That's the official statement, quoted in "Trump leaves G-7 meeting early to deal with Mideast; signs group statement/Trump signed the G-7’s statement backing Israel and criticizing Iran after discussions with other leaders and changes to the initial draft, a U.S. official said" (WaPo).
There's something off about that sentence, and I don't think it's just that "leads" should be "lead." (Subjunctive, right?) I think "urge" seems wrong.
Who is being urged? Isn't the right word "hope"? We hope that the resolution of the Iranian crisis leads to a broader de-escalation of hostilities in the Middle East.... But to hope in this situation is too passive, and yet, what is going on here except passivity?
And what disturbs me most is that it seems as though they want to urge that there be a "de-escalation," but they are not urging the belligerents to de-escalate now. There's a precondition, "the resolution of the Iranian crisis." So it seems that they are urging that the crisis be resolved, and then hoping that when — if? — that happens, hostilities will de-escalate. That makes the most sense, but it says nothing about what the "resolution" is. The Iran crisis could be resolved through a complete military victory for Israel.
Finally, what is a "broader de-escalation of hostilities"? Hostilities have been escalating. The de-escalation has yet to begin. It's nonsense to speak of something that doesn't exist getting broader. And escalation and de-escalation are metaphors of height, not breadth. Pick one. "Broader de-escalation" also absurdly asks simultaneously for more and for less: We want wider shortness.
This sentence feels as though it began with many different words that have been swapped out for awkward substitutions. We're told Trump wouldn't sign the original draft. I'll bet that was better written, but the edited version we see won Trump's signature. Perhaps he wanted it to say nothing specifically discernible (other than "including a ceasefire in Gaza"). And perhaps he wanted to endorse military victory for Israel — AKA "the resolution of the Iranian crisis" — and didn't want or need to say it outright. He did get the others to sign onto that.
পোস্টগুলি
৭৬টি মন্তব্য:
That makes the most sense, but it says nothing about what the "resolution" is. The Iran crisis could be resolved through a complete military victory for Israel.
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Sounds like somebody just started reading the front part of the newspaper section yesterday...
You poor poor Cohens. You have been so busy watching American Idol, making lists of your favorite musical numbers and taking vacations with your international lovers that you three done plumb forgot to read the newspapers. Silly bunnies. Don't get caught outside without your rubbers now. Gird up, boys. You might be called on to fight for your country just yet! That long-life veganism is going to pay off for Mr. JohnnyPops afterall! Go little cohens, make your stepdad proud?
Oooh, another meaningless resolution from the noncombatants.
Everyone can feel like they took action and appeared engaged.
Less Dead Children, ann.
We want more American taxpayer billions supporting out nation, not somebody else's murderous religious state...
If you have to kill unarmed children and women for God to award you his land prize on earth, you're doing something wrong. Go back and check your notes from all the years you taught Law and Religion? You missed something big during all your years of tenured lecuring, me thinks. Maybe call that Jew who taught torts and was making stock deals with his Israeli friends during office hours... Tom Palay, was it? Didn't you used to share a bathroom with him and kiss his ring regularly when they kept you on as a single-mom professor after richard cohen and you broke up after you moved here from new york city, back in the day?
You sure out of touch with America today. Nobody worships the Holocaust Jews anymore. They're gone, and the generations that have replaced them have no stones. They kill kids and bleat about winning (all using American tax dollars, and the majority is not all that into the Jews and providing last century's big victims "special powers" under our own laws to let them tear apart our country today...)
My DIL’s family was able to get out of Tehran.
Think of the billions wasted by the mullahs and the military spent trying to kill Jews. And all they’ve got to show for it is misery. I hope the people of Iran overthrow the government.
. The Iran crisis could be resolved through a complete military victory for Israel.
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Oh come on.
Next up after Iran is Pakistan... you don't have enough grandbabies to sacrifice for Israel, ann. You blew it when you put the first Mr. Cohen out of the home and took on the full time job of raising your sons alone as well as a full time legal job for the State. Go make your husband a sandwich now. Good girl.
The battle over the agreed-to wording will substitute for participation in the actual battle.
. I hope the people of Iran overthrow the government.
6/17/25, 7:00 AM
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I hope you drop dead of a heart attack, soon and very soon, Begley. God hates you too.
Why don't you care about the Israeli hostages, ann?
All those billions we Americans sent to help, and instead of trying to free their people, they are starving out innocent lives. For shame.
I hope you who cheer this die long painful deaths and hear your own children scream in pain one day. No mercy from a God whom you think you are greater than. No, no, no.
"We want the problems to go away. We don't want to get any ick on us."
Let's try again:
We have two sets of neighbors from Iran, now naturalized. I asked yesterday how their loved ones are doing - I got a heart emoji but no details.
“ There's something off about that sentence, and I don't think it's just that "leads" should be "lead." (Subjunctive, right?)”
I don’t know from subjunctive, but rewrite the sentence: We urge that [it] leads to a broader …
“Leads” sounds right, “lead” doesn’t. Substituting a referent shouldn’t have any effect, should it?
Aside from that, it’s all diplo-arglebargle stating the readily apparent, while avoiding anything meaningful.
@Hey Skipper: it should indeed be the subjective ("lead"). But aside from that, yeah. I wonder where this is going.
Strategic ambiguity or too many chefs?
Is this operation going to be a five year delay for the mullahs, or is it going to end the theocracy? And what are the logistics of the latter approach? Those are the questions, and in the meantime, political leaders need to issue statements that avoid the real issues.
…the images I saw from the meeting- all that forest. It made it look like it was Bohemian Club time already. Did they all pee in the woods?
If Israel has a chance to bring down the Iranian govt, they should take it and any ceasefire in Gaza should be delayed until after Hamas loses its benefactor.
Leads is correct because the subject is resolution—the resolution leads.
Urge is strange, but I’ve seen enough committee statements to understand what’s behind it—Althouse is almost certainly right that hope was considered but deemed too passive. Urge is more active without obligating anybody to do anything.
"This sentence feels as though it began with many different words that have been swapped out for awkward substitutions."
Maybe it's just a bunch of bullshit designed to get Tehran to give up without a fight that which would require time, effort, money and perhaps bodies to achieve otherwise.
Let them fight.
It's clear that Iran doesn't now possess nuclear weapons, so ... like the Japanese before them ... it is time to remind Iranian citizens that they have a responsibility to elect sane leaders and if they don't we'll just remove them from the Earth. We are not required to share this planet with a bunch of damn wildly-shrieking freaks bent on getting their 72 virgins for Christ's sake.
As to the substance, this is the G7's way of trying to get Israel to quit making the rubble bounce in Gaza because clearly some of the G7 find that unprofitable.
Resolution of the Iranian crisis -- regime change. New regime stops bankrolling the H squad (Hamas, Hezbollah, Houthis). Cease fire becomes de facto surrender. There's a lot of Underpants Gnome in the formulation, but that's the outline.
“Is this operation going to be a five year delay for the mullahs…?”
Well, probably, since that’s what most Western nations want. Why, one might ask? Because the mullahs want to eradicate Israel and kill Jews. Better to use a proxy than to get one’s own hands dirty.
It's hard to write really clearly about something that you don't, at heart, want the people to know the truth about.
What would a clear sentence be? "Keep baying for blood people! War is the answer!"?
Churchill made a comment to the effect that democracies could only fight total war, because the propagandization needed to get the people to come along, voluntarily send their sons to die, can't really be dialed back.
If you want to know the basis of this war, you should read about the Mackinder Zone.
Mackinder's Heartland Theory, proposed in 1904, suggests that the region known as the "Heartland," which includes parts of Eastern Europe and Central Asia, is crucial for global dominance. He argued that whoever controls this area can control the "World Island" (Afro-Eurasia) and, ultimately, the world due to its strategic resources and location. - DDG Summarization.
"We need to dominate the critical space on the board, and its resources, because we want to complete world domination, a Fourth Reich, if you will, and getting you people to believe that we have only good intentions for the people of Iran, and that their leaders won't be legitimate until they are specifically chosen by us, and to get you screaming for blood and death and destruction until we get our way, which has nothing to do with the welfare of the people of our victim countries. viz Afghanistan, Syria, Libya..."
The statement reads like a virtue signal, to me.
The bullshit G-7 anti-Iranian statement is meaningless because no nation intends to take any positive action to shut down WWIII. Else we forget, the US-Iran nuke negotiations were fake and the IDF fired the first volleys.
Poor Israel. So sad they cant assassinate civilians and other people in foreign countries whenever they feel like it - with no blowback. So unfair of Iran to get upset and strike back.
No country in the world acts like this. I can remember the moral outrage when it learned that the CIA were assassinating foreign leaders and tried to kill Castro. IRC, there's actually a law forbiddening the USA from doing it.
But once again, morality and international law means zero when Israel is involved. That's why I will never accept the left and others moralizing about foreigners breaking international law. You don't care about it, because if you did, you'd attack Israel.
Most important sentence is “Trump leaves G-7 early . . .” Trump knows the G7 leaders are mostly idiots there for the food and gossip. He couldn’t get out of there fast enough I imagine. On to doing the work of a real leader.
Iran has ever reason to get a nuke. Because Israel and the its bitch USA - will never stop attacking till Iran gets a Pro-Israeli regime. No Government would ever accept that.
This has zero to do with the USA. Iran could get a nuke tommorrow and it would change zero in this country. Nor are they going to nuke israel and get themselves nuked.
Meanwhile the situation on the ground (and in the air) is changing by the hour. But one is called upon to say something.
BTW, Ukraine is also a Mackinder conflict. Mackinder logic explains why Europe has invaded Russia and never stops licking its chops over domination of the Mackinder zone, which would bring China to its knees, BTW, and looter's access to 12 time zones worth of mineral wealth, not for nothing.
Israel was created by the British Empire as a cat's paw. For the same reason that the Truman sailed US warships and fought the mainland Chinese to prevent them from regaining Formosa, which Imperial Japan had taken from them, after the Empire of Japan had been defeated. Taiwan is intended to serve as "Landing Strip One" for the US in a war with China the same way that Britain helped us to defeat the Nazis in Western Europe. It's how the Japanese conquered China, the same recipe.
Ukraine is intended to serve the same purpose on the Black Sea, to subjugate Russia.
It's actually a fascinating game. It's like in chess, where the battle for domination of the center of the board is almost the whole point of the game.
The British Empire never died, it just decamped its HQ to Washington, but much of the strategic thinking still comes from the same people in Britain, descended from the officers of William the Conqueror, who were in turn descended from Roman officers.
There is a simple explanation, but not obvious -- as one fluent in French and German [plus several others], that English is written intentionally for **clear translation**. I've done it many times myself, with much longer statements, and when you work with multi-lingual groups on a regular basis [as I did for many years] it becomes second nature.
The target audience for this statement are the French and Germans [with their Muslim problems], as well as the distressingly anti-Semitic québécois, who put the Liberal Party into power at the last election in April.
French and German are each quite precise languages, and this was written in ways permitting a translation giving the politicians access to a legitimate translation serving those governments' domestic political needs and purposes.
Iran's last president died in a chopper crash. There were four helicopters flying back from Armenia. For some reason the president rode in the oldest helicopter, and the rest of the staff flew in modern ones. The flight path took them within two kilometers (A little over a mile) of what Israel calls a "smart city" in Armenia, which most observers believe are electronic warfare bases, and then the president's helicopter crashes into a mountain, which one can only assume was some kind of sensor failure, or other failure of electronic gear on the ancient chopper. It could be that the "smart city" was in Azerbaijan, I forget.
I am not saying that Israel assassinated the elected Iranian president during peace time, the same way that they have done so many other assassinations of Iranian officials with impunity, I am just relating the facts, and you can be the judge.
RCOCEAN II said...
Iran has ever reason to get a nuke. Because Israel and the its bitch USA - will never stop attacking till Iran gets a Pro-Israeli regime. No Government would ever accept that.
This has zero to do with the USA. Iran could get a nuke tommorrow and it would change zero in this country. Nor are they going to nuke israel and get themselves nuked.
6/17/25, 7:46 AM
——————————-
Iran has been at war with the US since 11/04/1979.
Iran has been the primary source of instability in the Mideast since the Mullahs came to power.
Without Iran there is no Hezbollah, Hamas, or Houthis.
I just don’t get the hate for Israel - the only country in the region that is based on Western values. Oh , wait, I do get it. For people like RCOCEAN II Jew hatred Trumps all.
My guess is that he if he is not a Holocaust denier he is adjacent to it.
Let me fix that G7 statement: "We urge the toppling of the Iranian theocracy and reintegration of Iran's people into the modern world with an elected nontheocratic government, and the unconditional surrender of Hamas leadership and all members of Hamas, who will be treated according to the rules of warfare as illegal combatants who purposefully murdered civilians both in Israel and Gaza.
Trump is gonna overthrow Iran's government... simple as that. Times are a-changing... Trump ain't Biden/Obama/Harris or even Dollar Bill Clinton.
I just don’t get the hate for Israel - the only country in the region that is based on Western values.
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The Jews have had masculinity stomped out of them over time. But most masculine men and women understand there's something very sick and sorry about armed men killing unarmed women and children and pounding their chests... I'm sorry you're too devolved to see it. Too many females in authority positions in your life; game over pretty much if you were raised by a "single" mom and don't understand masculinity or what manhood really is.
"My guess is that he if he is not a Holocaust denier he is adjacent to it."
I have been accused of that same thing, even as, as a child, I was told stories of the Holocaust by my own mother, who witnessed it first hand. Witnessed school friends and teachers being taken away by Nazis, whose own grandparents starved to death during Nazi occupation. "Holocaust denier" has been devalued into a propaganda trope, to stop people thinking further along any lines of thought that are "dangerous" to the consensus for war that our masters are trying to build.
Search on "thought terminating clichés"
FAFO Botfly: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68806508
Poor RC Ocean. He hates Jews and in a region where there is a live war of civilization against barbarism, chooses to ally with the head choppers. Very nearly all if not all of what you say against Jews is just wrong. I really wish you could meet some. Clearly you have not interacted with Jews in general or Israelis in particular and your warped posts claiming Jews are the source of all of the evil of the world are despicable.
1) Iran has no reason for a nuke. NO ONE is attacking it except to the extent that it sponsors terrorism and wants to use a nuclear weapon against the West. Israel does not attack Europe because Europe is not firing missiles at its schools. Israel does not attack Egypt because Egypt does not send suicide bombers to Israel's pizza shops. Israel does not attack Jordan because Jordan is not kidnapping and torturing Israeli citizens. Israel attacks only those intent on murdering its citizens.
2) Have you really never thought through what an Iranian nuke means? Never? You can't be an 8-year old. While it is the threat of delivering a nuclear bomb to a civilian population, as important is its deterrent threat. In that case it can shut down all oil tankers. Who would attack it? It can sponsor any attack it wants in any Western city. Who would attack it? No one. They would be a nuclear power. They can assassinate the leaders of all the oil producing states. Who would stop it? No one. They have nukes. It will be Iran that control trade that travels through the middle east. They would have a veto on all the policies of the West. Europe would bend its knee and sharia would be as recognized as Western law.
I don't think I've actually met in real life a rabid antisemite but yikes. I presume you are a David Duke type. Seemingly rational on the outside but on the inside it's all the Jews' fault. Biden? It's the Jews. Inflation? It's the Jews. Every time I see a post of yours, if there is any conceivable way you can tie something to a Jew "It's the Jews' fault" comes up.
You are a sad, sad pathetic person. Get a life. I imagine you live alone in your room and don't have companionship. You really need to get some.
Jaq said...
Iran's last president died in a chopper crash. There were four helicopters flying back from Armenia. For some reason the president rode in the oldest helicopter, and the rest of the staff flew in modern ones. The flight path took them within two kilometers (A little over a mile) of what Israel calls a "smart city" in Armenia, which most observers believe are electronic warfare bases, and then the president's helicopter crashes into a mountain, which one can only assume was some kind of sensor failure, or other failure of electronic gear on the ancient chopper. It could be that the "smart city" was in Azerbaijan, I forget.
I am not saying that Israel assassinated the elected Iranian president during peace time, the same way that they have done so many other assassinations of Iranian officials with impunity, I am just relating the facts, and you can be the judge.
6/17/25, 8:14 AM
Two responses:
1) What is peacetime? Iran has been sponsoring attacks against Israeli civilians since 1979. They have been at war with Israel for almost 50 years now. Just because Israel has struck back in very limited fashion since then does not change the fact that Iran declared war on Israel - and USA - a long time ago.
2) I might think that an older helicopter would be more resistant to electronic warfare? I don't know anything about it but I see how old trucks with minimal electronics drain batteries much more slowly than new cars with all the electronic energy drain and I would wonder if an older technology would be more resistant to electronic attack.
3) Of course I don't know if the thing about smart city is true or not so there's that...
RC Ocean - Another bizarre thought prompted by someone's comment is that we have been at war with Iran since 1979 when they declared war on us.
They took our people hostage. They murdered our soldiers in Beirut. They murdered our soldiers in Iran. There is quite a substantial blood debt their leadership owes. Now there is a war between the only democracy in the ME and the only pro-Western country in the ME, and our sworn enemy who has not only sworn to destroy us but in fact who has murdered countless Americans.
And YOU choose to stand with the barbarians! In any battle between Radical Islam and Western Civilization a good person would stand with the West. In any battle between communism and Western Civilization a good person stands with Western liberal values. In any battle between dictatorship and freedom a good person stands with freedom.
That you choose to stand with radical Islam, with dictatorship, with evil speaks volumes about you.
The logical conclusion could be that you are very misinformed and simply ignorant of the facts, that you are cognizant of the facts but cannot analyze facts correctly, or that you are sick and twisted. I don't see other options.
It's like young people (eg in college) who advocate for communism. They don't have the facts right, and they are not yet bright enough to analyze facts. They are just ignorant. Then they grow up and live in the real world for a bit. I don't think that's you though. I think you just hate Jews.
Leland - Is that the FA part? It's from 2024. I guess they are entering the FO part thanks to Donaldus Maximus!
" chooses to ally with the head choppers"
Who put the head choppers in charge in Libya, Syria, and Afghanistan?
Brzezinski: Yes. According to the official version of the story, the CIA began to assist mujahedeen in the year 1980, that is, after the invasion of the Soviet army against Afghanistan on December 24, 1979. But the truth that remained secret until today is quite different: it was on July 3, 1979 that President Carter signed his first order on the secret assistance to Kabul’s pro-Soviet regime opponents. That day I wrote a memorandum to the President in which I told him that that assistance would cause the Soviet intervention (…) we did not force the Russian intervention, we just, conscientiously, increased the intervention possibilities. - Nouvelle Observateur
Yes, we put the Taliban in power in order to provoke a Soviet invasion. We put the "head choppers" in charge.
The current defense minister of Pakistan, where bin Laden was found, has publicly declared, about a month ago, that Pakistani support for jihadi terrorism as a favor to the US was a cause for national shame. Why did we stop the bombing when bin Laden was at Tora Bora? Maybe he threatened to spill the beans.
https://www.azernews.az/business/141427.html?ysclid=mc0lg1weeq118198983
It all sounds very attractive, but also a way to put sophisticated electronics and communications facilities right on Iran's border with a cover story that it's all to help "newlyweds" etc.
Why did we extra-judicially kill bin Laden before he could say a word, when we had him captured?
These wars against Muslim psychos always begin well, but they go on forever.....Perhaps the mullahs will look to the previous example of Saddam and be more open to giving up their nuclear policy, or perhaps they'll look to the previous example of Qadaffi and keep on fighting. The Taliban sort of won in the end. (The big losers there weren't us, but the women of that country.).....I don't understand why they're so insistent on having nukes. There's nothing in the Koran about it.
I sense an uneasy tension between the America First MAGA and the Neocon MAGA .
Or another question might be why did we make up that crazy cover story about why we had to completely disappear the "remains" of bin Laden by dumping his body in the Indian Ocean? I think we probably killed bin Laden that day, but that was weird too.
Oh, BTW:
"The Jewish population of Iran is estimated to be around 9,100 to 9,300 individuals. This community is one of the oldest in the Diaspora, with a history in Iran dating back over 2,500 years."
Seems like if they really wanted to, if they really hated Jewish people that much, less than 10,000 wouldn't be that much of a reach to destroy. But they haven't, because these Jewish people are Iranians. Maybe it's Israeli policy that is the problem?
Or we supposed to, as "good Americans," to subscribe to some "Doctrine of Netanyahu Infallibility" that says that the only possible reason to criticize Netanyahu's policies is "Jew Hatred," since, you know, Bibi is perfect.
Everyone in the Middle East made a deal except Iran. Everyone in the Middle East is clamping down on sectarianism and territorial violence except Iran.(and their proxies hamas)
There is always conflict and people don't have to agree on everything. They can even be opposed and be enemies. But even enemies can be worked with.
Then there are the assholes. You have to discern between the enemies and the assholes.
Iran is Asshole.
The other Asshole is Zelensky. I would add Johnson and Biden to that butt assemblage. But those 2 have been deposed. Now it is just Zelensky.
Once these 2 assholes are removed things will settle down and the enemies can sit around the table together and talk with civility.
"I sense an uneasy tension between the America First MAGA and the Neocon MAGA ."
Which I am sure that you are trying to figure out how to exploit to get the Neocons and Neoliberal Democrats back in charge at the top, where they naturally belong, leading us to military misadventures everywhere.
"Iran is Asshole."
You are so close, and yet. This is the war of the moment, and you won't oppose it until it is too late, like me with Iraq and Afghanistan.
Either the DNI Tulsi Gabbard lied in her testimony before Congress, or Trump is lying now. It is that simple.
Asked where he personally stands on how close Iran was to getting a nuclear deal — given his DNI Tulsi Gabbard testified in March that the intel community “continues to assess Iran is not building a nuclear weapon” — Trump said, “Very close.” Asked about Gabbard’s testimony, Trump said, “I don’t care what she said. I think they were very close to having it.”
"I don't understand why they're so insistent on having nukes. There's nothing in the Koran about it."
Maybe you should know that their supreme leader has issued a fatwa proscribing Iran from developing nuclear weapons, and that there was already a deal on the table whereby Russia would take any uranium enriched beyond civilian needs, and that the recent IAEA finding about Iran and nuclear weapons references activity that dates back to right after the Iran Iraq war.
What they won't give up is civilian nuclear power, and they are in a region of the world where electrification would be a great gift to standard of living of the impoverished countries surrounding Iran, as well as Iran, but that's the real threat, isn't it, that Iran rises in stature in the region.
For the record, I think that Trump is lying now.
"the intel community “continues to assess Iran is not building a nuclear weapon”"
Is that the same intel community that said Iraq had WMDs?
"Maybe you should know that their supreme leader has issued a fatwa proscribing Iran from developing nuclear weapons, and that there was already a deal on the table whereby Russia would take any uranium enriched beyond civilian needs, and that the recent IAEA finding about Iran and nuclear weapons references activity that dates back to right after the Iran Iraq war."
Tell me you're not that goddamn dumb.
"They told us they aren't going to use the money for weapons or their military." And that's exactly what they did.
Please read "Whirlwind" by James Clavell for a reminder of the horrors that the people living in post-mullah takeover of Iran. I suppose the jews living in Iran now keep a very low profile and tow the line. They'd be well-advised to leave asap.
""Maybe you should know that their supreme leader has issued a fatwa proscribing Iran from developing nuclear weapons"
What Rusty said.
We're missing our head military genius. Where's Freder?
"French and German are each quite precise languages"
Oh, bullshit.
Blanket statements about generic characteristics of languages like this are generally nonsense. No matter how many individual languages a person might be fluent and, it shows no concept of language at all.
Even so, there is no way that French could have been the language of international diplomacy for so many years, if it were not perfectly capable of conveying dissimulation.
“Is that the same intel community that said Iraq had WMDs?”
No — this is Trump’s hand picked team.
It seems like Trump has given Netanyahu a blank check, then Israel moves unilaterally, Trump and MAGA Republicans say we must support whatever they choose to do, so Netanyahu is now dictating US foreign policy while Marco Rubio is irrelevant.
Do we know that Iran was days away from developing nuclear weapons? Or that Iran's bomb program is still active? How many times over the last 30 years have we been told that Iran was on the verge of getting the bomb? Do we even know that Iran doesn't already have nuclear weapons? After so much propaganda for so many years, how do we know what to believe? Should we believe Tulsi Gabbard who said three months ago that Iran's nuclear program was inactive? I'm getting Dick Cheney 2003 vibes from this. Also reminded of Michael Corleone's "Today we settle all family business" when I hear Netanyahu speak.
Hope is for pussies like BHO. Urge implies force.
We now have complete and total control of the skies over Iran. Iran had good sky trackers and other defensive equipment, and plenty of it, but it doesn’t compare to American made, conceived, and manufactured “stuff.” Nobody does it better than the good ol’ USA. ~ Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump
“WE” not “Israel”
This is Trump indicating that the US is now part of the war between Israel and Iran.
Rusty said...
"Maybe you should know that their supreme leader has issued a fatwa proscribing Iran from developing nuclear weapons, and that there was already a deal on the table whereby Russia would take any uranium enriched beyond civilian needs, and that the recent IAEA finding about Iran and nuclear weapons references activity that dates back to right after the Iran Iraq war."
Tell me you're not that goddamn dumb.
"They told us they aren't going to use the money for weapons or their military." And that's exactly what they did.
6/17/25, 10:26 AM
Yikes! Indeed. My thought too.
Kakistocracy said...
We now have complete and total control of the skies over Iran. Iran had good sky trackers and other defensive equipment, and plenty of it, but it doesn’t compare to American made, conceived, and manufactured “stuff.” Nobody does it better than the good ol’ USA. ~ Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump
“WE” not “Israel”
This is Trump indicating that the US is now part of the war between Israel and Iran.
6/17/25, 12:11 PM
I disagree. He is saying the Israelis are using the best technology in the world which is OUR stuff. This is like a live action advertisement for USA made military equipment. Who makes F-35's? Not Israel. No one can compete.
Fundamentalist Islamists with a martyrdom complex, nuclear weapons and delivery systems - if you can't see the problem I can't help you.
To those who oppose Israel's fight and who, to use Churchill's phrase, are "objectively pro-Iran," or more precisely "objectively pro-radical aggressive Islam," do you think Iran's objective is to defeat Israel or is their first objective regional domination and subsequent world domination once they can blackmail the world with their nuclear weapons?
This is a war of civilization against barbarism. I would assume the same people who would allow Iran to be in charge of the world's oil - the world's energy - also advocate for barbarism against civilization in the other world conflicts - China v Taiwan and Pakistan v India. If so you are a fool but at least consistent. If in contrast (RC Ocean) it is only the Jews you do not allow to defend themselves you are a Jew-hater.
We already know about RC Ocean tho.
KaKA squirted incontinently:
"It seems like Trump has given Netanyahu a blank check, then Israel moves unilaterally, Trump and MAGA Republicans say we must support whatever they choose to do, so Netanyahu is now dictating US foreign policy while Marco Rubio is irrelevant.
***************
Unless and until we give the Israelis an implicit go-ahead to use their nukes, and/or the means to deliver our bunker busters, we are NOT giving Israel a "blank check".
“We're missing our head military genius. Where's Freder?”
Fredo went to Lake Tahoe to do some fishing with Al Neri.
You all have to remove your personal feelings and biases from this conversation if you are going to understand it. All the people trying to guess what Trump is doing just break this down from the outside.
Trump gave the Iranians 60 days to make a deal.
During that 60 Days Trump has a historical Rapprochement with most other countries in the ME including Syria which is crazy. The only holdouts are Iranian proxies.
On day 61 Israel lights Iranian leadership up. Obviously pre-planned. It utterly decapitates Iranian leadership except for one person.
On day 62 a 3rd of the US Navy shows up in ports in Bahrain.
On day 63 Trump issues an ultimatum to Iran and tells them we could kill the Supreme Leader but he chooses not to. Demands unconditional surrender.
Everyone that goes to meet The Supreme Leader dies. People die as soon as they are promoted. Communications are cut off so he has to issue orders in person.
Musk opens up the internet to the Iranian people who are all now talking about dancing on the Mullahs graves. Women in particular are opening up.
Everything is set up so that the people of Iran pull the Supreme Leader out of his house and depose him. No matter what you think of the parties involved this plan was put together with the goal of as little US involvement as possible during the operation.
But the US is going to be involved enough that over the next 6 months Trump will be the kingmaker at the table when regional leaders set up the post Mullah Middle East.
In order for Russia, Europe, and China to participate in this rapprochement they will have to come to Trump hat in hand and all we had to do is move some Carriers to the port in Bahrain.
Russia is going to have to beg to keep their Syrian ports. China is going to be paying market price for oil. Europe can just get fucked. Israel doesn't have to deal with the mullahs and their proxies.
The plan as executed so far is brilliant and the goals of the effort are ambitious but realistic.
Kakistocracy said...
“WE” not “Israel”
This is Trump indicating that the US is now part of the war between Israel and Iran.
No, this is Trump asserting that the US is going to protect the reorganization of the Middle East and it is going to check any interference from China, Russia and Europe.
I don't know if it was Trump or Netanyahu or whatever combination of people who came up with this. Now Trump will be the broker for peace in a region that he has already set up for this and Israel is rid of the crazy 12th imam sadomasochist cult. Every other country in the ME wanted the crazy people in Iran out.
Jaq: "Why did we extra-judicially kill bin Laden before he could say a word, when we had him captured?"
Because our entire defense bar would be using every trick in the book to get him off, and the entire world's diplomatic apparatus would sanction us for mistreating him. They had already done more for less.
The old rule "it's cheaper to kill your victim" holds true.
JSM
PS: Oh, and he was holding an AK. - jsm
Jaq said
"What they won't give up is civilian nuclear power, and they are in a region of the world where electrification would be a great gift to standard of living of the impoverished countries surrounding Iran, as well as Iran, but that's the real threat, isn't it, that Iran rises in stature in the region."
********************
Horseshit Supreme
* Uranium for civilian nuclear power generation need only be enriched to 3 to4 %, NOT 60% and counting, as the Iranians were doing.
* Afghanistan don't need no steenkin' electricity. It desires to remain barbaric, stuck in the 12th century.
* "Pakistan already has civilian nuclear reactors for electric power generation. There are currently six operating nuclear power plants in Pakistan with one under construction."
* Turkey: No nuclear power reactors yet, but : The Akkuyu Nuclear Power Plant , with four nuclear reactor units, is under construction The first unit scheduled to be commissioned in 2025 and the remaining three coming online successively by 2028 .
* "Azerbaijan derives approximately 99% or more of its electrical power from its own domestic sources. Azerbaijan generates 23,567,280 MWh of electricity as of 2016, covering 116% of its annual consumption needs "
* Turkmenistan : Iran recorded electricity imports from Turkmenistan at 463 megawatts in 2010 , which indicates that Turkmenistan was actually exporting electricity to Iran rather than importing from Iran."
(I have no data for more recent imports, but the old data indicates Turkmenistan doesn't need electricity from Iran.)
* Iraq has ambitious plans to develop nuclear power to address its severe electricity shortage: Iraq seeks to build eight reactors capable of producing about 11 gigawatts, with a $40 billion plan that would be paid back over 20 years Watch In September 2024, Baghdad and Moscow signed a MoU on the peaceful use of nuclear energy, and China is set to build a 'sub-critical' nuclear reactor in Iraq.
[ALL STATS fro AI Claude]
Consider yourself FISKED.
As for your snotty claim that the "real reason" Iran has been opposed by Israel and the West is our fear of their rise in stature ---when Iran's leaders have for forty years openly called for our and Israel's' annihilation ---is one of MALICIOUS STUPIDITY.
Next time you show up claiming to offer geopolitical bullshit, we will remember this.
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