I am listening to a history of english language podcast and the other day I learned all animal words like swine, cow, sheep, hen and deer are anglo saxon words while beef, steak, veal, pork, mutton .... are french words. When Normans conquered England, the anglos were turned into serfs who kept care of animals but were not allowed to eat their meat, that was reserved french muckety mucks.
I noticed that Jacqueline Cartier passed away recently. She was 96 years old. She was a French author, and a comedian popular in the 50's. Not very well known outside of France. I think most of her stuff is 30 years old or more, so she probably retired in comfort. She chose a quiet spot with palm tree lined streets - Sainte-Marie-la-Mer.
Hopefully not too many dead migrants washing up on the beaches...
I guess I am surprised that Trump hasn't Tweeted any Althouse Poll results. I was going to say that I was surprised that Trump didn't Tweet any Drudge Poll results, but he actually has done that. I think Drudge Polls show Trump at about 92% popularity.
jwl, the animal/meat differentiation in language fascinates me. Cultures with Romance languages (not just French) tend to separate the meat from the animal: ham, beef, mutton, salami...
But not with poultry! Chicken, turkey, goose, duck. And not with lamb, strangely! Because we have veal, not calf.
Germanic languages go straight to the animal or parts thereof: swine, Rindfleisch, liverwurst...
There must be interplay between culture, especially cooking culture, and these euphemistic words in Romance languages. "Blood sausage" (Blotwurst) doesn't sell well in America.
I don't know what they do in Asian, African, or other root languages and cultures.
For some time, I've been wondering about the change in the meaning of "candor" and "candid" since Jane Austen's time. As in Candide, in her novels it meant seeing or putting the best face on things (from the Latin for the brightened togas that candidates for office donned).
Last week, I saw its modern meaning in a 1858 Trollope novel, so there was a considerable change in only 40 years.
Ted Turner sells buffalo meat. You can get ostrich at some restaurants. Maybe beef, ham, etc. are archaic. When we start serving humans, will it appear as "human" on the restaurant menu?
This hour, it is the news that the married, father-of-two-with-a-newborn-in-January Trump tv surrogate Jason Miller impregnated Trump transition advisor A.J. Delgado in Las Vegas.
The Twitterstorm is so fabulous. In magnificent Trump fashion, Miller Tweets that he and his wife(!) and daughters(!!!) welcome the child into the world. To which Delgado basically replies wtf, and notes that Miller hasn't paid $1.00 for the new love-child's support.
Delgado says that Miller says that he was "separated" at the time.
Tillerson plays coi, while Mattis posits the immediate destruction of the North Korean people.This confuses NBC, who has never seen grown men in action before.
You know, Michael K, I had forgotten that Jason Miller had at one time been named as Trump's Communications Director. (Miller resigned almost as soon as he was named. Then it was Mike Dubke, who quit after about 11 weeks. Then Sean Spicer absorbed the job along with being Press Secretary. Then it was Scaramucci. You can't make this stuff up.)
Being Trump's Communications Director is now like being the drummer for Spinal Tap.
It is appalling to me that Congress, given that he will sign any bill they pass, will not do anything.
What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people? After Trump campaigned on providing great coverage, with lowered premiums, and zero cuts to Medicaid. Trump said everybody would have to be covered, even though Trump knew that no other Republican would make such a promise.
And remember that Republicans in the Senate has just seen Trump lean on members of the House to pass something, anything, just to get it done, and then turned around and called the bill that they passed, "Mean; too mean" after the media made it clear who would be hurt in the process.
If Trump wants to repeal and replace Obamacare, Trump should write a replacement plan. Own it. Campaign on it. Be clear on what the hard choices are. Be straight about who wins and who loses. If he has disagreements with Congress, that is fine. Make them clear.
It's the sort of thing that Rush, Hannity, the other alt-right yakkers, and Althouse never talk about. They don't want any intelligent discourse about what the hard choices in healthcare are. They are unequipped to deal with it.
Hard to believe now, but Howard Johnson's was once the largest restaurant chain in the US. And frankly, I wish they still were.
They even had a location in Greenwich Village, which was long way from their New England origins. From my (unpublished) book WARREN STREET:
"Howard Johnson’s was an eastern chain of family-style restaurants serving everything from scrambled eggs to their own brand of ice cream. Also goulash and fried clams, most of their dinner menu pre-packaged somewhere up in New England, or possibly out in Jersey.
The Howard Johnson’s in the Village was, however, a far cry from New England, almost as if Howard had scouted the location blindfolded. And when the typical Howard Johnson customer happened to wander in off 6th Avenue, this Howard had a few surprises. Like the Village “regulars,” boys dressed as girls, men dressed as women, sitting at the counter and tables looking like the loudest, day-glow version of an off-Broadway disaster.
“Clarence, just look!” Cynthia Vermont urgently whispered to her husband with a light elbow to his ribs. “Cin, please, I’m trying to eat my goulash,” Clarence whispered back, the egg noodles dripping from his lips. “The one in the pink, I think she’s a ‘man’!” “Nah, it can’t be.” “I told you we shouldn’t come in here!” “Cin, this is ‘Howard Johnson’s’,” as he continued eating his goulash. “Well, down here I think ‘Howard’ must be a… homo-sexual.” “So what, the goulash tastes the same.” “It’s a good thing we didn’t bring the kids.” “Cin, you want the rest of your clams?” “Take’em with you, I don’t want to stay here another minute!” “Why, because they dress up in chartreuse?” “Put down that fork, stop eating!” “Cin, we came to Greenwich Village to see what it’s like, and they’re what it’s like.” “Well, I don’t think Reverend Clackston would appreciate your pagan view.” “Please, just relax, I don’t think they’re, uh, dangerous .” “Well, you can sit in this den of sin, but I’m leaving!” “Okay, I’m coming,” as Mrs. Vermont stood up, put her hands on her hips, and impatiently tapped her right foot as her husband tried to take the remaining goulash down in one gulp.
What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people
Yes. That is what they promised to do, and that is what they were elected to do.
If Trump wants to repeal and replace Obamacare, Trump should write a replacement plan.
That's not his job..that's Congress's job. The Republicans have been promising to repeal Obamacare ever since it was passed. They should have had a repeal, or a repeal and replace bill written six years ago.
If the Republicans in Congress can't pass budget bills or the repeal of Obamacare now...when will they ever be able to, and why should anybody ever vote for them again?
They don't want any intelligent discourse about what the hard choices in healthcare are.
How hard is it to simply return to the way things were eight years ago? And if this is impossible, then the Republicans should simply give up and concede to the Democrats. This is of course exactly what the Establishment Republicans do, and the reason why President Trump exists.
They don't want any intelligent discourse about what the hard choices in healthcare are.
This statement applies to Democrats. They persist in denying the existence of half the people within the Obamacare system who are receiving NO subsidy and perpetually shoulder the burden of ever higher rates and deductibles and copays, less choice or no choice. Obama and Democrats claim full credit for providing acess to healthcare for 20 million people yet ignore the 8-9 million who still are not covered by any form of insurance.
Geeze, I am so glad that there are Republicans who care about getting re-elected more than they care about demolishing the reputation of Obama. Because we still need to get federal judges confirmed, and tax legislation passed, and the Dept. of Ed. reformed, and lots of other items on the agenda.
It is NOT easy to go back to the pre-Obamacare status quo! That is the most naive formulation there is. Naturally, that is the Monkey-Butler Sean Hannity formulation. Millions of people have health insurance now, thanks to Obamacare.
Do I like Obamacare? Of course not! It never addressed the problem of the rising medical costs curve. Do we need other legislation? Of course we do! But it isn't reconciliation stuff; it is stuff that requires regular-order passage in the Senate. Stuff like tort reform, and national insurance law reform. 60 votes-type stuff. Unless you want to do away with the filibuster, which is a whole new argument and one that might just be worth having.
It's the one foolproof method I have found, to shutting up a Trump supporter: explain exactly what your "replacement" of Obamacare looks like. And tell me who gets hurt, by how much, and what you expect to tell those people.
"Chuck said... It is appalling to me that Congress, given that he will sign any bill they pass, will not do anything.
What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people? After Trump campaigned on providing great coverage, with lowered premiums, and zero cuts to Medicaid. Trump said everybody would have to be covered, even though Trump knew that no other Republican would make such a promise.
And remember that Republicans in the Senate has just seen Trump lean on members of the House to pass something, anything, just to get it done, and then turned around and called the bill that they passed, "Mean; too mean" after the media made it clear who would be hurt in the process.
If Trump wants to repeal and replace Obamacare, Trump should write a replacement plan. Own it. Campaign on it. Be clear on what the hard choices are. Be straight about who wins and who loses. If he has disagreements with Congress, that is fine. Make them clear.
It's the sort of thing that Rush, Hannity, the other alt-right yakkers, and Althouse never talk about. They don't want any intelligent discourse about what the hard choices in healthcare are. They are unequipped to deal with it."
What a steaming fucking pile. The GOP campaigned on repeal and replace. They promised long before Trump was even a candidate. They, like you, are scumbags.
Obama and Democrats claim full credit for providing acess to healthcare for 20 million people yet ignore the 8-9 million who still are not covered by any form of insurance.
If you are someone who is currently uninsured (let's say, for example, a 32 year-old self-employed tech consultant making $95,000/year), you aren't being attacked so much by Obamacare. You have made an election. You don't want to buy expensive insurance. So you don't. You'll face the Obamcare tax penalty, but that penalty is less than what you'd pay in insurance premiums. Of course you'll be completely exposed if you get hit by a car, or fall off a ladder while cleaning your gutters, or if you get cancer. You can buy insurance in the next enrollment period (and you will), thanks to the pre-existing condition provisions in the law. And of course everyone who knows anything about the insurance industry (whether they are in the business or not) will tell you that they can't continue the pre-existing condition regs unless nearly everybody is in the insurance pool.
"What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people? "
Yes. They promised and campaigned for office on that very issue.
As for Medicaid. That is a welfare program that, in a moment of brilliance, the Democrats made part of Obamacare but it existed long before that. The expansion of Medicaid was like the free heroin hit the dealer offers.
A free market would provide better insurance for less money. The only difference is that taxpayers are subsidizing some.
What a steaming fucking pile. The GOP campaigned on repeal and replace. They promised long before Trump was even a candidate. They, like you, are scumbags.
They aren't going to attach themselves to a bill that had about 15% popularity.
I'm not saying that we can't still reform healthcare; we should.
What I am saying is that Trump's bawling about how Obamacare is a disaster and he will negotiate its replacement is bullshit.
The real healthcare reform will come when a bipartisan majority reforms the ACA. The more that Trump personalizes it into a battle between him and the Obama legacy, the more that Trump will lose.
Michael K said... "What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people? "
Yes. They promised and campaigned for office on that very issue.
What bullshit. Trump campaigned on protecting and preserving "Medicare and Medicaid... we have to cover everybody... the government has to pay."
Michael K said... OK. I'm done reading and commenting on chuck's stuff.
Like I said, the surest way to shut up a Trump supporter is to get them talking about healthcare reform details.
And actually, Michael K, you know more than 99.9999999% of Trump supporters, about health care delivery, costs, and insurance. Whereas I, a humble medical malpractice defense lawyer, only know more than 99.99999% of Trump supporters.
Even Dr. Price has terrible difficulty articulating the "replace" part of "repeal and replace."
Yes. They promised and campaigned for office on that very issue.
What bullshit. Trump campaigned on protecting and preserving "Medicare and Medicaid... we have to cover everybody... the government has to pay."
Are you claiming that the Republican members of Congress and the Republican Party have not been promising to repeal Obamacare since it was passed?
Are you claiming that the Republican Congress didn't pass Obamacare repeal bills when they knew Obama would veto them, and refuse to do so now when they know Trump will sign them?
Trump's campaign rhetoric has nothing to do with the Republican party's promise to repeal, and failure to repeal, Obamacare.
The real healthcare reform will come when a bipartisan majority reforms the ACA
I'm shocked, shocked that a lifelong Republican and member of the Republican Establishment is recommending that Republicans roll over and show their bellies to the Democrats yet again.
They aren't going to attach themselves to a bill that had about 15% popularity.
What an Establishment statement to make: "We can't do what we promised to do, because the media will be mean to us."
Who needs people who aren't willing to do the hard and unpopular things that are necessary? If Republicans aren't courageous enough to act on their stated convictions, we might as well be ruled by the Democrats who are.
Hey, Gahrie, if you don't like the Republicans, you can always vote for a Democrat in 2018.
I remember some very smart and thoughtful Republicans complaining about Obamacare when it was passed; that it was the only legislation of its kind in modern American history that was passed on a party-line vote. That it was a colossal mistake to pass anything like that on a pure party-line basis.
Geeze, I am so glad that there are Republicans who care about getting re-elected more than they care about demolishing the reputation of Obama.
Yep..I'm starting to believe that Chuckles really is an Establishment GOP member. However the fact that the Republicans care more about getting re-elected than they care about doing what they promised to do when they ran for election is a problem for the rest of us. What's the campaign slogan in 2018: "Vote Republican, we really really promise to do something this time"?
I remember some very smart and thoughtful Republicans complaining about Obamacare when it was passed; that it was the only legislation of its kind in modern American history that was passed on a party-line vote. That it was a colossal mistake to pass anything like that on a pure party-line basis.
They were right.
OK Chuckles..now answer this one:
Why were the Republicans willing to repeal Obamacare on a partyline vote when they knew Obama would repeal it, but now they are unwilling to do so when Trump will sign it?
OK. I'm done reading and commenting on chuck's stuff.
Boredom has set in?
It's the eventual outcome when you get into a discussion with anyone who is determined to "win" the conversation. Rather than acknowledge good points and build on a shared reality, it becomes a game of "what did they say to which I can keep the conversation going until they finally quit?"
If you think pinging back and forth until the other person no longer responds is "winning", I don't want to start with you.
I do have a list of people on whose posts I absolutely won't comment. Chuck still isn't on it.
Why were the Republicans willing to repeal Obamacare on a partyline vote when they knew Obama would repeal it, but now they are unwilling to do so when Trump will sign it?
Because it was good politics. Because it spoke to a need; that the ACA as written would never stand up to the test of time. And would need to be reformed.
But main stream Republicans never made the sorts of promises and statements that Trump did; that he'd "cover everybody" and never make cuts to Medicaid or Medicare.
But main stream Republicans never made the sorts of promises and statements that Trump did; that he'd "cover everybody" and never make cuts to Medicaid or Medicare.
You're right.
All they did was promise to repeal it. Which they now refuse to do.
The inconvenient truth is it isn't Trump's statements which have boxed in the healthcare debate, but those of the respected members of the GOP - those LLR's in Congress most like Chuck himself.
They said they would repeal it, they clearly had the power to do it, and Trump - like the rest of the country - relied on them to do so.
Had they done their job and repealed Obamacare, both parties would now be hard at work crafting the beautiful replacement of which Trump so eloquently spoke.
"Chuck said... Why were the Republicans willing to repeal Obamacare on a partyline vote when they knew Obama would repeal it, but now they are unwilling to do so when Trump will sign it?
Because it was good politics. Because it spoke to a need; that the ACA as written would never stand up to the test of time. And would need to be reformed.
Fuck your "good politics", it doesn't do anything for anybody other themselves, and now they've painted themselves in the corner. And guess what, it will cost them. The WIGOP informs people that donations are only for the state races, that none of it will go the national party. Without being asked the question. Even a dumb fuck like you can figure out why they are doing that.
More from the Trumpster. He was clearly not moved by the criticism of the people who got us into this mess.
"President Donald Trump on Thursday ramped up his rhetoric on North Korea again, saying his warning of bringing "fire and fury" to the isolated nation may not have gone far enough.
"If anything, maybe that statement wasn't tough enough," he told reporters at his New Jersey golf club.
When asked what could be tougher than "fire and fury," the president responded: "we'll see." He also did not comment on whether the U.S. is considering a pre-emptive strike on North Korea.
"The people of this country should be very comfortable, and I will tell you this: If North Korea does anything in terms of even thinking about attack, of anybody that we love or we represent or our allies or us, they can be very, very nervous," Trump said. "I'll tell you why, and they should be very nervous. Because things will happen to them like they never thought possible."
"If Trump wants to repeal and replace Obamacare, Trump should write a replacement plan."
Or the people in the legislative branch who've been running on repeal / replace for the last seven years should do it. That would be the Republicans in Congress -- the legislative branch, not the executive branch.
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५६ टिप्पण्या:
Kool!
I am listening to a history of english language podcast and the other day I learned all animal words like swine, cow, sheep, hen and deer are anglo saxon words while beef, steak, veal, pork, mutton .... are french words. When Normans conquered England, the anglos were turned into serfs who kept care of animals but were not allowed to eat their meat, that was reserved french muckety mucks.
@jel, true.
Finally, a forum kustom designed krazy kat kartoon reference: http://www.newyorker.com/books/page-turner/the-gender-fluidity-of-krazy-kat
Krazy Kat, defying gender and racial stereotypes since before it was kool.
I noticed that Jacqueline Cartier passed away recently. She was 96 years old. She was a French author, and a comedian popular in the 50's. Not very well known outside of France. I think most of her stuff is 30 years old or more, so she probably retired in comfort. She chose a quiet spot with palm tree lined streets - Sainte-Marie-la-Mer.
Hopefully not too many dead migrants washing up on the beaches...
Stereotypes are not bad things.
Thanks Ignatz. You're a brick.
Koivfefe.
The old Kollege Klub in its State St. location. What a dump !
Susie Dent's Guide to Swearing.
Today's news in Trumpland.
Trump re-tweets some weird little online poll, as if it were a real poll:
http://www.newsmax.com/Politics/trump-twitter-retweet-president/2017/08/10/id/806877/
I guess I am surprised that Trump hasn't Tweeted any Althouse Poll results. I was going to say that I was surprised that Trump didn't Tweet any Drudge Poll results, but he actually has done that. I think Drudge Polls show Trump at about 92% popularity.
jwl, the animal/meat differentiation in language fascinates me. Cultures with Romance languages (not just French) tend to separate the meat from the animal: ham, beef, mutton, salami...
But not with poultry! Chicken, turkey, goose, duck. And not with lamb, strangely! Because we have veal, not calf.
Germanic languages go straight to the animal or parts thereof: swine, Rindfleisch, liverwurst...
There must be interplay between culture, especially cooking culture, and these euphemistic words in Romance languages. "Blood sausage" (Blotwurst) doesn't sell well in America.
I don't know what they do in Asian, African, or other root languages and cultures.
Since we're talking hard Cee's here:
For some time, I've been wondering about the change in the meaning of "candor" and "candid" since Jane Austen's time. As in Candide, in her novels it meant seeing or putting the best face on things (from the Latin for the brightened togas that candidates for office donned).
Last week, I saw its modern meaning in a 1858 Trollope novel, so there was a considerable change in only 40 years.
Ted Turner sells buffalo meat. You can get ostrich at some restaurants. Maybe beef, ham, etc. are archaic. When we start serving humans, will it appear as "human" on the restaurant menu?
Oh wait; that was last hour's news in Trumpland.
This hour, it is the news that the married, father-of-two-with-a-newborn-in-January Trump tv surrogate Jason Miller impregnated Trump transition advisor A.J. Delgado in Las Vegas.
The Twitterstorm is so fabulous. In magnificent Trump fashion, Miller Tweets that he and his wife(!) and daughters(!!!) welcome the child into the world. To which Delgado basically replies wtf, and notes that Miller hasn't paid $1.00 for the new love-child's support.
Delgado says that Miller says that he was "separated" at the time.
https://www.aol.com/article/news/2017/08/10/former-trump-staffers-reveal-love-child-after-2016-campaign-trail-romance/23073462/
Kareful!
Tillerson plays coi, while Mattis posits the immediate destruction of the North Korean people.This confuses NBC, who has never seen grown men in action before.
Chuck, you and Trump should get a hotel room.
Maybe after the presidency.
You know, Michael K, I had forgotten that Jason Miller had at one time been named as Trump's Communications Director. (Miller resigned almost as soon as he was named. Then it was Mike Dubke, who quit after about 11 weeks. Then Sean Spicer absorbed the job along with being Press Secretary. Then it was Scaramucci. You can't make this stuff up.)
Being Trump's Communications Director is now like being the drummer for Spinal Tap.
Chuck, I don't disagree with you completely about Trump. I can't watch the guy make a speech.
But, I think he is the only guy rich enough and fearless (maybe crazy) enough to take on the Deep State.
It is appalling to me that Congress, given that he will sign any bill they pass, will not do anything.
They have, like McCain, run for election on a vow to repeal Obamacare and that was last year !
"Grenouille" never made the jump over to English. Hmm, maybe a Norman princess said "let them eat frog"
Watched Comrade Detective last night on Amazon Prime. Enjoyed it.
It is appalling to me that Congress, given that he will sign any bill they pass, will not do anything.
What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people? After Trump campaigned on providing great coverage, with lowered premiums, and zero cuts to Medicaid. Trump said everybody would have to be covered, even though Trump knew that no other Republican would make such a promise.
And remember that Republicans in the Senate has just seen Trump lean on members of the House to pass something, anything, just to get it done, and then turned around and called the bill that they passed, "Mean; too mean" after the media made it clear who would be hurt in the process.
If Trump wants to repeal and replace Obamacare, Trump should write a replacement plan. Own it. Campaign on it. Be clear on what the hard choices are. Be straight about who wins and who loses. If he has disagreements with Congress, that is fine. Make them clear.
It's the sort of thing that Rush, Hannity, the other alt-right yakkers, and Althouse never talk about. They don't want any intelligent discourse about what the hard choices in healthcare are. They are unequipped to deal with it.
Hard to believe now, but Howard Johnson's was once the largest restaurant chain in the US. And frankly, I wish they still were.
They even had a location in Greenwich Village, which was long way from their New England origins. From my (unpublished) book WARREN STREET:
"Howard Johnson’s was an eastern chain of family-style restaurants serving everything from scrambled eggs to their own brand of ice cream. Also goulash and fried clams, most of their dinner menu pre-packaged somewhere up in New England, or possibly out in Jersey.
The Howard Johnson’s in the Village was, however, a far cry from New England, almost as if Howard had scouted the location blindfolded. And when the typical Howard Johnson customer happened to wander in off 6th Avenue, this Howard had a few surprises. Like the Village “regulars,” boys dressed as girls, men dressed as women, sitting at the counter and tables looking like the loudest, day-glow version of an off-Broadway disaster.
“Clarence, just look!” Cynthia Vermont urgently whispered to her husband with a light elbow to his ribs.
“Cin, please, I’m trying to eat my goulash,” Clarence whispered back, the egg noodles dripping from his lips.
“The one in the pink, I think she’s a ‘man’!”
“Nah, it can’t be.”
“I told you we shouldn’t come in here!”
“Cin, this is ‘Howard Johnson’s’,” as he continued eating his goulash.
“Well, down here I think ‘Howard’ must be a… homo-sexual.”
“So what, the goulash tastes the same.”
“It’s a good thing we didn’t bring the kids.”
“Cin, you want the rest of your clams?”
“Take’em with you, I don’t want to stay here another minute!”
“Why, because they dress up in chartreuse?”
“Put down that fork, stop eating!”
“Cin, we came to Greenwich Village to see what it’s like, and they’re what it’s like.”
“Well, I don’t think Reverend Clackston would appreciate your pagan view.”
“Please, just relax, I don’t think they’re, uh, dangerous .”
“Well, you can sit in this den of sin, but I’m leaving!”
“Okay, I’m coming,” as Mrs. Vermont stood up, put her hands on her hips, and impatiently tapped her right foot as her husband tried to take the remaining goulash down in one gulp.
_____________
What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people
Yes. That is what they promised to do, and that is what they were elected to do.
If Trump wants to repeal and replace Obamacare, Trump should write a replacement plan.
That's not his job..that's Congress's job. The Republicans have been promising to repeal Obamacare ever since it was passed. They should have had a repeal, or a repeal and replace bill written six years ago.
If the Republicans in Congress can't pass budget bills or the repeal of Obamacare now...when will they ever be able to, and why should anybody ever vote for them again?
They don't want any intelligent discourse about what the hard choices in healthcare are.
How hard is it to simply return to the way things were eight years ago? And if this is impossible, then the Republicans should simply give up and concede to the Democrats. This is of course exactly what the Establishment Republicans do, and the reason why President Trump exists.
What Gahrie said, both times.
They don't want any intelligent discourse about what the hard choices in healthcare are.
This statement applies to Democrats. They persist in denying the existence of half the people within the Obamacare system who are receiving NO subsidy and perpetually shoulder the burden of ever higher rates and deductibles and copays, less choice or no choice. Obama and Democrats claim full credit for providing acess to healthcare for 20 million people yet ignore the 8-9 million who still are not covered by any form of insurance.
It's easy for lefties to ignore 'hard choices'.
Geeze, I am so glad that there are Republicans who care about getting re-elected more than they care about demolishing the reputation of Obama. Because we still need to get federal judges confirmed, and tax legislation passed, and the Dept. of Ed. reformed, and lots of other items on the agenda.
It is NOT easy to go back to the pre-Obamacare status quo! That is the most naive formulation there is. Naturally, that is the Monkey-Butler Sean Hannity formulation. Millions of people have health insurance now, thanks to Obamacare.
Do I like Obamacare? Of course not! It never addressed the problem of the rising medical costs curve. Do we need other legislation? Of course we do! But it isn't reconciliation stuff; it is stuff that requires regular-order passage in the Senate. Stuff like tort reform, and national insurance law reform. 60 votes-type stuff. Unless you want to do away with the filibuster, which is a whole new argument and one that might just be worth having.
It's the one foolproof method I have found, to shutting up a Trump supporter: explain exactly what your "replacement" of Obamacare looks like. And tell me who gets hurt, by how much, and what you expect to tell those people.
"Chuck said...
It is appalling to me that Congress, given that he will sign any bill they pass, will not do anything.
What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people? After Trump campaigned on providing great coverage, with lowered premiums, and zero cuts to Medicaid. Trump said everybody would have to be covered, even though Trump knew that no other Republican would make such a promise.
And remember that Republicans in the Senate has just seen Trump lean on members of the House to pass something, anything, just to get it done, and then turned around and called the bill that they passed, "Mean; too mean" after the media made it clear who would be hurt in the process.
If Trump wants to repeal and replace Obamacare, Trump should write a replacement plan. Own it. Campaign on it. Be clear on what the hard choices are. Be straight about who wins and who loses. If he has disagreements with Congress, that is fine. Make them clear.
It's the sort of thing that Rush, Hannity, the other alt-right yakkers, and Althouse never talk about. They don't want any intelligent discourse about what the hard choices in healthcare are. They are unequipped to deal with it."
What a steaming fucking pile. The GOP campaigned on repeal and replace. They promised long before Trump was even a candidate. They, like you, are scumbags.
Obama and Democrats claim full credit for providing acess to healthcare for 20 million people yet ignore the 8-9 million who still are not covered by any form of insurance.
If you are someone who is currently uninsured (let's say, for example, a 32 year-old self-employed tech consultant making $95,000/year), you aren't being attacked so much by Obamacare. You have made an election. You don't want to buy expensive insurance. So you don't. You'll face the Obamcare tax penalty, but that penalty is less than what you'd pay in insurance premiums. Of course you'll be completely exposed if you get hit by a car, or fall off a ladder while cleaning your gutters, or if you get cancer. You can buy insurance in the next enrollment period (and you will), thanks to the pre-existing condition provisions in the law. And of course everyone who knows anything about the insurance industry (whether they are in the business or not) will tell you that they can't continue the pre-existing condition regs unless nearly everybody is in the insurance pool.
"What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people? "
Yes. They promised and campaigned for office on that very issue.
As for Medicaid. That is a welfare program that, in a moment of brilliance, the Democrats made part of Obamacare but it existed long before that. The expansion of Medicaid was like the free heroin hit the dealer offers.
A free market would provide better insurance for less money. The only difference is that taxpayers are subsidizing some.
What a steaming fucking pile. The GOP campaigned on repeal and replace. They promised long before Trump was even a candidate. They, like you, are scumbags.
They aren't going to attach themselves to a bill that had about 15% popularity.
I'm not saying that we can't still reform healthcare; we should.
What I am saying is that Trump's bawling about how Obamacare is a disaster and he will negotiate its replacement is bullshit.
The real healthcare reform will come when a bipartisan majority reforms the ACA. The more that Trump personalizes it into a battle between him and the Obama legacy, the more that Trump will lose.
OK. I'm done reading and commenting on chuck's stuff.
Michael K said...
"What are the Republicans in Congress supposed to do? Pass a bill, or several bills, that take away health insurance coverage, including Medicaid, from millions of people? "
Yes. They promised and campaigned for office on that very issue.
What bullshit. Trump campaigned on protecting and preserving "Medicare and Medicaid... we have to cover everybody... the government has to pay."
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/trump-obamacare-promises-236021
Michael K said...
OK. I'm done reading and commenting on chuck's stuff.
Like I said, the surest way to shut up a Trump supporter is to get them talking about healthcare reform details.
And actually, Michael K, you know more than 99.9999999% of Trump supporters, about health care delivery, costs, and insurance. Whereas I, a humble medical malpractice defense lawyer, only know more than 99.99999% of Trump supporters.
Even Dr. Price has terrible difficulty articulating the "replace" part of "repeal and replace."
Yes. They promised and campaigned for office on that very issue.
What bullshit. Trump campaigned on protecting and preserving "Medicare and Medicaid... we have to cover everybody... the government has to pay."
Are you claiming that the Republican members of Congress and the Republican Party have not been promising to repeal Obamacare since it was passed?
Are you claiming that the Republican Congress didn't pass Obamacare repeal bills when they knew Obama would veto them, and refuse to do so now when they know Trump will sign them?
Trump's campaign rhetoric has nothing to do with the Republican party's promise to repeal, and failure to repeal, Obamacare.
The real healthcare reform will come when a bipartisan majority reforms the ACA
I'm shocked, shocked that a lifelong Republican and member of the Republican Establishment is recommending that Republicans roll over and show their bellies to the Democrats yet again.
They aren't going to attach themselves to a bill that had about 15% popularity.
What an Establishment statement to make: "We can't do what we promised to do, because the media will be mean to us."
Who needs people who aren't willing to do the hard and unpopular things that are necessary? If Republicans aren't courageous enough to act on their stated convictions, we might as well be ruled by the Democrats who are.
Hey, Gahrie, if you don't like the Republicans, you can always vote for a Democrat in 2018.
I remember some very smart and thoughtful Republicans complaining about Obamacare when it was passed; that it was the only legislation of its kind in modern American history that was passed on a party-line vote. That it was a colossal mistake to pass anything like that on a pure party-line basis.
They were right.
Geeze, I am so glad that there are Republicans who care about getting re-elected more than they care about demolishing the reputation of Obama.
Yep..I'm starting to believe that Chuckles really is an Establishment GOP member. However the fact that the Republicans care more about getting re-elected than they care about doing what they promised to do when they ran for election is a problem for the rest of us. What's the campaign slogan in 2018: "Vote Republican, we really really promise to do something this time"?
To fix health care is simple. Just remove the age 65 restriction from Medicare.
That it was a colossal mistake to pass anything like that on a pure party-line basis.
They were right.
Repealing something, that you admit was a mistake, is not the same as passing something, mistake or not.
Your answer seems to be to do nothing...which I admit the GOP Establishment is good at.
Hey, Gahrie, if you don't like the Republicans, you can always vote for a Democrat in 2018.
Nope. I simply won't waste my time voting at all.
I remember some very smart and thoughtful Republicans complaining about Obamacare when it was passed; that it was the only legislation of its kind in modern American history that was passed on a party-line vote. That it was a colossal mistake to pass anything like that on a pure party-line basis.
They were right.
OK Chuckles..now answer this one:
Why were the Republicans willing to repeal Obamacare on a partyline vote when they knew Obama would repeal it, but now they are unwilling to do so when Trump will sign it?
OK. I'm done reading and commenting on chuck's stuff.
Boredom has set in?
It's the eventual outcome when you get into a discussion with anyone who is determined to "win" the conversation. Rather than acknowledge good points and build on a shared reality, it becomes a game of "what did they say to which I can keep the conversation going until they finally quit?"
If you think pinging back and forth until the other person no longer responds is "winning", I don't want to start with you.
I do have a list of people on whose posts I absolutely won't comment. Chuck still isn't on it.
Why were the Republicans willing to repeal Obamacare on a partyline vote when they knew Obama would repeal it, but now they are unwilling to do so when Trump will sign it?
Because it was good politics. Because it spoke to a need; that the ACA as written would never stand up to the test of time. And would need to be reformed.
But main stream Republicans never made the sorts of promises and statements that Trump did; that he'd "cover everybody" and never make cuts to Medicaid or Medicare.
But main stream Republicans never made the sorts of promises and statements that Trump did; that he'd "cover everybody" and never make cuts to Medicaid or Medicare.
You're right.
All they did was promise to repeal it. Which they now refuse to do.
All they did was promise to repeal it. Which they now refuse to do.
And unlike Trump is totally within their power to do so.
The inconvenient truth is it isn't Trump's statements which have boxed in the healthcare debate, but those of the respected members of the GOP - those LLR's in Congress most like Chuck himself.
They said they would repeal it, they clearly had the power to do it, and Trump - like the rest of the country - relied on them to do so.
Had they done their job and repealed Obamacare, both parties would now be hard at work crafting the beautiful replacement of which Trump so eloquently spoke.
I assume Althouse approves of this display of fashion intolerance.
"Chuck said...
Why were the Republicans willing to repeal Obamacare on a partyline vote when they knew Obama would repeal it, but now they are unwilling to do so when Trump will sign it?
Because it was good politics. Because it spoke to a need; that the ACA as written would never stand up to the test of time. And would need to be reformed.
Fuck your "good politics", it doesn't do anything for anybody other themselves, and now they've painted themselves in the corner. And guess what, it will cost them. The WIGOP informs people that donations are only for the state races, that none of it will go the national party. Without being asked the question. Even a dumb fuck like you can figure out why they are doing that.
More from the Trumpster. He was clearly not moved by the criticism of the people who got us into this mess.
"President Donald Trump on Thursday ramped up his rhetoric on North Korea again, saying his warning of bringing "fire and fury" to the isolated nation may not have gone far enough.
"If anything, maybe that statement wasn't tough enough," he told reporters at his New Jersey golf club.
When asked what could be tougher than "fire and fury," the president responded: "we'll see." He also did not comment on whether the U.S. is considering a pre-emptive strike on North Korea.
"The people of this country should be very comfortable, and I will tell you this: If North Korea does anything in terms of even thinking about attack, of anybody that we love or we represent or our allies or us, they can be very, very nervous," Trump said. "I'll tell you why, and they should be very nervous. Because things will happen to them like they never thought possible."
"If Trump wants to repeal and replace Obamacare, Trump should write a replacement plan."
Or the people in the legislative branch who've been running on repeal / replace for the last seven years should do it. That would be the Republicans in Congress -- the legislative branch, not the executive branch.
Repeal Obamacare. Only then will Democrats come to the table.
You know what the truly great thing about Game of Thrones is? In twenty years, the special effects are going to look stupid.
Given the adjacent alliteration, may I suggest the "Althouse Amazon All-Access Aperture"?
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