July 17, 2009

"As Christians, WE'RE SORRY."

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"For being self-righteous, judgmental bastards."

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"REVOLUTION."

More photos from the graffiti wall in Knoxville.

71 comments:

Paul Zrimsek said...

So which non-self-righteous, non-judgmental people have been demanding apologies from the Christians lately?

ricpic said...

Don't ya just want to hug a lefty?...to death.

Chip Ahoy said...

Oh, oh, oh, I wanna play too.

As anonymous sectarians
WE MAKE NO APOLOGY
for being marring, in-your-face
poster-putting-up hopelessly projective
and vocal repetitive pouting crybabies
DEVOLUTION

As anonymous sectarians
WE MAKE NO APOLOGY
for being marring, in-your-face
poster-putting-up hopelessly projective
and vocal repetitive pouting crybabies
DEVOLUTION

As anonymous sectarians
WE MAKE NO APOLOGY
for being marring, in-your-face
poster-putting-up hopelessly projective
and vocal repetitive pouting crybabies
DEVOLUTION

As anonymous sectarians
WE MAKE NO APOLOGY
for being marring, in-your-face
poster-putting-up hopelessly projective
and vocal repetitive pouting crybabies
DEVOLUTION

jag said...

"As Christians, we're sorry for holding any belief that might make any one of the earth's six billion people uncomfortable. We will try harder to stand for nothing whatsoever."

EDH said...

My god, was that cathedral drawn freehand with a marker on plywood?

It's exquisite.

LarsPorsena said...

"My god, was that cathedral drawn freehand with a marker on plywood?

It's exquisite."

It has me agog too. Could it have been stenciled?

Charity said...

Revolution is a church started by Jim and Tammy Faye Bakker's son Jay. My old neighbors had a Revolution bumper sticker that said, "Religion Kills." I thought they were the typical anti-Christian lefties that we get here in Burlington, VT, but the point is actually that religion kills the message of Christ. In other words, people get lost in the legalism, etc. I'm not endorsing Revolution, just telling you what it is. Here's their website.

chuck b. said...

Knoxville is an Althouse paradise!


(I'm talking about the content, not the content of the content.)

traditionalguy said...

Legalists do need to apologise to everyone, whether they are masquerading as Christians, Muslims, or one of the many Cults on Crack's list. The Spirit of Holiness guiding true Christians teaches them humility, while all the legalism on earth is based upon self righteous pride and displayed for prescious bragging rights.

Paddy O. said...

Don't know if it's connected at all, but this reminds me of the Christians Confess website that got attention (in specific circles) a couple years ago, and appears to be still going strong.

My impression of the site, and these stickers, is that's it's not about sucking up or being pc or whatever, it's a confession that Christians have not, in fact, been particularly Christian in their approaches or attitudes. The Church, for a long, long time was about power and control for far too many people and not about living as Jesus called us to live.

So, there's a move to admit the errors and attempt to move to a renewed spirituality. They can't let go of the baggage of the past, but such folks don't want to embrace it anymore. And, honestly, they want to evangelize in a way that better reflects the good news that Jesus' holistic ministry (life, work, teaching, cross, resurrection) expressed.

TMink said...

Paddy O wrote: " it's a confession that Christians have not, in fact, been particularly Christian in their approaches or attitudes. The Church, for a long, long time was about power and control for far too many people and not about living as Jesus called us to live."

Sounds like a good idea.

I can pony up.

I am sorry for the times I am a jerk on this blog.

Really. I am working on it.

Trey

Salamandyr said...

Whoever made those is a self-righteous little snot.

Paddy O. said...

Traditionalguy, that's exactly it. And your mention of the Spirit of Holiness is spot on. Holiness is far too often assumed as equivalent to legalism or moralism or self-righteousness. But that's a bad understanding, and people who think their holy because of legalism might very well be quite unholy.

And that's what this push is about, from what I can see. It's about trying to retune to be more in tune with the holy as represented by Jesus, and as continued by the Spirit who is holy.

By being legalists and power hungry, Christians have in a lot of ways denied their own Christ.

A couple of weeks ago I preached (well, presented an abridgment of a much longer paper) to a church in Oregon on a more accurate understanding of holiness. It was based on the work of Wolfhart Pannenberg--though as such it also pays close attention to what Scripture actually says.

Trey, me too. Keeping this stuff in mind has radically shaped my online conversation. Made me a lot more quiet than I used to be, but I think that's not as much permanent as a temporary step.

Big Mike said...

Trey, I can't remember you ever being a jerk.

Now me, on the other hand ...

But I have no plans to apologize.

As an atheist I appreciate the posted sentiment. Three of the four most evil people I've ever known were Bible-thumping, in-your-face Fundamentalist Christians.

Scott M said...

Legalists do need to apologise to everyone, whether they are masquerading as Christians, Muslims, or one of the many Cults on Crack's list. The Spirit of Holiness guiding true Christians teaches them humility, while all the legalism on earth is based upon self righteous pride and displayed for prescious bragging rights.

This is why, even as a believer myself, I've never been comfortable with anything other than traditional Lutheranism.

I love that old SNL sketch where the guy is talking to his guardian angel, who knows absolutely everything in the universe. Things like the 348th grossest thing in the world and, at the very end of the sketch, God's favorite religion...Lutheran lol

Bissage said...

(1) IMHO, Trey is one of the nicest guys on the internet.

That said, it has long been my personal experience that sincere individuals apologize mostly because they want to be liked.

This is why every day, in various ways, I apologize for my very existence.

Please forgive me.

(2) FWIW, I can understand why someone would apologize for something they did. I can understand why someone would apologize for something their child did. I can understand why someone would apologize for something a spouse or sibling or friend did. Maybe even a business associate.

I cannot understand why anyone would be so grandiose as to think that he or she has standing to apologize for a total stranger, no less millions of strangers, no less an abstraction like a country or a nation or a religion.

Seems insincere to me.

A public relations tactic and little else.

So says I, a knee-jerk splitter, not a joiner.

(The sentence immediately above is best read in a pirate voice. Yaaargh!!!)

(3) OBTW . . . . . . . . . . Uncle Albert?

Maguro said...

College kids...so subversive while they're fucking off for 4, 5 or 6 years on daddy's dime.

The Crack Emcee said...

I don't think, for a second, Christians put that up. It was a liberal NewAger, as usual, trying to hide his/her true intentions.

Nice cathedral, though.

The Macho Response

Beth said...

Trey, thanks. I've been hoping you'd do that for a long time now.

KIDDING!

Really, I couldn't resist.

And I join you in that apology. It's an effort worth making.

TMink said...

Beth, Bissage, you guys are great, and I think the world of you both, so I have likely been nice to you both.

But I have been a real ass to DTL and Jeremey. And there is no excuse for that.

So thanks for the kindness, I accept it and it is honestly touching.

But I will keep the idea in mind to be better to people who I do not appreciate.

"Three of the four most evil people I've ever known were Bible-thumping, in-your-face Fundamentalist Christians."

Me too. And that is sad. I think that is the point of the sticker. But I totally understand the suspicion and skepticism. Christians need to act better, not talk better.

I think we do better as a minority religion. So things are looking up.
Trey

elHombre said...

Sorta like Oblahblah apologizing for the US, isn't it?

Forget the charities, hospitals, universities, anti-slavery movements, etc. We apologize for being human, sometimes.

Scott said...

One of the teachers of the law came and heard them debating. Noticing that Jesus had given them a good answer, he asked him, "Of all the commandments, which is the most important?" "The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.' The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no commandment greater than these."

"Well said, teacher," the man replied. "You are right in saying that God is one and there is no other but him. To love him with all your heart, with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices."

When Jesus saw that he had answered wisely, he said to him, "You are not far from the kingdom of God." And from then on no one dared ask him any more questions. [Mark 12:28-34 NIV]


This is what Christianity is all about. Why would any Christian feel a need to apologize for believing this?

Lem said...

If you are really a Christian dont be like the pharisees.

MadisonMan said...

I am sorry if my being a jerk has offended anyone.

Trey, that's how you should word it.

LarsPorsena said...

@Tradition:
"The Spirit of Holiness guiding true Christians teaches them humility.."

To know humility you must be humiliated, you can't learn it.

ricpic said...

Trey is no jerk!

There. Puts me in with the in crowd.

ricpic said...

You can't fool me, Bissage, you magnificent bastard!

bearbee said...

"My god, was that cathedral drawn freehand with a marker on plywood?

It's exquisite."

It has me agog too. Could it have been stenciled
?

Too bad some a**hole had to muck it up.

Spire in 2nd pic appears freehand

tim maguire said...

I for one am glad the members of Revolution Church have decided to stop being self-righteous judgmental bastards and heartily welcome them to rejoin the congregation of decent people.

We didn't miss them, but maybe we would have if we knew about them.

Anyway, welcome!

DADvocate said...

Posting stickers on a wall is an empty meaningless apology at best. If you've been a self-righteous, judgemental bastard, apologize to those you acted that way towards.

If you havn't been a srjb, you have nothing for which to apologize and an apology is meaningless. I lean towards these being made by a non-Christian.

bearbee said...

Posting stickers on a wall is an empty meaningless apology at best.

It miscommunicates or communicates absolutely nothing. putting many Christians on the defensive.

Is that the intent?

We’re sorry for being self-righteous, judgmental bastards!

campy said...

"I apologize on behalf of those people over there who aren't perfect like me."

rhhardin said...

On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk.

hawkeyedjb said...

"As Christians?" Why apologize on behalf of a billion people who might not share your shortcomings?

How about, "As self-righteous, judgmental bastards, we’re sorry for being self-righteous, judgmental bastards."

rastajenk said...

In the current environment, there are no more self-righteous, judgmental bastards than those who pray at the altar of Global Warming. And I don't see any of them apologizing.

Freeman Hunt said...

How about, "As self-righteous, judgmental bastards, we’re sorry for being self-righteous, judgmental bastards."

Exactly.

I haven't noticed Christians being any more self-righteous, judgmental, or bastardly, than anyone else. Such faults are found across all of humanity.

As a Christian, one ought to be sorry for all sins, but this sticker seems to label all Christians with these specific sins. I reject that notion.

traditionalguy said...

Lars porsena...The scripture instructs us to humble ourselves, so that humiliation will not become necessary. One traditional method is the Jewish Yom Kippur tradition of humbling their soul by fasting and and repentance prayers. The secret is that amazing grace teaches us deep in our hearts, while listings of rules that we claim we can keep only pushes us into more sins. Another good way is to withdraw ourselves from our own opinion and let others have a chance to be right. That also frees you from the burden of having to be right all the time. Shalom to you.

Freeman Hunt said...

As a Christian, I apologize for the extra comma in my last post.

rhhardin said...

The "Sorry Montage," Rush Limbaugh, Nov 6, 2004. (real audio)

Lem said...

As a Christian, I’m sorry I was a church bus-pew groper ;)

dbp said...

As an atheist, I apologise for those Christians who feel the need to apologise for the acts of other Christians.

I further apologise to any who are offended by the above--except for the people who put the stickers on the plywood: I want to offend them.

Jeremy said...

I used to read Newsweek and the local paper (haha, I know) and always skipped any letter to the editor or opinion piece that began with the phrase "As a [mother/white man/conservative/union member/veteren/doctor/etc]." I think that if you've got a point to make it ought to be strong enough that it doesn't require an argument from authority.


-The Other Jeremy

Quayle said...

I’m sorry for being so interested in that 19th century American idiot/genius-charlatan Joseph Smith, who said:

"While one portion of the human race is judging and condemning the other without mercy, the Great Parent of the universe looks upon the whole human family with a fatherly care and paternal regard; He views them as His offspring. . . .

"He is a wise Lawgiver, and will judge all men, not according to the narrow, contracted notions of men, but, ‘according to the deeds done in the body whether they be good or evil,' or whether these deeds were done in England, America, Spain, Turkey, or India. . . "

Patrick said...

Is this an intimation of how Althouse feels about Obama?

Shanna said...

Paddy O wrote: " it's a confession that Christians have not, in fact, been particularly Christian in their approaches or attitudes.

Isn’t that the truth. People are people, and as such are prone to the same jerky things everyone else is prone to. But with some folks, it comes with this extra dose of self-righteousness that is not desirable. It’s part of why I can’t seem to settle in a church, because I’ve seen too much of the church leadership bs in a success of churches/church schools throughout childhood. You know when you see all those high school is horrible movies? The closest I ever came to any of that treatment was when I made the mistake of spending 7th grade in a “Christian” school where the guys who spent the entire year being a total jerk ended up winning the “Christian conduct award” at which I point I said forget this nonsense and went to a public school where people acted a hell of a lot more Christian than they did at the private school.

This is what Christianity is all about. Why would any Christian feel a need to apologize for believing this?

ITA, that Jesus was all about loving your neighbor, and being nice to the people who everyone else is mean to, but not all Christians live up to this. If you want to apologize for you imperfect self, have at it. All have sinned and come short of the glory of god and all that. However, it is asinine and obnoxious to apologize for people who are not you. Shut up, graffiti people!

Richard Fagin said...

traditionalguy and PaddyO, that's what separates Judeo-Christian philosophy from that of our self-appointed enemies. We can look at ourselves and see we need improvement, admit that we've done things wrong and need to change. There wouldn't have been an end to slavery and Jim Crow but for these facts.

Our adversaries, however, are on a mission from the almighty and have no such capacity. And if recognizing that means I'm a self-righteous, judgmental bastard, so be it. I want to live and I want my civilization to survive.

Titus,hellohowareyouIamsuperasusual said...

Wow, Knoxville is so cutting edge.

They have a wall that you can write on.

Totally creative and daring.....not

Titus,hellohowareyouIamsuperasusual said...

I am very spiritual but do not belong to any congregation. I tend to do my praying alone through quiet reflection and contemplation.

My parents go to catholic mass everyday.

I too, need to apologize for my sins on this site. Please forgive me fellow republicans.

Wow, a huge weight has just been lifted off my shoulders.

I feel revitalized. Group hug now. No trying to finger my ass during the group hug though. I know how some of you can get a little fresh.

Titus,hellohowareyouIamsuperasusual said...

I am also sorry I blew of the Divine Miss A last Christmas.

Please forgive me Grande Diva.

It was 20 degrees below zero and snowed every day and I never left the house but that is not an excuse.

I apologize in advance for asking this but how has the sex been on the road trip? a) exceeds expectations; b) meets expectations; c) disappointing but bearable; d) what sex?

traditionalguy said...

Richard Fagin...I agree with you. The Christian insight that our enemies are not flesh and blood (persons with bodies)helps direct the Christian not to attack others and be at peace with everyone, insofar as it lies within our power. But let anyone attack or intimidate my friends and then a fight becomes a necessity, and friends become a necessity in that fight, and Semper Fidelis suddenly becomes a lot more than an empty slogan. I suspect that is why I will accept a Sarah Palin's style of leadership over the more intellectual politicians, or more intellectual expositors, such as a Peggy Noonan. In a fight being intellectually correct is not the goal. The only goal is to win and end the fight.

Titus,hellohowareyouIamsuperasusual said...

Are there any cool neighborhoods in Knoxville which have lofts, kohlrabi batons, exotic cheese casks, vintage clothing stores, rare expensive wine stores, outdoor dining, walking distance to fabulous designer stores, gays, dinks, hipsters, artists and start up fabulous tech companies employing young entrepreneurial ivy league grads?

Titus,hellohowareyouIamsuperasusual said...

What is downtown Knoxville's city scene like? To people actually live in the city and not in subdivisions with ranch homes?

I am talking lofts, condos, brownstones, high rises right in the city.

Is there a runway on the streets of Knoxville?

traditionalguy said...

Titus...You are a hoot. You could write some great comedy,like Noel Coward's plays.

Titus,hellohowareyouIamsuperasusual said...

Thanks trad guy.

No serious, Althouse I have a request. I never request anything either.

Can we get some Knoxville city street scenes. I am interested. I love cities and don't know anything about Knoxville, other than it is where University of Tennessee is located.

At late at night I go online and study cities. I know quite a bit about many cities, even if I haven't been there. But I don't know much about Knoxville.

Also, can we get your analysis of Knoxville. Something more indepth. Could you live there, likes/dislikes, food, restaurants, shops, people.

What I am saying is open yourself up more to your faithful commenters. How is Knoxville making you feel?

Titus,hellohowareyouIamsuperasusual said...

Also, who are they wearing in Knoxville for the 2009 summer season?

Darcy said...

I will apologize to no one for being a Christian.

William said...

I have prayed long and hard for God to give me the strength and confidence to be a judgemental, self-righteous bastard. The Devil has chosen to make me his wishy-washy, endlessly vacillating minion.

Balfegor said...

Re: Freeman Hunt:

I haven't noticed Christians being any more self-righteous, judgmental, or bastardly, than anyone else. Such faults are found across all of humanity.

Sure. But depending on where you are, the people who are most arrogantly self-righteous, judgmental or bastardly may tend to be Christians, just the way, if you're in San Francisco, they'll all be conventionally bien-pensant Leftists.

I still recall, five or six years on, this snotty goatee-ed receptionist for a building I was at for an interview, whose idea of small talk was to crack offensive jokes about Bush II. I suspect that, as Californians often do, he assumed that because I'm non-White, I therefore shared his opinions of Bush II. I did not correct him, because that would have been rude, so instead I huff about him like this, behind his back. In Evangelical communities, I'm sure, there must be people just as smugly certain that everyone around them thinks the same things they do.

Anyhow, the people that get one's goat are not the people who live far away where one will never meet them. There are people, I suppose, who get the hives just imagining that that someone, somewhere is being self-righteous, but most of us are irritated only by the self-righteous chap next door.

section9 said...

Jesus Christ: post-modernist sissy ass lefty progressive secularists. You can find them pictured in Brittanica under "People Silently Awaiting Their Beheading By The Jihad".

Where is my revolver?!!! Where!

Leland said...

Pot judges Kettle to be judgemental.

Kirby Olson said...

I think everybody should be Sorry.

Sorry.

Maxine Weiss said...

a popular female blogger is in the NYT--


http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/17/business/media/17blog.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&hp&adxnnlx=1247804009-Nk37OWPsNN0Z%20gdyKUjvfQ


___________________

Lem said...

"Most Trusted Man in America" Walter Cronkite is dead.

And thats the way it is.

veni vidi vici said...

"(3) OBTW . . . . . . . . . . Uncle Albert?"



......... Admiral Halsey!

MadisonMan said...

I wonder how many obits will include and that's the way it is as the headline? Not very original.

JAL said...

Amazing Grace

Penny said...

"Sorry" as Christians?

Sorrier still that I was not Christian.

So now what?

Penny said...

What the heck is going on with Ann tonight? Althouse doesn't apologize for me or for you, yet she left an Althouse quote..."As Christians, WE'RE SORRY."

pst314 said...

A poster you will never see: "As progressives we are sorry for being self-righteous, judgmental bastards who sought to silence all we disagreed with and to control every detail of people's lives."

knox said...

the other jeremy,

when posting here, you really should consider changing your actual handle to "the other jeremy." More than once I've almost skipped one of your comments because I assume it's written by you-know-who. Just a thought.

Ann Althouse said...

"Can we get some Knoxville city street scenes. I am interested. I love cities and don't know anything about Knoxville, other than it is where University of Tennessee is located."

As you probably figured out already, I was just passing through Knoxville. A short walk + lunch w G&H, then on to Asheville.