propaganda and he's too intellectually lazy to question.

Other people think that because it says Congress will not be "prohibiting the free exercise thereof" of religion that it means we can have schools lead prayer services in the classroom.

What, O, what will Hatman do is another bunch of Supremes overrule the Warren Court on this?

Not only will his head explode, so will his hat.

Andy R. said...

What, O, what will Hatman do is [sic] another bunch of Supremes overrule the Warren Court on this?

You can keep praying on that one...

edutcher said...

The death penalty was overturned, separate but equal was overturned.

Eventually, the country comes to its senses on these things.

And, yes, prayer has been the beginning of many a change.

Palladian said...

It's generally expected that men remove their hats when inside a church.

I'm trying to think of faiths that allow or require hats.

Maybe one could get away with a crooked yarmulke when at synagogue.

Palladian said...

Or one could become a Sikh and wear a crooked turban.

GMay said...

How totally unexpected that Andy chooses not to articulate what his huge beef with organized religion is.

Palladian said...

Eh, probably, easier to just remain a secular douchebag with a crooked cap.

Maguro said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Mary Beth said...

Who wouldn't vote for a Mormon regardless of party affiliation.

Hint, the categories with the highest percentages are neither Protestant nor Republican. The poll is from last June and the results may be different today but I doubt it would be very different.

Andy R. said...

How totally unexpected that Andy chooses not to articulate what his huge beef with organized religion is.


It convinces people to believe in a god that doesn't exist, thereby supporting the idea that we should accept things without evidence. [I'm not sure if we're also including groups that don't have a "god" figure in the category of organized religion.]

Second, it requires delineating between "us" and "them" in ways that I think are damaging, although that tends to differ in the specifics between different religions.

Palladian said...

To be fair GMay, Andy's a queer like me, and many "organized" religions tend to have very wacky and unpleasant opinions of us.

The wonderful thing about Protestantism is that it's a disorganized religion, which allows almost anyone to remain a Christian and still find a sect that doesn't condemn you.

Andy R. said...

To be fair GMay, Andy's a queer like me

I'm actually a gay atheist with jewish heritage, so when you weigh the amount of killing the Christian church has done of gays, jews, and atheists compared to me saying some mean things on a blog, I think it's clear who the real bigots are.

Palladian said...

But of course it's much easier to be a member of the "reality-based community"... You know, the people who believe that humans have the mystical power to change global weather and temperature patterns by driving a Prius and who can happily vote for a man who, for religious reasons, is opposed to same-sex marriage.

edutcher said...

All it means is that Hatman needs somebody to hate because life just isn't fair (sniffle) to him and Occupying stuff is his little way of saying, "I hate you! I hate you! I hate you!", to everybody.

GMay said...

AndyR said: "It convinces people to believe in a god that doesn't exist, thereby supporting the idea that we should accept things without evidence."

"Religion" doesn't convince anyone. You're committing a common fallacy - applying rationality to the inherently non-rational. Apples to oranges, as it were. You obviously misunderstand the entire concept of faith.

"Second, it requires delineating between "us" and "them" in ways that I think are damaging, although that tends to differ in the specifics between different religions."

This is no different than liberal/progressive ideology and is clearly evidenced by every single one of your postings on this thread. The fact that you are either blissfully unaware, or willfully ignoring it, is quite clear to the casual observer.

Take it from a fellow non-believer.

gk1 said...

Honestly who cares what President Phoney does these days anyway? Its just a church Axelrod picked for him to go to because it polled well. Its not like he has any beliefs other than getting himself relected

Andy R. said...

Its not like he has any beliefs other than getting himself relected

I really hope this isn't coming from a Romney supporter...

Maguro said...

I'm actually a gay atheist with jewish heritage, so when you weigh the amount of killing the Christian church has done of gays, jews, and atheists compared to me saying some mean things on a blog, I think it's clear who the real bigots are.

Well, if you want to play that card, just consider that communists (who are atheists), have killed more people than than the Christian church, whatever that is.

So you should really be saying mean things on blogs about communists, if killing's what bothers you.

GMay said...

AndyR said: "...so when you weigh the amount of killing the Christian church has done of gays, jews, and atheists compared to me saying some mean things on a blog, I think it's clear who the real bigots are."

Well, if you want to dredge up history as a defense of your current bigotry, a far more recent history doesn't support you when you remember what the atheists did in Russia, China, and Cambodia.

When you look at it in terms of quantity as well, I'd say the atheists come out on top there too.

Did you have a better example to distract the thread from your overt bigotry?

Palladian said...

Atheists, in the form of Communists and Fascists, have killed hundreds of millions of people, specifically targeting populations of Jews, ethnic minorities and homosexuals, and this has all happened, unlike sectarian Christianity's transgressions, within living memory.

Organized religion isn't the culprit, it's the dark vestiges of ancient savagery inside the human soul, feebly justified by political, religious, or tribal ideas, that's to blame.

GMay said...

Palladian said: "To be fair GMay, Andy's a queer like me, and many "organized" religions tend to have very wacky and unpleasant opinions of us."

I wonder if his disdain and bigotry extends toward Islam with even more fervor since their history of killing gays and Jews is still being made.

Andy R. said...

I wonder if his disdain and bigotry extends toward Islam with even more fervor since their history of killing gays and Jews is still being made.

Of course.

Palladian said...

And don't give us your civility bullshit, pretending that you object to the "us and them" mentality of religions, when you and your kind do it all the time, justified by political and ideological difference. Humans always find clever ways to revert to their savagely insular tribal past, and you are not immune to it, hip hat styling and sophomoric sarcasm and all.

ken in sc said...

South Carolina is full of evangelicals and Baptists, and Romney is leading in the polls here. People are going to vote against Obama. They are not going to quibble about Mormonism if it gets in the way of voting Obama out.

Palladian said...

Oh yeah, it goes without saying that the in-crowd totally is not down with Islam either.

No, really, it almost always "goes without saying". Like, literally, they almost never say anything about Islam's intense and vicious bigotry against homosexuals, because, well, it's, like, part of their noble cultural heritage and, you know, who are we to judge them?

Plus those guys are totally scary.

n.n said...

He's serving the market. The market, that is the voting American citizens, should remember just how unreliable his service has been. Obama desperately needs to review his quality control procedures. He should take note that an inconsistent process is more than sufficient for the market to reject what he is selling. Perhaps, he could ask GM to explain it to him.

gk1 said...

This is just another phoney manuever like "pivoting to jobs". Every couple of months axelrod and plouffe read polling about how much old people hate obama and think hes a muslim. So they figure out some phoney church angle to play. He's not fooling anyone, I wish he would just stop it. He's only inconveniencing people who really do believe in god and have to deal with the secret service every sunday. Do everyone a favor and Stay home, ASSHOLE!

Jason said...

Liberals are always assuming everyone else is as stupid and bigoted as they are - after all, the have no other frame of reference to use - and are therefore always projecting their worst qualities onto others.

Jay said...

Andy R. said...

I'm actually a gay atheist with jewish heritage, so when you weigh the amount of killing the Christian church has done of gays, jews, and atheists


Hilarious.

Your historical knowledge consists of silly ignorance.

But don't worry, you're happy to share that ignorance on the Internet each day.

Jay said...

Andy R. said...


It convinces people to believe in a god that doesn't exist, thereby supporting the idea that we should accept things without evidence.


The entirety of your political beliefs consists of accepting things without evidence.

Examples include: AGW, government spending creates jobs, you are intelligent & informed but the other side is not, et. al.

David said...

Mormons are the new Jews. It's completely ok to be bigoted against them because they are so, well, different.

The evangelicals, who are subject to some of the same prejudices, are starting to figure this out.

Pogo said...

Peter Hitchens (Christopher's brother):

"''Last century we tried godlessness on a grand scale and the effects were devastating. Nazism, Stalinism, Pol-Pottery, mass murder and broken relationships: all promoted by state-imposed atheism or culture-insinuated secularism.

Atheism is a licence for ruthlessness, and appeals to the ruthless."

LilyBart said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
LilyBart said...

Has this become the Andy R show?

People - he's just a jerk trying to get a rise out of you. Just ingore him

Paul said...

Which Mosque did he go to Ann?

Or did he go to Jeremiah 'God Damn America' Wright's service.

Obama called for transparency, and Obama is transparent, and not in the since he said it.

Phil 3:14 said...

Considering how the evangelicals are going to feel about voting for a Mormon, this might actually work.
Andy,
Speaking as an evangelical,you no idea.

But go ahead and comfort in you belief.

As for the Obama's going to church, it should be noted that tomorrow is MLK Day.

Phil 3:14 said...

But speaking of Andy,

does Bill Maher comment on blogs?

Palladian said...

"Speaking as an evangelical,you no idea."

And, judging by your past comments here, you're far more tolerant and open-minded than Andy R., supposed liberal, has ever shown himself to be in his comments here.

Funny, that.

J Allen said...

He's attending a church which supports the occupy folks. Let me show you my surprised face 8~O

Mark said...

Sounds better than someone who is dumb enough to be a sincere Christian in the 21st century.

Obama's greatest strength has always been the gift that individual voters want to believe his lies are only to fool the idiots who don't believe as the individual (and obviously Obama, because he's smart and hip and cool and some other thing that no correct-thinking post-hippie can say) believe.

Obama is a con man. If he twitches left, or even radical, it's simply because he marinated in that particular pot on the way to his true calling. In the end, he'll do what he thinks will get the bling from the suckers. And like all confidence players, as the suckers get wise, he'll get more desperate, and start playing longer odds. Standard procedure when you're out of outs is to hit the road and get a new name.

That's actually pretty scary, because at this point Obama is out of outs and has nowhere to go.

Mick said...

Pure, shameless, political theater.

Obama was born British, of a Kenyan British subject father.

Obama can recite the adhan (shahada+) with a perfect arabic accent.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/06/opinion/06kristof.html

A single honest recitation of the Shahadah in Arabic is all that is required for a person to become a Muslim.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shahada

Although Obama Sr. was supposedly atheist, Obama Jr. studied the Koran. Could Obama simply be practicing Taqiyya by saying he is not Muslim, and going to a Christian church? Possibly, like everything about him one must sift through the layers of lies and half truths.

The fact is that by the words of Federalist #68, Obama had an "improper ascendant" (ancestor), he is not a "creature of our own" (sic). How can a "creature of our own" be the son of a Kenyan British subject?

Webster's 1913 Dictionary
As`cend´ant
n. 1. Ascent; height; elevation.
Sciences that were then in their highest ascendant.
- Temple.
2. (Astrol.) The horoscope, or that degree of the ecliptic which rises above the horizon at the moment of one's birth; supposed to have a commanding influence on a person's life and fortune.
3. Superiority, or commanding influence; ascendency; as, one man has the ascendant over another.
Chievres had acquired over the mind of the young monarch the ascendant not only of a tutor, but of a parent.
- Robertson.
4. An ancestor, or one who precedes in genealogy or degrees of kindred; a relative in the ascending line; a progenitor; - opposed to descendant.

Hoosier Daddy said...

"... I'm actually a gay atheist with jewish heritage, so when you weigh the amount of killing the Christian church has done of gays, jews, and atheists.."

Got anything more recent, like say in the last three centuries?

Damn good thing you don't live in an Islamic country. You score the infidel trifecta.