September 2, 2011

Do you remember Obama and Honduras?

It was back in July 2009:
As military "coups" go, the one this weekend in Honduras was strangely, well, democratic. The military didn't oust President Manuel Zelaya on its own but instead followed an order of the Supreme Court. It also quickly turned power over to the president of the Honduran Congress, a man from the same party as Mr. Zelaya. The legislature and legal authorities all remain intact.

We mention these not so small details because they are being overlooked as the world, including the U.S. President, denounces tiny Honduras in a way that it never has, say, Iran. President Obama is joining the U.N., Fidel Castro, Hugo Chávez and other model democrats in demanding that Mr. Zelaya be allowed to return from exile and restored to power. Maybe it's time to sort the real from the phony Latin American democrats.
Please compare Obama 2009 to this year's Obama, reacting to events in Arab countries.

134 comments:

Lincolntf said...

Obama's foreign policy, beginning with his shameful dismantling of 50 years worth of State craft in Eastern Europe, has been the unsung disaster of his term. He's a menace and a stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure.

Carol_Herman said...

Another fail.

If obama were to walk down a staircase ... he'd find the steps he's trying to land on, completely missing.

Nobody is gonna give a care to what DC thinks. Because what can DC do, tell the CIA to go in and kill people? All the guns they'd need are in Mexico ... in the cartel's hands.

And, watching things fall apart outside of our territorial waters is a good way to stay out of other people's business!

What, exactly, CAN obama do?

And, if you found out he could do something ... would you want him to, anyway?

Carol_Herman said...

Maybe, he'll just blame Hillary?

Chip S. said...

At least he didn't order air strikes back then.

bagoh20 said...

That's the problem: It's the same one guy. What a messed up dude.

Carol_Herman said...

If Wisconsin's Judiciary Committee wants to "punt" ... they can't take lessons from obama!

Some people teach by example. And, so does obama. The examples run counter to speech-E-flying.

edutcher said...

You expect GodZero to respect someone following a legal decision by a nation's Supreme Court?

By all means, Ann, step away from the coffee pot!

Not to mention the bottle of milk.

ndspinelli said...

No balls, and really not much brains either. Of all Obama's appointments, the most telling was Eric Holder. That was a huge red flag to me and this kind of horseshit is consistent w/ Holder's and Obama's world view.

Herman Carol said...

No.

J Lee said...

Obama brought in people to the State Department who were still angry over what Reagan did in Nicaragua and El Salvador in the early 1980s. It was a given that they and the president would take the side of the guy reflexively hostile to the United States in the Honduras battle, because ideologically they've been in sympathy with that position for over three decades.

Same thing with Egypt -- if the U.S. administrations since Sadat's assassination have been comfortable with Mubarak, than whoever opposes Hosni must be better (the Libyan situation is more muddles, since Britain and France basically dragged Obama kicking and screaming into the kerfufle, but the outcome may be the same, where what comes after Ghaddafi may be worse than what he's been for the past decade, just like what came after the Shah in Iran probably wasn't what the Carter State Department was expecting).

Scott M said...

I've never forgotten this one and still wonder why in the world more people weren't pissed off about it. To take it a step further, I can't believe anyone defended his position.

Quayle said...

With Obama sometimes the dictator must go, sometimes not.

He is absolutely opposed to Bush attacking Iraq.

But Gaddafi must be drive out by military intervention.

The left and most of Europe screamed like bloody murder when Bush struck out at Saddam, now they strike at a much easier target and pat themselves on the back for being such staunch anti-dictators.

Except for Merkel, who suffers the slight of not being greeted by Sarkozy yesterday in Paris. She got the underling. She wasn't sufficiently on board to now revel with the great conquers of Libya.

The real blood for oil theater was Libya, at least it was for the Europeans, but the western press yawns.

And Assad, openly shooting his own people, gets only slight treatment and covert opposition (so far.)

Mubarak got Obama's verbal support early, then Obama changes his mind, then Obama self-righteously says that the Egyptians must sort this out without American intervention.

But in Honduras America must intervene.

Obama has the distinction of being the Peace Prize winner prosecuting the most number of wars evah!

(Obama is awesome.)

If anyone here can explain the coherent policy I'd like to hear it.

cubanbob said...

Obama is a bully and a marxist. Why is anyone surprised? W on the other hand I do blame for for pushing the Venezuelan Army to reinstate Chavez when the launched a coup.

edutcher said...

J Lee said...

Obama brought in people to the State Department who were still angry over what Reagan did in Nicaragua and El Salvador in the early 1980s. It was a given that they and the president would take the side of the guy reflexively hostile to the United States in the Honduras battle, because ideologically they've been in sympathy with that position for over three decades.

That's been the attitude of the Left since 'Nam.

Pastafarian said...

If Carol Herman and Herman Carol ever meet, will the universe be annihilated?

Just one more goddamned thing to worry about.

William said...

Daniel Ortega was credibly accused of child molestation. Yet he remains President of Nicaragua. What does it say about the left that they freely chose such a man to implement their policies? Is there such a dearth of leadership that such flawed men as Chavez, Castro, Ortega are considered beacons rather than warning lights?.....These guys with the red berets and revolutionary rhetoric are variations on the theme of generals with epaulets and too many medals. Different beat, same melody......Latin America. Muslim lands. The only lesson that they have learned from history is that it is necessary to keep repeating it until you get it right. Perserverance-- that's the key. Zelaya's revolution. That's the one that will lead to utopia.

Carol_Herman said...

What I remember about Reagan's presidency, is that he and his staff were fully aware that the "beast had to be fed," daily!

In other words, Reagan knew ... what FDR also knew ... And, that was to be available DAILY for great copy!

A pro of pro's. Because the media is 24/7. And, every single outlet wanted to lead with "something."

How many different ways can you describe, for instance ... a ball getting into a goal? Or a man running around bases? Hasn't it all been said, before?

Besides. Reagan's team knew that the press was hostile! So, how did they work around this?

Why that's easy! Reagan's team did the VISUALS. And, the press, whose words were gonna be hostile ... lost out. The VISUALS worked!

Like watching a ballplayer ... running around the bases ... after the ball went over the fence. And, you could say "HOMER." (Or you could say "Simpson.")

The visuals rule the day.

And, that's where obama fails.

His visuals stink to the high heavens.

It's rarer to get to the VISUALS with accumen.

That's why you have to jump from FDR to Reagan ... to see how it was done with elan. And, how the people just loved it.

Chip S. said...

@Pastafarian--Thanks to your brilliant comment, I now see how this all fits together: Carol_Herman & Herman Carol, Bradley & Prosser, garage mahal & Original Mike, "Mary" & Althouse. And most of all, bubbles:

The bubble universe model proposes that different regions of this inflationary universe (termed a multiverse) decayed to a true vacuum state at different times, with decaying regions corresponding to "sub"- universes not in causal contact with each other and resulting in different physical laws in different regions....

Althouse Blog: Where sub-universes collide.

Rose said...

Obama and Honduras? And his odd actions at the time?

...more than 150 Mexicans and at least one U.S. government agent, are dead because of Gunwalker. The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) videotaped the sale of the gun that killed Border Patrol agent and military veteran Brian Terry. Weapons waltzed into Mexico under its “Operation Fast and Furious” have begun turning up in American cities. A second program called “Operation Castaway” has been discovered, walking guns into Honduras. MS-13, the most dangerous gang in the world, has strong ties to Honduras.
Guess we'll have to wait and see

captcha: oustrizi

Carol_Herman said...

Utopia is a greek word. It means NEVER NEVER LAND. It's a place for the imagination that has never, ever existed down here on earth.

Besides, democracy is messy.

It doesn't lend itself to letting groups of people decide anything. By definition, groups of people ARGUE.

Our Founding Fathers took for granted that humans would do everything to fight for power ... And, say just about anything. Which is allowed under the First Amendment. Then? They decided IF a politician got just a smidgen over 50% of the vote ... the whole pie was his.

Only on a criminal court jury ... did 12 people have to come to a unanimous decision. And, judges aren't allowed to interfere with these deliberations. Where it's been tried, the judge get reversed.

We've made the systems worse by making them so expensive! Why should it cost so much money to defend yourself in court; or to run for office?

MikeR said...

Honduras was always one of the most confusing US foreign policy actions in my memory. I never really understood why the Obama administration backed the horse it did. They were so obviously wrong, and that never changed from beginning to end.

sorepaw said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Richard Dolan said...

"Please compare Obama 2009 to this year's Obama, reacting to events in Arab countries."

Well, at least Ann sees that the only person to whom one can reasonably compare such a world-historical figure is O himself. No other frame of reference could possibly work. Depending on your political views, the themes of such a comparison might be: (1) O 'grew in office' and 'climbed the learning curve'; or (2) for O, the preferred demons are always on the 'right'; or (3) O's only interest is in the 'reset' button for the Muslim Middle East; or (4) Zelaya had worshipped at the O altar, and earned the support of our Narcissist-in-Chief; or (5) the MidEast matters, Honduras not so much; or (6) the misjudgment about Honduras was all Hillary's (or Condi's or Bush's) fault, the clear-eyed response now is pure O-driven.

Whjat's odd about so much of the O-commentary now is its retrospective tone -- it's as if we've already written him off, he's yesterday's news, and we're waiting for the new guy to show up. Things will improve when reality catches up and all of O-dom is in the past.

Gumby said...

Just watched attack video. Ann are you pregnant?

J said...

the haters of Fidel...really they'd like to bring back Batista, some mob casinos, and cheapie whores (across L.A.). Mafia-nomics

Mike said...

Obama's administration has three rules:

1. That was then, this is now.

2. Bad stuff is alway's someone else's fault.

3. Good stuff is always due to the awesomeness of Obama.

If in doubt, review rules 2 & 3, rinse and repeat.

The fact that a reasonable parent wouldn't let his `13 year old child get away with such nonsense is irrelevant.

J said...

Obama brought in people to the State Department who were still angry over what Reagan did in Nicaragua and El Salvador in the early 1980s.

you mean like arrest people without warrants, or order death squads to torture and kill people, like nuns? Yeah some were upset.

Scott M said...

the haters of Fidel...really they'd like to bring back Batista, some mob casinos, and cheapie whores (across L.A.). Mafia-nomics

So, there's no middle ground?

Chip S. said...

Utopia is a greek word.

That's like saying "economics" is a Greek word. Both are English neologisms (SWIDT?) formed by slight variants of Greek words. In this case, ou and topos, literally meaning "not [a] place."

"Utopia" does not seem to have been used as a word until the publication of Thomas More's book.

BTW, I only just discovered that there's a secondary meaning for "neologism", according to Merriam-Webster:

a meaningless word coined by a psychotic

madAsHell said...

Obama just keeps stepping in it!!

He continues to create his own dilemmas, and then can't find his way out.

Consider the debt debacle, he creates a dead-line, and then things don't go his way. A compromise was reached after he had been excluded from the negotiations.

He could have kept his mouth shut on Honduras, but his Marxist convictions ruled the day.

The beer summit, and the police behaved stoopidly.

The scheduling of the his jobs speech before the congress. He again required a joint session, and then couldn't get it scheduled.

Events, and realities on the ground just keep kicking the shit out of his agenda. He just can't figure it out.

The smartest man in the empty room.

Of course, this was the rational choice......or sumthin'

realwest said...

Obama knows as much about foreign policy - and especially democracies- as he does about economics.
But at least he's consistent. Wrong, but consistently so!

Carol_Herman said...

What's the price of lying?

At the bottom, here, isn't it possible that no matter what obama says, he isn't going to be believed?

Didn't his credibility go out the window long ago? (For me it "went" ... when he attacked the Cambridge cop for "acting stupidly.") Silent beer summit and all ... Obama lost credence. And, his friend, the Professor Gates, never really came off as anything but an affirmative action jerk. With a haaarvahd credential.

No one at haarvahd spoke up. No one there thought they'd have to do much, except wave their credential around. Which was a stupid mistake!

Lying is about the worst position you could get caught in. As kids are taught at an early age. Lying is very bad business.

But that's actually what we are watching!

It's like "Lying Is Punting." You don't think you're losing much ... because where's the ball? It's hardly moving at all.

Once you get caught, lying, however, you can never, ever get back to an honest position.

And, perhaps? Perhaps this is why people pay attention to the "mechanics" employed in announcing yet another Obama speech. If this was anybody else? And, there was an honest expression for it? It would be called a "gaffe."

We're beyond bloopers now.

In the future? The truth will have to be fit into a "tweet."

Carol_Herman said...

Wait a minute!

Obama got his trillion! And, then he did it, again! I'm not ready to write off his asking for even more money, ahead.

He knows Congress Critters LOVE pork. He will roll in the pork barrels. What does he care?

How much screaming needs to happen ... before politicians recognize that they're ALL in trouble?

J said...

So, there's no middle ground?

There may be--John Rawls ring a bell?--- but not on Mobhouse. Teabugs are not interested in civil discussions of economics or politics. They're interested in just win, baybe. Vegassnomics

exhelodrvr1 said...

Obama's foreign policy follows a consistent, two-part logic:

If he thinks it will help him politically, he follows Pres Bush's lead. If he thinks it won't matter politically, he acts against America's interests.

Scott M said...

Teabugs are not interested in civil discussions of economics or politics.

Take an honest guess as to the percentage of your comments on this blog that would fall under "civil discussions", John. How high do you think it would be? 25%?

Certainly higher recently, but that's not saying much. You seem to be a bright buy, but why would anyone waste time trying to engage you with the misspelled vitriol you spew on a regular basis?

J said...

a meaningless word coined by a psychotic

Hermanize, ie to Hermanize: to rant and rave incoherently at length, about any and all topics. After one "Carol Herman" a crazy bag lady known as a commenter at the Althouse blog.

--"Yo, Scott-tard, you're Hermanizing again."

Scott M said...

Scott-tard

Certainly civil.

Carol_Herman said...

J ... as in jerk. Misuses even a letter in our alphabet!

Lamar63 said...

J said...
the haters of Fidel...really they'd like to bring back Batista, some mob casinos, and cheapie whores (across L.A.). Mafia-nomics

9/2/11 11:27 AM

J said...
Obama brought in people to the State Department who were still angry over what Reagan did in Nicaragua and El Salvador in the early 1980s.

you mean like arrest people without warrants, or order death squads to torture and kill people, like nuns? Yeah some were upset.

9/2/11 11:31 AM

I've never understood why libs give Castro and Che a pass. Why not be consistent and condemn dictators of the left and right?

J said...

It's a combox, not your thesis on the wheat market from Peoria State, Scott the Hermanizer--which-- I suspect--even though spell-checked still sucked like, er, Annie Coulter on a coke binge in Ellay sucks.

traditionalguy said...

I remember the Honduras charade well.

That was the initial confirmation the Obama was at heart a Marxist dictator under cover of an election victory that next demanded the Constitution be changed to make him "elected President for Life" and re-distributor of all property rights.

So Hondurans resisted the traitor legally and beat him in their Supreme Court.

That makes one wonder what a SCOTUS with a 5/4 Obama appointed cabal would do.

And Hillary went along 100% with that attack on the Honduran Democratic government. She just pretended made up crap and the MSM went giddily along with her.

Then Obama and Hillary made the USA punish Honduras as an example of what happens to constitutional Governments who resist being taken over by a Marxist Thug For Life.

Now Hillary sees the Libyan Rebels as a highly favored Regime. Hmmm.

J said...

libs?
No libs, Lamar the assclown.
Fock we're not even in the Democrats.

Not agreeing to TP-GOP idiocies or the mafia does not a liberal make.

google up say Kropotkin and Bakunin--

Scott M said...

It's a combox, not your thesis on the wheat market from Peoria State, Scott the Hermanizer--which-- I suspect--even though spell-checked still sucked like, er, Annie Coulter on a coke binge in Ellay sucks.

And that's civil how, John?

Chip S. said...

the haters of Fidel...really they'd like to bring back Batista, some mob casinos, and cheapie whores

The casinos may be gone, but the whores remain.

Cuba's got to earn some foreign exchange somehow, and it isn't exactly an economic powerhouse. Beautiful women seem to abound there, fortunately.

J said...

misuse

...only if you beg, Carol and show me your blood test first, and get me [us} a respirator--I see some sexxay bag ladies once in a while, but....whew

Issob Morocco said...

It says he is a leftist, reacting like Pavlov's dog to the caterwauls of the BiCoastal and Urban Left.

It also portrays him as a man who has no real plan short of creating a Socialist dream, a Government run economy. He is oblivious to the realities of the world including human nature.

As to compare how he reacted in 2009 to the Middle East this summer, it still fits his pattern. Syria, a far worse actor and human rights scourge than Qaddafi could ever be, is allowed to crack skulls, shoot citizens and overall just provide some really solid oppression with nary any action, short of some 'terse' diplomatic missives.

In Libya, a place with economic value, but little National Security value, becomes ground zero for US non-involvement involvement.

In Egypt we had to remove immediately the US's man, Mubarek, without having a viable back up plan. If he had been allowed to stay on to September, as was originally voiced, we might have been able to create a strong alternative to the Islamist, who are now taking hold of power there.

Overall, he doubled down on the least risky, but least rewarding situation to involve our interests. But those are exactly the places where the left wanted us to go after, Egypt (helped us with Al Qaeda) and Libya, because well sometimes a dictator needs to be thrown under the bus.

Why? People may and do ask, "Is he doing this on purpose or is he just not understanding". Given his enormous track record of not accomplishing anything on his own but through the efforts of others (see his election, his book writing, his community organizing efforts) I would answer it does not matter why, just that he is incapable of being President of this country and Jan 20, 2013 cannot come soon enough.

Our experiment in Progressivism is over and once again a painful lesson is left as a reminder why we cannot let Leftist run anything we value.

Carol_Herman said...

You know, Castro actually chased out the middle class in Cuba!

The middle classes, as a general rule, always flee dictators. And, for the Cubans who came to Miami, they brought with them, not just their families, but their educations. Doctors. Lawyers. Engineers. Where all Miami really had were retired Jewish folk.

This is what really changed Florida!

Middle class people, for all their struggles when they have to get started, again, supply an ENGINE. Supply ECONOMIC GROWTH! America's been good at doing that, too.

Cuba is a basket case. Made worse as soon as the Soviet's collapsed. It's actually a 3rd world nation, 90 miles from our southern tip.

Back in Cuba? THEY MISS THEIR RELATIVES WHO CAME TO AMERICA! They envy them, as well. Castro isn't loved! He's FEARED!

Obama, meanwhile, got to be president. Not on many gifts ... But he did get the bonus of votes that surprised McCain. Because McCain couldn't imagine a black man winning the 2008 race.

As to the left tilt ... On board the democrapic ship ... there are those who are falling overboard!

We really don't have a left in this country that will "catch them." Because for a left to exist you need communists. And, we don't even have a communist plot. Because Karl Marx ain't buried here.

Pelosi also bedevils the left. (I'm sure a lot of them can't imagine why she didn't quit when she lost her Speaker's Office.) But I'd bet in da' House, Boehner's preferred.

Bad management ... usually makes those inside the company ... more terrified than you think!

Hillary's not the answer, either.

Ted Kennedy's dead. John Kerry can't lead his party, either. And, neither, really, can Harry Reid.

Where will the talent come from that changes the picture?

This country isn't going to choose only one side.

Lamar63 said...

@J

Ok so you are an anarchist. That is even more surprising. An anarchist should hate any form of tyranny.

Hoosier Daddy said...

"... you mean like arrest people without warrants, or order death squads to torture and kill people, like nuns? Yeah some were upset...."

Pretend they were Mormons and you can drift away to that special place of yours.

J said...

A leftist doesn't start out by hiring Goldman Sachs execs, or Larry Summers, or putting HRC in charge, or working with BuchCo (or extending his tax cuts for the wealthy).

BO's a centrist

Steven said...

you mean like arrest people without warrants, or order death squads to torture and kill people, like nuns? Yeah some were upset.

No, they weren't. If warrant-less arrests, torture, and murder were what was upsetting them, they'd have been anti-Castro, anti-Guevara, and anti-Ortega, too. Since they weren't, it's pretty easy to tell what was upsetting them were not any of the crimes of the right wingers in Latin America, but merely which side of the Cold War the right wingers were on.

Quayle said...

Thanks Hoosier.

In the same spirit as Butch Cassidy thanks the Sundance Kid

Carol_Herman said...

Nope. "BO" is not a centrist! Never was! Even his credential is from haavahd. Not from our heartland, at all.

What's made worse is that obama is seen as a liar.

His speeches fail.

And, you can't prop them up on grecian pillars.

The left is failing to attract talent!

That the schlemiel can win another 4 years? Why not? In bad times the "tramp" was the most successful hollywood actor on earth. Everyone knew his name! And, everyone sitting in a seat ... got to enjoy feeling superior.

Personally, I can't wait for the truth to get out of bed and start lacing up his shoelaces.

J said...

Ah so the killed were catholics--maybe even liberals!-- Hoosier yokel, and that's ok. Why even some mormonics would find that...appalling

"Special place"--like the US constitution, or maybe Jefferson and Madison's criticism of Smith-like religious enthusiasts and crackpots? yeah Reason does seem special to an idiot

SPImmortal said...

@J

Ok so you are an anarchist. That is even more surprising. An anarchist should hate any form of tyranny.

-----

Dude, don't be fooled.

Most of the people that call themselves "anarchists" nowadays are just hard left commies, in the literal sense.

It's just rebranding, like "climate change". It's rather embarrasing to admit to being a marxist.

SPImmortal said...

...only if you beg, Carol and show me your blood test first, and get me [us} a respirator--I see some sexxay bag ladies once in a while, but....whew

-----------

lol what is this fucking worthless jibberish?

PatCA said...

Hopefully Bams learned that tyrants are usually kinda bad.

Or he just fell in love with the Che photo and thinks Hispanic Lefties are groovy!

J said...

Castro may be guilty of some atrocities. Then, so was Reagan.

History and politics are contextual. Compared to the batista regime (and many US-backed banana republics, ie Chile) Castro doesn't seem that horrible.

J said...

It's none of yr fucking business, Pimmortal-pig

Lamar63 said...

@SPImmortal

I know a lot of "anarchist" and most of them are just poseurs. They have no idea what anarchy means. For instance see "anarchist" rioting in favor of government benefits. Or "anarchists" that defend left wing tyrants.

The central doctrine of anarchists is the elimination of government and especially central control by government.

SPImmortal said...

Castro may be guilty of some atrocities. Then, so was Reagan.

History and politics are contextual. Compared to the batista regime (and many US-backed banana republics, ie Chile) Castro doesn't seem that horrible.

-------

That's funny but I don't think the Batista regime had to keep boats out of private hands in order to prevent everyone from fleeing the island like Castro's had to do.

J is just fucking stupid to the core.

Jube said...

Of course, we all know what happens after military coups, and Honduras is no exception:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5gm5xL6c9mPeDnGUdiG9OM1cIhBgg?docId=a222bdcdd4b7490c9f2cfca0ae2f0095

"Honduras president: No more cellphones at meetings"

The horror!

SPImmortal said...

It's none of yr fucking business, Pimmortal-pig

--------

You're like a fucking toddler trying to invent your own language. So precious.

J said...

Your little Rush Limbozo labels and moralist TP crap are pure shit, Pigmortal (and you look like another Anny (let me call the server admin. and see who you really are--I have a good idea (ie, it's Raul, aka Hoss-let!!! though a right wing day for his bipolar-ness).

nada mas que basura

Chip Ahoy said...

Ann Barnhardt, the well-known Colorado firebrand who once said of Gen. Petraeus, "I'll give him one of my balls then he'd have one and I'd still have two," insists on her blog, and at the Western Rifle Shooters Association, at Free Republic, Flopping Aces, Freedom Torch, and many other right wing blogs too numerous and wearisome to mention here, that the Gunwalker scandal, Fast and Furious, is the ultimate false flag operation with two prongs, one out of Tulsa and the other out of Miami, where the operation is known as 'Castaway', intended to flood Mexico and South America with ill-gotten US arms and allow the dead bodies of Mexican citizens, police, South Americans, and eventually North Americans to pile up, in an attempt to overturn the second amendment. This theory is supported by the numbers persistently cited by DOJ and by State Dept. that are patently demonstrably false. According to Barnhardt's information Manuel Zelaya was essential to the Miami operation and that explains the truly weird insistence of US State Dept. on his reinstatement.

SPImmortal said...

Your little Rush Limbozo labels and moralist TP crap are pure shit, Pigmortal (and you look like another Anny (let me call the server admin. and see who you really are--I have a good idea (ie, it's Raul, aka Hoss-let!!! though a right wing day for his bipolar-ness).

nada mas que basura

--------

English motherfucker, do you speak it?

Please stop shitting your pants long enough to form a coherent sentence.

J said...

wrong again, Pigmortal--you're a little teabugger- mormon racist, who can't read, and has never read a real book in its life. Now, crawl back to yr LogCabin Romney sites, joto

Chip S. said...

(and many US-backed banana republics, ie Chile)

Wait a minute...

I'm not gonna say the US hasn't backed some shady governments, but Chile is a fully democratic, highly prosperous and free society.

If you're talking about Pinochet, which you probably are, then also recall that Chile was a well-functioning republic for a long time before Allende came to power with a small plurality. The Pinochet era was deplorable in many ways, but Chileans today mostly prefer simply not to talk about it. The unrest under Allende was widespread--it was not just some CIA-initiated coup--and Chileans like where they've ended up. Everybody would prefer that there hadn't been "disappearances," for sure, but the '70s in Chile were a lot more complicated than what's implied by the phrase "banana republic."

J said...

no habla ingles, Pim, el joto pendejo-- chinga tu putamadre

ay ay

heh heh

SPImmortal said...

wrong again, Pigmortal--you're a little teabugger- mormon racist, who can't read, and has never read a real book in its life. Now, crawl back to yr LogCabin Romney sites, joto

--------

I don't think you understand that no one can figure out what you are saying. You're a mumbling, bumbling retard of a blog poster and your weaksauce insults don't sting because nobody is bothered by the ineffectual rambling of a pathetic figure.

Steven said...

Compared to the batista regime . . . Castro doesn't seem that horrible.

Only of you're willfully ignorant of Castro's record of deliberate post-revolutionary murder, or consider anti-Americanism to justify being a bigger murderer than Batista ever was.

Which are you, J? An ignorant idiot, or an anti-American douchebag?

cubanbob said...

J said...
A leftist doesn't start out by hiring Goldman Sachs execs, or Larry Summers, or putting HRC in charge, or working with BuchCo (or extending his tax cuts for the wealthy).

BO's a centrist

9/2/11 12:03 PM

Only if you are a Stalinist. J place a stick of dynamite up your ass and blow your two functioning neurons out. And have a nice day.

Incidentally, why are you so anti-Batista? He was a negro. You have something against negroes? Or just the wrong sort of negroes?

Quayle said...

J is back regurgitating his lunch.

Big Mike said...

Obama's foreign policy is very consistent. If you hated the George W. Bush administration, or vice versa, then the Obama administration supports you unreservedly.

Whether this is a good basis for a foreign policy is a separate question.

J said...

Which are you, Steven, infected with an advanced stage of syphilis, or just an escapee from a mental hospital? zzzzzzzzz


AS said previously, the Smurfhouse is just too stupid for politics. You don't know fuck about either Bastista's corrupt regime, or Castro.

Maybe just stick to Rush Limblow's memoirs--ie, The Life and Times of Rush--America's favorite obese rich pedophile

J said...

hey cuban bob--grazi for the suggestions! No TNT needed--just a big irish fist in yr bitch face, when ah find you.

better find some protection, wicca queers

B said...

"I don't think you understand that no one can figure out what you are saying. You're a mumbling, bumbling retard of a blog poster .."

Right about now he'll avow that once again he's shown up the posters here with his rapier sharp intellect, declare victory, and look for a new thread to defecate in.

He either knows exactly how he's perceived and leverages it for attention or actually believes that his rambling nonsense represents the eclectic opinions of our intellectual superior.

Either way, the fact that he comes off as profoundly imbecilic and an utter jackass to boot escapes him.

SPImmortal said...

AS said previously, the Smurfhouse is just too stupid for politics. You don't know fuck about either Bastista's corrupt regime, or Castro.

--------

So tell us what nuance about Castro we're missing. This should be funny.

Or you could just speak jibberish and shit your pants again.

Henry said...

The central doctrine of anarchists is the elimination of government and especially central control by government.

Actually, no. The most prominent school of anarchism is social anarchism. Under this banner gather the anarchists who hate private property, but love collectivism. Theoretically such communities are self-managing and democratic, but in practice, once you damn the individual, your democracy means nothing.

Does J claim to be an anarchist? Maybe he is. I never read him.

SunnyJ said...

Which "O" of a year ago and which "O" of today? His intentionally manipulated pseudo-schizophrenia give you an infinte number of pairs to match up here? Do you want to match the pair that say or the pairs that do? Do you want to match the Thurs pairs or the Fri after the news cycle pairs? How about the pairs speaking to the base or the pairs speaking to the base's "enemies" (that would be everyone else in America)....

Consistency is not a goal of the "O". Manipulation to nudge the means to reach the ends is the long term goal. In that respect "O", has not changed even a nano-smidge (this number inverts from the direction the national debt is going) ad infinitum.

SPImmortal said...

"I don't think you understand that no one can figure out what you are saying. You're a mumbling, bumbling retard of a blog poster .."

Right about now he'll avow that once again he's shown up the posters here with his rapier sharp intellect, declare victory, and look for a new thread to defecate in.

He either knows exactly how he's perceived and leverages it for attention or actually believes that his rambling nonsense represents the eclectic opinions of our intellectual superior.

Either way, the fact that he comes off as profoundly imbecilic and an utter jackass to boot escapes him.

----------

I like how his made up words sound suspiciously like baby talk. Really let's you know what frame of mind he is in.

But I kinda feel sorry for him, he seems like a budding schitzo with very real mental problems.

cubanbob said...

J said...
no habla ingles, Pim, el joto pendejo-- chinga tu putamadre

ay ay

heh heh

9/2/11 12:22 PM

Eres un comemierda total. Ni sabes hablar en castellano y en ingles. El unico comunista bueno es un comunista muerto. Muerete y no jodes mas.

Lamar63 said...

Steven said...


Which are you, J? An ignorant idiot, or an anti-American douchebag?

9/2/11 12:37 PM

Some say J is an ignorant idiot. Others say J is an anti-American douchebag. I reject this false choice. There is a reasonable middle ground. People of good will can say J is an ignorant idiot and an anti American douchebag.

Michael said...

j wrote, accurately, "no habla ingles."

SPImmortal said...

The central doctrine of anarchists is the elimination of government and especially central control by government.

Actually, no. The most prominent school of anarchism is social anarchism. Under this banner gather the anarchists who hate private property, but love collectivism. Theoretically such communities are self-managing and democratic, but in practice, once you damn the individual, your democracy means nothing.

Does J claim to be an anarchist? Maybe he is. I never read him.

-------

Yeah, I already touched on that. Social anarchism is just warmed over marxism, because anarchy is "cooler".

がんこもん said...

Well, it's very simple. The Honduran military, Supreme Court and the Legislature were upholding the idea of rule-of-law and preventing Zelaya from following the Chavez method of gaining power. Can't have that! Leftist dictators must be allowed to carry out their designs!

As for Iran, it is ruled by a bunch of brutal, unelected, theocratic dictators. Unlike Honduras, it is violently anti-American and is actively engaged in killing Americans all over the world. And yes, Iran really is a theocracy.

See the difference? Now it is easy to understand - Obama seems to prefer the latter system. Especially when left-leaning dictators are in charge. Good thing we have the 22nd Amendment.

SunnyJ said...

@J you are correct that " Not agreeing to TP-GOP idiocies or the mafia does not a liberal make"

Likewise, not agreeing to Obama's economic policies, immigration or anything else makes you a racist.

You are so one sided in the application of your convictions that I suggest an MRI. It is possible you've had a stroke with right side paralysis. Get it checked out.

J said...

AS Ive said before Chip , there's no use arguing with white trash libertarians or mansonite-wicca trash aka A-house regs. Ie ya don't play chess with people who don't the moves.

Better to just laugh at them, and mock their miserable illiterate existences.

(and btw Byro--we're comin' to get yr email perp)

J said...

See above comment re "too stupid to blog" Sunny J

Shanna said...

Of all the stuff J says, his use of "yr" as if it is an actual word bothers me the most!

"Honduras president: No more cellphones at meetings"

Ha!

SPImmortal said...

(and btw Byro--we're comin' to get yr email perp)

---------

Do parenthesis indicate comments to people that exist only in your head? That's a neat system.

Michael said...

Cubanbob: I do not believe J can access internet translations fast enough to reply. His abuse of Spanish is a human rights violation, an insult to any native speaker, a vile pose.

Lamar63 said...

@Henry

J objected to be called a lib. He cited Bakunin and Kropotkin.

He's not a true anarchist. He is a poseur or a Koch plant.

Scott M said...

You guys continue to feed the troll without realizing it's simply going to get bigger. If you want to respond to him without polluting comment threads hereabouts, just email him here:

John Wells
jollyrogerx99@yahoo.com

Help keep our threads clean.

SPImmortal said...

Of all the stuff J says, his use of "yr" as if it is an actual word bothers me the most!

----------

I think of that as part of his attempt to replicate what is in his fevered mind some sort of "working class" speech pattern when he's trying to sound tough or something.

Or maybe he's an imbecile who's simply typing out whatever free associations are floating around in his head, and that's just what comes out.

Hard to say.

B said...

"...he seems like a budding schitzo with very real mental problems...."

Agreed. Anyone who descends so rapidly into babbling inchoate rage when his nonsense is not taken as wisdom is well on his way to the funny farm. Could be he's already a resident at one with internet privileges but I doubt it. I suspect said privileges would be closely monitored and his constant threats of physical violence would get them revoked.

Hoosier Daddy said...

"... People of good will can say J is an ignorant idiot and an anti American douchebag..."

Or the third possibility he us what my grandad would call 'crazier than a shithouse rat.

Kurt said...

Apparently commenter "J" never read Against All Hope by Armando Valladares (or anything else by Cuban refugees). Many Cubans opposed Batista and were initially sympathetic to the revolution, but then Castro turned out to be a communist and then a dictator and they realized that was not what they wanted. And then those who spoke out ended up in his notorious prisons.

SPImmortal said...

Cubanbob: I do not believe J can access internet translations fast enough to reply. His abuse of Spanish is a human rights violation, an insult to any native speaker, a vile pose.

------

If J posted his chickenscratch in Babelfish for translation to Spanish, I wonder if the algorithm would be able to handle it or if it would just return an error asking him to try again?

X said...

J is merely asking for fair play for Cuba.

B said...

"You guys continue to feed the troll without realizing it's simply going to get bigger."

You're right, but it's the sort of slow afternoon where everything is ticking along nicely and rattling the gibbon's cage helps while away the time. Shooting fish in a barrel is another good analogy.

J said...

jus STFU, and do Reason a favor, Alttards

David R. Graham said...

"If anyone here can explain the coherent policy I'd like to hear it."

Allow me to try: "vanguard of the revolution" is a Marxist concept that is used by Sayyid Qutb to define the posture and historical position of the Mohammedan Brotherhood. (Lenin was a bit more pragmatic and simply saw a tight group of fearless power-and wealth-seekers cloaking their aim in communist rhetoric while murdering their way into positions desired. Hitler, Castro, Allende, Kaddafi, Obama, Zelaya, Ortega, Chaves, Assads and the IRGC, all leftists, try to blend, in this respect, the approaches of Marx and Qutb on the one hand (idealistic/utopian rhetoric) and Lenin on the other (termination of opponents before and after securing the mechanisms of government).

All of that is cloaked in ideology (social justice, economic justice, peace and freedom) and community organizing (vanguard "activist" cells in local churches) developed in South America as "liberation theology" and imported in the USA by, prominently but not only, Saul Alinsky and James Cone (passed to his protege Jeremiah Wright), the latter adding a racial component, "black liberation theology," which aligned it Cone and Wright with the so-called "Nation of Islam."

In the 60s, the movement to clean up industrial waste was co-opted by Alinsky and even older-school leftists, sourced from New England Unitarians and Congregationalists, leaving us today with "eco-nazis" in lock-step with left-communist power and wealth seekers. A racial component has been added to that as well.

The coherent policy is left-communist aspiration for domination anywhere and everywhere. Kaddafi opposed the Muslim Brotherhood and al Qaeda, who are supported by the international leftist consortiums so long as they don't attack those consortiums directly. That is why he went down. al Qaeda's "mistake" was attacking its sister movements and sponsors. That is why they are hunted and killed.

But al Qaeda is not more than a proxy for nation-states, prominently Saddam's Iraq and later the IRGC's Iran and all along the Saudis as long as al Qaeda kept it out of the kingdom (which they didn't do, so the Saudis hit them).

The coherent policy is left-communist ideology and power seeking. It is a cruel hag with claws deeply embedded in many nations. Obama is one of its claw sets. But only one.

I thought all of this was known ....

David R. Graham said...

"Utopia is a greek word. It means NEVER NEVER LAND. It's a place for the imagination that has never, ever existed down here on earth."

Yes, a Greek compound word, u + topos = no place in the sense of "something for which there is no place to be, a non-potentiality as well as a non-actuality.

And ChipS, economics also is a Greek compound word, eco + nomos = a totality with a name, meaning, it builds itself or is built outward and upward (that's the significance of naming).

Greek is a living language. No matter when it is used or where or how, it is and always will be Greek, to include each word of it every made or pronounced.

David R. Graham said...

"Everyone knew his name! And, everyone sitting in a seat ... got to enjoy feeling superior.

Personally, I can't wait for the truth to get out of bed and start lacing up his shoelaces."

LOLLOLLOL Great stand-up comedy, recalls Shecky Greene and tops Mel Brooks, IMO. I need the laughs. Keep it coming! Stout handling of the goons as well. Delicious.

edutcher said...

J said...

Obama brought in people to the State Department who were still angry over what Reagan did in Nicaragua and El Salvador in the early 1980s.

you mean like arrest people without warrants, or order death squads to torture and kill people, like nuns? Yeah some were upset.


As he's shown, J is a great defender of the Catholic Church and scrupulously abides by GodZero's pleas for civility.

edutcher said...

J said...

Obama brought in people to the State Department who were still angry over what Reagan did in Nicaragua and El Salvador in the early 1980s.

you mean like arrest people without warrants, or order death squads to torture and kill people, like nuns? Yeah some were upset.


That's what the Ortega brothers and Fidel were all about.

As he's shown, J is a great defender of the Catholic Church and scrupulously abides by GodZero's pleas for civility.

Quayle said...

David, thanks.

But then, please, square for me the social leftists in America (pro gay, pro abortion, pro radical feminism) with the seemingly diametrically opposed Muslim Brotherhood.

Ralph L said...

I hope Fidel goes to hell before the election so we can all see Biden and half the MSM crying in Havana.

ricpic said...

You know what it boils down to? for a certain type of person - think J, AL, garage - the Left is sexy. Torture in dungeons? What's that compared to the promise of heaven on earth? It's all about the orgasmic rhetoric.

Kirk Parker said...

{Herman Carol)

Oh how I wish I thought up that shtick.

Kirk Parker said...

Richard Dolan,

"... it's as if we've already written him off..."

I'm not sure what that "as if" is doing in there...


wv: imbedr. "I was sick, but imbedr now".

David R. Graham said...

"David, thanks.

But then, please, square for me the social leftists in America (pro gay, pro abortion, pro radical feminism) with the seemingly diametrically opposed Muslim Brotherhood."

Excellent point. I think the answer comprises two simultaneous phenomena.

First and foremost, the goal of domination is the ultimate concern. Everything else (abortion, feminism, etc.) is an expendable detail. Ultimately, the social goals are unimportant. Proximately, they make good cover for the domination agenda.

Second, the alliance is temporary only. The social goals of an alliance member are not to figure in the policies of the alliance member holding the balance of power in the final domination structure. The MB and social leftists in America ally to remove and replace the US economic system, ways of life and Constitution, but one will suppress the other if either achieves the final goal of domination. I expect MB would prevail in any punch-out with social leftists in America.

There is also this to be considered: sodomy, to include with boys, is a powerful, universal habit in the Middle East. The MB's and the Iranian's rhetorical theological puritanism does not match their "cultures'" facts. Afghans seem less hypocritical in this regard but only less, and they are arguably world champions with respect to the universality of their sodomy. It is my understanding social leftists in America are aware of this phenomenon and more than willing to wink wink it.

Carol_Herman said...

Gee, I didn't know I'd get dyslexic camp followers.

My sign says: Carol Herman Lives Here.

Don't get confused. My first name ain't Herman. or Hyman. And, my last name wasn't my last name until I got married. I liked it. So, it has remained.

In the future though? I see people will have to learn how to "Tweet." The characters weren't limited to human speech. Has something to do with small screens. And, technology.

Quayle said...

"First and foremost, the goal of domination is the ultimate concern. Everything else (abortion, feminism, etc.) is an expendable detail. "

Then one line of attack, to shake lose the useful western idiots, must be to keep hammering away at how the power brokers' alliances are aiding groups that oppose the idiots' favorite social causes.

B said...

J said...jus STFU, and do Reason a favor, Alttards

Well, he didn't declare victory before scampering off this time.

More like: 'Oh yeah, yeah, well, you guys just shut up, you, you, you DOODYHEADS'

The gift that keeps on giving.

Quayle said...

J's superiority is what keeps his roundhouses from landing.

He's so far above us all.

Scott M said...

Seriously...send him an email and give him your sincere sentiments. I'm sure it will pay back big dividends.

B said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
SGT Ted said...

Obama had to support the authoritarian Communist. Fellow travelers is all it was.

B said...

Scott M said...Seriously...send him an email and give him your sincere sentiments. I'm sure it will pay back big dividends.

I'm curious. Why would you advocate doing this? Given his volatility, what could be gained by initiating a sidebar with him?

He is not a troll. At least he is not a leftist acting the way he does to troll conservative sites. The way he acts is the way he is.

For example, I have a rather rigorous approach to logic and more than a passing interest in philosophy has fallen out of that. Now and then I visit sites where some very knowledgeable people discuss it. J - same distinctive tweety grammar, same wannabe edgy persona though I did not know his name or recall his email - does or did frequent that sort of site also. To put it bluntly, he acted no differently than he does here. As you can imagine, he got old fast.

So again, what would or could be gained by starting a direct dialogue with him? Any value he adds to any discussion is far out-weighed by his manic delivery once he slips into that mode and he ALWAYS does.

Scott M said...

Shunting the vitriol, is the goal, I suppose. I don't expect many to do it, but any conversations directed at Mr Wells away from here is good for thread health.

Chip S. said...

Gee, I didn't know I'd get dyslexic camp followers.

My sign says: Carol Herman Lives Here.


I'll bet his sign says Here Lives Herman Carol.

B said...

Scott M said...Shunting the vitriol, is the goal, I suppose...

Ah. Not sure that will work. He's found a site that doesn't ban (though I have seen some of his more rabid comments removed by the administrator here).

He'll beshat Althouse until some other shiny object distracts him and the adults here will have to suffer him for the duration. He could be shunned away, but that requires a tacit agreement to completely ignore him - don't feed the troll - and that never works. He'll taunt and threaten until someone engages him. That goes hand and hand with the persona. He will however, leave a thread in peace if he's not taken seriously in engaging him, but rather thoroughly mocked. That also goes hand in hand with the persona.

B said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
B said...

Chip S. said...I'll bet his sign says Here Lives Herman Carol.

Thread winner.

n.n said...

This is simply about a new regime placing representatives sympathetic to its interests in positions of authority. They only question of consequence is about the underlying motivation.

This would be so much easier if were capable of divining intention.

Synova said...

It's easy enough to explain.

Zelaya is/was a Chavez toady. He was pushing a "for the people" sort of socialism that Obama is likely to feel sympathetic to.

Also, promoting or seeming to capitalism (or as it's known in the rest of the world, neo-liberalism) is icky. Really smart, educated people like Obama would never feel comfortable doing that.

The middle east is not in any way similar, not beyond the "deposed ruler for life" part of it.

Synova said...

Granted. In the end little Honduras told us where to shove it.

Bravo, Honduras!

Mike said...

Just our great leader leading from behind--behind Chavez, behind Sarkozy, and behind anyone else he can get to provide cover.

Brave Sir Robin....

proofofright said...

One cannot discuss the events of Honduras without mentioning the important and saving role of Senator Jim DeMint (R-SC) who wrote this in the Wall Street Journal after his trip there in October 2009:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703298004574459762462353766.html

"Indeed, the desire to move beyond the Zelaya era was almost universal in our meetings. Almost.

In a day packed with meetings, we met only one person in Honduras who opposed Mr. Zelaya's ouster, who wishes his return, and who mystifyingly rejects the legitimacy of the November elections: U.S. Ambassador Hugo Llorens.

When I asked Ambassador Llorens why the U.S. government insists on labeling what appears to the entire country to be the constitutional removal of Mr. Zelaya a "coup," he urged me to read the legal opinion drafted by the State Department's top lawyer, Harold Koh. As it happens, I have asked to see Mr. Koh's report before and since my trip, but all requests to publicly disclose it have been denied.

On the other hand, the only thorough examination of the facts to date—conducted by a senior analyst at the Law Library of Congress—confirms the legality and constitutionality of Mr. Zelaya's ouster. (It's on the Internet here .)

Unlike the Obama administration's snap decision after June 28, the (Library of Congress) Law Library report is grounded in the facts of the case and the intricacies of Honduran constitutional law. So persuasive is the report that after its release, the New Republic's James Kirchick concluded in an Oct. 3 article that President Obama's hastily decided Honduras policy is now "a mistake in search of a rationale."

ThomasD said...

"a mistake in search of a rationale."

Not quite as catchy as Hope and Change, but certainly more to the point.

orbicularioculi said...

@Lincolntf: "...He's a menace and a stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure..."

That is an incredibly accurate description of this INCOMPETENT.