January 16, 2012

"Politicians and political operatives far beyond Wisconsin will be watching closely..."

"... not just for what the recall effort may imply for other states’ leaders who are considering cuts to workers’ benefits and union powers as a way to solve budget problems, but also as a sign for the presidential race."
... In 2008, Mr. Obama won here by almost 14 percentage points, and a Republican presidential candidate has not won Wisconsin since 1984. But overwhelming Republican victories in 2010 and a State Supreme Court election in 2011... has raised new questions for races in the fall, including a United States Senate seat left open by the retirement of Herb Kohl, a Democrat.

“It’s an early skirmish, a dry run, a fight of proxies and laboratory for experimentation,” Mordecai Lee, a former state legislator who teaches at the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, said of the recall’s significance for the presidential election.

On both sides, the recall could create a testing ground for larger national themes about collective bargaining and unions, and build volunteer and political operations (not to mention a list of some 720,000 recall signers) long before fall.
I'd say it's more than just an early test. It's a place to shape public opinion. An immense amount of money will be spent focusing attention on a pretty specific set of issues: government employees (and their benefits and unions) and how to balance the budget. Presumably Mitt Romney will have the Republican nomination sewn up and presidential politics may be in a bit of a lull. I'm picturing national party politics overshadowed by the crisply ideological fight we're having here in Wisconsin. Suddenly, the spokesperson for conservatism will be the little seen but oft-denounced Scott Walker. And holding up the liberal end of the argument will be... somebody. We don't know who. I wonder how that will work out.

I happen to believe Russ Feingold will step forward, even though he's said he won't.  (I explained why back here.)

125 comments:

David said...

Russ is gonna do it. He can't do anything else.

Scott M said...

Republican nomination sewn up and presidential politics may be in a bit of a lull. I'm picturing national party politics overshadowed by the crisply ideological fight we're having here in Wisconsin.

Agreed whole-heartedly. The political grognards will need fodder and this will supply it in piles.

Toshtu said...

"And holding up the liberal end of the argument will be... somebody. We don't know who"

Garage?

Beldar said...

Russ Feingold should indeed step forward -- hands held before him for the cuffs. He's as much to blame as anyone in (or recently out) of Washington for the crushing mountain of debt we've run up through overspending, and for the refusal to even begin to address our entitlements problems.

Yes, he's among the most articulate and charismatic of scoundrels. And I think he probably still has you fooled, Professor A, more the pity.

John Stodder said...

I don't know if "the liberal end of the argument" can be made other than in deeds -- the raw exercise of power at the ballot box, in TV advertising which will fail to engage the issue, and in the streets in an effort to win support through sloganeering and theatrics.

There is no argument to be made in opposition to Walker's efforts. They weren't undertaken ideologically. It's math.

If there is a Republican War on Science (really, that's a punch line), there is even more clearly a Democratic War on Arithmetic. Someone like Feingold, both intelligent and vain about his intelligence, won't want to get drawn into table debates on the topic, because he'll look like an idiot OR he'll end up conceding most of his side's points so as not to look like an idiot.

TosaGuy said...

So would the national dems want to pour money into this recall this summer when they have senate seats across the country to defend?

Would Obama stick his nose in this fight when all he would do is push WI independents who are on the fence with regard to Walker, but dead-set against Obama. (I do know people like this).

One thing we have learned is that Obama doesn't have and doesn't seem to be all that interested in coat tails.

A. Shmendrik said...

"including a United States Senate seat left open by the retirement of Herb Kohl"

I object! This implies that the seat is occupied at present!

Michael Haz said...

Two things will keep Russ Feingold out of the gubernatorial contest:

First - He lost his Senate seat to Ron Johnson by 52% to 47%. That was essentially a re-call of Russ Feingold. He won the majority of votes in only 15 counties. See this map. Loud voices from the liberals aside, what real reason is there to believe he could win an election against Walker?

Second - He wants to be a justice, preferably a SCOTUS justice. He's the ideal candidate for an Obama appointment. he's very liberal, teaches law and best of all, has no track record that could be held against him in confirmation hearings. Justices make law, at least in the liberal viewpoint. Feingold wants to make law, to effect public policy, but without the work of a political campaign.

He won't run. Katie Falk will.

edutcher said...

One gets the impression if Walker covers himself with glory here, 2020 would be his for the taking.

Chuck66 said...

Its kind of sad that Russ Feingold is trying to create hatred in this state ("THIS ISN'T OVER UNTIL WE WIN") just so he can have a tool (being Governor) to use as he runs for President.

What an evil person.

SteveR said...

As usual, John Stodder is correct. So what if Feingold wins? It won't change the reality that the evolution of salaries and benefits for public employees, throughout the nation, has created a taxpayer burden that can't be maintained.

He would be wise to avoid the trap.

garage mahal said...

Suddenly, the spokesperson for conservatism will be the little seen but oft-denounced Scott Walker.

He's too busy traveling out of state to shake down Texas billionaires and Swiftboat money.

I look forward to the excuses tomorrow when signatures are turned in.

"15,000 signatures per day, that's it??!"

"This is actually good news for Scott Walker!"

Dust Bunny Queen said...

There is no argument to be made in opposition to Walker's efforts. They weren't undertaken ideologically. It's math.

However.....liberals just don't understand math (or economics, or history or much of anything else) so all they have left is bankrupt ideology and memorized talking points.

You just can't stop stupid.

m stone said...

Stodder: There is no argument to be made in opposition to Walker's efforts. They weren't undertaken ideologically. It's math.

I never heard it. Oh, signature-counter: what have you to say?

Tim said...

"And holding up the liberal end of the argument will be... somebody. We don't know who. I wonder how that will work out."

That somebody will be America's Dairy Cow, bloviating on racist voter ID, attacks on union perquisites, Texas billionaires and Swiftboat money all the while ignoring the log that is in his own side's eyes.

Otherwise, Wisconsin is a small state; this union effort to overturn democracy will not resonate as much as people think.

TosaGuy said...

"Second - He wants to be a justice, preferably a SCOTUS justice. He's the ideal candidate for an Obama appointment. he's very liberal, teaches law and best of all, has no track record that could be held against him in confirmation hearings. Justices make law, at least in the liberal viewpoint. Feingold wants to make law, to effect public policy, but without the work of a political campaign."

Very astute observation. It is also one fits the Feingold model of having a very left ideological position, but don't have any responsibility regarding implementing that position.

Jay said...

to shake down Texas billionaires and Swiftboat money.


I love that.

The last gasp of a dying political movement.

Chip Ahoy said...

Grognard. What a perfect word.

I will incorporate it immediately into everyday speech.

Jay said...


I look forward to the excuses tomorrow when signatures are turned in.


You know that moron Murphy who impersonated Koch on the phone and is now going around the state trying to get more signatures?

He also said this:

So, 4000 rubes are dead. Cry me the Tigris. Another 30,000 have been seriously wounded. Boo f***ing hoo. They got what they asked for — and cool robotic limbs, too.”

Just another one of your hero's garbage.

Jay said...

garage and his ilk in action:

ichols said the officer “directed” the man to the ground and requested assistance. As he attempted to handcuff the man, a 25-year-old Appleton woman hit the officer in the back with her picket sign.

Both were arrested and taken to the Winnebago County Jail. Nichols said OPD recommended the man be charged with disorderly conduct and resisting arrest and that the woman be charged with disorderly conduct and battery to a police officer, a Class H felony


Gee, if you're on the side of all that is right & good, I guess that is why you have to commit battery on a police officer.

garage mahal said...

The last gasp of a dying political movement.

That's why Walker is away every week shaking down billionaires for his recall? Haha. You're such clueless rube it warms my heart every time you post, Jaytard.

ricpic said...

Yes, for those to whom the populace exists only to be experimented on (as in a laboratory) what a brake on continual experimentation the election of an *ugh* conservative must be. But not to worry: voila, a recall, and the experimentation will regain warp speed.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

That's why Walker is away every week shaking down billionaires for his recall?


Actually, he's doing no such thing.

But don't worry garbage, your troop-hating hero Murphy is getting a lot of time with Democratic state Senators. OH, and a lot of publicity too: "meet special guest Ian Murphy of the Daily Beast, famous for his ‘Fake David Koch’ phone call."

Isn't that lovely?

garage mahal said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Jay said...

garage mahal said...
I see it's time to dust off the "they hate troops!" from the Republican playbook.


Note you can't bring yourself to condemn Murphy.

You're pathetic.

garage mahal said...

I see it's time to dust off the "they hate troops!" from the Republican playbook. While Walker's top aides are embezzling funds meant for .......troops. I'm sure that will resonate throughout Wisconsin, Jay. Nice catch!

pfennig said...

The anti-Walker crowd ought to be scared about this recall campaign. It takes a little effort to vote. You actually have to go somewhere and you only can do it on election day election day itself. Or you can complete and mail in an absentee ballot, but that also takes a little effort.

In contrast, over the last 60 days, every time I turn around, there has been someone offering up a recall petition for me to sign. Wisconsinites have been solicited daily at dozens of venues to sign. Signing a recall petition is much easier and simpler than voting.

I saw people out trying to collect recall signatures on Thanksgiving day and Christmas day. While it might say something about the dedication of the Walker opponents, I think it also says something about their desperation as well.

I am sure that they will get the required amount of signatures and may they will get 50,000 more. But given how easy it was to sign a petition if one were inclined to do so, I think the starting premise would be that millions of those who chose not to sign are either going to support Walker or are not going to vote against him.

garage mahal said...

They'll be many a campaign ads run from that fake Koch call. Plenty of time to talk about Walker talking to Murphy about sending troublmakers into the crowd. How he "dropped the bomb" on Wisconsin the week after the Super Bowl. How he openly lied about tricking Democrats into coming back for a vote. Good times Jay. Good times.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...
I see it's time to dust off the "they hate troops!" from the Republican playbook


Yes because quoting someone's own words is a "playbook" to the silly children like you.

Note that you can't criticize Murphy at all for his disgusting words.

Not at all.

Jay said...

How he openly lied about tricking Democrats into coming back for a vote.

Yet another lie.

You can't make a single post here without lying.

garage mahal said...

It's in the transcript fool.

Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...

Jay, thanks for the Ian Murphy link. It's good to see the real thoughts behind the left's latest hero.

Alex said...

Garage - why do you think it's ok to entrap politicians with fake calls?

TosaGuy said...

The danger to those of us who fight the political fight every day is that we forget that most people don't give a crap about political gotcha moments that will have happened over a year before any vote is cast.

Fake Koch Call vs. People's property tax bills with either cuts or insignificant increases? Which point will pursuade a true independent voter?

Scott M said...

Garage - why do you think it's ok to entrap politicians with fake calls?

Is that call by Murphy any different from James O'Keefe's various stings?

Patrick said...

Garage: In the interest of fairness, I'll reserve judgment on whether you agree with your side's hero Mr. Murphy, particularly how he feels about those who serve in the military. So, how do you feel about what he wrote? And, why don't you think your side can come up with no better spokesman? Seems most decent people would run from someone like that.

John M Auston said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Jay said...

ge mahal said...
It's in the transcript fool.


Yeah, you keep telling yourself that.

John M Auston said...

When we Baby Boomers were graduating in the 70's, and entering the work force, a wide-spread meme was that you could take a job with an organization, work 30-35 years, build up a pension, and perhaps retire in your early 60's, to live a couple of decades in financial peace.

Most of us entered the private sector to accomplish this, but (too) many of us entered the public sector.

We failed to imagine, however, let alone take into account, unprecedented events such as 9-11, massive and wide-spread crony capitalism, a thoroughly corrupt self-enriching political class, housing bubble, etc.

Those of us in the private sector watched it adjust to these changing conditions, and were hurt in the process. But the sector HAD to adjust, and that is its long term strength (and what recommends it over other less efficient and ultimately disastrous methods), though it is clearly a double-edged sword.

Those in the public sector, however, had codified in contract law, their retirement futures (and there is the mistake society made) and made it impervious to external economic conditions.

That was a HUGE mistake for society to have allowed, and though we may not be able to undo it now, we should at least halt the suicidal practice, going forward.

Seems to me that is all Walker and his supporters are trying to do. And that makes him evil?

SteveR said...

You know Garage, nobody you need or want to be convinced of anything is subject to influence by using the "Koch" angle.

Make an argument, maybe even your own. Don't use scare names and bogus statistics or rumors. No one side in Wisconsin has the high ground on the issue of outside the state money.

You've proven yourself to be unwilling or unable to stick with facts, so your not doing your side any good, as you persist.

garage mahal said...

Yeah, you keep telling yourself that.


Walker: So the paycheck thing, some of the other things threaten them. I think, collectively, there’s enough going on and as long as they don’t think I’m gonna cave — which, again, we have no interest in — an interesting idea that was brought up to me this morning by my chief of staff, we won’t do it until tomorrow, is putting out an appeal to the Democrat leader that I would be willing to sit down and talk to him, the assembly Democrat leader, plus the other two Republican leaders — talk, not negotiate — and listen to what they have to say if they will in turn — but I’ll only do it if all 14 of them come back and sit down in the state Assembly. They can recess it, to come back if we’re talking, but they all have to be back there. The reason for that is, we’re verifying it this afternoon, but legally, we believe, once they’ve gone into session, they don’t physically have to be there. If they’re actually in session for that day and they take a recess, the 19 Senate Republicans could then go into action and they’d have a quorum because they started out that way. Um, so we’re double checking that. But that would be the only, if you heard that I was going to talk to them, that would be the only reason why".

Chip S. said...

That's not a BFD IMO.

Calypso Facto said...

OMG!!! While illegally wiretapping the state's Governor, he recorded a statement about Walker considering doing something deceitful, but not illegal, that, in the end he didn't do? Whoa!

garage mahal said...

Walker didn't do it because Dems weren't dumb enough to go along with it.

Jay said...

How he openly lied about tricking Democrats into coming back for a vote.


And of course the "transcript" comes from the source of ____ again?

Patrick said...

I sort of wonder how much difference it makes whether the governor "tried to trick" the Dems into returning to session, where they were legally required to be. Especially since the Dems were doing the bidding of their puppet masters in the public unions, attempting only to line the pockets of the union bosses at the expense of the taxpayers.

I'm not sure that's a winning argument for you, Garage. I guess we'll find out.

Jay said...

How he openly lied about tricking Democrats into coming back for a vote.


Who did he "openly lie" to again?

Oh wait, he didn't.

Never mind.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...
Walker didn't do it because Dems weren't dumb enough to go along with it.


So he didn't openly lie about this "trick" then did he?

Boy, when you're so emotionally invested in this outcome I guess facts just can't get in the way.

garage mahal said...

So he didn't openly lie about this "trick" then did he?

Ah, yea he did. He told the public one thing [he wanted to negotiate with Dems] and told the truth [he never intended to negotiate with anyone] to who he thought was David Koch.

Debating you always feels like I'm doing it with one arm tied behind my back.

Tom Spaulding said...

If you need arms to debate, you're doing it wrong.

Patrick said...

Even if discussing a plan to consider thinking about tricking the Dems could be considered "lying," (and nothing in the statement indicates he did not want to negotiate with them), I still doubt that would be worse in the minds of nearly all Wisconsinites than what Ian Murphy wrote about those serving in the armed forces. Any Dem who voluntarily appears with that freak ought to be ashamed. Most, however, have shown themselves to be utterly without shame.

Beta Rube said...

I am not sure that reminding the voters about the dereliction and fleeing to another state of 14 Democrats is less damaging than the Governor using gray tactics to cajole them home to do their job.

Rusty said...

garage mahal said...
So he didn't openly lie about this "trick" then did he?

Ah, yea he did. He told the public one thing [he wanted to negotiate with Dems] and told the truth [he never intended to negotiate with anyone] to who he thought was David Koch.

Debating you always feels like I'm doing it with one arm tied behind my back.



But such silence when our current president does it as a matter of course.

When you lose this next political ploy to remove your governor I will feel very sad for you.

Donald Douglas said...

Ann, they're not "liberals." We haven't had liberals since Truman or Kennedy. They're progressives. Russ Feingold is progressive, as was Paul Wellstone. These people have taken the Democrat Party to the far, extreme left of the spectrum. You know that first hand.

garage mahal said...

Patrick
The Dem 14 were breaking no laws. Law enforcement told Fitzgerald they would not arrest them. But Fitz sent them on a wild good chase, for nothing. Is dragging a 8 month old pregnant women feet first into the Capitol what you really want to see from your government?

Alex said...

garage - but they are forever known as "Fleebaggers". That is their perpetual ignominy.

John M Auston said...

Is dragging a 8 month old pregnant women feet first into the Capitol what you really want to see from your government?

I know they start them young in some segments of our society, but I didn't know THAT young.

ic said...

Stodder: "Someone like Feingold...will look like an idiot OR he'll end up conceding most of his side's points so as not to look like an idiot."

Or he'll prove Wisconsians who voted for him are idiots.

Patrick said...

I must have missed where anybody dragged a pregnant lady into the Capital, and certainly wouldn't want to see it. Of course, not being a sexist, I don't want to see anyone - man, woman, pregnant or not - dragged into the Capital. I would want to see elected representatives do what they are elected to do, i.e. show up when called into session.

(Incidentally, I got quite a kick out of the awkward phrasing, implying that an 8 month old was pregnant!)

It's probably semantics, but when the Assembly is in session, representatives are required by the Rules of the Assembly to be there. Whether failure to do so is a crime is something on which I do not care to opine, but it is certainly a breach of their sworn duty. But, I suppose they take their duty to the union bosses more seriously than to their constituents or the WI Constitution. Good thing for Citizens United, or that cash could dry up.

Gulp!

damikesc said...

Is dragging a 8 month old pregnant women feet first into the Capitol what you really want to see from your government?

Yes, expecting pregnant women to do their jobs is asking way too much of them.

I know you love the whole "By Any Means Necessary" nonsense --- but this stuff ends up biting you back in the butt over time.

The fleebaggers should have had every dime of funding for their staffers removed for a 12 month period as a punishment.

Patrick said...

Although I missed the dragging of the pregnant 8 month old into the Capital, I did hear about the Democrat yelling at the Republican "You are dead."

Definitely not what I want to see from my government (although to be candid, I am a former, not current resident of WI). In fact, there are lots of things done by the Democrats, and the public unions that most decent people would not want to associate with (e.g. yelling crude things at 14 year olds). Seemed pretty par for the course for the left in '11. One wonders where the adults are in the Democratic party.

Rusty said...

Is dragging a 8 month old pregnant women feet first into the Capitol what you really want to see from your government?


You mean an woman who is eight months pregnant?

Alex said...

Is dragging a 8 month old pregnant women feet first into the Capitol what you really want to see from your government?

Interesting that the preggoid Fleebagger had the energy to flee to Illinois, but no more energy to come back to Madison. Funny that?

Alex said...

I did hear about the Democrat yelling at the Republican "You are dead."

Garage - answer that or GTFO. You are the one who is King of the Gotcha Games, so either play or fuck off.

garage mahal said...

Fitzgerald said he would have the Dem 14 "dragged feet first" into the Captiol. Julie Lassa was 8 months pregnant at the time.

garage mahal said...

Patrick
Fitzgerald said he would have the Dem 14 "dragged feet first" into the Captiol. Julie Lassa was 8 months pregnant at the time.

Alex said...

Fitzgerald said he would have the Dem 14 "dragged feet first" into the Captiol. Julie Lassa was 8 months pregnant at the time.

Ever hear of a "figure of speech" garage - or do you just enjoy playing childish games?

garage mahal said...

Fitz had a legal memorandum drawn up costing 27k that he claimed gave him the power to do just that.

Alex said...

Fitz had a legal memorandum drawn up costing 27k that he claimed gave him the power to do just that.

Show me the memo that literally said "drag them feet first" or GTFO garbage. I'm sick of your childish games.

Tom Spaulding said...

Fitzgerald said he would have the Dem 14 "dragged feet first" into the Captiol. Julie Lassa was 8 months pregnant at the time.

This is not allowed in GarageLand.

I did hear about the Democrat yelling at the Republican "You are dead."

This is allowed in GarageLand.

Cognitive Dissonance...it's a bitch.

Patrick said...

Seems I'm not the only one who caught the "8 month pregnant" thing. I might be the only one to admit that I nearly made the mistake myself.

As for what Fitzgerald said, Garage, I really doubt that he was thinking of the pregnant lady when he said that. Plus, if he'd exempted her, then all the others would have been shoving pillows down their shirts, and then where would we be?

Look, I know you don't like these guys, but that sort of thing really seems like an unnecessary stretch. When people see the truth stretched like that (juxtaposition of two unrelated facts), they tend to get suspicious of those behind the stretching. You don't like the policies, I get that. Argue the policies, not some BS about things that never happened, and weren't ever likely to happen. Almost no one is as into this crap as you and I, and they aren't going to buy it.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...
Patrick
The Dem 14 were breaking no laws.


So?

Walker broke no laws.

garage mahal said...

As for what Fitzgerald said, Garage, I really doubt that he was thinking of the pregnant lady when he said that.

It is a fact Fitzgerald had a legal memorandum drawn that he claimed gave him the authority to have all Dem 14 delivered to the Capitol, "with or without force".

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

Ah, yea he did. He told the public one thing [he wanted to negotiate with Dems] and told the truth [he never intended to negotiate with anyone] to who he thought was David Koch.


Um, no, no he did not.

You can present no public statements from Gov Walker demonstrating this.

garage mahal said...
Walker didn't do it because Dems weren't dumb enough to go along with it.


Which of course is contradictory and incoherent.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

It is a fact Fitzgerald had a legal memorandum drawn that he claimed gave him the authority to have all Dem 14 delivered to the Capitol, "with or without force"


Which of course means FEET FIRST!!!`111!??/!!

I guess when you're on the losing side of history, this is what you cling to.

garage mahal said...

Shorter Jay, every post, with fingers in his ears:

"Na na na na nahh! I can't hear you I can't hear you!".

Patrick said...

A "legal memorandum" was drawn. Fine. Your comment was about dragging a pregnant lady into the Capital. If you want to condemn the idea that the Assembly has the right to enforce its rules, feel free to do so. When you obfuscate, you make your position suspect.

Do you claim that the position taken in the "legal memorandum was wrong?" Do you claim that the position taken in the "legal memorandum" was without any basis at all, that it was frivolous? Should the Assembly Majority not have the right to research their legal rights in unprecedented situations?

The "fact" that such a "legal memorandum" exists is interesting, but without answers to the above doesn't help a fair observer reach any conclusion whatsoever. In other words, your initial comment about dragging a pregnant lady into the Capital was pure demagoguery, or however the hell you spell that friggin word.

Scott M said...

Shorter Jay, every post, with fingers in his ears:

"Na na na na nahh! I can't hear you I can't hear you!".


Shorter Garage Mahal:

"Squirrel!!!"

Seriously, GM. Not every movement is perfect. Case in point, I had one this morning that looks exactly like you.

garage mahal said...

Patrick
Of course it is wrong to arrest people and have them carried into the Captiol, when they were not breaking any laws, and is forbidden by the state consitution. Why does that need to be explained?

Tom Spaulding said...

Of course it is wrong to run to Illinois to prevent a Republican-controlled government from voting when they were not breaking any laws. Why does that need to be explained?

This is fun. Hardly requires any thought/effort at all. I see the attraction Progressivism has for the lazy. Intoxicating.

Patrick said...

So, Garage, you're retracting your statement about dragging pregnant ladies into the Capitol, and replacing it with your distaste for allowing the Assembly to enforce its rules. At least we have clarity. Thanks for your retraction.

I'm no expert in Constitutional law, especially WI's, but I doubt the issue is as clear as you make it out. Each branch has its own powers and obligations, and each is generally allowed to enforce its rules. Still, at most, you've got Fitz relying on a "legal memorandum," whose author I'm not sure has been identified. You obviously disagree with its analysis (while providing none of your own), but again, I suspect it's less than crystal clear. Of course, this would not have been an issue had the Dems taken their sworn obligations seriously.

Seeing Red said...

Excuse me, equal rights and all that, if she's PG and can't handle the workload, she should have stepped down. This looks like GM is defending her using her PG not to do her job. She chose and took the risk.

garage mahal said...

If you feel a women 8 months pregnant should be taken to the Capitol, by force, Fitzwalkerstan is your kind of place.

Tom Spaulding said...

If you feel a Progressive should shout "You are dead" to a female Republican in the Capitol, GarageLand is your kind of place.


See, it's that easy.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...
Shorter Jay, every post, with fingers in his ears:


Yes, let's review your bird droppings shall we?

1. Make silly, unverified claim.

2. Provide "proof" of claim by pasting a conveniently unsourced "transcript"

3. Said "transcript" does not say what was claim

4. Then inject that Walker didn't do it anyway

5. Provide no evidence of any public statement by Walker saying he wants to "negotiate"

6. Pretend you "won"

7. Rinse, repeat bird dropping pattern on other topics.

garage mahal said...

6. Pretend you "won"

Seriously, any moron can out-debate you, Jaytard. What I think is cute is that you think you're "helping" your side.

Tom Spaulding said...

Garage, you're not just any moron, you're the moron that can't defend his own positions on Althouse's blog.

Pride!

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

Seriously, any moron can out-debate you, Jaytard


I think it is hysterical you believe you're engaging in a "debate"

garage mahal said...

you're the moron that can't defend his own positions on Althouse's blog.

Is there is a position of mine you're confused about?

Jay said...

garage mahal said...

Seriously, any moron can out-debate you, Jaytard.


Mind you, as a response to me pointing out he believes he won something.

You are beyond parody.

Tom Spaulding said...

Stop ignoring this and defend it:

Rep. Gordon Hintz apologized to Republican Rep. Michelle Litjens for comments he made on the Assembly floor last week immediately following a vote on Gov. Scott Walker’s contentious budget repair bill. Hintz shouted a threatening obscenity that a number of witnesses heard amid the loud uproar after the chamber’s GOP majority successfully passed the bill.

According to local WTMJ news radio, a number of witnesses heard Hintz shout “You’re f***ing dead!” at Litjens.


No word on whether she was 8 months pregnant, and he meant her AND her unborn.

That's your side in action. Embrace it.

Alex said...

Notice what garage does - he tries to have it both ways. First he lobs grenades, then he tries to take a condescending professorial tone. Very clever garage, but it won't work here.

garage mahal said...

That's your side in action. Embrace it.

Sure, right after you embrace the death threats to WI Dems and people gathering signatures.

Patrick said...

Garage, did any elected Representative make threats to petition gatherers?

Did any Republicans storm into the Capitol? Did any Republicans deface the War Memorial? Did any Republicans scream obscenities at children? Did any Republicans shout death threats at Democrats in session?

The best you've got is a "legal memorandum." No reference to pregnant women.

Embrace your inner demagogue.

Tom Spaulding said...

Sure, right after you embrace the death threats to WI Dems and people gathering signatures.

Sure, right after you embrace the death threats to Wi GOP and businesses not showing enough "solidarity".

Keep going, I got all the ammo I need. Reams of it. You seem to think some "dragging pregnant women around" fake quote is going to influence the electorate.

Progressives through a hissy fit against the very people who pay for their salaries and pensions. Claims of "Dragging Pregnant women thru the Capitol" (not "just a clump of cells" in this case, eh?) are not going to win the argument.

I know you wish it were so.

Jay said...

garage mahal said...


Sure, right after you embrace the death threats to WI Dems and people gathering signatures.


I'd love for you to source that claim.

GMay said...

Who was that one elected official that was calling for blood in the streets again?

GMay said...

How sad is it that democratically-elected Democrats have to be dragged kicking and screaming back to the democratic process?

GMay said...

I love the faux compassion for the pregnant woman. I'm quite sure that most committed liberals aren't really concerned for the health of her unborn baby.

garage mahal said...

I'm quite sure that most committed liberals aren't really concerned for the health of her unborn baby.

I see you're all tore up about it.

vnjagvet said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Petunia said...

What will resonate throughout Wisconsin, Garage, is that Walker's county executive administration notified the DA when they realized there was something suspicious going on with the veterans' funds, and that of the three men arrested, only one was really a Walker aide, and one, the one with child pornography on his phone, works for the state department in charge of public schools, which is presided over by someone who is not appointed by the governor.

But don't let facts get in the way of what you think are effective arguments, but which are really only mindless bloviating.

vnjagvet said...

Garage's arguments on this thread suggest that he is getting lessons from Martin Short's Nathan Thurm

GMay said...

"I see you're all tore up about it."

You can't see whether I've indicated one way or the other, but thanks for playing.

James said...

I thought that after collecting 800,000 unimpeachable recall signatures; Garage and his band of Jeremys would be out celebrating and pouring beer on elected representatives, before their triumphant presentation of signed petitions to the GAB tomorrow.

Francisco D said...

This group is more erudite than one finds one other sites. What really confuses me is why Althousians continually feed the troll.

Garbage can be civil at times, but he is only repeating Daily Kos talking points. He's not as nuts as the former psych nurse who departed these shores, but he really has nothing to offer to inquiring minds.

Please feel free to tell me what I have missed.

damikesc said...

Sure, right after you embrace the death threats to WI Dems and people gathering signatures.

What elected Republican official threatened to kill an elected Democratic official?

I know of one WI Democrat who was threatened. Namely, Althouse.

I bet her threat wasn't made by a conservative.

Silly wingnut.

garage mahal said...

Garbage can be civil at times, but he is only repeating Daily Kos talking points

As Walker likes to say, I'm only talking about what I read in the papers.

Michael Haz said...

In his 2003 State of the State address, then-Governor Jim Doyle said to the residents of Wisconsin, “We should not, we must not, and I will not raise taxes.”

What an effing liar.

You okay with that lie, Garage? Just checking, because you seem to get your undies in a knot when governors lie.

Patrick said...

Garage is frequently civil, although he gets testy from time to time. Like all of us, I suppose. But, the people he associates with, politically speaking at least, do not help his image.

MadisonMan said...

Wisconsinites have been solicited daily at dozens of venues to sign.

Where do you live? I've been asked twice in person, and I've driven by one place where someone was outside asking.

Revenant said...

If Walker loses it will signal a refutation of the Republican Party's wicked anti-union campaigning and a ringing endorsement for both Barack Obama and the Democratic Party as a whole.

If Walker wins, it doesn't mean anything.

MadisonMan said...

Katherine Falk running for Governor is destined to fail. I don't know if anyone is telling her she can possibly win, but if they are, they're lying. I don't think a Democratic Politician could win. A Democratic Businessman (or woman) would have a better chance.

Because Walker is a Career Politician.

Because Walker is overseeing a freefall in jobs in Wisconsin. You can argue that it's not his fault, but he did campaign on 250K jobs in 4 years. I don't think even that very modest promise will pan out.

The difficulty for the Democratic Party is that all the energy behind The Recall is driven by Unions and the farther left corner of the party that is anchored in Dane County. But a Dane Co politician can't possibly win, IMO.

Prediction: The Successful (if it happens) Democratic Nominee will never mention Unions in the election (if it happens).

Tim said...

"Please feel free to tell me what I have missed."

Not much, except that while it's true that dairy cows are pretty docile, as kept, domesticated animals, they aren't raised to think for themselves, let alone take care of themselves. Like Blanche DuBois, they are wholly dependent upon the kindness of strangers.

After all, how many wild, let alone free-range cows are there roaming the fruited plains?

By themselves, they'd go extinct.

garage mahal said...

You okay with that lie, Garage? Just checking, because you seem to get your undies in a knot when governors lie..

I was living in FL at the time so I don't remember that one. Did this trigger one of the unsuccessful recall attempts against Doyle? [Okay if you're a Republican].

gk1 said...

I hope the democrats dump millions into this mess. I really do. In the end they are trying to support something(,public service unions with entitlement issues) that is collapsing under its own weight. Knock yourself out, retards.

Unknown said...

.....Swiftboat money.

Man, that's comedy gold. Thanks Garage!

Unknown said...

.....campaign ads run from that fake Koch call. Plenty of time to talk about Walker talking to Murphy about sending troublmakers into the crowd.....

Yes, I distinctly remember that part of the conversation where Murphy made all those remarks and Walker said "uh-huh" and "mmhmm". That was some serious conspiriatin'

How in the world could a Governor possibly be forgiven for talking to one of the biggest employers in the State? It must have been dirty doings. Be sure to have Charlie Sheen, Michael Moore and Rosie O'Donnell narrate it.

Unknown said...

....I must have missed where anybody dragged a pregnant lady into the Capital, and certainly wouldn't want to see it. ....

How about when the Democrats dragged a jailed drunk into the to participate in lame duck sessions.

---- sprung Chippewa Falls Assemblyman Jeff Wood from his jail cell, so he could be the decisive vote in a mad rush by state public employee unions to have new contracts approved by outgoing Gov. Jim Doyle before incoming Gov. Scott Walker could be sworn in. -----

That shows the dignity and respect that the progs bring to government.

Unknown said...

------Prediction: The Successful (if it happens) Democratic Nominee will never mention Unions in the election (if it happens).-----

Word. The losing Democratic candidate will never mention the firehose of Obama union money that they will be showering in.

On many of the websites I view there are anti-Walker ads focusing on concealed carry in bars and having identity checks for gun sales. Well over 50 percent of the population support gun rights, so figuring how those ads help the Dems is tough.

There wasn't any mention of unions in the last recall either. Just now a TV teacher's ad told us how many thousands of teachers have disappeared, but didn't mention that they retired with their gold-plated pension plans.

Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...

Prediction: The Successful (if it happens) Democratic Nominee will never mention Unions in the election (if it happens).

Don't worry Madman. Unlike the Republicans in the earlier recalls, Walker will be constantly reminding folks what all this recall bullshit is really about.

Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...

I love the new billboards in Milwaukee thanking Tom Barrett:

"Mayor Barrett saved Milwaukee $25 million, thanks to Gov. Walker’s reforms."

LOL. Btw, for you PotitiFact fans out there, this was rated mostly True.

MadisonMan said...

Walker will be constantly reminding folks what all this recall bullshit is really about.

Is that a winning strategy? I'm not sure it is, given the right Democratic candidate. (He or she would have to project an aura of going forward).

Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...

Is that a winning strategy?

Outside of Madison, I think it is.

Most people can understand a $3 billion plus structural deficit. I also think they understand the unsustaninable trajectory of plublic sector benefits. When Walker explains his actions in regards to where we are fiscally today vs. where we were a year ago, Walker wins.

Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...

He or she would have to project an aura of going forward

And hope the rubes in the rest of the state don't figure out the real issues in this race.

Listen, I just don't believe that pretending the recall is something other than what it is will fly this time around.