July 18, 2011

Missing from the Wisconsin recall election ads: the subject of collective bargaining that started all the protests.

The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reports on the 9 recall elections and the massive ad campaigns:
The ads that have aired in recent weeks have delved into candidates’ personal histories, gaffes and legal problems, into the broader battle over the state budget, and into federal issues like Medicare.

Gov. Walker’s push against collective bargaining for public employees is mostly absent from the broadcast advertising, either because strategists believe most voters have made up their mind about that issue or because they think other messages are more effective....
And here's Jack Craver in the Isthmus:
WTDY, the radio station where I work part-time, can't get in touch with Democratic candidates for Senate. They're apparently not interested in discussing why "big labor" is only a big issue for Republicans now. Democrats make little mention of the issue that brought about this historic opportunity to take back the State Senate....

Democrats get tons of money from unions, but they get even more from corporations. I would argue that the party's current posture on unions is evidence of its attempt to straddle straddle both interests.
Well, the Wisconsin protests were about public employee unions, so it should be easy to avoid that conflict... unless the project of supporting public employee unions depends on confusing people.

Craver continues, with lines that may be the norm in Madison but should raise eyebrows in the rest of the state:
What's incredible, however, is how willingly the American people entertain the notion that the Democratic Party is anti-business or left wing. Let's be clear: There is no American left. There used to be. But the right has taken over the dialogue in the last 30 years, and convinced us that any move towards an economic system championed by Roosevelt, Truman or Eisenhower represents an attack against American capitalist values.
Hmmm. Let me guess why the Democratic candidates don't want to be on Craver's radio show!

83 comments:

ndspinelli said...

I notice one of the attack ads highlights court records on CCAP, the very good online court record system in Wi. And, this is something pols are trying to shut down..you have to love irony.

Lincolntf said...

Yeah, there's no left wing in the United States. That's why we have a Government dead set on taxing "the rich" into oblivion. That must be a right wing agenda item that I've missed all these years.
Never mind the destruction of the domestic energy industry, the betrayal of our European allies and the funding of an Islamic shadow army somewhere in eastern Libya. Screw 'em. They can't admit that the country/world is a shitshow precisely because of the left wing agenda so they pretend that there has never been one. It's unhistory now.

Shouting Thomas said...

Obama, the most leftist president in U.S. history, isn't leftist enough for this pinhead.

Democrats get tons of money from unions, but they get even more from corporations.

This is true. Kookie has a point here. The corporate law firm I used to work for was a major player and contributor to the Democratic Party.

Left/right... doesn't seem to make a fucking bit of difference as far as I can see. Public employees have a sweet deal that they bought with campaign contributions.

The rest of us... well, we're fucked. The political system is completely unresponsive.

Drew said...

Let's be clear: There is no American left. There used to be. But the right has taken over the dialogue in the last 30 years, and convinced us that any move towards an economic system championed by Roosevelt, Truman or Eisenhower represents an attack against American capitalist values.

Ah, that's bogus. There's definitely an American Left, and it has nothing to do with Roosevelt, Truman, or Eisenhower. Leftists flatter themselves to think they are fit to tie Truman's shoes.

What's gone missing, actually, are American Liberals. The Democratic Party has been wrenched leftward by the commie/socialist wing, leaving Liberals behind. And there's a big difference between a liberal and a leftist.

roesch-voltaire said...

What is left of the American Left seems to be Bernie Sanders, and Dennis Kucinich so I tend to see America as run by a party and a half which does not have to pay much attention to the %14 of the population who are union members. Further while collective bargaining was a big piece of the puzzle, it was not the whole picture. A host of other folks were affected from farmers, to the disabled, to micro brewers, to credit unions, to small school districts, and a combination of these issues have resonated with a middle class that is beginning, in Wisconsin at least, to realize that they suffer most under the Republican order.

TosaGuy said...

There are alot of Republicans and conservatives today, to include myself, that would vote for Harry Truman. The question is, would today's liberals?

Chase said...

As someone who resisted using the term "socialist" regarding our current administration and Democrat Senate, it is no longer possible to see reality any differently.

When the new consumer protection agency comes into power it will be - like the EPA, the FEC and the USDA, more unaccountable to anyone and anything in unprecedented powers over the everyday lives of the American people.

The left is winning here, We are - literally - becoming a Soviet-light society, where every single aspect of our lives and decisions =re micro-managed by government regulation.

I didn't want to believe it. But when our city council discussed removing - not just refraining from building new ones - but removing existing cul-de-sacs, it was apparent that liberty is just a past concept in America. America is now about who gets to control the freedoms of others.

The council discussion never went anywhere, but the fact that elected officials even considered such an option on the table is scary beyond belief.

Say good-bye to the Free United States for your children. It's too late to turn back into the most free country in the history of the world.

Curious George said...

The why is easy...unionistas are going to vote for recall. The left knows that most of the rest of the state, despite the "polls" saying they are against the BRB, actually either don't give a rats ass or actually happy Walker dealt with these selfish fucks.

They are goin gafter Darling with the "sky is falling" schools message. That dog won't hunt.

Curious George said...

@TosaGuy said...

Same for JFK

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Missing from the 'news' article is accuracy.

Walker did not push against collective bargaining.

Walker pushed for restrictions on collective bargaining in certain areas: Pensions and Health Insurance.

The collective bargaining for workplace issues still remains.

But...hey...it is only about reporting the facts and accuracy....so who cares. Right?

MaggotAtBroad&Wall said...

50% of the country don't pay federal income taxes, yet we've got the biggest welfare state in the world. The $4 trillion the federal government will spend this year is greater than the entire GDP of Germany, which has the 4th largest economy in the world.

We went socialist 80 years ago, doubled down in 1964, and put the cherry on top in 2008. To say there's no Left, then who pushed all this socialism on us?

He sounds like an idiot. Maybe that's why nobody wants to appear on his show.

Paul Zrimsek said...

The problem with trying to craft a narrative on behalf of public-sector unions is that the Cruel Oppressor they're set up to fight against, the guy in the top hat and tails lighting his big cigar with a $100 bill wrung from the sweat of the workers' brows, is also the guy in the booth pulling the lever. You can see where the Democrats might want to soft-pedal that a bit.

TosaGuy said...

CB bargaining reform will never be undone. It will be tweaked eventually to force union memmbers to pay dues, but the othere results will become too popular and hit democrat local government budgets too hard if overturned.

Concealed carry and voter ID will never be undone either.

Phil 3:14 said...

Just another example of someone from the "wings" losing perspective. This is the democratic/liberal equivalence of the discussion on the right as to who's a "real" conservative.

Once you get any distance away from the center, you lose perspective. I would assume from R-V's comment that "left" = socialist (since Bernie Sanders is a socialist)

The big change is the gap in the middle. Look at the US Senate and use the ADA ratings and ACU ratings and see who ends up in the gap with a middle quartiles rating from both groups. You'll find no more than five and probably less.

Its that phenomenon that engenders claims that Barack Obama is a moderate, or that John McCain isn't a conservative.

So what we get is this cyclical swing of elected then later voted out moderate Democrats and moderate democrats (or if you like "Republican-lite" and "RINO")

galdosiana said...

CB bargaining reform will never be undone. It will be tweaked eventually to force union memmbers to pay dues, but the othere results will become too popular and hit democrat local government budgets too hard if overturned.

I'm confused by this... union members already have to pay dues, even under the new legislation. The difference is that now, you have to opt IN to the unions in order to have the amount automatically deducted from your paycheck. Those who do not want to be in the union no longer have to pay for it.

Curious George said...

@ galdosiana

Not correct. the state will not collect union dues period. The union will have too. Of course, that will be no problem. Solidarity Forever. Because the union makes them strong.

galdosiana said...

Really? So how does that work, then? The members have to write monthly checks or something? I thought that if you signed up with the union, your percentage would be re-routed to them each month automatically.

Scott M said...

I thought that if you signed up with the union, your percentage would be re-routed to them each month automatically.

Thus the beauty of the rule. Instead of never paying the deduction manually, they just get used to it automatically coming out. Once that's removed, people start asking questions. It's a bit like a law that would make federal withholding illegal. People would pay a lot more attention to government waste if they had to cut a check each month. Well, 50% of us would, anyway.

traditionalguy said...

What is bargaining for union dues collections?
We have never heard of that concept, says the Walker hater union mob.

It is all about the people in revolt against a cruel tyrant that uses a majority vote in the Assembly and went so far once as to to hold a vote in Wisconsin, when votes that count should be taken in Illinois.

Recall anger is fueled by the motto "Remember the Kloppenberg."

Curious George said...

@ galdosiana

Not anymore. I'm not sure what the unions are doing now. But the state ain't collecting.

Calypso Facto said...

"The members have to write monthly checks or something?"

The unions have already canvased their membership for automatic withdrawal. It'll just come from the bank each month rather than the state.

Scott M said...

The unions have already canvased their membership for automatic withdrawal.

As well they should. Then THEIR people have to administer that program, not the state. There's zero reason why the state should have done that in the first place.

Weren't they offering different discounts for up-front payments for the quarter/year/etc?

edutcher said...

If you mention collective bargaining, you remind them of why people will want to keep the Republicans and ditch the Demos.

As to no Left, perhaps that's why our most famous domestic terrorist described himself as a "radical, Leftist, small 'c' communist".

They've all gone on to something worse.

Ann Althouse said...

unless the project of supporting public employee unions depends on confusing people.

By George, I think she's got it!

Hagar said...

"... an economic system championed by Roosevelt, Truman or Eisenhower ..."

Oh, boy! This guy is farther out than Roesch-Voltaire!

Original Mike said...

Of course they're missing. They don't have to tell the recall proponents, they already know it and will vote accordingly. As for the rest of the electorate, the ad producers would like them to forget it.

Hockey Bum said...

the right has taken over the dialogue in the last 30 years, and convinced us that any move towards an economic system championed by Roosevelt, Truman or Eisenhower

Roosevelt, Truman and Eisenhower championed public sector unions? Who knew?

Alex said...

These reforms can always be undone. We live in a democracy. Laws change on a dime. GOP overreach in 2011 will lead to their doom!

Alex said...

There is no confusion. The people of WI stand in solidarity with their union brothers and sisters. The picket lines are forming and are joined. Solidarity will defeat the evil GOP.

n.n said...

It's interesting to note that he mentions public unions and FDR in one breath. When civil servants cooperate to form a union, they effectively establish an illegal fourth branch of government, which interferes with our representative government. FDR, among others, recognized this issue, and dismissed the cooperatives formed by civil servants as unacceptable.

There is an inescapable need for involuntary exploitation (e.g., taxation) in the formation and development of a society. For one thing, public works require an inherently centralized process. The concern with involuntary exploitation arises when it becomes progressive. The redistribution of wealth through involuntary exploitation promotes progressive corruption of individuals and society.

As for publicly directed social economics, the funding of individuals and groups through involuntary exploitation (i.e., redistributive change) must be limited, targeted, and audited to ensure effectiveness. In order to mitigate the risk of progressive corruption, the beneficiaries of involuntary exploitation should be materially engaged in their own recovery. Ideally, social economics will be conducted through voluntary exploitation (i.e., charitable works and donations).

The problem with the current conversation is that it relies on emotional appeals to manipulate people and quell dissent, and resists efforts to discuss the issues of merit.

As for the left-wing in America, the concept of redistributive change through involuntary exploitation is derived purely from left-wing ideology (or its companion in arms: anarchy -- generational progressives and rebels). Unfortunately, America's left has far surpassed the original ideals of "liberals" and "progressives". In their effort to consolidate wealth and power, they have resorted to denigrating individual dignity (e.g., classifying individuals by their incidental features -- skin color) and devaluing human life (e.g., sexual revolution, normalization of abortion, defining individuals by their behavior). Not even the Soviet communists were as regressive in their realization of left-wing ideology as the American left; although, there was one other prominent group in recent memory that employed the same tactics on a national scale.

Anyway, it is American Conservatism that moderates between the totalitarian ideologies of the left and the libertarian ideologies of the right. Unfortunately, even corruption in the exception can lead to runaway negative effects.

Let's hope the competing interests in America resolve their differences, and restore the prosperity of America and her citizens (which will then be naturally redistributed throughout the world through voluntary exploitation -- the market).

Oh, one more thing, there is no real distinction between capitalism and Marxism/communism/socialism/fascism. The material and philosophical difference resides in how opportunities are distributed. The left-wing ideologues are supreme capitalists in their pursuit of authoritarian monopolies.

Kent said...

Craver's claim that the Democrats simply want to restore Roosevelt-type ideals is manifestly false. Roosevelt was adamantly opposed to public sector unions and considered them a kind of perversion, on grounds that the govt employer wasn't a profit-seeking capitalist. The US only legalized public sector collective bargaining under JFK and the unions took another couple of decades to pick up steam.

SunnyJ said...

Smart Repub ads would list school districts coming out with new budgest under the new rules by Gov and recalled Repubs, showing savings, no layoffs, reduced class sizes etc. The information is coming in every day and easy to find and report.

Also show improved jobs data, new businesses coming in, balanced budget ='s X Credit Rating just released.

And, play Fred Clark's voice mail over and over...if you haven't heard him make the treatening remark "I'd like to slap that woman up", you can't believe the tone in the guys voice. Seriously creepy.

Lance said...

There is no American left. There used to be. But the right has taken over the dialogue in the last 30 years, and convinced us that any move towards an economic system championed by Roosevelt, Truman or Eisenhower represents an attack against American capitalist values.

Why didn't Craver include Johnson, Nixon, or Carter in his list of left-leaning Presidents?

Lance said...

Why didn't Craver include Johnson, Nixon, or Carter in his list of left-leaning Presidents?

Or even Hoover for that matter?

Scott M said...

Or even Hoover for that matter?

Because Hoover sucks?

Lucien said...

For someone who claims to be on the left, doesn't saying that there is no left in american politics come close to defining one's self as being out of the mainstream?

I'm not agreeing that such a thing has happened, just noting that this is kind of risky rhetoric, with the risk being self-marginalization.

KenK said...

I think what Craver means (and no I didn't rtfa) is that the Democratic Party has gentrified. They aren't any longer a political movement of, by and for ordinary working class people. Now they more inclined to be unionized public employees, agitators for special interests (gays, "minorities" abortion rights, greenies, et al), rent seeking business interests, lefty do-gooders (ACLU, Brady Campaign, MADD, and the trial lawyers. That's stuff like minimum wage increases, card check and NLRB reform is so hard and GATT, NAFTA, and "free trade" agreements are so easy.

Drew said...

It must also be noted that the effects of Walker's Budget Repair Law are being felt across the state, with the results being that schools suddenly have budget surpluses, are able to hire rather than fire, and reduce the size of classrooms. Down in the trenches, teachers are waking up to the fact that free of the strictures of unions, things are looking rosy. If the Democrats remind voters that these candidates were against these reforms, . . . well, that might just backfire.

Chuck66 said...

No left wing party here? So what's all this talk I hear about "making the rich pay their fair share"? Sounds like socialism to me.

murgatroyd666 said...

Ah, yes ... I can see the billboards now:

*** Vote Democrat! ***
Because striking public employees, rich trial lawyers, and government bureaucrats don't have enough power!

murgatroyd666 said...

Ah, yes ... I can see the billboards now:

*** Vote Democrat! ***
Because striking public employees, rich trial lawyers, and government bureaucrats don't have enough power!

murgatroyd666 said...

I *hate* Blogger.

It told me that comment didn't go through.

Last night all I got was "Sorry, Bolgger seems to have encountered a problem."

Althouse, are you SURE you want to stay with them?

Carol_Herman said...

Ads only go so far!

The Internet is different!

How far this subject gets ... maybe, has more to do with word-of-mouth?

Maybe, more things have changed these past three years, than not?

HOPE & CHANGE got knocked out of the box ... without so much as one lamestream attack against it, gone wild.

Gone wild is the new gold standard.

traditionalguy said...

Since 1996 the Democrat Party has been totally removed and replaced by an arrogant and power mad group dedicated to replacing Americans with non-Americans and privately owned and run businesses with government favored businesses with government minders.

The Dems and their friends are the ones getting rich!

The capital available to middle class Capitalists is being whittled down to near zero by destroying their saved dollars and increasing their food and energy costs.

But the unions still want to talk about the GOP as the wealthy folks' friends. That is false. The GOP is the middle class's friends.

MadisonMan said...

Missing from Scott Walker's election ads: The subject of Collective Bargaining for public workers.

Since when do politicians campaign on what they actually will do in office?

MadisonMan said...

It must also be noted that the effects of Walker's Budget Repair Law are being felt across the state, with the results being that schools suddenly have budget surpluses, are able to hire rather than fire, and reduce the size of classrooms.

Not everywhere. I know, for example, that while Pewaukee may get many millions of dollars more this year, Madison is receiving -- IIRC -- about 10 million dollars less than projected. You can argue about whether this is directly tied to the Budget "Repair" Bill. How the state apportions money for schools is permanently broken, IMO.

Alex said...

Since when do politicians campaign on what they actually will do in office?

The idea being that Walker didn't say anything about taking away collective bargaining rights in the campaign. He flat out lied.

Curious George said...

@MadisonMan said...

Many school districts that received cuts have budget surpluses. The savings from teacher pensions/health care as well as things like ditching WEA Trust (over putting competition in front of them) have are the reason. Just as Walker said it would.

Of course, Madison (like Milwaukee) rushed a contract with teachers through before the BRB became law. So they're stuck. Neither would have had a deficit and have to deal with cuts. And frankly they can suck it.

SunnyJ said...

@MadisonMan...you can argue lots of things but the fact is Madison was one of the schools that rushed to support the unions by signing an agreement in the unions best interest ahead of the passage of the legislation that actually gave the schools tools to use.

That action, and that action alone has put the Madison schools in a very bad place. Neither the school board or the unions were looking out for the students or the future of Madison schools.

They looked our for themselves by pretending "bargaining" of any kind was going along...when in reality they were both on the same side and no one was on the side of the table looking out for schools and kids...except for Gov Walker and the Repubs.

But, hey...why flirt with reality at this point. Madison does so well for itself circling La La land on the way to the Magic Kingdom.

Hockey Bum said...

Walker didn't say anything about taking away collective bargaining rights in the campaign. He flat out lied.

Well, which is it? He "didn't say anything" or he "flat out lied?"

Alex said...

Well, which is it? He "didn't say anything" or he "flat out lied?"

Both.

Hockey Bum said...

LOL. Having a bit of a Sylvia Plath experience?

Curious George said...

I'm sick of this "Walker didn't campaign on it" bullshit. He really couldn't. He didn't know if he would be able to do it because at the time there was a Democratic majority in the legislature which would have made it impossible.

garage mahal said...

LOL

SGT Ted said...

... unless the project of supporting public employee unions depends on confusing people.

That is what it depends on entirely, as the unionistas seek to conflate private sector unions with public employee ones. Hence the blather about "workers", as if they were coal miners and not tax leeches.

garage mahal said...

Hence the blather about "workers", as if they were coal miners and not tax leeches.

Some of those "tax leeches", i.e. 9/11 responders from NYC, are out canvassing in Wisconsin districts, spending their own money and vacation time. Whatever stupid reason they ever had to vote Republican, [and lots of them voted for Walker], is certainly gone now.

SunnyJ said...

Regardless of what Walker specifically said, he certainly made it clear he was going for a balanced budget and that couldn't happen with all the entitlements and union deals.

As a forced member of teachers union and getting all their newsletters, I can tell you for sure they were making clear for a year before the election that this is what was going to happen and how it would hurt the unions and teachers etc. That's partly why they were so mad and surprised when Walker won...and have been so bitter in their attacks...its guilt.

The union membership was asleep at the switch, jumping up and down that Obama was going to give them all his stash and Trumka was visiting the WH everyday along with SEIU's leader at the time.

And whack...the old Adams County Attitude Adjustment upside the head. Walker was in and the deal was going down. They were never surprised, they knew all along, they warned all along and then low and behold...

Lost the election and damn...that is not what democracy!

Hockey Bum said...

Some of those "tax leeches", i.e. 9/11 responders from NYC, are out canvassing in Wisconsin districts, spending their own money and vacation time.

Because NYC has been served so well by it's public unions. Like 3-month-old Addison Reynoso who died because a union work slowdown meant that streets weren't cleared of snow and the ambulance couldn't get to his home. And his wasn't the only death.

And then there are the no-show jobs for which SEIU officials receive six figure salaries from NYC.

Curious George said...

garage mahal said...

Some of those "tax leeches", i.e. 9/11 responders from NYC, are out canvassing in Wisconsin districts, spending their own money and vacation time. Whatever stupid reason they ever had to vote Republican, [and lots of them voted for Walker], is certainly gone now.

NYC "first responders" voted for Walker?

Why we need voter ID.

garage mahal said...

Like 3-month-old Addison Reynoso who died because a union work slowdown meant that streets weren't cleared of snow and the ambulance couldn't get to his home

This fable is a good example of Murdoch trash journalism.

Curious George said...

LOL, was curious about garage's claim and all I could find was that three EMT's were up in Appleton last week. Only one was identified as having been at the WTC on 9/11.

FDNY has almost 15,000 firefighters and EMT's. I guess having .02% show up here is "some"...but is one "some"?

Hockey Bum said...

This fable is a good example of Murdoch trash journalism.

Which part? The work slowdown? The snow clogged streets? The 3-year-old (and others) who died?

Please bless us with your superior knowledge of the union slowdown last winter.

Scott said...

It actually happened.

Scott said...

Garage is only good for parroting the party line. He wipes his ass with facts,

garage mahal said...

It actually happened.

You have no fucking idea what happened. You have anonymous allegations in a tabloid that Giuliani didn't even believe. As we've learned, not even young dead girls are off limits to Murdoch's dirty dick beating hands.

Get a life.

sorepaw said...

I await Garage's dismissal of a news item in the Wall Street Journal, on the grounds that Rupert Murdoch currently owns that newspaper; therefore, everything in it has to be a tabloid fabrication.

For someone who claims that Nancy Pelosi never arranged for anyone in her district to get an ObamaReidPelosiCare waiver, Garage is remarkably sure that every NewsCorp enterprise, regardless of location or market segment, does things the News of the World way.

garage mahal said...

For someone who claims that Nancy Pelosi never arranged for anyone in her district to get an ObamaReidPelosiCare waiver

You just can't stop lying can you? It's like breathing.

damikesc said...

Some of those "tax leeches", i.e. 9/11 responders from NYC, are out canvassing in Wisconsin districts, spending their own money and vacation time. Whatever stupid reason they ever had to vote Republican, [and lots of them voted for Walker], is certainly gone now.

By "their" money, you mean "the taxpayers'" money, right?

NYC certainly doesn't have major deficit problems or anything. Let's listen to THEIR advice.

Don't those union goons have more kids to cause the death of?

sorepaw said...

Garage,

Just pointing to your, umm, disparate standards of proof.

In support of charges against Nancy Pelosi arranging political favors for some of her constituents, ironclad evidence is required.

In support of charges against anyone who works for any part of any NewsCorp holding, any evidence that Rupert Murdoch ordered a story fabricated is distinctly not required.

Meanwhile, you still haven't said what you think the appropriate response is to people who have carried water for Communist dictators.

Do you really have no opinion on that subject?

garage mahal said...

In support of charges against Nancy Pelosi arranging political favors for some of her constituents, ironclad evidence is required.

You still have it wrong. I said I "had no idea" what the story on Pelosi health care waivers. Then I said if ScottM had any evidence, to bring it forth.

Hockey Bum said...

Actually, in fairness to Garage Mahal, a city report released in June was unable to corroborate a union slowdown.

However, it wasn't just the Murdoch owned Post that was reporting it. For example, here's a report from the local CBS affiliate.

ken in sc said...

In the 70s, one of my economics professors taught us that communist countries practiced state capitalism, and that most large western corporations were a form of private socialism. That still seems right to me.

sorepaw said...

Garage,

You demanded all kinds of evidence showing that Nancy Pelosi personally intervened to arrange ObamaReidPelosiCare waivers for businesses in her district.

You didn't require any evidence to conclude that a New York Post story about unionized workers deliberately going slow on the snowplowing was fabricated, and on orders from Rupert Murdoch himself.

Disparate standards.

MadisonMan said...

Of course, Madison (like Milwaukee) rushed a contract with teachers through before the BRB became law. So they're stuck. Neither would have had a deficit and have to deal with cuts. And frankly they can suck it.

It's my understanding that Madison did not rush through a contract with teachers (city workers, that's a different story) to seal a sweet deal for them. I thought the contract saved the School District something like $10M. (Maybe 'saved' isn't the right word). That's all from a memory of a news story months ago, however, and I don't know if anything was finalized.

garage mahal said...

You demanded all kinds of evidence showing that Nancy Pelosi personally intervened to arrange ObamaReidPelosiCare waivers for businesses in her district.

I think I asked the minimum required to back up that claim. If Pelosi WAS quid pro quo'ing somebody, why do you think I wouldn't want to know? Throw a link out there.

Here is what I said re: [shorter] Pelosigate:

You would need to prove Pelosi personally secured waivers for her district.

No idea. Feel free to make your case though

sorepaw said...

Garage,

There are 435 Congressional districts in this country.

Nancy Pelosi represents one of them.

Why have so many ObamaReidPelosiCare waivers gone to organizations in one district out of 435?

What do you think is a plausible explanation?

Now, what if special exemptions from some Federal mandate or regulatory burden were going in disproportionate numbers to businesses in John Boehner's district?

Would you knock down suspicions that Boehner was delivering payoffs to supporters by demanding proof of his direct involvement?

And now, what leads you to believe that a New York Post story alleging a deliberate slowdown in snowplowing was purposely fabricated?

What further leads you to believe that Rupert Murdoch ordered that such a story be fabricated?

MadisonMan said...

Curious George and SunnyJ: I don't think you know what's going in Wisconsin. Very few districts negotiated contracts before the CB bill passed. Were there any besides Milwaukee and Kenosha? Link. I'm not sure.

The shortfall in Madison, and elsewhere, occurs for reasons related to School Funding from the state. It has very little to do with Unions.

Try harder not to sound like a partisan hack. Your comments will be more interesting to read.

Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...

MM, many school districts, including Madison, reached contract agreements before the bill took effect. Most of these districts obtained similar concessions that would be required under Walker's bill. MPS was one of the few that refused to face reality.

Also, while it is true that Madison is receiving less in state aid, the savings from their contract consessions should offset the loss of state dollars.

MadisonMan said...

Thanks for the link to that article -- that was the one I remembered seeing, but the daughter got a new computer for college yesterday and was downloading the world onto it, apparently, making it really hard to search things.

Curious George said...

MadisonMan said...
Curious George and SunnyJ: I don't think you know what's going in Wisconsin. Very few districts negotiated contracts before the CB bill passed. Were there any besides Milwaukee and Kenosha? Link. I'm not sure.

The shortfall in Madison, and elsewhere, occurs for reasons related to School Funding from the state. It has very little to do with Unions.

Try harder not to sound like a partisan hack. Your comments will be more interesting to read.


I live is 'tosa, about 1/2 mile from Walker's home, so I do in fact know what's going on in WI.

Madison Schools negotiated and signed a contract before the BRB became law. Although they got some concessions they could have saved millions more, and that would have more than offset the reported $890k shortfall. It has everything to do with the union and school board cabal. As I said, they can suck it.

Quit sounding like a fucking retarded liberal hack. Your posts will more interesting to read.

Calypso Facto said...

Madison Schools are getting $2M less in state aid (based on formula) than they budgeted for but are also getting $1.7M MORE in state poverty aid than budgeted. With rounding, there was a $400k budget shortfall.

The midnight hour union contract calls for a 5% health insurance contribution that saved the district $1.7M. Going with the state's new level of 12.6% contributions would have saved the district another $2.4M.

From 2008-2010, the Madison School District increased it's revenue by 5% while enrollment increased less than .1%. I bet if I could easily look back further the disparity is even more egregious. With the rest of the state in recession, it's high time that school (and all government) budgets get careful scrutiny too.

MadisonMan said...

Madison Schools are getting $2M less in state aid (based on formula) than they budgeted for but are also getting $1.7M MORE in state poverty aid than budgeted. With rounding, there was a $400k budget shortfall.

Is that the most recent figure? The one I read back in late June, I think, was a lot more dire, something like 6 or 7 million less than expected.

That was before a death in the family, however, which has had a very interesting to live through deleterious effect on my memory. Interesting to me, at least, to experience again how emotions can effect memory.

MadisonMan said...

These old thread get pushed off the front page a lot faster with the redesign.

Calypso Facto said...

Madman: The reduction in state aid was $6.7M, $2M more than forecast. Combined with property tax revenues, the overall effect is a budgeted 3% reduction in next year's revenue.

I'm used to getting to the comments late and posting to the empty hall. Thanks for checking back! :)