I don't see updates on the front page anymore. The inconclusiveness is old news, I guess.
It's the new normal: inconclusive results. That seems awfully discordant with the denouncement of "election denial" we've heard for the last 2 years.
We should be seeing clear, competent counting of all the votes and straightforward reporting of unquestionable results.
I had to do my own search to see just how unresolved things are at the moment:
Isn't that the position we've been stuck on for about a week? The election was 13 days ago. It does not inspire confidence!
पोस्ट्स
१५६ टिप्पण्या:
I want recounts in AZ and NV but we'll never get them.
The most up-to-date data "seems" to be available at 270towin.com
At minimum they are more willing to call races than other sites.
https://www.270towin.com/
Have we stopped even caring that we still don't know the complete results of the 2022 elections?
I don't see updates on the front page anymore.
What is this "we?"
The people who read the WAPO and NYT may have.
The rest of the country has noticed that this election was brazenly corrupt. People who read from sources outside the Regime propaganda have noticed that there are some huge anomalies in several states.
The only way you could think this election was not completely fraudulent is to cruelly and neutrally lie to yourself.
When you disburse and collect ballots in reasonably secure facilities over a set period of time you can expect to have them processed quickly. When you send them hither, tither, and yon across the country, it becomes an exercise in herding cats.
It does not inspire confidence!
As so many of us have been saying.
It's so nice that we won't have to worry about election results any more. It'll save me so much adrenalin. Probably put years back onto my life!
RCP still has the tally if you scroll down a bit. There are 4 uncalled races. The Republican leads in all 4. 3 are in CA, the 4th is Boebert's district, which may be heading for a recount despite rumors last week that her opponent conceded.
Almost 2 weeks have gone by and yet these CA districts are nowhere near finishing. I assume it's because of some idiotic mail-in voting rule, but those Republican candidates better have their lawyers all over the counting table.
You've chosen the House tab. What does the Gov tab say for AZ? I'm guessing it shows blue, even though the election doesn't feel resolved here yet.
It was not an election. Our Last "fairly honest" Election was 2016.
Without a fair vote by citizens, Our American civilization is done and, as we see, we are headed steeply down, passing Venezuela now on our way toward Pol Pot.
"Leftism always leads in the direction of Pol Pot." Glenn Reynolds
I’m not surprised at the news blackout. The less said about the process the better for the cheaters in the Democrat party and their press agents. Fucking AP is still insisting Joe knows nothing about the business deals Joe made. Go figure.
Yes and no. We care, but we know Democrats cheat, so we are used to it now. Why bother voting when they cheat, and the DOJ and FBI help them??
everyone votes on the same day. at a polling station. with id.Paper ballets, numbered, traceable. It is so simple, which is why the left is against it.
The last time we voted like that, at least in my state, Trump won. and after that things changed, and I wonder why?
anyone who trusts the current system probably also feels good about the CDC, FBI and the DOJ.
Inclusive results are what the Dems want. And the Dems don't care about inspiring confidence. All they care about is power. See, e.g., 2020 elections.
Look at that map. Roll, Tide!
Isn't that the emerging new control strategy?
Tell people under threat what are unquestionable "conspiracy theories" while at the very same time injecting as much doubt and uncertainty as possible in the truth?
That way, the people will divide into two self-identify columns for differentiated treatment: obedient followers or dangerous questioners.
Four races are not final. Colorado’s third district was won by Republican Lauren Boebert, but the margin is close enough that, by law, there will be a mandatory recount. The other three districts are in California. They all share two characteristics in common: (1) less than 3/4 of the vote has been tabulated, and (2) a Republican is leading. Draw your own conclusions.
let's switch back to hand-counting everywhere else so that it can take even longer next time
Utter embarrassment.
Anyone who attempts to introduce reforms to this sH!+ show is “trying to suppress the vote.” So: election integrity equals voter suppression in the minds of liberal lights. Vote early and often, as we used to say in Louisiana. Where that is completely normal.
On a serious note, it's taken this long to count *all* the ballots for as long as I can remember. For example, Florida allows overseas military ballots to be counted if they arrive up to 10 days after election day.
Most elections aren't close enough to escape being called before that, but when they are, the appropriate thing to do is wait. Duh.
I'm old enough to remember when elections took 1 whole day. That was all. Vote by mail is fraud. Period end of story. On a side note - I work with this 32yo guy who was bragging about how he voted a month in advance by mail. He's young, able, ambulatory, and we get the freaking day off!! There is no good reason for him to vote by mail except pure laziness. Make federal elections a holiday, vote in person with ID, and dye their fingers purple on the way out. The world is laughing at us.
It does not inspire confidence!
Don't hate the playa, hate the game. If confidence is at odds with the facts, who's the mark?
Why are the Republican GOPe helping democrats steal elections?
The true battle starts now.
This is a national embarrassment. Someone out there thinks a third-world election system is to their advantage.
Boebert might take this as a sign and turn it down a little if she wants to be reelected.
Colorado was Californicated years ago.
It's hard to care when you have no chance of affecting the outcome. Far too many jurisdictions are embarrassingly inept and/or corrupt and nobody ever seems to pay a price for it.
The goal should be: all votes are cast on election day and all votes are counted on election day. It shouldn't be that difficult.
Well, California law states that mail-in ballots that are received up to 7 days after the election day must be counted. So counting of 50% of ballots didn't start in some of these counties until last Wednesday. And Kern County only has one ballot counting machine (as has been the case for last 3 election cycles). As anyone who has renewed license plates can attest, county clerk offices pioneered quiet quitting before it was a thing. And now what with the holidays coming up....
It does not inspire confidence!
That's a soft shoe way of saying "I'm getting the feeling the 2020 election fraud was real, and this one seems like bullshit too."
Althouse. I don't know how you can be surprised by this after having watched "ballot harvesting in the park" take place in Madison, WI summer 2020. Happened right in your back yard. Remember when the Madison clerk purposefully mixed the ballots collected in those red Domino's Pizza bags with the one's that were dropped off. It was done to destroy chain of custody in case the illegal event was challenged. Madison stuffed absentee ballots that day.
Voter fraud is here to stay. Some places more than others. The last REAL election was the 2016 surprise when Trump was elected. The establishment's shock let's you know that the 2016 election was real. The fake Russian Collusion accusations and investigation further show their fraudulent hand.
Their efforts have worked quite well. Democrats are in power doing whatever they want, and the GOPe remains a kept man comfortable minority.
Now they have panicked Trump voters jumping ship for a new savior, St. DeSantis, who will go down via the same voter and election fraud efforts which everyone is afraid to address.
Except Donald J Trump.
The D's need to slow the counting - when they need a win. Isn't that obvious?
Talked to my mother last week, in California. She was very matter-of-fact about it: Well, the way we do it is that absentee ballots can be mailed in right up to and including election day. But, that means they can't count ballots on election day? Well, it's important to us that everyone gets to vote.
I didn't get anywhere with an argument that it's also really important that elections run properly and in a transparent fashion. Ship has sailed.
My working theory is that the Dems are still trying to steal those remains House seats. If they can pick up most of them, they still have a chance to flip the House back later. Note that FJB/Garland’s new “Independent” Counsel has the mandate to go after Republican J6 Denialists in the House. Besides the in terrorem effect, this could be an additional reason for that move by Garland. Arrest a couple of the Republicans in the House for something. Maybe spitting on the street. Then offer them a plea deal, where they trade a dozen years in prison for resigning, letting a Dem governor appoint their successor.
Too radically dishonest for the Dems? They stole the Senate in 2020 with election fraud (3 Senate seats in GA and AZ). Likely did it again this time (AZ, PA, and maybe ultimately GA again). Why does anyone here believe that they would be above stealing the House through highly politicized, and unprecedented, attacks by the DOJ against Republican House members.
"The most up-to-date data "seems" to be available at 270towin.com. At minimum they are more willing to call races than other sites."
I'm not talking about the practice of "calling" races. I'm talking about the official process coming to completion. You can see the percentage of votes that have been counted. I'm saying they should have all reached 100% quite a while ago and it's demoralizing and suspicious that we are still waiting.
"The people who read the WAPO and NYT may have."
Show me the news sites that are still running the election results on the front page and show me the news sites that are covering the failure to complete the count as if it is an important news story.
If people were clicking on these stories, they'd stay on the front page, so I believe people are just letting this problem go and accepting inconclusiveness as the new norm.
Prove me wrong... and not just by asserting that you are not one of those people. Obviously, I'm not either, but I still used "we," because we live in a society. Or would you say "What do you mean 'we'?" about that too?
We all know how the votes get counted in the districts that still haven't resolved the election day results from 2 weeks ago, and we all know why the vote tabulations take this long. We all know that dishonesty is involved, and that there's a careful process of engineering a 'win' if it's at all possible. The Progressive Left likes to insist there's no election fraud, as the real cases pile up with 'Guilty' verdicts. The Progressive Left likes to pretend it's an honest casino.
But we all know otherwise, we all know that the political class is unconcerned with feelings of shame at the commentary from within and abroad, and we all know that until the political will manifests to clean up elections, and until the Legacy Main Stream Media takes their remit seriously and undertakes an unvarnished look at how the machinery operates, then the public either puts up with it - or resorts to direct methods. How to build political will to clean up elections, if it means a higher likelihood of loss of power?
Althouse: I don't expect you to answer this question, but I'll ask it again anyway.
Why did you oppose the United States Supreme Court hearing the 2020 Texas vs. Pennsylvania case? You now seem concerned with election integrity, or at least the appearance of integrity, when in 2020, you weren't.
Texas vs PA had 17 supporting state plaintiffs, and directly addressed MI, WI, PA, and GA voter fraud that was implemented that year. That was the time to deal with it.
Now it's too late. Abortion smortion. Texas vs PA is where Trump appointed Justices Barrett, Kavanaugh, and Gorsuch let the nation down. I believe to this day they were new, scared, and were railroaded by Roberts. Only Alito and Thomas had the guts to do the right thing and hear the case. Those guys aren't scared of Roberts.
Now...we live with targeted voter fraud. Probably for the rest of our lives.
The resolution of the storyline is that the Republicans won the House. Once they got to 218 the rest denouement.
"Althouse. I don't know how you can be surprised ..."
You need to take that back.
I never said I was surprised.
Why do people do that, use the "surprise" concept? Are you trying to annoy me?
Trump broke the minds of the elite ruling class (a good thing) and almost everything remains broken (a bad thing).
Time to pick up the pieces.
Remember the Slow Food Movement?
We’re in the midst of a Slow Elections Movement.
It takes time. Those votes don't steal themselves, you know. Ask Al Franken.
Chris said...
. . .There is no good reason for him to vote by mail except pure laziness. . .
I shall push back on this a bit, although I would give up my mail-in voting to get believable elections again. I like it because I can sit down at home and read through the voter's guide and do whatever other research I want before marking the ballot. If I had to, I suppose I could do the same, write it all down on a cheat sheet, and then go vote in person.
But yeah, no election is believable with significant mail-ins.
The longer the chain of custody, the better for the people who run the system.
"Why did you oppose the United States Supreme Court hearing the 2020 Texas vs. Pennsylvania case?"
Link to the post where I stated this opposition. If it's not clear that I opposed something, explain why you interpreting my post like that. Otherwise I can't understand your question.
One reason you shouldn't "expect" me to answer a question is that I don't understand it. I don't remember the incident and would have to refresh my recollection.
I actually don't expect YOU to answer my question (and I'll explain why if you make a sincere effort to answer it).
Ann Althouse wrote: "If people were clicking on these stories, they'd stay on the front page..." The ratings on Rotten Tomatoes reflect the public reaction, too.
Highly decentralized system. Not going to change. Here, California long notorious as slow but accurate. But not aware of fraud claim 2022 outside of Arizona Governor race in Republican controlled Maricopa County.
As others noted mandatory recount in 1 Colorado House race although Dem conceded to forestall partisan expenditures. Ranked voting recalculation to come on set date this month in Akaska Senate and House races (but 2 Rs in Senate). Runoff set for next month in Georgia Senate.
Once they went to computers, things slowed down. Hand counting was much faster.
Ranked choice voting further delays the counting. If you've got a slow process to begin with it stretches it out further. I suppose it allows for more fraud, but it also keeps results off the front pages the day after the election, and encourages all kinds of funny business with third party candidates. Like the "jungle primary," it's a bad idea.
If it's not clear that I opposed something, explain why you interpreting my post like that. Otherwise I can't understand your question.
You're being obtuse and trolling your readership. Again.
Emphasizing that we are still awaiting results makes the Demcorats who are still counting the votes look bad. So, its no longer news.
It was like the R's gaining control of the House. We got that in small print, while the FAILURE of THE RED WAVE was splashed in big headlines for days. Reason? It could be blamed on Trump, and make him look bad.
Is there anything in the NYT's about Lake refusing to concede and the Arz AG looking into vote fraud?
We care, Ann, but after awhile you realize that screaming about it is not the best use of your limited time and energy, when the system is that loaded against the truth.
Dems cheated Bernie their last 2 Dem presidential primaries. In 2016 dems were shocked Trump won. How could this happen? We fixed it.
They vowed it will never happen again.
And of course they cheated Bernie again, and then Pedo Joe got 25% more votes than Obama.
Now everyone wonders if elections are fair.
Two weeks in and no final results……and when they dribble in, they seesaw and the results swing back and forth. And MSM wonders why there are people that dare question results or claim fraud. Get a grip.
Florida changed their laws after the 2000 election, Georgia changed theirs after 2020 and voilà….results on Election Day. It’s not rocket science.
Althouse: Thanks; I'll find it. It was either a post, or a comment within a post. That's fair. I remember it clearly. I'll find it.
I don't expect you to address every commenter. You do a great job Captaining this ship.
remember that woman? That was running for governor? And her opponent was the Sec of State for that state? And she claimed that She WAS the governor, because of voter suppression?
I wonder what She would have said, if 48% of the ballot machines in the state's largest county had had "paper problems"? I wonder what she'd think about that happening in Some OTHER state?
Stacy? any comments?
This shit started when prog activists pushed late and election-day registration 20 yrs ago. Used to be you had to be registered already and it closes so the clerks could get everything ready for the election.
Now you have all these last minute Larrys and provisional ballots ("ballets" to Jim) that must be checked out.
The whole process has gone downhill since and any effort to roll it back is denounced as "voter suppression."
The old county clerks opposed the changes but they're gone and the new younger clerks are fine with it all.
Readering said...
"Highly decentralized system. Not going to change. Here, California long notorious as slow but accurate. "
It's also long notorious for political corruption. It's how you guys play the game. I'm not accusing you. It's just a fact. If you have a Democrat run anything there is going to be corruption. It's baked in the political pie. And let's face it California is run by Democrats. Remember the high speed rail project? The project was so corrupt that even the French company hired to oversee the project quit because of the level of corruption. They went to Morocco. Morocco is less corrupt than California. It doesn't take much of a leap to to think that elections are run the same way. California is/was a rich state. The opportunities for graft must be enormous.
If you're not seeing it you're not looking. Or your involved.
"We should be seeing clear, competent counting of all the votes and straightforward reporting of unquestionable results."
Shouldn't that be the goal? I am starting to doubt the intentions of our political class.
Butkus51 said...
"Dems cheated Bernie their last 2 Dem presidential primaries. In 2016 dems were shocked Trump won. How could this happen? We fixed it."
They did it right in front of us and then tried to tell us that we didn't see anything.
Nothing to see here. Move along. (f'ing deniers!)
Witness,
Hand-counting used to get the results more quickly than we get today using counting machines. It isn't like counting stuff has gotten harder to do. I no longer trust counting machines. I have seen enough examples of mistakes found to realize nothing can really make such counting safe to trust. Paper ballots only, counting done by teams representing each party involved, by hand until they agree with each other. That is the only way to rebuild trust in the voting system. If we continute to insist on mail-in-ballots, then the ballots need to be on the premises by the close of the polls on election night, or they don't get counted at all. Anyone disagreeing with this system of balloting and counting is a supporter of vote fraud- full stop.
"It does not inspire confidence!"
It does if you are a Democrat.
It is likely one of two things causing a decrease in demand for the results:
1. People think elections have been corrupted to the point that they don't represent the will of the people;
2. People think that they do represent the will of the people and are avoiding the conclusion that the Democrat victories reflect the diminished intelligence of half of the country.
Rusty: I've written here before that I voted Repulican in 2 governor races (last Brown, first Newsom) over disgust with high speed rail fiasco. But not aware of corrupt Dem election rigging. Last 3 House districts to be called all central valley Republican.
We need one day voting.
Smaller precincts.
Make it a federal holiday.
One day counting.
If you need an absentee ballot - you get one ahead of time -submit ahead of time - but it is counted on the day of the election.
Put an end to mail in voting.
How hard is this?
Paper ballots - no more touch screen insanity.
We still don't know who won the Dem. Iowa Caucus.....
Abnormal is the New Normal under these lying, cheatling clowns. The Democratic Party delenda est.
Florida allows ballots mailed overseas to arrive and be counted up to 10 days after the election, as do many states.
When races are close, waiting for all military/overseas ballots seems wise to me.
If Elections need to be tabulated ahead of that time then overseas military voting laws need to be revisited.
I've withdrawn my attention for my own mental health. 'Demoralizing' does not begin to describe my reaction to what they have done to our election system.
"If people were clicking on these stories, they'd stay on the front page"
This couldn't be more wrong. The corporate media sees itself as creating public interest, not serving it.
"It does not inspire confidence!"
The PTB want it that way. More room for fraud, more triggers for deniers, more opportunity to tar the deniers as yahoos.
Confidence, integrity, clean and efficient procedures are not a priority in these United States.
When neither side cares because uniparty establishmentarian corporatism is the coin of the realm in America and the reprehensibles who struggle, work shite jobs, live outside the big cities and are generally "unconnected" are so revulsed by said corporatists that the entire apparatus of the state has been turned against their tribune repeatedly - to no avail ("yet!!!") but process being the punishment well, you know... - the project of the state quickly becomes to pretend it never happened.
Election count disputes and stories perpetuate the Orange Man and the movement he traversed, and it's more important to erase him as a corollary to the project to imprison him. If they fail with their banana prosecution about to get underway, an assassination will almost undoubtedly follow. Who's dumb enough not to expect that? The only surprise is that it hasn't yet occurred but then, the establishment doesn't like the idea of making martyrs. Not with so much at stake in the realm of robbing the treasury.
Enjoy the decline.
If the media says that California is still counting the vote, it might make people think that something is wrong with California, so they don't report that the final results aren't in yet.
"everyone votes on the same day. at a polling station. with id.Paper ballets, numbered, traceable. It is so simple, which is why the left is against it."
JFC man, you think it's only "the left"? If at least the first two years of the Trump administration revealed about the party of "the right", being the GOP, it's no better; the leadership of the right is no better.
DeSantis might get a pass but he's coasting on the hard work done in the wake of 2000, not 2020. Where have Republicans actually gotten off their bedsore'd keisters and agitated consistently and cogently for, much less made, any real changes to address all the problems plaguing the process in 2020? Obvious problem states like Pennsylvania? LOL - obviously not. For the most part, they've stood by muttering impotently while being steamrolled, like dogs barking as the carnival moves on.
If the problem was only on the left, that would be pretty easy. Unfortunately, end-of-empire type corruption is a bipartisan pursuit in SpavinedAmerica (TM), which is where we live now... comrade.
"2. People think that they do represent the will of the people and are avoiding the conclusion that the Democrat victories reflect the diminished intelligence of half of the country."
Heh. There are a comparable number of people who conclude the Republican victories (and continuing support for Donald Trump) reflect the diminished intelligence of half of the country.
As the band Sparks sang decades ago, "Everybody's stupid, after all!"
Clear, competent, straightforward and unquestionable reporting of results? I'm looking forward to Christmas--but that particular present is not going to be under the tree.
In a voting world where much dirty work has been done at the crossroads--so to speak--we've arrived at a Stalinesque environment. It doesn't matter who votes or how many---it matters who counts the votes.
Fourth-world nation.
Here in Texas, leftists complain that a Concealed Handgun License can be used as voter ID, but a student ID from the University of Texas cannot. They fail to point out that the CHL has both fingerprint, photo, and DPS verification of address, which must be updated within 30 days of moving. Meanwhile the student ID merely has a picture of a person attending UT, with zero address verification, let alone nationality. This, the left calls "Voter Intimidation."
We are fighting against people too stupid and too dishonest to deal with reality.
“JAORE said...
We still don't know who won the Dem. Iowa Caucus.....“
CAUCUS DENIER!!!
Ann: Found what I believe to be your opposition to Texas vs. PA succeeding from a post on Dec 11, 2020.
Dec 11, 2020 you posted and article by Andrew McCarty of the National Review about Texas’ frivolous lawsuit.
Below the post you used the following tags which are still there: Andrew McCarthy, evidence, law, lawsuits I hope will fail, math, Trump 2020, voting
You have used the “lawsuits I hope will fail” tag on other lawsuits you hoped would fail. Latest was Trump’s defamation suit against CNN. I assume when you use this tag, you want the lawsuit to fail... like Texas vs PA.
Laslo Spatula also noticed the same, in the comments stating:
"And, I must say, I sure wish the retired WI constitutional law prof would weigh in."
Note the "lawsuits I hope will fail" tag on this post”.
The post immediately following was about the Supreme Courts official refusal to hear the Texas vs PA case.
So for two years I have wondered...why?
I believe the Supreme Court failed us and Texas vs PA was a missed opportunity. I also believe because of this the swing state fraud is now just baked in.
@Yancey
In my political lifetime, (i.e., at least since 2000), not all of the ballots have even *arrived* by election day. What's changed is how many ballots arrive after election day that can still be legally counted.
Paper ballots are important, so that machine counts can be verified as needed. This was done more than once in a nearby precinct in 2020. The counts differed by less than a handful of votes from the total each time, and the hand counts differed from each other. Ultimately, the machine count was accepted as more accurate.
It's simply not the case that machine-counting is slower than hand-counting.
You know who has the quickest, cleanest, and best election system in the country? Florida. You know where the red wave actually happened? Florida.
Bruce Hayden said...
Arrest a couple of the Republicans in the House for something. Maybe spitting on the street. Then offer them a plea deal, where they trade a dozen years in prison for resigning, letting a Dem governor appoint their successor.
Nope, that's only for Senators.
Article I, Section 2 When vacancies happen in the Representation from any State, the Executive Authority thereof shall issue Writs of Election to fill such Vacancies.
House seats are vacant until the next election or a special election is held depending on the state. However, the loss of seats would have impact as I think a majority of the House could vote to elect a new Speaker if the majority changed.
Bruce Hayden said...
Arrest a couple of the Republicans in the House for something. Maybe spitting on the street. Then offer them a plea deal, where they trade a dozen years in prison for resigning, letting a Dem governor appoint their successor.
Nope, that's only for Senators.
Article I, Section 2 When vacancies happen in the Representation from any State, the Executive Authority thereof shall issue Writs of Election to fill such Vacancies.
House seats are vacant until the next election or a special election is held depending on the state. However, the loss of seats would have impact as I think a majority of the House could vote to elect a new Speaker if the majority changed.
Machine counting is like playing poker with a guy who removes the cards from everybody's view for a little bit, then when he brings it back, deals the cards without cutting the deck.
"But not aware of fraud claim 2022 outside of Arizona Governor race in Republican controlled Maricopa County."
You do know that in Luzerne County, PA, that long lines happened and people drifted away on Republican heavy Election Day due to the Democrats who run the system not providing sufficient ballots. Can you imagine if this had happened in East St Louis, for example? We would be hearing about it to the turn of the next century.
@Gusty Winds (Parody)
Those links don't work for me.
Will try to find that stuff though
"We still don't know who won the Dem. Iowa Caucus.....“
LOL -
The corrupt mob dems control everything.... everything. It's Chicago.
“Show me the news sites that are still running the election results on the front page and show me the news sites that are covering the failure to complete the count as if it is an important news story.”
It’s not an important at news story. Nancy has conceded and Kevin has won. In California, there are three uncalled races that Republicans will likely win. in Alaska, Mary Peltola didn’t quite get over 50%, and the ranked choice tabulation for the not-quite-instant runoff isn’t scheduled until November 23, which is still before the December 6 senate runoff in Georgia. In Colorado, the race is headed for a mandatory record but Lauren Boebert’s opponent has already conceded.
Here's the post with the tags: https://althouse.blogspot.com/2020/12/the-state-isnt-exactly-scrupulous-in.html
Arrest a couple of the Republicans in the House for something. Maybe spitting on the street. Then offer them a plea deal, where they trade a dozen years in prison for resigning, letting a Dem governor appoint their successor.
That's not that different from how the Parliament managed to behead Charles I. Except they used street thugs in an unruly mob who just happened to unerringly chance upon supporters of Charles I in the street and keep them from showing up. Then, a couple of weeks later, when these same MPs showed up to protest the validity of the votes held without them, they were hanged for treason for having the temerity to question a vote of Parliament.
I think that Adam Schiff is a huge aficionado of that era. CIA too. I think it was the model of the "color revolutions" we have seen since.
The reason I was glad that lawsuit failed was because the election had already taken place, following rules that could be attacked after the fact, but it was too late to redo the voting. Whatever the problems were with the rules — arguably they weren't following *state* law — should have been handled before people voted. And it's a stretch to make a federal claim out of failing to follow state law. There is a constitutional question about that, but it shouldn't be used to undo an election after the people have voted.
You need regular procedures that work to get through an election and to a certified result, not a way to keep elections undecided and in question.
Readering said...
"Rusty: I've written here before that I voted Repulican in 2 governor races (last Brown, first Newsom) over disgust with high speed rail fiasco. But not aware of corrupt Dem election rigging. Last 3 House districts to be called all central valley Republican."
How you voted isn't relevant. You're not paying attention.
"Last three house districts..................." So what? What about LA and San Fran. reliably democrat and reliably corrupt. Chicago and Cook county aren't the rest of Illinois but they determine who gets elected. Don't for a moment think that the high speed rail fiaco was a one off thing. The Democrats you do vote for wake up every morning scheming of ways to fuck over the electorate. Why? Money and power.
I was a designer for a system a lot less important than counting votes, but it did count services delivered and received among other things, and so it had financial implications, and it was heavily depended on for accuracy by the users of it. It had to be designed so that changes could not be made to it without generating a log entry. The fact that these voting machines did not have immutable logs of all changes made renders them unfit for their task. Such a fundamental design oversight can only be seen as an intentional accommodation to fraudsters in power responsible for buying the system.
A perpetual motion machine is a mechanical engineering holy grail, of sorts. Wikipedia says such a contraption is impossible because it would “violate either the first or second law of thermodynamics or both.” Leaving us with the next best thing; a perpetual election cycle. All we need to achieve such an energy reproduction colossus is slow the counting of votes long enough to reach the start of the next election campaigning cycle thus achieving the much desired perpetual election campaign. We are so close 👌🏽 I’m willing to predict we’re going to have a perpetual election cycle before we have flying cars.
Blogger Ann Althouse said...
@Gusty Winds (Parody)
Those links don't work for me.
That's weird. They don't work. I'm pretty good at using the and to link articles. Trick is you HAVE to remove the "https://". I've never linked to one of your past blog posts. There is no "www" either after the https. Maybe I should have added it.
Anyway, thanks for finding and posting it. You're and honest Captain.
It was strange to go through and read those 2020 election days.
Interesting comments from 2020 Trump supporters who believed the fraud to be real, and were disappointed the Supreme Court passed on the case [Texas vs PA]. "The Republic is gone!" they declared.
Now, some of those same commenters, have dumped Trump and believe DeSantis can overcome the same fraud that is now permanent. I don't believe Trump nor DeSantis stand a chance in the 2024 Electoral College unless this is seriously addressed, or the GOP starts using the same methods...which doesn't fix a damn thing and still leaves our Republic in tatters.
Ann Althouse said...
"The most up-to-date data "seems" to be available at 270towin.com. At minimum they are more willing to call races than other sites."
I'm not talking about the practice of "calling" races. I'm talking about the official process coming to completion. You can see the percentage of votes that have been counted. I'm saying they should have all reached 100% quite a while ago and it's demoralizing and suspicious that we are still waiting.
11/21/22, 9:00 AM
I agree, and it is extremely suspicious. Why? As one person noted, ballots from military overseas can take time, but this is likely less than 1% of ballots.
I don't know about other locations, but each time I voted, it scanned through a machine. Thus, vote counted immediately. Mailed in ballots can easily be fed through the machine(s) fairly quickly, even with supervision and observers, even if you are not allowed to count prior to election day.
Why are they not counting the ballots and presenting the results?
"but it shouldn't be used to undo an election after the people have voted."
Once the election is stolen fair and square, there is no remedy in the courts, is what we learned. In PA in 2020, there were procedures that were found unconstitutional by the PA courts, but the vote stood. That's why Lake should fight tooth and nail to address problems in AZ, and perhaps demand a new election.
In Germany, a judge just invalidated an election due to similar issues as we saw in PA. It is not a crazy thing to do. Especially for Senators, who are not critical to the function of our government.
Thank you Ann for the answer. Not addressing you directly, I know you are busy, but addressing your response.
I agree that election laws should be settled prior to voting. They should also be followed. But if there is zero relief in the Courts after and fraudulent election, where is relief available in the system?
All you have to do to implement election fraud is get to the election and pull it off?
There’s obviously no reversing the fraud through the courts.
“Pencils down! Turn in your papers! Time’s up!”
I can see that. But Mike Pence on the other hand….could have provided relief. He knows it. Now he is trying to save his name for the history books. He wants to be loved again, since he will never be trusted again by his former supporters.
If there is no relief against voter fraud, why vote??? That’s kind of the point to the fraud.
The as-yet undecided elections are in predictable jurisdictions. When the right to vote in a federal election entails one set of rules in State A and another in State B, there's an equal-protection question. We're on a trail fraught with very big risks.
Regarding Gusty's 11:20 post:
"...Laslo Spatula also noticed the same, in the comments stating:
"And, I must say, I sure wish the retired WI constitutional law prof would weigh in."..."
Im my comment I was quoting another commentator, and went on to point out that Althouse had the "lawsuits I hope will fail" tag on the relevant post (that I considered as 'weighing in').
A minor quibble, but for the record etc etc
I am Laslo.
Althouse said...
"The people who read the WAPO and NYT may have."
Show me the news sites that are still running the election results on the front page and show me the news sites that are covering the failure to complete the count as if it is an important news story.
I agree you have to look. And they wont be described as "News" sites by people like you. But many people have realized that you cannot go to news sites to find out what is actually happening.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brianbushard/2022/11/09/fact-check-trump-asserts-baseless-midterm-election-fraud-claims-in-arizona-michigan-pennsylvania/?sh=44a6d9613008
https://www.newsnationnow.com/politics/elections-2022/lake-evidence-arizona-election/
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2022/11/arizona-2022-midterm-election-maricopa-county-voting-machines/672042/
https://apnews.com/article/2022-midterm-elections-arizona-government-and-politics-3f61a9901101e72b1af39fb56caac854
https://twitter.com/karilake/status/1593251949201084423?s=46&t=dVsbrgu4D_yNgkY7rWnjGgAnn
If people were clicking on these stories, they'd stay on the front page, so I believe people are just letting this problem go and accepting inconclusiveness as the new norm.
This is ridiculous.
You know these web sites have nothing to do with information and they are all owned by a tiny number of people. The people that own our media have wealth that absolutely dwarfs the value of these media institutions and couldn't care less about traffic or income.
These media sources are tools.
Well democrat cheating takes a long time. And the democrat media is on board with counting until you win, so it is the new normal. We are at third world country. I am NOT surprised that no one has asked jimmah carter his opinion.
Ann Althouse said...
The reason I was glad that lawsuit failed was because the election had already taken place, following rules that could be attacked after the fact, but it was too late to redo the voting. Whatever the problems were with the rules — arguably they weren't following *state* law — should have been handled before people voted. And it's a stretch to make a federal claim out of failing to follow state law. There is a constitutional question about that, but it shouldn't be used to undo an election after the people have voted.
You need regular procedures that work to get through an election and to a certified result, not a way to keep elections undecided and in question.
This is completely wrong. You are approaching this from the point of view of an expert in the legal field and therefore miss the bigger issue because of the narrow view of the expert.
Well over half the people in the country believe the elections are fraudulent to one extent or another.
Most think Biden is illegitimate, corrupt, and doing a bad job.
What Katie Hobbs did in Arizona has completely broken that State.
In this situation confidence in the Social Contract will erode and we will come into conflict because our elections are not inspiring confidence.
You cannot have a functioning society when people lose confidence in the social contract. Fraudulent shady elections are the fastest way to destroy a social contract in a Republic. If the election becomes about who can cheat more then you are completely lost.
If this continues prepare for a civil war no matter who wins.
"I agree that election laws should be settled prior to voting. They should also be followed. But if there is zero relief in the Courts after and fraudulent election, where is relief available in the system?"
But the claim wasn't fraud. It was that the wrong rules were applied. The rules need to be in place before the event, just like the rules of a game need to be what everyone thought were the rules. You can't, after a game is played, come up with a different interpretation of the rule book, say there should have been a different rule, and get the game to be replayed.
As for fraud, there are legal procedures after an election to deal with fraud. And those procedures are rules that are in place beforehand. Then you go through those procedures and you get to the end of them, and that's that. That's all you get. Not more procedures because you're not satisfied yet.
And in CObb COunty GA a lost and then found memory vard flipped the winner or an elected poistion.
A memory card.
Not ballots, not something traceable, not something that can be confirmed, but electronic entries on a memory card. COmpletely unauditable.
https://www.11alive.com/article/news/local/lost-memory-card-in-cobb-county-election/85-7fd51629-cbd9-4034-bfd2-480a0319ce83
California 22 has counted just 60% of the vote. They passed 50% last Thursday. It is remarkable. Colorado 3, FWIW, is done counting. Boebert won the first count, but by something like 150 votes. That's an automatic recount, just in case, in Colorado.
California is the only state still counting the first time around. According to CNN, that is because the state sends a mail-in ballot to every registered voter. Many, many people vote by mail now. Each ballot has to be checked to ensure it is filled in properly and crosschecked against the list of live voters to avoid double counting. It is a time-consuming process.
We should be seeing clear, competent counting of all the votes and straightforward reporting of unquestionable results.
===========
I want to say 'ha' then double 'ha ha' to the lebenty times
I never said I was surprised.
==========
more pertinently: why are you not yet resignedly accepting 'THE FARCE' IS ACCOMPLI
One big way to fix the stop caring is to stop giving the news organizations any viewers on the now moot "election night". Kill their ratings and advertising. They'll start pushing for a real "decision point" again and run article after article on, at least the drawn out vote counting.
You can appeal to avoiding appearance of impropriety, but we know nothing is more powerful than money. Kill election night coverage as a money maker and things will change.
Apropos of nothing:
BERLIN -- A Berlin court on Wednesday ordered a rerun of the German capital's 2021 state election because of severe election-day glitches at many polling stations.
The constitutional court of Berlin, one of three German cities that is also a state in its own right, declared the original vote invalid. It said in a statement that a partial rerun wouldn't be enough “in view of the large number and severity of the election errors.”
That followed complaints by several political parties and government entities over the Sept. 26, 2021, vote for the state legislature. Those complaining included Berlin’s election authority, the far-right Alternative for Germany party and a satirical political party, The Party.
Berlin held four votes on the same day last year: the state election, an election for the city's 12 district assemblies, the German national election and a local referendum. The Berlin Marathon, also held the same day, added to logistical difficulties.
Long lines formed outside many polling stations as voters struggled with extra ballot papers. Some polling stations ran out of ballot papers during the day and others received ones for the wrong district, leading to a large number of invalidated ballots. - ABC News.
The difference is that Germany is not yet post democratic, as is the US. apparently. There is no abstract principle that says elections cannot be redone if they are hopelessly screwed up.
“But the claim wasn't fraud. It was that the wrong rules were applied. The rules need to be in place before the event, just like the rules of a game need to be what everyone thought were the rules. You can't, after a game is played, come up with a different interpretation of the rule book, say there should have been a different rule, and get the game to be replayed.”
This allows the person in charge of the election to set rules that violate state laws, like the Covid rules. Courts have declared such changes to be illegal, but under this theory the crook gets to keep the wallet even if found guilty. This is not good policy.
There is nothing so time critical that prevents allowing court review and redo of elections, and don’t dick around with standing. If the state election authority screws up and breaks the law, then that state may suffer a bit, too bad, it’s the lesser of the two evils. Never reward crime or it will be standard procedure. Crooked election officials will create other crises to justify their illegal rule changes for the next election and nothing will be done then either.
If breaking election law can in practice never be redressed then it’s best to have no election laws at all, why fake it!
The consensus by which the US Government claims legitimacy requires that certain questions not be asked, and certain issues not be trusted to the voters.
The consensus by which the US Government claims legitimacy requires that certain questions not be asked, and certain issues not be trusted to the voters.
"You know who has the quickest, cleanest, and best election system in the country? Florida. You know where the red wave actually happened? Florida."
Seems like self-serving circular reasoning to me. When the results meet your expected desired outcome, the process is "quickest...cleanest...the best," in short: valid. When the results do not meet your expected desired outcome, (whether quick or slow) the process is dirty and invalid. This entire string of comments betrays this mindset.
As for fraud, there are legal procedures after an election to deal with fraud. And those procedures are rules that are in place beforehand. Then you go through those procedures and you get to the end of them, and that's that. That's all you get. Not more procedures because you're not satisfied yet.
What do you do when your local government, who in 2020 used emergency powers to change the rules without legislation or due process, decides in 2022 to just not provide enough ballots to particular voting precincts that all happen to be in more conservative areas? It is not fraud. It is disenfranchisement, but the rules say if people walked away because they didn’t have indefinite time to wait for ballots to arrive, that’s on them? I would think people would care, especially when then same local government is the only one in Texas that can’t finish counting within the allotted time defined in legislation. Yet, it isn’t even a story locally, state wide, or nationally. At the most recent county meeting, the county judge just dialed in by Zoom to avoid meeting with protesters.
Looks like a huge percentage of the still open races are in deep blue areas. Wonder if there is any correlation, statistically speaking. And if there is, I wonder if anyone is curious enough to investigate the causes.
"Well, California law states that mail-in ballots that are received up to 7 days after the election day must be counted."
Load of crap. If you need seven more days, mail the ballots out seven days earlier. If you show up at the polling place a day late, you don't get to vote. Why are mail-in ballots not treated the same?
The rules need to be in place before the event, just like the rules of a game need to be what everyone thought were the rules. You can't, after a game is played, come up with a different interpretation of the rule book, say there should have been a different rule, and get the game to be replayed.
As for fraud, there are legal procedures after an election to deal with fraud. And those procedures are rules that are in place beforehand.
If I remember the situation in PA in 2020 correctly, there were absolute howls of protest when the rules governing elections were changed extra-legally, close to election time. Those protests were dismissed, in the media and (here is a spot where my memory is definitely unreliable), I thought, in the PA courts, on the basis of urgency - it was too close to the election to register an objection (so, the changes may have been made so close to election time so that there wouldn't be time to use a legal remedy - that is at least one possible interpretation for why the changes were put into place when they were).
And if I understand the quote above, the process is circular: 1. If you're protesting the rules, you have to do it ahead of time. 2. If you try to protest the rules, you may not be allowed to if doing so would disrupt the election. 3. After the election, you can no longer protest the rules, because you didn't protest them ahead of time.
(4. If you try to claim fraud or bad process after the fact, you'd better hope the court doesn't deny you standing, though they probably will because (a) you should have prevented the fraud ahead of time by protesting the rule changes, and/or (b) you're another state, and though matters in your state are intimately connected to control of Congress and the White House, which are in the balance because of the actions of this state, elections are state matters - until they're not. This one seems to me to be important but problematic because of federalism, and I don't know how to resolve it. If those states that tried to allege bad process had been able to convince some portion of the PA electorate to bring the case instead of them, I wonder if the case would have been allowed to move forward. Clearly IANAL.)
That's a heck of a Catch-22 - if, as I said, I'm understanding both the 2020 situation and the quote correctly.
I get that you can't have a do-over. But could you at least have the remedy of the bad rules' or bad proccesses' being walked back before future elections and not being permitted in future?
Ann Althouse said...
The reason I was glad that lawsuit failed was because the election had already taken place, following rules that could be attacked after the fact, but it was too late to redo the voting. Whatever the problems were with the rules — arguably they weren't following *state* law — should have been handled before people voted. And it's a stretch to make a federal claim out of failing to follow state law. There is a constitutional question about that, but it shouldn't be used to undo an election after the people have voted."
If the election can't be conducted using the current law then the vote must be discarded. If this results in no representation the the election officials need to be punished severely. Fraudulent elections affect the ability of a State or States to provide a Republican form of government. PA did change the rules during the 2020 election which was exactly what the Supreme Court said could not be done in 2000. The effects of fraud in one state effects all States.
If Congress can legislate Motor Voting and same day registration it can pass legislation to ban fraudulent practices. If it were up to me amongst other things I would require six months and one day residency to vote in the precinct you are voting in. Otherwise vote in your previous precinct.
A computer science prof I had decades ago told a tale of his CPA transition into computer programmer. A client asked him for an accounting product. He responded with "What do you want the numbers to look like?". Electronic voting software is not rocket surgery, but auditing the programs "Ist Verboten".
Ann Althouse said...
The reason I was glad that lawsuit failed was because the election had already taken place, following rules that could be attacked after the fact, but it was too late to redo the voting. Whatever the problems were with the rules — arguably they weren't following *state* law — should have been handled before people voted. And it's a stretch to make a federal claim out of failing to follow state law. There is a constitutional question about that, but it shouldn't be used to undo an election after the people have voted."
If the election can't be conducted using the current law then the vote must be discarded. If this results in no representation the the election officials need to be punished severely. Fraudulent elections affect the ability of a State or States to provide a Republican form of government. PA did change the rules during the 2020 election which was exactly what the Supreme Court said could not be done in 2000. The effects of fraud in one state effects all States.
If Congress can legislate Motor Voting and same day registration it can pass legislation to ban fraudulent practices. If it were up to me amongst other things I would require six months and one day residency to vote in the precinct you are voting in. Otherwise vote in your previous precinct.
We should be seeing clear, competent counting of all the votes and straightforward reporting of unquestionable results.I had to do my own search to see just how unresolved things are at the moment:
And that's what we would be seeing, if the people running the show were:
1: Competent
2: Honest
Welcome to "election denialism"
Christopher B said...
When you disburse and collect ballots in reasonably secure facilities over a set period of time you can expect to have them processed quickly. When you send them hither, tither, and yon across the country, it becomes an exercise in herding cats.
Nope. If your State requires that only absentee ballots received before election night, that are properly filled out, are counted, then you can finish on election night.
But that takes away opportunities for fraud, so the Democrats fight tooth and nail against that
You can't, after a game is played, come up with a different interpretation of the rule book
The phrase "after the game is played" is doing a lot of work here. If protests of election rule changes were only happening after election day, then maybe the rest of our host's objection would apply. But what actually happened was that in certain states, rule and regulation changes were made by parties who didn't, under their own states' constitutions, have the authority to make those changes, and there were protests aplenty then - but they went unanswered because of the "COVID emergency" and/or the fact that there wasn't enough time to settle the matter before Election Day (a date rendered meaningless by those same changes).
So a more accurate statement would be something like this: "You can't, the day a game is played, come up with different rules that favor you and handicap the other team, disallow any objections to those rules on any grounds, and have the other team think that it's a fair game."
We would not invest 50 cents in a company that did not post a 10k signed off by an outside auditor. We vote for pols that spend our national treasure based on inauditable tabulations where, at least in AZ, it is apparently illegal to audit them. I remember cases where courts asked for ballots and were told we were supposed to keep them, but we didn’t.
Turns out that a thirty minute delay in voting in Maricopa County would be enough to flip the governor’s race, and mystery printer settings that could be done remotely by a hacker and which appeared on Election Day provided just such a delay.
Stealing the vote count is easier when the number of needed ballots can be determined first so only just barely enough fake votes can then be inserted into the count. That is less suspicious. But it leads to the many recount delays because of close wins.
The 2016 vote count was clean thanks to Adm Rogers military intelligence guys who out programmed Hillary’s Soros owned vote count programming. That was why she was so angry at her staff. Someone on her staff let .her paid for stolen vote count be un-stolen. Only Russians could have done it was her best excuse.
The original explanation I heard for slow counting was that Republicans wouldn't allow counting of early votes until election day. Given the slow counting in CA, it's safe to assume this explanation is no longer operational.
Ann Althouse posted "As for fraud, there are legal procedures after an election to deal with fraud. And those procedures are rules that are in place beforehand. Then you go through those procedures and you get to the end of them, and that's that. That's all you get. Not more procedures because you're not satisfied yet.
11/21/22, 12:19 PM
from reading posts up in here, I would wager at least 60% (at least) go for the latter (not satisfied so its fraud) based on the poster's posts. I believe number was 65 of 66 courts both Republican and Democratic elected judges went with "that's all you get" not more procedures because you're not satisfied or it's what you believe. Its documented
Democracy dies in darkness. Demos-cracy is aborted at the twilight fringe.
Anybody notice on the map that the pink uncalled areas in Colorado and California are where a Republican leads? I can't find any light blue on the map. All Democrat leads have been finalized.
I'm sure that's not corrupt or fraudulent at all. Just the way it's supposed to go.
“ I can't find any light blue on the map. All Democrat leads have been finalized.”
What did Delaware?
DINKY DAU 45 said...11/21/22, 12:19 PM
from reading posts up in here, I would wager at least 60% (at least) go for the latter (not satisfied so its fraud) based on the poster's posts. I believe number was 65 of 66 courts both Republican and Democratic elected judges went with "that's all you get" not more procedures because you're not satisfied or it's what you believe. Its documented
You're right. It's easy to run out the fraud relief clock when elections are conducted in November, counts are stretched out to late Nov, early December, and everyone takes their seats on January 3rd.
Some 2020 cases (like ones WI lib Supreme Court kicked away) basically said...you have to go through the lower courts first to get to us. Oh yeah...and don't forget time is running out. That's what "that's all you get" means. Too late, the fraudulent guy is already installed!! Sorry. Times up. Nothing we can do. Better luck next time. It'll never happen again. Promise!
Courts are designed to move SLOW. Waukesha County was impressive in convicting Darrell Brooks just under a year after he drove over the Dancing Grannies.
Obviously, the court system has failed, and provides ZERO relief to address voter fraud. In sympathy, judges are also corrupt, partisan, and afraid...just like American citizens.
Advantage voter fraud supporting libs. Good for you!!!!
There is voter fraud in the United States of America. We ALL KNOW it. Some are just afraid to speak it.
Part (not all) of the reason court system is designed to move SLOW...is....billable hours for the lawyers.
"We'll yeah. I know I was in court with another client, billing him too, but I was THINKING about your case while we were waiting. I can't discount my thoughts!"
Ann Althouse said...
As for fraud, there are legal procedures after an election to deal with fraud. And those procedures are rules that are in place beforehand. Then you go through those procedures and you get to the end of them, and that's that. That's all you get. Not more procedures because you're not satisfied yet.
This doesn't work.
The Regime has put in place a system that ensures they win every election. They mail out millions of votes and send people out to collect them.
You can say it is legal because they wrote those laws and keep the dishonest and fraudulent system in place.
I know this is hard for a lawyer to understand but this is the nub of it: An election is supposed to find out what the majority of people want.
The election in 2022 only found out how many ballots the Regime could mail to random addresses and then collect and count.
There is no way to vote your way out of this. If you want to keep going down this path prepare for a civil war.
Alaska light blue.
Nope. If your State requires that only absentee ballots received before election night, that are properly filled out, are counted, then you can finish on election night.
you mean... Like Iowa does. Iowa finished VERY fast. The Only area that took any time, was Polk county, which is democrat owned. Polk county dems tried VERY Hard to keep Polk county in the dem column.. But it's Really (well, kinda) hard to cheat in iowa; which is a HUGE disadvantage for dems.
Look at the states that required absentee ballots to be returned promptly, that had voter ID, that did NOT mail out unsolicited ballots to people (states like iowa), and look how They vote (pretty much the same as 2020.. But even redder
Robert, Florida does have the best vote counting system, and if you still lived here, you could see that for yourself. Votes are counted as they come in, ID is required, and results available the same day. If you think an ID is a barrier to voting, how would you feel if nobody had to show ID to withdraw money from your bank account?
I believe number was 65 of 66 courts both Republican and Democratic elected judges went with "that's all you get" not more procedures because you're not satisfied or it's what you believe.
I believe of those 65 court decisions, something like 65 of them were tossed on procedural grounds, not on their merits. (The real number is almost certainly less; I'm being a little snarky. But only a little, because where vote recounts, etc., were allowed to proceed, they couldn't possibly tell the court anything because a recount of some mixture of properly and improperly cast ballots doesn't change - or magically become a dependable number - just through counting them. You have to know how many were properly cast, and because of the way these areas handled ballots, that was impossible to know.)
As has been laid out in various comments above and elsewhere, when the procedures don't allow for a legal remedy, you can't get a legal remedy.
Witness,
Then do both kinds of counts everywhere. I no longer trust the machines, and I no longer trust the people who do selected hand counts as proof the machines are accurate.
Surely you can't object to doing a hand count and machine count as confirmation.
Get ready for the fun to begin.
Multiple counties in Arizona are suing Maricopa county and refusing to certify the election.
There are many states that are going to start leaving their corrupt blue counties soon.
Always and everywhere, Democrats are opposed to systems that would insure the integrity of elections and conducting audits that would identify problems with how an election was run. The only reason I can think of is that they don't want to identify those problems.
Change my mind.
Dinky Dope posted:
I believe number was 65 of 66 courts both Republican and Democratic elected judges went with "that's all you get" not more procedures because you're not satisfied or it's what you believe. Its documented .
Absolutely. All those decisions ASFAIK were on procedural grounds, like States do not have "standing" to challenge state rules. The Supreme Court chickened out. Even Alito said nothing about Pennsylvania ignoring his admonition to sequester late absentee ballots. The fix was in.
Blogger Achilles said...Get ready for the fun to begin...Multiple counties in Arizona are suing Maricopa county and refusing to certify the election.
Scott Adams linked to Kari Lake's AZ fight and basically said (paraphrasing)..."I think the Democrats just messed with the wrong election denier".
It's Texas vs PA on a state level. Counties vs County, instead of States vs. States.
There needs to be a uniform standard to voting machines in this country. The Federal government needs to lay out official guidelines for what the machines need to do and how they need to do it. The machines need to accurately record the votes digitally and then produce paper copies of all the votes. There also needs to be a secondary machine that can count paper ballots when the primary machines aren't working. The companies that produce these machines need to be held to a high standard of accuracy and regular certification by the government. If they can do it for gas station pumps and ATMs, they can do it for voting machines.....but it won't come cheap.
If the powers that be really cared about election integrity, they would be doing everything in their power to assuage the concerns. Instead, every question, no matter how reasonable, is a conspiracy theory, voting practices that are long established as facilitating vote fraud (*cough*votebymail*cough*ballotharvesting*cough*) have to be implemented or else it is voter suppression, voter ID is racist despite them demanding ID and even more for everything else, and the media claims that taking a month to count all the votes is normal and desirable. They don't care. It suits their purposes.
"There needs to be a uniform standard to voting machines in this country."
No machines. Visual handcounts. All parties witnessing, all sign off on the agreed total.
End of story.
It'll take longer? Than what we have now? Yeah, sure.
Let's be clear, mail-in ballots, drop boxes and big vote processing centers are designed to be chaotic, it is easier to introduce cheating when processes are chaotic. The longer the process draws out, the more opportunities to discard, replace or add ballots.
Elections should be in person with ID, do them at grade school enrollment areas, with about 2000 voters per presinct.
Make working at the polls like jury duty, with members of both parties observing. Everything on camera, and everyone knows the totals and signs off.
loudogblog,
That's a start, but not sufficient.
100% of the source code needs to be publicly available, along with the entire toolchain used to build the executable. Any observer needs to be able to take the claimed source, build and executable from that, calculate the sha-256 hash, and compare it to the published value for the executable on the machine itself.
If any questions arise, the installed executable can have its hash value recalculated, and if it doesn't match the published figure then all of the results from that machine are no good.
And several other security measures which I can't think of at the moment, but I'm sure Bruce Schneier could.
Forget 2020 lawsuits. What's the record of election results being overturned in litigation? Folks getting over their skis here.
Blogger Achilles said...Get ready for the fun to begin. Multiple counties in Arizona are suing Maricopa county and refusing to certify the election. There are many states that are going to start leaving their corrupt blue counties soon. 11/21/22, 6:08 PM
Thanks for sharing, Achilles.
I hope the whole system burns down rather than accede to fraud by leftists.
If Florida can count the votes in one day, everyone can do it. The delays are built in to allow fraud.
Voting should be:
One day in person. The only absentee ballots are those serving the government overseas.
You show an ID before you vote, and dip your finger in ink after you vote.
Paper ballots, bubble in similar to the scantrons we all used in school.
counting in public, perhaps a local theater. anyone can sit and watch.
There needs to be a uniform standard to voting machines in this country. The Federal government needs to lay out official guidelines for what the machines need to do and how they need to do it.
This would require a Constitutional amendment.
The "lost and found memory card" in Cobb County is disturbing. Most opportunities for voting fraud (not voter fraud: voting fraud, because it is coordinated by groups of bureaucrats) is baked into the rules. And it has more to do with demographic choices made by elected officials to benefit elected officials rather than anything observable on election day.
I remember another race in Georgia before computer hijinks where "a box of damp ballots was discovered in someone's trunk" in an unexpectedly close race involving the longtime Speaker of the House.
I adored the man but shook my darn head.
"Robert, Florida does have the best vote counting system, and if you still lived here, you could see that for yourself. Votes are counted as they come in, ID is required, and results available the same day. If you think an ID is a barrier to voting, how would you feel if nobody had to show ID to withdraw money from your bank account?"
Where did I say anything even faintly alluding to voter ID requirements? Nowhere. You're projecting. My point is that all it takes for many in the nation (and a majority of commenters here) to assert "vote fraud" is that their preferred candidate(s) did not win.
As for whether Florida's vote counting system is best, well, "best" how? Compared to what? Are there studies that closely compare the voting systems of each state to each other, examining the virtues and flaws of each, such that a "best" among all states can be reasonably determined?
Antiantifa said...
"California 22 has counted just 60% of the vote. They passed 50% last Thursday. It is remarkable. Colorado 3, FWIW, is done counting. Boebert won the first count, but by something like 150 votes. That's an automatic recount, just in case, in Colorado.
California is the only state still counting the first time around. According to CNN, that is because the state sends a mail-in ballot to every registered voter. Many, many people vote by mail now. Each ballot has to be checked to ensure it is filled in properly and crosschecked against the list of live voters to avoid double counting. It is a time-consuming process."
Finding out just how many ballots they need to manufacture. Filling out said ballots and putting them in already opened postmarked envelopes is tedious and takes time. It's made a little easier when you have voter lists and can see who voted on election day so that they can vote Democrat for all those registered voters that didn't show up. See how that works?
As for whether Florida's vote counting system is best, well, "best" how? Compared to what? Are there studies that closely compare the voting systems of each state to each other, examining the virtues and flaws of each, such that a "best" among all states can be reasonably determined?
Because none of us are smart enough to judge matters by what we have seen? It's an objective fact that Florida handles the voting process better than anyone else. And they even have to deal with having polls in two different time zones. However Florida's system making cheating hard, so it must be opposed at all costs by the Left.
Can you define what a woman is for me? Or can only biologists do that?
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